Topic: The Attack

[d.king037]

Snip

Ahh okay. I was well aware of those kind of stats and thought it was something more complicated based on more contextual information too. Thank you!

I do however think that a lot of those statistics can be used to support the notion of value of a player far too much. Most statistics remove context from the equation, as well as hard to measure things like off the ball work rate and movements. As important as what a player can do with the ball is what a player does when he doesn't have it and these are the things that its hard for stats to reveal.

Don't get me wrong, I'm a uni student and I was in an academy for a while so do value the use of statistics, but feel that sometimes too much value can be placed on them, but that's why we pay scouts and not anybody with access to whoscored or other stat websites!

[robgomm]

Stats are just stats, part of good analysis of them is putting them into context.

[Samie]

Ive been thinking about this ever since Sturridge returned and I mentioned this a week or so ago.  But ever since hes' returned and we're playing this 3-4-3 I don't think it brings the best out of him.  Like today he'll always get you a goal out of nothing because he's a class player but this formation I don't think helps him. He need's better/more support.

[AndyMuller]

Ive been thinking about this ever since Sturridge returned and I mentioned this a week or so ago.  But ever since hes' returned and we're playing this 3-4-3 I don't think it brings the best out of him.  Like today he'll always get you a goal out of nothing because he's a class player but this formation I don't think helps him. He need's better/more support.

I've been thinking this myself, it isolates him far too much and you can tell he's getting pissed off chasing lost causes and closing defenders down on his own. I've never been a fan of one central striker anyway always feel you need two together to support each other.

[Magix]

Ive been thinking about this ever since Sturridge returned and I mentioned this a week or so ago.  But ever since hes' returned and we're playing this 3-4-3 I don't think it brings the best out of him.  Like today he'll always get you a goal out of nothing because he's a class player but this formation I don't think helps him. He need's better/more support.

Feel the same. Maybe Sterling upfront with him? Coutinho behind and Lallana at wingback or as an option from the bench.

[Snail]

We need to talk about Sterling.

[RideTheWalrus]

We play with one striker, who isn't amazing at heading a ball. We play with two wide players, Sterling who cannot cross, and Moreno who can, but either has been told to not get forward too much, or doesn't have the confidence to. We have lots of players who press well, and are good in tight corners, but not enough who have composure.

[QC]

We need to talk about Sterling.

Yes, namely why do we push him to the wing just to accommodate Lallana.

[Clint Eastwood]

Coutinho needs support. One-man attack at the moment.

[Loo Pan]

Yes, namely why do we push him to the wing just to accommodate Lallana.

I don't think it's just about that. It's because of the lack of threat our other available wide players are bringing from that position. And this system really needs genuine threats out wide.

If Ibe had been available today, there's a good chance Lallana wouldn't have started.

[Redman0151]

We need to talk about Sterling.

20 years old and out of position, hard to expect consistent top class, even if his discussed wages may deserve it

[007.lankyguy]

We need to talk about Sterling.

Maybe we shouldn't be expecting a 21 year old to perform at his best when he's being moved around in positions that aren't his own, including LB where he finished today.

He's not in good form at the moment but it's hard for him to be considering what roles he's being asked to play.

[jepovic]

We need to talk about Sterling.

He's not a good wing back, and he seems to hate it too.

[Adeemo]

Coutinho, Lallana, Sterling and Sturridge do not posses anywhere near enough goal threat, nowhere fucking near. You can only rely on 25 yard screamers for so long but if you're not regularly creating chances inside the penalty area, you will eventually come unstuck. Yet again it comes back to selling our best player and goalscorer, without having a suitable list of replacements. Sanchez? No, Remy? no...erm. Absolute amateur hour and as I said in the half time thread, am I being too harsh thinking we've paid £25m for a few nice Cruyff turns?

[Samie]

Coutinho, Lallana, Sterling and Sturridge do not posses anywhere near enough goal threat, nowhere fucking near. You can only rely on 25 yard screamers for so long but if you're not regularly creating chances inside the penalty area, you will eventually come unstuck. Yet again it comes back to selling our best player and goalscorer, without having a suitable list of replacements. Sanchez? No, Remy? no...erm. Absolute amateur hour and as I said in the half time thread, am I being too harsh thinking we've paid £25m for a few nice Cruyff turns?

Sturridge will/can do IF we provide him with support.  This formation I personally believe doesn't not suit him.

[Adeemo]

Sturridge will/can do IF we provide him with support.  This formation I personally believe doesn't not suit him.

Agreed and I personally don't think he gets that chance today if Balotelli isn't on and occupying other defenders.

[Ste08]

Sterling was excellent behind the frontmen last year I could understand if we bought in prime Zidane you don't move him around for Lallana. I think Sturrige needs a partner too but we have anyone I trust. I think the diamond we ended with Monday could work with Sterling at the tip.

[groove]

Again, as I've said the last 2-3 games, Sturridge looks isolated and frustrated for the vast majority of the game. Yes, we've improved our defensively capabilities with this system change... what a goal Hazard, best player in the league easy... but we've done at the cost of a) our ability to break quickly (something Sterling, Sturridge and Coutinho as a trio are arguably the best in the league at) and b) giving Sturridge men, balls and movement to play with. For the brief moments we do provide Sturridge with that he looks sharp, skillful, creative. The goal today, the lay off for Lallana in the first half, the four chances he created against Swansea. People have criticised him for dropping too deep (although it's hardly surprising he does that when he sees so little of the action) but he didn't do that today and what does he have to feed on? Poorly aimed balls over the top and aimed at his head. He is too good of a player to only be touching the ball 10 times a game.

[Elzar]

Sterling and Sturridge do not work in this system.

Sterling is no good in that wingback position, and Sturridge can't make himself play on the line like he needs to when this is our formation. The best solution would be to push Coutinho central to the 3 and have Sterling and Sturridge infront, in my fairly inexperienced opinion anyway.

[groove]

Agree. We did that pre-season looked great. Against City and Dortmund. Alright it was pre-season but it's just things that looked like they could work and we never tried them again. Coutinho in the number 10 behind Sturridge and Sterling vs Dormund. And the Lucas, Can, Henderson midfield vs City in the second half which looked monstrous.

[Draex]

The key to 343 is having your wingbacks force the width and pin back the opposition.. Ours don't defend well, nor offer anything in attack - it's why we are coming unstuck, Monk worked it out Beavis has worked it out.

Get 2 up front and go after teams straight from the off. Lallana should be hooked for that miss, criminal at that level as it was a golden opportunity.. Score that and we don't have the throw on a 18 year old youth prospect into his first Utd game..

[SerbianScouser]

This made me so mad today. Even before Henderson received the ball Lallana should have been making the bending run. This is the problem you get when you want to play two creators between the lines and not people who make runs and have at least a bit of striker instincts.

There is a good reason why we don`t score as much as we would have liked. If Sturridge or Sterling were in that position you just know they would have attacked that space especially considering that subsequent Henderson`s pass and weight of it was actually spot on.

One creator between the lines is enough. The other player should always be somebody like Sterling, Markovic or Ibe.

[jepovic]

Sterling and Sturridge do not work in this system.

Sterling is no good in that wingback position, and Sturridge can't make himself play on the line like he needs to when this is our formation. The best solution would be to push Coutinho central to the 3 and have Sterling and Sturridge infront, in my fairly inexperienced opinion anyway.

Agree.

3412 would be my choice now. I'd be reluctant to mess with the defense that has been so solid. Sturridge needs a partner, and we need Sterling's speed up front.

[Pistolero]

I hope Rodgers has still got the number of that Caribbean hotel...

[PhaseOfPlay]

This made me so mad today. Even before Henderson received the ball Lallana should have been making the bending run. This is the problem you get when you want to play two creators between the lines and not people who make runs and have at least a bit of striker instincts.

There is a good reason why we don`t score as much as we would have liked. If Sturridge or Sterling were in that position you just know they would have attacked that space especially considering that subsequent Henderson`s pass and weight of it was actually spot on.

One creator between the lines is enough. The other player should always be somebody like Sterling, Markovic or Ibe.

Yep - gift horse looked in mouth there. I think Lallana should be rotation for Coutinho. Then, as you say, the other player - whether they are an out-and-out forward or a second striker - makes the runs off the work of the main forward. Two playmakers isn't working for our attack. I'd rather see Sterling up front and Coutinho in behind, then lose chances like that because of a lack of penetrating runs.

[Dree]

As like the beginning of last season, people are forgetting how young Sterling is. He's been fucking incredible at times. Of course he's going to have inconsistent times, especially when he's never been a top winger. He's special, not a run of the mill pace merchant like Townsend, Lennon and the like.

[kevin87]

Just putting it out there. I thought Balotelli showed a bit when he came on. As  a "second option" starting 11 i would like to see Sturridge and Balotelli start together. Sturridge looks so much more comfortable with a partner, and, no matter what you think of Balotelli, he always attracts at least 1 defender.

Our formation and forward set up was predictable and easily read by both Swansea and now Man utd. Opposition teams have become wiser to what we will be doing in our front half, and I would just like to see the boy given a start. Just to change things up and throw in that level of unpredictability he brings.

Not Sure if Arsenal is the game for this, but geez it would be a ballsy move by Brendan. Its a game we must win now so id be happy to roll the dice. If we start against them like we did today, with the lack of threatning runs coming from the front 3, we'll get done again.

[Zephyr]

I agree with that 100%. It is so frustrating to see such open spaces not being ran into by some of our lot.

Yep - gift horse looked in mouth there. I think Lallana should be rotation for Coutinho. Then, as you say, the other player - whether they are an out-and-out forward or a second striker - makes the runs off the work of the main forward. Two playmakers isn't working for our attack. I'd rather see Sterling up front and Coutinho in behind, then lose chances like that because of a lack of penetrating runs.

[Kopenhagen]

I think it's time to give Markovic another run in the centre, and maybe try Sterling up top with Sturridge (as a '2').

[Redman78]

Just putting it out there. I thought Balotelli showed a bit when he came on. As  a "second option" starting 11 i would like to see Sturridge and Balotelli start together. Sturridge looks so much more comfortable with a partner, and, no matter what you think of Balotelli, he always attracts at least 1 defender.

Our formation and forward set up was predictable and easily read by both Swansea and now Man utd. Opposition teams have become wiser to what we will be doing in our front half, and I would just like to see the boy given a start. Just to change things up and throw in that level of unpredictability he brings.

Not Sure if Arsenal is the game for this, but geez it would be a ballsy move by Brendan. Its a game we must win now so id be happy to roll the dice. If we start against them like we did today, with the lack of threatning runs coming from the front 3, we'll get done again.

Good point, I didn't think we looked too bad with Balotelli,  Sturridge and Sterling against spurs, I think against Arsenal we need to gamble a bit and be brave

[Dree]

I think it's time to give Markovic another run in the centre, and maybe try Sterling up top with Sturridge (as a '2').

Markovic was one of the best at wing back though, he was superb in the league cup semi. At least until Ibe's back.

[NorthamptonKopite]

Would hope the team looks like this for the next game. Quite clear Sterling isn't working out wide and the fact is he is a better player than Lallana who can cause more problems for oppositions.

                           Sturridge
   
               Coutinho            Sterling

     Moreno     Lucas        Henderson     Markovic

                Sakho       Skrtel      Can

                             Mignolet

Thats if Lucas is fit of course.

[Pradan]

Need to stop sacrificing Sterling's impact on this team for Lallana of all players. Lallana is a good squad player. He can fill in when injuries occur or due to lack of form to our starters.

Bewildering selection by Rodgers. All the even more so considering Rodgers stated only a month ago on Talksport, that Sterling didn't work out as the wing-back when he first tested the system at Newcastle.

[Studgotelli]

Random but I find it really annoying when Balotelli lines up FKs from ridiculous positions/distances. Just let someone put the ball in the box.

[Ken-Obi]

Need to stop sacrificing Sterling's impact on this team for Lallana of all players. Lallana is a good squad player. He can fill in when injuries occur or due to lack of form to our starters.

Bewildering selection by Rodgers. All the even more so considering Rodgers stated only a month ago on Talksport, that Sterling didn't work out as the wing-back when he first tested the system at Newcastle.

Great, blame Sterling on Lallana.

Sakho is holding Moreno back next.

[QC]

Great, blame Sterling on Lallana.

Sakho is holding Moreno back next.

He's right though. Sterling is shunted out wide to fit in Lallana.

[Redman0151]

Random but I find it really annoying when Balotelli lines up FKs from ridiculous positions/distances. Just let someone put the ball in the box.

Well we haven't scored from any of Henderson or Gerrard's wide free kicks in the league this year, so I don't see the problem with trying something new. Skrtel aside, our team are shocking at attacking balls put into the box

[Ken-Obi]

He's right though. Sterling is shunted out wide to fit in Lallana.

I was of the idea that the precocious talent of the reigning European Golden Boy would allow him to adapt and own any role, centre, wide, striker etc.

Don't ask me, ask the £150k/week brigade, that's what they said. *shrugs*

[Redman0151]

I was of the idea that the precocious talent of the reigning European Golden Boy would allow him to adapt and own any role, centre, wide, striker etc.

Don't ask me, ask the £150k/week brigade, that's what they said. *shrugs*

Should put Sturridge LWB too, he's on £150k per week so should adapt just fine

[Ken-Obi]

Should put Sturridge LWB too, he's on £150k per week so should adapt just fine

Sure. Sturridge was brought in to play as first and foremost, a striker. Paid his dues and some.

Direct that to the £150k/week groupie, mate - it's what they said, I'm just repeating what was mentioned.