Topic: The corruption fallacy - they’re all out to get us!

[DarkOfTheManatee]

It'll be interesting to see if we get a big, favourable decision in the last three games, now that our results don't matter anymore.

When opposition fans or pundits look at another club's season, they typically only remember the most unequivocally contentious decisions and the most recent one. Almost everyone still remembers we were robbed against Spurs (even if we should've "just moved on" afterwards), and at the moment it's the Gakpo West Ham moment or the Doku kung-fu kick that are the most recent memorable decisions. Both also against us (although the media have successfully managed to get the Forest drop-ball in the conversation too).

Would certainly be convenient for the PGMOL if the refs looked favourably on us until the end of the season, in the hope that this led to a controversial decision in our favour. That would take some of the heat off them, and help shift the narrative from one where we've been pretty clearly hard done by to one where "it evened itself out over the course of the season".

[paddysour]

They won't investigate. I've already said why. They will protect themselves, as they always try and do. It's a catastrophic fault with the way PGMOL is set up. It has a bias towards itself and exists to protect its members. There should be an independent body with oversight instead.

There. That's a fair answer.

So, will you go public with your own stuff at last? Have the courage to test your ideas with people more sceptical than the Liverpool fans on here.

Sounds like you are both on the same side lol

[Yorkykopite]

As for going public. You do realise this is a public forum?

Yes I do. It's almost 100 per cent Liverpool fans. It's why I suggested you present your ideas in a less biased forum. I suggested publishing your ideas, or presenting them to a broadcaster or podcaster, or writing up a pitch for a respectable newspaper or magazine. Test your theories in a more neutral environment. The close season is a great time to do it. Why is that so hard to understand?

If I believed in all the stuff that you do, and was absolutely convinced that Liverpool suffer and will continue to suffer, as you do, then I'd do my utmost to write my ideas up, present the evidence, and get those ideas disseminated. The media is never hostile to scandalous stories. You keep on describing a scandal. Get it out there.

The alternative is to keep whining in here, season after season and complaining that 'football is fucked'. That does no one any good. And you must be depressed - surely you must - about the prospect of continuing to do so next season and the season after and on and on forever. So be brave. Get your stuff out there and change things.

[Eeyore]

Yes I do. It's almost 100 per cent Liverpool fans. It's why I suggested you present your ideas in a less biased forum. I suggested publishing your ideas, or presenting them to a broadcaster or podcaster, or writing up a pitch for a respectable newspaper or magazine. Test your theories in a more neutral environment. The close season is a great time to do it. Why is that so hard to understand?

If I believed in all the stuff that you do, and was absolutely convinced that Liverpool suffer and will continue to suffer, as you do, then I'd do my utmost to write my ideas up, present the evidence, and get those ideas disseminated. The media is never hostile to scandalous stories. You keep on describing a scandal. Get it out there.

The alternative is to keep whining in here, season after season and complaining that 'football is fucked'. That does no one any good. And you must be depressed - surely you must - about the prospect of continuing to do so next season and the season after and on and on forever. So be brave. Get your stuff out there and change things.

Oh dear. Yet again you have cherry-picked a couple of lines from a post and completely ignored the important part.

This was the post you replied to.

What you are describing is 100% people conspiring and 100% a corrupt organisation. So both a conspiracy and corruption. The thing is if you have conspiracies and corruption then that is a perfect breeding ground for biases to flourish.

As for going public. You do realise this is a public forum?

So please pray tell why you have completely ignored and deleted the relevant part of the debate and done a Yorky and butchered a post and then replied to it.

Do you belive the actions of the officials and the PGMOL involved individuals conspiring and do you belive the PGMOL is a corrupt organisation.

Above all though why are you complaining about the reaction of a pro-Liverpool forum when the whole basis of your argument is that bias doesn't exist?

[Johnny Foreigner]

I don't know the ins and outs of british history and politics - not being born and brought up here, but hopefully know enough to have some opinion

Was fortunate enough to get a final ticket vs chelsea, and that was probably the loudest booing of the national anthem and rendition of fuck the tories etc i have ever heard in my 40 years of following this great club.. not sure if i can explain it, but i felt a bit of pride and enjoyment of this fuckem all.. howver, a bit of bittersweet, as i was looking at the refs and the "hospitality" section and I thought - there will a comeback to this..

no bragging, but i checked my "futbology app", and i watched football in 12 countries, xx matches etc, but that was one of the weirdest referee performances i have ever witnessed.. i was stone sober but could not really believe it..

corruoption, bias, incompetence, not sure what but something is rotten

[Peabee]

Anthony Taylor was the referee in 40 of the 81 losses of Klopp's LFC tenure so far.

[Yorkykopite]

Above all though why are you complaining about the reaction of a pro-Liverpool forum when the whole basis of your argument is that bias doesn't exist?

Since this is apparently your most serious point I'll answer it before I leave you to it. Surprisingly I believe that bias can exist in life. Controversial I know. Even more weird, I would expect a Liverpool fan forum to be biased towards Liverpool. Does this mean that nothing is unbiased? Of course not.

But I will leave you to it because the season is effectively over and, more to the point, I don't think you possess the courage to do what I asked you to do and take your ideas further afield where they might have some impact. (You don't even have the courage to answer the question of whether you will or not). My prediction is that you will be whining on this thread in 12 months time.

[Eeyore]

Since this is apparently your most serious point I'll answer it before I leave you to it. Surprisingly I believe that bias can exist in life. Controversial I know. Even more weird, I would expect a Liverpool fan forum to be biased towards Liverpool. Does this mean that nothing is unbiased? Of course not.

But I will leave you to it because the season is effectively over and, more to the point, I don't think you possess the courage to do what I asked you to do and take your ideas further afield where they might have some impact. (You don't even have the courage to answer the question of whether you will or not). My prediction is that you will be whining on this thread in 12 months time.

You don't have the courage to answer the questions you are asked. That is the issue.

It is very simple did the match officials conspire to not question Taylor saying floor, floor, floor to a goalkeeper who was physically prevented by Taylor on two occasions from taking a restart.

Have the PGMOL conspired to not investigate something that you called a cover up by Taylor. Something you described as Taylor looking to include Areola in his cover up.

Just answer the question please?

[Mahern]

You don't have the courage to answer the questions you are asked. That is the issue.

It is very simple did the match officials conspire to not question Taylor saying floor, floor, floor to a goalkeeper who was physically prevented by Taylor on two occasions from taking a restart.

Have the PGMOL conspired to not investigate something that you called a cover up by Taylor. Something you described as Taylor looking to include Areola in his cover up.

Just answer the question please?

I don't think VAR had any reason to get involved here, maybe if Gakpo didn't pause and just put it in, then we would have had a spectacle.

But unless PGMOL come out with a satisfactory explanation, and here the club should be asking for any available audio, then I agree they are conspiring. Just to ask, not sure if the officials are recorded or not unless VAR is being addressed?

I would also be keen to hear the answer to that second part of the question - did PGMOL conspire - from those who disagree with you?

[Mahern]

The other thing Gakpo should have done to fuck him up is contest the subsequent drop ball.

[Eeyore]

I don't think VAR had any reason to get involved here, maybe if Gakpo didn't pause and just put it in, then we would have had a spectacle.

But unless PGMOL come out with a satisfactory explanation, and here the club should be asking for any available audio, then I agree they are conspiring. Just to ask, not sure if the officials are recorded or not unless VAR is being addressed?

I would also be keen to hear the answer to that second part of the question - did PGMOL conspire - from those who disagree with you?

The unfortunate part is that players have a deep ingrained mentality that means they are trained to play to the whistle. Don't assume anything just play to the whistle. That is exactly what Gakpo does. He motions to the assistant and asks if he can challenge Areola and the assistant keeps his flag down.

Taylor then inexplicably blows his whistle. That then ends play. There is no coming back from that. Once a referee blows his whistle it acts like a guillotine. Nothing that happens after that moment matters. Taylor knew that. The mandate is clear any ambiguity the let VAR deal with it.

Is there anyone on the planet who thinks Taylor acted with certainty?

 

[Risto]

(From a West Ham forum:)



    My take on the Areola situation is that there is no way a Premier League keeper throws the ball down like that and pulls his socks up without having been told it’s a free kick.

    I would say the ref said to him ‘it’s a free kick’ and ran away from him… then the Liverpool players had retreated and the ref was then thinking he could keep the game going shouting at Areola to play on. Areola doesn’t hear this and as per usual a Liverpool player tries to score a cheap goal, so the ref then gets into a panic and tells Areola to make out he needs treatment:

    All in all it stems from the ref being out of control of the game, too many mixed signals from him.

(reply by another person)

Exactly I think the ref coc_ed up and ran up to him and said go down and fein injury ( if that was against us I'd be asking questions ) it's nice to get something for once :grin:

[GreatEx]

(From a West Ham forum:):

Doesn't explain why he restarted with a drop ball if it was actually a free kick. Just more panicking, I suppose.

[JRed]

(From a West Ham forum:)



    My take on the Areola situation is that there is no way a Premier League keeper throws the ball down like that and pulls his socks up without having been told it’s a free kick.

    I would say the ref said to him ‘it’s a free kick’ and ran away from him… then the Liverpool players had retreated and the ref was then thinking he could keep the game going shouting at Areola to play on. Areola doesn’t hear this and as per usual a Liverpool player tries to score a cheap goal, so the ref then gets into a panic and tells Areola to make out he needs treatment:

    All in all it stems from the ref being out of control of the game, too many mixed signals from him.

(reply by another person)

Exactly I think the ref coc_ed up and ran up to him and said go down and fein injury ( if that was against us I'd be asking questions ) it's nice to get something for once :grin:

Except if a ref gives a free kick he has to blow his whistle, which he didn’t, so he 100% did not give a free kick.

[Andy @ Allerton!]

So was a bit merry last night and a bit miffed about the whole thing, but what good does that do anyone?

Going to bow out of this thread I think.

Wish I could walk away from football, but I'm trapped. I have had a ST for decades now and everyone tells me it would be stupid to bin it, so I'm stuck.

That's how they get you. Even though you know it's bent, you can't walk away.

Fucks sake.

[rob1966]

Since this is apparently your most serious point I'll answer it before I leave you to it. Surprisingly I believe that bias can exist in life. Controversial I know. Even more weird, I would expect a Liverpool fan forum to be biased towards Liverpool. Does this mean that nothing is unbiased? Of course not.

But I will leave you to it because the season is effectively over and, more to the point, I don't think you possess the courage to do what I asked you to do and take your ideas further afield where they might have some impact. (You don't even have the courage to answer the question of whether you will or not). My prediction is that you will be whining on this thread in 12 months time.

Paul Tomkins, who has been writing about Liverpool for 20 years has already covered it in depth on his website, and it gained no traction with the main stream media, so what do you expect Al to do exactly?

[rob1966]

So was a bit merry last night and a bit miffed about the whole thing, but what good does that do anyone?

Going to bow out of this thread I think.

Wish I could walk away from football, but I'm trapped. I have had a ST for decades now and everyone tells me it would be stupid to bin it, so I'm stuck.

That's how they get you. Even though you know it's bent, you can't walk away.

Fucks sake.

22 fucking years I've been on the list, got fucked over by the club when they expanded the Anny and hardly fucking moved, don't bin it off, you'll regret it and youre playing into the clubs hand, they won't take one off the list, they'll flog your seat to tourists instead

[Mister Flip Flop]

So was a bit merry last night and a bit miffed about the whole thing, but what good does that do anyone?

Going to bow out of this thread I think.

Wish I could walk away from football, but I'm trapped. I have had a ST for decades now and everyone tells me it would be stupid to bin it, so I'm stuck.

That's how they get you. Even though you know it's bent, you can't walk away.

Fucks sake.

Totally understandable Andy. I'm done with it as soon as 115 don't get punished in a suitable manner for their cheating but it's a bit easier for me as i support Shamrock Rovers over here so i still have Varless football to watch and enjoy when i walk away.

[rossipersempre]

The unfortunate part is that players have a deep ingrained mentality that means they are trained to play to the whistle. Don't assume anything just play to the whistle. That is exactly what Gakpo does. He motions to the assistant and asks if he can challenge Areola and the assistant keeps his flag down.

Gakpo could have stuck the ball in before Taylor could react if he didn't hesitate. Don't remember this twat asking permission.



Or this well brought up nice lad...

[rob1966]

Gakpo could have stuck the ball in before Taylor could react if he didn't hesitate. Don't remember this twat asking permission.



Or this well brought up nice lad...

Yeah and not having a go at Cody but he was too honest. Darwin, Jota, Mo, Mac wouldn't have asked, they'd have just put the ball in the net.

To be fair to Cody, in that video I posted yesterday Nani does the same, he asks Clattenburg first. He likely didn't want to risk a yellow.

[rossipersempre]

Yeah and not having a go at Cody but he was too honest. Darwin, Jota, Mo, Mac wouldn't have asked, they'd have just put the ball in the net

At 87 mins given our death-spiralled season, what's the worst that could have happened? He'd have got booked. So what?

[spider-neil]

To be fair to Gakpo you quite clearly hear the whistle as he is running up to the ball.

[rossipersempre]

Not a single one of Man City's or Arsenal's players would have done the same.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not having a go at Gakpo, it's just frustrating that typically it's now all been swept under the carpet as a result, in a way it wouldn't if he'd just acted on instinct.

[rossipersempre]

To be fair to Gakpo you quite clearly hear the whistle as he is running up to the ball.

Was that before or after he checked with the assistant?

Even so, I'd have pretended not to hear and taken the yellow if it meant Taylor having to dig himself out of the hole he'd made.

[spider-neil]

Ref blows his whistle for no reason stops a Liverpool player from kicking the ball into an empty net and then clearly tells the keeper to get on the floor - Swept under the carpet after a day
Ref gives Liverpool a dropball - Outrage lasts a week

[spider-neil]

Was that before or after he checked with the assistant?

Even so, I'd have pretended not to hear and taken the yellow if it meant Taylor having to dig himself out of the hole he'd made.

I've watched it back, as Gakpo is approaching the ball you can clearly hear the whistle hence why he stops. If there is no whistle he slams the ball into an empty net. The first time I watched it in real time I didn't hear the whistle

[rob1966]

Was that before or after he checked with the assistant?

Even so, I'd have pretended not to hear and taken the yellow if it meant Taylor having to dig himself out of the hole he'd made.

He checked, ran for it, Taylor realised what was going on then blew the whistle like mad. If he doesn't do the check, he likely gets the ball and scores before Taylor realises whats going on. Although, I think the crowd roaring at Areola alerted Taylor anyway.

Once the whistle had gone, made no difference whar Cody did, its no goal

[Golyo]

Ref blows his whistle for no reason stops a Liverpool player from kicking the ball into an empty net and then clearly tells the keeper to get on the floor - Swept under the carpet after a day
Ref gives Liverpool a dropball - Outrage lasts a week

In a nutshell. With moderately fair refereeing this team would have won the league this year. I am pretty sure Jürgen is walking away because of all this bullshit.

[Mahern]

He checked, ran for it, Taylor realised what was going on then blew the whistle like mad. If he doesn't do the check, he likely gets the ball and scores before Taylor realises whats going on. Although, I think the crowd roaring at Areola alerted Taylor anyway.

Once the whistle had gone, made no difference whar Cody did, its no goal

I would have contested the drop ball and gone in Mane style like his goal in the City semi-final.

[BoRed]

There's no way Gakpo puts that ball into the net before Taylor whistles regardless of whether he first checks with the linesman or not. Let's not blame Gakpo for Taylor fucking us over.

[paddysour]

Paul Tomkins, who has been writing about Liverpool for 20 years has already covered it in depth on his website, and it gained no traction with the main stream media, so what do you expect Al to do exactly?

Simultaneously some of the absolute best research, and most awful writing, that I've ever seen.

Which is a real same because you can't argue with the data. But no rival fan will make it through the article.

[kermit^^]

Anthony Taylor was the referee in 40 of the 81 losses of Klopp's LFC tenure so far.

I don't think that is accurate.
https://www.worldfootball.net/referee_summary/anthony-taylor_2/liverpool-fc/4/

[Oh Campione]

I don't think that is accurate.
https://www.worldfootball.net/referee_summary/anthony-taylor_2/liverpool-fc/4/

What a strange stat to make up!?

[Lisan Al Gaib]

Anthony Taylor was the referee in 40 of the 81 losses of Klopp's LFC tenure so far.

Anthony Taylor has only refereed us 40 times in the entire time Klopp has been with us, you shouldn't just believe everything you read on the internet.

[Lisan Al Gaib]

What a strange stat to make up!?

It was going around Twitter just before the Utd game. Its amazing what bullshit people will just believe because it fits their agenda

[rossipersempre]

He checked, ran for it, Taylor realised what was going on then blew the whistle like mad. If he doesn't do the check, he likely gets the ball and scores before Taylor realises whats going on. Although, I think the crowd roaring at Areola alerted Taylor anyway.

Exactly, that was my point. There was a small window of opportunity.

[rossipersempre]

There's no way Gakpo puts that ball into the net before Taylor whistles regardless of whether he first checks with the linesman or not. Let's not blame Gakpo for Taylor fucking us over.

Nobody's having a go at him, not really.

The whole incident just seems to symbolise and sum up how polite and non-ruthless we are, especially given the stakes. Look at the noise emanating from the club after this latest "error". Deafening silence. Sure, we won't get the 2 points back but even with nothing left to play for, we should be shining a massive spotlight on this corrupt c*nt and all his corrupt c*nty PGMOL mates and trying to end his career.

You'd think it'd be hard to survive this openly deliberate cheating as a referee, but here we are 3 days later and the crickets are chirping. The former Strangeways prison officer has not even been stood down for the weekend by his former South Yorkshire Police Constable boss because that would be tantamount to admitting he actually did something wrong and needed investigating.

[BoRed]

Nobody's having a go at him, not really.

The whole incident just seems to symbolise and sum up how polite and non-ruthless we are, especially given the stakes. Look at the noise emanating from the club after this latest "error". Deafening silence. Sure, we won't get the 2 points back but even with nothing left to play for, we should be shining a massive spotlight on this corrupt c*nt and all his corrupt c*nty PGMOL mates and trying to end his career.

You'd think it'd be hard to survive this openly deliberate cheating as a referee, but here we are 3 days later and the crickets are chirping. The former Strangeways prison officer has not even been stood down for the weekend by his former South Yorkshire Police Constable boss because that would be tantamount to admitting he actually did something wrong and needed investigating.

I agree with that, the club haven't done enough. All the talk of "escalating" after the Spurs game was quickly forgotten, and if anything was done behind the scenes, it obviously hasn't made any difference.

[Eeyore]

I don't think VAR had any reason to get involved here, maybe if Gakpo didn't pause and just put it in, then we would have had a spectacle.

But unless PGMOL come out with a satisfactory explanation, and here the club should be asking for any available audio, then I agree they are conspiring. Just to ask, not sure if the officials are recorded or not unless VAR is being addressed?

I would also be keen to hear the answer to that second part of the question - did PGMOL conspire - from those who disagree with you?

Yeh the referee is micd up and recorded all the time. My understanding is that Stockley Park gets to hear the ref but the ref only hears VAR if they directly speak to him. So Stockley Park would have heard Taylor saying floor to Areola.

[rob1966]

I agree with that, the club haven't done enough. All the talk of "escalating" after the Spurs game was quickly forgotten, and if anything was done behind the scenes, it obviously hasn't made any difference.

I posted this reply below in the VAR thread

Club won't do anything. Soft as shite.

What exactly do you expect the club to do? Complain to the PGMOL, how did that go after the Spurs game, did we get better decisions, or did we just end up with Tierney every week? Do we ask ADFC and Arsenal, two clubs who have massively benefitted from these decisions against us, to support us? What about Utd, who never get bad decisions, would they support us? How did being openly critical of PGMOL go for Wolves and Forest?

What about the media? Stelling has kicked off, MOTD did, but BBC Football totally ignored it, Sky tried to whitewash it on Refwatch, Gallagher even used the words he's dug himself out of a hole, we've no backing in this

The PGMOL is ran by an ex SYP bizzie, it's as corrupt as that force, its as corrupt as the MET, the c*nts just close ranks and protect their own. Taylor is doing the CL Semis this week, he's doing the Euros, do you really think PGMOL will haul him over the coals?