Topic: Nat Phillips

[didi shamone]

He'd have made absolutely no difference to the result

I disagree. It would have meant our best midfielder was in midfield protecting the backline.

[Welshred]

I disagree. It would have meant our best midfielder was in midfield protecting the backline.

So play Ben Davies then. Or play me. If Fabinho in midfield stops that goal then it doesn't matter who the defender is.

[Fordy]

AL666 can talk his agenda all he likes.

PHILLIPS IS BADLY MISSED!

[BobPaisley3]

AL666 can talk his agenda all he likes.

PHILLIPS IS BADLY MISSED!

We’re certainly more vulnerable from the crossed ball without him.

[OOS]

We’re certainly more vulnerable from the crossed ball without him.

Wouldn't have fancied him against Newcastle runs from deep with a high line tbf ... swings and roundabouts and that

[didi shamone]

So play Ben Davies then. Or play me. If Fabinho in midfield stops that goal then it doesn't matter who the defender is.

Davies is obviously not even close to being good enough. Weird signing.
I'm not sure how good you are at centre back but I'd consider you in midfield for Gini

[BobPaisley3]

Wouldn't have fancied him against Newcastle runs from deep with a high line tbf ... swings and roundabouts and that

True but it doesn’t need to be one or the other. Adjust the line defending on the personnel . Regardless, you’ll always have aerial crosses coming into the box in English football.

[Crosby Nick]

He'd have made absolutely no difference to the result

I’d say he’d have been more likely to get his head on the Leeds corner.

[Welshred]

I’d say he’d have been more likely to get his head on the Leeds corner.

We didn't play Leeds today you Nick

[Crosby Nick]

We didn't play Leeds today you Nick

Good spot. I posted in another thread that I thought we’d missed him in the last two games.

[Welshred]

Good spot. I posted in another thread that I thought we’d missed him in the last two games.

My argument today though is that it doesn't matter whether he was playing or not we still would have conceded that goal

[B0151?]

He would have made a difference to the result. 100%.

[farawayred]

He would have made a difference to the result. 100%.

Just by letting Fabinho play at No.6 is enough protection for the defense.

[Fromola]

I’d say he’d have been more likely to get his head on the Leeds corner.

When we kept giving Leeds corners I knew they'd put one away. With Phillips in the team he can deal with them, particularly the area they scored from.

Today although Newcastle caused us some problems on the break, it was the high balls pumped in towards the end that would have been food and drink to Nat. A few games this season he's won vital headers late on to see the game out. We missed that the last two games.

Whether we'd have won both games is merely conjecture, but there's a good chance he'd have prevented both goals, just by getting his head on it.

[Eeyore]

When Saint-Maximin was terrorising our defence did anyone really think if only we had Nat to nullify him.

The forwards did their job they put us in front. It was the defenders job to see us through.

Just look at how many points we have dropped from winning positions.

[farawayred]

When Saint-Maximin was terrorising our defence did anyone really think if only we had Nat to nullify him.

The forwards did their job they put us in front. It was the defenders job to see us through.

Just look at how many points we have dropped from winning positions.

Gotta disagree, Al. Fabinho would have given the defense solid protection. Using him as a CB is what allowed Saint-Maximin to roam around and terrorize them.

And no, the forwards didn't do their job - to put the game beyond reach. They had a ton of chances, a metric ton.

[Eeyore]

Gotta disagree, Al. Fabinho would have given the defense solid protection. Using him as a CB is what allowed Saint-Maximin to roam around and terrorize them.

And no, the forwards didn't do their job - to put the game beyond reach. They had a ton of chances, a metric ton.

I will politely disagree.

Fabinho and Henderson have only been deployed at centre back because of our disastrous policy to go in to the season with only two fit centre backs. That was compounded by failing to bring in a senior centre back for January 1.

[farawayred]

I will politely disagree.

Fabinho and Henderson have only been deployed at centre back because of our disastrous policy to go in to the season with only two fit centre backs. That was compounded by failing to bring in a senior centre back for January 1.

Oh, I agree with you on the CB situation. Although it can be argued that it was highly unexpected. VVD played all CL and PL games last season, bar one, so one of the CB spots was taken. Three injury-prone CBs competed for the other. We sold Lovren, but I can see how the decision-makers could have opted for Matip/Gomez as RCB, and Fabinho could cover if absolutely needed. I get that. But the absolute necessity came with VVD's injury right away. Then it was Gomez and every man and his dog that played CB for us. What I didn't get and hold against our recruitment team is why didn't we get a CB in January at the opening of the window? Why did we wait so long? We were top of the table with all the shit that happened to us. I think that decision has come to cost us the CL spot, never mind the league.

[Welshred]

Just by letting Fabinho play at No.6 is enough protection for the defense.

So it could literally be any centre back in the world other than Nat Phillips if Fabinho in the midfield wins us the game?

[farawayred]

So it could literally be any centre back in the world other than Nat Phillips if Fabinho in the midfield wins us the game?

We are talking about those on our books. Fabinho is a better protector than CB, although he's quite good there. But I would have played Davis; he can't be that bad, can he?

[killer-heels]

I think we needed him considering he is the only centreback Klopp trusted to play and thus put Fabinho back in midfield.

[Welshred]

We are talking about those on our books. Fabinho is a better protector than CB, although he's quite good there. But I would have played Davis; he can't be that bad, can he?

Right, so playing Billy Koumetio in defence and Fabinho in midfield wins us the game? That's not a glowing endorsement on Nat Phillips. We needed calmness and composure after the disallowed goal to win us the game, Henderson and Virgil are probably the two who would have provided us with that.

[farawayred]

Why do you keep moving the goalposts?

So it could literally be any centre back in the world other than Nat Phillips if Fabinho in the midfield wins us the game?

Your first post referred to "any centre back in the world other than Nat Phillips..." where did I say that?

Right, so playing Billy Koumetio in defence and Fabinho in midfield wins us the game? That's not a glowing endorsement on Nat Phillips. We needed calmness and composure after the disallowed goal to win us the game, Henderson and Virgil are probably the two who would have provided us with that.

Your second post - where did I say anything about Billy Koumetio?

You can keep going, but I find this pointless.

[Eeyore]

Oh, I agree with you on the CB situation. Although it can be argued that it was highly unexpected. VVD played all CL and PL games last season, bar one, so one of the CB spots was taken. Three injury-prone CBs competed for the other. We sold Lovren, but I can see how the decision-makers could have opted for Matip/Gomez as RCB, and Fabinho could cover if absolutely needed. I get that. But the absolute necessity came with VVD's injury right away. Then it was Gomez and every man and his dog that played CB for us. What I didn't get and hold against our recruitment team is why didn't we get a CB in January at the opening of the window? Why did we wait so long? We were top of the table with all the shit that happened to us. I think that decision has come to cost us the CL spot, never mind the league.

The criminal bit is that we simply didn't have centre back's coming through the system who could play the way we wanted to play.

Klopp played Hummels and Subotic as a teenage centre back partnership.

[Welshred]

I'm not moving any goalposts. I'm sticking with my original assertion that we would have conceded whether he played or not today when people said we missed him. We didn't.

[Machae]

Unless you have an alternate reality thingy majig, theres no way of knowing that, so it's all moot

What I want to know is, how the worlds slowest player injures his hamstring

[didi shamone]

Hes a first choice centre back so we absolutely missed him in the last two games. There's a reason Klopp has made him part of the first 11.

Even if you don't rate him thats a fact. It may just be a fact because of what we lose in midfield with Fab having to cover for him but like it or lump it our current strongest 11 includes Philips. That's obviously how klopp sees it as he keeps picking him. He'll walk straight back into the team when fit.

[decosabute]

He'd have made absolutely no difference to the result

No way we concede the last two goals with him playing.

Was funny seeing these two posts back to back in the thread. Pretty much opposite views, both stated as fact, both pure conjecture.

I personally feel that Phillips in defence and Fabinho in midfield would have seen us win the last two games. First half vs Madrid aside, we've looked so much more solid with that setup lately. But I guess we'll never know for sure with these last two games.

Even with Phillips out, I would like to see Fabinho in midfield under all circumstances myself though.

[MonsLibpool]

Was funny seeing these two posts back to back in the thread. Pretty much opposite views, both stated as fact, both pure conjecture.

I personally feel that Phillips in defence and Fabinho in midfield would have seen us win the last two games. First half vs Madrid aside, we've looked so much more solid with that setup lately. But I guess we'll never know for sure with these last two games.

Even with Phillips out, I would like to see Fabinho in midfield under all circumstances myself though.

He wins everything in the air and has helped out see out some tight wins recently. Having him makes teams less likely to hoof it.

[Black Bull Nova]

Who knows whether he would have been there in terms of the goals but I tell you what, he would have been there in terms of passion and commitment at the back which to me felt missing from us but there for both opponents.

I am surprise to see that no-one has come on here to blame Nat for the results because he got himself injured so often has every mistake he's made been highlighted since he got in the team.

[BeingJohnMarkovic]

We need Nat now more than ever, for his strength and yes, leadership at the back.

[decosabute]

Imagine someone told you back in August that the loss of Nat Phillips would be what ruined our push to scrape into the top 4.

[decosabute]

Anyone know if he's back this week by the way?

[CHOPPER]

Imagine someone told you back in August that the loss of Nat Phillips would be what ruined our push to scrape into the top 4.

I'd probably say that they're talking out their arse, as not scoring goals will be the issue that will make us fall short on any form of success.

[Welshred]

I'd probably say that they're talking out their arse, as not scoring goals will be the issue that will make us fall short on any form of success.

And even if it wasn't it would be the loss of Van Dijk, Gomez and Matip far ahead of losing Nat Phillips

[Eeyore]

I'd probably say that they're talking out their arse, as not scoring goals will be the issue that will make us fall short on any form of success.

I am not sure mate.

We are the 5th highest goalscorers. The shocking bit is that Brighton have conceded 39 and Fulham have conceded 43 they are in 17th and 18th place in the League.

We have conceded 39 from 33 games this season.

In 18/19 we conceded 22 from 38 games.

[decosabute]

And even if it wasn't it would be the loss of Van Dijk, Gomez and Matip far ahead of losing Nat Phillips

Oh come on you know what I mean - it's half-joking, but still. Two weeks ago I'd have backed us to get top 4. Even on 94 minutes on Saturday, I'd have probably backed us to get top 4. Obviously the players you mentioned are far, far bigger losses overall, but recently, what's killed our tiny bit of momentum (in my opinion) is losing Phillips, losing a settled back four, and again forcing Fabinho out of midfield to cover.

[johnj147]

Can't believe he's injured now unreal.so it is

[thaddeus]

Oh come on you know what I mean - it's half-joking, but still. Two weeks ago I'd have backed us to get top 4. Even on 94 minutes on Saturday, I'd have probably backed us to get top 4. Obviously the players you mentioned are far, far bigger losses overall, but recently, what's killed our tiny bit of momentum (in my opinion) is losing Phillips, losing a settled back four, and again forcing Fabinho out of midfield to cover.

Ignoring the other 180+ minutes of the last two games I don't think we would have conceded either goal with Phillips on the pitch.  The Leeds corner was dropped into an area where he would have almost certainly won the first header and it's hard to believe a ball punted into the penalty area in the 95th minute would have only been competed for by Robbo if Phillips had been on the pitch.

For all VVDs class it's his ability to consistently win the first ball that we miss as much as anything.  Phillips filled that gap well (he arguably got into the team on the basis of just that) but there's not really anybody else in our squad that provides that aerial dominance.  For sure we should have killed both of those games off when we were 1-0 and creating chances but it's no great surprise that we can't hold on to a lead when we can't defend our own penalty area from what should be low percentage balls.

[decosabute]

Ignoring the other 180+ minutes of the last two games I don't think we would have conceded either goal with Phillips on the pitch.  The Leeds corner was dropped into an area where he would have almost certainly won the first header and it's hard to believe a ball punted into the penalty area in the 95th minute would have only been competed for by Robbo if Phillips had been on the pitch.

For all VVDs class it's his ability to consistently win the first ball that we miss as much as anything.  Phillips filled that gap well (he arguably got into the team on the basis of just that) but there's not really anybody else in our squad that provides that aerial dominance.  For sure we should have killed both of those games off when we were 1-0 and creating chances but it's no great surprise that we can't hold on to a lead when we can't defend our own penalty area from what should be low percentage balls.

100% agree. Phillips has massive limitations on the turn, especially against quality opposition, but in a backs to the wall set-up he's actually a huge asset. And you're dead right on Virgil too. People always cling to the 'cigars out' moments with Van Dijk, like flicking it over a forward's head or playing an amazing long diagonal, but the bigger reason for his greatness is his dominance. Phillips has that in the air, and, in a backs-to-the-wall setup at least (which both Leeds and Newcastle became), on the ground too.