Topic: General Manchester City thread

[Xxavi]

Not the likes of Klopp, Pocchettino, Benitez and many other who don't fear jobs where you have to build from scratch with not a lot of money.

I have been a big fan of Benitez since his Valenca days (and ignoring his Madrid stint). Even while he was at Madrid, I felt for him, he was treated like a trash.

With that being said, if you are so black and white in your judgment, then, Benitez utterly failed at a club where he had it all. You shouldn't overrate those perennial midtable coaches who get the job done (not saying your list is that, but you get the point). Every league has about 5-6 of them, who go from Watford to Swansea to Crystal Palace. Or from Osasuna to Granada to Malaga. They may do a good job for those clubs, but there is 0 evidence that they would do well at Barca, Madrid, ManU or ManCity.

Rafa Benitez went to Real Madrid and managed to fall out with just about everybody at Madrid in half a year, and got himself kicked out. The team he left behind has made history winning CL title multiple times. You really have to get your judgment straight. There is no evidence that any of Pochettino, Klopp and Benitez would do as well as Pep, Mourinho etc. have done at big clubs.

[Dim Glas]

I have been a big fan of Benitez since his Valenca days (and ignoring his Madrid stint). Even while he was at Madrid, I felt for him, he was treated like a trash.

With that being said, if you are so black and white in your judgment, then, Benitez utterly failed at a club where he had it all. You shouldn't overrate those perennial midtable coaches who get the job done (not saying your list is that, but you get the point). Every league has about 5-6 of them, who go from Watford to Swansea to Crystal Palace. Or from Osasuna to Granada to Malaga. They may do a good job for those clubs, but there is 0 evidence that they would do well at Barca, Madrid, ManU or ManCity.

Rafa Benitez went to Real Madrid and managed to fall out with just about everybody at Madrid in half a year, and got himself kicked out. The team he left behind has made history winning CL title multiple times. You really have to get your judgment straight. There is no evidence that any of Pochettino, Klopp and Benitez would do as well as Pep, Mourinho etc. have done at big clubs.

how've you got that from the post you where responding too. He was saying that not all big managers necessarily want to go to the clubs where they are given an open cheque book, unlike Mourinho and Guardiola. And I think that is true although not necessarily to the ones he quoted. But I'm pretty confident in saying that Klopp could have gone to a club with far huger resources than Liverpool many a time over, but he decided to stay with Dortmund though and then when he left he decided he wanted the challenge of Liverpool. But we'll never likely know how he'd do in spain cos he's said he'd only coach in the Premier league or Germany.

I'm sure we'll see one day if Pochettino can make the transition though as it's only a matter of time till he goes back to La Liga, although it of course depends how he does for Spurs and what teams might have openings.

[Steady Eddie]

I have been a big fan of Benitez since his Valenca days (and ignoring his Madrid stint). Even while he was at Madrid, I felt for him, he was treated like a trash.

With that being said, if you are so black and white in your judgment, then, Benitez utterly failed at a club where he had it all. You shouldn't overrate those perennial midtable coaches who get the job done (not saying your list is that, but you get the point). Every league has about 5-6 of them, who go from Watford to Swansea to Crystal Palace. Or from Osasuna to Granada to Malaga. They may do a good job for those clubs, but there is 0 evidence that they would do well at Barca, Madrid, ManU or ManCity.

Rafa Benitez went to Real Madrid and managed to fall out with just about everybody at Madrid in half a year, and got himself kicked out. The team he left behind has made history winning CL title multiple times. You really have to get your judgment straight. There is no evidence that any of Pochettino, Klopp and Benitez would do as well as Pep, Mourinho etc. have done at big clubs.

Benitez won a champions league at a 'big club'

[Xxavi]

Pep was right when he said that if he had a season like this for Barca, Bayern or Madrid, he'd be fired. At these clubs, you are a failure even with a narrow, "unlucky" miss. I think worst of them is Bayern, to be honest. They have almost 0 respect for the Bundesliga title, everything is solely judged on CL win or no win at this point, which is ludicrous. Ancelotti was being hyped up until their Madrid match, and after an unlucky loss, immediately, he was seen as worse than Pep by many Bayern fans. How crazy is that? CL is a cup tourney, details matter. Pep's Bayern was also very close to beating Atletico Madrid. So your entire season is judged on some fine details of a given match.

My point is, whilst I am a fan of Klopp and Benitez (not such a fan of Pochettino), it's patently wrong to say that they have it hard. These guys are praised for their achievements. People are understanding and give them a lot more time. Pep or Mourinho get called a failure after 1 season of not winning CL or league title. They are under a lot more pressure. Pochettino did well finishing 2nd but all these years, his teams have been sucking in Europe badly. Nobody seemingly is too critical of him for that. Would anybody be more understanding and forgiving if Klopp, Benitez or Pochettino went to Bayern and didn't win everything in sight in their first season? No, there would be reports leaking that these are small club coaches, big fishes in a small pond, not ready for top clubs etc.

They may do well at Bayern, to be fair, but this is yet to be seen. For now, they are praised for what they are achieving, without all that pressure from media and fans.

[Xxavi]

how've you got that from the post you where responding too. He was saying that not all big managers necessarily want to go to the clubs where they are given an open cheque book, unlike Mourinho and Guardiola. And I think that is true although not necessarily to the ones he quoted. But I'm pretty confident in saying that Klopp could have gone to a club with far huger resources than Liverpool many a time over, but he decided to stay with Dortmund though and then when he left he decided he wanted the challenge of Liverpool. But we'll never likely know how he'd do in spain cos he's said he'd only coach in the Premier league or Germany.

I'm sure we'll see one day if Pochettino can make the transition though as it's only a matter of time till he goes back to La Liga, although it of course depends how he does for Spurs and what teams might have openings.

We don't know future. Klopp will not always be employed by Liverpool, and he will go wherever he goes. My point is, there seems to be a widespread assumption that these are sure bets because they have proven themselves under a more restrictive environment.

This is a big assumption that is not necessarily true at all.

Now that I think about it, Manuel Pellegrini is the perfect example. He did a marvelous job at Villarreal, almost got them into a CL final with Riquelme. But at Madrid, he really didn't look like he was ready to manage such a big club. Goes back to Malaga and does a superb job yet again, taking them far into CL. Then at ManCity, he still looks like a limited coach not ready to take them to the next level.

I may also add Wenger here  He is a good coach, but is seemingly obsessed with things that are not necessarily tied to "winning". Tony Adams (I think) was right when he said he'd be sacked by Bayern or Madrid in 1 season. They don't give a sh*t about playing pretty football with youngsters and finishing in top 4. Spend, if you must, but win.

Both Mourinho and Pep are showing that they are not happy to be competing for top 4. They both recognize limitations of the squad and are willing to do whatever to win. That's the spirit. I want Barca's new coach, Valverde, to do the same. Spend if you must, get rid of deadwood, but I want to see Barca challenging for titles next season.

[Max_powers]

We don't know future. Klopp will not always be employed by Liverpool, and he will go wherever he goes. My point is, there seems to be a widespread assumption that these are sure bets because they have proven themselves under a more restrictive environment.

This is a big assumption that is not necessarily true at all.

Now that I think about it, Manuel Pellegrini is the perfect example. He did a marvelous job at Villarreal, almost got them into a CL final with Riquelme. But at Madrid, he really didn't look like he was ready to manage such a big club. Goes back to Malaga and does a superb job yet again, taking them far into CL. Then at ManCity, he still looks like a limited coach not ready to take them to the next level.

I may also add Wenger here  He is a good coach, but is seemingly obsessed with things that are not necessarily tied to "winning". Tony Adams (I think) was right when he said he'd be sacked by Bayern or Madrid in 1 season. They don't give a sh*t about playing pretty football with youngsters and finishing in top 4. Spend, if you must, but win.

Both Mourinho and Pep are showing that they are not happy to be competing for top 4. They both recognize limitations of the squad and are willing to do whatever to win. That's the spirit. I want Barca's new coach, Valverde, to do the same. Spend if you must, get rid of deadwood, but I want to see Barca challenging for titles next season.

In Mourinho's case, he needs to first compete for top 4 before he can be unhappy with that. Also disagree fully that spending half a billion pounds every 2-3 seasons is the most logical way to build teams. Not only that most of the money they are spending is just going straight to buying more deadwood.  Sure City can do it, but most other clubs would suffer financially in the long run if they tried it.

[gritsvanilla]

We don't know future. Klopp will not always be employed by Liverpool, and he will go wherever he goes. My point is, there seems to be a widespread assumption that these are sure bets because they have proven themselves under a more restrictive environment.

This is a big assumption that is not necessarily true at all.

Now that I think about it, Manuel Pellegrini is the perfect example. He did a marvelous job at Villarreal, almost got them into a CL final with Riquelme. But at Madrid, he really didn't look like he was ready to manage such a big club. Goes back to Malaga and does a superb job yet again, taking them far into CL. Then at ManCity, he still looks like a limited coach not ready to take them to the next level.

I may also add Wenger here  He is a good coach, but is seemingly obsessed with things that are not necessarily tied to "winning". Tony Adams (I think) was right when he said he'd be sacked by Bayern or Madrid in 1 season. They don't give a sh*t about playing pretty football with youngsters and finishing in top 4. Spend, if you must, but win.

Both Mourinho and Pep are showing that they are not happy to be competing for top 4. They both recognize limitations of the squad and are willing to do whatever to win. That's the spirit. I want Barca's new coach, Valverde, to do the same. Spend if you must, get rid of deadwood, but I want to see Barca challenging for titles next season.

Spoilt much. It's attitudes like this that have severely dented my interest in the beautiful game, seems to have fuck all to do with sport and more to do with money. In all of your hyperbole you seem to have forgotten that Benitez won the CL with a pretty ramshackle squad and got to another final two years later with another squad that didn't cost upwards of half a million, as for comparing his time at Real to Pep's achievements i'd say that was a bit unfair given the fact he was sacked after 6 months and Madrid is a circus anyway, i mean isn't this the same club who sacked Carlo Ancellotti after he'd won them their first CL in years.

As for denigrating Manuel Pellegrini well that's just nonsense, do me a favour Xxavi go and check how Pellegrini's first season at City compares to Pep's and tell me you ain't talking trash and as i said above bringing Real Madrid's managerial merry go round into the discussion proves absolutely nothing regarding a manager's abilities.

[rafathegaffa83]

I am actually so happy that for once Barca board did the right thing and not sign Nolito. Watching him for City was painful, so slow, so indecisive at times.

I remember a few people on here thinking he was great after his first game there. It was always likely a daft signing. Players over the age of 28, who haven't played in the PL before tend to have difficulty adapting.

[Doc Red]

I don't hate him, I just don't have much respect for him, doesn't mean I don't think he should do the job, he's free to do whatever the hell he wants, but in the same way, doesnt mean everyone has to laud him. Everyone's free to their opinions eh, I am ok with people thinking he's the bees knees too. We just don't have to all agree!

I feel the same way as I do with Mourinho these days, even though Guardiola isn't a wanker like him, so that's why no hate, but I have little respect for either of them.

Pep and Mourinho are like Barca and Madrid. On face value, one of the two looks the more clean, enticing, artistic, honourable, and more pleasing for the neutral, but dig down deep enough and you'll see the reality: they're both sides of the same coin and just one side is shinier than the other. Listening to Eto'o and Abrahimovic speak of their experiences with Pep offers a striking contrast to what many assume Pep is like. Quite frankly I think they're just as thin skinned and petty as one another but we know more of Mourinho than Pep, though in fairness Pep seems to have a line he doesn't cross unlike Mourinho, and Mourinho has more of a victim complex rather than that of a tortured genius.

I look forward to seeing Klopp maintain his impressive record against Pep.

[Schmidt]

I remember a few people on here thinking he was great after his first game there. It was always likely a daft signing. Players over the age of 28, who haven't played in the PL before tend to have difficulty adapting.

It worked out well for them though, Nolito hit the ground running and scored a few goals for them in the first half of the season, then as Sané settled he took over that spot and bossed it in the second half. Now it looks like they'll recoup a decent amount for him too.

[sinnermichael]

Looks like they could end up with Walker and Bertrand as their fullbacks next season. Hardly a significant upgrade.

[Grobbelrevell]

Looks like they could end up with Walker and Bertrand as their fullbacks next season. Hardly a significant upgrade.

I dunno, i'd say both represent precisely that on last season's version of Kolarov/Clichy, and Sagna/Zabaleta.

[Gili Gulu]

Looks like they could end up with Walker and Bertrand as their fullbacks next season. Hardly a significant upgrade.

They'll go all out for Mendy for left-back surely?

[Grobbelrevell]

They'll go all out for Mendy for left-back surely?

Latest reports are that they've baulked at the £40m asking price and are in talks with Southampton over Bertrand as an alternative.

Might well turn out to be a negotiating ploy though. We'll see.

[Dim Glas]

City baulking at fees? Hilarious. It's them that have done more than most to drive fees up.

[.adam]

I would imagine Bertrand would end up costing a similar amount to Mendy given the premium applied to English players.

[Kopenhagen]

Isn't Bertrand kind of similar to Clyne, a decent 7/10 guy? I figured Guardiola would want a more glamorous fullback for his attacking style.

[The North Bank]

Surprised they didnt go for Kolasinac, from what Im hearing , hed be an upgrade on Bertrand.

[SerbianScouser]

Isn't Bertrand kind of similar to Clyne, a decent 7/10 guy? I figured Guardiola would want a more glamorous fullback for his attacking style.

I find it very surprising as well. He needs his fullbacks to have winger qualities in the final third. Bertrand doesn't make much sense for a Pep team imo.

[Xabi Gerrard]

Isn't Bertrand kind of similar to Clyne, a decent 7/10 guy? I figured Guardiola would want a more glamorous fullback for his attacking style.

I know a lot of managers in the past have preferred to have one full back more attacking than the other, with the defensive player tucking in to make a back three when the marauding one attacks. Was Guardiola the same at Barca when he used Alves as his attacking full back and Abidal as his more conservative one?

I could be wrong. Worth baring in mind of course that Ryan Bertrand has played (and won) a Champions League final as a left winger, so he probably can offer something in the attacking third.

[PeterTheRed ...]

City baulking at fees? Hilarious. It's them that have done more than most to drive fees up.

We have already discussed this. They don't have unlimited transfer funds.

[Dim Glas]

We have already discussed this. They don't have unlimited transfer funds.

I swear you are doing it on purpose now

[Craig S]

I find it very surprising as well. He needs his fullbacks to have winger qualities in the final third. Bertrand doesn't make much sense for a Pep team imo.

He destroyed us in the SF 1st leg. I think he's a brilliant attacking full back.

[AshLFC]

Surprised they didnt go for Kolasinac, from what Im hearing , hed be an upgrade on Bertrand.

I wonder why we didn't if you're right....and he's free

[clinical]

I wonder why we didn't if you're right....and he's free

Really shocked we didn't aswell after the success of Matip and the fact we need a left back desperately.

[Dim Glas]

I wonder why we didn't if you're right....and he's free

I think he was joking, he's an Arsenal fan, big upping their new player Who knows if he's better, he's not played a minute in this league yet. We'll see next season. He was a good player in the Bundesliga though.

[The North Bank]

I think he was joking, he's an Arsenal fan, big upping their new player Who knows if he's better, he's not played a minute in this league yet. We'll see next season. He was a good player in the Bundesliga though.

 I dont know the player but Im hearing good things, from bundesliga experts in the media. City have Clichy and Kolarov and left back, we have gibbs and Monreal , and liverpool have Milner and Moreno?, so if hes anywhere near as good as the reports, and hes young, and free, I do wonder why there wasnt any competition to sign him, apart from a couple of italian clubs.
Bertrand would cost about 20m and hes hardly a world beater.
Mendy at Monaco looked excellent in CL last season, I would go for him if I was City and money is no object.

[PeterTheRed ...]

Really shocked we didn't aswell after the success of Matip and the fact we need a left back desperately.

To be honest, Matip is a much better player than Kolasinac.

[Goalposts for Jumpers]

To be honest, Matip is a much better player than Kolasinac.

Agree with this.

A few people mentioning him making a Bundesliga team of the year, but you've got to remember that Shalke have been in a mid-table battle this season, and he's probably stood out because he's aggressive and tough, and he popped up with a couple of crucial goals and assists. But, to me, he lacks a bit of class on the ball. His pass completion % for a defender is shocking - and might explain ours and City's lack of interest. He does whip in a mean cross, but i'm not sure he'll make the Arsenal starting 11 to be honest.

[Chakan]

[Phil M]

Aurier going the other way then? Alves is 10 years older than him. Strange.

[PeterTheRed ...]

I suspect this summer might turn into an interesting cock measuring contest between Qatar and UAE, especially considering the present political situation in the region. Sanchez might be the next on the agenda, with both Man City and PSG linked with him.

[Skeeve]

At first glance that sounds better than they offered me more money, but given that neither have come close to winning the CL, it actually equates to 'I chose the noncompetitive league for the easy title wins.'

[sinnermichael]

£50m for Kyle Walker. Madness.

[Dim Glas]

Guardiola and Mourinho are having their own little competition for King of the Chequebook Managers these last 2 summers.

[Red-Soldier]

Excess of 50m   

[disgraced cake]

Fucking madness. Buy that Mendy as well and it's over 100 odd million on full backs.

[DivisiveNewSigning]

Fucking madness. Buy that Mendy as well and it's over 100 odd million on full backs.

Best spender manager in the world.

[Sh0rty]

Absolutely unbelievable

[Keith Lard]

£50m on Kyle fucking Walker! World has officially gone mad ... Leipzig will now demand £200m for Keita.

Mental