Author Topic: Youth and Under 23 Thread (Read 12354530 times)

Sarge · « **Reply #520 on:** February 14, 2008, 11:35:09 pm »

Quote from: ouestlereferee on February 14, 2008, 11:32:51 pm

that sounds ominous Sarge.

Players only,well + Owners. But big changes.

Crazyhorse7778 · « **Reply #521 on:** February 14, 2008, 11:43:09 pm »

Don't think Astrit will ever be converted to a wide-left player to be honest, no matter how bad our left side is.

Xabifan · « **Reply #522 on:** February 15, 2008, 12:14:39 am »

Anyone got a fixture list?

ouestlereferee · « **Reply #523 on:** February 15, 2008, 01:13:01 am »

Quote from: Crazyhorse7778 on February 14, 2008, 11:43:09 pm

Don't think Astrit will ever be converted to a wide-left player to be honest, no matter how bad our left side is.

wikipedia describes him as "Attacking Midfielder (centre/left)".... presumably there's no conversion required.....

Crazyhorse7778 · « **Reply #524 on:** February 15, 2008, 01:17:07 am »

Quote from: ouestlereferee on February 15, 2008, 01:13:01 am

wikipedia describes him as "Attacking Midfielder (centre/left)".... presumably there's no conversion required.....

His strengths are vision and passing so he does all of his best work in the centre, he is one of the most talented young players we have, regardless of what wikipedia says he is not a left midfielder, and trying to make one out of him could hamper his development.

ouestlereferee · « **Reply #525 on:** February 15, 2008, 01:18:37 am »

Quote from: Crazyhorse7778 on February 15, 2008, 01:17:07 am

His strengths are vision and passing so he does all of his best work in the centre, he is one of the most talented young players we have, regardless of what wikipedia says he is not a left midfielder, and trying to make one out of him could hamper his development.

you could say the same about zidane in 98....

RedMichelFerri · « **Reply #526 on:** February 15, 2008, 04:50:58 am »

Marvin pourie looks to me a faster version of Viduka with bit dribbling ability. He is as powerful as Viduka but has good pace too and can dribble when required. He'll cope with physical side of EPL too. I'll take Eccelton, Pacheco, Pourie, Nemeth (He has similar instinct as Fowler and know where the goal is even when he is having his back towards it. Instinctive player), Ammoo over Kuyt and Voronin.

I am also very impressed with Astrit. Has awesome vision and range of passing.

Uhoh AureliOs · « **Reply #527 on:** February 15, 2008, 09:53:15 am »

Quote from: Crazyhorse7778 on February 15, 2008, 01:17:07 am

His strengths are vision and passing so he does all of his best work in the centre, he is one of the most talented young players we have, regardless of what wikipedia says he is not a left midfielder, and trying to make one out of him could hamper his development.

Aye he's a left footed central midfielder. Wikipedia is gash.

Sarge · « **Reply #528 on:** February 15, 2008, 12:41:51 pm »

Quote from: Xabifan on February 15, 2008, 12:14:39 am

Anyone got a fixture list?

Try the Reserve/Youths thread.

Kite · « **Reply #529 on:** February 15, 2008, 01:16:33 pm »

Quote from: Sarge on February 14, 2008, 11:25:12 pm

Not doubting that just think a complete overhaul of the whole Club is coming.

I agree. I think several players Rafa inherited are going and maybe some more established names. Its needed too.

Sarge · « **Reply #530 on:** February 15, 2008, 01:22:38 pm »

Quote from: Kite on February 15, 2008, 01:16:33 pm

I agree. I think several players Rafa inherited are going and maybe some more established names. Its needed too.

As i said it is not maybe its defo now.

leroy · « **Reply #531 on:** February 15, 2008, 01:36:36 pm »

Quote from: ouestlereferee on February 15, 2008, 01:13:01 am

wikipedia describes him as "Attacking Midfielder (centre/left)".... presumably there's no conversion required.....

Would you like that changed?

bathoz · « **Reply #532 on:** February 15, 2008, 02:03:50 pm »

I've always wondered about playing experienced players for the 4th striker - ala having Voronin or Fowler in the role. Surely the very nature of the job is the sort of thing you want a youthful someone who's willing to give it his all in an attempt to be 3rd/2nd/1st striker. And while Voronin may still have ambitions that way, Fowler never did - not really.

I really like the look of it when Benitez first arrived, and we had Owen, Cisse, Baros, and S-P/Mellor filling the fourth spot. (Granted that would have been an incredibly one dimensional attack, but that's another issue)

ouestlereferee · « **Reply #533 on:** February 15, 2008, 02:16:56 pm »

Quote from: bathoz on February 15, 2008, 02:03:50 pm

I've always wondered about playing experienced players for the 4th striker - ala having Voronin or Fowler in the role. Surely the very nature of the job is the sort of thing you want a youthful someone who's willing to give it his all in an attempt to be 3rd/2nd/1st striker. And while Voronin may still have ambitions that way, Fowler never did - not really.

I agree with this idea. This is really where Arsenal differ in use of youths compared to us - the average age of the first XI is similar, but guys like Bendtner are a lot lot younger than Voronin....

Sarge · « **Reply #534 on:** February 15, 2008, 02:16:59 pm »

As stated on here many times our Youth/Reserve Strikers are not quite ready yet so maybe this is why?

ouestlereferee · « **Reply #535 on:** February 15, 2008, 02:18:41 pm »

Quote from: Sarge on February 15, 2008, 02:16:59 pm

As stated on here many times our Youth/Reserve Strikers are not quite ready yet so maybe this is why?

i hope it's because we don't want to push their development too much where it damages the player in the longer term... because if it's not, i'd rather have these guys playing and cash in on kuyt, voronin, riise

Sarge · « **Reply #536 on:** February 15, 2008, 02:28:07 pm »

Quote from: ouestlereferee on February 15, 2008, 02:18:41 pm

i hope it's because we don't want to push their development too much where it damages the player in the longer term... because if it's not, i'd rather have these guys playing and cash in on kuyt, voronin, riise

Quote from: Sarge on February 15, 2008, 02:16:59 pm

As stated on here many times our Youth/Reserve Strikers are not quite ready yet so maybe this is why?

Matt as you know i agree with you on this but i am going by what people have said in this thread including yourself.

.adam · « **Reply #537 on:** February 15, 2008, 02:38:39 pm »

Quote from: Sarge on February 15, 2008, 01:22:38 pm

As i said it is not maybe its defo now.

D'you have any inside knowledge you'd like to divulge, Sarge?

P.S. Please say Riise.

ouestlereferee · « **Reply #538 on:** February 15, 2008, 02:44:39 pm »

Quote from: .adam on February 15, 2008, 02:38:39 pm

D'you have any inside knowledge you'd like to divulge, Sarge?

P.S. Please say Riise.

if he only said kuyt, voronin, & kewell would you be upset?

Sarge · « **Reply #539 on:** February 15, 2008, 02:48:30 pm »

Quote from: .adam on February 15, 2008, 02:38:39 pm

D'you have any inside knowledge you'd like to divulge, Sarge?

P.S. Please say Riise.

No and if you read the thread its quite clear what people want. But i think Riise will go in the Summer Yes.

.adam · « **Reply #540 on:** February 15, 2008, 03:11:38 pm »

Quote from: ouestlereferee on February 15, 2008, 02:44:39 pm

if he only said kuyt, voronin, & kewell would you be upset?

Yes. Yes I would. Is this the answer you are looking for?

ouestlereferee · « **Reply #541 on:** February 15, 2008, 03:13:24 pm »

Quote from: .adam on February 15, 2008, 03:11:38 pm

Yes. Yes I would. Is this the answer you are looking for?

according to meatloaf, 2 outta 3 ain't bad, so 3 outta 4 must be better?

.adam · « **Reply #542 on:** February 15, 2008, 03:14:10 pm »

Quote from: ouestlereferee on February 15, 2008, 03:13:24 pm

according to meatloaf, 2 outta 3 ain't bad, so 3 outta 4 must be better?

Meatloaf shmeetloaf.

ouestlereferee · « **Reply #543 on:** February 15, 2008, 03:15:55 pm »

Quote from: .adam on February 15, 2008, 03:14:10 pm

Meatloaf shmeetloaf.

I'd love to take the words right out of Torres' mouth.....

Sarge · « **Reply #544 on:** February 15, 2008, 03:16:21 pm »

Quote from: .adam on February 15, 2008, 03:14:10 pm

Meatloaf = Steve Bruce.

Sarge · « **Reply #545 on:** February 15, 2008, 04:59:07 pm »

Argentine starlet Mauro Icardi has turned down a possible move to Liverpool or Arsenal in order to join Real Madrid.

The highly-rated 14-year-old striker, who holds an Italian passport, has agreed a six-year deal with Real after leaving Barcelona.

Liverpool and Arsenal were among a host of European clubs chasing Icardi, but the forward has opted to sign for the Spanish champions.

Icardi joined Barcelona in June 2007 after catching the eye of youth team co-ordinator Pep Boada.

However, Real have now tempted Icardi away from their fierce rivals as coach Bernd Schuster looks to the future

http://www.skysports.com/story/0,19528,11669_3148802,00.html

ouestlereferee · « **Reply #546 on:** February 15, 2008, 05:12:38 pm »

Quote from: Sarge on February 15, 2008, 04:59:07 pm

Argentine starlet Mauro Icardi has turned down a possible move to Liverpool or Arsenal in order to join Real Madrid.

The highly-rated 14-year-old striker, who holds an Italian passport, has agreed a six-year deal with Real after leaving Barcelona.

Liverpool and Arsenal were among a host of European clubs chasing Icardi, but the forward has opted to sign for the Spanish champions.

Icardi joined Barcelona in June 2007 after catching the eye of youth team co-ordinator Pep Boada.

However, Real have now tempted Icardi away from their fierce rivals as coach Bernd Schuster looks to the future

http://www.skysports.com/story/0,19528,11669_3148802,00.html

How have they given him a 6 year contract when apparently Fabregas, Pique, Pacheco, Bruna couldn't be tied down in the same way?

I think it's more likely that Kuyt is top scorer in the league this season than Schuster is still there by the time this guy's ready for senior football....

Sarge · « **Reply #547 on:** February 15, 2008, 05:19:52 pm »

True but you never know, in 6 years he will only be 20.

Sarge · « **Reply #548 on:** February 17, 2008, 12:22:51 pm »

So Insua has to get a chance at LB this season, really can he be any worse?

Manila Kop · « **Reply #549 on:** February 17, 2008, 12:56:45 pm »

Quote from: Sarge on February 17, 2008, 12:22:51 pm

So Insua has to get a chance at LB this season, really can he be any worse?

Aye, wouldn't have minded giving Mikel a run-out yesterday either given how many times the ball got hoofed up to Crouch by Carra and Sami.

But then Rafa would get rubbished for the "insanity" of playing ressies against Barnsley like Itandje. Christ, we are stuck between a rock and a hard place aren't we.

Sarge · « **Reply #550 on:** February 17, 2008, 01:07:04 pm »

Quote from: Manila Kop on February 17, 2008, 12:56:45 pm

Aye, wouldn't have minded giving Mikel a run-out yesterday either given how many times the ball got hoofed up to Crouch by Carra and Sami.

But then Rafa would get rubbished for the "insanity" of playing ressies against Barnsley like Itandje. Christ, we are stuck between a rock and a hard place aren't we.

I do not think so, i feel fans well the majority of them would like to see Insua in the starting XI?

Uhoh AureliOs · « **Reply #551 on:** February 17, 2008, 01:14:23 pm »

I would. He looks pretty good from what I've seen of him.

The Armchair · « **Reply #552 on:** February 17, 2008, 01:28:17 pm »

I'm going up to watch the reserves play Newcastle tomorrow night, I watched the win away to Sunderland which was impressive for the resilience shown, especially as Sunderland fielded a few experienced players like Dwight Yorke, Ian Harte and Russel Anderson, as well as a defender they'd signed from PSG.

Insua and Huth were impressive at the back and Plessis looks a prospect in midfield. However, the one that stood out was Nemeth - he looks to have a real touch of class about him and his finish (a lob over the keeper) was clinical, we could have a real star on our hands.
The limited bits i've seen of Pacheco and Bruna have also created excitement for the future. Bruna's technique and movement look great and Pacheco's ability and coolness in finishing are frightening for such a young player.

I'd like to see Nemeth and Insua involved in the first team squad asap.

Manila Kop · « **Reply #553 on:** February 17, 2008, 01:50:03 pm »

Quote from: Sarge on February 17, 2008, 01:07:04 pm

I do not think so, i feel fans well the majority of them would like to see Insua in the starting XI?

Quote from: Uhoh AureliOs on February 17, 2008, 01:14:23 pm

I would. He looks pretty good from what I've seen of him.

So would I, but after all the rubbish being heaped on Rafa after yesterday's defeat I'm not surprised he erred on the side of caution. I can only imagine what the reaction would have been if Insua had made a mistake yesterday - Rafa would be accused of "underestimating the opposition" and "tinkering with the squad" not just by the pundits but by some of our own supporters.

Sarge · « **Reply #554 on:** February 17, 2008, 02:17:16 pm »

Quote from: Manila Kop on February 17, 2008, 01:50:03 pm

So would I, but after all the rubbish being heaped on Rafa after yesterday's defeat I'm not surprised he erred on the side of caution. I can only imagine what the reaction would have been if Insua had made a mistake yesterday - Rafa would be accused of "underestimating the opposition" and "tinkering with the squad" not just by the pundits but by some of our own supporters.

Well tht is happening now anyway.

Manila Kop · « **Reply #555 on:** February 17, 2008, 02:24:52 pm »

Quote from: Sarge on February 17, 2008, 02:17:16 pm

Well tht is happening now anyway.

Fair point. He might as well bring some of them on if he's going to get rubbished for whatever happens anyway eh.

Sarge · « **Reply #556 on:** February 17, 2008, 02:34:29 pm »

Quote from: Manila Kop on February 17, 2008, 02:24:52 pm

Fair point. He might as well bring some of them on if he's going to get rubbished for whatever happens anyway eh.

Yes as i said Insua cannot be any worse than Riise/Aurelio and the fans would support the lad i am sure of it. Also Nemeth cannot be as bad as whats up front at present.

Uhoh AureliOs · « **Reply #557 on:** February 17, 2008, 02:48:51 pm »

I wonder what it takes nowadays for a youth/reserve player to be selected ahead of a member of the first team? Is it simply Rafa doesn't think they're ready/experienced enough? Or they don't fully know or grasp the language? The tactics? The team ethics? It'd be interesting to have an insight into Rafas thinking on the subject. So far he's shown that he's not afraid to go around buying up young talent, so surely he has plans to utilise them in the near future.

I just hope we don't send Insua out on loan next season as so far Rafa hasn't been in a hurry to bring anyone back off loan.

Sarge · « **Reply #558 on:** February 17, 2008, 03:01:49 pm »

Quote from: Uhoh AureliOs on February 17, 2008, 02:48:51 pm

I wonder what it takes nowadays for a youth/reserve player to be selected ahead of a member of the first team? Is it simply Rafa doesn't think they're ready/experienced enough? Or they don't fully know or grasp the language? The tactics? The team ethics? It'd be interesting to have an insight into Rafas thinking on the subject. So far he's shown that he's not afraid to go around buying up young talent, so surely he has plans to utilise them in the near future.

I just hope we don't send Insua out on loan next season as so far Rafa hasn't been in a hurry to bring anyone back off loan.

Lots of questions indeed.

ouestlereferee · « **Reply #559 on:** February 17, 2008, 03:15:54 pm »

Quote from: Manila Kop on February 17, 2008, 02:24:52 pm

Fair point. He might as well bring some of them on if he's going to get rubbished for whatever happens anyway eh.

What are the odds Insua starts against Inter? You'd never know with Rafa - he did it against Barca with Arbeloa.