Topic: Wrestling Thread (AEW, NJPW, WWE, etc) (*)

[tubby]

Full thoughts in the cold light of day:

Starks vs Jericho - Great opener, felt like a Dynamite main event, just really solid throughout and Starks winning clean was exactly what needed to happen.  Time to move on to a new feud.
Jungle Boy vs Christian - This was way better than I thought it would be, really well constructed match, which is a Christian calling card.  Excellent work from both of them but the real star of the show was Christian's evil villain polo neck wrestling gear.
Trios Match - Right result, and just a classic version of that type of Bucks match.  Everyone got some shine, the story they told made sense and there was a bunch of cool shit in there.
Women's Match - Decent, but they've had better.  Tough spot on the card, but it was well produced and I thought Ruby played her part at the end really well.  At least they've finally pulled the trigger on her, even though I would have someone else in that spot.
Texas Death - My girlfriend hid behind me for half of this one, brutal stuff.  Great finish, and Mox is a nutter who needs to take some time off now he's got this one out of his system.  They absolutely delivered on the promise with this.
TNT - A little plodding in parts, but a solid match.  Wasn't really into this but it was another match in a tricky spot and the crowd were spent after the previous one.
Tag Titles - Fun match, nothing amazing, but lots of nice little spots.  The crowd going DEAD silent for the pin at the end might mean that the Gunns aren't champs for long, especially with FTR rocking up.  They've done what they can to get heat and the crowd like to give them abuse, but no one buys them as champs.  It was a smart finish, though, because it calmed the crowd right down, leading into the iron man.
Iron Man - Started slow off the back of the deflating tag finish, but that's what it needed.  The slow build was great and let the crowd take a breath so they were right into it by the end.  Danielson is magic in there and MJF kept up with him and didn't look out of place at all.  His reign needed this kind of win and he looks a million bucks in there, loved that white gear.

They always deliver with the PPVs and this one was right up there.  Just hope they can build on the momentum off the back of it.

One other thing I just realised - all the finishes were younger talent going over the old guard.  Using their vets really well.

[Riquende]

All good observations. My first message to a mate who I assumed was also watching (but wasn't) was about Christian's turtleneck.

One thing I'd add re: the Trios is that I got the sense that the story was Kenny was doing all the hard lifting on the Elite's side, and he seemed to look pretty pissed off after the match. Dunno whether that's seeding a split sometime this year, especially with Cole back shortly. I don't really know what you do with the Elite otherwise if you want to keep them out of the various title pictures.

[tubby]

Yeah Kenny did look really strong in that match, but I wonder if that's just because he's Kenny Omega.  I want to see him in singles anyway so if they do split, I'm down.

[amir87]

Wrestlemania card taking shape. Some good ones in there and some piss breaks.

[damomad]

Do they have 2 matches big enough to main event both nights? Is it going to be Owens and Zayn vs Usos night 1 and Reigns/Rhodes night 2?

[Sheer Magnetism]

Watched a bit of RAW last night while waiting for basketball and it was absolutely shocking, worse than I remember. They interrupted a match at one point to show a vignette for a different match, and the overall standard of the work was dire. Bloodline or no, how can anyone watch that?

[gerrardisgod]

I woke up at a stupid time and flicked it on, just in time to see the ultimate channel changer Nikki Cross coming to the ring. Genuinely dreadful.

[Stockholm Syndrome]

I woke up at a stupid time and flicked it on, just in time to see the ultimate channel changer Nikki Cross coming to the ring. Genuinely dreadful.

Thing is as well, she is actually legitimately good in a different role - throughout her Indy and ICW days she was mainly as like a little person syndrome, shout pub landlord type with significantly inflated ego, and it worked really well. This crazy gimmick is fucking piss

Also you would be shocked to hear Vince was backstage at Raw. And as a result you get Chad Gable called small and Ugly, and Gargano called a comic book geek as an insult.

Over the last few weeks, yeah I am thinking Vince may be creeping back.

Also sounds like the potential buyers have dropped down to Saudi Arabia, with Vince as chairman

[OsirisMVZ]

There was a backstage promo or two on Raw which felt entirely from Vince's mouth, the Lashley one especially.

[Malaysian Kopite]

AEW probably have the most consistent run of good PPVs of any wrestling company ever. Mid booking in the lead up and then they go and knock it out of the park. I'm expecting to be underwhelmed again in the next 3 months or so before they somehow deliver again at DoN.

[Stockholm Syndrome]

Not the strongest Dynamite after the PPV, not bad but not amazing. Very much feels like a restart of new programs going forward.

I do think AEW would benefit from more big shows, even if all of them are not PPV. Just allows a greater rotation of feuds a bit quicker.

I am guessing with how things are setting up that there will be Blood & Guts, and likely involving the BCC and Dark Order (and maybe Hangman) which should be good but frankly I would want that feud to end, the Texas Death match was perfect ending. Perhaps if Dark Order thanks but ask Hangman not to be involved  because he has other things to move on to, and get a substitute maybe.

[Samie]

WWE in talks with Betting regulators in the U.S to allow betting on matches. How is that going to work when it is scripted? 

[Stockholm Syndrome]

WWE in talks with Betting regulators in the U.S to allow betting on matches. How is that going to work when it is scripted? 

To be fair, you can bet on the matches already, just not in the US (officially)

But yeah it does seem like the old WWE hotline where you would ring and pay $1 a minute to vote if Shawn Michaels should be fired or defend the IC Title against Marty Jannetty as if it wasn't scripted   

It is slightly concerning that WWE may be aware of the bets and thus swing results one way or the other. Although by that token you could also use it as a means of fan power - bully them into pushing someone by lots of people betting on the opponent instead

[paulrazor]

Yeah I have seen betting especially on royal rumble and wrestlemania

I remember taker was 1/6 the night he lost the streak

To be fair, you can bet on the matches already, just not in the US (officially)

But yeah it does seem like the old WWE hotline where you would ring and pay $1 a minute to vote if Shawn Michaels should be fired or defend the IC Title against Marty Jannetty as if it wasn't scripted   

It is slightly concerning that WWE may be aware of the bets and thus swing results one way or the other. Although by that token you could also use it as a means of fan power - bully them into pushing someone by lots of people betting on the opponent instead

there used to be a ppv where fans voted for matches etc

cyber sunday I think

obviously scripted too

[damomad]

Yeah I have seen betting especially on royal rumble and wrestlemania

I remember taker was 1/6 the night he lost the streak
 there used to be a ppv where fans voted for matches etc

cyber sunday I think

obviously scripted too

It was originally known as Taboo Tuesday. Things you wouldn't get away with these days:

Poll
Outfit for the Fulfill Your Fantasy Diva Battle Royal

Results
School girl (53.10%)
French maid (30.03%)
Nurse outfit (16.87%)

[tubby]

Get QT off my screen FFS.

Wasn't that good a Dynamite, some decent stuff but most of it was build towards the Canadian episode.

[John_P]

With Taboo Tuesday they'd have things like what type of match should they have and the options would be No DQ, No Holds Barred, or Tables Match. So the actual match would be the same, just a slightly different finish between each one.

[Riquende]

Get QT off my screen FFS.

Yeah, it's a 'bold' move to say the least! He was always about to be doing something as they've been promoting this 'QTV' for a while, and just last week he randomly announced that the Factory had disbanded.

But come on, was there no-one better they could find for a Hobbs support slot? No-one that deserves more TV time than they've been getting? They had to go for QT, who might be a great trainer/producer, but is objectively one of the least popular on-screen talents across his entire AEW run?

[ScouserAtHeart]

The only thing I remember about Taboo Tuesday is the weird intense way Edge would proounce it

[tubby]

Yeah, it's a 'bold' move to say the least! He was always about to be doing something as they've been promoting this 'QTV' for a while, and just last week he randomly announced that the Factory had disbanded.

But come on, was there no-one better they could find for a Hobbs support slot? No-one that deserves more TV time than they've been getting? They had to go for QT, who might be a great trainer/producer, but is objectively one of the least popular on-screen talents across his entire AEW run?

I have no idea what QTV is.  I get the idea of putting Hobbs with someone heelish, because he was starting to get some real traction as a cool heel who gets cheered and it looks like they don't want to go in that direction, but surely, SURELY there's better people available than QT, it's such a bizarre move.  Would've made sense back in the Daily's Place days, but the landscape of AEW has changed so much over the past couple of years and he's just not anywhere near the level needed and should stick to Dark.

[Riquende]

I have no idea what QTV is.

Nobody did, there have been some logos etc shown on Dark for about a month, and people assumed it was related to him given the name.

Looks like some sort of parody of 'ITK' wrestling newsletters/podcasts?

I think it currently only exists as a Twitter account but they've indicated on there it'll be part of Dynamite next week.

https://twitter.com/QualityTVAEW

[tubby]

Oh god this is going to be pure wrestlecrap, I can smell it already.

[Barefoot Doctor]

Gunther/Sheamus/Drew should be brilliant at Mania.

[tubby]

The Bellas have removed all the WWE stuff from their social media and are now going by their real names.  I am praying... PRAYING that they don't end up in AEW.  I know they have a bunch of followers and would draw eyes but pls no.

[gazzalfc]

Depends on if they want Danielson to sign a new contract in future.

I think the Bellas/Garcias have their own plan and I don't think it involves wrestling

[tubby]

Not sure Danielson re-signing is dependent on his missus getting a job there.  I think he'll likely see this current contract out and then either go back to WWE as a trainer/producer or maybe do similar at AEW.

[El Lobo]

The Bellas have removed all the WWE stuff from their social media and are now going by their real names.

Is there a Tony Khan version of this?

[gazzalfc]

Not sure Danielson re-signing is dependent on his missus getting a job there.  I think he'll likely see this current contract out and then either go back to WWE as a trainer/producer or maybe do similar at AEW.

I'm not saying it's dependant on having her as an on-screen wrestling show talent. But if having her signed to AEW helps them keep a family dynamic on the road, open doors to their own shows etc.

[Stockholm Syndrome]

I don't particularly blame the Bella's honestly. Learning that John Laurentiis cheated on their mother with interns, whilst she had cancer (a brain tumor), and that he supposedly shared them with Vince and it was all and open secret of sleaze in the company - yeah I maybe wouldn't want to be a part of that company anymore either.

I do hope they have their own thing and don't join AEW, but they appear to be very well liked - beyond Bryan there is Saraya, Renee who are friends, Britt absolutely LOVES them as well and she does a hell of a lot for getting female talent signed and on the show (big advocate for Jamie, Toni,been trying to get feelers out for Mercedes Moné, maybe would so something for the Bella's too - hopefully not but who knows)

[damomad]

Having never watched a single episode of Total Divas, are the Bellas any great loss to WWE? Have they even been active on the roster in the past few years? Nothing against them but I don't see it as a Sasha level loss.

[Stockholm Syndrome]

Having never watched a single episode of Total Divas, are the Bellas any great loss to WWE? Have they even been active on the roster in the past few years? Nothing against them but I don't see it as a Sasha level loss.

It's not a massive loss no. They are always good for a pop or a one off match (well not good but they are always somehow credible for such).

They do bring with them a lot of fans, but they are a relic of a bygone era.

I don't want them in AEW I don't think they fit the scenery but they would bring fans. If they turned up in let's say Impact, they would be by far the biggest act they got in terms of popularity.

They aren't good but they are legitimate stars (from the past mind) with a lot of fans

[OsirisMVZ]

The Bellas have removed all the WWE stuff from their social media and are now going by their real names.

It's because they've got some upcoming show on Amazon which conflicts with the WWE copyrights for the reality shows they did on other networks.

[Riquende]

Really enjoyed that Dynamite, some great callbacks for longer-term viewers at the top and tail. Aubrey Edwards certainly winning the "Rick Knox award for not remotely enforcing the legal men in a multi-man match involving The Elite" this week.

The Outcasts storyline is better having got past the "Ruby's loyalty" bit, but still not clicking. It's the three Heels, against a whole slew of Faces in including the world champion & 2 former world champions. The dynamic is off, but thanks to the rationale behind the faction they can't just throw numbers in to support the Heels.

[Stockholm Syndrome]

Really good Dynamite I felt, really set up some good feuds.

I like the 4 pillars angle for a feud, I think that really works. I didn't like too much the insider baseball jabs at MJF getting everything and burying Rampage - don't make the company the heel, but I LOVED Darby's version of it which was "I love this company, I hate the crybabies in the back, including you MJF"

Elite helping out Hangman is awesome again, I really love it. I would say this maybe leads to Blood and Guts with a tag team joining BCC and Adam Cole or Bryan Danielson or Eddie Kingston or Konosuke Takeshita joining Elite/Hangman, can then branch off into different feuds going into DoN.

I definitely think it should be one of the Adams beating MJF and the more I look the more I think it should be Adam Page. They really need to solidify this guy as THE face of the company, the go to guy for a hero - like your Cena or your Takahashi or your Sting - the guy you know can always be a hero, and always be a hero champ or challenger  if needs be.

[Wolverine]

Adam page, the guy sucks can't cut a promo to save his life his first title run was dreadful felt like a mid-carder was champion the guy has no charisma, he looks like he is going to cry every time he speaks  , honestly just keep the belt on MJF the company is full of dorks who belong in NJPW.

Ricky starks is the one he has the charisma and mic skills to have a good run and the feud with MJF will be epic.

Also fuck off the win loss record it's not UFC ffs who gives a shit about win and losses we know its fake, it's always been about the story and characters , the actual wrestling is the least important part of it.

Tony Khan just runs this company like a die hard mark for nerds they really need to think about the casuals more.

[Stockholm Syndrome]

Adam page, the guy sucks can't cut a promo to save his life his first title run was dreadful felt like a mid-carder was champion the guy has no charisma, he looks like he is going to cry every time he speaks  , honestly just keep the belt on MJF the company is full of dorks who belong in NJPW.

Ricky starks is the one he has the charisma and mic skills to have a good run and the feud with MJF will be epic.

Also fuck off the win loss record it's not UFC ffs who gives a shit about win and losses we know its fake, it's always been about the story and characters , the actual wrestling is the least important part of it.

Tony Khan just runs this company like a die hard mark for nerds they really need to think about the casuals more.

I would have to disagree that the wrestling is the least important part of it, but you will be happy to know the Rankings have been gone for like 6 to 8 months now so yeah, quite current criticism that 

I do agree on Starks, and they did have a brilliant little mini feud. He is absolutely championship material, maybe the next go around after MJF

[Wolverine]

Hahah fair enough and maybe I was Harsh on Adam page but his first run was so forgettable I don't think he has the IT factor really.

I am sure I saw the win loss record still come up they do need to get rid of that!

Yes agreeed Starks vs MJF would be great for AEW it could actually gain some mainstream attraction would be some epic promo clips trending which does more than any match could.

That 1st promo battle they had was a great tease!

I look at like this, great story and characters and you only need the actual match to be serviceable , look back to Austin and Undertaker Feud all kinds of crazy shit and most the matches were just solid nothing mind blowing but nobody cared, it's still one of the greatest feuds in WWE.

I just think modern wrestling is all in ring action, the writing is so shit and half arsed if they actually tried it could be so much better and engaging.

 I never get the feeling of I can't wait to tune in next week or leaving the show on a cliff hanger anymore, it's just filler match after match.

[Riquende]

The win/loss records are still tracked and appears in the chyron (& on the roster pages), it's the weekly Top 5 that was downplayed towards the end of last year and then apparently abandoned entirely.

I think part of Page's problem was being the publicly-annointed champion-in-waiting since even before Omega won the belt, it was just a queston of timing. So everyone knew the reign was coming, and it was going to have a lot to live up to. Then he wasn't really champion for that long (I think he had 2 feuds?) before it went to Punk. Given what happened to the title picture since, it does feel like it was a 'blink and you missed it' reign, but that's not on Page.

[Stockholm Syndrome]

The win/loss records are still tracked and appears in the chyron (& on the roster pages), it's the weekly Top 5 that was downplayed towards the end of last year and then apparently abandoned entirely.

I think part of Page's problem was being the publicly-annointed champion-in-waiting since even before Omega won the belt, it was just a queston of timing. So everyone knew the reign was coming, and it was going to have a lot to live up to. Then he wasn't really champion for that long (I think he had 2 feuds?) before it went to Punk. Given what happened to the title picture since, it does feel like it was a 'blink and you missed it' reign, but that's not on Page.

Thing is he had a relatively long reign, it is just the nature of the PPV's. He had the belt for 7 months, but that was only 1 PPV. He feuded with Bryan, Archer, Adam Cole, then dropped to Punk. And to be fair, the feuds and matches were fucking awesome.

I do think they could do with more big shows, PPV or not, just ending events. Maybe not 1 every 3 weeks like WWE but also not one every 3 months like AEW at the moment. They added Forbidden Door as a show (coming again June 25th btw, I am somewhat considering going actually because Toronto is cool as a holiday anyway) but maybe a few more for April, maybe push Grand Slam a bit later, have one in January or February, just break up the long cycles a bit. I also think Winter is Coming is a good one, but it needs to be on a bit later after Revolution I feel to be truly effective for a feud ender

I think with rounding off this Moxley feud and getting back with the Elite, he is due a title win again at All Out. Either him, or Adam Cole are the best current candidates I would say in terms of pure babyfaces, and a pure babyfaces is needed to beat the pure heel that is MJF.

[Stockholm Syndrome]

Hahah fair enough and maybe I was Harsh on Adam page but his first run was so forgettable I don't think he has the IT factor really.

I am sure I saw the win loss record still come up they do need to get rid of that!

Yes agreeed Starks vs MJF would be great for AEW it could actually gain some mainstream attraction would be some epic promo clips trending which does more than any match could.

That 1st promo battle they had was a great tease!

I look at like this, great story and characters and you only need the actual match to be serviceable , look back to Austin and Undertaker Feud all kinds of crazy shit and most the matches were just solid nothing mind blowing but nobody cared, it's still one of the greatest feuds in WWE.

I just think modern wrestling is all in ring action, the writing is so shit and half arsed if they actually tried it could be so much better and engaging.

 I never get the feeling of I can't wait to tune in next week or leaving the show on a cliff hanger anymore, it's just filler match after match.

I would say in terms of Dynamite at least, which they are improving on I think and last night is a show for it, is trying to run an episode through line story. Something that happens early and finishes at the very end. They did it with the BCC vs Dark Order fight, could have done a bit more but they did it.

I do think they can improve upon that