Author Topic: since when did ? (Read 8135 times)

docker · « **on:** February 18, 2008, 11:06:39 pm »

reaching a final count towards a managers credits ? or maintaing a champions league position?
this is starting to really piss me off, its only being used by those trying to justify the failings of rafa,so why is it being used as an achievement, it means sweet f.a to a season ticket/auto cup scheme member only if you win,i mean walking back to a bus with a purple wristband after athens,do you think we classed getting there as a victory,no chance,and neither should anyone else use it either,?

do you use paisley reaching the fa cup just days before our greatest night in rome,do you bollocks,or shanklys trip to hampden park,and theres more,but we dont use them?

??

anon-y-mouse · « **Reply #1 on:** February 18, 2008, 11:07:41 pm »

Party Phil · « **Reply #2 on:** February 18, 2008, 11:07:52 pm »

BCCC · « **Reply #3 on:** February 18, 2008, 11:09:26 pm »

Clowns to the left of me, Jokers to the right here I am...

Sir Capon of Debaser · « **Reply #4 on:** February 18, 2008, 11:14:08 pm »

The Bill Hicks Appreciation Society · « **Reply #5 on:** February 18, 2008, 11:14:24 pm »

no not a victory but it's an achievement, in that it was 90 minutes away from a sixth european cup. Even getting to a final of this magnitude is an achievement... okay it may not seem it for us having been to 2 in 3 years but i'm sure Ferguson would have liked another crack at it.

It's used simply as a gauge of how good a manager Rafa Benitez is. In 3 years (yes I know you've heard it all before but you're obviously not listening) he's won two major trophies. I don't think anyone would have seriously expected him to do that, his youth teams have won two youth f.a cups back to back which demonstrates the quality of his young purchases.

Rafa is building a dynasty not just a quick fix, as Shanks was allowed to do.

LFCfan4Life · « **Reply #6 on:** February 18, 2008, 11:14:51 pm »

did any other manager come runner up in 2007?

did they manage to beat Barcalona 1-2 away, beat PSV(the team that kicked arsenal out) and Chelsea

and make it to the final thats no fluke mate?

did they play Lille and Roma and then get kicked out by the only decent opposition

and atleast the people walking out with that purple band got a chance to be there no LFC before 2005 had that for the prior 20 years

Mighty_Red · « **Reply #7 on:** February 18, 2008, 11:15:26 pm »

Quote from: docker on February 18, 2008, 11:06:39 pm

reaching a final count towards a managers credits ? or maintaing a champions league position?
this is starting to really piss me off, its only being used by those trying to justify the failings of rafa,so why is it being used as an achievement, it means sweet f.a to a season ticket/auto cup scheme member only if you win,i mean walking back to a bus with a purple wristband after athens,do you think we classed getting there as a victory,no chance,and neither should anyone else use it either,?

The whole point was not that we reached a "random" final, we achieved it twice in 3 seasons. It proved that 2005 was no fluke, and we are capable of reaching (and winning) CL finals. The fact that not many clubs reach the final means that it is an achievement in itself, but getting to two means it can't be all miracles and luck

At the end of day, its all about whether you want to present a positive positve spin on achievements or a negative

Serenity · « **Reply #8 on:** February 18, 2008, 11:32:10 pm »

Quote from: docker on February 18, 2008, 11:06:39 pm

reaching a final count towards a managers credits ? or maintaing a champions league position?
this is starting to really piss me off, its only being used by those trying to justify the failings of rafa,so why is it being used as an achievement, it means sweet f.a to a season ticket/auto cup scheme member only if you win,i mean walking back to a bus with a purple wristband after athens,do you think we classed getting there as a victory,no chance,and neither should anyone else use it either,?

do you use paisley reaching the fa cup just days before our greatest night in rome,do you bollocks,or shanklys trip to hampden park,and theres more,but we dont use them???

It would have been the same had we gone out in the group stages

Oddball · « **Reply #9 on:** February 18, 2008, 11:35:57 pm »

Cob from TIA · « **Reply #10 on:** February 18, 2008, 11:37:22 pm »

Quote from: docker on February 18, 2008, 11:06:39 pm

since when did reaching a final count towards a managers credits ?

... since the number finals reached by his team in a particular competition (in this case the Champions League) inside three seasons equals the total number of appearances in the final of the same competition for all other clubs from the same country in the previous twenty years.

If you mean a manager's reputation/standing when you say 'credits' that is.

StuH · « **Reply #11 on:** February 18, 2008, 11:52:32 pm »

Fucking boring all of these bollocks threads.

If the internet and 24 sports coverage existed in 1968/69, Shankly would have got the sack.

inq80 · « **Reply #12 on:** February 18, 2008, 11:55:34 pm »

Quote from: StuH on February 18, 2008, 11:52:32 pm

If the internet and 24 sports coverage existed in 1968/69, Shankly would have got the sack.

sumed up nicely - in fact that's going in my sig

Libero · « **Reply #13 on:** February 19, 2008, 12:26:26 am »

Quote from: LFCfan4Life on February 18, 2008, 11:14:51 pm

did any other manager come runner up in 2007?

did they manage to beat Barcalona 1-2 away, beat PSV(the team that kicked arsenal out) and Chelsea

and make it to the final thats no fluke mate?

did they play Lille and Roma and then get kicked out by the only decent opposition

and atleast the people walking out with that purple band got a chance to be there no LFC before 2005 had that for the prior 20 years

Terrific post mate. Alas, it's wasted on these people like docker i suspect.

Billy The Kid · « **Reply #14 on:** February 19, 2008, 12:31:47 am »

Poor Rafa just cant win can he? RAWK thread titles are getting more and more like gutter press headlines.

Guz-kop · « **Reply #15 on:** February 19, 2008, 12:32:11 am »

The way we handled our group and topped it with relative ease

The way we dusted ourselves down from being a goal down in the Nou Camp to hang in there long enough to equalise at HT and then having the bollocks to nick the winner. All before we battered them for 45mins at Anfield.

The way we brushed PSV aside with a clinical performance in Eindhoven

The way we played shit in the first leg against Chelsea but battled through (largely thanks to Pepe "Doesn't make many saves" Reina) enough to allow Danny Agger, overwhelmed in the first leg, to score the vital goal for us before we went toe to toe with Chelsea (as opposed to camping in our half for 85 minutes).

The way we controlled posession and didn't look shit scared in Athens against Milan

I dunno about you but the way we matured and progressed as a team in the European Cup last year, for me, was fucking impressive. It without a doubt saved our season last year but in terms of mentality and style of play for Europe, was a huge step in the right direction despite our obvious shortcomings in the final. It was as important as some of the league form we showed in the last two-thirds of the league 2005/6 season IMO

smithy · « **Reply #16 on:** February 19, 2008, 12:35:06 am »

Lucky bastard, getting a wristband

redman1977 · « **Reply #17 on:** February 19, 2008, 12:35:43 am »

I swear they have installed computers for patients in Ashworth hospital

Alf · « **Reply #18 on:** February 19, 2008, 12:40:38 am »

Since when did starting another thread on a subject covered in a half dozen threads on here already justify starting another one. This is starting to really piss me off.

Fat Scouser · « **Reply #19 on:** February 19, 2008, 12:48:17 am »

Quote from: docker on February 18, 2008, 11:06:39 pm

reaching a final count towards a managers credits ? or maintaing a champions league position?
this is starting to really piss me off, its only being used by those trying to justify the failings of rafa,so why is it being used as an achievement, it means sweet f.a to a season ticket/auto cup scheme member only if you win,i mean walking back to a bus with a purple wristband after athens,do you think we classed getting there as a victory,no chance,and neither should anyone else use it either,?

do you use paisley reaching the fa cup just days before our greatest night in rome,do you bollocks,or shanklys trip to hampden park,and theres more,but we dont use them???

Err, yeah. I do use Paisley's Fa Cup final. I know loads of other lads that do an all. And rightly so. To get that close to the treble was an incredible achievement. And saying that, so is Rafa's 2 CL finals in 3 seasons. So, if you want to have a go at Rafa, do so by all means. But for fucks sake, at least attack him for his failings and not his achievements.

RJH · « **Reply #20 on:** February 19, 2008, 01:15:28 am »

Quote from: docker on February 18, 2008, 11:06:39 pm

reaching a final count towards a managers credits ? or maintaing a champions league position?
this is starting to really piss me off, its only being used by those trying to justify the failings of rafa,so why is it being used as an achievement, it means sweet f.a to a season ticket/auto cup scheme member only if you win,i mean walking back to a bus with a purple wristband after athens,do you think we classed getting there as a victory,no chance,and neither should anyone else use it either,?

do you use paisley reaching the fa cup just days before our greatest night in rome,do you bollocks,or shanklys trip to hampden park,and theres more,but we dont use them???

Look at it the other way. Does not reaching finals count against a manager? or failing to maintain a champs league position? Obviously it does. So why can't the opposite apply?
The phrase "first is first, second is nowhere" doesn't really apply. If getting to the final isn't worth anything, then it's the same as getting knocked out in the first round. Presumably it only counts if you actually win.
By the same logic, winning the Premier League is what matters, and if a manager doesn't win it, it doesn't matter whether the team finishes 2nd or 17th.

althered68 · « **Reply #21 on:** February 19, 2008, 01:27:13 am »

My God, where will it end?! These types of threads actually picking holes in a European campaign that saw us beat Barca away and overcome Chelsea again are absolutley fucking unbelievable.

Whoever it was that made the comment about Shankly getting sacked if there was an internet and Slysports in 68'-69' was fucking spot on.

Maybe Rafa's tenure is coming to an end, maybe it isn't, but for Christ's sake how ridiculous are we going to get here?!

Trousers · « **Reply #22 on:** February 19, 2008, 01:39:28 am »

It's only docker.
It's a bit like Michael Jackson's doctor commenting on what makes a good plastic surgeon.

seattlered · « **Reply #23 on:** February 19, 2008, 05:52:56 am »

Boutros Boutros Ghali?

Party Phil · « **Reply #24 on:** February 19, 2008, 07:23:33 am »

yeah, since when has a champions league final appearance been the saving grace of a manager who'd won no silverware and finished 4th in the league two years in a row?

*cough* Arsene Wenger *cough*

Sasquatch · « **Reply #25 on:** February 19, 2008, 07:47:09 am »

Quote from: althered68 on February 19, 2008, 01:27:13 am

Whoever it was that made the comment about Shankly getting sacked if there was an internet and Slysports in 68'-69' was fucking spot on.

I disagree. I would say the '69/70 season. LOL.

TheInquisition · « **Reply #26 on:** February 19, 2008, 07:59:25 am »

1983 F.A. Cup

Liverpool 2 Brighton and Hove Albion 3.

At Anfield.

Sack Paisley....finished fifth one year too. Honest to God Sky Sports Warriors he did!

7777 · « **Reply #27 on:** February 19, 2008, 08:03:22 am »

we gain so many whoppers supporting us?

TheInquisition · « **Reply #28 on:** February 19, 2008, 08:16:59 am »

Indeed we do..by the way my first game was Oldham 1977 F.A. Cup ....."Whopper" of a game.

Now if anyone does not understand the irony of my earlier post then you really should educate yourself into The Liverpool Way.

RTK - Reclaim The Klub.

Wools out.

ArcticRed · « **Reply #29 on:** February 19, 2008, 08:20:29 am »

I tend to wonder...
if we had won the Prem in 2005... and finished close second in 2007... while at the same time getting stomped by the mid-range euro teams in the group stages of the CL every year... would these promoters of the "the Prem is the end all, be all. CL means nothing"-view have been any happier? Part of me thinks "Nah! They would then be whining about our bad runs and lack of trophies in Europe". Funny thing is... the other part is thinking the same.

oh, and Hi!, btw. Long time lurker, recent sign-up

jimmy d · « **Reply #30 on:** February 19, 2008, 08:24:17 am »

Quote from: StuH on February 18, 2008, 11:52:32 pm

Fucking boring all of these bollocks threads.

Sasquatch · « **Reply #31 on:** February 19, 2008, 08:30:02 am »

Quote from: ArcticRed on February 19, 2008, 08:20:29 am

I tend to wonder...
if we had won the Prem in 2005... and finished close second in 2007... while at the same time getting stomped by the mid-range euro teams in the group stages of the CL every year... would these promoters of the "the Prem is the end all, be all. CL means nothing"-view have been any happier? Part of me thinks "Nah! They would then be whining about our bad runs and lack of trophies in Europe". Funny thing is... the other part is thinking the same.

oh, and Hi!, btw. Long time lurker, recent sign-up

Howdy and welcome. Your point is a good one.

crealism · « **Reply #32 on:** February 19, 2008, 08:58:49 am »

Then what else counts?

BrettD · « **Reply #33 on:** February 19, 2008, 09:01:18 am »

Can a mod change his name to cocker?

Kemlyn 28 · « **Reply #34 on:** February 19, 2008, 10:26:42 am »

Quote from: The Bill Hicks Appreciation Society on February 18, 2008, 11:14:24 pm

It's used simply as a gauge of how good a manager Rafa Benitez is. In 3 years (yes I know you've heard it all before but you're obviously not listening) he's won two major trophies. I don't think anyone would have seriously expected him to do that, his youth teams have won two youth f.a cups back to back which demonstrates the quality of his young purchases.

Only time will tell if those FA youth cup wins mean anything,producing players for the first team or selling players on and earning the club money are what counts.

Quote from: ArcticRed on February 19, 2008, 08:20:29 am

I tend to wonder...
if we had won the Prem in 2005... and finished close second in 2007... while at the same time getting stomped by the mid-range euro teams in the group stages of the CL every year... would these promoters of the "the Prem is the end all, be all. CL means nothing"-view have been any happier? Part of me thinks "Nah! They would then be whining about our bad runs and lack of trophies in Europe". Funny thing is... the other part is thinking the same.

oh, and Hi!, btw. Long time lurker, recent sign-up

No most of us recognise that the league is the most important and always should be.As a season ticket holder I put the money up front to watch 19 league games and hopefully for the team to put in 100% effort in every one of them,Europe is a bonus,a nice one admittedly.The C/L is a farce,unlike the European Cup proper when you actually had to win the league to earn the right to play in it.

Slick_Beef · « **Reply #35 on:** February 19, 2008, 10:31:41 am »

Since this -

We didn't win that day but we still appreciate that he got us there in the first place, and gave us a chance.

banksybanks · « **Reply #36 on:** February 19, 2008, 10:44:12 am »

Did Bobby Robson not get a knighthood shortly after getting to the WC semi's in 1990? I may be wrong, but didn't getting to a couple of finals save Bryan Robson's job when he got Boro relegated?

mulfella · « **Reply #37 on:** February 19, 2008, 10:52:44 am »

Quote from: docker on February 18, 2008, 11:06:39 pm

reaching a final count towards a managers credits ?

The "Special one" missed out twice.

Uncle Ronnie · « **Reply #38 on:** February 19, 2008, 10:55:37 am »

Given our recent history I would have thought 2 European Cup Finals in 3 years was impressive, apparently not. Or perhaps you've been asleep since 1990

*whispers* We've been crap for 15 years

WOOLTONIAN · « **Reply #39 on:** February 19, 2008, 10:56:30 am »

Quote from: StuH on February 18, 2008, 11:52:32 pm

Fucking boring all of these bollocks threads.

If the internet and 24 sports coverage existed in 1968/69, Shankly would have got the sack.

If it wasn't for the support of TV Williams Shanks would have got the sack.
It seems to me that Docker is only saying what Bill said himself.
"1st is everything 2nd is nothing "