Author Topic: Wheres Rafa''s new contract?  (Read 158209 times)

Offline shelovesyou

  • andyouknow youshouldbe glad OOOOOOH!!!
  • RAWK Supporter
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 17,251
  • Yes
Re: Wheres Rafa''s new contract?
« Reply #720 on: February 25, 2009, 02:43:50 pm »
Ballague on SSN now . . . .

All just rumours

Its Rubbish .
the easiest way for me to grow as a person is to surround myself with people smarter than I am

Offline Something Else

  • that car's fine lookin' man (clearly insured with confused.com)
  • RAWK Supporter
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 33,204
  • Bazinga
  • Super Title: something else required
Re: Wheres Rafa''s new contract?
« Reply #721 on: February 25, 2009, 02:48:02 pm »
Can someone tell me if bookies are correct more times than wrong when suspending betting??? im not a pro gambler and would not know?

no

they do it to give them time to look over the situation, see if something is odd

William Hill had 300 phone calls in a small space of time so they suspended in order to check that they had not missed anything and were going to get taken for a fair bit of cash.

They are protecting their money and will wait before reopening, incase someone has been tipped off.

Their closing of the books has nothing to do with whether or not the thing will happen, in this case, its just they are now operating at too high a risk of loses, or they would be had they carried on the betting, had rafa leave.

THink of it as responsible lending by banks, not that anyone knows what that is any more ;)

Offline fry

  • or stew
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 3,757
  • Hoe Hoe Hoe
Re: Wheres Rafa''s new contract?
« Reply #722 on: February 25, 2009, 02:51:45 pm »
no

they do it to give them time to look over the situation, see if something is odd

William Hill had 300 phone calls in a small space of time so they suspended in order to check that they had not missed anything and were going to get taken for a fair bit of cash.

They are protecting their money and will wait before reopening, incase someone has been tipped off.

Their closing of the books has nothing to do with whether or not the thing will happen, in this case, its just they are now operating at too high a risk of loses, or they would be had they carried on the betting, had rafa leave.

THink of it as responsible lending by banks, not that anyone knows what that is any more ;)
I see, maybe RBS would be in better hands if they merged with paddypower.
Disclaimer: The above post may not be based on facts even if stated as fact.

Offline Cracking Left Foot

  • RAWK Supporter
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 2,971
Re: Wheres Rafa''s new contract?
« Reply #723 on: February 25, 2009, 02:55:21 pm »
To be fair I don't think Jose would either after all the crap with Chelsea - likes to be in full charge of the team like Rafa wants to be

No self-respecting manager would want to work with our owners, no matter the pull and prestige of the Liverpool name.

Which is why I'm very worried that if Rafa was to leave, we'd be left with Curbs or Strachan (who apparently Parry was very impressed with when they were interviewing after Ged left - source: Carra's book).
Thank you Jurgen

Offline Something Else

  • that car's fine lookin' man (clearly insured with confused.com)
  • RAWK Supporter
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 33,204
  • Bazinga
  • Super Title: something else required
Re: Wheres Rafa''s new contract?
« Reply #724 on: February 25, 2009, 02:57:55 pm »
I see, maybe RBS would be in better hands if they merged with paddypower.

indeed

however i feel for the banks in some ways as they dont have the ability to do stuff like this and are forced by he government sometimes to get shafted, but thats off topic completely

the only thing that should be read into it on this occasion is that they panicked and did not want to lose huge sums of cash

As someone else said, if we all rang up one now saying Moyes is about to leave the same would happen, however the media would be less arsed ;)

Offline lfc_col

  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 7,651
  • And Could He Play!
Re: Wheres Rafa''s new contract?
« Reply #725 on: February 25, 2009, 02:58:16 pm »
Ballague on SSN now . . . .

All just rumours

Its Rubbish .

he knows nothing just as much as we do
We Won It Six Times



JFT 97

Offline ricflairandy

  • moany grumbling in my day the club gave you gold coins grump of a moaning bastard honestly national service for Suarez and another thing...
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 2,419
  • Whoooooooooooooo!
Re: Wheres Rafa''s new contract?
« Reply #726 on: February 25, 2009, 02:58:48 pm »
No self-respecting manager would want to work with our owners, no matter the pull and prestige of the Liverpool name.

Which is why I'm very worried that if Rafa was to leave, we'd be left with Curbs or Strachan (who apparently Parry was very impressed with when they were interviewing after Ged left - source: Carra's book).


Erm, arnt you forgetting a certain mr roader. Hes available. Also im sure mclaren would jump at the chansh to return to english football.
http://www.musclefood.com/AH6059
4 chicken breasts free!

Offline Lionel Rich Tea

  • Anny Roader
  • ****
  • Posts: 341
Re: Wheres Rafa''s new contract?
« Reply #727 on: February 25, 2009, 03:06:08 pm »
Mickey Adams has just left Brighton....?

Offline Lush is the best medicine...

  • FUCK THE POLICE - NWA
  • RAWK Supporter
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 40,804
Re: Wheres Rafa''s new contract?
« Reply #728 on: February 25, 2009, 03:06:21 pm »
mourinho 5/2 on paddypower to be our next manager - please god no

http://www.paddypower.com/bet?action=go_fb_type&ev_type_id=7483&ev_oc_grp_ids=56982

Mickey Adams has just left Brighton....?

he looks far too much like nick griffin for my liking

Offline A Day 2 Remember

  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 1,385
  • At The End Of The Storm - Are we there yet??
Re: Wheres Rafa''s new contract?
« Reply #729 on: February 25, 2009, 03:12:21 pm »
Can someone tell me if bookies are correct more times than wrong when suspending betting??? I'm not a pro gambler and would not know?

Bookies work off actuarial calculations which is similar to the computer models used in underwriting etc. Its a simply risk calculation based on whether they can underwrite/payout on the number of bets they receive.

Once the data says we are potentially taking too large a risk they suspend betting. It is not based on facts in the real world but on computer data.

Hope this helps.
5th times a charm

I want to read about a Welshman reclaiming our Kop and over engineering songs we have nicked. Priorities guys

Offline fry

  • or stew
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 3,757
  • Hoe Hoe Hoe
Re: Wheres Rafa''s new contract?
« Reply #730 on: February 25, 2009, 03:17:12 pm »
Bookies work off actuarial calculations which is similar to the computer models used in underwriting etc. Its a simply risk calculation based on whether they can underwrite/payout on the number of bets they receive.

Once the data says we are potentially taking too large a risk they suspend betting. It is not based on facts in the real world but on computer data.

Hope this helps.

Cheers, but lets say if a booke knew somthing from a source would they stop it or would they leave it to the computer to decide.
Disclaimer: The above post may not be based on facts even if stated as fact.

Offline Something Else

  • that car's fine lookin' man (clearly insured with confused.com)
  • RAWK Supporter
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 33,204
  • Bazinga
  • Super Title: something else required
Re: Wheres Rafa''s new contract?
« Reply #731 on: February 25, 2009, 03:18:21 pm »
Cheers, but lets say if a booke knew somthing from a source would they stop it or would they leave it to the computer to decide.

depends, if they knew for a fact he was staying, they would keep it open as they would be making more money, its all about the money

Offline shelovesyou

  • andyouknow youshouldbe glad OOOOOOH!!!
  • RAWK Supporter
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 17,251
  • Yes
Re: Wheres Rafa''s new contract?
« Reply #732 on: February 25, 2009, 03:19:09 pm »
he knows nothing just as much as we do

I think he may have slightly better contacts than you or I do . . .
the easiest way for me to grow as a person is to surround myself with people smarter than I am

Offline shelovesyou

  • andyouknow youshouldbe glad OOOOOOH!!!
  • RAWK Supporter
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 17,251
  • Yes
Re: Wheres Rafa''s new contract?
« Reply #733 on: February 25, 2009, 03:20:01 pm »
Cheers, but lets say if a booke knew somthing from a source would they stop it or would they leave it to the computer to decide.

Computer says NO
the easiest way for me to grow as a person is to surround myself with people smarter than I am

Offline Cracking Left Foot

  • RAWK Supporter
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 2,971
Re: Wheres Rafa''s new contract?
« Reply #734 on: February 25, 2009, 03:22:14 pm »

Erm, arnt you forgetting a certain mr roader. Hes available. Also im sure mclaren would jump at the chansh to return to english football.

Good point. Allardyce is probably already practicising his "why wasn't I given the chance to be Liverpool manager, why did they give it to another foreigner?" spiel as we speak.
Thank you Jurgen

Offline Мерфи

  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 1,684
Re: Wheres Rafa''s new contract?
« Reply #735 on: February 25, 2009, 03:25:43 pm »
Is it possible to bet against somebody being made the next manager?  If Mourinho is 5/2 to be the next manager - can I get 2/5 odds that he is not going to be the next manager?  Because there is no way that man is going to be our next manager - If I can make 40 pence on the pound, I'm interested.
Never argue with a fool . . . people may not know the difference .

Offline wetherby

  • Main Stander
  • ***
  • Posts: 136
Re: Wheres Rafa''s new contract?
« Reply #736 on: February 25, 2009, 03:34:21 pm »
I think he may have slightly better contacts than you or I do . . .

You'd get the same level of accuracy if you gave a monkey a magic 8 ball.

Offline redtom

  • Main Stander
  • ***
  • Posts: 201
Re: Wheres Rafa''s new contract?
« Reply #737 on: February 25, 2009, 03:35:34 pm »
You'd get the same level of accuracy if you gave a monkey a magic 8 ball.

But the Monkey says to ask again later!

Offline alvaro

  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 2,188
Re: Wheres Rafa''s new contract?
« Reply #738 on: February 25, 2009, 03:36:04 pm »
I see pelligrini name being thrown in that paddypoker list as well! (im chilean and I know him well) Anyway each time something off the pitch happens our lads give an awesome european performance, anybody remembers the bellamy/riise drama?

Offline The Flying Pig

  • Bill. Not improving with age.
  • RAWK Supporter
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 3,652
  • Truth? Yes. Justice? Not yet. JFT96.
Re: Wheres Rafa''s new contract?
« Reply #739 on: February 25, 2009, 03:43:17 pm »
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/sport/football/premier_league/liverpool/article5802909.ece

Tony Evans (a red,I think?) in The Times.

Players backing Rafa and Stevie plays tonight!
Suddenly I turned around and she was standin' there
With silver bracelets on her wrists and flowers in her hair
She walked up to me so gracefully and took my crown of thorns
"Come in", She said, "I'll give you shelter from the storm."

I might be in!

Offline wetherby

  • Main Stander
  • ***
  • Posts: 136
Re: Wheres Rafa''s new contract?
« Reply #740 on: February 25, 2009, 03:46:44 pm »
But the Monkey says to ask again later!

That's because the monkey's got advertising revenue to boost on his website. In this case, the monkey does know rafa, sort of, and there is a chance benitez met someone to do with hicks in madrid last night (apparently), but quite why rafa would then ring the monkey and tell him, I don't know. The monkey's a chancer. A chancer monkey.

I see pelligrini name being thrown in that paddypoker list as well! (im chilean and I know him well) Anyway each time something off the pitch happens our lads give an awesome european performance, anybody remembers the bellamy/riise drama?

That's a fair point about bellamy and riise, and funnily enough Pellegrini is one of the few coaches who would do a decent job in rafa's stead should he leave (although Mauricio might get confused), but i would have thought a chilean - why would a chilean automatically know pellegrini? it's a big country - would both know how to spell his name and shy away from words like "lads" and "awesome". I might be being a bit harsh on you (you could be chilean for all i know) but it sort of sums up where all this stuff came from. It's people on the internet making out things as fact that are, at best, hearsay or, more often than not, just stuff they've made up. What makes (and again this isn't directed at you alvaro) someone go on the internet and lie? Does it make them feel important? There are a lot of posters on RAWK and elsewhere with valid opinions (note: not all opinions are valid, some are moronic) interesting points of view and some inside information that we are all grateful for. There are a lot of others who know fuck all but seem to use internet forums as the way to validate their existences. Why?

Offline Bennyo

  • Wasn't arsed about having a custom title, so all he got was this.
  • RAWK Supporter
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 4,524
Re: Wheres Rafa''s new contract?
« Reply #741 on: February 25, 2009, 03:58:16 pm »
Betting's back on on betfair for Benitez to go - so how do i make as much money possible since he's staying?

Do I lay yes, or back no?

This will be the second time I've gambled as I think you can guess! ;)

Offline Lush is the best medicine...

  • FUCK THE POLICE - NWA
  • RAWK Supporter
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 40,804
Re: Wheres Rafa''s new contract?
« Reply #742 on: February 25, 2009, 04:00:44 pm »
Betting's back on on betfair for Benítez to go - so how do i make as much money possible since he's staying?

Do I lay yes, or back no?

This will be the second time I've gambled as I think you can guess! ;)

lay him leaving

Offline danwms

  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 3,334
  • Walking through the storm.
    • Last FM
Re: Wheres Rafa''s new contract?
« Reply #743 on: February 25, 2009, 04:06:54 pm »
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/sport/football/premier_league/liverpool/article5802909.ece

Tony Evans (a red,I think?) in The Times.

Players backing Rafa and Stevie plays tonight!

who is Tony Evans?

And what he know about this situation>?

Offline Bennyo

  • Wasn't arsed about having a custom title, so all he got was this.
  • RAWK Supporter
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 4,524
Re: Wheres Rafa''s new contract?
« Reply #744 on: February 25, 2009, 04:09:37 pm »
lay him leaving

So if I lay him, say 500/1 with a £10 bet - then I could win 5k - but could loose 5k if he does go??

Offline Something Else

  • that car's fine lookin' man (clearly insured with confused.com)
  • RAWK Supporter
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 33,204
  • Bazinga
  • Super Title: something else required
Re: Wheres Rafa''s new contract?
« Reply #745 on: February 25, 2009, 04:14:51 pm »
So if I lay him, say 500/1 with a £10 bet - then I could win 5k - but could loose 5k if he does go??

no you lose your bet

the other person to lay against you would have to put up 5K to win your tenner

Offline Cracking Left Foot

  • RAWK Supporter
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 2,971
Re: Wheres Rafa''s new contract?
« Reply #746 on: February 25, 2009, 04:15:21 pm »
So if I lay him, say 500/1 with a £10 bet - then I could win 5k - but could loose 5k if he does go??


As much as I love Rafa, I wouldn't like to lay him.

Well, maybe if he won us the Prem, I'd suck him off like.
Thank you Jurgen

Offline Cracking Left Foot

  • RAWK Supporter
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 2,971
Re: Wheres Rafa''s new contract?
« Reply #747 on: February 25, 2009, 04:16:53 pm »
who is Tony Evans?

And what he know about this situation>?


Football editor of The Times. Scouser and a definite Red (he often appears on their podcast).

Whether he knows more than any other journalist is open to debate of course.
Thank you Jurgen

Offline OohCampione

  • RAWK Scribbler
  • RAWK Supporter
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 3,749
  • SOS Convert
Re: Wheres Rafa''s new contract?
« Reply #748 on: February 25, 2009, 04:17:39 pm »
So if I lay him, say 500/1 with a £10 bet - then I could win 5k - but could loose 5k if he does go??

Not quite. With that bet you would only win the £10 that you 'lay'.

If Benítez is 5/1 to go and you back him then you stand to win £5 for every £ you bet.
BUT if you lay him, you risk having to pay out £5 for every £1 someone bets with you.

BEWARE!!
Quote from: Peter Griffin, Yesterday
"You'd better watch who you're calling a child, Lois. Because if I'm a child, you know what that makes you? A Pedophile. And I'll be damned if I'm gonna be lectured by a pervert."

Offline Bennyo

  • Wasn't arsed about having a custom title, so all he got was this.
  • RAWK Supporter
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 4,524
Re: Wheres Rafa''s new contract?
« Reply #749 on: February 25, 2009, 04:18:08 pm »
no you lose your bet

the other person to lay against you would have to put up 5K to win your tenner

Ah, I get it - cheers :)

So why does it say that I would be 'liable' for £4,990?

PS. Sorry to corrupt this thread like this..

Offline Bennyo

  • Wasn't arsed about having a custom title, so all he got was this.
  • RAWK Supporter
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 4,524
Re: Wheres Rafa''s new contract?
« Reply #750 on: February 25, 2009, 04:20:36 pm »
Not quite. With that bet you would only win the £10 that you 'lay'.

If Benítez is 5/1 to go and you back him then you stand to win £5 for every £ you bet.
BUT if you lay him, you risk having to pay out £5 for every £1 someone bets with you.

BEWARE!!

Ok, much clearer.. think I'll stay away from laying (not that kind of laying ;) )

Thanks guys.

Offline alvaro

  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 2,188
Re: Wheres Rafa''s new contract?
« Reply #751 on: February 25, 2009, 04:22:21 pm »
You can see my email in my profile to prove my nationality :p

Offline lvcjmac

  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 1,005
  • Pennsylvania Kopite
    • Local Internet Marketing
Re: Wheres Rafa''s new contract?
« Reply #752 on: February 25, 2009, 04:26:57 pm »
who is Tony Evans?

And what he know about this situation>?

He's a Scouser/Red that writes for the Times and is a regular contributor to the Times Podcast. 
18 time English Champions | 5 time European Champions | 3 UEFA Cups | 7 FA Cups | 8 League Cups

Offline manifest

  • RAWK Supporter
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 1,536
Re: Wheres Rafa''s new contract?
« Reply #753 on: February 25, 2009, 04:29:26 pm »
yeah forgot about megson, hed be good for us.

what about curbs aswell, and mabey we could get harry redknapp to leave spurs, hes a boss manager.


and if harry came, he'd bring back robbie keane. As captain. woo hoo.

Online HarryLabrador

  • went broke, so had to get the retrievers in.
  • RAWK Supporter
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 7,290
Re: Wheres Rafa''s new contract?
« Reply #754 on: February 25, 2009, 04:30:35 pm »
From Times OnlineFebruary 25, 2009

Tom Hicks camp denies Rafael Benitez is on the brink of leaving Liverpool

Tony Evans and Ben Smith

Sources close to Tom Hicks, the Liverpool co-owner, have responded with dismay to suggestions that Rafael Benitez is on the brink of leaving the club.

The Spaniard's future as manager appeared more uncertain than ever this morning, as rumours swept Madrid and Liverpool suggesting he was about to leave Anfield. Leading bookmakers suspended all bets on his future at the club, however the Hicks camp has moved swiftly to play down the reports, with sources claiming that despite the antagonism between the owners and Benitez, they will not allow the manager to walk away.

Benitez has been locked in talks over a new contract in recent months and surprised the club’s hierarchy by rejecting a fifth draft of the deal over the weekend. The Liverpool manager has less than 18 months left on his contract at Anfield and believes that if he reaches the end of the season without a commitment from Hicks and George Gillett, he would be forced to look for a new job.

The Americans agreed to offer Benitez a new contract before Christmas but the document remains unsigned. Sources close to Benitez have suggested that the Spaniard has reached agreement with the club on a number of occasions, only to find that, when the written contract arrived, it contained different terms than had been agreed verbally.

The owners have bowed to his requests for more control over transfer policy and the youth academy, but sticking points remain about the job security of his backroom staff and his concern at the delays in the decision-making process, given the dysfunctional relationship between the owners.

Benitez began his career in coaching at the Bernabeu in 1986 and the Liverpool manager has been linked with a return to Madrid, where Juande Ramos is the incumbent. However, Ramos is a short-term appointment and is likely to be replaced in the summer.

Speculation has suggested that Kenny Dalglish has been approached to act in a caretaker capacity in the event of Benitez leaving, but the former Liverpool manager has heard nothing from the club. Dalglish has always been an advocate of the Spaniard, but nevertheless it is thought he would be happy to step forward in any emergency to provide a helping hand at Anfield.

The internal politics of Liverpool have been tortuous since the American owners took over and Benitez has endured a difficult relationship with Rick Parry, the chief executive. The pair have been enbroiled in a power struggle which has worn down the manager. However, Benitez believes he is right and will not depart without a fight.

Jan Molby, the former Liverpool midfielder, said he expected Benitez to remain in charge despite the rumours.

"I'd be surprised if Rafa were to walk out on Liverpool," he said. "We do know for a while he's been unhappy about certain things, but I still think it would take a big man to walk out on Liverpool at such a crucial stage of the season.

"Whereas some people are quite happy to back Rafael Benitez to be gone by the end of the week, I would rather take the odds on him being Liverpool manager next Monday.

"I heard the rumours myself last night, and they have been gathering pace, everyone's talking about it. I think the people who say it can't happen might just prove to be spot-on."

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/sport/football/premier_league/liverpool/article5802715.ece?&EMC-Bltn=9BOD9A
SoS Membership Number: 387

Offline ladcameo

  • Kopite
  • *****
  • Posts: 700
  • You'll Never Walk Alone
Re: Wheres Rafa''s new contract?
« Reply #755 on: February 25, 2009, 04:34:28 pm »
And Sky Sports News sources understands that Liverpool's final preparations for the game, which can be seen live on Sky Sports 2, have continued as normal.

A source close to the said: "Rafa is not going to be sacked, such suggestions are ridiculous.

"We are aware of the rumours and speculation that has been buzzing around in Madrid but it is just not true.

"This has not bothered the manager or the team. Everything we have done since we arrived in Madrid has been spot on.

"Nobody has even mentioned this and we are surprised that such suggestions have been raised. Rafa Benitez is not about to be sacked by Liverpool."


SSN has added some more stuff on the same story

Offline No666

  • Married to Macca.
  • RAWK Scribe
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 17,065
Re: Wheres Rafa''s new contract?
« Reply #756 on: February 25, 2009, 04:47:30 pm »
I spoke to a well-connected sports journo (and LFC supporter) yesterday who told me, amongst other things, that the players were being affected by the Rafa rumour stuff that's going on at present. Which kind of dovetails with what evans is saying. My mate was incredibly downbeat and depressed at the time, but let's hope it means the team will build a siege mentality.

Offline shelovesyou

  • andyouknow youshouldbe glad OOOOOOH!!!
  • RAWK Supporter
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 17,251
  • Yes
Re: Wheres Rafa''s new contract?
« Reply #757 on: February 25, 2009, 04:50:06 pm »
I spoke to a well-connected sports journo (and LFC supporter) yesterday who told me, amongst other things, that the players were being affected by the Rafa rumour stuff that's going on at present. Which kind of dovetails with what evans is saying. My mate was incredibly downbeat and depressed at the time, but let's hope it means the team will build a siege mentality.

Of course its going to affect the players , It would in any walk of life if you had heard that yer manager/boss might be leaving or not happy with his contract . . .
Can I ask what you mean by " amongst other things " ?
the easiest way for me to grow as a person is to surround myself with people smarter than I am

Offline Bogman

  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 1,304
Re: Wheres Rafa''s new contract?
« Reply #758 on: February 25, 2009, 04:57:21 pm »
ool do have a game in Madrid
Posted on February 25th, 2009 by Jim Boardman

It may sound like paranoia, but the English media really are out to get Liverpool boss Rafael Benítez.

It’s not really that he’s getting special treatment in that respect; he’s just the best candidate right now for that role.

The higher profile the manager, the higher the chance your campaign will sell papers or draw viewers in. And Rafa is about the highest profile target available.

The BBC will tell you what happens if you stand up to Alex Ferguson - and few other news outlets have the bottle to do the same. Chelsea’s bosses are changing so quickly these days that the press don’t have time to start a campaign against one before he’s been sent packing with his compensation cheque.

The other “top four” manager, Arsene Wenger, isn’t actually in charge of a top-four side at the moment. Arsenal are six points below fourth place in the league and well out of touch of top spot, but for some reason Wenger’s comments aren’t picked apart, or his every decision placed under a microscope.

The actual other current top-four manager is Martin O’Neill, who could change his name to Marmite O’Neill to demonstrate how he is viewed by many people. He always has something to say, and if he was the current target of the media there’d be plenty to pick at. As it is, his side are currently doing better than expected, and with Arsenal doing so poorly, the pressure is less of a problem than it might be. If his gamble to send a shadow squad out to contest the UEFA Cup backfires, and his side don’t take full points in the league at the weekend, maybe Rafa will get a little bit of a rest.  Maybe.

Of course now that Rafa is the centre of attention for the media, all he can do is to put out his strongest team every game, using his strongest formation, attacking from the off without ever looking like conceding a goal, and finishing the game as several-nil winners. Much less and there’s something that the media can pick at.

That only relates to post-match coverage though. Anything less than a convincing win tonight will see more “Rafa to quit” or “Rafa to be sacked” headlines. But even if there is a convincing win, the fallback is use the dispute over his contract, or - if any player fails to smile when being substituted - to bring up player unrest.

Tonight’s match is in Spain of course, homeland of Rafa and a number of his stars, and a lazy angle might be to say that one or more of the Spanish contingent were homesick, even more so after spending some time in Madrid. And Madrid was Rafa’s home, the place he first started to coach.

Rafa’s links to Real Madrid always make it easy to stitch some story up about him moving there. And it’s not just the press making stories up - rumours flying around supporters start to get some credence, yet most of the time they are no more credible than those that blue-scarved fish-wives like to spread through the city about the Liverpool players they’d love to see on their team’s books.

When it’s an Evertonian telling a bare-faced lie about the health of Daniel Agger, it’s easy to see their reasons for telling such lies. They support Everton. They hate Liverpool.

When it’s a newspaper telling the lies, again it’s easy to see why. It might be annoying, it might be shameful, but it sells papers.

It also unsettles a side. Negative stories about certain players often appear just before a big match, and it’s not just Liverpool it happens to.

But although those reasons are understandable, it’s difficult to justify the spreading of malicious rumours about Liverpool FC when it’s a so-called support spreading those rumours.

Newspapers have to be more careful than the scaremongering fans spreading rumours to other fans, knowing their rumours are false. Newspapers have to be wary of any legal action. But it doesn’t stop them from misleading people.

Two recent stories caught my eye, mainly because they actually prompted a denial from the two players involved.

The first was a relatively harmless story, but although the false accusation levelled at the player was frivolous, it’s illustrative of how easily the English press can print unfounded stories.

The player was Fernando Torres, the accusation was that he was a big fan of ITV’s Dancing on Ice and hoped he’d be able to compete on the show one day! The tabloid report said Torres “wants to appear on TV’s Dancing On Ice,” but that Rafa Benítez was “horrified at the prospect of his £20million hitman coming a cropper.”

The story, in the Daily Star, even carried what it said were quotes from Liverpool’s number nine: “The television in England is very good and there is a lot that I enjoy to watch. There is a programme called Dancing On Ice where a celebrity and a skater perform together. It is very artistic and elegant to watch. One day perhaps you may see me on the programme, too.”

It then went on to claim that other team members knew all about his “love for the Sunday night ITV1 show”, before quoting a “club insider” who said Torres arranges to get the show recorded if he’s away with the team. This insider, who maybe hadn’t heard of Sky Plus, supposedly said: “He’s going to have to wait until his playing days are over before he hits the ice. Can you imagine Rafa’s face if he was told his £20m star player had injured himself doing a pirouette on the rink? It doesn’t bear thinking about.”

For 24 hours nobody really questioned the story. It wasn’t exactly a big story after all, and raised a chuckle from anyone who showed any real interest. But it annoyed Torres enough that he had to dismiss it the next day. He told Liverpool’s own official website that the whole story was complete nonsense.

He said: “I get used to people making things up about me, but this is absolute rubbish.”

He’d never even heard of the show: “I’ve since been told the show is very popular in England, but the first I knew about it was when one of my teammates pointed out the story in a newspaper yesterday.”

 ”I’ve never seen the programme or know how it works and certainly don’t want to appear on it. The story is being reported everywhere as if it’s fact, but it’s a complete fabrication and I wanted to make that clear.”

The only harm done really was that Torres probably has a new nickname at Melwood as a result. More people will have heard the original story than heard his response, and no doubt some commentator will refer to it on a frosty day’s fixture in a few years. The Daily Star didn’t even mention his response, let alone apologise for their original story or explain how it came about.

That story hit the press in the same week as another one about Liverpool keeper Pepe Reina, and had it gained enough credibility it would have been much more harmful to Liverpool than a claim about a player wanting to be an ice dancer.

In this case it was more a case of carefully-chosen words than a completely made-up story. But the principle is the same.

The story carried a quote from Pepe’s dad, himself a former keeper. Miguel Reina played for Atlético Madrid when Pepe was a child.

But before it got to the quote the article said: “Liverpool face a big fight to stop keeper Pepe Reina leaving the club for Atletico Madrid. Reina is keen to return to Spain for family reasons, although the Anfield club had hoped to delay any move for many years.”

For Liverpool fans, if one of the club’s most important players is itching to go home then that’s quite a bombshell. The article then quoted Reina’s dad: “Pepe is crazy about playing for Atletico and I will try to convince him to move as soon as possible.”

Now that didn’t quite seem to be saying the same thing as the words that had come before it.

It’s almost certain that Pepe loves the idea of playing for his boyhood club one day. Most players would. Craig Bellamy and Robbie Keane wanted to, even if it didn’t work out as they’d hoped. And - with all due respect to Atlético - if it’s a move to a club not quite as high in the pecking order as their current club, it’s likely to be a move they’d want to make late in their careers. No doubt Pepe and his dad have discussed that exact idea - but Miguel would love to see it happen sooner rather than later. As most dads surely would in his position.

The quote was given to Radio Marca in Spain, and a fuller version of the translation read: “My son has seen the red and white colours since he was small and he would love to play for Atletico. This weekend I am going to see him and I will talk to him about it. Pepe is crazy about playing for Atletico and I will try to convince him so that he does it as soon as possible.”

So Pepe’s dad was going to see if he could work on his son, to see if he could persuade him to move back to Spain sooner rather than later. And Pepe does want to play for Atlético one day.

But the article didn’t really make it sound like that. “Family reasons” makes it sound like there’s some crisis back home. And rumours doing the rounds often claim that either his wife is unhappy here or that he is homesick. That rumour does the rounds with any non-Scouse Red.

Rather than letting it grow from a bit of twisting of words into a full-blown “Pepe wants to go home” story, Reina Junior felt it important to clarify what the true story was.

He said: “It’s my father who made this declaration because he wants me to play for Atletico, but as far as I’m concerned, I don’t. If one day I was to think of moving back to Spanish football, Atletico would be my first option because it’s a club I have a lot of affection for.

“Nevertheless, saying that I want to move to Atletico right now is wrong because I’m happy at Liverpool.”

It wasn’t even Pepe’s dad who said he wanted to move to Atlético now. But still, Pepe couldn’t have made it much clearer. He’s happy at Anfield.

It was actually refreshing to see people from this club speaking out to put the media right. We need to do it a lot more.

So much of what we’ve read in the last 12-18 months about the owners, potential buyers and the manager has been reported with as much truth behind it as those two stories. It becomes more and more difficult to find the truth. In fact we’ll probably miss the truth, when it does come out, as yet another boy cries wolf.

Stories on the ownership situation are losing credibility all the time, mainly because nobody - not even the two owners - is really sure what’s going to happen next.

Most of last year’s stories about that situation were fuelled by the aims of one involved party or other. Liars accused liars of lying, and were often lying as they did it. Some of them turned out to be all mouth, as the saying goes. Even those who seemed to have no motive than to do some good for the club would be working on trying to boost their reputation, and in turn the fee they could charge for interviews.

Armed with all that double-dealing, papers had no problems at all in adding extra twists when it suited.

Stories about the manager probably deserve even less credibility than many of those relating to the ownership.

In many ways Rafa Benítez doesn’t help himself. He could sometimes do with either saying nothing at all, or just telling it how it is. When he drops cryptic hints, it leaves so much room for interpretation that he can’t really expect the truth to be told.

There are, without doubt, a lot of people looking to see him fall from grace. Inside and outside the club. Inside and outside the fanbase.

It was no surprise that the impact of his outburst about Alex Ferguson was overplayed.

Liverpool had played more games than United when he spoke out, so regardless of how Liverpool performed United could close the gap by six points without Liverpool kicking a ball. But although that doesn’t account for the points dropped in drawn games, it does make it somewhat misleading to blame the outburst for the whole of the difference in points now compared to then.

Few people argued with what Rafa actually said about how United are treated by the FA and referees - but few people really expected the FA to respond to the points raised. By not charging Rafa over what he said, the FA avoided evidence being brought up that might leave them having to answer some questions themselves. And although it was hardly done in a nice way, and probably overplayed itself, Steve Bennett has been punished for some comments recorded by undercover reporters. The referee Rafa found the most unbelievable where United were concerned has allegedly been told he won’t be asked to referee at the top level next season.

Rafa was criticised, mocked even, for the Robbie Keane saga. But that whole situation has been full of claim and counter-claim, and it’s unlikely we’ll ever hear the full story. What doesn’t seem to have been denied is that Rafa thought he was getting both Keane and Barry, and that he’d have sacrificed Keane if he’d known he was only going to get one of the two. Whether he also felt Keane was overpriced isn’t clear, nor is it clear if his treatment of Keane was down to Keane’s attitude and form or his own anger at the way he lost out on Barry.

Whatever happened, when transfers go wrong it’s the manager who gets blamed.

Liverpool aren’t going out buying Rafa players he’s never asked for, but he understandably feels frustration when he’s not allowed to prioritise which of his targets to go for first. He feels frustration when delays before following talks up lead to players going to other clubs, or fees going through the roof. He feels frustration that he’s powerless to stop this happening.

And that has been an issue for him since before the current owners arrived. It was something they were told the first time they met him.

It seems they didn’t actually believe him. It was his word against Rick Parry’s. Whether they took Parry’s side or stayed neutral, they didn’t believe him. But he was determined they would believe him, one day.

That determination eventually played a part in the owners approaching Klinsmann and the whole storm of him “concentrating on coaching”. It wasn’t until he finally got to explain all of this face-to-face, in front of the whole board, including Parry, that he finally seemed to get anyone’s attention.

It was at some point after that meeting that the two owners stopped working with each other. Did Hicks begin to support Rafa as a result of his dispute with Gillett? Or did the dispute begin because Hicks felt Gillett was wrong about Rafa? We can only speculate until somebody puts their hands up and tells us, and the owners have never said publicly why they actually fell out with each other.

But they are still at odds, and their relationship is strictly professional. Gillett still wants out, but there aren’t any buyers. Hicks still wants to stay, but doesn’t seem to be able to find a partner to help him buy Gillett out. If he can’t find a way of getting control, he might just be tempted to sell his half too, against all he’s said before, but there just aren’t any serious buyers around.

The lack of a decent working relationship between the owners is helping those with an axe to grind against Rafa. And one of the owners still has an axe to grind against Rafa.

Hicks has publicly supported Rafa ever since they got over that Klinsmann-related row. Cynics might say he’s doing that for the wrong reasons, but whatever his reasons he is behind Rafa about as much as he can be. Hicks and Rafa haven’t had a bad word to say about each other since the turn of last year, not in public at least, and although it’s pretty much a professional relationship it is relatively amiable.

Gillett has had problems with Rafa that pre-date that meeting with Klinsmann. His views on Rafa haven’t weakened at all in the time that’s passed. In fact Gillett’s views on Rafa are completely at odds with Gillett agreeing for Rafa to get a new contract.

It seems remarkable that Rafa has even been offered a new deal, let alone one that includes many of the clauses and conditions he’s asked for.

But it actually confirms a little more that Gillett is looking for a way out.

Fans will argue all day about what will happen if Rafa leaves.

Some believe that Jose Mourinho will come running, accept the challenge on offer, with the limited budget included, and turn Liverpool into Champions by the end of his first full season, glossing over the fact he’s guilty of many of the little annoyances that they use as weight in their “sack Rafa” arguments.

Others think that it would lead to an exodus of the best players and a serious risk of the club dropping out of the top places in the table and spiralling towards doom.

It would take a massive amount of luck for a new manager to improve on Rafa’s work enough for it to almost guarantee the league. And if that amount of luck was around, Rafa would win the league with it himself. Dropping out of the top four is certainly possible though, even Arsenal have seen how possible this season, and their manager is some kind of hero to many of Rafa’s critics.

When you look at the extremes in terms of how people predict the future should Rafa stay, those extremes are much closer. One set of fans argue he’ll win the league next season and to not write this one off just yet (even Jamie Carragher has said that about this season). The other set of fans will say he’ll never win the league as Liverpool boss, but they all admit he’ll win occasional silverware and keep the club in the top four.

And that’s almost certainly why Gillett is happy to give Rafa a contract, conditions apply.

Despite his personal differences, he clearly feels Rafa is the safer bet.

Yes, a new manager would have a big impact - but that big impact could just as easily be a big negative impact as a big positive one.

By keeping Rafa at the club, it guarantees (as much as it’s possible to in football) that Liverpool will stay in the top four and compete in the Champions League every season.

And with Gillett waiting for a buyer, he wants to see the club at least retain its position, and of course its value. Even if he has to sell in a way that see Hicks take control, he wants that to leave him with as much profit as possible.

We can say the same with Hicks. Whether it’s in the long-term or short-term, he came to Liverpool to make money. The more value the club has, the more money he’ll make when he does sell. The easier it will be to attract investors or convince banks if he wants to stay.

 

Rafa knows this. He’s in a strong position. And so he’s making sure his demands are met as much as possible.

Rafa knows that there really isn’t any way to tell how the future ownership of the club will go. And he wants a contract that works for him regardless.

We’ve read he wants a clause where he can leave without compensation being due if the club is sold to new owners.

I believe that this is inaccurate.

As is the idea that he’s trying to get a deal that makes it easy for him to go to Real when they decide they want him.

If Real wanted Rafa, they’d have no qualms about paying compensation to get him. They’ll negotiate a deal with Liverpool, and they’ll pay it. As they and other clubs have done before.

And if Rafa had already made it clear he wanted to leave, his position would be pretty untenable anyway. It’s a red herring, as is often the case.

Very few people really know what is preventing Rafa from signing his deal.

Maybe he’s got tired of some sections of the support joining in with the media in putting his every act under a microscope and twisting it into something different. Maybe the rumour he’s about to leave is actually accurate, because he really has had enough.

But that’s very doubtful, for now at least.

Rafa needs to work out if it’s better to let the press work with nothing, to work with something too small to use without twisting, or to work with something that is real but far too mundane compared to their often-crazy theories.

But it’s not just the press he has to contend with. And it’s difficult to see how a Liverpool fan can honestly say it’s good for the club to have fans lying in wait for any sightings of any slight chinks in Rafa’s armour before launching yet another attack on him. The best they’ll do is to make no difference, after that they can only really cause damage.

The press will keep at Rafa now until that contract is signed, they smell blood and they’re going for the kill.

But they don’t, on the whole, support Liverpool.

And believe it or not, Liverpool are actually playing a game tonight. One that would have seen us classed as underdogs a few years ago. If we’re underdogs now, it’s because of the external pressures that are being placed on the manager and his players. Apart from that, we’re on a par with the big clubs in Europe again. We’re capable of beating any of them - but shouldn’t be condemned if once in a while one of them gets the upper hand.

But if we don’t stop this civil war, the one that far too many fans are fighting in, we’ll only be able to play those big European sides in friendlies.

If you can’t be friendly, if you can’t enjoy this hobby that must cost you a fair percentage of your spare cash, maybe it’s time to see if, unlike Fernando, you are more suited to Dancing On Ice. Maybe it’s time to join your local Amateur Dramatic group. Maybe you just need a little bit of a rest from it all, a break to think again just what football is supposed to be all about.

If we can’t enjoy the build-up to a match like tonight, something has gone badly wrong. Although by the time you’ve read this, there’ll be no build-up left!


http://www.anfieldroad.com/news/200902253214/liverpool-do-have-a-game-in-madrid.html/
I saw Saddam's hanging on YouTube and it made me think. It made me think... is there nothing on the Internet that I won't masturbate to?

Offline Walter Sobchak

  • RAWK Supporter
  • Legacy Fan
  • ******
  • Posts: 7,998
  • Calmer than you are
Re: Wheres Rafa''s new contract?
« Reply #759 on: February 25, 2009, 05:02:42 pm »
some sort of official statement from the club would be welcomed.

also be interested to read kennys next piece on the official site