Author Topic: Arsenal: Top of the divers league  (Read 375857 times)

Offline Bullet500

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Re: Arsenal: Top of the divers league
« Reply #7440 on: April 17, 2024, 07:40:47 am »
Arsenal spent decent amount of money in every window since Wenger left, but that's not the support that a manager needs. I'm on the outside, so I don't pretend to know, but it seemed that the club structure was not established, the manager didn't have the necessary input on players and style, and he definitely wasn't given enough time to stamp his image on the club. Could be wrong though...
All the points you mentioned are true. Those are the first things Arteta fixed. He won the power struggle and forced Raul Sanllehi out because he did not want to deal with Sanllehi's favourite agents. btw, we spent money during Wenger's later years too (except one season where we REALLY had to but all we got was Petr Cech for free) and our recruitment was generally terrible.

I am sure Emery would have wanted to fix these things, but I think he would have fared better if he were fluent in English. The environment at the club was unfavourable and being a bit of a schemer is sometimes a necessity in corporate politics.

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Re: Arsenal: Top of the divers league
« Reply #7441 on: April 17, 2024, 07:54:16 am »
So spurs fans celebrated villa beating us even if it meant villa will get 4th, and will today celebrate bayern beating us even if it means no 5 CL places and Spurs go to europa.

They need to remember that when they next moan about Levy not having ambition.

Offline JRed

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Re: Arsenal: Top of the divers league
« Reply #7442 on: April 17, 2024, 07:56:38 am »
So spurs fans celebrated villa beating us even if it meant villa will get 4th, and will today celebrate bayern beating us even if it means no 5 CL places and Spurs go to europa.

They need to remember that when they next moan about Levy not having ambition.
Nobody wants to see Odourgard taking a photo of Arteta lifting a trophy tho. So I can understand where the spurs fans are coming from.

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Re: Arsenal: Top of the divers league
« Reply #7443 on: April 17, 2024, 07:59:09 am »
As I said previously, Emery is a very good coach. However, what we’re seeing with Emery is people projecting rather than the reality. What he’s shown is that he’s a very good manager in European football, winning Europa League, getting to finals and even taking Villarreal to semi final of Champions League. However, in all his time as a manager, he’s never won a domestic competition outside of PSG, and anyone can make PSG win stuff, even Poch. And he’s never shown outside of Paris that he can win 28-30 games that’s needed to win the Premier League.

What we see is that he’s a very good tactician, as can be seen by his European record. This can translate to individual games in the Premier League, like we’ve seen from him vs Arsenal and Man City in the past. But we’ve also seen that from other coaches before. But getting that drive to you players, that level of consistency to get win after win after win, week after week, is very difficult to do in this league. Arteta has shown that he can get mighty close to it. Emery has not, so yeah, as much as I like Emery, I’m happy just now with Arteta.

Before Barca psg game yesterday they showed the 0-4 6-1 CL tie when Barca turned around that tie, didnt know Emery was PSG manager at the time till they showed him slumped on the sidelines. Its typical Emery, capable of big results but often follows it up with disastrous results, thats why he wont challenge for serious league titles where you need to win 10 in a row just to stay in contention. Villa 3 weeks ago lost 4-0 at home to Spurs, who lost 4-0 away to Newcastle. Theres a lot of inconsistency below the top 3 and thats Emerys place. Still doing amazing because villa were relegation certainties when he joined, but he has a ceiling that rules him out of the top positions for me. Thats why he wasnt right for Arsenal, you cant ride getting beat at home 4-0, villa has lesser expectations so suits him well.
« Last Edit: April 17, 2024, 08:00:52 am by The North Bank »

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Re: Arsenal: Top of the divers league
« Reply #7444 on: April 17, 2024, 08:05:25 am »
Tall order today, having to win away at Bayern, still our best chance of a trophy because at least its in our hands still.

Offline UntouchableLuis

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Re: Arsenal: Top of the divers league
« Reply #7445 on: April 17, 2024, 08:22:18 am »
I respect what Arsenal have done over the last few years- in a normal footballing landscape they'd probably win a title but like us, you might get 1 title in 10 attempts if you're lucky as you can only lose maybe 1 or 2 games a season and draw no more than 2 or 3 games.

We need to invest now as we still have a better squad but we will be losing a lot of our spine (VVD, Salah) whereas Arsenal have their spine but need to add depth, which is easier.
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Re: Arsenal: Top of the divers league
« Reply #7446 on: April 17, 2024, 08:31:45 am »
No way should Arsenal fans be regretful of having Emery over Arteta. Emery is a good manager and Arteta still has to prove that he can win the big trophies, but Arteta has now got his team playing in a style that could win this league.

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Re: Arsenal: Top of the divers league
« Reply #7447 on: April 17, 2024, 09:14:08 am »
I respect what Arsenal have done over the last few years- in a normal footballing landscape they'd probably win a title but like us, you might get 1 title in 10 attempts if you're lucky as you can only lose maybe 1 or 2 games a season and draw no more than 2 or 3 games.

We need to invest now as we still have a better squad but we will be losing a lot of our spine (VVD, Salah) whereas Arsenal have their spine but need to add depth, which is easier.

We need 3 starters ourselves. Firstly we need a goal scorer, i dont think any of our players are in the top 10 scorers in the league, so a forward that scores goals is a priority for me. Secondly we need a holding midfielder , Jorginho has been great but his legs are going and is struggling now , left him out against villa and the link between defence and midfield wasnt there. Thirdly we need a left back, he should already be at the club in Timber but after a whole season out itll be a challenge to get back to the player we had.

Offline Mahern

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Re: Arsenal: Top of the divers league
« Reply #7448 on: April 17, 2024, 09:48:12 am »
We need 3 starters ourselves. Firstly we need a goal scorer, i dont think any of our players are in the top 10 scorers in the league, so a forward that scores goals is a priority for me. Secondly we need a holding midfielder , Jorginho has been great but his legs are going and is struggling now , left him out against villa and the link between defence and midfield wasnt there. Thirdly we need a left back, he should already be at the club in Timber but after a whole season out itll be a challenge to get back to the player we had.

Is Rice not a holding midfielder? Partey? or you are talking about depth?

How many left backs do Arsenal want?

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Re: Arsenal: Top of the divers league
« Reply #7449 on: April 17, 2024, 09:53:16 am »
Rice has done his best work as a box to box midfielder. Don't think he passes the ball through the lines well enough to be a number 6 in this Arsenal set up hence Jorginho playing there.

Offline deano2727

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Re: Arsenal: Top of the divers league
« Reply #7450 on: April 17, 2024, 09:57:47 am »
Huge game for them tonight. If they go out tonight and fail to win the league, they're in the position of it being a disappointing season after all the promise of the season so far.

Offline ScottishGoon

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Re: Arsenal: Top of the divers league
« Reply #7451 on: April 17, 2024, 10:13:31 am »
Is Rice not a holding midfielder? Partey? or you are talking about depth?

How many left backs do Arsenal want?

We basically need a Jorginho / Partey replacement with legs. Someone that can play through the lines. I don't know if you want to call it a 6 or an 8, because i think in our system they can dovetail depending on the game situation, as long as both midfielders compliment each other. Zubimendi seems mentioned a lot. Your lad Mac Alister would have probably been a great partner for Rice.

Left back has been a bit of a shitshow this season. We have the numbers, but none of the fit one's are ideal. As TNB says, the feeling is that's why Timber was purchased, he should be able to defend better than Zinchenko, but build better than Kiwior or Tomiyasu. However, he's another one that's a centre back by trade, so it remained to be seen how he did there long term, never mind coming off the back of an ACL injury.

And yeah, still looking for that reliable goalscorer. Jesus knee is a real worry, and he isn't it anyway. Havertz has done well up there, but he isn't it either. As much as he is still a good player to have in the squad, i dont think he's 'the answer' either, so in terms of fee and wages, that's a bit disappointing still.  We lack pace at times as well with no Marinelli, don't really have a threat in behind at all.

« Last Edit: April 17, 2024, 10:31:07 am by ScottishGoon »

Offline Redley

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Re: Arsenal: Top of the divers league
« Reply #7452 on: April 17, 2024, 10:29:46 am »
As I said previously, Emery is a very good coach. However, what we’re seeing with Emery is people projecting rather than the reality. What he’s shown is that he’s a very good manager in European football, winning Europa League, getting to finals and even taking Villarreal to semi final of Champions League. However, in all his time as a manager, he’s never won a domestic competition outside of PSG, and anyone can make PSG win stuff, even Poch. And he’s never shown outside of Paris that he can win 28-30 games that’s needed to win the Premier League.

What we see is that he’s a very good tactician, as can be seen by his European record. This can translate to individual games in the Premier League, like we’ve seen from him vs Arsenal and Man City in the past. But we’ve also seen that from other coaches before. But getting that drive to you players, that level of consistency to get win after win after win, week after week, is very difficult to do in this league. Arteta has shown that he can get mighty close to it. Emery has not, so yeah, as much as I like Emery, I’m happy just now with Arteta.

There's surely an aspect of never really managing a side that was expected to challenge domestically (and I wouldnt hold not winning a domestic cup against him particularly). Valencia, Sevilla and Villareal are never realistically going to win La Liga these days. And same with Arsenal and Villa. You guys at the time were absolutely nowhere, a shitshow through the club. Thats been somewhat rectified, but again I really wouldn't hold it against him that he didn't win domestically. He took Valencia back into the CL and then put both Sevilla and Villareal on the map in terms of winning the Europa League. And now doing very well at Villa.

I'm actually surprised he's never had a proper chance at a properly big club, he's a good coach. I was a bit in awe watching them play out from the back on Sunday.

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Re: Arsenal: Top of the divers league
« Reply #7453 on: April 17, 2024, 10:30:45 am »
How do Arsenal fans feel about finishing second? Is there any discussion among them about the potential for City to be stripped titles/docked points in the future?

If there's one good thing to come out of the last 10 disastrous days as a Liverpool fan, it is that maybe with a second club about to be robbed of multiple titles by City, it might start getting more attention from the media. I get the impression the mainstream media don't really care about Liverpool but might about Arsenal.

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Re: Arsenal: Top of the divers league
« Reply #7454 on: April 17, 2024, 10:31:12 am »
I hope Havertz scores tonight so I get to listen to his chant. Must be amongst my favourite ones these days. ;D

It's a great chant. I wonder where they got the inspiration

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Re: Arsenal: Top of the divers league
« Reply #7455 on: April 17, 2024, 10:35:26 am »
Tall order today, having to win away at Bayern, still our best chance of a trophy because at least its in our hands still.

It’s not for everyone.

To be fair you only need a draw and 5 good penalties!

Offline ScottishGoon

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Re: Arsenal: Top of the divers league
« Reply #7456 on: April 17, 2024, 10:44:50 am »
There's surely an aspect of never really managing a side that was expected to challenge domestically (and I wouldnt hold not winning a domestic cup against him particularly). Valencia, Sevilla and Villareal are never realistically going to win La Liga these days. And same with Arsenal and Villa. You guys at the time were absolutely nowhere, a shitshow through the club. Thats been somewhat rectified, but again I really wouldn't hold it against him that he didn't win domestically. He took Valencia back into the CL and then put both Sevilla and Villareal on the map in terms of winning the Europa League. And now doing very well at Villa.

I'm actually surprised he's never had a proper chance at a properly big club, he's a good coach. I was a bit in awe watching them play out from the back on Sunday.

Yeah, there's defo that, and listen, if he gets another chance at a big big club, he could well go on to prove me wrong, i wouldn't be utterly shocked if he did to be honest. He probably deserves that chance, most defo. But the other question is, why is he never really in the conversation for these jobs? There's some big jobs coming up in the summer. Liverpool, Bayern, Barca at the very least, but i dont think i've seen him linked with any?

My main problem is people looking at his record and just assuming he would better Arteta. He might have, we'll never know. My gut feeling though is that he'd have maybe won us a Europa League, and we'd be battling for 3rd or 4th place. Some might argue that is bettering Arteta as that's at least winning something. But i'd rather have a team that's good enough to challenge for titles, hoping that because of that quality, a cup or 2 along the way would eventually come.

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Re: Arsenal: Top of the divers league
« Reply #7457 on: April 17, 2024, 11:22:35 am »
How do Arsenal fans feel about finishing second? Is there any discussion among them about the potential for City to be stripped titles/docked points in the future?

If there's one good thing to come out of the last 10 disastrous days as a Liverpool fan, it is that maybe with a second club about to be robbed of multiple titles by City, it might start getting more attention from the media. I get the impression the mainstream media don't really care about Liverpool but might about Arsenal.

No , no one believes City will get any punishment.

Offline Kopenhagen

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Re: Arsenal: Top of the divers league
« Reply #7458 on: April 17, 2024, 01:10:44 pm »
I suppose with the focus on Abu Dhabi and KSA, this issue isn't mentioned, but Arsenal's partnership with Paul Kagame's Rwanda, one of the worst police states in the world, is truly reprehensible, and it's made its way into the news for once:

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2024/apr/17/rwanda-president-paul-kagame-arsenal-game-30-years-genocide

If anyone wants to learn more, I'd recommend Do Not Disturb by Michela Wrong.
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Offline ScottishGoon

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Re: Arsenal: Top of the divers league
« Reply #7459 on: April 17, 2024, 02:34:30 pm »
I suppose with the focus on Abu Dhabi and KSA, this issue isn't mentioned, but Arsenal's partnership with Paul Kagame's Rwanda, one of the worst police states in the world, is truly reprehensible, and it's made its way into the news for once:

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2024/apr/17/rwanda-president-paul-kagame-arsenal-game-30-years-genocide

If anyone wants to learn more, I'd recommend Do Not Disturb by Michela Wrong.

Wont pretend to know to much about the rights and wrongs. I know it's not just Arsenal Visit Rwanda have a partnership with, Bayern Munich & PSG do to, i assume that clubs have done their homework about the tie ups?
« Last Edit: April 17, 2024, 02:37:01 pm by ScottishGoon »

Offline stewil007

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Re: Arsenal: Top of the divers league
« Reply #7460 on: April 17, 2024, 02:43:32 pm »
Wont pretend to know to much about the rights and wrongs. I know it's not just Arsenal Visit Rwanda have a partnership with, Bayern Munich & PSG do to, i assume that clubs have done their homework about the tie ups?

or done a pro and cons table on the amount of cash it brings in.........

PRO : shit load of cash
CON : bit of a dodgy regime


Offline ScottishGoon

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Re: Arsenal: Top of the divers league
« Reply #7461 on: April 17, 2024, 02:50:28 pm »
or done a pro and cons table on the amount of cash it brings in.........

PRO : shit load of cash
CON : bit of a dodgy regime

Probably right. Remember our current outgoing Chief Exec was duped into a partnership a few years ago a few years ago by fraudsters claiming to work for BYD!

https://www.sportspromedia.com/news/arsenal-sponsor-fraud-byd-china/

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Re: Arsenal: Top of the divers league
« Reply #7462 on: April 17, 2024, 03:27:10 pm »
I suppose with the focus on Abu Dhabi and KSA, this issue isn't mentioned, but Arsenal's partnership with Paul Kagame's Rwanda, one of the worst police states in the world, is truly reprehensible, and it's made its way into the news for once:

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2024/apr/17/rwanda-president-paul-kagame-arsenal-game-30-years-genocide

If anyone wants to learn more, I'd recommend Do Not Disturb by Michela Wrong.

Paul Kagame’s Ruwanda? Could be worse I suppose. Could be Rishi Sunaks Britain.

Offline Bullet500

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Re: Arsenal: Top of the divers league
« Reply #7463 on: April 17, 2024, 05:36:58 pm »
Tall order today, having to win away at Bayern, still our best chance of a trophy because at least its in our hands still.
Bayern does not have their full squad.

Gnabry and Coman are out. Davies is suspended. Sane isn't 100% if Tuchel is to be believed.

Arsenal needs to perform and win.

Offline JRed

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Re: Arsenal: Top of the divers league
« Reply #7464 on: April 17, 2024, 06:05:52 pm »
Can see Harry getting a hatrick tonight.

Offline deano2727

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Re: Arsenal: Top of the divers league
« Reply #7465 on: April 17, 2024, 06:06:22 pm »
Bayern does not have their full squad.

Gnabry and Coman are out. Davies is suspended. Sane isn't 100% if Tuchel is to be believed.

Arsenal needs to perform and win.

Taking that into consideration, you really should be progressing - particularly if Sane also doesn't start.

Offline Kopenhagen

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Re: Arsenal: Top of the divers league
« Reply #7466 on: April 17, 2024, 06:23:28 pm »
Wont pretend to know to much about the rights and wrongs. I know it's not just Arsenal Visit Rwanda have a partnership with, Bayern Munich & PSG do to, i assume that clubs have done their homework about the tie ups?

The West gives them a free hand due to collective guilt around the 1993 genocide; but the regime is odious and has sought to whitewash its image through Visit Rwanda and other such initiatives. They've chased down political opponents and executed them in other countries numerous times. Any pushback inside Britain is unlikely due to this shocking migrant deal between Sunak and Kagame. They've also stoked a serious conflict in the eastern DRC through their funding of the M23 militia, which is essentially a death squad opposed to the government.

Anyway, obviously it's a money thing. Kagame is an Arsenal fan.

https://www.theguardian.com/news/2019/jan/15/rwanda-who-killed-patrick-karegeya-exiled-spy-chief

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2021/feb/22/exiled-rwandan-opposition-politician-shot-dead-in-cape-town

https://www.hrw.org/news/2023/02/06/dr-congo-atrocities-rwanda-backed-m23-rebels

https://www.theguardian.com/global-development/2024/apr/11/rwanda-militias-drc-goma

I'm not using this for cheap shots at Arsenal, just to be clear. But it's something the fans, I'd hope, would (and should) be against, and it's in the news for once. We have lots of odious links through our partners too, particularly AXA and Standard Chartered, of course. However, the difference is Visit Rwanda is sportswashing, not dissimilar to KSA and Abu Dhabi sportswashing.
« Last Edit: April 17, 2024, 06:29:47 pm by Kopenhagen »
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Offline Dougle

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Re: Arsenal: Top of the divers league
« Reply #7467 on: April 17, 2024, 08:07:05 pm »
Bayern does not have their full squad.

Gnabry and Coman are out. Davies is suspended. Sane isn't 100% if Tuchel is to be believed.

Arsenal needs to perform and win.

You'll never get a better chance away against Bayern. It's a semi stiff Bayern etc etc ... !

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Re: Arsenal: Top of the divers league
« Reply #7468 on: April 17, 2024, 08:48:12 pm »
Hope it goes to ET.
"All the lads have been talking about is walking out in front of the Kop, with 40,000 singing 'You'll Never Walk Alone'," Collins told BBC Radio Solent. "All the money in the world couldn't buy that feeling," he added.

Offline DelTrotter

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Re: Arsenal: Top of the divers league
« Reply #7469 on: April 17, 2024, 09:53:45 pm »
Schooled by Big Ric Dier and Harry Kane. Hahahahah.

Absolutely beautiful that Saka's cheating cost them not just the first game but tonight too, he'll still be diving again on the weekend though!

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Re: Arsenal: Top of the divers league
« Reply #7470 on: April 17, 2024, 09:54:34 pm »
I don't think you have the minerals for Europe lads.

Offline Garlic Red

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Re: Arsenal: Top of the divers league
« Reply #7471 on: April 17, 2024, 09:55:52 pm »
I was really underwhelmed by Arteta/Arsenal there. Simply outclassed tactically by Tuchel.

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Re: Arsenal: Top of the divers league
« Reply #7472 on: April 17, 2024, 09:55:56 pm »
The Bayern goal coming from a Saka dive that the ref didn’t fall for.


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Re: Arsenal: Top of the divers league
« Reply #7473 on: April 17, 2024, 09:56:13 pm »
Winning at the Allianz isn’t for everyone you gangs of diving c*nts.

Hope Odergaard takes some photos out there tonight  :wave

Offline Redley

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Re: Arsenal: Top of the divers league
« Reply #7474 on: April 17, 2024, 09:56:34 pm »

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Re: Arsenal: Top of the divers league
« Reply #7475 on: April 17, 2024, 09:57:00 pm »
European mentality midgets  :wave
Soccer - let's face it, its not really about a game of ball anymore is it?

Offline DelTrotter

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Re: Arsenal: Top of the divers league
« Reply #7476 on: April 17, 2024, 09:57:16 pm »
The Bayern goal coming from a Saka dive that the ref didn’t fall for.



Hahaha yep, fucking glorious. He was absolutely hopeless as well.

Offline Jwils21

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Re: Arsenal: Top of the divers league
« Reply #7477 on: April 17, 2024, 09:58:20 pm »
Bayern must have a frighteningly tight defence to keep a clean sheet against the most prolific and clinical attack in football history.

Offline Tonyh8su

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Re: Arsenal: Top of the divers league
« Reply #7478 on: April 17, 2024, 09:58:54 pm »
The goal coming from a Saka dive that he could've just competed for the ball instead. Saka diving for a penalty against the last second at home when he was around the keeper and had a tap in. Saka taking the last minute free kick quickly and fucking it up.

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Get the camera out, Martin!

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Re: Arsenal: Top of the divers league
« Reply #7479 on: April 17, 2024, 10:00:07 pm »
The Bayern goal coming from a Saka dive that the ref didn’t fall for.


Saka is to be awarded the freshest cut of grass on which he hasn't yet dived. Many groundsmen are still looking...
Cruyff: "Victory is not enough, there also needs to be beautiful football."