Topic: Kolo Toure

[Dani LFC]

Apart from Gary McAllister, our record of signing players in their 30s is cack.

Karl-Heinz Riedle
Jari Litmanen
Mauricio Pellegrino
Robbie Fowler
Craig Bellamy

[Skidder.]

Karl-Heinz Riedle
Jari Litmanen
Mauricio Pellegrino
Robbie Fowler
Craig Bellamy

Aside of Bellamy and Litmanen, none of them really stand out as great 30+ signings. Pellegrino didn't do too well, Fowlers second stint was arguably nothing more than a PR stunt and Riedle didn't exactly do as well as expected. Bellamy was quite good and Litmanen joined us about 5 years too late.

When you hold McAllister up to these, well there's no real comparison. McAllister has been by far one of the best free signings we've made.

[Djimi Smicer34]

total bullshit of experience card.

What is the point of experience if the plan is to sit on the bench ? Two 28 years old defenders in team are not experienced enough ? Both respective captains of their country ? The simple fact is Skrtel is leaving and hence the so called experience needed.

The simple fact is Carragher has retired and Toure has been brought in as a solid squad player with a wealth of Premier League experience who can step in and do a more than adequate job if required and bring the same type of qualities to the squad that Carragher did.  Toure has nothing to do with Martin Skrtel, he would have been a target whether Skrtel stays or goes.

[JohnnoWhite]

Well on that method of evaluation so would Lescott don't you think?

[El Lobo]

It's 100% necessary to cut the manager the slack if he wishes to give club youngsters 1st team experience. If the answer is ever NO, how the feck does any football team handle its essential succession planning?

That's the managers shout - he HAS to back himself to make the right call.
The fans are obligated to recognise this responsibility.

Cant agree with that, as sensible as it sounds.

Last summer the manager was left in a bit of a hole and had to put his faith in youngsters, and he was cut slack accordingly. There has to be a certain level of expectation now though, so if he decided that he'd bed more youngsters in this season at the cost of points and positions then I dare say he wouldn't be cut the same slack.

[El Lobo]

Aside of Bellamy and Litmanen, none of them really stand out as great 30+ signings. Pellegrino didn't do too well, Fowlers second stint was arguably nothing more than a PR stunt and Riedle didn't exactly do as well as expected. Bellamy was quite good and Litmanen joined us about 5 years too late.

When you hold McAllister up to these, well there's no real comparison. McAllister has been by far one of the best free signings we've made.

Got to take issue with that

Scored some important goals for us in those two seasons. Plus you cant really just rate the impact these guys had on the pitch without mentioning the impact they may well have had off it. Fowler, Litmanen and Riedle in their pomp were three of the best strikers in Europe. Pellegrino was very good too, plus enabled us to rest players in the lead up to Istanbul.

Not saying Toure is of that standard, but he's had a very good career and has been a very good player for a lot of it.

[Djimi Smicer34]

Well on that method of evaluation so would Lescott don't you think?

Maybe, if he's available.  We've obviously decided that Toure is the player who fits the bill for us, just reading what Neil Jones of the Echo has had to say on Twitter, that the Man City scouts recommended Toure's fitness and character and that Rodgers was particularly impressed by his performance against Christian Benteke.  On a free transfer and having taken what the Echo calls a "significant" pay cut I think we've gotten a very good deal in Toure, could we have done the same with Lescott?

[Lucas DuoFlush]

The Greek was a successful signing anyway. He made a few mistakes (like every defender) but he was treated warmly by us and when he went most people were a little sad (though understood we had to release him). Bit of a cult figure and was magnificent in the air.

[Gnurglan]

A few years ago we signed Rangers reject Kyrgiakos as cover, a few years before that we signed a barely mobile Pellegrino as cover.

I think Toure has more to offer us now than either of those two did at that time. If he starts 15-20 league games next season I won't lose too much sleep.

There's a difference. Back then we needed cover and we signed backup players. It was about giving us cover on the cheap. Now we need to add a first pick and we've signed a backup player. Status quo. The only reasonable explanation for this is we're selling another player (or two) to finance that first pick.

I think this signing needs to be seen in a bigger context to make sense. We'll get the whole picture later on. But right now, I reckon we're on the same number of players as we were. And we are no better as a team.

[CHOPPER]

If you're good enough, you're young enough.

[El Lobo]

But right now, I reckon we're on the same number of players as we were. And we are no better as a team.

If we're going by that rationale, then we're already stronger as a team because we've lost Carra but gained Toure, Carroll and Spearing.

[Mutton Geoff]

i swear if we signed Messi somebody would be in here saying not for me, waste of money!

[Mutton Geoff]

If you're good enough, you're young enough.

Many a good tune played on an old fiddle!

[Entropicity]

Kop Only Loves One Toure 

[Gnurglan]

If we're going by that rationale, then we're already stronger as a team because we've lost Carra but gained Toure, Carroll and Spearing.

Touche.

Just think we need to see this signing for what it is later on. Let's say, for arguments sake, that we sign a top class CB with the money we get from selling for example Coates and Skrtel. Then it makes sense to add Toure on a free. In particular if we also plan to give Wisdom/Kelly or some other Academy player games at CB. Then we phase Toure out and we phase one of those in. Fine. He's a player for a transition period.

But we need to see this. I don't think Toure on his own has improved us. It's status quo. And if we add a 32-year old to keep status quo, well, then it's a bit pointless. Toure's signing will only make sense later on.

[Gnurglan]

Many a good tune played on an old fiddle!

Kolo Toure = Stradivarius? On a free?

[El Lobo]

Touche.

Just think we need to see this signing for what it is later on. Let's say, for arguments sake, that we sign a top class CB with the money we get from selling for example Coates and Skrtel. Then it makes sense to add Toure on a free. In particular if we also plan to give Wisdom/Kelly or some other Academy player games at CB. Then we phase Toure out and we phase one of those in. Fine. He's a player for a transition period.

But we need to see this. I don't think Toure on his own has improved us. It's status quo. And if we add a 32-year old to keep status quo, well, then it's a bit pointless. Toure's signing will only make sense later on.

Yep, completely agree.

All the signs point to us signing at least one more player at CB.

But on the flip side, and I hesitate to say this, even if we signed no-one and Toure WAS signed as first choice, it still might improve us..... Not to say Toure is a better defender than Carra, but he may well be more comfortable playing a higher line and in one on ones, and thus also get the best out of our fullbacks, Agger, Reina and our defensive mids and in turn the whole team.

Considering how many 'technical' people we have at the club, and how much attention we pay to small details, I'd suggest we've signed Toure for a reason over him just being experienced. He may actually be an upgrade on Carra, purely for his ability to play in a preferred Rodgers system.

[BigRed100]

Don't know how I feel about this one to be honest. But anyway, welcome.

This.

Welcome Kolo - now go lose a few pound before pre-season please!

[GBF]

didnt know we are signing only Kolo during the summer

bad Brendan!

[Skidder.]

Got to take issue with that

Scored some important goals for us in those two seasons. Plus you cant really just rate the impact these guys had on the pitch without mentioning the impact they may well have had off it. Fowler, Litmanen and Riedle in their pomp were three of the best strikers in Europe. Pellegrino was very good too, plus enabled us to rest players in the lead up to Istanbul.

Not saying Toure is of that standard, but he's had a very good career and has been a very good player for a lot of it.

I don't doubt that he did, but Fowler's second spell with us was as much a token signing than anything else. I don't think anybody expected him to really return and find a form of the Fowler of old, shake off some Injury problems he had and finish off his career with Liverpool. However, it was a really nice feeling seeing him back and I'm sure the locker room and academy where a bit stoked to have him back.

And I'm not denying that they where, in their prime, excellent players, but at 30+ signing for us, they didn't exactly make the impact that Gary McAllister had. True, they where signed as utility players, but the original point I was making was that the OP held them up against McAllister, they where in no way as good, or influential as Gary McAllister.

[eLToRo]

Soto was useful though mate. The big man was not world class or anything, but he was relatively solid.
Hopefully Kolo can give us even more.

Fair point. I'm not sure if he was 100 per cent solid but I cant remember him making any big mistakes and he scores a fair few aswell.

Kolo is a proven centre back in the Premier League. He played in great teams and know what it is like to win. The only reason he has stopped playing as much in the last 2 years is biggest they bought Lescott and like always at City the next player just gets dropped to be replaced by the guy they plaid more money for. Even though Toure is probably better than Lescott.

Great signing. He was great against us this year and is a better player than Carragher( in the last few years and debatably overall) so we are improved already as a squad. already.

[amir87]

If you're good enough, you're young enough.

The same rule applies to posters on Rawk too.

[Dani LFC]

Kolo Toure to sign for Liverpool on July 1

By James Pearce
29 May 2013

Kolo Toure is joining Liverpool FC on a free transfer from Manchester City after agreeing a two-year contract.

The 32-year-old defender passed his medical and finalised personal terms yesterday to become the Reds' first signing of the summer.

Toure’s current deal at Eastlands expires at the end of June so he will officially become a Liverpool player on July 1.

The ECHO understands that in moving to Anfield, the Ivory Coast international, who earns around £90,000 per week at City, has taken a significant pay cut.

Boss Brendan Rodgers has made no secret of his desire to add more experience to his ranks during the transfer window and firmly believes the centre-back fits the bill.

Toure has graced the Premier League for more than a decade and has won the title with both Arsenal and Man City.

He is viewed as a valuable squad player rather than as a direct replacement for retired vice-captain Jamie Carragher.

http://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/liverpool-fc-sign-kolo-toure-4025219

[Crackerjack Sam]

Good signing. end of

[brownie 09]

"@LivEchoLFC 4m
You can re-read our Kolo #Toure webchat with Rob Dawson here http://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/live-what-kolo-toure-bring-4027199 …"

[Gnurglan]

This.

Welcome Kolo - now go lose a few pound before pre-season please!

He's already agreed to a pay cut.

[idontknow]

Confident this will turn out a good signing.

[Bird Bird Bird The Bird Is The Word]

Welcome to Liverpool Kolo!

It's an odd transfer, it's very easy to stand back and think "He's on a free, has been playing well for City, their fans are unhappy about losing him, he's apparently taken a wage cut, so what's the catch?", however I think we've acted quickly and taken advantage of a club that is currently not being ran very well, much like how we took advantage of Inter and Chelsea in January.

If we can get another centre half like Kyriakos Papadopoulos, then we'll have three very good centre backs able to challenge for the two positions and then maybe Coates or another signing as back-up, I think we'll be in a very strong position for dealing with fatigue and fixtures.

[LincsRedbob]

need to see a picture of his face impressed on a cola cube now

[JohnnoWhite]

ElLobo posted:- Cant agree with that, as sensible as it sounds.

Last summer the manager was left in a bit of a hole and had to put his faith in youngsters, and he was cut slack accordingly. There has to be a certain level of expectation now though, so if he decided that he'd bed more youngsters in this season at the cost of points and positions then I dare say he wouldn't be cut the same slack.
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So what do you suggest is the way the fella in charge bloods his youngsters - back then now or in the future? Doing it on the training pitch is no substitute for the match-day scenario and when a manager has little funds at his disposal, what other choices does he or indeed do the fans have?
In crude parlance it's called shit or get off the pot time. The fans have either to back his hunches or cut him adrift after a while of waiting.

It was the same at United in 1989 when Fergie's arse was hangin' out the window until the class of 92 came through the youth ranks - and I think you know the rest of that story.

[penga]

Pretty much brought in to replace Carragher like for like. Good experienced player to add to depth but as has been suggested not sure he is 1st choice. He has been outcompeted by a young Nastasic in his 1st year basically. Better option than Ashley Williams due to price but he is lacking height and 40% odd aerial duel win rate is not going to solve our problems in the air.

[Roger Federer]

I'm assuming the manager and transfer committee have selected Papadopoulos for that role. What little I've seen of him is good, but that's what they get paid for.

So we're expecting our defence to be led by a 21-year old, who's been out for over 6 months (I think)? I don't watch Schalke and didn't pay much attention to Greece at Euro 2012, so I'm not disputing his quality (I haven't got a clue how good he is), but I'd be quite worried if Papa and Agger (could easily be injured), backed up by Toure, were our three main centre halfs at the start of the season.

[Red Beret]

Toure is a good signing for us.  With Carra gone it should be relatively cash neutral wages wise; he'll be no slower than Carra and he's just as experienced.

[Mr_Shane]

What I like about this signing is that if you want to win trophies or to challenge, you want players in your side who have the experience in winning must-win games. Toure having being in two squads that have won titles should have this experience, which is what I hope he will bring to our side.

[ManchesterBlue]

Toure is a good signing for us.  With Carra gone it should be relatively cash neutral wages wise; he'll be no slower than Carra and he's just as experienced.

He's quite a bit quicker than Carragher I'd say but not as much of a leader on the pitch.

[mulfella]

Toure is a good signing for us.  With Carra gone it should be relatively cash neutral wages wise; he'll be no slower than Carra and he's just as experienced.

Cash Neutral? He's likely to be on significantly less than Carra was.

[redmark]

So we're expecting our defence to be led by a 21-year old, who's been out for over 6 months (I think)? I don't watch Schalke and didn't pay much attention to Greece at Euro 2012, so I'm not disputing his quality (I haven't got a clue how good he is), but I'd be quite worried if Papa and Agger (could easily be injured), backed up by Toure, were our three main centre halfs at the start of the season.

Granted, we wouldn't want to replace two thirds of our senior centre backs in a single summer. Rodgers had little influence over Carragher's retirement, but it seems didn't get the leadership (or reaction) he wanted from Skrtel. It looks like we're approaching it fairly sensibly if that's what we have to do - an experienced player and a younger one; if we don't go for a younger player, we'll be looking at constantly having to address the position. I trust that we'll have done our homework on the knee injury and be confident that it's not of long term significance. I also think that if we are also looking at (for example) Llori to replace Coates, the manager will have a 4th choice he's more confident of using should the need arise.

There's some risk to the strategy, sure.

[Mr_Shane]

Skrtel and Coates are still here. Are we going to assume that they won't be here and we will not be getting anyone when the season starts then? That's a lot of assumptions to make

[Rusty]

Decent signing on a freebie, assuming his wages aren't enormous (which it doesn't sound like they are). Should bring some experience to the backline in case we are looking to give either Kelly or Wisdom some games in the centre maybe in the cups.

I would also expect us to get another bigger-money first pick centre back signing as well this summer, as well as cover at left back (after Enrique our options are Downing or Robinson).

[theCanadian]

Welcome to the club Kolo!

I've always liked him, as he's always seemed like a strong, hard-working, no-nonsense centre-back.

Makes sense as a guy to fill in the void left by Carragher. Probably nowhere near the leadership qualities but nevertheless, a decorated career and 3 years younger than Carra so he should be able to give us a couple of decent seasons hopefully.

I might have missed this bit, but does anyone know how long the contract is? I'd assume 2 years would be appropriate...