Topic: Not quite so 'Super' League

[Coolie High]

Yes and No....some teams are barely rooted and seem to move very easily.  Certain teams, Green Bay Packers for example, are very English in their connection to the community.  Owners regularly want a new stadium with at least a partial investment with tax dollars.  When voters say No it's easy to find a city that wants a team and is willing to build a stadium to get one. 

As a yank I hate to see all this for your game.  One of my favorite aspects of European football is how unique it felt when I started following.  Visiting Anfield was nothing like an American sporting event and it felt special. 

It's brutal and I'm sorry. 

My favorite quote lately;
"The answer to all your questions is: Money."  TV exec Don Ohlmeyer

Bingo.

[plura]

We have evidence of FSG's 'ability to backtrack'. I wouldn't think it is out of the realm of possibilities. It is still the best possible outcome right now, so let's see what happens when further shit comes their way.

[Butcher Knife Roberto]

Well I'm looking forward to reading about the court battles considerably more than the footy, it's got the strong whiff of a load of overhyped shite all over it. The prospect of only ever playing against those other teams for the foreseeable future is dull as shit. But hey, I'm just a Legacy Fan, what do I know having supported my club for over 40 years? I won't be forking out for more subscriptions or paying premium prices to see what will inevitably turn out to be overpriced dross. But then they aren't banking on guys like me being part of it; it's the money from New Fans they want. Next thing we'll be the fucking Dubai Reds or some other shite, playing matches in all 4 corners of the world to attract new fans, and of course paying subscribers who will need space by their seats for a bag of merchandise from the club shop. Nah, sorry, give me a cold away in Middlesbrough in the cup over yet another game against Real Madrid served with canapés and surrounded by rich wankers on business events. This is just wrong on every level, and it'll be the New Fans who will be making small group of rich men even richer through extortionate ticket prices and an endless stream of garbage merchandise, all sponsored by *insert generic brand here*.

Look, we all know the game needs reforming, but to chuck the toys out and say fuck you to not only every other club in the league structure but also the history of the tournaments we hold dear to us as fans is just too far. UEFA is definitely far from perfect, but I'll have ol' big ears over whatever nonsense Perez et al have between theirs. The sheer elation of winning number six only made me dream of winning number seven and more. But with this piece of stupidity, the club can kiss that, and our heritage, goodbye. So I'll be doing the same in return. Cheers for 40-odd years of fun Old LFC, it's been a blast. I'll be having nothing to do with the New LFC.

[kkjellquist]

The experience, the sport itself, will be much worse. Football has to be competitive to be exciting, otherwise it's just preseason boredom. ESL will many more games meaningless.

This....one of the worst aspects of US sports is the maddeningly long and meaningless regular seasons.  I am a fan of American football, but I rarely watch until the last couple weeks of the regular season and playoffs.  NBA & NHL regular seasons are almost completely pointless.

[killer-heels]

We have evidence of FSG's 'ability to backtrack'. I wouldn't think it is out of the realm of possibilities. It is still the best possible outcome right now, so let's see what happens when further shit comes their way.

It is the best outcome. They will forever be known as utter c*nts but at least they may not go through with it.

[jepovic]

That ship has already sailed with VAR.

VAR is shit for similar reasons. It kills the excitement and emotions of the goals. It's an amazingly stupid way of ruining a product, like commercial breaks in a movie.
There's still lots of room to make football worse though. More pointless games with that awful preseason vibe.

[Gray Hamster]

That'd be proper piss-your-pants hilarious.

Imagine the Blue Loon 'fewm'

And PSG would always have the biggest of big, fuck-off asterisk next to their win.

I’d be absolutely dumbfounded if this happens.....It just isn’t going to happen.

[RedForeverTT]

What we will have in reality over the next few years is just another NBA/ABA scenario, with the clubs split in the ESL and the UCL. In the end, the ESL will probably consume the remaining top clubs from the UCL, and a single European Super League will be created, probably without participation in the domestic leagues. I respect anyone's opinion, but if I have learned something during my life, it is that you can't stop progress, no matter how hard you fight against it. And to be honest, we have all contributed to this, from the very first moment when we started buying expensive PL and CL tickets, SkySport subscribtions, expensive club kits and other merchandise, and turned ourselves into football consumers. The baby is born (even though it looks very ugly), and we can't put it back because we don't like it ...

That’s quite a realistic scenario. Perhaps more closely resembling NBA and college Basketball that also has a strong following, lots of money but more local and acts as feeder to NBA.

[killer-heels]

This....one of the worst aspects of US sports is the maddeningly long and meaningless regular seasons.  I am a fan of American football, but I rarely watch until the last couple weeks of the regular season and playoffs.  NBA & NHL regular seasons are almost completely pointless.

I don’t really understand this argument. Wasn’t the first division all about just one team getting into the premier competition?

[WhereAngelsPlay]

It’s funny because this poster actually kinda agrees with the super league.

Who,me ?

[Fromola]

I wounder if this will lead to renewed calls for Rangers and Celtic to request a place in the PL especially if the 6 clubs get thrown out or get allowed into this new format?

Is there no talk of Rangers or Celtic invited to ESL? They've got absolutely massive fanbases and profiles. Ajax as well, Marseille, Valencia, Benfica, Sevilla. I know Porto have turned it down.

[Coolie High]

Who,me ?

Nah the poster you quoted.

[PIPA23]

I agree with this. I greatly enjoy your input in this thread. An American-style league with salary cap and trading would be interesting, if they are going through with this super league anyway. Best-of-5 or seven playoff games could create some new rivalries as well.

I prefer the current format, but it looks like we’re at the point of no return here.

Part of why the teams want this super league... like AC Milan and Madrid is that the PL is getting all the attention away because of its quality...

part of why the PL teams including us want this is unclear to me... no other thing than money is why they want this...

the PL is getting better and more competitive in a way with teams like West Ham, Leicester in the mix and former top teams like Arsenal fighting in mid-table currently...

Do they want a salary cap and competitiveness in the super league? don't be stupid, they have competitiveness right now in the PL and still, they can not understand that you have to EARN your position...

the only thing to improve football is to have a salary cap within the domestic leagues so the game is fair to all... but no relegation and European teams being more important rivals than domestic teams is the stupidity of the highest order.

The main reason these clubs are where they are are the FANS... all football is about tradition, support, helping the community and taking the best talents from a young age, and making them fight to be a part of their home team...

I'm sick of this idea of super league. it is disrespectful to the fans, the traditions, the game...the opponents... this is not the traditions that pushed us and rest of the clubs to where they are now. it is the opposite of that.

[CHOPPER]

Has the RAWK hierarchy reached out to the sister fingering sweaty scruff manc lot, yet?

[jillcwhomever]

It’s better for all the clubs , this is unanimously condemned from the top to the bottom. And West Ham are above is right at this moment who were in relegation zone last year, Leeds just got promoted and are a win today away from being above us also.

In the 80’s before the Premier League how many teams won the league? Us Arsenal Everton.

Tell that to my brother who is a Southampton fan. I am pretty sure he would say they have no chance from the start. As for the 80's the league tables for the most part were competitive and there were both big and smaller teams in the mix, the likes of Ipswhich, Nottingham Forest, QPR, all finished high up in the table. Now we have gaps of crazy numbers between the elite and everyone else. It's really not the same.

[kkjellquist]

I don’t really understand this argument. Wasn’t the first division all about just one team getting into the premier competition?

I'm saying our regular seasons are pointless most of the time because nothing is really on the line until the playoffs.  The problem in the NBA and NHL is so many teams make the playoffs it ends up being a second season.  The ESL could be like that if the same teams play each other endlessly and then have some meaningful games for a trophy at the end. 

[PeterTheRed ...]

Pretty clear what some are trying to do on here but if you call them out on it they deny they support this

I think if they support it then should just say so... Rather than having best of both worlds where they can deny they're in favour of this while trying to make the case for it, getting to call everyone hypocrites and such

Well, I am probably the only one who has openly supported the idea of the Super League at these boards for years. Not because it is perfect, but because it is better than the shit the corrupt and incompetent UEFA and PL are serving us.

If I am to give my money, I'd rather give it to the club directly, than to give it to some corrupt bureaucrats at UEFA and the PL, or to SkySports.

The old game of football died with the old Division One and the old European Cup. The new game of football is a monster, but it is my choice to support the monster that fucks up the PL and UEFA, the organisations that burried the Division One and the European Cup.

I won't stop supporting LFC because we will be competing in the ESL. Just like I didn't stop supporting us when we sold our soul to the devil, and joined the PL and the CL.

Tonight, we have a game that is very important for our fight to win the top 4 trophy. Fuck me, that is as cringe as the ESL, if not more. And I will still watch it, and support us as I always do ...

[CHOPPER]

Tell that to my brother who is a Southampton fan. I am pretty sure he would say they have no chance from the start. As for the 80's the league tables for the most part were competitive and there were both big and smaller teams in the mix, the likes of Ipswhich, Nottingham Forest, QPR, all finished high up in the table. Now we have gaps of crazy numbers between the elite and everyone else. It's really not the same.

Did you buy him to be your brother?

[Eeyore]

I feel similarly. There's an alternative reality where we aren't involved in this and Al 666, Spirit of Shankly, Spion Kop 1906 etc. are lambasting FSG for being short-sighted and us being left behind while the other top clubs prosper.

To be honest mate that is absolute bollocks.

[Red Raw]

[scouseman]

is there similar backlash against this new super league from other clubs fans as well  or is it just us?

[Kekule]

'Real Madrid, Manchester City and Chelsea will likely be banned from this season’s Champions League semi-finals, UEFA executive committee member Jesper Moller told broadcaster DR on Monday.

“The clubs must go, and I expect that to happen on Friday. Then we have to find out how to finish (this season’s) Champions League tournament,” said Moller, who is the head of the Danish FA. “There is an extraordinary executive committee meeting on Friday.”'


^ from https://www.theguardian.com/football/live/2021/apr/19/european-super-league-latest-reaction-to-breakaway-football-competition-live?page=with:block-607dae408f08080a7ae65756#block-607dae408f08080a7ae65756

It won’t happen. They’ll eventually let it continue and Manchester City, who were thrown out before the competition started only to be let back in, will have been thrown out a second time only to be let back in again, will probably end up winning it and thus the crowning the most farcical year of football ever.

[Skeeve]

We have evidence of FSG's 'ability to backtrack'. I wouldn't think it is out of the realm of possibilities. It is still the best possible outcome right now, so let's see what happens when further shit comes their way.

While the ESL is clearly a horribly bad attempt at fixing the problem, I'd hope that any u-turn from the breakaway clubs would only come in response to a significant commitment to change from uefa and fifa. they need to change things in a manner that doesn't simply consist of adding yet more games into any already bloated schedule or rebranding games to try and hide their pointlessness, for the long term health of the game there needs to be a lighter schedule for the top players and there also needs to be robust financial controls.

[Gray Hamster]

We have evidence of FSG's 'ability to backtrack'. I wouldn't think it is out of the realm of possibilities. It is still the best possible outcome right now, so let's see what happens when further shit comes their way.

Their intention was always likely to backtrack (my guess after they negotiated you more favourable revenue distribution with UEFA) but honestly, i think they’ve made a huge mistake here. Massive reputational damage.

[CHOPPER]

To be honest mate that is absolute bollocks.

You're now a group?


Can I have a badge please mister?..............We could do T-shirts? 

[Samie]

Florentino Pérez will speak tonight about all questions regarding the European Super League! Is the first time in a while that he’s agreed to give out an interview or answer questions. [@elchiringuitotv]

[WhereAngelsPlay]

is there similar backlash against this new super league from other clubs fans as well  or is it just us?

Pretty universal.

[naYoRHa2b]

After a few hours to reflect I feel torn, conflicted and just general anger. I know this super league isn't the answer. It feels hollow and I see local people where I live seriously upset. I've gradually become disillusioned with football in general for a long time and I've grown to resent the authorities and the money around football even though I'm complicit by doing nothing about it and still wanting my team to be successful and earn the money to buy better players.

I know deep down this isn't right but I also know that if it doesn't go ahead nothing changes and it gradually gets worse anyway. It's like I'd take a quick death over a slow one.

[Armin]

We all have to set our own limits in life, work out what we can and cannot live with, draw our own lines in the sand.  For me, this is one of those moments and the issue is crystal clear with little to no room for confusion. There's no way this can be interpreted or explained away as anything other than what it is. Cynicism, greed, opportunism of the basest kind and an action taken with blatant disregard for the sporting principles on which the game rests. It is a declaration of war on the football pyramid and the principle of competition it embodies. It cannot stand unopposed.

That Liverpool FC have signed their names to it must be regarded as one of the greatest misjudgements in the history of the club. A fatal misreading of the fanbase, a failure to listen and to understand the very thing which gives the club its value. A failure on an institutional level of personnel within the club and its stakeholders to communicate to the owners that this decision doesn't just open up a period of bad press or a temporary disruption to commercial activity, but will be the cause of an endless, damaging civil war where one side will never give in and never concede, because their investment is far greater than any figure on a balance sheet could ever represent.

The only answer to this is to ensure that it fails in its objective to create a cash cow for the parties concerned. Not a penny should go to any club including that supports this folly or broadcaster or commercial partner that enables it.  No discussion online should be possible without the voice of those whose heritage is being taken from them being heard. No potential sponsor should be under any illusion that their involvement will not be portrayed in the most negative form possible. No quarter should be expected or given until this ill conceived venture is dead and buried and an apology extended to the fans whose interests and emotional and financial investment have been ignored.



The separation of Liverpool FC, it's fans, it's history, it's proud heritage, from those that would seek to profit from the destruction of our national sport needs to take place.  At some point they will learn that legal ownership of an entity is meaningless if the bedrock on which it's based has shifted and the unity which those banners at Anfield proudly boast of is shattered.

[Eeyore]

We have evidence of FSG's 'ability to backtrack'. I wouldn't think it is out of the realm of possibilities. It is still the best possible outcome right now, so let's see what happens when further shit comes their way.

Can they backtrack though. According to Hogan we have signed up for the ESL.

[ToneLa]

is there similar backlash against this new super league from other clubs fans as well  or is it just us?

The Blueloon poll was 95% against the idea

Thought most the posts are angry they're in bed with "the cartel" aka us

[CHOPPER]

is there similar backlash against this new super league from other clubs fans as well  or is it just us?

The RAWK hierarchy need to reach out. If they feel that they can't go on.

[Samie]

[Kashinoda]

is there similar backlash against this new super league from other clubs fans as well  or is it just us?

It's probably the most unified fan-bases across the country and Europe have been.

Stephen Fry puts it best.

[Fromola]

While the ESL is clearly a horribly bad attempt at fixing the problem, I'd hope that any u-turn from the breakaway clubs would only come in response to a significant commitment to change from uefa and fifa. they need to change things in a manner that doesn't simply consist of adding yet more games into any already bloated schedule or rebranding games to try and hide their pointlessness, for the long term health of the game there needs to be a lighter schedule for the top players and there also needs to be robust financial controls.

But the ESL is even more games than the expanded CL and these clubs want to stay in their domestic leagues.

We need less games but all the powers that be ever propose are more games and more competitions as the two announcements from UEFA and the ESL in the last 24 hours.

[Butcher Knife Roberto]

Their intention was always likely to backtrack (my guess after they negotiated you more favourable revenue distribution with UEFA) but honestly, i think they’ve made a huge mistake here. Massive reputational damage.

This whole thing will collapse the moment one of the founder clubs shits itself at the prospect of losing millions in TV revenue when they're banned from their domestic league and withdraws. I'll put a fiver on it being LFC.

[oojason]

'Premier League’s ‘Other 14’ ponder response to breakaway threat':-

https://www.theguardian.com/football/2021/apr/19/premier-leagues-other-14-ponder-response-to-breakaway-threat

[alonsoisared]

Some proper out of touch people posting on this thread. I never thought RAWK was this bad. If all of our local fan groups are vehemently against it and you're sat there siding with FSG or worse still using Hillsborough to have a pop at that banner at Anfield (can't believe I actually read that just now) then you have to be questioning where your head is in regard to this club.

[Skeeve]

VAR is shit for similar reasons. It kills the excitement and emotions of the goals. It's an amazingly stupid way of ruining a product, like commercial breaks in a movie.
There's still lots of room to make football worse though. More pointless games with that awful preseason vibe.

What about the emotions of a side missing out on a trophy or getting relegated due to the increasing amount of fuckups by the officials, does that not ruin things then?

The only reason var takes so long to check things is due to them focusing too much on the inches of offsides and not a clear error, they could have easily implemented it to be part of the officiating team, but the pgmol see it as a threat to their incompetent members and are seeking to sabotage it.

[jillcwhomever]

Did you buy him to be your brother?

If only I could take him back and exchange him.  You can't believe the conversations on football I've had with him over the years. Especially after the Mane and Van Dijk transfers.