Topic: Wrestling Thread (AEW, NJPW, WWE, etc) (*)

[gerrardisgod]

Ah, so just something personal then, presumably. Nowhere near as bad as an actual segment, still not a nice reflection though.

[ianburns252]

Interesting quotes from Bryan here regarding his choice to go to AEW - https://bleacherreport.com/articles/10012248-report-vince-mcmahon-said-bryan-danielson-could-work-njpws-g1-in-wwe-contract-talks

"I started thinking about things and WWE was so gracious with me as far as the offer that they gave me. They were going to let me go do some other stuff on the outside. But, I hate to say this... Vince (McMahon) and I have a great relationship. I love him, I do. Sometimes he's overprotective of me. And I want to be able to push my limits. That's one of the things that I love about this, is the physicality of what we do out there and being able to push my limits and being able to do that here in a safe manner is one of the things that really drew me here.
"There's just excitement," he continued. "You all see it. You were probably all out there and you felt it. You felt how excited people are about this product and it feels vibrant. And even just watching it through a TV screen in a trailer. I'm sitting there going, 'God this is awesome. I want to be a part of this.' So that was it... I really battled back and forth because there's a lot of people there that I consider family, that actually are legitimately my family, and you know, people that I love there. So it was a really tough decision."

Does sound like WWE were prepared to make all the concessions possible for him and that it mostly came down to them not wanting to see him concussed or worse again whereas he feels he has it in him.

[gazzalfc]

WWE were never going to do a deal with New Japan. That was Vince trying to throw empty promises at him to get him to sign whilst trying to destabilise AEW's deal with New Japan.

The bit about being overprotective is probably more true. There is a bit of the way Kurt Angle left WWE for TNA all those years ago in there. Vince hated what Kurt Angle did to his body whilst wrestling in WWE and did everything he could to stop Angle from wrestling until he had his neck sorted. That meant losing him to TNA. Obviously in hindsight Vince was right as Kurt really struggles with his mobility today.

Just getting back into the ring safely was an incredible achievement for Bryan and medical science in general. WWE needed to keep him safe from future concussions and was not going to get that unless he wrestled the WWE way. Bryan wants to wrestle his way. The two were never going to agree.

[ianburns252]

I mean, if Bryan thought it was steam ahead then either he is complicit and just making Vince look good by saying it or he was naïve and being taken for a mug by Vince - neither of these seem plausible to me

[tubby]

Vince doesn't want anyone dying in the ring on his show, so you can see his caution with Danielson (who probably wants to do a whole bunch of stuff he really shouldn't be doing with his history).

With the New Japan stuff, WWE wanted an exclusive contract with them, which is their standard bullshit approach of trying to own everything.

[Stockholm Syndrome]

To be fair it always seemed like Bryan would be able to do as he pleased, that was the supposed deal. WWE wanted a NJPW deal as well to exclusively send their talent to them. I know COVID fucked up international travel now but imagine NJPW cutting themselves off from all other international talent to get the likes of Jaxson Ryker, Ellias, and Karrion Kross sent over every now and then (and surely on terms where they win)

[Wild Romany Boy]

WWE sucks right now. That is all.

[gazzalfc]

WWE sucks right now. That is all.

Roman/Lesnar/Paul Heyman is great. Everything else is shit.

[Wild Romany Boy]

Roman/Lesnar/Paul Heyman is great. Everything else is shit.

to be honest, even that is pretty tiring in my eyes.

There is some good stuff scattered around - Roman is on a tear and Lashley carries himself like a real champion - but it's all booked so badly that it just sucks.

[RedSandgrounder]

Bryan may end up working a stiffer more dangerous style but I imagine he'll only be wrestling once or twice a month with AEW, with the odd trip to Japan thrown in, he wont be wrestling night in night out on the road, and will be given time to heal up.

[tubby]

Think WWE just looks more over-produced and samey these days because of the way AEW are doing things.  Their shows feel so much more exciting and they've given all that young talent the rub of being alongside the old guard.  Punk coming in and working Darby before moving onto Hobbs is great business and a real carrot for the undercard there.  Same with Danielson going after the Elite, they've positioned Jungle Boy right in the middle of all that.

[tubby]

Big E tweeting about cashing in tonight.  But AEW isn't competition, right, Vince?

[Barefoot Doctor]

Big E tweeting about cashing in tonight.  But AEW isn't competition, right, Vince?

Obvious desperate ratings grab but great moment for Big E.

[amir87]

Was a really good moment but always ruins the excitement of cashing in when it's announced beforehand.

Very deserving for Big E though.

[Barefoot Doctor]

Was a really good moment but always ruins the excitement of cashing in when it's announced beforehand.

Very deserving for Big E though.

It does, yeah. Would have been a huge pop if he hadn't been announced for the show, or at least if they'd kept him off the show until the very end - instead they had him in the opening promo segment.

Ziggler's cash-in remains undefeated in terms of crowd reaction.

[gazzalfc]

Shame it couldn't happen at a big PPV so he could have that moment.

He wont be champion for very long. He'll end up like Kofi. But as long as the 18-49 numbers get a bump then its all good

[bird_lfc]

Dynamite was on at the ambulance station on our meal break last night

I think I caught MJF’s promo on Pillman, which was great he’s a fantastic heat magnet, Black vs Rhodes, again Black looks fantastic and The Elite/Danielson confrontation

Gotta say, the elite stuff is pretty cringe, I can’t stand the young bucks (go away heat) and the majority of them are complete dorks (gallows and Anderson In particular just seem incredibly average to Me)

Omega vs Cole down the line could be cool though

[El Lobo]

It does, yeah. Would have been a huge pop if he hadn't been announced for the show, or at least if they'd kept him off the show until the very end - instead they had him in the opening promo segment.

Ziggler's cash-in remains undefeated in terms of crowd reaction.

Its the same everywhere now to be fair, not just a WWE thing. I think Edge returning at the Rumble was the last proper shock/huge organic pop. The dirtsheets probably don't help.

[Stockholm Syndrome]

Dynamite was on at the ambulance station on our meal break last night

I think I caught MJF’s promo on Pillman, which was great he’s a fantastic heat magnet, Black vs Rhodes, again Black looks fantastic and The Elite/Danielson confrontation

Gotta say, the elite stuff is pretty cringe, I can’t stand the young bucks (go away heat) and the majority of them are complete dorks (gallows and Anderson In particular just seem incredibly average to Me)

Omega vs Cole down the line could be cool though

I heard one description of the Bucks from commentary on a PWG show which always stuck with me "They are a caricature of a cartoon of what a wrestler should be" which I think about sums it up. I can forgive the act though now that they are pure cowardly and ridiculous dorky heels (who despite this also happen to be really really good wrestlers). Same with Omega. The Good Brothers though are kinda shite.

Shame it couldn't happen at a big PPV so he could have that moment.

He wont be champion for very long. He'll end up like Kofi. But as long as the 18-49 numbers get a bump then its all good

I am doubtful but I really hope he gets a good run with it. He more than deserves it and should have been champ about 2 years ago.

I am disappointed in the hot shotting aspect of it all, and the lack of actual story telling. But WWE story telling is now all about creating great moments. Things you can but on a highlight real and remember a show for THAT moment. As a moment, it was awesome, and that's probably the best you can ask for from WWE now, an awesome moment.

[tubby]

Gotta say, the elite stuff is pretty cringe, I can’t stand the young bucks (go away heat) and the majority of them are complete dorks (gallows and Anderson In particular just seem incredibly average to Me)

I can see why the Bucks are not for some people, but being dorks is literally their gimmick.  They're passive-aggressive dweebs who happen to be great at sports.  Agree on Gallows and Anderson being worthless, though.  They shouldn't be on Dynamite at all and they're only good for a skit or two on BTE now and then.  Shame, because Karl Anderson was an excellent worker 5 years ago.

Happy for Big E and that's a refreshing change at the top of the tree in WWE.  Hope he gets a decent run with the belt and isn't just a transitional champ.

Apparently, Gargano's contract is up soon.  Not sure he's someone who should make the jump, I don't see how he'd fit in at AEW.

[Stockholm Syndrome]

My big fear for Big E is he drops it back to Bobby at the PPV or something, he goes back to feuding with Goldberg, and then an eventual Bobby vs Brock mania march.

[Barefoot Doctor]

Apparently, Gargano's contract is up soon.  Not sure he's someone who should make the jump, I don't see how he'd fit in at AEW.

Think he'd get lost in the shuffle, unless he could come over with Ciampa and reunite DIY in the tag division?

[tubby]

Think he'd get lost in the shuffle, unless he could come over with Ciampa and reunite DIY in the tag division?

Maybe, but I think that'd be their ceiling, don't see either being a solo threat in AEW and Ciampa's neck is a mess these days.  But on the flipside, I'm not sure there's going to be a whole lot for them in NXT either, with the new remit there.

[Stockholm Syndrome]

I am not a huge fan of Gargano by any stretch, I always thought he just come off like a proper try hard dork; as a face it was just super Indy cool moves that don't look hard, and as a heel it was a parody, staring at his hands wondering why he is so violent crap. I don't know what his Lumis stuff has been like but heard some people say he is actually quite funny as this goofy heel.

He is clearly pretty skillful as a wrestler even if I don't like his style, but I wouldn't want him in AEW really. But then I really don't like him as a wrestler.

[Sheer Magnetism]

I like Gargano a lot but I think he'd be a far better fit in ROH than AEW (where he'd still be a decent mid-carder).

[OsirisMVZ]

ROH has fallen off the face of the earth during the pandemic, he'd be a good get for them and add some relevancy but they don't have any dance partners for him.

I think he is enough of a WWE mark to stay if they put him onto 205 or a lower spot on the main roster like what they were planning for Adam Cole. Do they even still do 205 Live?

[Stockholm Syndrome]

To be fair I think part of my dislike for Gargano also comes from his Evolve run where Gabe booked him like a superstar and he was honestly just boring.

Part of his pure love of wrestling face persona just got on my nerves as it felt like diet Daniel Bryan/Bryan Danielson, where it all looks soft and choreographed, where as Bryan wrestles stiff like his opponent owes him money.

[El Lobo]

He reminds me of Nunzio.

Him, Enzo and Cass could have been a great new FBI.

[tubby]

Enzo

Hey, I wonder what he's up to these days.

<a href="https://www.youtube.com/v/iCROR_q8Woo" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer" class="bbc_link bbc_flash_disabled new_win">https://www.youtube.com/v/iCROR_q8Woo</a>

Anyone got any idea what he's going on about?

[Stockholm Syndrome]

Hey, I wonder what he's up to these days.

<a href="https://www.youtube.com/v/iCROR_q8Woo" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer" class="bbc_link bbc_flash_disabled new_win">https://www.youtube.com/v/iCROR_q8Woo</a>

Anyone got any idea what he's going on about?

Ok I feel for sure when they showed the New York view, Enzo was off screen with a rolled up dollar and some white powder to get into character

[tubby]

Pete Dunne's contract was up soon too but he's just re-signed for 3 years.  Might see him win the NXT title tonight now he's locked in.

[tubby]

Imagine having one of the Steiner Brother's sons on your show and renaming him Bron Breakker.

[Barefoot Doctor]

Well, the new NXT sure is bright.

Seems they've really flooded it with lots of developmental talent, some guy I'd never heard of ended up in the title match (Cal Bloom/Von Wagoner).

Imagine having one of the Steiner Brother's sons on your show and renaming him Bron Breakker.

Looks like he's getting the Vince megapush. Going over LA Knight in the opening match (god knows why, since Knight was in the title match later) and then having the staredown at the end with Ciampa.

Fair to say, I think, that the days of big names coming to NXT has come to an end. It was the place from like 2015 to 2018/19, but between AEW and the pandemic I think it's been killed.

[Stockholm Syndrome]

So in one sense I am happy with this. NXT is meant to be developmental after all and one of the joys of the original NXT was seeing these largely green workers develop and become something. It was sometime chaotic, sometimes bad, but always a lot of fun. It's from this that you had Bray Wyatt and the Family, Rusev/Miro, Big E, Sasha Banks, Alexa Bliss, FTR/The Revival, and Bayley really find their feet, as well as a lot of really fun (if now defunct) acts like Tyler Breeze, Enzo and Cass, Emma, Paige, and, American Alpha.

This new NXT could burn out as soon as the novelty wears off and it is just Vince, Prichard, and Dunn's finger in the pie, or it may be chaotic fun, if not particularly good wrestling

I say from my perspective right now, I prefer this to the post 17/18 NXT which was just becoming a old, rotting super indie and stuck up it's own arse.

[Barefoot Doctor]

So in one sense I am happy with this. NXT is meant to be developmental after all and one of the joys of the original NXT was seeing these largely green workers develop and become something. It was sometime chaotic, sometimes bad, but always a lot of fun. It's from this that you had Bray Wyatt and the Family, Rusev/Miro, Big E, Sasha Banks, Alexa Bliss, FTR/The Revival, and Bayley really find their feet, as well as a lot of really fun (if now defunct) acts like Tyler Breeze, Enzo and Cass, Emma, Paige, and, American Alpha.

This new NXT could burn out as soon as the novelty wears off and it is just Vince, Prichard, and Dunn's finger in the pie, or it may be chaotic fun, if not particularly good wrestling

I say from my perspective right now, I prefer this to the post 17/18 NXT which was just becoming a old, rotting super indie and stuck up it's own arse.

Yeah, agree with you there. The whole point of NXT should be talent honing their act before getting called up to the main roster. And as you say, when you look at Raw and Smackdown it's done it's job - there's a significant amount of talent that has gone through NXT, and not just the big indy guys who passed through briefly like Balor, Owens and Nakamura. Even guys like Corbin and Elias, they're really solid hands and every wrestling company needs guys like that.

I'm not sure if NXT's TV show has ever been particularly good. Certainly not since it went two hours, but even before that its strength was always the Takeover PPVs. Some of those events were stone cold classics - five or six matches per card, and rarely a dud amongst them. That's what I'll miss about NXT.

[bird_lfc]

Steiner’s boy is how a wrestler and look and act for me, but I’m pretty old school

Early signs are very good however and look forward to seeing more of him. Close your eyes and he sounds just like them!

[Stockholm Syndrome]

Steiner’s boy is how a wrestler and look and act for me, but I’m pretty old school

Early signs are very good however and look forward to seeing more of him. Close your eyes and he sounds just like them!

He got his father's voice with his uncle's inflection.

[tubby]

He got his father's voice with his uncle's inflection.

How's his maths?

[Stockholm Syndrome]

So AEW taking chicken shit and turning it into a full 6 course fine dining chicken experience with this Suzuki thing - have little time and cut Suzuki's music off and then turn that crappiness into a real positive with the storyline with Suzuki-gun. The match should be really really good.

This may be the only time I will call production botch a possible work not a shoot, because it is all coming together so well now. And it happened in the one place where they may not turn on a guy for cutting off Suzuki (Moxley in Cincinnati)

[tubby]

Insane card for next week.  The benefit of only running 4 PPVs a year is that they can put together super shows like that every now and then.

Dragon vs Omega will be insane.