Topic: I'm really genuinely concerned...no rant intended

[west_london_red]

Interesting how few people are mentioning the stadium in the last few pages, which to me is the biggest concern about FSG, will they build something and what will it be, a redevelopment or a new stadium and how long is it gonna take?

[scatman]

Interesting how few people are mentioning the stadium in the last few pages, which to me is the biggest concern about FSG, will they build something and what will it be, a redevelopment or a new stadium and how long is it gonna take?

it's going to be a redevelopment, that much is certain from what we have heard from the club

[rushie9]

i hope we just make a "DORTMUND" in the EPL, and we build back fr here ...

[Matt8Pie]

Are we actually paying Aquilani and Bellamy off? Or are they just rumours? If it's true, that's very concerning.

[Gnurglan]

Aquilani we have tried to sell for 2 years with no luck, and both Kuyt and Maxi were are into their 30's with little left on their contract - so who is going to pay £10m for those?

Sorry, but I think those are excuses. It's our own making. We're talking about a player who has played for Juve and Milan for the last two years. We can't play him, but those at a higher level than us can. (And instead of AA, we go out and spend 20M+ on other players who now play in CM.) Given his last couple of years, we should be able to get something for him. Kuyt and Maxi scored something like 30 league goals between them over the past two seasons. IMO all three could have been kept and all three could have been given fairly big roles this season. It's not as if the competition is fierce.

And we net pay to offload them. But whatever we think of them, the main point is - it's our own making. The clause for Kuyt (1M I think) was our choice. Another obvious mistake. I doubt clubs would have backed out had it been 3-5M. Get 2-3M for Maxi and the same for AA and there's our 10M. Instead of -4M. It's a long line of errors that have put us in this situation. And these three are still just the tip of an iceberg. This could even be said to be the good part. We've lost far more money. 

Now I understand if we want a clearout. I do. But then I'd hope that we are ruthless and apply the same filter for everyone. No sympathy. At all. Only those we see a future for are allowed to stay. The rest are sent packing. What we do is something different. We find a few players and make them our casualties. So we can make a few statements, something that looks good. Then we keep a long line of players who are worse, because we can't make the effort to sell them.

We're just lazy (and/or incompetent) and because of it, we need to throw money at the problems.

[Brentieke]

Are we actually paying Aquilani and Bellamy off? Or are they just rumours? If it's true, that's very concerning.

Very Leeds-ish Im sorry to say.

[scatman]

Sorry, but I think those are excuses. It's our own making. We're talking about a player who has played for Juve and Milan for the last two years. We can't play him, but those at a higher level than us can. (And instead of AA, we go out and spend 20M+ on other players who now play in CM.) Given his last couple of years, we should be able to get something for him. Kuyt and Maxi scored something like 30 league goals between them over the past two seasons. IMO all three could have been kept and all three could have been given fairly big roles this season. It's not as if the competition is fierce.

And we net pay to offload them. But whatever we think of them, the main point is - it's our own making. The clause for Kuyt (1M I think) was our choice. Another obvious mistake. I doubt clubs would have backed out had it been 3-5M. Get 2-3M for Maxi and the same for AA and there's our 10M. Instead of -4M. It's a long line of errors that have put us in this situation. And these three are still just the tip of an iceberg. This could even be said to be the good part. We've lost far more money. 

Now I understand if we want a clearout. I do. But then I'd hope that we are ruthless and apply the same filter for everyone. No sympathy. At all. Only those we see a future for are allowed to stay. The rest are sent packing. What we do is something different. We find a few players and make them our casualties. So we can make a few statements, something that looks good. Then we keep a long line of players who are worse, because we can't make the effort to sell them.

We're just lazy (and/or incompetent) and because of it, we need to throw money at the problems.

This is why we should be concerned. Park commands 5m yet our dutch international commands just 1m. Some seriously bad decisions that keep on occuring. Let's see how the Aquilani sale and possible Bellamy sale now progress.

[Matt8Pie]

Very Leeds-ish Im sorry to say.

Fucking hell. This club is such a joke.

[west_london_red]

it's going to be a redevelopment, that much is certain from what we have heard from the club

I know, but if FSG dont manage to do something concrete in the next couple of years (srtart the building work, get approval from the council etc) I would certainly have my concerns, its dragged on for long enough as it is.

[Fat Scouser]

We're just lazy (and/or incompetent) and because of it, we need to throw money at the problems.

Besides the blip of Rafa, when he actually made some money on transfers, we've been woeful in the market for years. I thought this money ball malarkey was meant to stop all that. Seems to me, we are just wobbling along the same old path.

I honestly don't know any answers, but then that's not my job. I don't get paid millions to sort this cack out, but I'll have me say on it when the window shuts. I even hope it's a nice one, but, after decades of feeling turned over, I'm not too optimistic right now.

[CraigDS]

Sorry, but I think those are excuses. It's our own making. We're talking about a player who has played for Juve and Milan for the last two years. We can't play him, but those at a higher level than us can. (And instead of AA, we go out and spend 20M+ on other players who now play in CM.) Given his last couple of years, we should be able to get something for him. Kuyt and Maxi scored something like 30 league goals between them over the past two seasons. IMO all three could have been kept and all three could have been given fairly big roles this season. It's not as if the competition is fierce.

And we net pay to offload them. But whatever we think of them, the main point is - it's our own making. The clause for Kuyt (1M I think) was our choice. Another obvious mistake. I doubt clubs would have backed out had it been 3-5M. Get 2-3M for Maxi and the same for AA and there's our 10M. Instead of -4M. It's a long line of errors that have put us in this situation. And these three are still just the tip of an iceberg. This could even be said to be the good part. We've lost far more money. 

Now I understand if we want a clearout. I do. But then I'd hope that we are ruthless and apply the same filter for everyone. No sympathy. At all. Only those we see a future for are allowed to stay. The rest are sent packing. What we do is something different. We find a few players and make them our casualties. So we can make a few statements, something that looks good. Then we keep a long line of players who are worse, because we can't make the effort to sell them.

We're just lazy (and/or incompetent) and because of it, we need to throw money at the problems.

The clause in Kuyts was pre-FSG so can't blame them for it. Was yet another joke Purslow made. And Maxi wanted to go, and wouldn't you after last season where he should of been used a hell of a lot more? That and he a. doesn't speak English and b. his family aren't here/not happy here. Not many players at an age of 31, wanting to go back to his home land, in last year of their contract, go for much money at all.

As for Aquilani, if he has done so well then why did AC refuse to pay the piddly sum agreed for him. Or Juventus before them. Neither clearly felt he was worth much to be honest (probably due to wages, which again were pre-FSG).

Sometimes getting decent fees isn't possible, and it's a case of clearing out the crap so not having to pay big wages for the rest of their contract. If he stayed Aquilani would of cost something like £10m over the next 2 years then left for nothing anyway.

[TepidT2O]

Fucking hell. This club is such a joke.

Getting rid of aquilani a joke?
Ok we're going to give him away for a net amount of zero, but to be honest, what else was there to do?

What we can't afford is people who don't play many games on £80k a week.


Fine if it's the first 11 but not for bit part players....

It's the same deal for Carroll, he won't start every game so he's much to expensive for a bit part....

Could say the same about aurelio, kuyt, maxi and Bellamy...... All good players don't get me wrong, but if they're ink going to play every 2nd or third game then they're on way too much money.



Think it makes sense myself....

Mind you, we do need to bring in replacements pretty sharpish now....

[AndrewLFC_1971]

A lot of people in this thread seem to be making assumptions based on very little, if any, knowledge of what is actually going on at the club, if we were hearing H&G type whispers coming out of the club then we'd need to start worrying, as it is we need to get behind our new manager and the team he sees fit to put out there to represent us, people having concerns is no bad thing but some people on here are simply unrealistic about things and need to wake up.

[thelinnen]

Are we actually paying Aquilani and Bellamy off? Or are they just rumours? If it's true, that's very concerning.

If its true then I have no doubt the people in charge of this club are complete idiots.

[Brentieke]

Besides the blip of Rafa, when he actually made some money on transfers, we've been woeful in the market for years. I thought this money ball malarkey was meant to stop all that. Seems to me, we are just wobbling along the same old path.

I honestly don't know any answers, but then that's not my job. I don't get paid millions to sort this cack out, but I'll have me say on it when the window shuts. I even hope it's a nice one, but, after decades of feeling turned over, I'm not too optimistic right now.

Rafa as guilty as anyone, if not more, with the catastophic last 2 years he had in the transfer market.

It's a fact not accepted by many, but Rafa spent a fortune in his last 2 years on Keane, Riera, Dossena, Ngog, Cavalieri, Aquilani, Johnson, Soto etc... in some of the most spirit crushingly disastrous deals in LFC history.

[Kite]

Time to get behind the new manager, the new and old players and just enjoy being a fan.  Fair enough if we by mid season are mid table and things are no better, then fine we'll all be as depressed as each other.  But for now, allow yourself some optimism and look forward to the start of an exciting new season.

How can you expect the players to lift themselves if we don't either.

[Melbred]

Getting rid of aquilani a joke?
Ok we're going to give him away for a net amount of zero, but to be honest, what else was there to do?

What we can't afford is people who don't play many games on £80k a week.


Fine if it's the first 11 but not for bit part players....

It's the same deal for Carroll, he won't start every game so he's much to expensive for a bit part....

Could say the same about aurelio, kuyt, maxi and Bellamy...... All good players don't get me wrong, but if they're ink going to play every 2nd or third game then they're on way too much money.


Think it makes sense myself....

Mind you, we do need to bring in replacements pretty sharpish now....

I agree, it makes perfect sense what we are doing, and in some of those cases it's simply out of our control.

The key, as you say, is the replacements - so I'll reserve judgement until the transfer window closes where we'll have a much clearer idea of where things stand.

[Sangria]

This is why we should be concerned. Park commands 5m yet our dutch international commands just 1m. Some seriously bad decisions that keep on occuring. Let's see how the Aquilani sale and possible Bellamy sale now progress.

We got more money for Voronin than we did for Kuyt. We lost money on the best specialist DM in the world because he only had a year left on his contract, but we made 4m profit on Crouch despite him having only a year left on his contract. We have accountants in charge at the club who constantly write off depreciating assets, but we have noone who knows how to make a little money go a long footballing way.

[Fat Scouser]

Rafa as guilty as anyone, if not more, with the catastophic last 2 years he had in the transfer market.

It's a fact not accepted by many, but Rafa spent a fortune in his last 2 years on Keane, Riera, Dossena, Ngog, Cavalieri, Aquilani, Johnson, Soto etc... in some of the most spirit crushingly disastrous deals in LFC history.

Keane and Aquilani, you may have some sort of case, even after taking in the circumstances of the deals. But the fact is, since Souness we have lost money hand over fist in the transfer market. Rafa is the only manager that put an end to that and actually made some sort of profit in his wheeling and dealing, which I consider to be a minor miracle when everything is taken into consideration.

[Carlito Roberto]

Mr Dilkington and Macca the voice of reason in this thread.

[Sangria]

Rafa as guilty as anyone, if not more, with the catastophic last 2 years he had in the transfer market.

It's a fact not accepted by many, but Rafa spent a fortune in his last 2 years on Keane, Riera, Dossena, Ngog, Cavalieri, Aquilani, Johnson, Soto etc... in some of the most spirit crushingly disastrous deals in LFC history.

Fuck me, Ngog a spirit crushingly disastrous deal. He wasn't even old enough to have counted if we had PL squads back then, and we eventually made a profit on him. Care to compare him with his replacement in terms of goalscoring effectiveness?

[007.lankyguy]

Keane and Aquilani, you may have some sort of case, even after taking in the circumstances of the deals. But the fact is, since Souness we have lost money hand over fist in the transfer market. Rafa is the only manager that put an end to that and actually made some sort of profit in his wheeling and dealing, which I consider to be a minor miracle when everything is taken into consideration.

I think he'd rather have not had to make a profit that summer

[stewy17]

I hate to do this, but people should take a look at our squad in May 2009 and compare it with our squad now.

3 Years for fucks sake, we've gone from being one of the best in Europe to well, whatever we are now. Over the past 3 seasons we've sold our best and brightest for huge money to Real Madrid, Barca and Chelsea. Now we're trying to offload expensive "flops" to West Ham and Fiorentina and losing quality experienced european/international footballers and replacing them with Swansea and Fulham players (on top of the former blackpool, sunderland and aston villa players we already have).

This is fucking scary times for the club, realistically we are years away from challenging for any major trophies and its going to keep getting further away unless something changes soon.

[Matt8Pie]

Getting rid of aquilani a joke?
Ok we're going to give him away for a net amount of zero, but to be honest, what else was there to do?

What we can't afford is people who don't play many games on £80k a week.


Fine if it's the first 11 but not for bit part players....

It's the same deal for Carroll, he won't start every game so he's much to expensive for a bit part....

Could say the same about aurelio, kuyt, maxi and Bellamy...... All good players don't get me wrong, but if they're ink going to play every 2nd or third game then they're on way too much money.



Think it makes sense myself....

Mind you, we do need to bring in replacements pretty sharpish now....

It's not that we're getting rid of him, it's that we're apparently paying him to leave and doing the same for Bellamy. The club are paying him so another club doesn't have to buy him while we get told we have to pay £15m for a 22 year old Welsh player with one year's experience in the Premiership. I imagine our budget is quite tight and we're (apparently) spending money on getting rid of players so they're gone instead of using that money to strengthen the squad.

Aquilani and Bellamy, two of our better players, will (apparently) be paid to leave the club while lesser players are earning a lot more per week than they are worth.

[skipper757]

That's the thing about it Brentie.  Our scouting network has let us down, starting with Rafa's last years through Hodgson and Comolli to where we start now.  I know Torres gave us no time but we did spend 23 million on Suarez.  That Torres money could've been invested so shrewdly, but we had Comolli doing the transfers.  Need I say more about the summer?  Even if we spent 40-50 net this window, you'd still be worried about our current scouting structure.

There's always been bargains even with Chelsea, Man United, Real Madrid, and Barcelona sniffing around, as Rafa showed us.  The fact that Rafa had extensive experience in Spain and employed scouts all around Europe got us amazing bargains.  Arbeloa was a Real Madrid youth product and Reina was Barca's.  Real Madrid have let go of players ranging from from youth products like Mata, Eto'o, Soldado, etc. to casting off Huntelaar, Robben, Sneijder, and Van der Vaart.  None of them are as choosy as you might think.  Eto'o was at Mallorca (wasn't Ged interested for a while?), Soldado at Getafe, Arbeloa at Depor, etc.

But our genius manager and his network of scouts were the reason we were able to do it.  If FSG and Rodgers came aboard when we were in much better shape, we could wait and see for transfer dealings.  But since we're coming off a three-year tailspin of 7th-6th-8th, we need those bargains and we need them now.  Unfortunately, it's once again wait and see for transfers and results.

FSG's lack of structure has been seriously concerning.  No one should've given Comolli that much power.  When you see Cabaye going for 5 million and Debuchy going for 7 million and Belhanda becoming a star, I wonder what we were doing, considering Comolli's "expertise" in French Football.  I'd struggle to listen to Billy Beane for baseball advice, let alone football.  Then this summer, what was all talk of a great structure?  If your vision is a DOF-young manager model, then you stick to it.  Rodgers gives a powerpoint and you give all power to him?  Not saying Rodgers isn't capable (I like the bloke and think he'll do well), but FSG isn't exactly filling everyone with confidence when they can't decide on a structure themselves.  They got handed a bad deck of cards with Hodgson's mess, the wage bill mess, and the club's declining performances on the pitch.  Not to mention Torres' departure.

But FSG haven't exactly handled it all well.

Another thing to consider.  The Red Sox won two World Series titles, but they came through playoffs obviously.  If the Premier League had a playoff, I wouldn't be as concerned considering 90/180 minutes of football can turn into anything.  However, over the course of 38 games, it's a different story.  We could knock the stuffing out of Man United, City, Chelsea, Arsenal, Everton, and Spurs but that gives us nothing but pride.  Consistency is extremely difficult to maintain in league play.  Not to mention, in American sports, you can always rebuild and start from the bottom as there is no relegation.  Plus, the worse you do, the better young players you get a chance to draft.  Going from average/mediocre/crap to playoffs isn't all that wondrous.  And once you're there, it's head-to-head for supremacy. 

This sure isn't the case for the English league.  The further we fall behind, the more unlikely we will break into the top.  I mean, Wigan were 2nd after 10 games one year.  Villa were third in 08/09 in January.  Were any of them near the top at the end?  Of course not.

To maintain consistency over 38 games takes incredible team-building these days.  Rafa had us so close but so much of his work with squad mentality and consistency has been dismantled.  We're now practically building from a top-half position (not a challenging position or even European position) while others are getting stronger. 

My concern isn't with specific amounts of money regarding FSG.  My concerns with them regard their understanding of the game.

I don't think they knew what they were getting themselves into.  It honestly wouldn't surprise me to see them sell in the next couple of years if things don't perk up.  They might've bitten off more than they could chew and now they're deliberating with the process forward.  They're not bad people or crude businessmen hell-bent on trampling on tradition, but I just get the feeling they're out of their depth a little.

If they had been the owners under Rafa instead of H&G, then we might have 20, 21, 22 titles by now because the club was in great shape and just needed an extra push (AKA not servicing hundreds of millions of pounds of debt).  We had a brilliant starting 11 with CL football every year.  Instead, we got them when we were at a low and now after some big investment, we're still struggling.  I don't know if they're going to be able to push us that much higher.  It's like what Noelle said earlier, even if they could get us CL football consistently, then they still might have to re-assess regarding a potential title push and maybe have to sell.

Sustainability is a great idea but the path to the league title has giant Man City-Chelsea-esque obstacles in the way.

Lots of my own speculation, I know, but some rambling is good for the soul...

[Hazell]

Fuck me, Ngog a spirit crushingly disastrous deal. He wasn't even old enough to have counted if we had PL squads back then, and we eventually made a profit on him. Care to compare him with his replacement in terms of goalscoring effectiveness?

Many of those names shouldn't be counted as 'spirit crushingly disastrous' or 'catastrophic' really. Only one or two at a push.

[Kite]

Keane and Aquilani, you may have some sort of case, even after taking in the circumstances of the deals. But the fact is, since Souness we have lost money hand over fist in the transfer market. Rafa is the only manager that put an end to that and actually made some sort of profit in his wheeling and dealing, which I consider to be a minor miracle when everything is taken into consideration.

Everyone was too busy taking the piss on the amount of players in and out.  And for some reason nobody ever took our net spend seriously, certainly not the media with their constant ridiculing.  You look at his numbers in black and white and easy to see.  How he even got us close to a title with the shackles around him is amazing.  And it was probably these shackles that pushed him to his biggest mistakes, Alonso, Keane etc.

He certainly wouldn't have spent 35 million on Andy Carroll.

[Gnurglan]

What do people expect Rodgers to do with Carra? No-one is going to buy him on his wages, he's not going to want to go. He's being transitioned into coaching by the looks of it Seems like he could be a very good one as well. I actually thought Carra was setting a sterling example on tour. He was playing on the left side to seemingly accommodate Skrtel (who'll be getting most of the game time), he didn't hoof it once and was really trying his best to keep the ball on the floor and in our possession. There was one occasion vs Spurs when he kept onto it for an age, seemingly in thought, before making a very forward pass on the floor. Previously he would have just hoofed it.

I know his situation isn't ideal but there is nothing Rodgers can do about it really. I'm not saying he should be anywhere near the first-team by the way. I'm just saying his effort on tour was admirable considering his obvious flaws, he tried his best not to disrupt the team and adapt. Set a great example.

With Joe Cole, I believe if someone was interested in him we wouldn't have any hesitation in selling. The problem is no-one would be interested. At least they aren't now, and he doesn't seem too interested in moving either. The whole attitude he's being positioned as our poster boy because he's done a blog is, quite frankly, ridiculous and pathetic.

How is getting rid of one player who is clearly past his peak (Kuyt), one player who wanted to go home (Maxi) and one player who has been an outcast for some time (Aquilani) evidence of a club in decline? Would you be happier if we had signed Borini on 100k a week and if we sign Allen on a similar deal?

If we mean business, Carra should be eased out or offloaded. We're now at a point where you could argue he's 4th pick. In that sense, he's a luxuary and we could get rid. Replace him in that 4th pick role with Kelly/Wilson/Sama/Wisdom/...
If he wants to coach he should go some place else. The door is always open for him to come back, but he should not be involved with the first team or the Reserves. He's too close to the players.

With Cole it's slightly different. We've paved the way for him now. He's got a good chance of being 1st pick, or at least on the bench every game. Do we trust him for that? If we do, play him and expect him to deliver. None of this 2 goals/season and a few tricks. For a first choice, he should get 10-15 goals+assists. If we don't think he has that in him - goodbye. We gave away Maxi and Kuyt, players who have at least offered that kind of level recently. We can't realistically expect Cole to be worse and be OK with that, if we intend to improve.

The problem is that we will keep those two. We will keep them because it's too damn hard to get rid. It would require a bit of work, so we'll avoid that.

We planned to axe Maxi and Kuyt. Prepared their exits so they wanted to leave. Let others replace them, even if they're crap and insert a low exit fee. Then there's nothing the club can do. So what a surprise they're off. We can now say it was out of our hands. We can also say that we're going places because we've managed to lower the wage bill. Great. No work and we have something to show we're doing the right things...

But then we will accept that Carra and Cole are average, we'll accept that they don't perform in line with what they should. Because they're good old boys who needs to earn a living. Or something. We find a lot of reasons to keep them (and others), but we don't even bother to expect them to play big roles. That's when we become a charity.

[Bjinxi]

I hate to do this, but people should take a look at our squad in May 2009 and compare it with our squad now.

3 Years for fucks sake, we've gone from being one of the best in Europe to well, whatever we are now. Over the past 3 seasons we've sold our best and brightest for huge money to Real Madrid, Barca and Chelsea. Now we're trying to offload expensive "flops" to West Ham and Fiorentina and losing quality experienced european/international footballers and replacing them with Swansea and Fulham players (on top of the former blackpool, sunderland and aston villa players we already have).

This is fucking scary times for the club, realistically we are years away from challenging for any major trophies and its going to keep getting further away unless something changes soon.

Sadly, at the moment it looks like mediocrity takes over, only with a few world class players. Hope I am wrong though.

[CraigDS]

It's not that we're getting rid of him, it's that we're apparently paying him to leave and doing the same for Bellamy. The club are paying him so another club doesn't have to buy him while we get told we have to pay £15m for a 22 year old Welsh player with one year's experience in the Premiership. I imagine our budget is quite tight and we're (apparently) spending money on getting rid of players so they're gone instead of using that money to strengthen the squad.

Aquilani and Bellamy, two of our better players, will (apparently) be paid to leave the club while lesser players are earning a lot more per week than they are worth.

This is a manager discussion though surely?

He is clearly not wanting those players in his squad that are going (unless they want to move, all Bellamy, which is why he won't be getting paid to leave) so it's best to cut our losses now rather than lose more so in wages. And he is the one picking the new players to come in as feels they improve the squad.

Those two discussion points aren't really anything to do with the owners.

[Sangria]

Keane and Aquilani, you may have some sort of case, even after taking in the circumstances of the deals. But the fact is, since Souness we have lost money hand over fist in the transfer market. Rafa is the only manager that put an end to that and actually made some sort of profit in his wheeling and dealing, which I consider to be a minor miracle when everything is taken into consideration.

The Benitez players we have remaining, which is essentially the functioning core of the current side, had a net cost of around 20-30m. Which we could probably recoup by selling any one of them, as, Suarez apart, they're the only players we have who would fetch any decent money on the market. And I'm not even taking into account the likes of Shelvey and Sterling who might well become prominent players for us in the future. 6 seasons from 2004 to 2010, including 1 European Cup and another EC final, including a core of players we still have who are desired by the top teams in Europe, cost us 30m net. Sell a couple of those players and it would have cost us nothing in total, and we'd still have a few players left, a European Cup in our cabinet and memories of being Europe's number 1 team.

[Gnurglan]

Rafa as guilty as anyone, if not more, with the catastophic last 2 years he had in the transfer market.

It's a fact not accepted by many, but Rafa spent a fortune in his last 2 years on Keane, Riera, Dossena, Ngog, Cavalieri, Aquilani, Johnson, Soto etc... in some of the most spirit crushingly disastrous deals in LFC history.

Sure, Rafa made mistakes too. He's not without fault. But I do have some sympathy for his mistakes. It was Alonso and Keane. We got good money for Alonso, we corrected Keane quickly. Aquilani was a mistake, of course. Johnson for Arbeloa was not a wise net spend of some 15M, but at least Johnson is a first pick. Dossena, I agree. Don't see a problem with Ngog. We earned money on him and he was a gamble who did what we could request. That's no longer the norm. Now the norm is to lose money while we go weaker.

It's when you get to Konchesky, Poulsen (vs Insua and Aquilani that we already had), Cole, Carra's new contract, or when you consider how we spent the Torres money and last summer's activities that we really lost it. I think Hodgson's short spell alone may have cost us 40-50M in contracts and fees and it was painfully obvious that all those things would make us worse off. Not even the intentions were good. It was more or less a plan to make us worse.

[stardorman]

Why do we seem to force ourselves into corners with players?

It really amazes me why we do it.. what ever happened to getting the players back,
get them playing.. then if another club comes sniffing we negotiate and see where it goes.

It feels at the minute that instead of making other clubs desire our players, we almost
encourage other teams to know that we're desperate to offload and will do all we can
to make it happen.

[fowler9_god]

Why do we seem to force ourselves into corners with players?

It really amazes me why we do it.. what ever happened to getting the players back,
get them playing.. then if another club comes sniffing we negotiate and see where it goes.

It feels at the minute that instead of making other clubs desire our players, we almost
encourage other teams to know that we're desperate to offload and will do all we can
to make it happen.

Ha, its funny isn't it?

The way the Carroll issue is being handled is also laughable.

[Walshy nMe®]

It's not that we're getting rid of him, it's that we're apparently paying him to leave and doing the same for Bellamy.

So nothing confirmed then.

And if the owners can afford it, what does it matter?  How does it affect you?  If it doesn't affect the running of the club in terms of money available for Rodgers, why do you care?

[Mutton Geoff]

Getting rid of aquilani a joke?
Ok we're going to give him away for a net amount of zero, but to be honest, what else was there to do?

What we can't afford is people who don't play many games on £80k a week.


Fine if it's the first 11 but not for bit part players....

It's the same deal for Carroll, he won't start every game so he's much to expensive for a bit part....

Could say the same about aurelio, kuyt, maxi and Bellamy...... All good players don't get me wrong, but if they're ink going to play every 2nd or third game then they're on way too much money.



Think it makes sense myself....

Mind you, we do need to bring in replacements pretty sharpish now....

not wishing to pick on this post in general but your argument could have been used last season and probably was for not getting a high earner in as cover for Lucas and how did that work out?

Your idea of getting rid of quality out of the squad for  a cheaper option is unless they replace like for like incredibly dangerous it fits with expecting Jay to do Lucas's job as well as him , or Morgan coming in for Suarez or Borini, he can do a job but will it be good enough right now!

All the top teams win and qualify for the CL (which is the new holy grail) by having a depth of quality in the squads not by diluting the quality at every transfer window as we seem to be doing! through bad buys and no buys at all.

Mind you so far i feel sorry for this Borini guy if you believe the spin in here he is replacing Maxi, Kuyt, Albert, Carroll, and what now maybe Bellamy as well i hope he is good and fast then!

As I said in my last post thank god Rafa had the foresight to get the academy on track, i reckon we will be seeing  the fruits of his labours a lot this season!

[The Flying Pig]

The clause in Kuyts was pre-FSG so can't blame them for it. Was yet another joke Purslow made. And Maxi wanted to go, and wouldn't you after last season where he should of been used a hell of a lot more? That and he a. doesn't speak English and b. his family aren't here/not happy here. Not many players at an age of 31, wanting to go back to his home land, in last year of their contract, go for much money at all.

As for Aquilani, if he has done so well then why did AC refuse to pay the piddly sum agreed for him. Or Juventus before them. Neither clearly felt he was worth much to be honest (probably due to wages, which again were pre-FSG).

Sometimes getting decent fees isn't possible, and it's a case of clearing out the crap so not having to pay big wages for the rest of their contract. If he stayed Aquilani would of cost something like £10m over the next 2 years then left for nothing anyway.

The £1million release cluse was added to Dirk's contract when he extended it in April 2011,FSG took over in October 2010.

[CraigDS]

I think we need to separate the crappy deals done before FSG, the likes of Kuyts buy out clause, Aquilani, Cole's and Carra's wages, etc. as no matter what the club is going to have to take a hit on those. And it is going to hurt us in the short term but hopefully within the next year all those pre-FSG mistakes will be sorted out.

Then we have the big mess from last summer, namely two which are Carroll and Downing (due to initial fee, age, or both). With the jury still out on Henderson (who you'd hope would still have a decent sell on fee and people wanting him). The others are lower cost (namely Adam) so we should be OK moving on should the need be there.

The big test will be FSG allowing Rodgers to make the call to get rid of the players he wants to get rid of, even if it means a hefty loss, and still providing funds for him to purchase replacements. Obviously replacing Carroll won't be Rodger's getting another £25-35m to spend, but he shouldn't need that to improve upon Carroll (otherwise you don't get rid). We won't really have a real idea on what FSG have allowed until the end of the transfer window.

[The Flying Pig]

See above.

[CraigDS]

The £1million release cluse was added to Dirk's contract when he extended it in April 2011,FSG took over in October 2010.

So it was, didn't think he had signed an extension that recently.