Topic: Team Analysis: Jürgen Klopp’s Liverpool Tactics (*)

[newterp]

Reckon Klopp gives Lallana another season to prove himself again?

Surely if he does start next season like this we should  consider selling in Jan. He's on high wages and contributing nothing as sturridge is.

for sure he will give him another season. that said - Lallana's age profile and injuries will give him very little rope with Klopp next season.

[Dench57]

we're actually so fucking good

[Suareznumber7]

Reckon Klopp gives Lallana another season to prove himself again?

Surely if he does start next season like this we should  consider selling in Jan. He's on high wages and contributing nothing as sturridge is.

Another season to “prove himself”?  I would say that Lallana doesn’t need to “prove himself” at this point.  The only reason he hasn’t contributed anything this year is because of the injuries, one of which was caused by rushing him back too soon.  I don’t think there is anyway that he’s not an important member of the squad next year. 

[Gnurglan]

Another season to “prove himself”?  I would say that Lallana doesn’t need to “prove himself” at this point.  The only reason he hasn’t contributed anything this year is because of the injuries, one of which was caused by rushing him back too soon.  I don’t think there is anyway that he’s not an important member of the squad next year. 

We'll see, but I suspect Lallana isn't as ’safe’ as we assume. Can, Milner, Henderson, AOC and Wijnaldum have all played more than him and we are getting Keita too. Lallana may still be a member of the squad next season, but the importance is something he will have to justify.

[Tony19:6]

We'll see, but I suspect Lallana isn't as ’safe’ as we assume. Can, Milner, Henderson, AOC and Wijnaldum have all played more than him and we are getting Keita too. Lallana may still be a member of the squad next season, but the importance is something he will have to justify.

And Lallana has been better than pretty much all of those. I cant see him not being a squad member at the very least  next season.

[BabuYagu]

Another season to “prove himself”?  I would say that Lallana doesn’t need to “prove himself” at this point.  The only reason he hasn’t contributed anything this year is because of the injuries, one of which was caused by rushing him back too soon.  I don’t think there is anyway that he’s not an important member of the squad next year.

Not sure that is true. It is more just the nature of long term injuries that on the path to recover there will be stumbles and further falls.

Lallana wasn't rushed back, by all accounts we were very cautious and even held him back at times for his own good. However at his age, having done very little running in the past 6 months, breaking down when he returns is a very real and normal scenario regardless of how long you give the muscle to recover. A part of it could very well be Lallana needing to adjust to the fact his body can no longer do what he wants it to do. We saw the same with Lucas too.

[harleydanger]

Another season to “prove himself”?  I would say that Lallana doesn’t need to “prove himself” at this point.  The only reason he hasn’t contributed anything this year is because of the injuries, one of which was caused by rushing him back too soon.  I don’t think there is anyway that he’s not an important member of the squad next year. 

Next year is his last here I reckon.

[Suareznumber7]

Not sure that is true. It is more just the nature of long term injuries that on the path to recover there will be stumbles and further falls.

Lallana wasn't rushed back, by all accounts we were very cautious and even held him back at times for his own good. However at his age, having done very little running in the past 6 months, breaking down when he returns is a very real and normal scenario regardless of how long you give the muscle to recover. A part of it could very well be Lallana needing to adjust to the fact his body can no longer do what he wants it to do. We saw the same with Lucas too.

I’m pretty sure Klopp confirmed that he was played too soon and got re-injured.  Think it was when he made his first comeback to the squad over the winter.  My timing could be off but I’m pretty confident Klopp confirmed it. 

[Suareznumber7]

Next year is his last here I reckon.

Why do you say that?

[xbugawugax]

Why do you say that?

age and injuries maybe?

he is almost with injuries for the whole of this season and by next season he is already 30. Pretty sure moving forward Klopp is already looking at alternatives in midfield next season.

[BabuYagu]

Noticed something interesting yesterday in our build up play - and don't think it was accidental.

We talked before how in our system there needs to be three at the back. This is usually split CBs and then the #6 drops between them. Napoli have a stay-at-home full back who plays RCB effectively in their build up. Or some sides simply play a back three.

Yesterday I noticed our CB's shifting side to side and one of our #8's (usually Gini, but Ox did occassionally also) was dropping in ball far side. This keeps our best aerially dominant players center in Lovren/VVD, removes the need for the #6 to be good in the air. The downside is of course that one of your #8's is ball far side and on the deepest line of your shape where they are unlikely to influence the game. Imagine next season, for example, would you rather have Ox & Keita fulfilling that role? Or a #6 comfortable dropping between them?

It won't show up on the heat maps because they were not picking up much if any touches back there as they tended to be opposite side of the ball. It was happening though. I will try to get some gif examples of it to show. It was definitely something we have been working on though as you could see one dropping back a bit once the other started moving forward. Henderson had a freer role in midfield - which I mentioned before is better for players who are weaker tactically, like Alli & Pogba, albeit he was roaming in a deeper position than a higher one on the pitch.

[CowboyKangaroo]

age and injuries maybe?

he is almost with injuries for the whole of this season and by next season he is already 30. Pretty sure moving forward Klopp is already looking at alternatives in midfield next season.

Yeah, but we can keep a very talented 30 year old as a squad player even if he is injury prone.

[Chalky Boots]

age and injuries maybe?

he is almost with injuries for the whole of this season and by next season he is already 30. Pretty sure moving forward Klopp is already looking at alternatives in midfield next season.

Maybe it was throwaway but listening to the way klopp was speaking about Gini as the 6 before the City away game had me thinking that there's only chamberlain at the club who'd fit his ideal makeup of a midfielder who plays on the sides of the 433. That would leave me thinking that the likes of Lallana will gradually fade into the background of this team.

[afc tukrish]

Yesterday I noticed our CB's shifting side to side and one of our #8's (usually Gini, but Ox did occassionally also) was dropping in ball far side. This keeps our best aerially dominant players center in Lovren/VVD, removes the need for the #6 to be good in the air. The downside is of course that one of your #8's is ball far side and on the deepest line of your shape where they are unlikely to influence the game. Imagine next season, for example, would you rather have Ox & Keita fulfilling that role? Or a #6 comfortable dropping between them?

Was it both sides that the 8 dropped in?

Might have been to position as cover for the wide defender after the cross field ball from the opposition...

As well as Trent played against City, he almost always had cover on the inside toward which he ushered Sane...

Klopp/Krawietz might have decided to use quicker midfield players as cover in that situation rather than central defenders while simultaneously keeping the better aerial players more centrally positioned, as you noted...

Ox and Gini are also both quite mobile and capable of pinching in weak side then getting forward to support the attack after we win back possession...

Would be interested in the gifs...

[ScouserAtHeart]

Anyone else think Lascelles would be a good long term partner to Van Dijk?

[Djimi Smicer34]

Anyone else think Lascelles would be a good long term partner to Van Dijk?

No.

We've got enough centre backs to be getting on with and I'd rather see Gomez get an opportunity before we go and spend more money on the position. 

[Mr_Shane]

Ox and Keita on both sides of the 6 is a mouth-watering thought no? now who is the 6 going to be? I would be ok with Wini maybe Henderson playing there against the low-block teams. They would never dare leave their half. But to play against elite teams who who should we be looking at?   

[Gnurglan]

Noticed something interesting yesterday in our build up play - and don't think it was accidental.

We talked before how in our system there needs to be three at the back. This is usually split CBs and then the #6 drops between them. Napoli have a stay-at-home full back who plays RCB effectively in their build up. Or some sides simply play a back three.

Yesterday I noticed our CB's shifting side to side and one of our #8's (usually Gini, but Ox did occassionally also) was dropping in ball far side. This keeps our best aerially dominant players center in Lovren/VVD, removes the need for the #6 to be good in the air. The downside is of course that one of your #8's is ball far side and on the deepest line of your shape where they are unlikely to influence the game. Imagine next season, for example, would you rather have Ox & Keita fulfilling that role? Or a #6 comfortable dropping between them?

It won't show up on the heat maps because they were not picking up much if any touches back there as they tended to be opposite side of the ball. It was happening though. I will try to get some gif examples of it to show. It was definitely something we have been working on though as you could see one dropping back a bit once the other started moving forward. Henderson had a freer role in midfield - which I mentioned before is better for players who are weaker tactically, like Alli & Pogba, albeit he was roaming in a deeper position than a higher one on the pitch.

I think I'm missing something here. Do you mean when we have the ball? Why would we need to focus on our #6 to be good in the air then? I can understand the benefit with having the CBs in the center of the pitch. We don't want a repeat of what we saw for City's goal last week.

[Clint Eastwood]

I liked Henderson's role yesterday. Seemed a bit more attacking. He's very good at those diagonal cross/long passes that land around the penalty spot. He created a fair few chances and Mane's goal if I recall.

[Dougle]

Noticed something interesting yesterday in our build up play - and don't think it was accidental.

We talked before how in our system there needs to be three at the back. This is usually split CBs and then the #6 drops between them. Napoli have a stay-at-home full back who plays RCB effectively in their build up. Or some sides simply play a back three.

Yesterday I noticed our CB's shifting side to side and one of our #8's (usually Gini, but Ox did occassionally also) was dropping in ball far side. This keeps our best aerially dominant players center in Lovren/VVD, removes the need for the #6 to be good in the air. The downside is of course that one of your #8's is ball far side and on the deepest line of your shape where they are unlikely to influence the game. Imagine next season, for example, would you rather have Ox & Keita fulfilling that role? Or a #6 comfortable dropping between them?

It won't show up on the heat maps because they were not picking up much if any touches back there as they tended to be opposite side of the ball. It was happening though. I will try to get some gif examples of it to show. It was definitely something we have been working on though as you could see one dropping back a bit once the other started moving forward. Henderson had a freer role in midfield - which I mentioned before is better for players who are weaker tactically, like Alli & Pogba, albeit he was roaming in a deeper position than a higher one on the pitch.

I was going to ask in this thread how folk saw our midfield operating yesterday. It seemed more dynamic, attack-wise. Henderson seemed freer and more aggressive and vertical (is that the word ?). Gini covered, side to side,wherever he was needed and (to me) seemed to sweep up allover the place. Get the ball and serve it to the providers. As for Ox, he too seemed to roam and really attacked from the middle. It brought a live threat from the middle and could have created more danger from the front as the opposition had to now deal with this as well as the chaos merchants up front.
I would assume this relates to the opposition as well and also that it is a degree of change rather than a new policy. Any thoughts?

[Magix]

The sheer mobility and movement of yesterday's midfield seems to suggest this is one of the ways we'll get round the low block or teams bus-parking at Anfield.

[peachybum]

I liked Henderson's role yesterday. Seemed a bit more attacking. He's very good at those diagonal cross/long passes that land around the penalty spot. He created a fair few chances and Mane's goal if I recall.

Those crosses are far more dangerous than Mo just sending in an in-swinger when we have a corner that side. Obviously we can't do it every time as teams will get wise to it but if teams aren't going to cut it off we should just keep working that ball to Henderson to put it.

[LovelyCushionedHeader]

Not sure if this has been mentioned, but our high line defending free kicks is unbelievably effective which the whole team deserves credit for because it takes proper guts. It relies on every single player refusing to drop any deeper before the ball is played but we have managed to master it. I can’t remember such a situation not resulting in an offside over the last 10 matches.

[tubby]

Not sure if this has been mentioned, but our high line defending free kicks is unbelievably effective which the whole team deserves credit for because it takes proper guts. It relies on every single player refusing to drop any deeper before the ball is played but we have managed to master it. I can’t remember such a situation not resulting in an offside over the last 10 matches.

The defence has been really switch on over the past few months with offside calls in general.  We rarely seem to get caught out these days.

[Asam]

Ox and Keita on both sides of the 6 is a mouth-watering thought no? now who is the 6 going to be? I would be ok with Wini maybe Henderson playing there against the low-block teams. They would never dare leave their half. But to play against elite teams who who should we be looking at?

From the players linked I think Jorginho is a great option, will nit be cheap but he's superb on the ball and would elevate how well we move the ball

[TepidT2O]

I reckon we might go back for zielinski though....

We were very interested and he’s done very well in Italy...

We do tend to keep our eye on players...

[deFacto please, you bastards]

I reckon we might go back for zielinski though....

We were very interested and he’s done very well in Italy...

We do tend to keep our eye on players...

Disagree, think we will sign a higher caliber player than that.

[Giono]

From the players linked I think Jorginho is a great option, will nit be cheap but he's superb on the ball and would elevate how well we move the ball

Yesterday’s midfield had the look of a fluid trio of 8s more than we have seen before. Jorginho may fit into that even better than as a 6. Him (or another), Keita, Hendo, Gini, Ox and possibly Milner will give us some interesting options for a midfield three whether against bus parkers or the Man Citys of the world.

[hassinator]

I liked Henderson's role yesterday. Seemed a bit more attacking. He's very good at those diagonal cross/long passes that land around the penalty spot. He created a fair few chances and Mane's goal if I recall.

i thought he was playing as an 8 with wee gini anchoring MF as the 6 which might explain the tactical shift at the back babu pointed out.

hendo definitely looked good against bournemouth.

[hassinator]

I reckon we might go back for zielinski though....

We were very interested and he’s done very well in Italy...

We do tend to keep our eye on players...

great defensive numbers as well as attacking flair which seems very klopp.  can't see him being cheap though as deal runs to 2021.

but do we need to be thinking about signing more brits this window with some of our older MFs perhaps coming to the end of their cycle?

[hassinator]

Yesterday’s midfield had the look of a fluid trio of 8s more than we have seen before. Jorginho may fit into that even better than as a 6. Him (or another), Keita, Hendo, Gini, Ox and possibly Milner will give us some interesting options for a midfield three whether against bus parkers or the Man Citys of the world.

jorginho started out as an 8 and wears that shirt for napoli so very much on message.

[aka_da_saus]

great defensive numbers as well as attacking flair which seems very klopp.  can't see him being cheap though as deal runs to 2021.

but do we need to be thinking about signing more brits this window with some of our older MFs perhaps coming to the end of their cycle?

prob one of the reasons why James Maddison on our radar (rumoured)

[hassinator]

prob one of the reasons why James Maddison on our radar (rumoured)

he reads well in the papers but i've never seen him play - any good?

[nico 8]

Noticed something interesting yesterday in our build up play - and don't think it was accidental.

We talked before how in our system there needs to be three at the back. This is usually split CBs and then the #6 drops between them. Napoli have a stay-at-home full back who plays RCB effectively in their build up. Or some sides simply play a back three.

Yesterday I noticed our CB's shifting side to side and one of our #8's (usually Gini, but Ox did occassionally also) was dropping in ball far side. This keeps our best aerially dominant players center in Lovren/VVD, removes the need for the #6 to be good in the air. The downside is of course that one of your #8's is ball far side and on the deepest line of your shape where they are unlikely to influence the game. Imagine next season, for example, would you rather have Ox & Keita fulfilling that role? Or a #6 comfortable dropping between them?

It won't show up on the heat maps because they were not picking up much if any touches back there as they tended to be opposite side of the ball. It was happening though. I will try to get some gif examples of it to show. It was definitely something we have been working on though as you could see one dropping back a bit once the other started moving forward. Henderson had a freer role in midfield - which I mentioned before is better for players who are weaker tactically, like Alli & Pogba, albeit he was roaming in a deeper position than a higher one on the pitch.

What you have noticed is something I suggested when discussing Jorginho and his weakness in the air. When he pushes up, Gini drops back into his position. Maybe not between and splitting the CB's. Could it be whichever side the no. 6 pushes into that no.8 drops back to play on the left or right as the last part of a 3rd CB.

[aka_da_saus]

he reads well in the papers but i've never seen him play - any good?

only going by you tube myself !

[nico 8]

Anyone else think Lascelles would be a good long term partner to Van Dijk?

If or when WBA go down - any thoughts on Salah's Egyptian teammate, Hegazi at CB and the Polish no.6/ defensive midfielder in Krychowiak.

[Kashinoda]

It's close but I think we're definitely better now?

[slotmachine]

Christian Eriksen is the player we need to replace Phil. He is double digits in goals and assists every season. A top notch free-kick taker and is superb shooting with either foot. He would be excellent on either side in the front 3 and also can really play in the midfield 3 and would be an excellent lock-picker similar to Citys Silva's and DeBruyne. He as always had the quality on the ball from when he was at Ajax but i always thought he was a bit of a show pony but over the last 3 years under Pocchetino his work rate and is tactical awareness without the ball have been excellent and for me he is now a complete player. He has only 2 years left on is deal at 70k a week so Levy is going to have to offer a new contract with a significant increase in wages which leaves Spurs vulnerable to a big bid which they would have to accept because the players value only decreases inside the last 2 years. I would easily pay 50 to 60m to have someone like that.

I also like Lemar but i would prefer Eriksen and while their is no indication by the usual sources that Klopp is interested just think he would be perfect as a creative force in our squad. Its going to be interesting to see who Klopp gets to replace Emre and Phil. Lemar, Jorginho, Zielinski, Draxler Brandt and Pulisic have all been on our radar since Klopp took over. Will he go back in for any of these?

[LovelyCushionedHeader]

Christian Eriksen is the player we need to replace Phil. He is double digits in goals and assists every season. A top notch free-kick taker and is superb shooting with either foot. He would be excellent on either side in the front 3 and also can really play in the midfield 3 and would be an excellent lock-picker similar to Citys Silva's and DeBruyne. He as always had the quality on the ball from when he was at Ajax but i always thought he was a bit of a show pony but over the last 3 years under Pocchetino his work rate and is tactical awareness without the ball have been excellent and for me he is now a complete player. He has only 2 years left on is deal at 70k a week so Levy is going to have to offer a new contract with a significant increase in wages which leaves Spurs vulnerable to a big bid which they would have to accept because the players value only decreases inside the last 2 years. I would easily pay 50 to 60m to have someone like that.

I also like Lemar but i would prefer Eriksen and while their is no indication by the usual sources that Klopp is interested just think he would be perfect as a creative force in our squad. Its going to be interesting to see who Klopp gets to replace Emre and Phil. Lemar, Jorginho, Zielinski, Draxler Brandt and Pulisic have all been on our radar since Klopp took over. Will he go back in for any of these?

There is absolutely zero chance of us signing Eriksen.

[Djimi Smicer34]

I would easily pay 50 to 60m to have someone like that.

Given it's Daniel Levy, I'd probably add another £30-40m to that.

And even then, Levy is not selling a player like Eriksen to us.