Author Topic: Re: Brendan Rodgers to remain at LFC - pointless speculation in here please...  (Read 176714 times)

Offline eyescream

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Re: Brendan Rodgers to remain at LFC after positive talks with owners
« Reply #400 on: June 3, 2015, 09:42:43 am »
So, it's a "Do Or Die"season for BR. I hope he'll do better, but somewhat don't feel optimistic.

Offline audioedge

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Re: Brendan Rodgers to remain at LFC after positive talks with owners
« Reply #401 on: June 3, 2015, 09:45:14 am »
I think we have just seen the acceptance of mediocrity. The owners are basically telling us 5th 6th is were we are at (and the statistics prove this) but they do not want to make the big gamble (oh and its a gamble that costs a lot of money) to try and catapult us into a consistent team challenging the top 4. It has been this way for ages now, started going downhill when H&G took over and also when City spent big and took our natural place (well they took Arsenals who then took ours). There is nothing to do but lower your expectations. I must say I preferred Rafas teams, we were hard to beat, and had an attitude an identity. Now we flip-flop between brilliant and shite. Just hope BR signs some hard men and stops us being such fannys in the middle of the park. We will see.
« Last Edit: June 3, 2015, 09:53:56 am by audioedge »

Offline L666KOP

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Re: Brendan Rodgers to remain at LFC after positive talks with owners
« Reply #402 on: June 3, 2015, 09:46:09 am »
Really good OP.
 :)

All I will add, is that FSG made a decision that took courage, especially since the media had done all their legwork in justifying his dismissal.

I just hope they show the courage in backing him this window, and that is best done by buying the players he thinks will get us back on track, not the ones we think will get us back on track.
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Offline Historical Fool

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Re: Brendan Rodgers to remain at LFC after positive talks with owners
« Reply #403 on: June 3, 2015, 09:47:02 am »
I have just read the news in the Guardian. Story can be found here.

On balance, I am pleased that FSG has decided to back the manager. God knows, I have been frustrated with him and his choices this season, but I instinctively dislike the knee-jerk opinions of the modern media, and so have tended to set aside my own impatience as something created by too much reading.

I think it is right that our manager is given more time to make progress. Rationally, I know where we are as a club and the challenges that face us in this football era. Three seasons is not enough to make us perennial contenders on or off the pitch. If the baying mob consider this 'settling for mediocrity' then I accept the label, whilst privately laughing at their sense of entitlement. In my youth, I had my over-developed sense of entitlement satisfied almost every season. I feel for those who have never had that, and can't see that it will never return in the same manner while the structure of football remains 'the money takes it all'.

Having said that, I've been very troubled by the manner of defeats and decisions made this season. Accepting that my knowledge of football is not great, some of the choices in rotation and use of young players have been baffling. Some decisions, in my view, that Rodgers has made have bordered on cowardly, but perhaps are better characterised as inexperienced and over-pressured. He has lost my trust, but I am willing to continue my support in the hope that he will grow through this awful time and realise that he must stick to whatever principles he has and drive on. If his principles are wrong, so be it. But don't chop and change, don't play young players out of position all the time, and don't bend. If you're going to go down, go down doing what you believe in. More than likely, you will succeed.

My lack of trust comes from not actually knowing what his principles are. I loved the manner in which he had us playing last season, not just for the success, but because it was Liverpool through and through. This season, I have had no idea what he wants to achieve, who he is as a manager. Are we to be a Swansea, 'death-by-football' team - which I would personally hate, as the biggest gripes I have are the pointless passing in front of our goal before anything happens and the twenty-minute delay every time we have a throw-in whilst we try and find the 'perfect' throw - or the free-flowing, madcap, go get-'em-tiger of last season, which I loved despite having to take shares in a blood-pressure pharmaceutical factory. Whatever it is Brendan, for fuck's sake please believe in it and stick to it.

FSG have also lost some of my trust, as it's not entirely clear any more that they want us to have the success they brought to the Red Sox. I don't know what their plan is either, but for now they have my support too. By sticking with Brendan, I feel more comfortable that they understand what stability brings, and that their end of season review - which is clearly not going to be shared with us, the supporters, for whatever inscrutable reasons - has been thorough and provided detailed conclusions up which they will act decisively. Keeping Brendan is a good move, in my view, because radical change will inevitably bring radical instability, and there is no manager out there aside from Rafa who I would trust to get the club right. All the rest would suffer from the same horror show we as supporters have served up for Rodgers this season, probably even more so.

The players I am more sanguine about. I think we did pretty well last transfer window, and that our young players will be much better in their second season. Returning to my theme above, I consider we did them no favours by the constant chopping and changing of their roles - as a leader myself, I believe strongly in getting new people to excel in their correct role before challenging them with instability. Indeed, the first rule of change management is to ensure people can mentally cope with the change around them by giving them some sense of their role and allowing them to achieve in it. Setting people up to fail, when all around them is also crashing, will cause psychological crises, especially in youngsters in the early twenties. This is my biggest criticism of Rodgers' management - bearing in mind he's young too, at least in managerial terms - and it is why, in my opinion, the wheels finally fell off badly in the last third of the season. There's a point in a crisis where people just give up through confusion and psychological weariness.

The commitment to stability, after a period of holiday, will do everyone a power of good. However, I would expect Rodgers to meet with each player now, apologise for his indecision and mistakes, and agree a way forward that they can embrace. In a few weeks time, if that air is cleared now, they will reassemble full of fight and clarity for the new season. It's not easy, but it is liberating - I've done it myself after a calamitous year of my own mistakes, and my teams (business not sports) have always appreciated the frankness and honesty. They also however, want direction with the humility - people want leaders, however flawed, to lead with decisiveness. I hope Brendan has that in him.

Finally, the fans I have less hope for. I am disappointed by some of what I have read on this site and heard from people elsewhere. We are all influenced by the media, of course, and our own disappointments. The saddest thing is that we turn on each other, and I hope that tidal wave of resentment on either side flows back from whence it came. The joy of being a Liverpool supporter, for me at least, has always been the tight knit sense of community - that we belong to something, together, that is greater than football, that our city and people represent, and that the club represents through sport. It's a privilege that we should enjoy whatever league our club plays in, however well we do.

I hope that process of healing will be helped by great success this coming season, and that Rodgers and the players that wear the red shirt will show us marvellous things once again. But I hope we re-unite as supporters too, and support our manager and team through whatever comes, storm or dawn.

That's terrible. I keep reading it as Brendan Rodgers' Ghost to remain at LFC after positive talks with owners.

Not just once, either, a few times.

Terrible.
You're all too fucking serious, the lot of you. Relax, we don't really matter.

Oh, and we should have an in's and out's topic, stickied.

Offline Caffeine

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Re: Brendan Rodgers to remain at LFC after positive talks with owners
« Reply #404 on: June 3, 2015, 09:47:43 am »
If the status quo is being maintained with the manager, then FSG must acknowledge that change is required behind the scenes. And I don't just mean 'targetting Prem-proven experience', I mean a fundamental change to the way players are targetted and their clubs approached. Last summer resulted in an omnishambles of a season, and we cannot let that happen again.

If nothing changes within "the committee" or above Rodgers, then I will have lost a lot of faith in FSG and it will cement the opinion of many supporters that they are content to tread water, sell young players on for huge profit, expand the stadium then sell up when the price is right.

I hope Rodgers proves me wrong and manages to construct a coherent playing style based on a sensible means of targetting players this summer. I hope if we sign Benteke, he proves me wrong too. I hope Rodgers can organise a defence next season.

I do think if there was no better option, Klopp, Ancelotti etc, then there is little point sacking the manager for the sake of it, but I worry we are going to waste another summer of £Xm investment in players for a manager who may be under extreme pressure should we not start the season well.

I am also really struggling to see where the leadership is going to come from next season, with a young manager, inexperienced coaching staff, and a playing squad now completely devoid of leadership bar one or two potential players.
« Last Edit: June 3, 2015, 09:50:28 am by Joga »

Offline ThePoolMan

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Re: Brendan Rodgers to remain at LFC after positive talks with owners
« Reply #405 on: June 3, 2015, 09:49:32 am »
Last season's amateuristic misteps have caused a massive erosion of confidence in Rodgers and in the team that he has working with him - particularly Ian Ayre, fellows and Edwards. I for one have been left with little trust in their judgement. Still, since the decision has been made by FSG, I will support them and stop calling for their immediate removal for now.

Howevrer, for all of FSG's public show of support, Rodgers must be aware that he is living on borrowed time and that he has to perform next season or he will be gone, just like that. I can only hope for the club's sake that Ayre, Edwards and Fellows were also made aware of this in regards to themselves. 


Offline RedinEd

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Re: Brendan Rodgers to remain at LFC after positive talks with owners
« Reply #406 on: June 3, 2015, 09:49:44 am »
Overall, I am disappointed that Rodgers is staying for all the reasons given in the excellent opening post. I do wonder whether FSG made any effort to talk with the likes of Klopp, Ancelotti, Emery etc; if not I feel that was an opportunity missed.
I will continue supporting LFC of course, as I have done for the last 50 years. However, I have never felt quite as dejected as I currently am about the style and quality of play we showed this past season, our poor performance in the transfer market or the management's ambition.
I can only hope that Rodgers will finally learn from his numerous mistakes and give us a team to be proud of.

Offline ThePoolMan

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Re: Brendan Rodgers to remain at LFC after positive talks with owners
« Reply #407 on: June 3, 2015, 09:49:55 am »
If the status quo is being maintained with the manager, then FSG must acknowledge that change is required behind the scenes. And I don't just mean 'targetting Prem-proven experience', I mean a fundamental change to the way players are targetted and their clubs approached. Last summer resulted in an omnishambles of a season, and we cannot let that happen again.

If nothing changes within "the committee" or above Rodgers, then I will have lost a lot of faith in FSG and it will cement the opinion of many supporters that they are content to tread water, sell young players on for huge profit, expand the stadium then sell up when the price is right.

I hope Rodgers proves me wrong and manages to construct a coherent playing style based on a sensible means of targetting players this summer. I hope if we sign Benteke, he proves me wrong too. I hope Rodgers can organise a defence next season.

I do think if there was no better option, Klopp, Ancelotti etc, then there is little point sacking the manager for the sake of it, but I worry we are going to waste another summer of £Xm investment in players for a manager who may be under extreme pressure should we not start the season well.

+1

Offline paul211b

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Re: Brendan Rodgers to remain at LFC after positive talks with owners
« Reply #408 on: June 3, 2015, 09:51:13 am »
Bit Meh! about this really.   With Klopp on a break I would have hoped that FSG spoke to him.   So I will back Rogers but I think he has to hit the ground running next season, or will be replaced by Klopp in January or at the end of next season. 
My only worry is how much money we let him spunk on average players before then.

Offline Dr Otto

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Re: Brendan Rodgers to remain at LFC after positive talks with owners
« Reply #409 on: June 3, 2015, 09:54:52 am »
Very disappointed. The phrase "managing expectations" seems to be bandied around a lot, and now it seems that FSG and "their man" have taken ownership of Project Mediocrity, will fully collaborate on this piece of work and will roll it out for all to see in the summer. Bet they have an Excel spreadsheet and everything. Nice.

Oh and "The problem is, Rodgers' teams are notoriously slow starters anyway because of his training methods where he wants to peak later on in the season". How well did that work out, eh ?

Offline ThePoolMan

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Re: Brendan Rodgers to remain at LFC after positive talks with owners
« Reply #410 on: June 3, 2015, 09:54:54 am »
Bit Meh! about this really.   With Klopp on a break I would have hoped that FSG spoke to him.   So I will back Rogers but I think he has to hit the ground running next season, or will be replaced by Klopp in January or at the end of next season. 
My only worry is how much money we let him spunk on average players before then.

Given that both Klopp and Ancelotti are out of the running for a year, it is actually a good idea to wait till they are available again. In particular Ancelotti is the ideal choice to take over from Rodgers should he fail to improve from this season in terms of experience at the very highest level of the club game, his acumen and judgement, his standing in the global game and the respect and esteem in which he is held by players. Unai Emery is another one to keep an eye on.

Offline ArthurDent

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Re: Brendan Rodgers to remain at LFC after positive talks with owners
« Reply #411 on: June 3, 2015, 09:57:06 am »
I hope it doesn't lead to a bitter season of fan in-fighting, that isn't going to be productive at all.

As someone who believes that Klopp is 100% right for this club, it's time for me to shrug and say "so be it"; it was never about wanting Rodgers out, it was all about wanting Klopp in. That's not going to happen now, so there we have it. Worse things happen at sea.

Lets hope that next season sees us play a lot more like 2013/14 than 2014/15. Allez les rouges.
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Offline Historical Fool

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Re: Brendan Rodgers to remain at LFC after positive talks with owners
« Reply #412 on: June 3, 2015, 10:07:52 am »
Allez les rouges.

100% BEHIND LE BOSS!
You're all too fucking serious, the lot of you. Relax, we don't really matter.

Oh, and we should have an in's and out's topic, stickied.

Offline 11 friends

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Re: Brendan Rodgers to remain at LFC after positive talks with owners
« Reply #413 on: June 3, 2015, 10:20:56 am »
I'll wait until the decisions made yesterday are made public before I have any hope for next season.If FSG ,and the manager they wholly endorsed,continue in the same vein it could become ugly.l hope not,but in an ideal world I would have liked Brendan to continue his managing apprenticeship at another club.

Offline adamski29

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Re: Brendan Rodgers to remain at LFC after positive talks with owners
« Reply #414 on: June 3, 2015, 10:25:08 am »
Now that the decision has been made even if I don't think it's the right one in isolation I will be behind Brendan . I say in isolation cause if this decision has been made without major changes to the structure of the club and how we do business then all they are doing in essence is hanging the manager out to dry. If we are to continue with the requirement policy and recruitment practices, if there is to be no director of football appointed, and a stop put to all this leaking from the club then it is a disaster waiting to happen.

I can support the manager and hope he does well and still know the structure at the club is insufficient. They need to help the man do his best this structure doesn't do that.

I also have a concern that Brendan is reverting to "death by football"  if he is then that would be a grave mistake IMHO. Parking the bus against Liverpool will become an art form and we will struggle to break teams down. It is a hard system to get right unless you have access to really good technical players, and lots of them, and being in the premier league doesn't help thus style flourish.
Having watch Roy Evans team who played some lovely football but did it all in front of the opposition back four, it is a very frustrating thing to watch a team toil and fail to find the break through.

Anyway i hope changes are made as outlined above and that Brendan gets off to a good start with a style of football that is exciting not frustrating.
He will need to.

Offline 00jebus

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Re: Brendan Rodgers to remain at LFC after positive talks with owners
« Reply #415 on: June 3, 2015, 10:27:26 am »
eh, he'll probably be alright so long as Sturridge stays fit, another one of our strikers start scoring regularly or we bring in someone lethal.
Good chance for the youngsters in the Europa too.

Heres hoping the debacle that was last season was a one-off, due to the culmination of everything bad that could possibly happen to us football-wise, happening.
Lets draw a line under it.

Lets look to the future, we have a good young manager who has hopefully learned from last season, quite a few young players who could be absolute stars (Coutinho's only 22!), will soon have an expanded ground. Still filled with hope for the next few years.

Offline saoirse08

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Re: Brendan Rodgers to remain at LFC after positive talks with owners
« Reply #416 on: June 3, 2015, 10:31:39 am »
Excellent OP. Sums up pretty much where I, and I suspect, many other Liverpool fans are at present. Not since the sacking of Rafa and the installation of Hodgson as manager have we entered a post/pre-season with such low expectations. Back then it was understandable, as the club was in such an awful mess, with bankruptcy a very real threat.

In someways, it reminds me of how we entered Souness' last season. I remember the last game of the previous campaign against Spurs at Anfield. Souness wasn't present that day and word quickly spread that he had been sacked. Many, myself included, were happy with this outcome. We even won 6-2 without him! I remember listening to the local radio the next day awaiting the official announcement that Souness had been fired. But it didn't come.

Instead Souness remained and the board fudged the issue and promoted Roy Evans to assistant manager. Souness lasted until January that season, and Roy Evans stepped in as his position became untenable after another poor FA Cup defeat to Bristol City (Rovers?)*. In many ways - and with hindsight - it was a smart move to have Roy in place in case things turned sour.

If things go badly for Rodgers early this season, I'm not sure there is anybody currently at the club with Roy's love and knowledge of the club to step in, even until the end of the season. This is a big worry for me. A mediocre 2015/16 could quickly turn into a disastrous season.

I hope we find an experienced coach to come on board for next season, preferably with European experience, to help Brendan. This or some structural changes to how the club is run and how transfers are conducted are a must. If not, we will find ourselves back in the early 90s when the board didn't act incisively enough and sack Souness when it was evident he wasn't up to the job, and had alienated many of the playing staff.

* Think I got my first glimpse of Robbie Fowler that night as I'm sure he was on the bench. Think I remember him warming up and thinking he looked about 12.
« Last Edit: June 3, 2015, 10:33:39 am by saoirse08 »
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Offline ahfolk79

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Re: Brendan Rodgers to remain at LFC after positive talks with owners
« Reply #417 on: June 3, 2015, 10:31:44 am »
This is a terrible thing to say but, although the outcome of yesterday’s “review” may well be a great decision, there is a rather base side of me that wanted to see someone get fired for the indescribably terrible performances against Palace and Stoke. If they’d have come out and said Ayre hasn’t been pulling his weight and has been told to fill a bin liner, I’d have been delighted. I know there’s no logic in that and it’s a good thing I’m not in charge!
"He’s not so much a player I can really take responsibility for. I’d have to share the responsibility for Joe, less so than for people like [Christian] Poulsen, [Raul] Meireles and [Paul] Konchesky, who are players I was quite happy to bring to the club."

Roy feeling justifiably smug about the powerhouses he snatched from under the noses of Barca

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Re: Brendan Rodgers to remain at LFC after positive talks with owners
« Reply #418 on: June 3, 2015, 10:33:19 am »
I believe he said judge me after three seasons, I may be wrong. One bad season, one excellent season, one dreadful season.
He has one more chance and he will need every single player and staff member to be on his side for it to come off. If not, if one or two of the starting 11 or more important players doubt him, even a bit, the wheels will come off again.

I would love nothing more for him to have a great season with us but sadly i cant see it. I will however support him for as long as he is the boss. I also hope he stops taking so much. stops putting his foot in his mouth, stops being so carefree with the media and talk sport and just fucking gets on with the job instead of telling everyone what he does and how he does it. Give them nothing, get on with the job, act like a motherfucking boss and stop coming across so soft.

Offline Historical Fool

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Re: Brendan Rodgers to remain at LFC after positive talks with owners
« Reply #419 on: June 3, 2015, 10:39:25 am »
I believe he said judge me after three seasons, I may be wrong. One bad season, one excellent season, one dreadful season.

Well the dreadful season, he was in his first year, and I guess there are mitigating circumstances for it - cutting wage bill, outflux of players, etc.

The excellent season I can agree on, and the bad season was in his third year.

That being said, I don't know how a drop from 6th to 7th can be considered the difference between bad and dreadful, since there's no real difference besides prize money (both places still qualify for the Europa), but it's perception I guess.
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Re: Brendan Rodgers to remain at LFC after positive talks with owners
« Reply #420 on: June 3, 2015, 10:40:50 am »
Weighing it up, reviewing this and that, I have come to one conclusion.

I have absolutely no faith in LFC finishing in the top four next season.

The question is though, should I?
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Offline audioedge

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FWIW, early on in this thread I saw his three seasons characterised as average, excellent, and disastrous. Considering we finished 7th, 2nd, and 6th respectively, I'm quite sold on which was the excellent season, but I'm a bit puzzled as to why his first season was considered a disaster when the one just past is considered average. Is one place in the table such a big difference?
I think the general consensus is that first season he inherited a steaming pile of crap and that by the third season he had spent enough to fund a trip to the moon (and back).

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Re: Brendan Rodgers to remain at LFC after positive talks with owners
« Reply #422 on: June 3, 2015, 10:41:53 am »
We don't need to build up the fact that next season is make or break, that's pretty much a given and probably would be for any manager who's gone 3 years without winning a trophy, even if we'd finished the season fairly well.

He's been backed by the owners, I hope he gets the majority of support from the fans too (you can never please everybody). Some may have lost faith or actively want him out, but the only way that will happen now is if we have a really poor first 3 months of the season and I'm sure nobody wants that?

I do fear for him if we start slowly. Let's hope for 3 1-0 wins like the start of 13/14 and that we kick on from there.

Offline pjshaun

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Re: Brendan Rodgers to remain at LFC after positive talks with owners
« Reply #423 on: June 3, 2015, 10:42:26 am »
Really good OP.
 :)

All I will add, is that FSG made a decision that took courage, especially since the media had done all their legwork in justifying his dismissal.

I just hope they show the courage in backing him this window, and that is best done by buying the players he thinks will get us back on track, not the ones we think will get us back on track.
There's nothing courageous about that decision. They still don't have any idea about football even after 5 years. They are trying to be too clever by trying to reinvent something which they hardly knew anything about 5 years ago. Say what you say about them but we have only made top 4 once in their 5 year tenure here. For whatever reasons. Let that sink in.

We are doing financially well but that's just short term. With our continuous slide down the table, it won't last long. It certainly won't last long with this 'Top 4 once in every 5 year' strategy. And there is nothing to suggest so far they will make changes even if we start the next season poorly or again fail to make top 4. I don't think Brendan is under any pressure to start the season well.

There is a reason players are managed by a manager. If they aren't motivated or perform well, manager is responsible. Full stop. You can't go ahead and change the whole squad/roster just because they underperformed. You can understand one or two not performing well but when whole squad is collectively poor, there is something wrong with their manager.

Offline rocco

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Re: Brendan Rodgers to remain at LFC after positive talks with owners
« Reply #424 on: June 3, 2015, 10:42:48 am »
We go again ;)

Lets get back challenging Brendan .

Offline Historical Fool

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I think the general consensus is that first season he inherited a steaming pile of crap and that by the third season he had spent enough to fund a trip to the moon (and back).

Well, nope. A trip to the moon and back costs USD 750m at existing market rates.

To orbit the moon, it costs USD 150m however. But why go so far and not land?
You're all too fucking serious, the lot of you. Relax, we don't really matter.

Oh, and we should have an in's and out's topic, stickied.

Offline Dubred

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Re: Brendan Rodgers to remain at LFC after positive talks with owners
« Reply #426 on: June 3, 2015, 10:45:46 am »
Pressure is going to be incredible on him from right now, all the way through the summer with new targets and signings being scrutinized relentlessly.

He showed signs of crumbling with the pressure of the season just gone.

I'm just not sure he will deal with it x 3 which is what I expect.

Its noble in a way and great to see in the age of modern football - a manager being backed - but from the supporting Liverpool point of view it feels terribly like waiting for the inevitable to happen and putting us back yet another year on top of the 25yrs already gone.

Offline [new username under construction]

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Re: Brendan Rodgers to remain at LFC after positive talks with owners
« Reply #427 on: June 3, 2015, 10:48:15 am »
I still think that if FSG had sacked him now then they would have been under no pressure, they could have lumped everything on him. Now they are keeping him, if it goes tits up, they are going to be under huge pressure from fans as well

Offline pjshaun

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Re: Brendan Rodgers to remain at LFC after positive talks with owners
« Reply #428 on: June 3, 2015, 10:53:52 am »
Where are people getting these ideas that next season is 'Do or die for Brendan', 'Brendan's last chance', 'Brendan has to start well or the knives will be out', 'Brendan will be under huge pressure', 'FSG will be under huge pressure'? Just because everyone wants us to do well, doesn't mean anyone will be under any pressure. Is there any official statement from the club? It's all assumption at the moment. FSG are too arrogant or ignorant to do anything about it as long as they feel like it.

Offline MightyRedLFC

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Re: Brendan Rodgers to remain at LFC after positive talks with owners
« Reply #429 on: June 3, 2015, 10:55:11 am »
I am a bit torn. A month ago I would have backed BR, but after Villa, Palace and Stoke, I am not so sure. I hope we get a good start next season, and build a winning mentality early. If not, I fear it will be a very difficult season for BR and the owners.

Offline pjshaun

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Unless there's a major change in the transfer committee, this will be the moment I've lost faith in FSG.

When we had that season under Kenny, FSG came in and fired the director of football, the manager and the head of medicine. They then sanctionned the fucking off on loan of their record signing. We didn't agree with everything they did, but they took a stand and made it clear they thought the season was unacceptable and that they made people accountable.

If they do absolutely nothing now about this car crash of a season after 2 years of the most ridiculous waste of money and illogical transfers in world sport history, as well as 2 years of failing to get our targets then they will have made a statement that nobody is accountable for anything at Liverpool Football Club and the on the pitch results are the lest of their concerns. 

If that's the case, then the wonderful 13/14 season could be seen in the future as the last hurrah of this great club and last season as the beginning of the end of this institution's pretense of being a top club, existing to challenge and win trophies.
Couldn't agree more. We are well and truly fucked as long as FSG is in charge of our club.

I miss the days when I didn't give a fuck who was our owner. All I used to do back then was talk about tactics, players and manager. There is too much focus on owners these days. Owner's philosophy, owner's choices, owners, owners, fucking owners. They should be behind the scenes and out of the limelight. But no, it's all about owners now. At least with our club.

Offline audioedge

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Re: Brendan Rodgers to remain at LFC after positive talks with owners
« Reply #431 on: June 3, 2015, 11:01:28 am »
Where are people getting these ideas that next season is 'Do or die for Brendan', 'Brendan's last chance', 'Brendan has to start well or the knives will be out', 'Brendan will be under huge pressure', 'FSG will be under huge pressure'? Just because everyone wants us to do well, doesn't mean anyone will be under any pressure. Is there any official statement from the club? It's all assumption at the moment. FSG are too arrogant or ignorant to do anything about it as long as they feel like it.
If he churns out any more displays like to Stoke and Palace games, and we are floundering near the bottom of the table then people will vote with there feet and FSG will feel pressure like they did with the Owl. (By the way am not saying this will happen, as I doubt it will, but what I am saying is there are circumstances which will force the owners to react)

Offline Devon Red

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Re: Brendan Rodgers to remain at LFC after positive talks with owners
« Reply #432 on: June 3, 2015, 11:03:51 am »
On the basis of the 'judge me after 3 seasons' comment I think Rodgers deserves to stay and should have our support. His first season was pretty much where any reasonable analysis should have expected us to be, his second season was an over-achievement and exaggerated our real sustainably position, and the third season has been an under-achievement - albeit with one period of sustained good results. Overall that puts his tenure just about on par.

I was concerned by the Stoke result, but more importantly by the way that we performed at Wembley against Villa. The ability to raise our game when it really matters is a question mark that needs to be resolved next season. Defensively we need to find a consistent system with clear first choice players in each position. We also need to score some more goals, although the heights of our attacking flair of 2013/2014 will never be recreated unless we stumble across another genius in the Suarez mould. We shouldn't expect that, once in a generation players are...well...once in a generation. More realistically we need players across the attacking positions who are capable of contributing regular goals, something clearly lacking this season.

It does ultimately come down to expectations. Liverpool should be a consistent Champions League team with semi-regular challenges for the title. Rodgers hasn't achieved that yet, but he has shown the capability. Another season like this one just passed would and should be his last, but if we achieve top 4 then I believe that Rodgers could go on to develop us into the club that we are capable of being.


Offline Bergersrightwingviews

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Re: Brendan Rodgers to remain at LFC after positive talks with owners
« Reply #433 on: June 3, 2015, 11:05:35 am »
Personally I would have gone all out for Klopp, but other than him I don't think there are any other available candidates I would want. Rafa's ship has sailed sadly, and Ancelotti is probably out of our league at the moment.

I like Brendan, and I can certainly see why he deserves more time. I just hope something changes, whether that is a DoF or a different transfer set-up or whatever. We cannot go on as we have been.

I personally think we need some older heads in the coaching team/club as a whole. Brendan just is not experienced enough to be running things single-handedly. That is not a criticism - it is a fact he is a young manager with very limited experience and he needs some help.

In an ideal world I would want  a really experienced DoF who no longer wants to coach. Someone like Capello would be great if he has had enough of being messed around by the loathsome Russian FA.
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Offline Solomon Grundy

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Re: Brendan Rodgers to remain at LFC after positive talks with owners
« Reply #434 on: June 3, 2015, 11:05:58 am »
If he churns out any more displays like to Stoke and Palace games, and we are floundering near the bottom of the table then people will vote with there feet and FSG will feel pressure like they did with the Owl. (By the way am not saying this will happen, as I doubt it will, but what I am saying is there are circumstances which will force the owners to react)

Yep.

If we're 5th or 6th and a few points off 4th at Christmas they won't act. If we're in the bottom half of the table by christmas, 15-20 pts off the pace they will act.

Offline sambhi92

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Re: Brendan Rodgers to remain at LFC after positive talks with owners
« Reply #435 on: June 3, 2015, 11:09:06 am »
If he churns out any more displays like to Stoke and Palace games, and we are floundering near the bottom of the table then people will vote with there feet and FSG will feel pressure like they did with the Owl. (By the way am not saying this will happen, as I doubt it will, but what I am saying is there are circumstances which will force the owners to react)

Really think you have to remember those two performances where at the end of the season where we had nothing to play for. I know they should have played for Stevie but the fact is they didnt and probably couldnt be arsed. Rodgers has to sort this out and make sure we're up for it every game.

We wont see many Palace or Stoke performances again, they were just one offs. If we perform like we did vs Villa then we have issues. 
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Re: Brendan Rodgers to remain at LFC after positive talks with owners
« Reply #436 on: June 3, 2015, 11:10:06 am »
On the basis of the 'judge me after 3 seasons' comment I think Rodgers deserves to stay and should have our support. His first season was pretty much where any reasonable analysis should have expected us to be, his second season was an over-achievement and exaggerated our real sustainably position, and the third season has been an under-achievement - albeit with one period of sustained good results. Overall that puts his tenure just about on par.

I was concerned by the Stoke result, but more importantly by the way that we performed at Wembley against Villa. The ability to raise our game when it really matters is a question mark that needs to be resolved next season. Defensively we need to find a consistent system with clear first choice players in each position. We also need to score some more goals, although the heights of our attacking flair of 2013/2014 will never be recreated unless we stumble across another genius in the Suarez mould. We shouldn't expect that, once in a generation players are...well...once in a generation. More realistically we need players across the attacking positions who are capable of contributing regular goals, something clearly lacking this season.

It does ultimately come down to expectations. Liverpool should be a consistent Champions League team with semi-regular challenges for the title. Rodgers hasn't achieved that yet, but he has shown the capability. Another season like this one just passed would and should be his last, but if we achieve top 4 then I believe that Rodgers could go on to develop us into the club that we are capable of being.



I think that's a very fair and balanced assessment. Without a Suarez genius we are going to struggle to get back to 13/14 goals and points tallies. That's not a slight on the manager, just a given. We should be able to get back to being a solid close to 2 points per game sort of team though. What did we finish on this season - 62 points I think without a striker of note and with a bad drop off at the end of the season.

Get our house in order, get a new striker in who can score regularly or Sturridge back to fitness and I don't see why this crop can't get us into the mid 70 points region next season. If we do that then I think it'll be a decent season.

A repeat of this season and I think Rodgers will be gone and that's probably something he's fully aware of too.

Offline Jookie

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Re: Brendan Rodgers to remain at LFC after positive talks with owners
« Reply #437 on: June 3, 2015, 11:17:00 am »
We should be able to get back to being a solid close to 2 points per game sort of team though.


Plus 70 points should be our aim next season. It's not unrealistic and would put us in with a shout of Top 4.

If I was FSG, that would have been the minimum target I would presented to Rodgers yesterday. Achieve +70 points in 2015-16 or face the sack.
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Offline Walk On

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Re: Brendan Rodgers to remain at LFC after positive talks with owners
« Reply #438 on: June 3, 2015, 11:21:24 am »
Great post and well said. 

On balance, I am pleased that FSG has decided to back the manager. God knows, I have been frustrated with him and his choices this season, but I instinctively dislike the knee-jerk opinions of the modern media, and so have tended to set aside my own impatience as something created by too much reading.

I'm wouldn't say that I'm pleased that the manager has been given a reprieve, but I wouldn't say that I would've been over-joyed had he been sacked.  My reason for the latter would've been that, as I've stated previously, I really have no appetite for another project or 5 year plan.  I some regards, it is encouraging to see FSG back the manager but not, at the same time, they should support him with the funds and players to make sure we're reasonably successful next season, be that with a cup run or top-4 finish.

Having said that, I've been very troubled by the manner of defeats and decisions made this season. Accepting that my knowledge of football is not great, some of the choices in rotation and use of young players have been baffling. Some decisions, in my view, that Rodgers has made have bordered on cowardly, but perhaps are better characterised as inexperienced and over-pressured. He has lost my trust, but I am willing to continue my support in the hope that he will grow through this awful time and realise that he must stick to whatever principles he has and drive on. If his principles are wrong, so be it. But don't chop and change, don't play young players out of position all the time, and don't bend. If you're going to go down, go down doing what you believe in. More than likely, you will succeed.

If anything, I think this chopping and changing is what may have led to those defeats at the end of the season.  While there was an outside chance of top-4, when that became less likely, the priority should have been to see how the players could perform in their ideal/preferred positions with a view to the following season and where/what reinforcements would be needed.  I felt that at the end, there was far too much plugging of gaps and naturally something had to give.  While it might not have been right, the players simply seemed to lost faith and gave up.  This was clearly seen in Can's performance.  While he's been superb as a makeshift defender in a back 3, he clearly didn't feel comfortable in a back 4 and lost all confidence from the cup defeat against Villa and in the game against Stoke. 

FSG have also lost some of my trust, as it's not entirely clear any more that they want us to have the success they brought to the Red Sox. I don't know what their plan is either, but for now they have my support too. By sticking with Brendan, I feel more comfortable that they understand what stability brings, and that their end of season review - which is clearly not going to be shared with us, the supporters, for whatever inscrutable reasons - has been thorough and provided detailed conclusions up which they will act decisively.

It will be interesting to see how FSG support the manager.  While we expect them to splash the cash, I think there needs to be a bit more transparency on the transfer committee and who plays what role.  For far too long it seems that players are thrust upon the manager and he's got to make it work.  But lately, it seems like the manager does have some influence.  Perhaps this influence needs to be greater, after all he's got to work with these players and get them to fit his system/philosophy.  I would also like a greater presence at games.  It seems like they've been "managing from abroad".  If Mike Gordon is supposed to be their rep over here, he needs to start being more visible.

The players I am more sanguine about. I think we did pretty well last transfer window, and that our young players will be much better in their second season. Returning to my theme above, I consider we did them no favours by the constant chopping and changing of their roles - as a leader myself, I believe strongly in getting new people to excel in their correct role before challenging them with instability. Indeed, the first rule of change management is to ensure people can mentally cope with the change around them by giving them some sense of their role and allowing them to achieve in it.

To be honest, I'm quite disappointed with the way the manager has handled the (young) players, especially those with delicate situations.  Markovic was widely touted as a good up and coming player and you'd expect someone like Rodgers to get the best out of him,  but instead he's been left out of the squad and that has naturally led to a loss of confidence.  I agree that you want to play those players in their preferred positions, and the constant changing hasn't helped either.  While you'd expect some flexibility on the players part, to want to convert them entirely may not have been the best approach.

Perhaps even the Gerrard/Sterling situation could've been handled in a slightly different manner.  But I suppose my biggest frustration was the way the strikers have been handled.  To have 3 available but still insist on playing without one for large parts of the season/matches does not send the right signals to the squad.  And when they were used, was it any surprise that none performed?

I would expect Rodgers to meet with each player now, apologise for his indecision and mistakes, and agree a way forward that they can embrace. In a few weeks time, if that air is cleared now, they will reassemble full of fight and clarity for the new season.

I would be pleasantly surprised if Rodgers came out and apologised to the players... but if that doesn't happen, I hope he does have a session (be it one on one or with the group as a whole) and lays out the plan for the season, how he hopes to take key fixtures in the league.  Also, how the Europa league will be treated and what he expects from them as players and as a squad as a whole. 

But now that FSG have made their decision, we need to back the manager and the players.  I'm sure there will be some teething problems but hopefully this won't last too long.  We need to have a good start, show some ambition and I hope we as a fan-base can get behind the club and look onward and upward.
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Offline adamski29

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Re: Brendan Rodgers to remain at LFC after positive talks with owners
« Reply #439 on: June 3, 2015, 11:23:29 am »
Really good OP.
 :)

All I will add, is that FSG made a decision that took courage, especially since the media had done all their legwork in justifying his dismissal.

I just hope they show the courage in backing him this window, and that is best done by buying the players he thinks will get us back on track, not the ones we think will get us back on track.











Getting your excuses out in front early should the likley transpire?






I presume that this is what your likley to say if the shit hits the fan next season given that you support the manager at all costs.
The fact that you think Brendan should be given carte blanch to pick all his own signings means your judgement is to put it mildly, suspect.