Topic: Labour Thread * No Gaza *

[Andy @ Allerton!]

Sorry mate, been out to give blood.
He said lots of jolly good stuff and his final words were actually let's pull together to push the Tories in to the sea.
It'll be on YT.

Hurrah!

[TepidT2O]

Hurrah!

Couple  of clips here Andy.

https://twitter.com/haggis_uk/status/1734528249747706065?s=61&t=IBM61bzNciP9yNB3C-HiEg

Nice to see the word hope being used.

[Robinred]

There was a really good conversation with Angela Raynor on the Leading podcast today with Alastair & Rory.

This from last week, highlighting the Resolution Foundation, was also excellent, and thoughtful, and most of all serious regarding the mess we’re in, and the pathways to reversing the decline.

https://youtu.be/ADM6vpF4_7k?si=GZwLK4P1ZAeqiJoC

[Andy @ Allerton!]

Couple  of clips here Andy.

https://twitter.com/haggis_uk/status/1734528249747706065?s=61&t=IBM61bzNciP9yNB3C-HiEg

Nice to see the word hope being used.

Cheers mate.

[thaddeus]

Wales' First Minister Mark Drakeford resigns

Mark Drakeford has announced he will stand down as Welsh Labour leader in March, to be followed by a leadership contest for a new first minister.

A new party leader in Wales will be elected before Easter, Mr Drakeford said in a statement.

He will remain as first minister until his successor is picked by his party.

Mr Drakeford, 69, who is the Cardiff West Member of the Senedd (MS), was confirmed as first minister exactly five years and one day ago.

He had planned to stand down in 2024 but the timing of his announcement was a surprise.

I think he'll be missed.  I know some of the recent policies like the 20mph speed limits wound people up but he's been a very good first minister.  I think the UK as a whole would be much better off had the past five years been under his stewardship rather than May, Johnson, Truss and Sunak.

On the radio they said he had considered standing down in January when his wife suddenly died but he wanted to give an orderly handover.

With two former legal professionals - Vaughan Gething and Jeremy Miles - favourites to take over the top of the Labour party is looking a bit... bland.

[Slippers]

I think he'll be missed.  I know some of the recent policies like the 20mph speed limits wound people up but he's been a very good first minister.  I think the UK as a whole would be much better off had the past five years been under his stewardship rather than May, Johnson, Truss and Sunak.

On the radio they said he had considered standing down in January when his wife suddenly died but he wanted to give an orderly handover.

With two former legal professionals - Vaughan Gething and Jeremy Miles - favourites to take over the top of the Labour party is looking a bit... bland.

Good riddance.

[reddebs]

Good riddance.

Not many like him do they.  To the point where not many now like his/labour policies and might struggle to win seats at the GE

[Robinred]

Good riddance.

Care to expand? Your disdain tells us nothing.

[Kenny's Jacket]

Not many like him do they.  To the point where not many now like his/labour policies and might struggle to win seats at the GE

Overall I did, He had good polies like UBI for those who grew up in care.
The 20 mph law is daft, made worse by handing, decisions to the councils was a terrible idea

He also spends massive amounts on the nhs, but its terrible, really, really bad.

Its very hard to judge a devolved power, with a set budget#


Its sad that he will be remembered by the 20 mph thing

[Yorkykopite]

There was a really good conversation with Angela Raynor on the Leading podcast today with Alastair & Rory.

Just heard this. She's pretty extraordinary.

[reddebs]

Overall I did, He had good polies like UBI for those who grew up in care.
The 20 mph law is daft, made worse by handing, decisions to the councils was a terrible idea

He also spends massive amounts on the nhs, but its terrible, really, really bad.

Its very hard to judge a devolved power, with a set budget#


Its sad that he will be remembered by the 20 mph thing

I don't mind the 20mph but maybe Anglesey just set it up ok compared to the mainland.

No idea on the NHS stuff as thankfully we don't really need or use it much but we've had all our jabs on time, I've had my smear and mammogram as planned and been seen both by my GP and had an emergency appointment at A&E when I've needed it.

[Fromola]

If Starmer has anything about him he'll enact Leveson 2.

[Kenny's Jacket]

I don't mind the 20mph but maybe Anglesey just set it up ok compared to the mainland.

No idea on the NHS stuff as thankfully we don't really need or use it much but we've had all our jabs on time, I've had my smear and mammogram as planned and been seen both by my GP and had an emergency appointment at A&E when I've needed it.

We have got roads by ours which not long ago we’re 70 mph, they’re now 20.  The council have implemented poorly, but maybe the government should have had more input.

The health board in north wales is constantly in special measures and involved in controversy

However drakeford seemed a decent man who had some good progressive policies

[Andy @ Allerton!]

Care to expand? Your disdain tells us nothing.

I don't go to Wales very often, but last time I did - fucking 70/50 MPH roads were fucking 20

What a fucking inbred cockwobbling c*nt.

Get fucked you fucking idiot.


No offence, like


I can't imagine how hated he must be by locals that have been literally ragged up the hoop by this c*nt.

[Red-Soldier]

If Starmer has anything about him he'll enact Leveson 2.

I agree.  I don't think he will, though.

[oldfordie]

 
Anything more to add to the long list of things Starmer has to do otherwise he's just the same as the Torys.
I think Starmer has to lower the tax on Baccy as the Torys are always putting the tax up every budget, if Labour do the same then Starmers just the same as the Torys,

[Fromola]

Anything more to add to the long list of things Starmer has to do otherwise he's just the same as the Torys.
I think Starmer has to lower the tax on Baccy as the Torys are always putting the tax up every budget, if Labour do the same then Starmers just the same as the Torys,

Even someone as weak as Ed Milliband pressured the government into Leveson In the first place and pledged to enact Leveson 2.

Obviously Starmer can't do everything but this is another chance for a Labour government to bring in voting reform, press reform and generally roll back the facets of Thatcherism the last Labour government continued and often enhanced (Pfi, privatisation, deregulation etc).

It can't just be Blair revisited with no meaningful lasting change, given the utter state of things.

[oldfordie]

Even someone as weak as Ed Milliband pressured the government into Leveson In the first place and pledged to enact Leveson 2.

Obviously Starmer can't do everything but this is another chance for a Labour government to bring in voting reform, press reform and generally roll back the facets of Thatcherism the last Labour government continued and often enhanced (Pfi, privatisation, deregulation etc).

It can't just be Blair revisited with no meaningful lasting change, given the utter state of things.

Ive no problem with people posting what they would like to see Labour bring in, I will agree with many of the suggestions as well so it's not about arguing or disagreeing with the suggestions, it's when those posts go on to say if Starmer/Labour don't implement this then they are no better than the Torys. it loses credibility.

[reddebs]

We have got roads by ours which not long ago we’re 70 mph, they’re now 20.  The council have implemented poorly, but maybe the government should have had more input.

The health board in north wales is constantly in special measures and involved in controversy

However drakeford seemed a decent man who had some good progressive policies

Yeah see they've done it differently here where the only sections of 20mph were previously 30mph and in some cases it's only a small section of the 30 that's been reduced to 20.

All the other roads are as they were.

I know about the special measures but isn't that down to the health minister rather than Drakeford?

As you say he seems a genuine, kind and considerate politician and person which is very rare these days.

[Red-Soldier]

Ive no problem with people posting what they would like to see Labour bring in, I will agree with many of the suggestions as well so it's not about arguing or disagreeing with the suggestions, it's when those posts go on to say if Starmer/Labour don't implement this then they are no better than the Torys. it loses credibility.

Neither of the two posts said anything of the sort.

[TepidT2O]

So everyone has an idea of what sort of things a labour government should be doing…

But what should they prioritise in their first year.

What are the top three poo ivies they must do first?

[oldfordie]

Neither of the two posts said anything of the sort.

No they didn't which is why I never quoted them.

[Sangria]

So everyone has an idea of what sort of things a labour government should be doing…

But what should they prioritise in their first year.

What are the top three poo ivies they must do first?

Renationalise Thames Water and stop the poo ivies from going into the water should be a priority as a policy.

[TepidT2O]

Renationalise Thames Water and stop the poo ivies from going into the water should be a priority as a policy.

That’s one of the first three things you’d do?

[Sangria]

That’s one of the first three things you’d do?

Don't you want to stop poo ivies from going into rivers?

[TepidT2O]

Don't you want to stop poo ivies from going into rivers?

I ask myself this.

Is this important? Fairly, yes.

Will privatising it make a big impact on this or be an effective use of public funds? No.

Wouldn’t be in my top 20

[Fromola]

Ive no problem with people posting what they would like to see Labour bring in, I will agree with many of the suggestions as well so it's not about arguing or disagreeing with the suggestions, it's when those posts go on to say if Starmer/Labour don't implement this then they are no better than the Torys. it loses credibility.

They will be better but they have to build a legacy for change and for keeping the Tories out, not playing it safe and keeping the seat warm for them for 5-10 years time

[Sangria]

I ask myself this.

Is this important? Fairly, yes.

Will privatising it make a big impact on this or be an effective use of public funds? No.

Wouldn’t be in my top 20

I was playing with your auto correct ("poo ivies" rather than "policies").

[Jiminy Cricket]

So everyone has an idea of what sort of things a labour government should be doing…

But what should they prioritise in their first year.

What are the top three poo ivies they must do first?

[Elmo!]

Top poo ivie should just be not to stink the place out.

[Jiminy Cricket]

Top poo ivie should just be not to stink the place out.

I can only suppose that Tepid meant to post that comment to another kind of website altogether.

[TheShanklyGates]

Maybe the priority should be fixing the NHS so Tepid can get his legendary fat fingers seen to.

[oldfordie]

They will be better but they have to build a legacy for change and for keeping the Tories out, not playing it safe and keeping the seat warm for them for 5-10 years time

Well we will have to wait and see what change they bring in and how quickly this happens. if people chose to focus on what they don't do and ignore everything they do with a begrudging they are better than the Torys but.....then that change will never be acknowledged in many eyes.

I take the legacy for change to mean the Country sees them as bringing in many changes that made the country better in so many ways. I wouldn't assume people will notice or remember.

[TepidT2O]

Front page of the telegraph has the first of many lefties lawyers attack on Starmer.

It’s very weak at best

[TepidT2O]

Another day another Starmer story on the front of the telegraph.

It’s so very weak, it really is.  Lawyer acts as lawyer for people. Big wow.

[Red-Soldier]

Another day another Starmer story on the front of the telegraph.

It’s so very weak, it really is.  Lawyer acts as lawyer for people. Big wow.

The majority of the public just want rid of the Tories.  I don't think they care what the Tory press write about now.

Starmer is grey enough to be inoffensive to most.

[Lusty]

Another day another Starmer story on the front of the telegraph.

It’s so very weak, it really is.  Lawyer acts as lawyer for people. Big wow.

They've had 3 and a half years to come up with this stuff and the best they've managed so far is 'his Mum owned a field' and 'he once saved a dog's life'.

The culture war stuff works in America but it won't work over here because they've been in power for 13 years and no one can get a doctor's appointment.  In this country we rely on the government for more services and so at some point you're going to get judged on your record.

[CowboyKangaroo]

Another day another Starmer story on the front of the telegraph.

It’s so very weak, it really is.  Lawyer acts as lawyer for people. Big wow.

Also, I haven't read the story and have no intention to, but surely they are aware that the cab rank rule exists and barristers generally* don't have latitude to turn down a client? And that this rule exists so that barristers aren't criticised for who they represent (as otherwise it would make unpopular people have less access to justice)?

*it does happen, but you have to make up an excuse first. "Terribly sorry, no capacity all of that year for new work", or put your most belligerent clerk on it.

[ToneLa]

Another day another Starmer story on the front of the telegraph.

It’s so very weak, it really is.  Lawyer acts as lawyer for people. Big wow.

Yes, as predicted, the smear campaign

It's truly desperate stuff. I wish tory voters thought about this: If that's all they have to offer, then they are not serving you

[Nobby Reserve]

The execrable Jordan Peterson - darling of the Alt-Right, InCels, and a fair few misguided leftists - having a hissy fit at Labour, screaming that if Labour win power, the UK will 'be Venezuela for 20 years'

Zoe Williams in the Guardian responds...

 

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2023/dec/18/jordan-peterson-labour-ruin-britain-tories


I particularly like her "Peterson lives at the outer edges of audacity, untroubled by considerations such as making sense and being knowledgeable"

and..

"But back to this Venezuela business. There are certain case studies from the past 100 years of economic history that rightwing commentators hit like an eject button, often with a triumphant flourish: “Boom! I bounced out of the argument, wearing the parachute: sayonara, sucker!”

If anyone suggests anything vaguely different from vulture capitalism, these commentators suggest, they are a socialist who will drag down the economy to Venezuela’s level. If anyone suggests the state do anything to alleviate widespread poverty, they are tarred as a money-tree fantasist who will recreate Weimar Germany, where you needed a wheelbarrow of cash to buy a loaf of bread. Any sudden change of regime will result in a Zimbabwe situation – more inflation, more wheelbarrows. Dare to question the prevailing anything since the 2008 financial crash? You will go the way of Greece.

No question, the Venezuelan economy sounds like a tough place in which to thrive. But the parallel doesn’t have the satisfying thunk of plausibility it would need to strike fear into the hearts of voters. We know what economic vandalism looks like, because we have been watching it for years.

It looks like David Cameron and George Gideon Oliver Osborne, son of Sir Peter Osborne, 17th Baronet of Ballentaylor and Ballylemon and Felicity Alexandra Loxton-Peacock, educated at St. Paul's and Magdalen College, Oxford, talking about “backroom savings” when they mean “let’s cut funding to everything and see what’s standing at the end”. It looks like the Brexiters, with their blithe “sovereignty today, prosperity tomorrow, or maybe in 50 years”. It looks like Liz Truss, daring the markets to reject her ideological certainties, only to find they were happy to do so. But what was the harm? It’s only people with a mortgage (more than 14 million of them) who are bearing the brunt; oh, and people who rent, which is nearly everyone else.

It’s quite the argument to make to this benighted country: whatever hardship you are living through, a reckless socialist could make it so much worse. First, it requires ignorance of the nature and causes of hardship in Britain; second, it requires his majesty’s opposition to look anything like socialists."