Topic: LFC's next manager - chat and informed speculation

[smutchin]

Us being willing to go big on a DM last summer doesn’t mean Slot, Hughes and Edwards will feel the same, though of course they might.

I'm optimistic they'll be able to find a better player than Caicedo at a better price. It's what they do.

[Garlic Red]

It's a fair question, but the nature of it kind of illustrates my point. We're not building from scratch, but getting a new manager in inevitably leads to a bit of a renovation. So the progress we need isn't necessarily easily measurable, it's more nuanced than finishing top 4 or winning a cup.

I think unless it's really obvious that Slot isn't the right fit, league position isn't overly important in the first year. It's about him getting the club, communicating well with the fans, establishing his system and style of play, improving players, moving on the right players if needed. If those things are happening, I could take a year of less pleasing results. I'm also not saying that I don't think we will finish top 4 - I think we probably will - it's more the language around "demands" and "minimum expectations" that I find a little unpalatable.

I agree with this. We’re entering into the unknown - massively - and that can go in so many different directions. Sticking a minimum expectation on a manager in his first year, for me at least, isn’t fair or the right way of going about it. I’m not really arsed how people perceive big clubs should act or the expectations they should set, I just want to see my club going in the right direction and believe the new bloke’s the right person to lead the club.

I think those setting expectations in year 1 - even simply finishing top 4 - sound a bit like Chelsea fans who knee jerk their way through half the managers in Europe because they want immediate results. There’s heaps of evidence throughout every era of football that most of the best managers need time to start achieving. This is the most competitive league in the world, a few poor results can lead to weeks - sometimes months - of poor results, it’s truly unforgiving so expecting the club to kind of carry on where it left off under Jurgen, for me at least, is setting the bar high. We can still finish top 4 but the reality is Klopp’s built this entire thing, it’s geared up for him to overachieve, we can’t dismiss the new fella if he can’t get the same results with the same squad. As you say, I just want to see the signs are there and worry about the results later. If the signs are there we should do pretty well.

[Peabee]

We have what, the 4th or so highest wage bill in the country? We must be mismanaged then if top four is success.

[Henry Chinaski]

Regarding whether Slot wants a number 6... I think the following transcript from an extremely popular Dutch football program is quite telling (spoiler: Johan Derksen, the most populist curmudgeon in Dutch media, who truly knows his football, believes he'll be a huge success):

--

Host: Do you think Slot will do well there?

René van der Gijp: "Well… You know, Klopp is practically a messiah there, right? We might say he hasn’t achieved much in the past two years, but he's a big deal. He was the same at Dortmund. That farewell at Dortmund with Klopp, the tears and the frenzy… It was madness. He’s so popular there… Now he's third, but with City and Arsenal, that happens. He would have preferred to win the championship, but alas, it wasn’t to be.

“I think Slot would be wise to gradually phase out players like Salah and van Dijk. Yes, let them go. Look, Van Dijk, for instance… You know, I just read that Dortmund wants him to replace Hummels. Then he’d be playing in a league that’s a bit less intense than England."

Johan Derksen: “René, I'm convinced that Slot will excel there. His entire career is proof of that. Nothing but praise as an assistant coach at Cambuur. Fantastic. Then he moved to AZ, where they soon considered him more vital than the head coach. He did well as head coach there. He could have joined Feyenoord and, frankly, he's outperformed Dick Advocaat.

Host: "Yes, but he has better players at his disposal, I'd argue. Dick (Advocaat) couldn’t bring anyone in then. It was during COVID, and I believe he managed to get some players afterward, right?”

Johan Derksen: "True, but Feyenoord? No one could get that team off the ground. There have been many coaches and he has succeeded, so I have the utmost confidence in Slot."

Van der Gijp: "You are moving up, aren’t you? From the sub-sub-subtop of Europe to the absolute top of Europe and one of the world's largest clubs. He deserves it, though. It’s fantastic that he’s getting this chance."

Derksen: “His personality merits that support. The fact that he upholds standards of decency. He's a decent, cheerful man. I think he'll fit in well there. He won’t grumble at the English press like the Manchester United coach does. He knows how to charm them properly."

Host: "Yeah, interestingly enough, in another program, both Wesley (Sneijder) and Dick (Advocaat) said, ‘don’t bring too many Dutch players, it’s not wise’. There are already three, so he doesn’t want more. But he wants to bring Geertruida."

Derksen: “Van Gaal did the same at Barcelona.”

Host: “Dick said: ‘I did it myself at Glasgow Rangers, but it's not advised to have too many Dutch players there at once. Only the very best are accepted."

Van der Gijp: “Right, the worst example is Anthony, of course. Again this weekend… So much money paid for him, and yet again this weekend. That’s a no. That’s the worst example.

“But look, with (Lusharel) Geertruida you’ve got a guy who can play center, right-back, or midfield. He’s a bit like Daley Blind. He can play so many roles, so he's really a good guy. But the others - Timber, Wieffer, well… He shouldn’t bring them."

--

It appears Slot may already view Geertruida as a squad solution for the number 6. Otherwise, quite encouraging words from the gentlemen, right? I follow the program a bit as a Dutch speaker, and I must say, they've always been tough on Ten Hag.

[Kopenhagen]

It appears Slot may already view Geertruida as a squad solution for the number 6. Otherwise, quite encouraging words from the gentlemen, right? I follow the program a bit as a Dutch speaker, and I must say, they've always been tough on Ten Hag.

Cheers for that. I totally forgot about Advocaat's brief time in England until I saw his name there.

Geertruida seems like a Blind utility type for sure - expect that signing will happen if the fee is right.

Do they dislike Seven Hag ("The Manchester United coach," lol) because he's a miserable robotic sod? Seemed like he wasn't much loved in the Netherlands because of his drywall personality. I always found United fans' coronation of Seven Hag as really bizarre and said as much on here - I mean, he interviewed for the Spurs job and Levy was not convinced by his grim personality. Yet United fans, with their leader, the Rat in Chief, said he was the only option and suddenly became experts on Dutch football, when most who actually knew him noted he didn't have the personality to handle the job. And we've seen the trainwreck it's been ever since. I said as much when they signed him.

On the other hand, I know nothing of Slot, but watching a few interviews you can see he has a personality to handle the job. If anything, his quotes from last week are encouraging, despite causing a weird moral panic on here. He is a charming straight shooter who backs himself and isn't afraid of the media, unlike Seven Hag, who'd rather ban the media from his press conferences and come out with some truly delusional stuff about them being the most entertaining team in the country, etc.

[Henry Chinaski]

Do they dislike Seven Hag ("The Manchester United coach," lol) because he's a miserable robotic sod? Seemed like he wasn't much loved in the Netherlands because of his drywall personality.

He was frequently mocked on the show, especially by René van der Gijp, who would imitate his hoarse voice and odd mannerisms at press conferences. They regard him as a bullshit merchant, a grim reaper.

This is Van der gijp imitating Ten Hag.

[Samie]

Tap-in saying evreything is done, it's just we're waiting to announce it.

[bornandbRED]

The centre back situation will be interesting. Van Dijk feels some way past his best and there may have to be some serious thinking going into giving him a new deal, but he’s the only CB bar Quansah that we can rely on to stay fit. 

[Draex]

Tap-in saying evreything is done, it's just we're waiting to announce it.

He'll be re-wording this 5 times a day till we announce it.

[newterp]

He'll be re-wording this 5 times a day till we announce it.

$$$$$$

[danm77]

The centre back situation will be interesting. Van Dijk feels some way past his best and there may have to be some serious thinking going into giving him a new deal, but he’s the only CB bar Quansah that we can rely on to stay fit.

VVD has been on fire this season, barring the last couple of months.

[Mighty_Red]

The centre back situation will be interesting. Van Dijk feels some way past his best and there may have to be some serious thinking going into giving him a new deal, but he’s the only CB bar Quansah that we can rely on to stay fit. 

Unless we got some insane offer or he really wants to go, no way way we let VVD go. Think he will sign for another 2 years. We just need to start looking for his successor which could be Quansah by then.

[mickeydocs]

It appears Slot may already view Geertruida as a squad solution for the number 6. Otherwise, quite encouraging words from the gentlemen, right? I follow the program a bit as a Dutch speaker, and I must say, they've always been tough on Ten Hag.
[/quote]

Great post, thanks for sharing. Has Geertruida played as a 6?

[In the Name of Klopp]

It appears Slot may already view Geertruida as a squad solution for the number 6. Otherwise, quite encouraging words from the gentlemen, right? I follow the program a bit as a Dutch speaker, and I must say, they've always been tough on Ten Hag.


Great post, thanks for sharing. Has Geertruida played as a 6?

I hope we sign a proper number 6 and stop playing players out of position. I don't know who's available, but there has to be an above-average DCM out there somewhere. 

[wemmick]

It appears Slot may already view Geertruida as a squad solution for the number 6. Otherwise, quite encouraging words from the gentlemen, right? I follow the program a bit as a Dutch speaker, and I must say, they've always been tough on Ten Hag.


Great post, thanks for sharing. Has Geertruida played as a 6?

So instead of a dedicated 6, we'd have our own version of John Stones? I wonder if Slot would play a 4 CB system like City -- Gomez, VVD, Konate, and Geertruida? Seems like Geertruida plays on the right for Feyenoord. Maybe Trent will move into one of the 3 attacking midfield spots?

[Garlic Red]

So instead of a dedicated 6, we'd have our own version of John Stones? I wonder if Slot would play a 4 CB system like City -- Gomez, VVD, Konate, and Geertruida? Seems like Geertruida plays on the right for Feyenoord. Maybe Trent will move into one of the 3 attacking midfield spots?

To be honest, I’d be happy to see the club get creative regarding a 6. I mentioned this in the transfer thread the other day but I can remember United being in for Fabinho when he was at Monaco, at the time he was being mooted as a right back/centre back option. By the time we signed him he was one of the best 6s in Europe. Not every player can do what Fabinho did, obviously, but the 6 market is embarrassingly weak, there’s a reason we were offering double market value for Caicedo 12 months ago and haven’t been able to find a solution since the Tchouameni deal didn’t come off, there’s a dearth of elite options. Maybe getting creative and using a defender there could be the solution.

[Henry Chinaski]

It appears Slot may already view Geertruida as a squad solution for the number 6. Otherwise, quite encouraging words from the gentlemen, right? I follow the program a bit as a Dutch speaker, and I must say, they've always been tough on Ten Hag.


Great post, thanks for sharing. Has Geertruida played as a 6?

Yes. He usually plays as a central defender or right-back, but in the Dutch league, he's seen as a tactical asset in midfield because of his excellent reading of the game and clever passing ability. Initially, they even saw him as an attacking midfielder, apparently.

[LovelyCushionedHeader]

Regarding whether Slot wants a number 6... I think the following transcript from an extremely popular Dutch football program is quite telling (spoiler: Johan Derksen, the most populist curmudgeon in Dutch media, who truly knows his football, believes he'll be a huge success):

--

Host: Do you think Slot will do well there?

René van der Gijp: "Well… You know, Klopp is practically a messiah there, right? We might say he hasn’t achieved much in the past two years, but he's a big deal. He was the same at Dortmund. That farewell at Dortmund with Klopp, the tears and the frenzy… It was madness. He’s so popular there… Now he's third, but with City and Arsenal, that happens. He would have preferred to win the championship, but alas, it wasn’t to be.

“I think Slot would be wise to gradually phase out players like Salah and van Dijk. Yes, let them go. Look, Van Dijk, for instance… You know, I just read that Dortmund wants him to replace Hummels. Then he’d be playing in a league that’s a bit less intense than England."

Johan Derksen: “René, I'm convinced that Slot will excel there. His entire career is proof of that. Nothing but praise as an assistant coach at Cambuur. Fantastic. Then he moved to AZ, where they soon considered him more vital than the head coach. He did well as head coach there. He could have joined Feyenoord and, frankly, he's outperformed Dick Advocaat.

Host: "Yes, but he has better players at his disposal, I'd argue. Dick (Advocaat) couldn’t bring anyone in then. It was during COVID, and I believe he managed to get some players afterward, right?”

Johan Derksen: "True, but Feyenoord? No one could get that team off the ground. There have been many coaches and he has succeeded, so I have the utmost confidence in Slot."

Van der Gijp: "You are moving up, aren’t you? From the sub-sub-subtop of Europe to the absolute top of Europe and one of the world's largest clubs. He deserves it, though. It’s fantastic that he’s getting this chance."

Derksen: “His personality merits that support. The fact that he upholds standards of decency. He's a decent, cheerful man. I think he'll fit in well there. He won’t grumble at the English press like the Manchester United coach does. He knows how to charm them properly."

Host: "Yeah, interestingly enough, in another program, both Wesley (Sneijder) and Dick (Advocaat) said, ‘don’t bring too many Dutch players, it’s not wise’. There are already three, so he doesn’t want more. But he wants to bring Geertruida."

Derksen: “Van Gaal did the same at Barcelona.”

Host: “Dick said: ‘I did it myself at Glasgow Rangers, but it's not advised to have too many Dutch players there at once. Only the very best are accepted."

Van der Gijp: “Right, the worst example is Anthony, of course. Again this weekend… So much money paid for him, and yet again this weekend. That’s a no. That’s the worst example.

“But look, with (Lusharel) Geertruida you’ve got a guy who can play center, right-back, or midfield. He’s a bit like Daley Blind. He can play so many roles, so he's really a good guy. But the others - Timber, Wieffer, well… He shouldn’t bring them."

--

It appears Slot may already view Geertruida as a squad solution for the number 6. Otherwise, quite encouraging words from the gentlemen, right? I follow the program a bit as a Dutch speaker, and I must say, they've always been tough on Ten Hag.

Geertruida is predominately a right back.

[Henry Chinaski]

Geertruida is predominately a right back.

In the Ajax-game, the only time I saw Feyenoord play this season (at some pub while visiting a festival in The Hague), he was deployed at centre-back. But yes, mostly RB!

[TepidT2O]

Geertruida is predominately a right back.

Geertruida’s name is virtually unpronounceable let me tell you!

[mattD]

Regarding whether Slot wants a number 6... I think the following transcript from an extremely popular Dutch football program is quite telling (spoiler: Johan Derksen, the most populist curmudgeon in Dutch media, who truly knows his football, believes he'll be a huge success):

--

Host: Do you think Slot will do well there?

René van der Gijp: "Well… You know, Klopp is practically a messiah there, right? We might say he hasn’t achieved much in the past two years, but he's a big deal. He was the same at Dortmund. That farewell at Dortmund with Klopp, the tears and the frenzy… It was madness. He’s so popular there… Now he's third, but with City and Arsenal, that happens. He would have preferred to win the championship, but alas, it wasn’t to be.

“I think Slot would be wise to gradually phase out players like Salah and van Dijk. Yes, let them go. Look, Van Dijk, for instance… You know, I just read that Dortmund wants him to replace Hummels. Then he’d be playing in a league that’s a bit less intense than England."

Johan Derksen: “René, I'm convinced that Slot will excel there. His entire career is proof of that. Nothing but praise as an assistant coach at Cambuur. Fantastic. Then he moved to AZ, where they soon considered him more vital than the head coach. He did well as head coach there. He could have joined Feyenoord and, frankly, he's outperformed Dick Advocaat.

Host: "Yes, but he has better players at his disposal, I'd argue. Dick (Advocaat) couldn’t bring anyone in then. It was during COVID, and I believe he managed to get some players afterward, right?”

Johan Derksen: "True, but Feyenoord? No one could get that team off the ground. There have been many coaches and he has succeeded, so I have the utmost confidence in Slot."

Van der Gijp: "You are moving up, aren’t you? From the sub-sub-subtop of Europe to the absolute top of Europe and one of the world's largest clubs. He deserves it, though. It’s fantastic that he’s getting this chance."

Derksen: “His personality merits that support. The fact that he upholds standards of decency. He's a decent, cheerful man. I think he'll fit in well there. He won’t grumble at the English press like the Manchester United coach does. He knows how to charm them properly."

Host: "Yeah, interestingly enough, in another program, both Wesley (Sneijder) and Dick (Advocaat) said, ‘don’t bring too many Dutch players, it’s not wise’. There are already three, so he doesn’t want more. But he wants to bring Geertruida."

Derksen: “Van Gaal did the same at Barcelona.”

Host: “Dick said: ‘I did it myself at Glasgow Rangers, but it's not advised to have too many Dutch players there at once. Only the very best are accepted."

Van der Gijp: “Right, the worst example is Anthony, of course. Again this weekend… So much money paid for him, and yet again this weekend. That’s a no. That’s the worst example.

“But look, with (Lusharel) Geertruida you’ve got a guy who can play center, right-back, or midfield. He’s a bit like Daley Blind. He can play so many roles, so he's really a good guy. But the others - Timber, Wieffer, well… He shouldn’t bring them."

--

It appears Slot may already view Geertruida as a squad solution for the number 6. Otherwise, quite encouraging words from the gentlemen, right? I follow the program a bit as a Dutch speaker, and I must say, they've always been tough on Ten Hag.

Always laugh at the level of discussion with football punditry on the continent versus England.

This is really in depth and quite perceptive, while we get 'Ole's at the wheel, yeah baby!!! Whooo yeah!!!".

Kind of sums up the cultures of the two and why England are so brain addled when it comes to trying to win competitions.

[RayPhilAlan]

To be honest, I’d be happy to see the club get creative regarding a 6. I mentioned this in the transfer thread the other day but I can remember United being in for Fabinho when he was at Monaco, at the time he was being mooted as a right back/centre back option. By the time we signed him he was one of the best 6s in Europe. Not every player can do what Fabinho did, obviously, but the 6 market is embarrassingly weak, there’s a reason we were offering double market value for Caicedo 12 months ago and haven’t been able to find a solution since the Tchouameni deal didn’t come off, there’s a dearth of elite options. Maybe getting creative and using a defender there could be the solution.

Kinda like how we've adapted Bajcetic's game since he first joined as a centreback?

[Giono]

Kinda like how we've adapted Bajcetic's game since he first joined as a centreback?

Fabinho was a defender.

[Samie]

Rumour is announcment on Friday. 

[Barefoot Doctor]

Geertruida’s name is virtually unpronounceable let me tell you!

TAW did a special show on Geertruida and the Feyenoord lad they were talking to seemed to pronounce it as Heertroida…

Interesting personal story actually, apparently only did his first media interview recently as he had a bad stammer. But was made vice captain of Feyenoord so really focused on working on improving his stammer so he could be confident fronting up to the press. The Feyenoord person seemed adamant he’d come here (and would be the only player to follow Slot) and that he’d be a strong utility player. Not necessarily taking any position as first choice, but playing more often than not due to his versatility.

[MBL?]

Biggest worries about him is this supposed all out all the time approach. I find this a bit odd as well since he seems to love pep and I don't really seem themnin that way.

Other thing is that he's Dutch. He will 100% say stuff that people don't like. Whether it be fans, players, oppo or those above him. It's the way of the world.

[RobbieRedman]

anyone else got the feeling he's gonna win the lot in his first season?

[CHOPPER]

anyone else got the feeling he's gonna win the lot in his first season?

Slot a chance of it happening.

[stjohns]

Always laugh at the level of discussion with football punditry on the continent versus England.

This is really in depth and quite perceptive, while we get 'Ole's at the wheel, yeah baby!!! Whooo yeah!!!".

Kind of sums up the cultures of the two and why England are so brain addled when it comes to trying to win competitions.

Bang on, this. Reminded me of an occasion a year or so ago where Thierry Henry was on some pundit panel with the usual British suspects. His beautifully spoken English compared to that of those goons was a total embarrassment.

[Black Bull Nova]

I think we need a deadline after which puns on Arne's second name have to cease. Break the ban and it's a ban and an encouragement to find a job as a headline writer for a tabloid.

[SamLad]

Learnings for Slott (he won't have encountered):

The number of games we play 60+ v 40
Crazy scheduling -  Christmas and Saturday noon kick-offs after South American games on Thursday
The League cup
The Everton (and to an extent Man United) games that define their season.
Man City, Arsenal; 2 of the beat teams in Europe. And the rest of the top half probably superior to all the the Dutch League.
Different premier league rules regarding what constitutes a foul
Referees determined to be unbowed by the Pressure of Anfield
Typically xenophobic pundits, the Koeman and Ten Haag experience in the premier league hasn't done him any favours
The CL format means no dead rubbers so we could run out of steam at the business end of the season.

You'd advise him to start the players slow and keep a bit in the tank - but of course if we draw a few games early on or god forbid lose a couple he'll be under a lot of pressure - it's hard to navigate. Good luck Arne 

interesting list. not to mention a tad worrying. do these concerns ring true to those who are familiar with him / the Dutch league?

[Bend It Like Aurelio]

Biggest worries about him is this supposed all out all the time approach. I find this a bit odd as well since he seems to love pep and I don't really seem themnin that way.

Other thing is that he's Dutch. He will 100% say stuff that people don't like. Whether it be fans, players, oppo or those above him. It's the way of the world.

He’s not exactly all balls out from what I’ve seen. They’re fairly methodical in their buildup play. But they press from all angles with more players, while our pressing these days is very structured towards midfield traps.

And the Dutch themselves think he’s genuinely a good human being that takes no shit. I honestly think that’s a great thing.

[Ratboy3G]

Apparently van Persie is on Slot's coaching staff at Feyenoord, maybe he'll come in and teach the forwards how to score

[Garlic Red]

Biggest worries about him is this supposed all out all the time approach. I find this a bit odd as well since he seems to love pep and I don't really seem themnin that way.

Other thing is that he's Dutch. He will 100% say stuff that people don't like. Whether it be fans, players, oppo or those above him. It's the way of the world.

Not sure how you don’t think Pep is an all out attack coach?

He seeks to dominate the game on every single level, yes they may be ‘risk averse’ at times but it’s irrefutable it’s the best way to dominate games and win if you have the best players around to play that way.

Pep’s obviously evolved to appreciate the more defensive players and the balance they bring, particularly in preventing counter attacks and shutting down the opposition’s best player, but he’s still an incredibly attacking coach who sets his teams up to dominate. Arteta is much of the same, yes they sometimes take less risks, they would rather recycle the ball to generate the right possession than go forward at will, but it’s all in the name of dominating the game in the opposition’s half.

[LovelyCushionedHeader]

Apparently van Persie is on Slot's coaching staff at Feyenoord, maybe he'll come in and teach the forwards how to score

Probably not the right person to teach them how to not get injured though

[Mahern]

anyone else got the feeling he's gonna win the lot in his first season?

I think he's going to be amazing, where that leads us who knows.

[B0151?]

anyone else got the feeling he's gonna win the lot in his first season?

I can't wait for that first interview. I think it will put everyone fully on board. We like to moan here (like everyone i guess) but also we love a great character and someone to rally behind. I think that Slot will be very good at that, FSG could have made a very wise appointment in that regard.

[KirkVanHouten]

Imagine how we young lads felt 50 years ago when the great Bill Shankly, right out of the blue, called it a day. Heartbroken & traumatised is the only way I could describe it. Turned out OK in the end though didn't it ? Keep the faith. We've got a great squad so our new manager is half way there already. If he's as tactically switched on as many people are saying, then we could be in for more fun times.

This is a good post for perspective. Thanks mate

[KirkVanHouten]

Depends what they're willing to invest in the team ultimately.

Although it'll help a lot if we make better strategic decisions. 2016-2018 - really good and on point (and with the same structure we'll have now). 2019 to 2023 a lot of questionable decision making with recruitment. As much from signings we didn't make as much as signings we did and that also comes back to budgets and also being more ruthless in moving players on.

Also if Klopp wasn't leaving, maybe we'd have got an experienced midfielder in in January who could have made the difference.

Honestly the decision making since 2019 is the probably the most concerning. Just strange choices and unnecessary risks that didn’t seem to pay dividends in later seasons.

[rossipersempre]

Rumour is announcment on Friday.