Topic: Rugby League

[Black Bull Nova]

We all have our crosses to bear 

My Step Dad is from Southport and has been watching Wigan since the 1950's, he introduced me and our kid to RL in 1985, seen some great games following Wigan down the years, Manly still stands out even now.

I will have to admit that the Wigan team from the late 80s/early 90s is the best ever, Saints have been great in the last decade but Hanley, Offiah, Botica, Edwards, Gregory, Radlinski, Robinson, Farrell, Betts, Lydon, Paul, Connolly (grrr), Bell, Hampson etc. will probably never be surpassed. Bastards.

[Statto Red]

I will have to admit that the Wigan team from the late 80s/early 90s is the best ever, Saints have been great in the last decade but Hanley, Offiah, Botica, Edwards, Gregory, Radlinski, Robinson, Farrell, Betts, Lydon, Paul, Connolly (grrr), Bell, Hampson etc. will probably never be surpassed. Bastards.

Wasn't that hard as Wigan went full time pro in the late 80s, Leeds went full time pro early 90s but won sweet FA for their troubles, everyone else was semi pro as they couldn't afford to go full time pro until super league started, it showed on the pitch with Wigan winning everything from 1990 to 1996.

[Samie]

Outside of the that Wigan era and the Saints I would say the Bradford Bulls team of the early to mid 00's was scary as fuck.

[Black Bull Nova]

Outside of the that Wigan era and the Saints I would say the Bradford Bulls team of the early to mid 00's was scary as fuck.

Indeed, those 2 finals, Saints v Bradford were immense, would love to see Bradford back in the mix, they still get 5,000 people a game (they still have the biggest ground capacity) but have a record attendance of nearly 70,000 in the past. I am sure the new grading will help them back up as long as their form continues to improve. They were big team.

[rob1966]

I will have to admit that the Wigan team from the late 80s/early 90s is the best ever, Saints have been great in the last decade but Hanley, Offiah, Botica, Edwards, Gregory, Radlinski, Robinson, Farrell, Betts, Lydon, Paul, Connolly (grrr), Bell, Hampson etc. will probably never be surpassed. Bastards.

It was a fantastic time to be introduced to RL, some of the games were brilliant and as my stepdad doesn't have kids of his own, he loved it that me and our kid wanted to go the games with him, travelled all over watching Wigan, great times.

[Statto Red]

Indeed, those 2 finals, Saints v Bradford were immense, would love to see Bradford back in the mix, they still get 5,000 people a game (they still have the biggest ground capacity) but have a record attendance of nearly 70,000 in the past. I am sure the new grading will help them back up as long as their form continues to improve. They were big team.

Odsal is still the same shithole of a ground it always was, their's still the one covered stand & the rest open terracing, which is the old school terracing, it's a weird ground, with no stand but hospitality boxes at one end.

Bradford Bulls moved to Dewsbury for a couple of years from 2019, because they couldn't afford to play at Odsal, Bradford Bulls don't own the stadium anymore.

Early 00s Bradford Bulls had a benefactor pouring money into them, he got fed up & withdrew support, & Bradford went to shit.

[Samie]

Do you remember Lesley Vainokolo? Nicknamed "The Volcano" he was League's version of Jonah Lomou . 

[Black Bull Nova]

Do you remember Lesley Vainokolo? Nicknamed "The Volcano" he was League's version of Jonah Lomou . 

Indeed, a beast, they really were Bulls but we had that horrible little bastard Bobby Goulding. At least he was our little bastard at that moment.


Saints cheaper version of Jonah Lomu was Kevin Ward

[Crosby Nick]

Do you remember Lesley Vainokolo? Nicknamed "The Volcano" he was League's version of Jonah Lomou . 

He definitely wasn’t Union’s! I think he switched codes late in his career when his knees were shot.

Didn’t he score about 6 or 7 tries in a game once?

[Samie]

He scored SIX in a Semi final eliminator I think.

By the time he go to Union he was an extinct Volcano.

[Nobby Reserve]

Early 00s Bradford Bulls had a benefactor pouring money into them, he got fed up & withdrew support, & Bradford went to shit.

They ripped off the 'Cougarmania' thing that Keighley had developed, and would give shitloads of tickets a game away to try to get support through the turnstyle, along with ultra-cheap season tickets. They didn't so much have a rich benefactor (Caisley wasn't particularly wealthy), and were living on tick a lot. They made a huge error trying to nab Iestyn Harris from Leeds, who sued and won. Caisley left soon after. When they cut back on the freebies, crowds dwindled. They tried to get it all back but the bubble was burst.

I used to dislike them immensely. We'd been in the shadow of a mouldy pie for years (when I was growing up, which made it doubly painful) and, just as we'd seen them off and ourselves rose to prominence in 1996, along come the Bradford fucking Bulls to piss on our moment in the sun. As well, Saints were the cavalier entertainers, full of pace and flair and playing the game how it *should* be played, whilst Bratfud were the neanderthalic brutes depending on pounding the opposition into submission.

WRT Vainakolo, when we had Darren Albert opposite on the wing, Albert was half the size but Vainakolo never got the better of him, with albert dumping him on his arse several times.

[rob1966]

They ripped off the 'Cougarmania' thing that Keighley had developed, and would give shitloads of tickets a game away to try to get support through the turnstyle, along with ultra-cheap season tickets. They didn't so much have a rich benefactor (Caisley wasn't particularly wealthy), and were living on tick a lot. They made a huge error trying to nab Iestyn Harris from Leeds, who sued and won. Caisley left soon after. When they cut back on the freebies, crowds dwindled. They tried to get it all back but the bubble was burst.

I used to dislike them immensely. We'd been in the shadow of a mouldy pie for years (when I was growing up, which made it doubly painful) and, just as we'd seen them off and ourselves rose to prominence in 1996, along come the Bradford fucking Bulls to piss on our moment in the sun. As well, Saints were the cavalier entertainers, full of pace and flair and playing the game how it *should* be played, whilst Bratfud were the neanderthalic brutes depending on pounding the opposition into submission.

WRT Vainakolo, when we had Darren Albert opposite on the wing, Albert was half the size but Vainakolo never got the better of him, with albert dumping him on his arse several times.

You'll always have this though. I watched this live on Telly and couldn't believe it

<a href="https://www.youtube.com/v/VjhE7DOvD-c" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer" class="bbc_link bbc_flash_disabled new_win">https://www.youtube.com/v/VjhE7DOvD-c</a>

[Spanish Al]

Always got to re watch that video whenever it pops up somewhere.

Before my time as a Saints fan but my word, unbelievable, goosebumps. I wish so many more understood the game to realise just how incredible that passage of play is. If RL was as widely watched as Union worldwide, this would just be everywhere and everyone would know of it.  Play off match, hooter has gone, one more play, deep inside their own half. Just absolutely bonkers they even thought it was possible. Incredible commentary too.

Two players on the inside of Joynt there would have chinned him had he not evaded the tackles

[Black Bull Nova]

Always got to re watch that video whenever it pops up somewhere.

Before my time as a Saints fan but my word, unbelievable, goosebumps. I wish so many more understood the game to realise just how incredible that passage of play is. If RL was as widely watched as Union worldwide, this would just be everywhere and everyone would know of it.  Play off match, hooter has gone, one more play, deep inside their own half. Just absolutely bonkers they even thought it was possible. Incredible commentary too.

Two players on the inside of Joynt there would have chinned him had he not evaded the tackles

I watched it live (with a Wigan fan), it genuinely is one of the most astonishing plays in any sport I have ever seen, moreso when you saw it live because of the time element and kicking across your own 25 I have never seen before or after. It was a big game as well, a winner takes all game. One mistake or a tackle and Bradford are in the final. I think it finished Bradford off as a team and was the making of modern Saints.
Could not happen in Union and would be celebrated like that Barbarians try every week if it happened in that game.
Funny thing is we see excitement like that (although not quite that standard) all the time in League, yesterday in the Wigan/Hull KR game, Saturday's Leigh/Saints game, the WC championship, just seen Manly lose a 30-0 lead and survive with the last play.

RL, at it's strongest, is the best game in the world. Only when you get the likes of the Liverpool/Barca game is it surpassed (albeit Liverpool are better than most at making football entertaining, that's a reason I love Liverpool and RL)

[JP!]

Wide to West was certainly one bullet in the Bulls.

This may have been the last (from my side, Wigan)...

https://youtu.be/e6SKDwwJpIQ

[Statto Red]

They ripped off the 'Cougarmania' thing that Keighley had developed, and would give shitloads of tickets a game away to try to get support through the turnstyle, along with ultra-cheap season tickets. They didn't so much have a rich benefactor (Caisley wasn't particularly wealthy), and were living on tick a lot. They made a huge error trying to nab Iestyn Harris from Leeds, who sued and won. Caisley left soon after. When they cut back on the freebies, crowds dwindled. They tried to get it all back but the bubble was burst.

I used to dislike them immensely. We'd been in the shadow of a mouldy pie for years (when I was growing up, which made it doubly painful) and, just as we'd seen them off and ourselves rose to prominence in 1996, along come the Bradford fucking Bulls to piss on our moment in the sun. As well, Saints were the cavalier entertainers, full of pace and flair and playing the game how it *should* be played, whilst Bratfud were the neanderthalic brutes depending on pounding the opposition into submission.

WRT Vainakolo, when we had Darren Albert opposite on the wing, Albert was half the size but Vainakolo never got the better of him, with albert dumping him on his arse several times.

That's true, used to dislike Bradford at the time too, Bradford were also known as the Dulls too, as their tactics were 5 drives & a kick, the pitch at Odsal has on a slope in the corners [may still do] they took advantage of that with the tactics, with often Vianakolo running in to ground the ball for a try.

 I do remember Vianakolo, a Tongan who played international RL for New Zealand, but went to union [Gloucester for 5 years, then La Rochelle for a season] wafter he went to union, he qualified for England RU berceuse of residency rules

Anyone remember Kevin Penny, former basketball player who Warrington signed & played on the wing, had loads of pace & great going forward with ball in hand, but his defending was dreadful & often dropped the ball if it was kicked to him, & didn't like being turned around so the ball was often kicked behind him, Saints were merciless in taking advantage from his dreadful defending, when Saints played Warrington

[Crosby Nick]

Bradford had a second, almost equally as big winger on the other side too didn’t they? Sure his name began with a V too but have gone a bit blank.

[Statto Red]

Bradford had a second, almost equally as big winger on the other side too didn’t they? Sure his name began with a V too but have gone a bit blank.

Has a quick look & Tevita Vaikona.

[Crosby Nick]

Has a quick look & Tevita Vaikona.

That’s him! Another Tongan I think.

[Statto Red]

Speaking of Bradford, remember Paul Anderson, he was a prop played for Bradford between 97 & 05, finished his career off at St Helens, he took his one & only conversion of his career for Saints in one of the last matches of his career & he nailed it like a seasoned kicker.

[Statto Red]

That’s him! Another Tongan I think.

Yep he is Tongan, who did play international RL for Tonga.

[Nobby Reserve]

Speaking of Bradford, remember Paul Anderson, he was a prop played for Bradford between 97 & 05, finished his career off at St Helens, he took his one & only conversion of his career for Saints in one of the last matches of his career & he nailed it like a seasoned kicker.

I remember groaning when we signed him, thinking "why would we want some fat, washed-up trundler cast-off from Bradford?"

Only here for 2 seasons and wow! He was immense, almost to Kevin Ward levels. His final season was the amazing and grand-slamming 2006.


(he should have had another GF winner's ring in 2005, but that cheapshot thug Newton went on a 'injure as many Saints players as I can' spree when we played Wigan in the penultimate league game, who were well out of the play-off picture already)

[Statto Red]

I remember groaning when we signed him, thinking "why would we want some fat, washed-up trundler cast-off from Bradford?"

Only here for 2 seasons and wow! He was immense, almost to Kevin Ward levels. His final season was the amazing and grand-slamming 2006.


(he should have had another GF winner's ring in 2005, but that cheapshot thug Newton went on a 'injure as many Saints players as I can' spree when we played Wigan in the penultimate league game, who were well out of the play-off picture already)

I remember that match, Sean Long was one of Newton's victims, & missed the rest of the season, the coward of a ref never sent Newton off either Saints lost key players for the playoffs including Long & season was done, loathed Newton ever since that match.

That match being late in the season, Saints were guaranteed of first [certainly a top 2 finish] so never understood why Saints went with a full first team squad for that match even though it was Wigan.

2005 season was a weird season for Saints, Ian Millward was controversially sacked as Saints head coach early on [largely due to stuff what went on behind the scenes rather than on the pitch results/performances], Saints had a miracle comeback at Warrington from losing 16-4 with 8 minutes left, to win just as the final hooter sounded, battered Wigan 75-0  in the challenge cup [a week after Wigan got battered 70-0 at Leeds ] ended coming up short, Saints lost to Hull FC in the semis, & lost both matches in the playoffs largely due to missing key players after Newton's cheap shots.

[Black Bull Nova]

(he should have had another GF winner's ring in 2005, but that cheapshot thug Newton went on a 'injure as many Saints players as I can' spree when we played Wigan in the penultimate league game, who were well out of the play-off picture already)

Ah, Terry Newton, he killed himself at home 5 years later

[Nobby Reserve]

Paasi - ACL, MCL and ankle

Walmsley - MCL (already had surgery)

Both out for season. Paasi's career may be over.

Both done by extremely dangerous 'tackles' by the same player (plus Knowles and LMS)

Saints sent medical reports to the Disciplinary on all four, which the Disciplinary ignored and issued a 'no case to answer' after the MRP flagged three of the injuries as potential foul play (note the difference to the Knowles/Cooper tackle, which really was a regulation tackle with no foul play)

Wellens has gone ballistic in a presser today. No doubt he'll also get a fine now.


Think we can safely call our season over. We have 4/5 players who could do a job at prop, but none are the impact metre-munchers like Big Al and Iggy.

[Nobby Reserve]

I remember that match, Sean Long was one of Newton's victims, & missed the rest of the season, the coward of a ref never sent Newton off either Saints lost key players for the playoffs including Long & season was done, loathed Newton ever since that match.

That match being late in the season, Saints were guaranteed of first [certainly a top 2 finish] so never understood why Saints went with a full first team squad for that match even though it was Wigan.

2005 season was a weird season for Saints, Ian Millward was controversially sacked as Saints head coach early on [largely due to stuff what went on behind the scenes rather than on the pitch results/performances], Saints had a miracle comeback at Warrington from losing 16-4 with 8 minutes left, to win just as the final hooter sounded, battered Wigan 75-0  in the challenge cup [a week after Wigan got battered 70-0 at Leeds ] ended coming up short, Saints lost to Hull FC in the semis, & lost both matches in the playoffs largely due to missing key players after Newton's cheap shots.

Despised Newton even before that game - he was a coward on the pitch who would constantly be 2nd/3rd man into a tackle, often with a snide dig. Rarely took the ball in, especially after he'd been throwing a cheapshot, when he'd go missing. In some of the Derbies, you'd see a few of the Saints players trying to line him up but he'd always run scared.

that 2005 game, though. It was the most cowardly attack on Long. Long was tackled and falling, his head unprotected, when Newton scoped him and swung a haymaker into his face. Smashed his eye socket and cheekbone, doing irreparable nerve damage - Long still can't close that eye and looks like one half of his face is in fright. He should have sued Newton, before the sad twat topped himself.

[Statto Red]

Paasi - ACL, MCL and ankle

Walmsley - MCL (already had surgery)

Both out for season. Paasi's career may be over.

Both done by extremely dangerous 'tackles' by the same player (plus Knowles and LMS)

Saints sent medical reports to the Disciplinary on all four, which the Disciplinary ignored and issued a 'no case to answer' after the MRP flagged three of the injuries as potential foul play (note the difference to the Knowles/Cooper tackle, which really was a regulation tackle with no foul play)

Wellens has gone ballistic in a presser today. No doubt he'll also get a fine now.


Think we can safely call our season over. We have 4/5 players who could do a job at prop, but none are the impact metre-munchers like Big Al and Iggy.

I'm not surprised Wellens has gone ballistic at the RFL, the RFL disciplinary is a joke & completely inconsistent & has been for years. 

[Black Bull Nova]

Was that the injury Walmsley played on with?

[liversaint]

That was a great night.
[/quote

We all have our crosses to bear 

My Step Dad is from Southport and has been watching Wigan since the 1950's, he introduced me and our kid to RL in 1985, seen some great games following Wigan down the years, Manly still stands out even now.

Another one who went that night. Astonishing game, massive crowd and a sending off. Even as a saints fan it was a brilliant achievement, made special for the family by my dads cousin who played for the Pies.

Some of the collisions and punch ups that night would get 20 match bans nowadays 😁

[liversaint]

Paasi - ACL, MCL and ankle

Walmsley - MCL (already had surgery)

Both out for season. Paasi's career may be over.

Both done by extremely dangerous 'tackles' by the same player (plus Knowles and LMS)

Saints sent medical reports to the Disciplinary on all four, which the Disciplinary ignored and issued a 'no case to answer' after the MRP flagged three of the injuries as potential foul play (note the difference to the Knowles/Cooper tackle, which really was a regulation tackle with no foul play)

Wellens has gone ballistic in a presser today. No doubt he'll also get a fine now.


Think we can safely call our season over. We have 4/5 players who could do a job at prop, but none are the impact metre-munchers like Big Al and Iggy.

Wellens has gone in the presser with full backing of McManus. I’m told from a good source that they have a dossier of around 17 incidents which have been dealt with differently to same types to other clubs and are fighting behind the scenes for explanations.

[Black Bull Nova]

Because you can avoid the Australian scores easily I can fill midweek catching up on their games
What about this one,

New Zealand Warriors v Canberra Raiders
What a game (15 minute highlights)

https://www.nrl.com/watch/matches/telstra-premiership/2023/round-21/warriors-v-raiders/

[Statto Red]

Wellens has gone in the presser with full backing of McManus. I’m told from a good source that they have a dossier of around 17 incidents which have been dealt with differently to same types to other clubs and are fighting behind the scenes for explanations.

That's interesting, Saints very rarely go public with such venom over officiating & disciplinary issues, & tend to keep these issues behind the scenes, Saints really have been pissed off the last couple of years with inconsistent officiating & disciplinary [& seem to be targeted more than other clubs] that it's come to a head now.

 

[Nobby Reserve]

Wellens has gone in the presser with full backing of McManus. I’m told from a good source that they have a dossier of around 17 incidents which have been dealt with differently to same types to other clubs and are fighting behind the scenes for explanations.

That's interesting, Saints very rarely go public with such venom over officiating & disciplinary issues, & tend to keep these issues behind the scenes, Saints really have been pissed off the last couple of years with inconsistent officiating & disciplinary [& seem to be targeted more than other clubs] that it's come to a head now.

Good to know. We've always tried to play strictly by the book. I get the feeling that, even though we're the most successful club in the SL era,  the RFL view us as kind of upstarts, with Wigan and Leeds being the favoured clubs (along with Warrington for the money Moran pumps in)

[Red Cactii]

Because you can avoid the Australian scores easily I can fill midweek catching up on their games
What about this one,

New Zealand Warriors v Canberra Raiders
What a game (15 minute highlights)

https://www.nrl.com/watch/matches/telstra-premiership/2023/round-21/warriors-v-raiders/

Craziest part is the NSW Cup (tier below NRL) also ended with the same scoreline beforehand.

[Statto Red]

Good to know. We've always tried to play strictly by the book. I get the feeling that, even though we're the most successful club in the SL era,  the RFL view us as kind of upstarts, with Wigan and Leeds being the favoured clubs (along with Warrington for the money Moran pumps in)

Leeds & Wigan definitely get preferential treatment when it comes to disciplinary.

RFL disciplinary has long been a joke, quite often players found guilty get treated differently for the same offence, & who are not multiple offenders either, with no consistency in punishments handed out.

 Because of the success Saints are having, Saints feel like they're being treated more severely than players from other clubs committing the same offences.

[Black Bull Nova]

Leeds & Wigan definitely get preferential treatment when it comes to disciplinary.

RFL disciplinary has long been a joke, quite often players found guilty get treated differently for the same offence, & who are not multiple offenders either, with no consistency in punishments handed out.

 Because of the success Saints are having, Saints feel like they're being treated more severely than players from other clubs committing the same offences.

It looks like a fairly straightforward case of inconsistency, I am sure the club will be upset, partly because of the numbers of players involved and the seriousness of the injuries, especially Paasi. As you say, at this point of the season, it effectively makes Saints underdogs for the SL, all because of one players actions.

[Nobby Reserve]

Leeds & Wigan definitely get preferential treatment when it comes to disciplinary.

RFL disciplinary has long been a joke, quite often players found guilty get treated differently for the same offence, & who are not multiple offenders either, with no consistency in punishments handed out.

 Because of the success Saints are having, Saints feel like they're being treated more severely than players from other clubs committing the same offences.

I do think there's a 'Saints winning every year is bad' undercurrent running through the RFL, and they're acting on that. The biggest concern is that our players are gatting physically hammered without punishment.

How many headshots has Ritson had this year, the majority of which haven't even resulted in a penalty?

How many times has Lomax been clattered late when passing/kicking - and, where our guys get pinged by the disciplinary for it every sodding time, it's not even got a penalty, let alone a ban for the player. Remember that incident where he got a green card (reducing the team to 12 for 2 mins) when the replays showed he'd been illegally clattered?

Welsby got taken out late off the ball by Ipape near their line. Stayed on his haunches. No penalty.

[Statto Red]

Leigh are away at Wigan on Saturday, [it's live on C4], see if Leigh use same when tackling techniques when tackling Wigan players, & watch Leigh get hammered with penalties for it when nothing was done last weekend. .

[Yorkykopite]

I will have to admit that the Wigan team from the late 80s/early 90s is the best ever, Saints have been great in the last decade but Hanley, Offiah, Botica, Edwards, Gregory, Radlinski, Robinson, Farrell, Betts, Lydon, Paul, Connolly (grrr), Bell, Hampson etc. will probably never be surpassed. Bastards.

You forgot an old school mate of mine. Henderson Gill.

Could have been a good footballer too but chose Rugby League.

[Statto Red]

Fuckin hell Warrington, humiliated 42-6 at Wakefield, won the first 8 matches & won only 3 matches since, in danger of missing the playoffs now.

Daryl Powell has been sacked as Warrington head coach too.