Topic: Sarah Everard* Update Jan 2023 - Met Police rapist.

[scatman]

The Nessa story has definitely been on the news a lot (rightly so), there was a huge vigil attended by people from all across London, so has the murder of the 2 sisters in Fryent Park which was referred to in the post above. I don't even live in the UK and knew about the 2 sisters in Fryent Park, hell I even remember the name of the park. In fact I recently read a long read on the BBC about it as well as multiple stories about the killer that were all on the BBC front page.

[Circa1892]

Why are people calling for all these changes to the police force over one cop?it’s not like you have police officers going out and murdering women left and right. The simple fact is, even if that monster wasn’t a cop he could have easily bought handcuffs and a fake identification card. I find the fact he was a police officer completely irrelevant.

The twat has a loving family, a wife, mates etc yet people think some blanket laws and rules would have picked up the fact he might be a future killer? The fact he was able to hide these thoughts from his closest people in life, makes me think some stranger filling in a form wouldn’t have worked.

He could probably have faked it. But he didn’t. He is a paid public servant we are all supposed to trust. He did what he did because he was confident he could get away with it. It absolutely isn’t just “one cop”

Surely we all know someone who’s had a horrific experience with the police. I got punched repeatedly in the head by an off duty copper after I pushed him when he groped my mate. I was told by his mate they’d “have a word” but if I took it further there’s “allsorts” they could pin on me (spoiler, there isn’t).

As a bloke this isn’t about me. Just take a look on Twitter. It’s littered with stories of women who’ve been abused by police who’ve then used their power to cover it up. It’s a fucking rotten system. It is absolutely littered with disgusting, psychotic men who abuse their position with impunity. They’re enabled by shite like Cressida Dick, corrupt and disgusting people.

Wayne Couzens is one of the worst humans who’ve ever lived, and he will rot in his own filth in jail - but he’s not some random rotten apple - he’s the one that got caught.

Cressida Dick, Norman Bettison. They’re all the fucking same. Put them in the 30s and we know who they’d be

[stevensr123]

He could probably have faked it. But he didn’t. He is a paid public servant we are all supposed to trust. He did what he did because he was confident he could get away with it. It absolutely isn’t just “one cop”

Surely we all know someone who’s had a horrific experience with the police. I got punched repeatedly in the head by an off duty copper after I pushed him when he groped my mate. I was told by his mate they’d “have a word” but if I took it further there’s “allsorts” they could pin on me (spoiler, there isn’t).

As a bloke this isn’t about me. Just take a look on Twitter. It’s littered with stories of women who’ve been abused by police who’ve then used their power to cover it up. It’s a fucking rotten system. It is absolutely littered with disgusting, psychotic men who abuse their position with impunity. They’re enabled by shite like Cressida Dick, corrupt and disgusting people.

Wayne Couzens is one of the worst humans who’ve ever lived, and he will rot in his own filth in jail - but he’s not some random rotten apple - he’s the one that got caught.

Cressida Dick, Norman Bettison. They’re all the fucking same. Put them in the 30s and we know who they’d be

He is a paid public servant? So what? Las time I checked, being a public servant doesn’t stop someone from being murderer, and last time I checked, the police didn’t condone what he did, in fact they investigated and arrested the scum bag, no?

To suggest murder and sexual assault is rampant in the police force, and using twitter as evidence is also laughable.


Like any horrible murder, people are screaming out for change and banding about a shit load of either useless changes, or changes that are completely bonkers - to make themselves feel like that I have something meaningful. It’s understandable because emotions are obviously and rightfully high.

And in terms of educating boys etc as far as I’m aware there is still a debate about nature vs nurture, and If was as simple changing thr education system, I’m sure many countries before would have successfully implemented such education.

I would rather more police in the streets, giving women the ability to carry protection, and much tougher sentencing ( sexual assault/ rape life sentences as a minimum).
.

[Dr. Beaker]

I come across a lot of these armed coppers at work. The police in general are quite a macho bunch, but the armed cops are largely in a different league, not all of them obviously. Even the female ones are often ridiculously macho. I wonder if this particular weirdo only joined in the first place because he had this sort of abuse of power in mind.

I always thought that the psychological monitoring the police maintained on their firearms officers would have ensured that his certificate (to 'carry') would have been withdrawn because of his weird behaviour leading up to this tragedy. I know that the merest whiff of alcohol, or suspicion of marital problems would have been enough only a few years ago.

[Circa1892]

I don’t think anyone would suggest the vast majority of coppers aren’t decent people in it for the right reasons. But suggesting they aren’t absolutely infested with rotten people is, at best, naive - or, like yourself, someone more than a little too defensive about our brave police force.

Arguably for a different thread as this needs a little more decorum, but would you make the argument that policing in this (and probably every…) country doesn’t need root and branch reform?

[stevensr123]

I come across a lot of these armed coppers at work. The police in general are quite a macho bunch, but the armed cops are largely in a different league, not all of them obviously. Even the female ones are often ridiculously macho. I wonder if this particular weirdo only joined in the first place because he had this sort of abuse of power in mind.

I always thought that the psychological monitoring the police maintained on their firearms officers would have ensured that his certificate (to 'carry') would have been withdrawn because of his weird behaviour leading up to this tragedy. I know that the merest whiff of alcohol, or suspicion of marital problems would have been enough only a few years ago.

but how would him being off the police force stopped this? He wasn’t carrying his weapon, he wasn’t using his  police car, he carried hand cuffs which anyone can buy and a badge which most people I imagine don’t even read.

He was a scum bag that was out to murder someone, and sadly it’s extremely (if not impossible) to stop. Awful all around.

[lamad]

Although this was the totally wrong - not to mention unfair - way to go about raising a point and this is a thread about the horrific murder of Sarah Everard (however, for a variety of reasons I would also like to expess my absolute no to the death penalty), there is a huge discussion out there about violence against women and how society handles it, so I hope it is okay to post two links. Just in case anyone is interested and hasn't seen them:
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2021/sep/29/the-missing-white-woman-syndrome-still-plagues-america
https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2021/sep/26/femicide-us-silent-epidemic

[Levitz]

but how would him being off the police force stopped this? He wasn’t carrying his weapon, he wasn’t using his  police car, he carried hand cuffs which anyone can buy and a badge which most people I imagine don’t even read.

He was a scum bag that was out to murder someone, and sadly it’s extremely (if not impossible) to stop. Awful all around.

'one bad apple' 'one scum bag'

do fuck off.

He had multiple allegations of  indecent exposure that were'n't investigated. He was know as 'rapist' by previous colleagues for his creepy behaviour around women. He shared violent misogynistic messages to his colleagues in their whatsapp group

They knew who he was and did fuck all because he was 'one of theirs'. As they do all the fucking time. The police service is institutionally racist and misogynistic, police officers abuse their power aots and get away with appalling behaviour all the fucking time. Needs fundamental fucking reform.

Google 'sexual misconduct allegations in the police'

Google 'victims of police domestic violence' and 'silenced'

Google "Kate Wilson'

and then go and find out about Jean Charles de Menezes

Then come back and tell me the problem is one bad guy.

Yours

a woman.

[CornerFlag]

Unfortunately, there are police officers who should be stripped of being able to wear that uniform.  To the level of Sarah Everard's murder?  Hopefully, this evil prick is the only one there ever is again.  But there are officers who abuse their powers and are hidden from consequence by those around them, and that perpetuates a cycle that this behaviour is okay, that women can be subjugated or second-class to them.  But move that away from the police and then the wider scope is men.  That description perfectly fits men.  Not all men, but the likely person behind such behaviour is a man.  And that's what, fundamentally, needs to change.

Personally, I hate the "ACAB" chants.  They're not, there are good people whose sole purpose is to serve those around them and do good.  They have a job to do and some, perhaps most, do it impeccably.  I've grown up around people who served in Merseyside Police and they are damn good people.

Also, I'm almost completely against the death penalty, but regarding anyone who gets given a whole-life tariff after a guilty plea I'd offer them (with the family of those affected in agreement) the opportunity to be executed.  They can refuse and remain in prison, or agree (and the aggrieved family does also) and shuffle off this mortal coil and, maybe, give a sense of peace to their victims.

At the end of the day, all of this comes too late for Sarah Everard.  She did nothing wrong. And yet, because one guy's attitude towards women was so despicable, she is no longer with us.  There shouldn't ever be another Sarah Everard ever again, and I wish I could say there never will be, but I think anyone reading this would know that's extremely unlikely.

We men need to make sure we're doing everything we can to root out such attitudes.  Because we know what the end result might be, and it could be someone you know.

RIP Sarah.

[Zeb]

I'm going to agree with Levitz in at least part, not to pile on anyone else's opinion.

My local police force has been failing for a very long time. Serious failures where crimes aren't even investigated - hell, aren't after logged after being reported, serious offenders not being picked up, vulnerable people (often women in domestic violence situations) not getting anything like the support and protection they should have. And the police higher ups told the world that the reports from journalists were bollocks. The politicians meant to be doing oversight couldn't be arsed and repeated the police line. And so it's gone on for years until eventually the Chief Constable felt he had to take early retirement and a new one is put in. And the cycle repeats.

So there's a culture there of arse covering, which we all know about from other things, rather than actually tackling problems which are identified. And I'm not seeing much in the way of politicians showing that they're giving appropriate oversight nor much accountability going on, let alone changes. There's something seriously wrong there. Obviously underfunding is an issue but it goes beyond that. Maybe an inquiry is the start of trying to unpick it.

[JerseyKloppite]

but how would him being off the police force stopped this? He wasn’t carrying his weapon, he wasn’t using his  police car, he carried hand cuffs which anyone can buy and a badge which most people I imagine don’t even read.

He was a scum bag that was out to murder someone, and sadly it’s extremely (if not impossible) to stop. Awful all around.

The issue about him being in the police force is much wider than this. Firstly, he's in a position of authority. Secondly, he's in a very rare position where he's able to obtain coercive control of someone. Police officers, as people who are paid by the public to protect them, should be held to a higher standard of behaviour than the average person. Being able to trust public servants generally, but police officers in particular, is vital, both generally in society and for women who deserve to feel safe. My other half, and any number of women voicing concerns today, now feel that if they were approached by a single male police officer they would feel more unsafe than before. That's deeply troubling.

The investigations that will follow the sentencing will hopefully get to the bottom of this. I'm not saying it's easy for the police, or any recruiter, to identify dangerous personality traits in all of their employees. But there seem to have been a lot of warning signs in this case that were missed, and it's important to know why.

[bornandbRED]

The psychological aspect of these crimes and trying to understand why people do stuff like this is so difficult. How fucked up must you be to go and do something like that?

The points that he has made have validity and the debate about the media portrayal / wider societal issues of racial bias is important. The issue isn't making the points and, for me, never was. It was being asked to do so (repeatedly) in a separate thread where that could be the focus of the conversation, either any existing thread about racial issues, or a new thread about violence against women. He was asked this on a number of occasions by a number of posters, so that this thread could focus on the issue of this particular case, and either violence against women generally or the issue of police corruption/complacency/trust.

The first comment he made wasn't even along the lines of "this was deplorable, violence against women is awful, sympathy for the victim, thoughts for the families, etc". It was immediately "why don't you care about about other victims"? In a thread discussing an individual's rape and murder, that's pretty cold and came across very badly. The argument that followed, on an issue which is plainly emotive, was entirely avoidable.

So again, if people want to have this conversation then they absolutely should. I really can't stress that enough, as it's important that RAWK's members can discuss these issues. Just not in this thread, on a day when the focus is very much on the sentencing of an evil individual, and trying to pay respect to someone who must have gone through hell.

Yeah, agreed the delivery method was tactless and accusing forum members is a bit random.

Important to recognise both crimes were awful, my thoughts are with both families but such conversations shouldn’t be swept under the carpet and I’d say are entirely relevant to this thread and topic.

The Nessa crime was reported from day one on the BBC, even before they announced her name;

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-58585499

The BBC has kept up to date on this crime on a daily basis and I think any allegations of racism are wrong.

The conversation’s about the extent of reporting, not absence of. One was the nation’s premier story - one was a side story which is even evidenced by the URL of the article of you posted being situated in the London section of BBC news rather than the National section. It was very much regional reporting to begin with. I remember seeing the case discussed on Twitter and there being no corresponding story on the BBC front page last weekend.

‘Any allegations of racism are wrong?’ I’m not accusing anyone of racism. Simply pointing out the clear discrepancy. Make of that what you will - but you can’t deny it exists and telling someone of colour it doesn’t is akin to a fat bloke advising me on a diet. Maybe it’s driven by editorial teams or journalists, maybe people care less… but deaths of PoC never seem to garner as much interest.

https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-england-london-57377414

Another event where we didn’t see Prince William and Kate Middleton blaze to the scene for a photo op. They probably didn’t even know it happened.

Anyway… that’s enough of the digression.


 

[Zeb]

Just on news coverage, worth keeping in mind that as soon as charges are made then press is very limited in what they can report and everyone (in the UK) is subject to the laws around making sure trials are fair. Welshred pointed this out on the first page. There are issues in which cases get widespread coverage across our press but may be worth taking a step back before making the argument on current cases. Just twopenceworth.

[Statto Red]

Just on news coverage, worth keeping in mind that as soon as charges are made then press is very limited in what they can report and everyone (in the UK) is subject to the laws around making sure trials are fair. Welshred pointed this out on the first page. There are issues in which cases get widespread coverage across our press but may be worth taking a step back before making the argument on current cases. Just twopenceworth.

Indeed, in the UK, once a person is charged with a crime, it then becomes under sub judice law until the trial is over, the media can only report on what happened in court on the day in question until the trail is over.

[The North Bank]

The fact that it’s a police officer makes it somehow even more frightening and gives it more attention. This case is pretty much closed now. There is a lot more we don’t know about the Sabina nessa case and it will get more attention when the facts start to come out.

[jillcwhomever]

The fact that it’s a police officer makes it somehow even more frightening and gives it more attention. This case is pretty much closed now. There is a lot more we don’t know about the Sabina nessa case and it will get more attention when the facts start to come out.

That is my thoughts too, and as others have said it's only just going to court so we shouldn't be talking about it until everything is out in the open. Going by what was said in an earlier report, I'm pretty sure it will get spoken about more, as it sounds horrific. I hope her family is getting the support they will need in the meantime.

[John C]

Maybe an inquiry is the start of trying to unpick it.

Perhaps, or perhaps the result will be something like this claiming there's no institutional racism Zeb.
https://www.channel4.com/news/no-evidence-of-institutional-racism-in-uk-says-report-commissioned-by-government
Apologies for straying.

As Jersey says, this just adds another strain on the daily lives women face which many men are unappreciative of - we've had this discussion on this forum.

[Zeb]

Perhaps, or perhaps the result will be something like this claiming there's no institutional racism Zeb.
https://www.channel4.com/news/no-evidence-of-institutional-racism-in-uk-says-report-commissioned-by-government
Apologies for straying.

As Jersey says, this just adds another strain on the daily lives women face which many men are unappreciative of - we've had this discussion on this forum.

Yeah, it'd have to be something Judge led with a really wide scope to dig in, cos I don't think this is just going to be the Met. It's just the Met more often on the telly rushing to defend the institution and sod the cost to it as the initial reaction. After I posted last night, I was reading some of what former police officers were saying about how things were covered up because of the culture internally going back years.

It's only one aspect of it though, isn't it? Like you quote, it's another strain, not the only one. (Edit: been thinking about something wrote here - https://www.independent.co.uk/voices/sarah-everard-murder-wayne-couzens-b1929275.html )

[John C]

It's only one aspect of it though, isn't it? Like you quote, it's another strain, not the only one. (Edit: been thinking about something wrote here - https://www.independent.co.uk/voices/sarah-everard-murder-wayne-couzens-b1929275.html )

Flippin hec I thought I was aware of a few things but 80 women killed since March. Fucking hell mate that's a shock.

Winter mornings and nights make it even worse and unfairly restrictive. I'll be getting up and going for my morning run anytime between 6.00 and 7.30 in the dark, I know I won't pass the usual women that are out that time of the morning in the summer.

[AlphaDelta]

A very emotive subject with various opinions and views. I sat reading the details of what that bastard done yesterday morning and cried. The horror of a serving police officer, in uniform, doing what he did, it makes the blood run cold. The element of trust has literally been shattered.

I get there is lots of evidence of the police being corrupt, insular, sometimes racist, sometimes misogynistic, but there is lots of decent, honest, brave coppers. PC Keith Palmer, murdered trying to stop a terrorist, WPC's Fiona Bone and Nicola Hughes, two young coppers, brutally murdered by a piece of shit wannabe gangster, PC Charlie Guenigault, awarded the George Medal for trying to stop the Borough Market Terror Attack, off-duty and unarmed. My point is the police service is not rife with badness, but like any profession, badness exists in some form.

The amount of damage this piece of shit has done is beyond measure and will probably be felt for decades to come.

RIP Sarah x

[CornerFlag]

The sentencing remarks for the murdering scumbag.  Damning and harrowing.

[Red-Soldier]

The sentencing remarks for the murdering scumbag.  Damning and harrowing.

Just as I thought:

The most important question in this sentencing exercise, therefore, revolves around a
question of principle: if a police officer uses his office to kidnap, rape and murder a
victim, is the seriousness of the offence exceptionally high, such that it ought to be
treated in the same way as the other examples set out in paragraph 2(2). In my judgment
the police are in a unique position, which is essentially different from any other public
servants. They have powers of coercion and control that are in an exceptional category. In
this country it is expected that the police will act in the public interest; indeed, the
authority of the police is to a truly significant extent dependent on the public’s consent,
and the power of officers to detain, arrest and otherwise control important aspects of our
lives is only effective because of the critical trust that we repose in the constabulary, that
they will act lawfully and in the best interests of society. If that is undermined, one of the
enduring safeguards of law and order in this country is inevitably jeopardised. In my
judgment, the misuse of a police officer’s role such as occurred in this case in order to
kidnap, rape and murder a lone victim is of equal seriousness as a murder carried out for
the purpose of advancing a political, religious, racial or ideological cause. All of these
situations attack different aspects of the fundamental underpinnings of our democratic
way of life. It is this vital factor which in my view makes the seriousness of this case
exceptionally high. Self-evidently, it would need for the police officer to have used his
role as a constable in a critical way to facilitate the commission of the offence; if his
professional occupation was of little or no relevance to the offending, then these
considerations clearly would not apply.

[KillieRed]

A very emotive subject with various opinions and views. I sat reading the details of what that bastard done yesterday morning and cried. The horror of a serving police officer, in uniform, doing what he did, it makes the blood run cold. The element of trust has literally been shattered.

I get there is lots of evidence of the police being corrupt, insular, sometimes racist, sometimes misogynistic, but there is lots of decent, honest, brave coppers. PC Keith Palmer, murdered trying to stop a terrorist, WPC's Fiona Bone and Nicola Hughes, two young coppers, brutally murdered by a piece of shit wannabe gangster, PC Charlie Guenigault, awarded the George Medal for trying to stop the Borough Market Terror Attack, off-duty and unarmed. My point is the police service is not rife with badness, but like any profession, badness exists in some form.

The amount of damage this piece of shit has done is beyond measure and will probably be felt for decades to come.

RIP Sarah x

I agree: the coppers i know are generally very serious people, sometimes nerdy and quite boring. There may be a different culture in the workplace but the ones I know are good people who have gone into the job for the right reasons.

[Red Viper]

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/met-police-sarah-everard-couzens-b1930331.html

Just "wave down a bus". Ladies and gentleman, the problem has been solved. Thank you very much Cressida Dick.

Jesus fucking Christ.

[Dr. Beaker]

I work alongside the police and have done for twenty-odd years. There are obviously some arseholes but mostly they appear quite normal - there are some that I actually like. But my colleagues and I generally agree on one thing: Even the ones we like, we don't trust.

So, I hear you ask yourselves, how can you possibly like someone you don't trust? Well it's a difficult one. Just chatting to them them, you can get to like 'em. They are not all extreme right wing bastards. I would say most are just normal right wing bastards. Some are even more normal than that and can see reason. With coppers generally, more than most people (who often go with their emotions) they need evidence, and that's good.

But they are human and can be lazy bastards just like the rest of us. The reason why none of us (well none that I have spoken to on the subject) trust them, is because when something does go wrong, they will all back each other up even if it means lying through their teeth, and even if it means you, their so called 'mate' gets hung out to dry. We don't even blame them. We generally used to think, 'well they get involved on the streets with all kinds of scum and end up in all sorts of situations, the likes of which none of us have to deal with as we push our pens around' - you can't blame them for covering for each other when they have to make split second decisions in the most horrific situations.

Well I guess that's all changed now. And I actually do expect that there is about to be an equally massive outrage as the background of this case gets exposed.

On a different issue, I did jury duty a couple of years ago, on two separate rape cases. One case involved an alleged rape that happened in a multiple occupancy house, in her bedroom on the first floor (a room only just big enough for a bed). The first floor had four bedrooms, the other three were occupied by three couples.

She knew the bloke, they had been to a works do. They had apparently first started arguing and eventually it ended up with lots of screaming and shouting. But I've never seen a police officer look so sheepish as the officer in the witness box when he had to admit that they hadn't even interviewed the other three couples to find out if they had heard any noise?!

[rob1966]

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/met-police-sarah-everard-couzens-b1930331.html

Just "wave down a bus". Ladies and gentleman, the problem has been solved. Thank you very much Cressida Dick.

Jesus fucking Christ.

What fucking planet does that woman live on? Sarah was stopped by a copper, while out after visiting a friend during lockdown, she likely thought she was in serious trouble and has complied with a police officers instructions, like the rest of us would have done. Did she think she would compound things by trying to get away? Its scallies who run, not normal law abiding people.

[Red Viper]

What fucking planet does that woman live on? Sarah was stopped by a copper, while out after visiting a friend during lockdown, she likely thought she was in serious trouble and has complied with a police officers instructions, like the rest of us would have done. Did she think she would compound things by trying to get away? Its scallies who run, not normal law abiding people.

This is just the Met scrambling for any kind of way out of this when there isn't one.

[12C]

The latest from the Met

“Challenge plain clothes officers”
My Missus is furious. Her comments
“How do you challenge an officer with a warrant card? It will be ‘resisting arrest’ to most of them.”

“This puts the blame onto the victim and any future victim because “you should have challenged him”, is now the official line.

Add in the fact that Dick was claiming one bad apple when there are 17 officers under investigation for their handling of this case, and the Times is tweeting stuff about officers delaying the search/arrest of the murderer by hours allowing his phone to be deleted - this is worrying.

[rob1966]

I know a couple of GMP officers and a GMP PCSO, our kid knows someone quite high up in Dorset Police and as a kid one of my mates Dads was a Superintendent in Merseyside Police. All sound people, but you can see they are always switched on and you watch what you say to them. They can be right bastards, but with what they deal with on a day to day basis, I can see why. I think of the lads I grew up with and they were fucking nutters, I could never picture myself trying to arrest some of those nor seeing one of them when out with the family off duty. It takes a different breed to want to do what they do.

[rob1966]

The latest from the Met

“Challenge plain clothes officers”
My Missus is furious. Her comments
“How do you challenge an officer with a warrant card? It will be ‘resisting arrest’ to most of them.”

“This puts the blame onto the victim and any future victim because “you should have challenged him”, is now the official line.

Add in the fact that Dick was claiming one bad apple when there are 17 officers under investigation for their handling of this case, and the Times is tweeting stuff about officers delaying the search/arrest of the murderer by hours allowing his phone to be deleted - this is worrying.

Growing up in Kirkby, you knew to never challenge a copper if you liked being healthy. I got arrested at 15 for something trivial (to me) and the coppers were trying to goad me and my mates, we just kept our gobs shut.

[Snail]

'one bad apple' 'one scum bag'

do fuck off.

He had multiple allegations of  indecent exposure that were'n't investigated. He was know as 'rapist' by previous colleagues for his creepy behaviour around women. He shared violent misogynistic messages to his colleagues in their whatsapp group

They knew who he was and did fuck all because he was 'one of theirs'. As they do all the fucking time. The police service is institutionally racist and misogynistic, police officers abuse their power aots and get away with appalling behaviour all the fucking time. Needs fundamental fucking reform.

Google 'sexual misconduct allegations in the police'

Google 'victims of police domestic violence' and 'silenced'

Google "Kate Wilson'

and then go and find out about Jean Charles de Menezes

Then come back and tell me the problem is one bad guy.

Yours

a woman.

Is right.

[Red Viper]

'one bad apple' 'one scum bag'

do fuck off.

He had multiple allegations of  indecent exposure that were'n't investigated. He was know as 'rapist' by previous colleagues for his creepy behaviour around women. He shared violent misogynistic messages to his colleagues in their whatsapp group

They knew who he was and did fuck all because he was 'one of theirs'. As they do all the fucking time. The police service is institutionally racist and misogynistic, police officers abuse their power aots and get away with appalling behaviour all the fucking time. Needs fundamental fucking reform.

Google 'sexual misconduct allegations in the police'

Google 'victims of police domestic violence' and 'silenced'

Google "Kate Wilson'

and then go and find out about Jean Charles de Menezes

Then come back and tell me the problem is one bad guy.

Yours

a woman.

Must have scrolled past this. Fucking spot on.

[12C]

Growing up in Kirkby, you knew to never challenge a copper if you liked being healthy. I got arrested at 15 for something trivial (to me) and the coppers were trying to goad me and my mates, we just kept our gobs shut.

Rob, similar experiences.
I was 15 stood waiting at a bus stop in the middle of fields on Canny Farm when a cop car pulls up and one of them says says
“What are you doing?”
“I’m waiting for a bus!”
As I said it I though “oh shit that sounds like I’m being sarky…”
Somehow they thought I was “acting suspicious”, stood on my own 200m from the nearest building at a bus stop.
Knowing mates who had been taken in for refusing to co-operate, it taught me a few things.

[Red-Soldier]

Credit to the judge.  Obviously, the police do as much as they can to try to sweep things under the carpet and look after their own.  He's sent out a strong message to any other officer who has a thought of doing what Couzens did.

[Welshred]

Why are people calling for all these changes to the police force over one cop?it’s not like you have police officers going out and murdering women left and right. The simple fact is, even if that monster wasn’t a cop he could have easily bought handcuffs and a fake identification card. I find the fact he was a police officer completely irrelevant.

Why did people call for changes to general practice after Harold Shipman? He was just one Dr. It's not like you have doctors going out and murdering elderly people left and right. The simple face is, even if that monster wasn't a Dr he could have easily still killed elderly people. The fact he was a GP is completely irrelevant...

Except its not. Dr's, police officers, civil servants, anyone who works within a public office needs to have the trust of the public to be able to do their job without criminal activity towards those they work with. A case like this, and Shipman's, damages that trust and erodes confidence with the public that they are safe when they encounter them. Why do reforms need to happen? Simply because if you don't reform then you leave yourself open to it happening again, if you don't learn from your mistakes you are destined to repeat them and if something likes this happens again the Met Police will not be trusted by anyone to look after them safely again. One cop can change the view of the police for everyone and then every single colleague of theirs then gets tarred with the same brush. That's why reforms have to happen to ensure people are safe when in the presence of police officers. General practice had to go through several reforms to ensure something like Shipman didn't happen again, the police force will have to do so as well.

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/met-police-sarah-everard-couzens-b1930331.html

Just "wave down a bus". Ladies and gentleman, the problem has been solved. Thank you very much Cressida Dick.

Jesus fucking Christ.

I do find this a little bit disingenuous as it seems like that's the only piece of advice they've given, which would just be ridiculous. "Call 999 if you're real and imminent danger and able to, if not seek help by shouting to a passer by, run into a house, knock on a door or wave a bus down" is what they've said and I don't think much of that is unreasonable if you're with a plain closed police officer who isn't happy with being challenged about their intentions.

The latest from the Met

“Challenge plain clothes officers”
My Missus is furious. Her comments
“How do you challenge an officer with a warrant card? It will be ‘resisting arrest’ to most of them.”

“This puts the blame onto the victim and any future victim because “you should have challenged him”, is now the official line.

Add in the fact that Dick was claiming one bad apple when there are 17 officers under investigation for their handling of this case, and the Times is tweeting stuff about officers delaying the search/arrest of the murderer by hours allowing his phone to be deleted - this is worrying.

Any police officer who isn't happy with being challenged in the current climate is a red flag isn't it? If that was me I'd start to seek help as soon as possible for any officer who gets arsey with you asking what they're intentions are and to provide reassurance through the various means mentioned to ensure you feel safe.

[12C]

https://twitter.com/mark_george_qc/status/1443564067210280972?s=21

  Mark George QC (one of the outstanding Hillsborough lawyers on our side) tweeted a this response yesterday

[Welshred]

'one bad apple' 'one scum bag'

do fuck off.

He had multiple allegations of  indecent exposure that were'n't investigated. He was know as 'rapist' by previous colleagues for his creepy behaviour around women. He shared violent misogynistic messages to his colleagues in their whatsapp group

They knew who he was and did fuck all because he was 'one of theirs'. As they do all the fucking time. The police service is institutionally racist and misogynistic, police officers abuse their power aots and get away with appalling behaviour all the fucking time. Needs fundamental fucking reform.

Google 'sexual misconduct allegations in the police'

Google 'victims of police domestic violence' and 'silenced'

Google "Kate Wilson'

and then go and find out about Jean Charles de Menezes

Then come back and tell me the problem is one bad guy.

Yours

a woman.

Bang on, he shouldn't have been in public to commit this crime in the first place, the Met failed massively by rewarding him by fast tracking to a senior position instead.

[Slippers]

I don’t think it’s as simple as that. I agree we shouldn’t condemn every officer or the entire force over one monster, but there were reports of some behaviour prior to him committing this murder (exposing or flashing himself on more then one occasion) that should have been picked up or investigated further and if they were could have identified that this guy had some pretty serious problems.

He had a reputation amongst his colleagues for 'creepy behaviour'(whatever that means)and a report of him driving around naked from the waist down was supposedly never investigated.

[Red Viper]

I do find this a little bit disingenuous as it seems like that's the only piece of advice they've given, which would just be ridiculous. "Call 999 if you're real and imminent danger and able to, if not seek help by shouting to a passer by, run into a house, knock on a door or wave a bus down" is what they've said and I don't think much of that is unreasonable if you're with a plain closed police officer who isn't happy with being challenged about their intentions.

It's just victim blaming nonsense with absolutely no practical reasoning behind it at all. None of what they've advised would have saved Sarah's life because she had no reason not to trust a police officer acting within what she would have assumed to have been his legal duties as a police officer.

It's a joke that after months of this case that's the best the Met can come up with. Especially when their "bad egg" is someone they knew to be a problem but continued to promote him throughout the ranks anyway. This is on them, not the public to resolve.

[Welshred]

I don't see it as victim blaming, I see it as advice for the public to try and keep them safe. They've said its unusual for lone plain clothes police officers to approach people in public and if this happens there's some advice for people to follow to keep them safe. What do you want them to do? Just carry on like nothing has happened? There's absolutely no victim blaming involved, the Met know they need reforms to restore public faith but that takes time and in the mean time they have offered some guidance on what to do if found in these situations. Like I said above right now any officer without ulterior motive should be understanding as to why these questions are being asked for them and if they aren't then red flags should start to be waved, why else would they not be happy with the person they're speaking to asking to speak to someone on their radio to ensure they're legit? Either way your initial post of "Just wave a bus down" was disingenuous as it seemed that this was the only advice the Met had offered. You also simply don't know if any of that would have saved Sarah's life either, that's projection, if Couzens wasn't able to answer those questions then maybe she would have struggled rather than being placed in handcuffs and brought attention to what was going on to possible passers by?