Topic: Arsenal: Top of the divers league

[ScottishGoon]

Never said you did. (Often the 'you' is a general comment, meaning 'Arsenal'.) But what I'm saying is, you'll (Arsenal) have to automatically improve. Not 'maybe'. This is the consequence of being the team trying to push City to the absolute limit. But already, there are Arsenal fans saying, well, KDB's getting older and Walker's getting slower, like City will won't make the adjustments to replace them. Maybe all this will change when Pep's gone. Or maybe the game itself is already gone.

I know we’ll need to improve, and I look forward to seeing if we can do that. All I’m saying is that I don’t take it for granted that we will like some are accusing me of.

I know the challenge and I know it’s a feckin difficult one, but let’s give it a go! If not we can all just hope Pep fecks off in a season or so.

Yes unlike normal winning teams that have cycles, their cycle could potentially never end because they have unlimited funds and are allowed to operate outside ffp regulations. It is obscene.
We just have to keep knocking on the door and hope they get served some justice, on the filed or off it.

I’m not sure mate. They’ve been built up for years with the sole purpose of luring Guardiola as manager. The signed Barca executive’s, and built the off the field structure all around hiring him.

I think when he goes, there’s a chance that the club might need a bit of a reset, as I wouldn’t be surprised if the likes of Soriano and Begiristain go with him.
I don’t think they’ll go away, but I think they’ll come back to the chasing pack at least.

[John C]

But thinking of the bigger picture, I hope City close it out to reiterate what cheating c*nts they are, and what a toothless corrupt farce the PL is.

I don't agree with the notion that we need them to win the league to prove they are cheating c*nts. Facts, figures, accounts and investigations can only prove that. And has been - hence 115.
They might win leagues because they are cheating c*nts, but we shouldn't want title wins to prove it, that doesn't get them punished. Relevant information only proves it.

[Tonyh8su]

Sorry Tony, I need to have a chuckle at this level of moan from you today! 

Funny how quick the cheating is accepted.

[BigBrainArteta]

It's strange watching another side sell themselves dreams about how things will be so much better year on year completely ignoring potential season derailing injuries and issues that hamper your season

Teams arnt where they are by random. The place in the league table is a product of the quality of players and how well the manager organizes them. I dont see anything random about our current position in the league. We have some of the best players in the league and a manager who is showing signs of real quality. Most of our top players are on big contracts and under the age of 25. Arteta will be backed in the market again, we will be able to sell Nelson, ESR and Nketiah ro give us more FFP breathing room.

Whatever happens this season, remains to be seen. However going into next season I really see no reason why Arsenal will 'drop off'.

[Bucko - Dubai]

They are starting to sense it happening to them

[Clint Eastwood]

Kinda hope City win it. If they win, it’s just another trophy that no one will remember and no one will respect, that one day may get stripped from them. It will rile up more people in London and therefore cause more outrage about City’s cheating over the last decade.

If Arsenal win there will be a party all summer. The celebrations would be huge, especially with these Arsenal players. It will also be Arteta equalling Klopp’s PL which I cannot accept. People would actually respect their title. There will be more celebrations and acclaim in one night than City’s treble winners got in a year.

Also let’s not forget everyone calling to null and void the one year that we finally managed to keep the cheats at arms length.

So I’d rather City win another meaningless trophy.

[ScottishGoon]

Funny how quick the cheating is accepted.

It was just what you actually said to make your point, ending with ‘White standing in front of the keeper’, I just found it funny. If you had said obstructed or impeded then it would have been a bit more dramatic.

I don't agree with the notion that we need them to win the league to prove they are cheating c*nts. Facts, figures, accounts and investigations can only prove that. And has been - hence 115.
They might win leagues because they are cheating c*nts, but we shouldn't want title wins to prove it, that doesn't get them punished. Relevant information only proves it.

Exactly John, I don’t get the line of argument that City winning will help expose how corrupt the league is, and maybe more pressure will be applied to damage them, or words to that affect.

Whoever wins the league, City, Arsenal, Liverpool or anyone else in the future, it won’t change any punishment 1 iota. City’s punishment will be decided in a court room, by a score of lawyers and people in suits that will get even more wealthy as this 1 will drag and drag I think. And that being the case, they’ll hire a massive team of the best lawyers and try and run rings round the accusations.

There’s now nothing on the pitch that happens now, will affect what happens off the pitch at these hearings, and to think so is just massively clutching at straws.

Better to just say you prefer City to win the league because everyone is used to them winning it now, and if anyone else like Arsenal wins it then it becomes a bit of an event, like Clint eventually does. That’s honest, instead of coming up with a justification that it might damage the cheats long term, when it won’t make any difference whatsoever.

[The North Bank]

I think if city were a properly run club, more people will want us to win it, to knock them off their perch, like with united under fergie (they only cheated on the field unlike city). But because City have cheated their way to this position its easier for people to stomach them winning it again and again *because its the nearest thing to a void season where if my team doesnt win it no one credible wins it* . None of that will be reflected in the record books though, 4 in a row (and counting) including a treble, will go down as the greatest era of dominance in the history of English football.

[Knight]

Kinda hope City win it. If they win, it’s just another trophy that no one will remember and no one will respect, that one day may get stripped from them. It will rile up more people in London and therefore cause more outrage about City’s cheating over the last decade.

If Arsenal win there will be a party all summer. The celebrations would be huge, especially with these Arsenal players. It will also be Arteta equalling Klopp’s PL which I cannot accept. People would actually respect their title. There will be more celebrations and acclaim in one night than City’s treble winners got in a year.

Also let’s not forget everyone calling to null and void the one year that we finally managed to keep the cheats at arms length.

So I’d rather City win another meaningless trophy.

By no means a dig at you Clint because this is a common theme on this forum at the moment. That said...

I think it's pretty smalltime to have this mentality. As if Liverpool aren't a big enough club to cope when other teams also achieve impressive things. I've always thought it small time to witness the whole league root against us against City because they can't cope with the prospect of other teams succeeding if they can't (with a sense that City's success doesn't count) so I'm not going to turn into them now.

As for City, normally everyone wants the cheats to lose - there's an inbuilt sense of justice that makes us feel like that in loads of different contexts. Root against the cheats, always root against the cheats. Wanting the cheats to win is just so bizarre. They don't care how you feel about their win, they just want to win. By cheating. It's brilliant when cheats can't even win when they cheat. All football fans should want City to fail, whoever that means ends up succeeding.

[Draex]

Next season I hope a keeper stamps on Whites foot and breaks some toes anytime he starts his cheating on set pieces.

[JRed]

To be honest, I don’t want Arsenal to win it because I don’t want that detestable little prick Arteta being level with Klopp on PL titles. Doesn’t seem right. Plus there’s the way Arsenal play, cheating, diving and cry arsing. They are reffed differently to us which pisses me off. Then there is obviously the TNB factor aswell 😉

[The North Bank]

To be honest, I don’t want Arsenal to win it because I don’t want that detestable little prick Arteta being level with Klopp on PL titles. Doesn’t seem right. Plus there’s the way Arsenal play, cheating, diving and cry arsing. They are reffed differently to us which pisses me off. Then there is obviously the TNB factor aswell 😉

Strongly disagree with all your points apart from the last one.

[6BigCups]

To be honest, I don’t want Arsenal to win it because I don’t want that detestable little prick Arteta being level with Klopp on PL titles. Doesn’t seem right. Plus there’s the way Arsenal play, cheating, diving and cry arsing. They are reffed differently to us which pisses me off. Then there is obviously the TNB factor aswell 😉

I can’t support the idea of wanting such a cheating gang of shithouses to win, and be lauded for it. If 115 win at least no one would give a shit.

[rob1966]

Getting invested in the next opposition city face.. Chris fucking woods man.... Next its wolves with half a team out.

Come on you Spurs, its football mate, Big Ange is our last chance.

Its like us relying on Everton, you're dreaming if you think they won't bend over for ADFC

[killer-heels]

Arteta is a c*nt but he is one hell of a coach. I still maintain that at both ends of the field Arsenal don't have top quality but what he has done has been able to build a system which suffocates most Premier League sides, so much so that they don't need an absolute elite backline/goalkeeper or striker.

That would not work in Europe however and in the CL, where you need to have both a system and that individual quality. But for the Premier League its been highly effective.

[rob1966]

They are starting to sense it happening to them

Ah poor little Arsenal

I can’t support the idea of wanting such a cheating gang of shithouses to win, and be lauded for it. If 115 win at least no one would give a shit.

I despise the cheating pricks and that lego headed Captain Black wankstain. If they do win it, then the narrative is "oh the league is competitive" whereas the more the cheats win it the more it gets like Ligue 1 and the more it might actually wake some c*nts up.

[The North Bank]

Its like us relying on Everton, you're dreaming if you think they won't bend over for ADFC

Desperate times , “its how you play mate” . Spurs fans will definitely want city to win, but to be fair to Ange hes not bought into their small time bitterness and wants to build a competitive football team.

Theyll still lose because theyre hopeless at corners and city have a lot of height so will do what we did yesterday.

[The North Bank]

Arteta is a c*nt but he is one hell of a coach. I still maintain that at both ends of the field Arsenal don't have top quality but what he has done has been able to build a system which suffocates most Premier League sides, so much so that they don't need an absolute elite backline/goalkeeper or striker.

That would not work in Europe however and in the CL, where you need to have both a system and that individual quality. But for the Premier League its been highly effective.

I think our centre back partnership is as good as any in Europe. Agree about not having an elite keeper or striker. Keeper is good enough for the league given how we suffocate teams as you say, but with the passes Odegaard threads through we should have a 20 goal striker/wide forward. That needs addressing in the summer.

[PatriotScouser]

It'll be typical 'Spursy' to flop when playing their biggest rivals and turn it on against the team that their biggest rivals are competing against for the league.

I half expect them to get a result too...

[thaddeus]

Arsenal seem to have had the rub of the green this season with referee decisions.  The swing in the game from a penalty and potentially 1-1 to nothing given and 0-2 was huge.

I am a bit jealous as our central defenders have been soft for my liking this season but Arsenal's get away with roughing up players constantly.  Arguably we wouldn't get away with similar defending which is perhaps why we're as soft as we are.

As we've dropped out of the race I hope they go on to win it but I don't see Man City dropping any more points even though they're not playing particularly well.

[lobsterboy]

Fair play to Arteta though.
We were mocking him a few years back but as his experience grows, he is becoming a very good coach.
Might even end up at 115 when Ped leaves.

[The North Bank]

Fair play to Arteta though.
We were mocking him a few years back but as his experience grows, he is becoming a very good coach.
Might even end up at 115 when Ped leaves.

League 2 would be a real test of his credentials

[killer-heels]

I think our centre back partnership is as good as any in Europe. Agree about not having an elite keeper or striker. Keeper is good enough for the league given how we suffocate teams as you say, but with the passes Odegaard threads through we should have a 20 goal striker/wide forward. That needs addressing in the summer.

I think the centreback partnership is helped a lot by the structure ahead of it and the fact that White helps out and you have Rice in front, plus midfielders who work their arses off. I think individually they can be rattled, but the system is so risk averse that it stops them being exposed.

But yeah the goalkeeper is ok at best. But you do have some fantastic footballers and the coaching is top class.

[Crosby Nick]

When you have a really solid spine it can elevate you as we saw with Alisson, Virg +1 and Fabinho. I’d say that was stronger than what Arsenal put out but what they have is still too strong for most of the league. We’ve definitely lost some of that solidity in the last few seasons.

Agree that they went from potentially 1-1 to 2-0 in a flash and that was huge for them. Didn’t think they played well enough to deserve to be 3 up but at the same time they shouldn’t have been worrying about conceding a third at the end either. The goals they conceded were self inflicted and unlike them.

If they win the title no one could say they didn’t deserve it. They are in that horrible situation of watching and hoping for a City slip up. Feels like Spurs or nothing and you don’t want to be relying on them. But who knows. Would be funny if a Spurs player found some infamy!

And worth repeating that a points deduction should be given for Rice’s haircut.

[ScubaSteve]

They are starting to sense it happening to them

This will hurt them a lot more than the last title chase. I hope city win it

[The North Bank]

I think the centreback partnership is helped a lot by the structure ahead of it and the fact that White helps out and you have Rice in front, plus midfielders who work their arses off. I think individually they can be rattled, but the system is so risk averse that it stops them being exposed.

But yeah the goalkeeper is ok at best. But you do have some fantastic footballers and the coaching is top class.

Yeh thats a good assessment

[Chris~]

I'm kind of interested in how much longer Saka can keep playing the amount of minutes he does with the role he has. Maybe he's just a freak but even someone like Salah who played a lot of minutes I feel like we ended up needing to give him less defensive responsibility. Where as, to me, it seems at the moment Saka goes through a lot of running back and off the ball work and is going to have pretty much no summer breaks with England. Feels like at some point that needs to tip.

[The North Bank]

I'm kind of interested in how much longer Saka can keep playing the amount of minutes he does with the role he has. Maybe he's just a freak but even someone like Salah who played a lot of minutes I feel like we ended up needing to give him less defensive responsibility. Where as, to me, it seems at the moment Saka goes through a lot of running back and off the ball work and is going to have pretty much no summer breaks with England. Feels like at some point that needs to tip.

We desperately need to sign cover there next season to help Saka out. Olise/Pedro neto would be ideal, despite their questionable injury record. Super players.

[RedDeadRejection]

The more teams that experience City pipping them to a league, the more chance we may have of getting rid of the shit stains as it won't just be "lol Liverpool" anymore.

[Chris~]

We desperately need to sign cover there next season to help Saka out. Olise/Pedro neto would be ideal, despite their questionable injury record. Super players.

Thing is though, if you get cover does Saka actually sit out many more games, maybe 5 more league games and doesn't worry about the domestic cups at all? Like with Salah for us if he was fit, he played, because he was that good and you usually need those difference makers on the pitch to get 90+ points. Just think at some point you'll need to give him less defensive work and then how does that knock on effect look. I think Arteta getting so many players to committ in the running to press and then get back in shape quickly is a massive plus for you. Just not sure how long it can be sustained with the same core. Like I say, just interested in how long it can last and maybe it just doesn't matter, but just basing it off our experience really.

[Yorkykopite]

I was impressed by Arsenal's defence yesterday. They absolutely defend as a team and are exceptionally quick at getting men behind the ball when things go wrong. As an attacking side you have to be perfect to capitalise on the counter-attack. One slightly miscontrolled pass and a slight loss of momentum and it's too late. Arsenal's midfield will reorganise between you and the goal. A better team than Tottenham might have made life more difficult for Arsenal. A number of promising moves - especially on the Arsenal left - broke down or lost momentum because passes were slightly behind Son or because Son was scruffy in his first touch. But it's asking a lot of any team to get everything right when you're on the counterattack and trying to do things quickly.

The two weaknesses at the back I guess are the goalie (wrong shape and size for a start) and Gabriel who still gets squared up on one-on-ones. But how do you even get one on one with him? That's the problem. I was impressed yesterday by how quickly both Rice and - especially - White got into position to help him and stop him being isolated. White's not much cop with the ball at his feet but that's not his job at Arsenal. He's there to defend and cover ground. He's good at both.

We're out of it now. Who do we want to win? As a club Arsenal are obviously preferable to Man City. Man City aren't even a club in the genuine sense. As a team, though, I'd take City any day. I know that's not popular on here. We're meant to be bored by them. But I find that hard. Their creativity on the ball, especially when Foden and De Bruyne are in harness, is amazing. And Rodri is such a wonderful player too. And there's this. They don't dive and feign injury as much as Arsenal. They don't get their noses in front and then wind down the clock. Their instincts are much more positive than an Arteta team could be. I lost count yesterday (again!) of how many times Arsenal players pretended to be injured, many clutching their faces, as they tried to disrupt Tottenham's momentum in the second half. There's a sneakiness to them that deserves to fail.

[Son of Spion]

If I put aside how irritating Captain Black is, I think it will be a sad day for football when the 115* 'win' the title at their expense. They've built a strong side who are lasting the pace. For all the gripes about the equally irritating play acting, they're still a proper football club that's going to have a great season yet be cheated out of their reward.

I really don't care how hard they'd celebrate. If they win it, they'd deserve it. I certainly wouldn't begrudge them.

Looking at the bigger picture, another genuine club being cheated does see more than one fanbase (ours) seething over the cheating by the 115*. That might slightly increase the leverage of those of us kicking back against the rampant cheating going on, as yet unaddressed.

[BigBrainArteta]

Fair play to Arteta though.
We were mocking him a few years back but as his experience grows, he is becoming a very good coach.
Might even end up at 115 when Ped leaves.

I wouldnt worry about that. Arteta is where he belongs. Former player and captain, never celebrated any of City's goals agianst us when he was the assistant there.

Arteta will be manager of Arsenal for years to come.

[Bobsackamano]

We desperately need to sign cover there next season to help Saka out. Olise/Pedro neto would be ideal, despite their questionable injury record. Super players.

Olise is too good to settle for being backup, the potential is their to be top draw. He has a good attitude as well, the fly in the ointment is the injury record however he is still only 22 so could grow out it.

Anyway hope Arsenal win the league now, definitely be worthy winners.

[Terry de Niro]

Arteta is a c*nt

You should have stopped right there.   

[AthleticClub]

I wouldnt worry about that. Arteta is where he belongs. Former player and captain, never celebrated any of City's goals agianst us when he was the assistant there.

Arteta will be manager of Arsenal for years to come.

Pressure is on next season if he bottles it again and ends another season trophy less. Imagine the ground will be empty 5 minutes before time against Everton if City are cruising you gang of rats.

[Crosby Nick]

I wouldnt worry about that. Arteta is where he belongs. Former player and captain, never celebrated any of City's goals agianst us when he was the assistant there.

Arteta will be manager of Arsenal for years to come.

What if Everton come calling? Or Rangers? He had some poor taste in football clubs.

[The North Bank]

Olise is too good to settle for being backup, the potential is their to be top draw. He has a good attitude as well, the fly in the ointment is the injury record however he is still only 22 so could grow out it.

Anyway hope Arsenal win the league now, definitely be worthy winners.

CL expands next season doesn’t it? You dont have to be a starter to start 20 games a season anymore. Hes versatile enough as well so wouldn’t just be Sakas back up. Palace will demand top dollar for him though.

[Cusamano]

I wouldnt worry about that. Arteta is where he belongs. Former player and captain, never celebrated any of City's goals agianst us when he was the assistant there.

Arteta will be manager of Arsenal for years to come.

They are not the pull they once were but if Barcelona come calling it will be interesting to see what happens

Wont be anytime soon anyway

[Lisan Al Gaib]

They are not the pull they once were but if Barcelona come calling it will be interesting to see what happens

Wont be anytime soon anyway

Barca, Bayern, PSG or Bayern come in for him and he'll be off before their fans can steal another song off another club