Author Topic: Old photos of and around Liverpool (Read 846166 times)

gazzam1963 · « **Reply #1240 on:** July 9, 2012, 10:27:15 pm »

Bit late as the tunnels were last weeks theme , but I've been doing a bit of travelling through them this last month and what I've noticed is how bendy the queensway one is too it's younger counterpart which seems shorter and straighter . Any ideas why ?

The Gulleysucker · « **Reply #1241 on:** July 9, 2012, 10:49:07 pm »

Quote from: gazzam1963 on July 9, 2012, 10:27:15 pm

Bit late as the tunnels were last weeks theme , but I've been doing a bit of travelling through them this last month and what I've noticed is how bendy the queensway one is too it's younger counterpart which seems shorter and straighter . Any ideas why ?

Not too sure, but at a guess perhaps one of the reasons might be something to do with avoiding the Liverpool Birkenhead railway tunnel that was built a good while before.
I'll have to find a map that shows the route of all of them....

Big Red Richie · « **Reply #1242 on:** July 9, 2012, 10:54:02 pm »

To my knowledge, purely engineering of it's time. The reason the Queensway is so bendy in parts is purely to take advantage of the natural softer strata of rock to cut through, but also to slow down the gradent of the descent/rise. It meanders rather than cutting a straight path.

By the time you get to the 60s, the engineering and tunneling machines have evolved into all round better digging apparatus, which can cut a swathe through anything.

There again, maybe Gulley has the answer.

I do remember them mentioning it when I went on the tour a couple of years ago, but I can't remember the reasons given.

The Gulleysucker · « **Reply #1243 on:** July 9, 2012, 10:58:11 pm »

Quote from: Big Red Richie on July 9, 2012, 10:54:02 pm

Richie, Tsar and all interested, howsabout for the next theme we do the Liver building, construction, interior, as much as can be found together with any interesting anecdotes?

Big Red Richie · « **Reply #1244 on:** July 9, 2012, 11:00:33 pm »

I'm up for that one.

Sorry about last week. I give it this big speach blah, blah, blah, and was then ghosted into dereliction of duty. I had a lot on last week.

gazzam1963 · « **Reply #1245 on:** July 9, 2012, 11:21:41 pm »

Cheers boys for the answers , both make sense .

sharkeyb · « **Reply #1246 on:** July 9, 2012, 11:24:29 pm »

Yeah its definatly bendy because they didnt have the technology to cut though the harder rock to had to avoid it

The Gulleysucker · « **Reply #1247 on:** July 9, 2012, 11:46:11 pm »

Two possible answers....

For example, why are there bends in the tunnel? Because it had to swerve around rail tunnels at the Birkenhead end and avoid undermining some big buildings near the Liverpool waterfront.

from ...http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/mersey-tunnel-celebrates-with-sound-of-music-jonathan-foster-reports-on-plans-to-mark-the-diamond-jubilee-of-an-engineering-masterpiece-1413457.html

and

This bends because at the time it was built it was incorrectly thought that a straight tunnel would cause problems with wind blowing through it.

from here ... http://www.theanswerbank.co.uk/Travel/Question161853.html

But I think this needs further verification.

Big Red Richie · « **Reply #1248 on:** July 10, 2012, 01:29:53 pm »

Quote from: And Could He Play on July 8, 2012, 08:44:15 pm

anyone got any good imagine of the hidden liverbird?

By hidden, what do you refere?

Are you talking about the ones posted on the end of the last page, or something else? Please, share.

Just for a bit of info for you Liverbird hunters.

Mersey Chambers was built circa 1878, and I don't know if the liverbird on top was placed there immediately on completion of a short time there after.

The Bank Of Liverpool building, now known to many of you as The Sir Thomas Hotel, also has a Livebird.
I have it from a very good source(ex-member of staff) that in it's cellar is the original Liver Bird that either stood on the building, or more likely stood somewhere inside the bank reception area or board room, from when the building was built in 1882.

The Bank of Liverpool merged with Martins Bank circa 1914, and was eventually just changed to Martins Bank circs 1928.

The statue/sculpture is said to stand about 3 feet tall (unknown if it's cast bronze/lead, or stone/marble) and is protectively wrapped and stored in a secure area of the basement.

And Could He Play · « **Reply #1249 on:** July 10, 2012, 01:33:25 pm »

Quote from: Big Red Richie on July 10, 2012, 01:29:53 pm

By hidden, what do you refere?

Are you talking about the ones posted on the end of the last page, or something else? Please, share.

Just for a bit of info for you Liverbird hunters.

Mersey Chambers was built circa 1878, and I don't know if the liverbird on top was placed there immediately on completion of a short time there after.

The Bank Of Liverpool building, now known to many of you as The Sir Thomas Hotel, also has a Livebird.
I have it from a very good source(ex-member of staff) that in it's cellar is the original Liver Bird that either stood on the building, or more likely stood somewhere inside the bank reception area or board room, from when the building was built in 1882.

The Bank of Liverpool merged with Martins Bank circa 1914, and was eventually just changed to Martins Bank circs 1928.

The statue/sculpture is said to stand about 3 feet tall (unknown if it's cast bronze/lead, or stone/marble) and is protectively wrapped and stored in a secure area of the basement.

i remember hearing a story there is another one in the liver building somewhere, was also told about a bar/smoking room many man many years ago on the top floor where all the big solicitors, power people in liverpool would meet up for drinks and to conduct business.

Big Red Richie · « **Reply #1250 on:** July 10, 2012, 01:47:47 pm »

I've just found a photo of the Bank of Liverpool Liverbird. I'll scan and post it up later.

Tsar Kastik · « **Reply #1251 on:** July 10, 2012, 10:29:35 pm »

inside the clock chamber

And Could He Play · « **Reply #1252 on:** July 10, 2012, 10:37:56 pm »

ok i cant find anything on this bar in the liver building where the shipping merchants, lawyers etc used to drink

OLDIE · « **Reply #1253 on:** July 10, 2012, 10:43:13 pm »

Quote from: And Could He Play on July 10, 2012, 10:37:56 pm

ok i cant find anything on this bar in the liver building where the shipping merchants, lawyers etc used to drink

There were many bars but the most popular was Ma Boyles just of Water Street - between Reliance House & Tower Buildings

Big Red Richie · « **Reply #1254 on:** July 10, 2012, 10:52:06 pm »

Tsar. That looks like a set off a Fritz Lang prduction.

Metropolis - the missing footage.

And Could He Play · « **Reply #1255 on:** July 10, 2012, 10:55:18 pm »

Quote from: OLDIE on July 10, 2012, 10:43:13 pm

There were many bars but the most popular was Ma Boyles just of Water Street - between Reliance House & Tower Buildings

i was told it was actually on the top floor of the liver buildings, ill have to double check this.

The Gulleysucker · « **Reply #1256 on:** July 10, 2012, 11:02:46 pm »

Quote from: And Could He Play on July 10, 2012, 10:55:18 pm

i was told it was actually on the top floor of the liver buildings, ill have to double check this.

Do you mean the boardroom?

(the above is from quite a few from a tour here ... http://flickeflu.com/set/72157606299108624 some good shots of the ceiling detail and also from the roof)

And here's Queenie pooping in for a sarnie and a quick bevvie......

from here ... http://www.friendsofroyallyver.co.uk/

And Could He Play · « **Reply #1257 on:** July 10, 2012, 11:04:32 pm »

might have been actually. the guy made it out like it was a proper bar rea and you had to be well, a somebody to get in.

Tsar Kastik · « **Reply #1258 on:** July 14, 2012, 02:17:42 pm »

Booker maybe...April 1944

Tsar Kastik · « **Reply #1259 on:** July 14, 2012, 03:15:37 pm »

Another one, but they mention Queens Drive on the text with this

The Gulleysucker · « **Reply #1260 on:** July 14, 2012, 03:31:08 pm »

Quote from: Tsar Kastik on July 14, 2012, 03:15:37 pm

Another one, but they mention Queens Drive on the text with this

I'm not sure if that is Queens drive. You can just make out the Tram lines running in a 'Green lane' in the middle and I'm not sure Queens Drive ever had that though Bowring Park Road did which might vaguely make sense if they were heading off in Burtonwood direction. (Though I wonder, since those Lightnings in that pic were made by Lockheed, if they went to the Lockheed workshop at Speke first)

I'll dig out my Trams book and check and try to locate that.

Sir Capon of Debaser · « **Reply #1261 on:** July 14, 2012, 04:09:55 pm »

Does anyone have any pics of Renshaw Street from the 60s?

Dr. Beaker · « **Reply #1262 on:** July 14, 2012, 05:31:28 pm »

Quote from: sharkeyb on July 9, 2012, 11:24:29 pm

Yeah its definatly bendy because they didnt have the technology to cut though the harder rock to had to avoid it

When I was living up on the Wirral, there was this Scottish woman who frequented my local with her fella. She had previously been married, and one day she brought in her two beautiful grown-up daughters, both about 18 years old, and both black.

Everyone did a brilliant job of not saying anything stupid or indeed even giving the impression of being in the least bit surprised. She was obviously enjoying our discomfort, but even on subsequent occassions nobody ever brought the subject up, even when she wasn't there.

Then one night, when we were all pretty pissed, we must have been talking about religion or something, and the subject of muslims came up. She says, "Oh my dad was a muslim". The conversation came to a galloping standstill as we all grappled, in our pissed-up state with this latest piece in the puzzle, while she kept a pretty good straight face. Mercifully she then burst out laughing and told us that her dad came down to Liverpool originally because he was a tunnel-builder. He had previously worked on the tunnels into Mecca but only muslims were allowed into Mecca so they had all had to convert!

Tsar Kastik · « **Reply #1263 on:** July 15, 2012, 07:05:11 pm »

Once again, I don't know where

Big Red Richie · « **Reply #1264 on:** July 15, 2012, 07:33:23 pm »

Obviously the Dockers Umbrella in the background.

Dr. Beaker · « **Reply #1265 on:** July 15, 2012, 08:07:09 pm »

Quote from: Big Red Richie on July 15, 2012, 07:33:23 pm

Obviously the Dockers Umbrella in the background.

And some sort of funny first generation aeroplane thing that takes off sideways, in the foreground, unless my eyes are deceiving me.

Tsar Kastik · « **Reply #1266 on:** July 15, 2012, 08:19:05 pm »

When I first saw it I thought, 'easy Dock Rd by the grain silo'...but it's not. There's also something odd about that bus trailing them I reckon.

The Gulleysucker · « **Reply #1267 on:** July 16, 2012, 09:01:51 am »

Quote from: Tsar Kastik on July 15, 2012, 07:05:11 pm

Once again, I don't know where

Tsar, I'm trying to locate that one but the road in relation to the Overhead (if it is) doesn't seem right though I'll keep at it.

I've found several more of P47's in Liverpool scattered around...

Bubble P47's on HMS Puncher which berthed on 17th Oct 44

from here.

Razorbacks unloading from lighter

from here.

Razorback at the Pier Head

Much better resolution here.

and then what look like Bubbles

from here which says they are off to Burtonwood but who knows....

Razorbacks in the suburbs somewhere...

from here.
I wonder where that little girl that's watching is now, I guess she'd be around 75 today.

Razorbacks, possibly Speke according to the comments on Flikr

from here.

Note all the lorries are identical to the one in your photo and have RAF numberplates.

There are also two distinct variants of P47's in all these pictures which I've indicated.
Your photo, and some of the above, are of what was called the bubble canopy P47's which would date them mid 44 at the earliest onwards. The other older variant was called the razorback (once the bubble canopy came out) and would likely be pre mid '44.

Big Red Richie · « **Reply #1268 on:** July 16, 2012, 12:08:33 pm »

I still reckon if we scan for pictures of the Overhead Railway and docks, from mid 1940's backwards, and locate that particular building, you'll solve the location.

It deffo looks like the LOR behind the aircraft's 'tail' (Yes! the invisible tail )

Bearing in mind that the building is not of the red brick veriety, which most of the dock road is built of, so I would presume it's a 20th century building.

Find the building, you find the location.

Big Red Richie · « **Reply #1269 on:** July 16, 2012, 12:14:31 pm »

If you read the comments under the picture of the planes with the little girl in front of them:

nimrod 2010 (9 months ago | reply)

incredible a few days ago i was standing at this junction of booker av and melbreck rd i went back today had a look ,the studs which held the street sign booker avenue in place are just visible ,having been filled in . great photo

D. Sheley (9 months ago)

Are the houses the same? Or did they tear them down and build some ugle modern crap to replace them?

nimrod 2010 (9 months ago)

nothing has changed, trees are bigger houses all intact try google st view amazing. thinking out loud maybe thats why the p47 came this way the angle at the way there being transported they could not fit under the railway bridge at allerton because they were to wide .so they turned right of mather av down booker avenue

The Gulleysucker · « **Reply #1270 on:** July 16, 2012, 01:19:42 pm »

Quote from: Big Red Richie on July 16, 2012, 12:14:31 pm

If you read the comments under the picture ......

Cheers Richie, I missed them.

On the Tsar OHR one, I spent round 30 minutes this morning going through all the photo's I could glean for Silos on the docks and even went through all the OHR photo's I could find. As Tsar says, it's a weird one.
I do think it's the OHR, you can just make out the concrete bases of the supports in the road in the background, but as to where...
I've checked both North and South and I just can't find a building like that. I really don't think it's a Silo as there are windows on the floors but there is something nagging in the back of my mind about a building that used to be somewhere around where Tates was (not the Sugar silo) when you approached Exchange that looked similar but I could be mistaken and I just can't figure out if it was that, how it could be so near the OHR line and why the planes would even be going/coming from that direction unless the planes came in via the North docks.
It's an odd one alright.

Tsar Kastik · « **Reply #1271 on:** July 16, 2012, 01:29:09 pm »

Quote from: Big Red Richie on July 16, 2012, 12:08:33 pm

I still reckon if we scan for pictures of the Overhead Railway and docks, from mid 1940's backwards, and locate that particular building, you'll solve the location.

It deffo looks like the LOR behind the aircraft's 'tail' (Yes! the invisible tail )

Bearing in mind that the building is not of the red brick veriety, which most of the dock road is built of, so I would presume it's a 20th century building.

Find the building, you find the location.

The text that accompanied that pic...

The Gulleysucker · « **Reply #1272 on:** July 16, 2012, 01:50:23 pm »

Found the building. I'll post the location up in a minute or so....

Big Red Richie · « **Reply #1273 on:** July 16, 2012, 01:54:57 pm »

Nothing escapes the Gulleysucker. The all knowing, all seeing, being of the ether.

The Gulleysucker · « **Reply #1274 on:** July 16, 2012, 02:13:42 pm »

Argh, it's not.
I had a tiny photo of the south docks and spotted the Brunswick silo but it's all wrong when examined closely, the windows just don't match up.

This is frustrating....

Big Red Richie · « **Reply #1275 on:** July 16, 2012, 03:12:51 pm »

I'm still trying to find the location.

As an aside, I came across this ten minute film snippet from the 50s which is quite a good quick look.

It has nothing to do with our current search, by the way.

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/v/S-7EoTLJfR4?version=3" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer" class="bbc_link bbc_flash_disabled new_win">http://www.youtube.com/v/S-7EoTLJfR4?version=3</a>

Aww bollocks ^^^

Try this.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=S-7EoTLJfR4

Tsar Kastik · « **Reply #1276 on:** July 16, 2012, 03:44:39 pm »

Quote from: The Gulleysucker on July 16, 2012, 02:13:42 pm

Argh, it's not.
I had a tiny photo of the south docks and spotted the Brunswick silo but it's all wrong when examined closely, the windows just don't match up.

This is frustrating....

That was what threw me off my original thinking,

Tsar Kastik · « **Reply #1277 on:** July 16, 2012, 04:58:59 pm »

maybe..from 3.20ish on here, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ibhmF50GFKk&feature=related

The Gulleysucker · « **Reply #1278 on:** July 16, 2012, 05:36:01 pm »

Quote from: Tsar Kastik on July 16, 2012, 04:58:59 pm

maybe..from 3.20ish on here, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ibhmF50GFKk&feature=related

I think that crossing has got to be the one on Regents Road (no streetview at that point!) around here on Earth.

Looks like the building may have been demolished since that video.

What I still find odd is in that original photo, the convoy appears to be heading south along the road, which is odd as Speke and Burtonwood are to the south. I would have thought they would come from the south so I wonder if they had possibly come a round-a-bout via the East Lancs and then down to Marsh Lane onto Rimrose to avoid clogging up the traffic on Regents too much?

But interesting vid, 4 x class 20's.... as a kid in the 60's I always wanted to see one of them but they never seemed to come Merseyside.

I think most of them have been withdrawn and scrapped now except for possibly weedkiller trains and novelty acts, certainly haven't seen any for a good few years now.

Tsar Kastik · « **Reply #1279 on:** July 16, 2012, 05:56:34 pm »

It looks like they shipped in planes to the north docks as well; I know these are RAF, but it shows that Gladstone dock (I think) had the capabilities.

thanks to Johnnyblue c/o Yo