Topic: Shove fourth

[LiverpoolForever]

I know what you're saying mate, obviously I know we don't have a divine right to be in the Top 4, but why should it take time for us to do so? I'm sick of every year it being the same, ''only a year from challenging'' or ''2 or 3 away and we'll be right up there''.

We finished about 3/4 points behind Spurs last season, with a well worse squad than we currently have, they're probably favourites for 4th now and will be well within their rights to, for the moment, feel they may well get into the Champions League come next season.

 
 

Why should it take time? Do you think the teams above us and around us stood still while we were scratching around on free transfers? Teams above us have spent millions season in season out on top players , thats not a gap you close quickly , especially with us changing managers as often as we have.

The focus hasnt been just on the football at LFC.Rafa got us to within a whisker of the title with us playing great football but even that could be seen as a season of over-achiving.We aint the Liverpool of old , we havent got a right to be up there the same as Villa fans have accepted there wont be back as they were in the 80's.

All that said we are heading back in the right direction and are playing a lot better than we have been in the recent past.Breaking in the top 4 is probably harder than its ever been with City crashing in last season.

[pathetic]

you lot sound just like man utd fans....yeah, he may have signed keane, but didn't he also sign Alonso, Mascherano, Lucas etc (and that's just central midfielders). and barry isnt doing that bad is he?

anyway, just thought i'd put it out there.  doesn't mean i'm not backing the manager or the players, but i do think we could have spent the money better.  everyone is a genius in hindsight though.

[Ski]

Given what happened today it would've been all the more sweet had we managed to pick up 3pts yesterday. Hell, if we'd taken out chances last weekend we'd be level on pts with utd tonight & joint 2nd instead after some were laughing at the start the 2 n.london clubs started one is now only 2pts behind us and the other a pt ahead with a game in hand.

I know it's gonna take longer for the team to gel and we will (hopefully) become more ruthless and clinical just feeling a bit 'glass half empty' tonight.

[Billy The Kid]

Spent it on Barry and Keane?

Well you did ask for it

You just can't help yourself, can you?

[-Willo-]

Why should it take time? Do you think the teams above us and around us stood still while we were scratching around on free transfers? Teams above us have spent millions season in season out on top players , thats not a gap you close quickly , especially with us changing managers as often as we have.

The focus hasnt been just on the football at LFC.Rafa got us to within a whisker of the title with us playing great football but even that could be seen as a season of over-achiving.We aint the Liverpool of old , we havent got a right to be up there the same as Villa fans have accepted there wont be back as they were in the 80's.

All that said we are heading back in the right direction and are playing a lot better than we have been in the recent past.Breaking in the top 4 is probably harder than its ever been with City crashing in last season.

I'm on about Tottenham more than anyone, we finished within a whisker of 'em last season, while they've spent about £12 million if that this season, we've strengthened massively since January and all through the summer, so naturally should improve, therefore why is it ok for us to take our time to come to the level of Top 4 standard, yet they can go about their business, look pretty much spot on, and now climb to favourites for 4th, is that not a case of double standards? It should take us time, ok then, we keep telling ourselves that and we'll let the Spurs fans enjoy nights out at the Bernabeau, San Siro, Allianz Arena, etc...

Because there was not much in it come the end of the season, so naturally it should be pretty close, I know its early doors but I'm just saying it they're doing what is required really, if it was Arsenal in 4th and Spurs were level on points with us I'd say fair enough, same top 4 as last season, it may take time, and us and Spurs were around the same level, but again Spurs have shown its not too much of an ask, and if they are capable of it, we are (Top 4), especially since we've improved massively in the summer.

I still think we'll get top 4, or at least take it down to the wire, I'm just saying all this because our attitude as fans seems to be that its going to take time if you get me? Look at Spurs, its not taking them time by the looks of things so lets just put that 'excuse' to one side, and start putting the points on the board required to be back to where we should be.

They're setting the benchmark when ideally it'd be us, hopefully we start doing just that soon, starting at The Hawthorns?

[Breitner]

You just can't help yourself, can you?

No 

[Torpedo Tommy]

couldn't help but think what rafa would have done with the money we spent last January and in the summer....

Thats funny because I was thinking the same only about Paisley instead. Let's move on.

If people can't see that either bad luck or shite finishing cost us in the last two games then they really need to stop watching Sunday Supplement, SSN and Goals on Sunday and start watching and understanding football.

If we are 6th bottom and deservedly so then I can understand the level of shite that's posted. If we've just done enough in the last two games to win 4 games then I'd sort of hope for some patience from reds.

I left the game frustrated but with a bit more luck and by being a bit more clinical we'd have won yesterday comfortably. At least we are creating chances and not conceding that many.

We are at a stage when we should now be seeing the benefits and can't hide behind the new players excuse for much longer but some shite on here is unbelievable. Frustrating - yes! End of the world? Not at all. Let's have a bit of patience!

[jaffod]

Exactly.

Aint often I agree with Breitner, but stop rewriting history everyone. Rafa was terrible in the transfer market from September 2007 onwards.

Armed with 50 quid and a curly wurly so would you be.

[pathetic]

Thats funny because I was thinking the same only about Paisley instead. Let's move on.

If people can't see that either bad luck or shite finishing cost us in the last two games then they really need to stop watching Sunday Supplement, SSN and Goals on Sunday and start watching and understanding football.

If we are 6th bottom and deservedly so then I can understand the level of shite that's posted. If we've just done enough in the last two games to win 4 games then I'd sort of hope for some patience from reds.

I left the game frustrated but with a bit more luck and by being a bit more clinical we'd have won yesterday comfortably. At least we are creating chances and not conceding that many.

We are at a stage when we should now be seeing the benefits and can't hide behind the new players excuse for much longer but some shite on here is unbelievable. Frustrating - yes! End of the world? Not at all. Let's have a bit of patience!

i agree with you mate on the luck/lack of finishing. but you don't win games cause you deserve to. you win them by putting the ball at the back of the net.

[Torpedo Tommy]

you lot sound just like man utd fans....yeah, he may have signed keane, but didn't he also sign Alonso, Mascherano, Lucas etc (and that's just central midfielders). and barry isnt doing that bad is he?

anyway, just thought i'd put it out there.  doesn't mean i'm not backing the manager or the players, but i do think we could have spent the money better.  everyone is a genius in hindsight though.

Please! As much as I loved Rafa (and still do!) we have moved on. Let us as fans move on without forgetting Rafa but supporting Kenny and the lads.

[Torpedo Tommy]

i agree with you mate on the luck/lack of finishing. but you don't win games cause you deserve to. you win them by putting the ball at the back of the net.

You are right. And we must start scoring or we'll drop completely off the pace. But we aren't playing that bad. spurts away was shit but we ain't that bad. It will click, mark my words in a few months time

[Red Genius]

Well you can bet your bottom dollar there will be some shooting practise going on this week at Melwood, at least you'd fucking hope there should be, everybody needs to sharpen up infront of goal.

But hey if you told me this time last year the difference between then and now finishing in the top 4 was a bit of shooting practise i'd have sawn your arm off.

We're playing some good stuff in patches in every game, we have to take the chances whilst we're dominating and become more clinical. Its not like our build up and chance creation was a one off in this particular game its been a running theme for a few weeks now.

We'll sort it out, i've no worries about that.

[Billy The Kid]

Exactly.

Aint often I agree with Breitner, but stop rewriting history everyone. Rafa was terrible in the transfer market from September 2007 onwards.

Of course he was. He really spunked away a wad of financial backing, didn't he?

[jaffod]

Jaffod mate whilst your points on how a team are successful are fine and well, you surely know its not that simple. You can mock the statements about taking time but we are fucking miles away from this time last year, miles away. On that sort of trajectory, we can only look forward to a bright future. I can't see how you think its so bad; had we been terrible yesterday I'd understand everyone moaning but we were massively superior, very unlucky, playing some great stuff. You must see the improvement based on last season.

But it is that simple.

I'm not talking about our overall play, fwiw I think we can compete with anybody in this league on our day. But this thread is about our chances of finishing 4th and whether you like it or not the simple fact is if we continue to squander chances like we have done so far this season and continue to be so brittle at the back there is no chance of us getting a CL spot.
 It's the same mistakes being made over and over again and we're just not fucking learning from them. Suarez, arguably our best player, has missed clear cut chances in each of the 3 home games we've drawn...although he is by no means the sole culprit. The 3 goals conceded in those 1-1 draws have been diabolical from a defensive point of view.
 They are the harsh facts, basic aspects of the game of football. Until we put it right we can't claim to be playing great stuff.

[JP-65]

But it is that simple.

I'm not talking about our overall play, fwiw I think we can compete with anybody in this league on our day. But this thread is about our chances of finishing 4th and whether you like it or not the simple fact is if we continue to squander chances like we have done so far this season and continue to be so brittle at the back there is no chance of us getting a CL spot.
 It's the same mistakes being made over and over again and we're just not fucking learning from them. Suarez, arguably our best player, has missed clear cut chances in each of the 3 home games we've drawn...although he is by no means the sole culprit. The 3 goals conceded in those 1-1 draws have been diabolical from a defensive point of view.
 They are the harsh facts, basic aspects of the game of football. Until we put it right we can't claim to be playing great stuff.

and 3 1-0 leads given up at home, as we know from 3 seasons ago, draws kill you.

[pathetic]

You are right. And we must start scoring or we'll drop completely off the pace. But we aren't playing that bad. spurts away was shit but we ain't that bad. It will click, mark my words in a few months time

let's hope so. that's what i was thinking in the beginning of the season. but frustration sometimes takes over!!! anyway, have a feeling we'll beat west brom by a huge margin...let's take it from there, shall we

[drpepe]

and 3 1-0 leads given up at home, as we know from 3 seasons ago, draws kill you.

when you're playing for 4th rather than 1st, you get a little more leeway in terms of dropping points. but boy, we seem to like doing things the hard way 

[RedinExile]

Armed with 50 quid and a curly wurly so would you be.

pmsl
the weird thing is I almost used curly wurly in an abusive post I decided not to upload myself earlier - scary! dededededeedeeeeeeeeeeee!!

[Brentieke]

Armed with 50 quid and a curly wurly so would you be.

Of course he was. He really spunked away a wad of financial backing, didn't he?

6m Skrtel
7m Dossena
8m Riera
1.5m Ngog
3.5M Cvalieri
20m Keane
17.5m Johnson
18m Aquilani
1.5m Soto

Around 73m pounds spent gross there (hence the talk of net spend which diverts away from the fact that Rafa spent big on several players that we utter crap or alot worse than the players they replaced).

[pathetic]

6m Skrtel
7m Dossena
8m Riera
1.5m Ngog
3.5M Cvalieri
20m Keane
17.5m Johnson
18m Aquilani
1.5m Soto

Around 73m pounds spent gross there (hence the talk of net spend which diverts away from the fact that Rafa spent big on several players that we utter crap or alot worse than the players they replaced).

Keane, Cavalieri and Dossena are the only shit players in that list imo. and we almost recouped all our money back on them didn't we? name me a manager with a hundred percent record in the transfer market.

[kasperoff]

It's all hearsay now of course, but if Rafa had proper no caveat backing I reckon we'd have both Mata and Silva playing for us now. Not to mention perhaps Martinez, Alvez and Ramos.

[RedinExile]

6m Skrtel
7m Dossena
8m Riera
1.5m Ngog
3.5M Cvalieri
20m Keane
17.5m Johnson
18m Aquilani
1.5m Soto

Around 73m pounds spent gross there (hence the talk of net spend which diverts away from the fact that Rafa spent big on several players that we utter crap or alot worse than the players they replaced).

What was the loss made on all your +10M players listed? Dear oh fucking dear back to class for you mate

[1021]

6m Skrtel
7m Dossena
8m Riera
1.5m Ngog
3.5M Cvalieri
20m Keane
17.5m Johnson
18m Aquilani
1.5m Soto

Around 73m pounds spent gross there (hence the talk of net spend which diverts away from the fact that Rafa spent big on several players that we utter crap or alot worse than the players they replaced).

Skrtel: Kenny still plays him, solid centre half.
Dossena: Wasn't a great player for Liverpool, sometimes it doesn't work out, and worth the two forth goals from a nostalgic point of view.
Riera: Was a good player, but a gobshite.
Ngog: 1.5M, scored some good goals, worth a go for a youngster, played too much due to the thinness of the squad
Cavellieri: Back up keeper? Really that makes your list of grievances?
Keane: Didn't cost 20 million, was a bad signing, we cut our losses.
Johnson: Benitez, Capello, and Dalglish disagree with you but okay.
Aquilani: Never given a chance and AC Milan and Juventus disagree with you.
Soto: Definition of a solid signing.

[Lush is the best medicine...]

6m Skrtel
7m Dossena
8m Riera
1.5m Ngog
3.5M Cvalieri
20m Keane
17.5m Johnson
18m Aquilani
1.5m Soto

Around 73m pounds spent gross there (hence the talk of net spend which diverts away from the fact that Rafa spent big on several players that we utter crap or alot worse than the players they replaced).

you missed out masherano there

[xavidub]

True, but I wonder if there won't be a few raised eyebrows around FSG, so soon after they broke the club transfer record twice and authorised a heavy outlay not six months ago.

Since it seems we apparently analysed the stats and signed Henderson for his pass rate and Downing for his crossing it would have been good if we could have also analysed the goal-per-game stat and signed someone who excelled at that. In the end its the only stat that matters

[Torpedo Tommy]

let's hope so. that's what i was thinking in the beginning of the season. but frustration sometimes takes over!!! anyway, have a feeling we'll beat west brom by a huge margin...let's take it from there, shall we

Aye! T'would be good

[please, I have my reasons for it but...]

What are you on about daft arse? It's not made up it's a huge fucking fact. But we're Liverpool, etc

That doesn't reflect on any fucking thing other than you trying to wrongly prove your point, Spurs finished 8th, City finished 10th in 2008-09. In 2009-10, they were 4th and 5th respectively.

[Snail]

Exactly.

Aint often I agree with Breitner, but stop rewriting history everyone. Rafa was terrible in the transfer market from September 2007 onwards.

I can't possibly imagine why that was...

[Jetmir M.]

Since it seems we apparently analysed the stats and signed Henderson for his pass rate and Downing for his crossing it would have been good if we could have also analysed the goal-per-game stat and signed someone who excelled at that. In the end its the only stat that matters

Couldn't agree more really. We so badly need a poacher, I think our chances of securing 4th will be down to whether we add a goal scoring striker or not. As much as we all love Suarez, he's not the most prolific striker out there, is he? And, for all the hard work he puts in, neither is Kuyt actually. As for Andy... he just isn't clicking at Liverpool. Our play is pretty shitty when he's in the team actually, with the likes of Carra hoofing it to him every time they got the ball, it's so predictable and easy for the opposition to defend.

Now, I realize sometimes it's down to luck, but with us it's happening every game actually (creating a lot and not scoring enough) and somehow we've forgotten how it's like to keep a clean sheet.

[Torpedo Tommy]

6m Skrtel
7m Dossena
8m Riera
1.5m Ngog
3.5M Cvalieri
20m Keane
17.5m Johnson
18m Aquilani
1.5m Soto

Around 73m pounds spent gross there (hence the talk of net spend which diverts away from the fact that Rafa spent big on several players that we utter crap or alot worse than the players they replaced).

Honestly why do we have to do this?

You are right but I don't get why have to keep revisiting Rafa's failures. Just so unnecessary as we've moved on.

I'm praying for 6 points from West Brom and Swansea - just for harmony on here.

[-Willo-]

That doesn't reflect on any fucking thing other thing other than you trying to wrongly prove your point, Spurs finished 8th, City finished 10th in 2008-09. In 2009-10, they were 4th and 5th respectively.

[CallumLFC]

That doesn't reflect on any fucking thing other thing other than you trying to wrongly prove your point, Spurs finished 8th, City finished 10th in 2008-09. In 2009-10, they were 4th and 5th respectively.

Bang.

[Breitner]

That doesn't reflect on any fucking thing other thing other than you trying to wrongly prove your point, Spurs finished 8th, City finished 10th in 2008-09. In 2009-10, they were 4th and 5th respectively.

Maybe you've forgotten just how far we'd fallen? 2nd to 7th, a club at war, almost bankrupt and dragged through the courts, and a fuckwit of a manager come and gone within 6 months, all the while City were spending gazillions and Spurs were quietly building a well run club and consistant team. But of course we should be right back up there straight away, cos we're Liverpool and have won loads of stuff in the past

Makes me wonder what that strife was all for when all we end up with is a load of armchair managers pissing and moaning because it's not an overnight fix. We're probably one bad result away from a Dalglish out thread on here, which is pretty fucking horrendous when you think about it

[Breitner]

Bang.

Yeah right

[Gifted Right Foot]

i think fourth spot will be a race between manchester united and newcastle with us getting third... *troll face*

[RedinExile]

Makes me wonder what that strife was all for when all we end up with is a load of armchair managers pissing and moaning because it's not an overnight fix. We're probably one bad result away from a Dalglish out thread on here, which is pretty fucking horrendous when you think about it

Dear Pastor Breitner, don't be offended if I don't take any sermons from your good self on how to demonstrate support for managers of Liverpool Football Club from the likes of your hypocritical self. All the best.

[Breitner]

Dear Pastor Breitner, don't be offended if I don't take any sermons from your good self on how to demonstrate support for managers of Liverpool Football Club from the likes of your hypocritical self. All the best.

You don't actually suppport Liverpool though, just senor Benitez

[Breitner]

Well i am.

Cold, sad individual. So sad the crap you spout about a man who gave us so many great memories.

Aye, Pompey away stands out as one particular nightmare. But then gloryhunters only remember the big european victories

[Johnnyboy1973]

Fuck me. Rafa bad, Rafa good?

You sad fuckers.

Judge Kenny. Personally I would wait more than nine games but you ALL have your thresholds.

[please, I have my reasons for it but...]

Maybe you've forgotten just how far we'd fallen? 2nd to 7th, a club at war, almost bankrupt and dragged through the courts, and a fuckwit of a manager come and gone within 6 months, all the while City were spending gazillions and Spurs were quietly building a well run club and consistant team. But of course we should be right back up there straight away, cos we're Liverpool and have won loads of stuff in the past

Makes me wonder what that strife was all for when all we end up with is a load of armchair managers pissing and moaning because it's not an overnight fix. We're probably one bad result away from a Dalglish out thread on here, which is pretty fucking horrendous when you think about it

So? That was more than a year ago, we after that had two transfer windows and had money to spend in them. Just like City and Spurs in the summer of 2009, we had the variety to buy players that we want with lots of cash stacking in our bank account. With the amount of money we spent and the number of players we brought, we should be doing better. I'm sure Spurs were also a relegation fodder in 2008-09 till November which if anything further proves my point. I'm not saying we should be on the same level with City, United and Chelsea right now, but comparing our performance to our direct rivals for forth, we are still behind.

I'd also love if you take a look at Newcastle, a club within war of itself, an owner who is bad, an inferior manager to the one we have, sold most of their good players (Carroll, Enrique, Barton and Nolan) and bought shit loads of others in the summer, compare their performances to ours and most importantly their new recruits to our new recruits and which ones have performed better. Just because our manager is Kenny Dalglish doesn't mean he isn't immune to constructive criticism, and even though I love him and support him, I have to say we should perform better than we are right now or else there is a problem. This "but we're October" bollocks don't matter, a point dropped in October weighs the same as a point dropped in April.