Author Topic: Sportwashing-A general thread  (Read 62560 times)

Offline GreatEx

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Re: Sportwashing-A general thread
« Reply #440 on: August 21, 2023, 11:24:42 am »
. This is where you play Henderson.

Bit harsh, I think he still offers something in midfield

Offline classycarra

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Re: Sportwashing-A general thread
« Reply #441 on: August 21, 2023, 11:48:24 am »
Saudi immigration policy is essentially to murder  refugees trying to cross the border from Ethiopia into their country. Hundreds have been killed by explosives and firearms in recent months. This is where you play Henderson.

From today's Guardian:

https://www.theguardian.com/law/2023/aug/21/fired-on-like-rain-saudi-border-guards-accused-of-mass-killings-of-ethiopians
Difficult to read all of that. Absolutely shocking, and I say that as someone who understands what to expect from the brutal saudi state

A timely reminder to anyone on here who suggests that people who raise issues (with state-led violence, persecution, murder, torture) are being culturally insensitive or xenophobic - read this article. and wake up.

wake up because you, as an individual, are an apologist for this behaviour - and believing that it should not be questioned by people (especially westerners) is scumbag behaviour. as is suggesting that 'they have a different culture and should be left to it' - because that is you, as an individual, engaging in xenophobia about people from saudi arabia.

this isn't solely for the reactionaries, the social conservatives, or the fundamentalists on RAWK who've announced themselve in recent months, but just as equally the useful idiots who defend the interests of the raping murdering and torturing saudi state

Offline Yorkykopite

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Re: Sportwashing-A general thread
« Reply #442 on: August 21, 2023, 11:54:31 am »
Difficult to read all of that. Absolutely shocking, and I say that as someone who understands what to expect from the brutal saudi state

A timely reminder to anyone on here who suggests that people who raise issues (with state-led violence, persecution, murder, torture) are being culturally insensitive or xenophobic - read this article. and wake up.

wake up because you, as an individual, are an apologist for this behaviour - and believing that it should not be questioned by people (especially westerners) is scumbag behaviour. as is suggesting that 'they have a different culture and should be left to it' - because that is you, as an individual, engaging in xenophobia about people from saudi arabia.

this isn't solely for the reactionaries, the social conservatives, or the fundamentalists on RAWK who've announced themselve in recent months, but just as equally the useful idiots who defend the interests of the raping murdering and torturing saudi state

Oddly enough Carra the presence of Gerrard and Henderson and the rest of the mercenaries in Saudi Arabia might lead to greater interest being shown in the everyday brutality of this regime. I give Henderson and the rest no credit for this, since it isn't their intention to undermine the regime in any way. Quite the opposite. They want to prosper off the back of it.

We rightly deplore our own government's handling of refugees to our shores. It's sick and shameful. But Saudi Arabian border guards deal with desperate refugees by killing them en masse as soon as they spot them. Racists. Barbarians. Savages.
"If you want the world to love you don't discuss Middle Eastern politics" Saul Bellow.

Offline classycarra

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Re: Sportwashing-A general thread
« Reply #443 on: August 21, 2023, 11:58:16 am »
We rightly deplore our own government's handling of refugees to our shores. It's sick and shameful. But Saudi Arabian border guards deal with desperate refugees by killing them en masse as soon as they spot them. Racists. Barbarians. Savages.
They're worse than that. And they're doing what their theocratic masters want them to do
Quote
The latest investigation into abuses in an area largely shut off to foreign journalists and aid workers is the most detailed picture yet of what is happening at the border.

Among the most shocking claims are that:
-Saudi border forces shelled a group of people who had been arrested, detained and expelled even as they attempted to cross the border back into Yemen.
-Saudi border forces forced a young person who had survived an attack to rape another survivor under threat of execution.
-People detained after crossing the border were shot at close quarters, and survivors were told by border forces to choose a limb to be shot in.

Offline oojason

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Re: Sportwashing-A general thread
« Reply #444 on: August 21, 2023, 01:24:40 pm »
Difficult to read all of that. Absolutely shocking, and I say that as someone who understands what to expect from the brutal saudi state

A timely reminder to anyone on here who suggests that people who raise issues (with state-led violence, persecution, murder, torture) are being culturally insensitive or xenophobic - read this article. and wake up.

wake up because you, as an individual, are an apologist for this behaviour - and believing that it should not be questioned by people (especially westerners) is scumbag behaviour. as is suggesting that 'they have a different culture and should be left to it' - because that is you, as an individual, engaging in xenophobia about people from saudi arabia.

this isn't solely for the reactionaries, the social conservatives, or the fundamentalists on RAWK who've announced themselve in recent months, but just as equally the useful idiots who defend the interests of the raping murdering and torturing saudi state

100% this.


And for anyone who missed / skipped past Yorkie's linked article above...


'‘Fired on like rain’: Saudi border guards accused of mass killings of Ethiopians':-

Report by Human Rights Watch details alleged attacks using explosive weapons and small arms on Saudi Arabia-Yemen border

www.theguardian.com/law/2023/aug/21/fired-on-like-rain-saudi-border-guards-accused-of-mass-killings-of-ethiopians





a snippet...


'Saudi border guards have been accused of killing hundreds of Ethiopians using small arms and explosive weapons in a targeted campaign that rights advocates suggest may amount to a crime against humanity.

The shocking claims are made in a detailed investigation by Human Rights Watch, which interviewed dozens of Ethiopian people who said they were attacked by border guards while they tried to cross into Saudi Arabia from Yemen.

Last week Downing Street confirmed that Rishi Sunak plans to welcome Saudi Arabia’s crown prince Mohammed bin Salman to London “at the earliest opportunity”. It would be the first visit since the death in 2018 of the Saudi dissident Jamal Khashoggi, who US intelligence believe was murdered and dismembered by Saudi agents in Istanbul on the orders of Prince Mohammed.

Using satellite imaging, photographs of deaths from more than 20 incidents, witness testimony by survivors and forensic experts’ examination of survivors’ wounds, HRW has built up a compelling and horrific picture of an escalating campaign of extreme violence aimed at people trying to cross the border.

Witness testimony describes mass killings, with women and children dying in shelling, and dead people and body parts spread along trails.'




« Last Edit: August 21, 2023, 01:28:34 pm by oojason »
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Offline redgriffin73

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Re: Sportwashing-A general thread
« Reply #445 on: August 21, 2023, 02:56:31 pm »
Bit harsh, I think he still offers something in midfield

;D
Rafa Benitez: "I'll always keep in my heart the good times I've had here, the strong and loyal support of the fans in the tough times and the love from Liverpool. I have no words to thank you enough for all these years and I am very proud to say that I was your manager. Thank you so much once more and always remember: You'll never walk alone."

Offline Black Bull Nova

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Re: Sportwashing-A general thread
« Reply #446 on: August 21, 2023, 03:50:39 pm »
How much money do you need?
Makes me want to puke.


Neymar getting $500,000 for every post that promotes Saudi,


There we have it, we knew it but that's the reason he's there.


I would assume there's a limit on that because he could bankrupt them over 6 months given the amount of spare time he has in his pool and in his private jet.


Happy retirement Neymar, you were always an over-rated diving dickhead, shame you made (mostly) bad career choices, you could have been remembered.
aarf, aarf, aarf.

Offline Elzar

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Re: Sportwashing-A general thread
« Reply #447 on: August 21, 2023, 06:28:08 pm »
Jota set to leave already. Wonder what has changed, will be interesting to see if more detail comes out.
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Offline GreatEx

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Re: Sportwashing-A general thread
« Reply #448 on: August 21, 2023, 10:10:24 pm »
Maybe he was trying to do some of that "change from the inside" stuff the Hendo apologists are clinging to.

Offline Crosby Nick

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Re: Sportwashing-A general thread
« Reply #449 on: August 21, 2023, 10:42:35 pm »
Jota set to leave already. Wonder what has changed, will be interesting to see if more detail comes out.

Maybe they realised they’d signed the wrong Jota and refused to pay him.

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Re: Sportwashing-A general thread
« Reply #450 on: August 22, 2023, 12:56:38 pm »
Jota set to leave already. Wonder what has changed, will be interesting to see if more detail comes out.

the rumour is from a few journos is that the club's releasing him, rather than him wanting out.   Whole thing sounds mad. They’ve seen enough to think he’s not good enough / what they need, so are allowing him to become a free agent weeks after paying 25m or whatever it was, so they can go back in the market for a bigger name to take his place  ???

Offline classycarra

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Re: Sportwashing-A general thread
« Reply #451 on: August 22, 2023, 01:01:33 pm »
the rumour is from a few journos is that the club's releasing him, rather than him wanting out.   Whole thing sounds mad. They’ve seen enough to think he’s not good enough / what they need, so are allowing him to become a free agent weeks after paying 25m or whatever it was, so they can go back in the market for a bigger name to take his place  ???
arent they forcing him on loan to another club in their league?

all the transfers are done by that same ex-chelsea prick emanolo. seems like he's a numpty

Offline LovelyCushionedHeader

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Re: Sportwashing-A general thread
« Reply #452 on: August 22, 2023, 01:27:41 pm »
Saudi immigration policy is essentially to murder  refugees trying to cross the border from Ethiopia into their country. Hundreds have been killed by explosives and firearms in recent months. This is where you play Henderson.

From today's Guardian:

https://www.theguardian.com/law/2023/aug/21/fired-on-like-rain-saudi-border-guards-accused-of-mass-killings-of-ethiopians

Unfortunately, I reckon a fair share of the English population would be supportive of our government doing the same thing!
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Offline classycarra

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Re: Sportwashing-A general thread
« Reply #453 on: August 22, 2023, 01:43:36 pm »
Unfortunately, I reckon a fair share of the English population would be supportive of our government doing the same thing!
Doubtful

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Re: Sportwashing-A general thread
« Reply #454 on: August 22, 2023, 02:21:58 pm »
Doubtful

Fair. You have more faith in society than me!
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Offline classycarra

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Re: Sportwashing-A general thread
« Reply #455 on: August 22, 2023, 03:35:34 pm »
Fair. You have more faith in society than me!
haha, i'm fairly cynical but im relatively hopeful that most of the people here aren't actively pro-torture/maiming/murder for sadistic entertainment!

i agree there'll be pockets who are (passively) content with the concept of people trying to migrate here suffering ill health and other unpleasantness, but the complicity and deliberate sadism element is a step beyond for most outside of the most monstrous (i'd hope)

Offline blacksun

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Re: Sportwashing-A general thread
« Reply #456 on: August 23, 2023, 08:00:18 pm »
haha, i'm fairly cynical but im relatively hopeful that most of the people here aren't actively pro-torture/maiming/murder for sadistic entertainment!

i agree there'll be pockets who are (passively) content with the concept of people trying to migrate here suffering ill health and other unpleasantness, but the complicity and deliberate sadism element is a step beyond for most outside of the most monstrous (i'd hope)

You have more faith in people than me, I've heard more than one idiot here in the US say 'they don't understand why Border Patrol just don't shoot these criminals trying to get into our country illegally, that would stop  them pouring in in no time'

Offline Yorkykopite

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Re: Sportwashing-A general thread
« Reply #457 on: August 23, 2023, 08:16:05 pm »
You have more faith in people than me, I've heard more than one idiot here in the US say 'they don't understand why Border Patrol just don't shoot these criminals trying to get into our country illegally, that would stop  them pouring in in no time'

So that's at least two by your own reckoning!

Loud bigoted voices. They like to pretend they're representative. But it's not so.

We have a TV programme here called Question Time. A few weeks back the audience was asked whether they supported our own government's punitive policies on asylum seekers. They don't involve mass murder like the Saudi immigration policy. But they are sick nonetheless. Not a single person in the audience would admit that they liked them. It was quite an amazing moment.
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Offline blacksun

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Re: Sportwashing-A general thread
« Reply #458 on: August 23, 2023, 08:55:49 pm »
So that's at least two by your own reckoning!

Loud bigoted voices. They like to pretend they're representative. But it's not so.

We have a TV programme here called Question Time. A few weeks back the audience was asked whether they supported our own government's punitive policies on asylum seekers. They don't involve mass murder like the Saudi immigration policy. But they are sick nonetheless. Not a single person in the audience would admit that they liked them. It was quite an amazing moment.

Two things Yorkie, I'm from there so I know Question Time :)
And just because others haven't actually vocalised like the others doesn't mean they don't think it, I agree the loudest idiots are usually the most bigoted but I know others too who would probably be nodding inside even if they are smart enough not to say it out loud

Offline Yorkykopite

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Re: Sportwashing-A general thread
« Reply #459 on: August 23, 2023, 09:22:18 pm »
Two things Yorkie, I'm from there so I know Question Time :)
And just because others haven't actually vocalised like the others doesn't mean they don't think it, I agree the loudest idiots are usually the most bigoted but I know others too who would probably be nodding inside even if they are smart enough not to say it out loud

Sorry mate, thought you were a Yank!

I don't mind people "nodding inside". I'd rather they were virtuous of course. But, failing that, it's a social achievement if they daren't actually articulate their poisonous views.
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Offline blacksun

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Re: Sportwashing-A general thread
« Reply #460 on: August 23, 2023, 09:45:17 pm »
Sorry mate, thought you were a Yank!

I don't mind people "nodding inside". I'd rather they were virtuous of course. But, failing that, it's a social achievement if they daren't actually articulate their poisonous views.

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Offline Vote For Pedro

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Re: Sportwashing-A general thread
« Reply #461 on: August 24, 2023, 12:45:25 pm »
Rumours starting to spread that Qatar have won the bidding to buying United. Had an air of inevitability but it's still a blow and another nail in the coffin of the top flight if true.

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Re: Sportwashing-A general thread
« Reply #462 on: August 24, 2023, 12:50:00 pm »
Rumours starting to spread that Qatar have won the bidding to buying United. Had an air of inevitability but it's still a blow and another nail in the coffin of the top flight if true.

Where are the rumours coming from have any of the usual journalists hinted at it or just the usual hopeful United fans on twitter?
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Offline Vote For Pedro

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Re: Sportwashing-A general thread
« Reply #463 on: August 24, 2023, 12:58:57 pm »
Where are the rumours coming from have any of the usual journalists hinted at it or just the usual hopeful United fans on twitter?
It's in the Metro today, and the MEN, and the rag (apparently).

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Re: Sportwashing-A general thread
« Reply #464 on: August 24, 2023, 01:03:41 pm »
It's in the Metro today, and the MEN, and the rag (apparently).

I will only worry about it if Delaney starts saying the same thing. No one of any note is confirming it at the moment.
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Offline Ray K

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Re: Sportwashing-A general thread
« Reply #465 on: August 24, 2023, 01:42:12 pm »
Tennis now in bed with the Saudis, which everyone predicted after the LIV golf merger.

Jeddah, Saudi Arabia will host the Next Gen ATP Finals (Under 21) from 2023-2027.

The tournament will take place over 5 days at King Abdullah Sports City on indoor hard court from Nov 28-Dec 2 2023, with a record $2m prize money.

***
I'd say it's a racing certainty that the ATP Finals will go there when the current deal with Turin ends in 2025.
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Offline Walshy nMe®

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Re: Sportwashing-A general thread
« Reply #466 on: August 24, 2023, 01:58:19 pm »
Wimb - Al'don will be there in a few years too.

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Re: Sportwashing-A general thread
« Reply #467 on: August 24, 2023, 03:19:15 pm »
Tennis now in bed with the Saudis, which everyone predicted after the LIV golf merger.

Jeddah, Saudi Arabia will host the Next Gen ATP Finals (Under 21) from 2023-2027.

The tournament will take place over 5 days at King Abdullah Sports City on indoor hard court from Nov 28-Dec 2 2023, with a record $2m prize money.

***
I'd say it's a racing certainty that the ATP Finals will go there when the current deal with Turin ends in 2025.
Good to see a high profile Tennis competition hosted by a country with a rich history in the game, who can forget the roster of Saudi talent that has taken part on the Tennis tour over the years?, a real hotbed of the sport, well deserved and not a byproduct of cronyism or bribery at the top levels of the sport, all of the naysayers will beheading for the exits if they don't tone down the criticism.

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Re: Sportwashing-A general thread
« Reply #468 on: August 25, 2023, 01:40:06 pm »
From this week's upshot:

Quote
😘 Just two months after joining Saudi side Al-Ittihad, Karim Benzema is rumoured to be leaving because he doesn’t fit with manager Nuno Espirito Santo’s tactics.

Offline Jwils21

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Re: Sportwashing-A general thread
« Reply #469 on: August 26, 2023, 11:41:37 am »
From this week's upshot:

Jota is allegedly getting binned too. Reports saying the fans are unhappy because he’s not a big name. Spoilt brats, just fuck off :wanker

Offline DarkOfTheManatee

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Re: Sportwashing-A general thread
« Reply #470 on: August 27, 2023, 11:13:20 pm »
Wonder what could have lured Roberto 'Two Salaries' Mancini to take over the Saudi Arabia team?

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Re: Sportwashing-A general thread
« Reply #471 on: August 28, 2023, 11:58:24 am »
86 million pounds for 4 years work for Mancini. Good that the poor guy is finally making some money
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Offline GreatEx

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Re: Sportwashing-A general thread
« Reply #472 on: August 30, 2023, 11:00:19 am »
https://www.hrw.org/news/2023/08/29/saudi-arabia-man-sentenced-death-tweets

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Re: Sportwashing-A general thread
« Reply #473 on: August 30, 2023, 09:41:23 pm »

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Re: Sportwashing-A general thread
« Reply #474 on: August 31, 2023, 05:16:10 pm »

'Saudi Arabia lobbies Europe to support 2034 World Cup bid':-

Saudis insisting they could hold World Cup in summer despite fierce heat

www.thetimes.co.uk/article/saudi-arabia-lobbies-europe-to-support-2034-world-cup-bid-p0ll5ptfl - or in full, here - https://archive.ph/HnDhG





a snippet...


'Saudi Arabia has embarked on a campaign to gain support in Europe for a bid to host the 2034 World Cup.

Officials and ministers from Saudi Arabia have approached senior figures in European football to secure backing for the Gulf state to host the men’s tournament.

It is seen as the ultimate ambition for the Saudis, who are spending billions of pounds on sport and have attracted some of the biggest names in football — including Cristiano Ronaldo and Neymar — to their clubs over the past year.

Saudi Arabia had initially considered a joint bid for the 2030 World Cup with Egypt and Greece but is now focusing on hosting 2034 on its own, say sources with knowledge of the situation. A joint bid by Spain, Portugal and Morocco is now seen as the favourite to win the bid for the 2030 tournament.'
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Offline JRed

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Re: Sportwashing-A general thread
« Reply #475 on: August 31, 2023, 05:27:24 pm »
Just saw a clip of Gareth Southgate doing an impression of Eddie Howe on sky sports:’ I don’t see why there should be an adverse reaction to a player because of where he plays his football…..it’s a complex political aspects that I’m not really trained to do’ When asked about Henderson being in the squad.
Fuckoff Gareth you prick.

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Re: Sportwashing-A general thread
« Reply #476 on: August 31, 2023, 05:48:55 pm »
'Saudi Arabia lobbies Europe to support 2034 World Cup bid':-

Fuck off yer stone age c*nts  :wanker

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Re: Sportwashing-A general thread
« Reply #477 on: September 1, 2023, 08:59:05 am »
Just don't castigate me for asking questions around [Henderson], because there are lots of grey areas.

One thing that won't help the cause is shutting down any form of debate.
why are you saying this? what debate is being shut down? seems like some kind of comfort blanket phrase for people who struggle to make coherent convincing arguments - rest assured you aren't being shut down
This isn’t true. Not wanting to relitigate the Henderson situation here, but I and apparently others just took 40 days in the sin bin for posts about this very issue. Here’s the warning I was sent when they muted me:
Quote
You have received a warning
« Sent to: Iska on: July 21, 2023, 10:29:35 pm »
Iska,
Consistent with the others who have taken a hard stance and have been unequivocal about the Hendo situation we're muting you for now. The discussion is not negotiable on this site.
RAWK Mods
That’s shutting down debate, in the most literal sense. The thread was deleted and everything.

In any event there’s plenty of piling on, shouting down and bullying goes on on Rawk nowadays - the Henderson talk was particularly brutal, but afaict can tell none of the actual pilers-on took a ban for it. If that doesn’t look like shutting down to you, it’s probably because you don’t hold any views that aren’t standard Rawk orthodoxy.

Offline classycarra

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Re: Sportwashing-A general thread
« Reply #478 on: September 1, 2023, 09:34:04 am »
This isn’t true. Not wanting to relitigate the Henderson situation here, but I and apparently others just took 40 days in the sin bin for posts about this very issue. Here’s the warning I was sent when they muted me:That’s shutting down debate, in the most literal sense. The thread was deleted and everything.
I have no idea what occurred with your situation, but I stand by what I said to HomesickRed in that quoted post.

They made an outrageous claim (that people critical of Henderson's move should, to avoid hypocrisy, generalise and criticist all players from the middle east as bigoted).

We then exchanged a couple of messages about it, they mentioned the spurious line about 'shutting down debate' out of nowhere, and since then they've voluntarily not replied. That's not an example of being shut down, that's them having a weak argument and quietly dropping it

Offline Iska

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Re: Sportwashing-A general thread
« Reply #479 on: September 1, 2023, 09:54:36 am »
I have no idea what occurred with your situation, but I stand by what I said to HomesickRed in that quoted post.
Nor do I, because the thread’s been deleted and the mods don’t enter into dialogue on this sort of thing - fwiw I suspect it’s mistaken identity because my views on Henderson are pretty middle-of-the-road and the last thing I did was stick up for someone whom I felt was being bullied. I hope it wasn’t for either of those, but then the warning does specifically say it was for my opinions so I’ve got to take it at face value. I think it’s beyond pathetic, but there you go.

No particular view on your beef—you’re big boys and can sort it out among yourselves—but you appeared to be suggesting that in general debate isn’t being shut down, so I thought it useful to show that it very much is.