Author Topic: Spurs vs Liverpool 2-1 Post Match Reaction  (Read 69379 times)

Offline HarryLabrador

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Re: Spurs vs Liverpool 2-1 Post Match Reaction
« Reply #640 on: August 16, 2009, 10:30:27 pm »
Rafael Benítez cries foul to referee but Liverpool begin poorly
David Hytner at White Hart Lane
Sunday 16 August 2009 22.09 BST

Rafael Benítez made passing reference to a meeting which he had attended "the other day" to address the thorny issue of referees, their decisions and how managers ought to react to them in the prickly heat of the moment. "They said we cannot speak about the referee as a person [or] about their decisions," said Benítez, the Liverpool manager, as he sweated in an airless post-match press conference suite at White Hart Lane.

What the Spaniard said next came without a shrug of his shoulders but it roughly equated to "What the hell". The new season might be a matter of days old but the task of gagging managers in the face of perceived injustices appears to be as thankless as ever. In the case of the contentious moments here, the emphasis ought to be on the word 'perceived'.

Having already been awarded a stonewall penalty, for a foul by the Tottenham goalkeeper, Heurelho Gomes, on Glen Johnson – which was converted by Steven Gerrard – Benítez watched as his substitute Andriy Voronin was levered off the ball inside the penalty area on 86 minutes by Benoît Assou-Ekotto.

Arms outstretched, Benítez reacted incredulously when the referee Phil Dowd kept his hands behind his back. His mood, and that of the Liverpool coaching staff, was not improved moments later when Fernando Torres cannoned a shot against Assou-Ekotto, and Dowd ignored the appeal for handball.

"I think everyone could see there was a penalty, especially to Voronin, it was so clear," said Benítez. "The third one, you could excuse. You can say that the hand was to the ball or the ball was to the hand, it could be, but the other one was so clear, it was unbelievable. Can you get two penalties at an away ground? No. With this referee, I knew that this was impossible."

Benítez was asked what he thought of the referee's overall performance. He remained tight-lipped but theatrically took off his spectacles and held them up for inspection. The non-award for the Assou-Ekotto handball shout brought the red mist down on Sammy Lee, the Liverpool assistant manager. He directed a volley of abuse at the fourth official Stuart Attwell, who is a relative rookie at the age of 26, and, at one point, Benítez had to step in to separate the pair. Lee could not remain quiet and, after continued protests, he was sent to the stands. The sight of him stomping angrily off down the tunnel summed up Liverpool's frustrations.

"The fourth official is a young referee and maybe he needs to calm down a bit," said Benítez. "He is too young. Sammy will be banned from the touchline but the only thing with Sammy is that he cannot score goals for us. So hopefully Torres will do his job."  ;D

This was an isolated moment of humour. There was little for Benítez to smile about and, in truth, his moans about the officials not only did him no credit but it obscured the consensus that Liverpool deserved nothing from the game.

Benítez, who saw Jamie Carragher receive stitches in a head wound and Martin Skrtel depart with stitches and a damaged jaw after a first-half collision between the pair, did acknowledge that his team "did not play well, especially in the first-half" and that they had not been "comfortable in possession". "We need to improve in the middle, keeping the ball," he added. "The understanding between the strikers and the midfielders has to be much better."

Victory against Stoke City at Anfield on Wednesday night, he said, was now imperative but Benítez denied that Xabi Alonso's absence was a factor in the disjointed performance; the playmaker has left to join Real Madrid. Harry Redknapp, however, was not so sure.

"They are going to miss him," said the Tottenham manager. "He is a quality player. I felt today that Liverpool didn't get the ball into Gerrard playing in that hole off Torres. It would have been hard to press Liverpool like we did if Alonso had been in the team because he is so clever and he can turn the ball around corners with just one touch."

If Liverpool have to improve, Tottenham need to build upon an excellent result, which featured a host of fine individual performances, from Assou-Ekotto and the debutant Sébastien Bassong, who headed the winning goal, to Luka Modric and Wilson Palacios.

"Palacios gives us something different," said Redknapp. "He is that Graham Roberts type of player that Tottenham haven't had for years. We have changed the team around in terms of characters and we look a much better group of players."

http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/2009/aug/16/rafael-benitez-liverpool-tottenham-penalty-referee
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Offline BCCC

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Re: Spurs vs Liverpool 2-1 Post Match Reaction
« Reply #641 on: August 16, 2009, 10:31:13 pm »
I reckon its evens that they'll get booed off at half time on Wednesday if we're not beating Stoke.
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Re: Spurs vs Liverpool 2-1 Post Match Reaction
« Reply #642 on: August 16, 2009, 10:32:04 pm »
Two home games in a row now, Stoke & Villa, then Bolton away then Burnley at home.

We'll set ourselves up ripe and sweet for the season with those games.

Nice run of games to get the fire burning, trust me.

Can see us getting the full 12 points from those. No reason why we can't batter all 4 of them.

Unfortunately the doom merchants will find something else to complain about.
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Re: Spurs vs Liverpool 2-1 Post Match Reaction
« Reply #643 on: August 16, 2009, 10:32:06 pm »
They talk some shite, but half the time, they also talk sense but a lot of our fans are too blind to see it as if no one has the right to say anything negative about a club of our stature that hasnt won a league title in 19 years.

Bollocks.

If they were just to talk reliably about the game and what goes on then fine.

But if you haven' realised by now that's not what they are there for - they are there for generating 'interest' and 'conversation' and people watching their shite football station. They have more agendas than Boots after a ink spill over christmas - then fair play - you never, ever wil.

The only people I've heard spout more shite than Sky is the newspapers.

They talk crap and what's more they do it on purpose. Because no one can be that thick*


* Apart from Sky fans who know no better obviously
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Offline Paul JH

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Re: Spurs vs Liverpool 2-1 Post Match Reaction
« Reply #644 on: August 16, 2009, 10:32:33 pm »
Not to get on the lads case, but when was the last time Ryan Babel had a decent match for us, where you came away from the game or watching it saying 'he was great today, ran them ragged'?

Can't remember any in the last 12 months.

Oh, and anyone saying Hoddle, Keys and Redknapp talked sense today fucking baffles me.
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« Last Edit: August 16, 2009, 10:34:04 pm by Paul JH »
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Offline Marko B

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Re: Spurs vs Liverpool 2-1 Post Match Reaction
« Reply #645 on: August 16, 2009, 10:34:33 pm »
Positives: - Johnson was fantastic and looks like he could have a stormer of a season, Lucas was excellent in the middle, and Yossi was also brilliant when he came on. Also noteworthy was Insua once again looking assured as well as Ayala doing the same.

Negatives: Skrtel and Carra definitely not 100%, Babel and Torres absolutely atrocious (in Torres defence he at least looked a slight danger late on), Masche, Gerrard and Voronin (penalty aside) were largely anonymous, injuries.

First game of the season was never going to run smoothly especially considering Spurs are a decent side and despite the awful refereeing (penalty aside it was shocking both ways). Onwards and upwards but there were definitely positives that make me confident for the rest of the season.

Onwards and upwards.

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Offline Giono

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Re: Spurs vs Liverpool 2-1 Post Match Reaction
« Reply #646 on: August 16, 2009, 10:36:27 pm »
How many times can we keep on saying that? Hes now in his 3rd year with us and I dont think there has been any improvement.

He had a great 1st season when his confidence was high and a crappy second season when his confidence was low. The 2nd part is the part you remember.

Partly he was terrible last season because defenders new how to defend against him. They close-in because they know that he won't pass. They just have to strip it from him. But that adjustment period for defenders is normal. Now he has to develop another trick to trump them again...passing. If he was to be able to look fir the pass while sucking-in defenders like that, he'd be a huge asset.

I'm willing to give him one more season to develop, and it looks like Rafa is too.



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Re: Spurs vs Liverpool 2-1 Post Match Reaction
« Reply #647 on: August 16, 2009, 10:36:48 pm »
Oh and i love the fact its a general rule that you cant get two penalties away from home even if they are pens.

WTF?
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Offline LFCfan4Life

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Re: Spurs vs Liverpool 2-1 Post Match Reaction
« Reply #648 on: August 16, 2009, 10:37:11 pm »
Not to get on the lads case, but when was the last time Ryan Babel had a decent match for us, where you came away from the game or watching it saying 'he was great today, ran them ragged'?

Can't remember any in the last 12 months.

your right but then again couldn't say that about gerrard, torres, kuyt, masch, carra or srktel either today they were all poor

Babel was also targeted by two or three spurs players every time he had the ball to ensure he didn't get a free run at anyone or the box

Two bulls, one old and one young, standing at the top of a field watching a herd of cows. The young one says, "hey let's run down and fuck one of them", and the older one says, "patience, let's walk down and fuck them all".

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Offline Paul JH

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Re: Spurs vs Liverpool 2-1 Post Match Reaction
« Reply #649 on: August 16, 2009, 10:37:28 pm »
Positives: - Johnson was fantastic and looks like he could have a stormer of a season.

After seeing him today, I think at home, he could be the difference between draws and wins. He gives us something Arbeloa didn't at home, an extra attacking option.
Can see already why Rafa signed him, his run today for the penalty was excellent and at home, I think we need something more from the full backs against teams who sit back.

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Offline Fordy

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Re: Spurs vs Liverpool 2-1 Post Match Reaction
« Reply #650 on: August 16, 2009, 10:37:53 pm »
Reina

Johnson
Agger
Skrtel
Aurelio

Masch
Lucas

Kuyt
Gerrard
Babel

Torres


Is one team.


Cavalieri

Degen (Not good enough)
Carragher
San Jose ( needs more experience)
Insua

Spearing/Plessis (Both lack experience)
Aquilani  (Newly brought)

Dossena  (Not good enough)
Benayoun
Babel

Voronin (Not good enough)
Ngog     (Not experience enough)


I think that aside from the 2nd team's forwards and centre back, we've got two very strong teams.

Reina

Johnson
Agger
Skrtel
Aurelio

Masch
Lucas   (Needs to raise his game)

Kuyt
Gerrard
Babel   (Clearly doesnt produce for us)

Torres


Is one team.


Cavalieri

Degen (Not good enough)
Carragher
San Jose ( needs more experience)
Insua

Spearing/Plessis (Both lack experience)
Aquilani  (Newly brought)

Dossena  (Not good enough)
Benayoun


Voronin (Not good enough)
Ngog     (Not experience enough)

We can put two teams together but the we lack quality in depth.

Offline Bjornar

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Re: Spurs vs Liverpool 2-1 Post Match Reaction
« Reply #651 on: August 16, 2009, 10:38:34 pm »
the lucas defenders camp went into completely unnecessary overdrive which prompted multiple posts with the usual rolling eyes bollocks and smartarse comments. Those same defendents castigate Babel and I'm struggling to see the difference between the two in terms of IMPACT.

Spot on.

Offline RK7

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Re: Spurs vs Liverpool 2-1 Post Match Reaction
« Reply #652 on: August 16, 2009, 10:38:38 pm »
Last season although very good showed we had a severe lack of depth, yet we all pointed to the fact that we were unbeaten for a long period. It was like a broken record at times. Today was another example of our lack of depth.

Every time Torres goes down I find myself worried, we need quality cover. Teams below us are improving, we need to find more options soon.

Offline Paul JH

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Re: Spurs vs Liverpool 2-1 Post Match Reaction
« Reply #653 on: August 16, 2009, 10:39:43 pm »
your right but then again couldn't say that about gerrard, torres, kuyt, masch, carra or srktel either today they were all poor

Eh?

Yes, but Gerrard, Kuyt, Masch etc have all had many MANY games in the last 12 months where they've put in great performances. Ryan Babel hasn't. I'm not on about just today, today was his chance again, and he didn't take it. There's not one game in the last 12 months where he's put in a match winning or outstanding performance.
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Offline walshys_mullet

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Re: Spurs vs Liverpool 2-1 Post Match Reaction
« Reply #654 on: August 16, 2009, 10:41:22 pm »
Rafael Benítez cries foul to referee but Liverpool begin poorly
David Hytner at White Hart Lane
Sunday 16 August 2009 22.09 BST

Rafael Benítez made passing reference to a meeting which he had attended "the other day" to address the thorny issue of referees, their decisions and how managers ought to react to them in the prickly heat of the moment. "They said we cannot speak about the referee as a person [or] about their decisions," said Benítez, the Liverpool manager, as he sweated in an airless post-match press conference suite at White Hart Lane.

What the Spaniard said next came without a shrug of his shoulders but it roughly equated to "What the hell". The new season might be a matter of days old but the task of gagging managers in the face of perceived injustices appears to be as thankless as ever. In the case of the contentious moments here, the emphasis ought to be on the word 'perceived'.

Having already been awarded a stonewall penalty, for a foul by the Tottenham goalkeeper, Heurelho Gomes, on Glen Johnson – which was converted by Steven Gerrard – Benítez watched as his substitute Andriy Voronin was levered off the ball inside the penalty area on 86 minutes by Benoît Assou-Ekotto.

Arms outstretched, Benítez reacted incredulously when the referee Phil Dowd kept his hands behind his back. His mood, and that of the Liverpool coaching staff, was not improved moments later when Fernando Torres cannoned a shot against Assou-Ekotto, and Dowd ignored the appeal for handball.

"I think everyone could see there was a penalty, especially to Voronin, it was so clear," said Benítez. "The third one, you could excuse. You can say that the hand was to the ball or the ball was to the hand, it could be, but the other one was so clear, it was unbelievable. Can you get two penalties at an away ground? No. With this referee, I knew that this was impossible."

Benítez was asked what he thought of the referee's overall performance. He remained tight-lipped but theatrically took off his spectacles and held them up for inspection. The non-award for the Assou-Ekotto handball shout brought the red mist down on Sammy Lee, the Liverpool assistant manager. He directed a volley of abuse at the fourth official Stuart Attwell, who is a relative rookie at the age of 26, and, at one point, Benítez had to step in to separate the pair. Lee could not remain quiet and, after continued protests, he was sent to the stands. The sight of him stomping angrily off down the tunnel summed up Liverpool's frustrations.

"The fourth official is a young referee and maybe he needs to calm down a bit," said Benítez. "He is too young. Sammy will be banned from the touchline but the only thing with Sammy is that he cannot score goals for us. So hopefully Torres will do his job."  ;D

This was an isolated moment of humour. There was little for Benítez to smile about and, in truth, his moans about the officials not only did him no credit but it obscured the consensus that Liverpool deserved nothing from the game.

Benítez, who saw Jamie Carragher receive stitches in a head wound and Martin Skrtel depart with stitches and a damaged jaw after a first-half collision between the pair, did acknowledge that his team "did not play well, especially in the first-half" and that they had not been "comfortable in possession". "We need to improve in the middle, keeping the ball," he added. "The understanding between the strikers and the midfielders has to be much better."

Victory against Stoke City at Anfield on Wednesday night, he said, was now imperative but Benítez denied that Xabi Alonso's absence was a factor in the disjointed performance; the playmaker has left to join Real Madrid. Harry Redknapp, however, was not so sure.

"They are going to miss him," said the Tottenham manager. "He is a quality player. I felt today that Liverpool didn't get the ball into Gerrard playing in that hole off Torres. It would have been hard to press Liverpool like we did if Alonso had been in the team because he is so clever and he can turn the ball around corners with just one touch."

If Liverpool have to improve, Tottenham need to build upon an excellent result, which featured a host of fine individual performances, from Assou-Ekotto and the debutant Sébastien Bassong, who headed the winning goal, to Luka Modric and Wilson Palacios.

"Palacios gives us something different," said Redknapp. "He is that Graham Roberts type of player that Tottenham haven't had for years. We have changed the team around in terms of characters and we look a much better group of players."

http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/2009/aug/16/rafael-benitez-liverpool-tottenham-penalty-referee

Thing is Rafa has a point.

Yeah so we didnt play well.

So yeah we probably didnt deserve anything.

But that doesnt mean that when we do craft a bloody great opening that the opposition should go unpunished whether we are playing them off the field or being hammered.

Its just systematic of this country to pour scorn on fair play. No one was complaining last year when we battered them off the park and lost.

And all the apologists who put up with the likes of Bassong playing - he shouldnt have played end of. And because the rules are soft and people in this country are just willing to go along with things because 'thats just the way it is' thats why things dont get any better, whether in football or not.

If you put up with S***e, you'll recieve s***e.

Im glad Benítez moaned because he had bloody good reason too.
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Offline Marko B

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Re: Spurs vs Liverpool 2-1 Post Match Reaction
« Reply #655 on: August 16, 2009, 10:41:30 pm »
your right but then again couldn't say that about gerrard, torres, kuyt, masch, carra or srktel either today they were all poor

Babel was also targeted by two or three spurs players every time he had the ball to ensure he didn't get a free run at anyone or the box



Come off it now, fair is fair but when you spend 3/4 of the game with no left side and as soon as Yossi comes on the situation is totally reversed it gives you a very big picture of the situation as a whole.
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Offline Songs to Sing

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Re: Spurs vs Liverpool 2-1 Post Match Reaction
« Reply #656 on: August 16, 2009, 10:41:57 pm »
Ive been saying for a while now, we just need more quality players, that much is clear. If rafa doesnt sign more players by the deadline, ill be astonished.
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Offline its cold in the stands

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Re: Spurs vs Liverpool 2-1 Post Match Reaction
« Reply #657 on: August 16, 2009, 10:42:40 pm »
Oh and i love the fact its a general rule that you cant get two penalties away from home even if they are pens.

WTF?

to be honest mate i dont think we deserved a point.
but for reina and some terrible finishing that could have been embaressing, anyway, keane`s miss from about 3 yards out reminds us why we sold him back to spurs.

Offline Crackerjack Sam

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Re: Spurs vs Liverpool 2-1 Post Match Reaction
« Reply #658 on: August 16, 2009, 10:44:48 pm »
Reina

Johnson
Agger
Skrtel
Aurelio

Masch
Lucas   (Needs to raise his game)

Kuyt
Gerrard
Babel   (Clearly doesnt produce for us)

Torres


Is one team.


Cavalieri

Degen (Not good enough)
Carragher
San Jose ( needs more experience)
Insua

Spearing/Plessis (Both lack experience)
Aquilani  (Newly brought)

Dossena  (Not good enough)
Benayoun


Voronin (Not good enough)
Ngog     (Not experience enough)

We can put two teams together but the we lack quality in depth.
That's good enough for me. Thank you clearing that up Fordy, I'm off to bed.
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Offline walshys_mullet

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Re: Spurs vs Liverpool 2-1 Post Match Reaction
« Reply #659 on: August 16, 2009, 10:45:05 pm »
to be honest mate i dont think we deserved a point.
but for reina and some terrible finishing that could have been embaressing, anyway, keane`s miss from about 3 yards out reminds us why we sold him back to spurs.

mate we deserve a pen when its a pen regardless of how we are performing, those are the rules.
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Offline LFCfan4Life

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Re: Spurs vs Liverpool 2-1 Post Match Reaction
« Reply #660 on: August 16, 2009, 10:45:13 pm »
Eh?

Yes, but Gerrard, Kuyt, Masch etc have all had many MANY games in the last 12 months where they've put in great performances. Ryan Babel hasn't. I'm not on about just today, today was his chance again, and he didn't take it. There's not one game in the last 12 months where he's put in a match winning or outstanding performance.

last season was shit for him, we all know that, but he still had his moments like united and madrid home but look back to 2007/08 season and he was brilliant

but im willing to give everyone a clean slate and see what goes on from here

one game into the season is way too early to start taking about bad performances especially when so many of the team were shit
Two bulls, one old and one young, standing at the top of a field watching a herd of cows. The young one says, "hey let's run down and fuck one of them", and the older one says, "patience, let's walk down and fuck them all".

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JUSTICE 4 THE 96.

Offline El Campeador

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Re: Spurs vs Liverpool 2-1 Post Match Reaction
« Reply #661 on: August 16, 2009, 10:45:42 pm »
Ive been saying for a while now, we just need more quality players, that much is clear. If rafa doesnt sign more players by the deadline, ill be astonished.

How about Rafa adds Aurelio, Riera, Agger, Aquilani, and El Zhar to the squad, and we play two central defenders who don't have bashed brains for an hour, would that be acceptable? Think we'd beat Spurs if that was the case?

Offline xabi14

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Re: Spurs vs Liverpool 2-1 Post Match Reaction
« Reply #662 on: August 16, 2009, 10:47:47 pm »
last season was shit for him, we all know that, but he still had his moments like united and madrid home but look back to 2007/08 season and he was brilliant

but im willing to give everyone a clean slate and see what goes on from here

one game into the season is way too early to start taking about bad performances especially when so many of the team were shit
Many of his best performances, and goals for that matter, have come whilst out on the Right though. Derby at home, Geordies away 07/08 for starters

Offline RedinExile

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Re: Spurs vs Liverpool 2-1 Post Match Reaction
« Reply #663 on: August 16, 2009, 10:48:02 pm »
Eh?

Yes, but Gerrard, Kuyt, Masch etc have all had many MANY games in the last 12 months where they've put in great performances. Ryan Babel hasn't. I'm not on about just today, today was his chance again, and he didn't take it. There's not one game in the last 12 months where he's put in a match winning or outstanding performance.
How many good games has Lucas put in if that is your angle?
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Offline Crackerjack Sam

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Re: Spurs vs Liverpool 2-1 Post Match Reaction
« Reply #664 on: August 16, 2009, 10:50:20 pm »
Ive been saying for a while now, we just need more quality players, that much is clear. If rafa doesnt sign more players by the deadline, ill be astonished.
He's right, simple as. At least another striker.
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Re: Spurs vs Liverpool 2-1 Post Match Reaction
« Reply #665 on: August 16, 2009, 10:50:29 pm »
We really missed Riera today, his control and passing would have really helped us stretch the play: another natural player is his position is starting to look really crucial gap in the squad for us. Bigtime.

I don't think we should overreact but I struggling to get away from the feeling that we lack a player or two and that we not going to find them in our reserves or youth teams.
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Offline red_dub

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Re: Spurs vs Liverpool 2-1 Post Match Reaction
« Reply #666 on: August 16, 2009, 10:50:30 pm »
first game of the season, not happy but what can you do, away from home plus pre-season hasn't been great.

one thing i can say is that spurs could bring pavylchenko and crouch on, we had vorinon.need more options!!

next.......
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Offline buttersstotch

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Re: Spurs vs Liverpool 2-1 Post Match Reaction
« Reply #667 on: August 16, 2009, 10:50:32 pm »
I know there's a mentality that we shouldn't moan who we get 1st game of the season - but it DOES matter. Whilst Chelsea and Man Utd have relatively easy home games, we have probably one of the most difficult away games all season. The difference between the Tottenham and Liverpool players' fitness levels was massive. And it showed.

Every 50/50 ball - Spurs looked like getting it. It was no suprise Torres get stronger as the game went on, as he got fitter. We were just off the boil today. Not gonna look into it in too much detail as it was just one of those things.

I am a little bit worried about our stength in depth. I hope Benitez has got a couple more signings lined up, or else injuries could take their toll.

Johnson looks ace though. Definitely what we needed. But he was putting in decent balls into the box and there was 1 red shirt and 3 white shirts in the box. This needs to improve. Gerrard, Kuyt and Babel needed to support Torres in the box, as against two big strong defenders he's got a 10% chance of putting the ball back in the next, especially when he's half fit.

People seem to be hitting the panic buttons too much. Chelsea and Man Utd were not much better than us in their opening games - difference being they played Hull and Birmingham. If we get beat on Wednesday then yes RING ALARM BELLS

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Re: Spurs vs Liverpool 2-1 Post Match Reaction
« Reply #668 on: August 16, 2009, 10:51:05 pm »
He had a great 1st season when his confidence was high and a crappy second season when his confidence was low. The 2nd part is the part you remember.

Partly he was terrible last season because defenders new how to defend against him. They close-in because they know that he won't pass. They just have to strip it from him. But that adjustment period for defenders is normal. Now he has to develop another trick to trump them again...passing. If he was to be able to look fir the pass while sucking-in defenders like that, he'd be a huge asset.

I'm willing to give him one more season to develop, and it looks like Rafa is too.

I would argue the opposite. He was poor in first season, but because it was his first he was forgiven. When he carried on in the same vein in his second season, the explaination that it was his first season no longer applied and it dawned that hes not going to get any better (with us anyway, certainly not writing his carrer off, just his career with us).
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Offline hobbes2007

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Re: Spurs vs Liverpool 2-1 Post Match Reaction
« Reply #669 on: August 16, 2009, 10:53:41 pm »
1 game ladies and gents, just 1 game. Let's not go overboard on how bad we were, or come up with lots of rationales about how great we are in reality.



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Offline Giono

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Re: Spurs vs Liverpool 2-1 Post Match Reaction
« Reply #670 on: August 16, 2009, 10:56:27 pm »
Yes, but whenever he's been given the chance on the left over the last 12 months (it's not just today), he's failed miserably. There's the odd game when he plays ok, but have you ever looked and Babel and thought 'he was great today'. Seriously?

I'd agree with you if it was just today like you say, but it's not, it's over the last 12 months, he's been pretty abysmal, and did nothing today when he had the chance to.
I blame Rafa simply because it's been well documented Babel himself has said that he doesn't like playing on the left, and yet even though he's been poor there for a while, he still gets a game.

It's like when Kuyt was playing badly, but Rafa would never drop him, Rafa is persisting with Babel.
Saying that, it wasn't just him today, a lot of players didn't put the effort in.

You're right. Rafa does have a habit of being loyal to his own instincts. Kuyt, Crouch, Morientes, Lucas...

But I think it is more than just Rafa's patience that puts Babel on the pitch. I think it is his speed and the way that he stretches defenses. That benefits our team more than having him displace someone in the middle. He would prefer that Babel draw defenders with his challenging runs out left rather than up the middle.

To play in the middle takes more than just an eye for goal, it takes the ability to bring other players into the play. So many folks talk about how Torres and Gerrard have an understand. How much understand would Babel and Torres have? Not much.

Look at Yossi. His speed is respected and draws defenders, but they have to cut off passing angles too. So he has more room to run unencumbered and he his more effective up the middle because he can bring others into the play with a quick pass.
 
I'm more than happy to have Babel develop out on the left. He has one more season to become a team player on a top side.






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Re: Spurs vs Liverpool 2-1 Post Match Reaction
« Reply #671 on: August 16, 2009, 10:56:29 pm »
I was hoping Babel would have a good game today, but he struggled to impose himself in any way. The last game I can remember where he impressed was Marseille way in the CL last season, which was in September I think. If the lad could just bag himself a goal then it might give him a shot in the arm. He just seems short on confidence.

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Offline cjc9020801Beverly Hills

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Re: Spurs vs Liverpool 2-1 Post Match Reaction
« Reply #672 on: August 16, 2009, 10:57:31 pm »
Aside from the defeat, and obvious cricisms and tripe which will come our way in the next few days... a bit of humour?? With Carragher, Skrtel, Agger and various young defenders coming through the ranks there will (eventually) be good competition for places. However, it doesn't need 2 of them to take each other out!!  ;)  Seriously mind, well done to both for playing on...it looked horrendous.

Losing one game won't lose us the title...it didn't last season. Last season we lost the title with our home form. Plus 9 of the 11 that started today played in the 4-1 win at Old Trafford last season, and we did that WITHOUT Alonso. So reasons to be positive.
« Last Edit: August 16, 2009, 10:59:22 pm by cac9280 »

Offline Crackerjack Sam

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Re: Spurs vs Liverpool 2-1 Post Match Reaction
« Reply #673 on: August 16, 2009, 10:58:38 pm »
I was hoping Babel would have a good game today, but he struggled to impose himself in any way. The last game I can remember where he impressed was Marseille way in the CL last season, which was in September I think. If the lad could just bag himself a goal then it might give him a shot in the arm. He just seems short on confidence.


As bad as he played today. I would to see him feature more in games.
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Offline LFCfan4Life

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Re: Spurs vs Liverpool 2-1 Post Match Reaction
« Reply #674 on: August 16, 2009, 10:58:44 pm »
1 game ladies and gents, just 1 game. Let's not go overboard on how bad we were, or come up with lots of rationales about how great we are in reality.

agree

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Offline slimbo

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Re: Spurs vs Liverpool 2-1 Post Match Reaction
« Reply #675 on: August 16, 2009, 11:03:49 pm »
Quote
from: RedinExile on Today at 10:27:52 PM
the lucas defenders camp went into completely unnecessary overdrive which prompted multiple posts with the usual rolling eyes bollocks and smartarse comments. Those same defendents castigate Babel and I'm struggling to see the difference between the two in terms of IMPACT.

Well I thought Lucas did ok today in what was a difficult game. Interesting that people still want to have a go at Lucas who played as well as Masch today, and generally had a better passing game than Masch.

As for Babel, well we would expect him to have an impact with the attributes he supposedly has and the position he plays, as per Yossi. Personally, barring injuries to other players, I wouldn't want to see Babel start for us again.

And we didn't deserve a draw. Very flat and sluggish.

Offline RK7

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Re: Spurs vs Liverpool 2-1 Post Match Reaction
« Reply #676 on: August 16, 2009, 11:04:17 pm »
I cant understand the bashing of Babel, he came to us a better player than he is now, described by Van Bastern as the best 20 year old he had ever seen (or something to that effect). The fact is he is not a left winger, how Rafa ignores this baffles me, the lad has no confidence and it shows.
For the Dutch the other night he ripped Johnson apart, Rafa does not stike me as the hand round the shoulder sort of guy.

Offline rafa forever

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Re: Spurs vs Liverpool 2-1 Post Match Reaction
« Reply #677 on: August 16, 2009, 11:04:32 pm »
Lucas had a good game today, thats another positive.
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Re: Spurs vs Liverpool 2-1 Post Match Reaction
« Reply #678 on: August 16, 2009, 11:04:39 pm »
mate we deserve a pen when its a pen regardless of how we are performing, those are the rules.
Is true. It was a clear panalty AND.... their player was stood in a clear offise position for the first goal directly in line with Reinna's line of site. Given the ball rose off the deck until it hit the net and given it went so close to the offside player that he raised his arms to protect himself how could that not be dissallowed for offside and interfering with play or gaining an advantage?
« Last Edit: August 16, 2009, 11:10:52 pm by Shanks1965 »
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Offline maher

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Re: Spurs vs Liverpool 2-1 Post Match Reaction
« Reply #679 on: August 16, 2009, 11:07:32 pm »
our problem that is not solved yet is that we play with lack of width and we try to keep the ball and not play fast passes..
i watched Arsenal yesterday and chelsea..and also Tottenham against us today..they pass the ball very quick and not keeping it so we were struggling..   

actually im concerned about some of the players that we have and we build our hopes on them like Lucas, Babel, Voronin
Lucas is good player and developing but since he joined us i barely see one EXTRA addition of him ..
 Voronin sometimes play well but he do many many mistakes and he doesn't have the EXTRA addition that make a chance for a goal from nothing!
Babel.. well .. many people were saying that Rafa should give him his chance etc.. but let's be serious.. how many times he had his chances to prove himself and he failed?!
except of his super-subs in his first season he was barely good with us.. today for example his efficiency was simply 0% ! his problem is that his effeciency in winning the man to man when he has the ball is very low! not just today..many games that he played he was the same..

our probllem is that we have a lack of width and a lack of the EXTRA additon from many of our players!
our only players that have the EXTRA addition that can lead us to win the league are: Torres, Gerrard, Mascherano, Benayoun, Johnson and i suppose Aquilani too

we still need High Quality winger and Quality Striker at least...we need width!!