Author Topic: The Apollo moon landings thread (Read 52778 times)

Byrnee · « **Reply #120 on:** July 7, 2009, 11:23:18 am »

Quote from: MichaelA on July 5, 2009, 02:56:41 pm

Whereas you have provided what evidence to the contrary?

As an aside, I genuinely think that any individual who believes in conspiracy theories does so out of a innate and deep seated insecurity about their own intelligence. By demonstrating their scepticism about widely held beliefs of the majority, they somehow convince themselves that they're smarter than the average bear...but they're not. They're bottom feeders with a warped sense of self importance. IMHO.

No offence intended to any if you out there wearing your tin foil hats.

That is so, so true.

Excellent read, this thread, apart from the nutters.

Thanks for all the good links and photos peeps, fascinating stuff. I've always loved Space and been in awe of the moon landings. How sad that people feel the need to question one of mankind's greatest ever achievements. The men and woman of the Apollo space project were heroes, and will be remembered as such through the ages.

The men and women who perpetuate the myth of the hoax are fools, and will quickly be forgotten. They remind me an awful lot of creationists - deny the weight of evidence to the point of absurdity. They simply DON'T WANT TO believe, and will not accept the evidence, no matter what.

Incidentally, as with Creationism, the burden of proof is with them. It has been PROVED that man went to the moon. Someone can tell me that they didn't, but since I have science and facts to back up my argument, they can't keep telling me to prove it, they have to prove the opposite opinion. And they can't. They're like children, sticking their fingers in their ears and shouting out for attention. Pathetic.

I'm inspired by the moon landings and the brave work achieved by everyone involved in pushing forward the science behind it.

The hoax arguments bore me to tears.

Science Dared.
And Succeeded.
Wonderful.

Sorted!! · « **Reply #121 on:** July 7, 2009, 11:24:41 am »

Some wonderful pictures on this thread.

PROPER crazyemlyn72 · « **Reply #122 on:** July 7, 2009, 03:05:33 pm »

they are 2 great photos above^^^^^^^^

CHOPPER · « **Reply #123 on:** July 7, 2009, 04:18:04 pm »

Slightly off topic and I don't want to hijack the thread but seeing as our only look into ours and other galaxy's are via space telescopes (the earth radio telescopes are a bit drab if you ask me) am just gonna chuck a few images out there for your appreciation, NASA really do some good telescopes and not forgetting Galex and Chandra. I could spend all day looking at images like these, some of the better images are just to big to post, I may post some.....infact go look yourself you won't be disappointed.

Hubble

Spitzer
guesstimated look in space

actual

Alan_X · « **Reply #124 on:** July 7, 2009, 08:39:28 pm »

Slightly off topic but space related. There was a really good programme about the Russian space dogs on the BBC:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/b00lkvtp/Space_Dogs/

Some amazing footage...

lurganboy · « **Reply #125 on:** July 7, 2009, 10:32:14 pm »

Also well worth watching. I'm literally seconds finished watching it - In The Shadow of the Moon. The feature length documentary available on YouTube in 10 parts.

Utterly stunning in parts. I have never seen lunar mountains like them. Stunning.

ttnbd · « **Reply #126 on:** July 7, 2009, 10:35:15 pm »

There is a programme on discovery on the 20th called Moon Walk 1. A lot of digitally remastered film that's not been seen for atleast 35 years by Theo Kamecke. Should be a good watch (it's 2 and a half hours long). 10pm on the discovery channel.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/film/2009/may/25/apollo-11-anniversary

RedSandgrounder · « **Reply #127 on:** July 8, 2009, 02:14:07 am »

Not to try and start up conspiracy theories again, nor am I sure I believe them, I haven't even looked into them too deeply, and I'd love, love to believe that man stepped on the moon just little than 40 years ago.

However, for me, it's far, far more absurd, to believe that they DID do it, than the easy way of thinking that they just faked it.

As I say, I guess I believe more that they did land on the moon in 1969, but doubt creeps in every so often, just because if they did, it is such an amazing, incredible, unthinkable feat.

TomG · « **Reply #128 on:** July 8, 2009, 03:09:27 am »

Great thread fellas.

Has something more significant ever been achieved by man?

In my opinion, no.

How often do we all stare up at the moon at night in wonder and amazement. Imagine what it felt like to be Armstrong and Aldrin and be able to stare back down at the earth, 250,000 miles away and be the first to gaze at such an awe inspiring site.

To see the oceans and the continents all at once, with the wonderful backdrop of deep space. Just thinking about it makes one feel so small and insignificant, but at the same time feel so lucky to be a part of this miracle we call life in our universe.

Now almost forty years on from landing on the moon, one has to think of what man will discover and achieve in the next forty years. It truly boggles the mind.

MichaelA · « **Reply #129 on:** July 9, 2009, 08:41:32 pm »

Horizon on BBC4 now is an incredibly powerful and moving programme about the Apollo landings and the space race that lead to the very summit of human achievement.

Phil M · « **Reply #130 on:** July 9, 2009, 09:05:30 pm »

Quote from: MichaelA on July 9, 2009, 08:41:32 pm

Horizon on BBC4 now is an incredibly powerful and moving programme about the Apollo landings and the space race that lead to the very summit of human achievement.

Damn, missed that.

4pool · « **Reply #131 on:** July 9, 2009, 10:08:49 pm »

Quote from: RedSandgrounder on July 8, 2009, 02:14:07 am

Not to try and start up conspiracy theories again, nor am I sure I believe them, I haven't even looked into them too deeply, and I'd love, love to believe that man stepped on the moon just little than 40 years ago.

However, for me, it's far, far more absurd, to believe that they DID do it, than the easy way of thinking that they just faked it.

As I say, I guess I believe more that they did land on the moon in 1969, but doubt creeps in every so often, just because if they did, it is such an amazing, incredible, unthinkable feat.

Don't worry. There are those who say the holocaust never happened either. In spite of the overwhelming evidence.

Photo shopped and made up the whole incident.

And if people preach it long enough , people will believe.

As for going to the moon, it 100% happened as well.

Either that or the damn government spent one hell of a lot of money for a good tv flick. I doubt President Kennedy and then Johnson spent money on a made for tv movie. But I suppose conspiracy theorists would have an excuse for where the money went as well.

lachesis · « **Reply #132 on:** July 10, 2009, 09:51:27 am »

Been reading that NASA have plans to be back on the moon by 2020.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/sci/tech/4261522.stm

Quite an old article, but was mentioned here again:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/sci/tech/8142935.stm

Quote

He also revealed that Nasa's plans to send an American back to the Moon by 2020 could be delayed.

It was important now, he said, to balance science spending priorities.

Rafas Tapas · « **Reply #133 on:** July 10, 2009, 10:57:02 am »

Caught Sunday's BBC documentary (the one narrated by Michael Kitchen) on I Player last night. It was feature-length (about 100 mins) but I can't remember being so absorbed in a TV programme. In particular I was struck by the quiet, understated manner of nearly all the Apollo participants interviewed - Aldrin and Borman especially. I thought as I was watching it how well a lot of these guys were wearing, but it was only at the end that I realized that the programme was made in 1994 - presumably to mark the twenty-fifth anniversary of Apollo 11. I'm afraid I doubt that the BBC could make such a compelling programme today: now it would be half the length, with most of that given over to no-mark celebrities sharing their irrelevant reminiscences and reflections.

Anyway another thing that struck me was how Apollo 8 has been relatively neglected by history. This was actually man's first visit to the moon - OK they didn't land but they accomplished the (to me) terrifying task of leaving earth's orbit and traversing 250,000 miles of the void.

As regards the conspiracy theory, personally I don't think there's anything in it, although I do understand why some people might at least have an open mind - after all, the Apollo programme was a mind-blowingly difficult project which was accomplished with astonishing success, and in less time than it now takes to get planning permission for a new power station in the UK. If the project had miscarried, especially at a late stage, maybe there would have been an incentive for NASA to look into ways of faking success. I'm sure that didn't happen - for one thing, it would have come out by now - but I don't think its very courteous to bracket sceptics on this topic with Holocaust deniers and other brands of nutter.

Danny Boys Dad · « **Reply #134 on:** July 10, 2009, 11:02:16 am »

Quote from: TomG on July 8, 2009, 03:09:27 am

Has something more significant ever been achieved by man?

In my opinion, no.

I suppose there is a good argument that something like eradicating smallpox was a greater and more significant achievement in terms of the impact on ordinary people, but the spin-offs from the space programme have changed the world completely in a way that not much else has since the combustion engine or the printed word.

CHOPPER · « **Reply #135 on:** July 10, 2009, 11:16:06 am »

In 1999 the year of the moonbase

the BBC ran a series called The Planets, if you get a chance to watch this I seriously recommend that you do, a fabulous series and one of if not the best programmes on our solar system, or at least since Space 1999 that is.

Xabi Gerrard · « **Reply #136 on:** July 10, 2009, 11:40:54 am »

Quote from: 4pool on July 9, 2009, 10:08:49 pm

Don't worry. There are those who say the holocaust never happened either. In spite of the overwhelming evidence.

Photo shopped and made up the whole incident.

And if people preach it long enough , people will believe.

Jesus F Christ. Get a grip man.

Quote from: Rafas Tapas on July 10, 2009, 10:57:02 am

As regards the conspiracy theory, personally I don't think there's anything in it, although I do understand why some people might at least have an open mind - after all, the Apollo programme was a mind-blowingly difficult project which was accomplished with astonishing success, and in less time than it now takes to get planning permission for a new power station in the UK. If the project had miscarried, especially at a late stage, maybe there would have been an incentive for NASA to look into ways of faking success. I'm sure that didn't happen - for one thing, it would have come out by now - but I don't think its very courteous to bracket sceptics on this topic with Holocaust deniers and other brands of nutter.

Spot. On.

4pool · « **Reply #137 on:** July 10, 2009, 12:54:49 pm »

Quote from: Xabi Gerrard on July 10, 2009, 11:40:54 am

Jesus F Christ. Get a grip man.

I do have a grip.

The analogy is there that there are those out there who are skeptics. You just don't like the analogy I used.

There are those who believe the US Government was behind 9/11 and brought down the buildings in spite of the overwhelming evidence to the contrary there still is some traction for some.

It's dead easy to put doubt in someones mind. Fancy website. Technical issues that seem plausible to some. Then you get someone to actually believe the conspiracy. Spread it throughout the web and there you go.

Same with those who question there never was a landing on the Moon.

My question would be after 40 years, all those within Nasa, the government, etc..none have come out to claim it was a hoax. And this is from a government that leaks documents left, right, and center.

Art Vandelay · « **Reply #138 on:** July 10, 2009, 01:15:09 pm »

Quote from: lachesis on July 10, 2009, 09:51:27 am

Been reading that NASA have plans to be back on the moon by 2020.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/sci/tech/4261522.stm

Quite an old article, but was mentioned here again:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/sci/tech/8142935.stm

They just did a test a couple of days ago for the new Orion spacecraft...

http://www.space.com/missionlaunches/090708-astronaut-escape-ship-test.html

Art Vandelay · « **Reply #139 on:** July 10, 2009, 01:19:29 pm »

And NASA are planning to take photo's of the Apollo landing sites with the LRO that's currently in moon orbit, which hopefully will end all this conspiracy bollocks*.

*Yeah I know, some utter twats will still say it's fake....

Xabi Gerrard · « **Reply #140 on:** July 10, 2009, 01:36:07 pm »

Quote from: 4pool on July 10, 2009, 12:54:49 pm

I do have a grip.

The analogy is there that there are those out there who are skeptics. You just don't like the analogy I used.

There are those who believe the US Government was behind 9/11 and brought down the buildings in spite of the overwhelming evidence to the contrary there still is some traction for some.

It's dead easy to put doubt in someones mind. Fancy website. Technical issues that seem plausible to some. Then you get someone to actually believe the conspiracy. Spread it throughout the web and there you go.

Same with those who question there never was a landing on the Moon.

My question would be after 40 years, all those within Nasa, the government, etc..none have come out to claim it was a hoax. And this is from a government that leaks documents left, right, and center.

You're right I dont like the analogy you used. It was downright lazy.

The Holocaust is one of the most emotive issues there is, a heinous, terrble crime. Those who deny its existance are by and large nasty people with severe racist tendancies. However stupid you may feel people are who dont believe in the moon landings, they are a complete different kettle of fish.

If you're just extremely naive and really cant see the difference, please take a bit of time to think about it before you go comparing them again.

If you didnt already know, you can be arrested in half of Europe for not believing in the Holocaust. As ridiculous as that is, I hope it gives you some sort of indication of the emotions involved, and how vile characters who deny it are perceived to be.

Sorry for continuing this off-topic strand of the thread. I actually believe man landed on the moon, but I wouldnt be surprised if it was revealed to be bollox one day. Fair enough if anyone thinks I'm stupid for this, but banding me with Holocaust deniers, thats just not on.

You should have just used the 9/11 conspiracy thing for your analogy from the beginning.

Rafas Tapas · « **Reply #141 on:** July 10, 2009, 01:46:18 pm »

Quote from: 4pool on July 10, 2009, 12:54:49 pm

I do have a grip.

The analogy is there that there are those out there who are skeptics. You just don't like the analogy I used.

There are those who believe the US Government was behind 9/11 and brought down the buildings in spite of the overwhelming evidence to the contrary there still is some traction for some.

It's dead easy to put doubt in someones mind. Fancy website. Technical issues that seem plausible to some. Then you get someone to actually believe the conspiracy. Spread it throughout the web and there you go.

Same with those who question there never was a landing on the Moon.

My question would be after 40 years, all those within Nasa, the government, etc..none have come out to claim it was a hoax. And this is from a government that leaks documents left, right, and center.

I agree with you, but your Holocaust analogy is insulting and specious. Holocaust deniers, I would imagine, are mostly actuated by anti-semitism or similar repellent prejudices. Whilst I think moon-landing sceptics are mistaken, it's difficult to know what axe they have to grind, apart maybe from anti-Americanism in some instances. In other words, these sceptics claim to have their doubts because that they genuinely do. To put them in with knuckle-dragging neo-Nazis is pretty bad form.

4pool · « **Reply #142 on:** July 10, 2009, 03:21:12 pm »

So it seems that some deniers are classified as different based on how much one abhors what is being denied. And the lesson learned is there are classifications of various denial groups. Not that to be in denial against all evidence to the contrary, which is what denial groups do, is the point regardless of what it is actually being denied.

Rafas Tapas · « **Reply #143 on:** July 10, 2009, 03:45:45 pm »

Quote from: 4pool on July 10, 2009, 03:21:12 pm

So it seems that some deniers are classified as different based on how much one abhors what is being denied. And the lesson learned is there are classifications of various denial groups. Not that to be in denial against all evidence to the contrary, which is what denial groups do, is the point regardless of what it is actually being denied.

Wouldn't you find it insulting to have your views, on a topic entirely unrelated to the Holocaust, equated to those of a Holocaust denier? Don't you understand that there is a moral aspect to Holocaust denial which is absent from other forms of scepticism, no matter how cranky you might think they are?

4pool · « **Reply #144 on:** July 10, 2009, 08:12:45 pm »

Yes.

But again that is one being selective because of the analogy chosen.

So what you are saying is the Holocaust is off limits unless there is a specific discussion on that very topic.

Naturally, someone would be upset if they were a denier of something and then someone interjected well there are holocaust deniers as well. Wouldn't sit well.

But the point is, deniers regardless of what is being denied in spite of overwhelming evidence still are deniers.

The overwhelming evidence points to Man really did land on the moon. Same with the gas chambers in Germany. But if i wanted to be a skeptic, be anti Goverment, be whatever and then claim it was a hoax and that wouldn't surprise me if it was--where is the logic different?

One hundred years from now there will be more Holocaust deniers because most won't be alive who know different. So those with control of the media or education system will be able to claim anything. And people will still have the facts to dispute but there won't be the personal connection of those alive.

Which is why students at University seem to be the main ones who don't believe Man landed on the moon. Or 9/11 was a put up job by the US government as a reason to go to war. The longer we get away from the event, the more traction deniers will get. It's 40 years since Man landed on the moon and look what we have now. You wouldn't have had this 35-40 years ago.

Party Phil · « **Reply #145 on:** July 11, 2009, 11:53:56 am »

Quote from: Art Vandelay on July 10, 2009, 01:19:29 pm

And NASA are planning to take photo's of the Apollo landing sites with the LRO that's currently in moon orbit, which hopefully will end all this conspiracy bollocks

obviously they'll fake it

Tuckwoor · « **Reply #146 on:** July 13, 2009, 04:53:18 pm »

I keep reading about the new moon landings that they are planning on downsizing the "moon base" ideas. They better not just stick a flag up there this time.

We want HD footage of the astronauts browsing RAWK using the new PTN space internet extension.

It's Jimmy Corkhill · « **Reply #147 on:** July 14, 2009, 09:01:15 pm »

This new Lunar Orbiter is pure shit, its only sent 3 pictures back in about a week.

Scruffy penny-pinching bastards

Surprise me. · « **Reply #148 on:** July 15, 2009, 11:21:43 pm »

maybe a bit off-topic but just seen the space shuttle launch. Fantastic thing to see. 4000mph at one point! Looks like they are travelling very slowly from the camera too as they enter space. Same as the way planes are seen from the ground i guess.

Phil M · « **Reply #149 on:** July 15, 2009, 11:25:14 pm »

Quote from: El Torres on July 15, 2009, 11:21:43 pm

maybe a bit off-topic but just seen the space shuttle launch. Fantastic thing to see. 4000mph at one point! Looks like they are travelling very slowly from the camera too as they enter space. Same as the way planes are seen from the ground i guess.

Where did you see it mate?

alex. · « **Reply #150 on:** July 15, 2009, 11:26:41 pm »

Quote from: Phil M on July 15, 2009, 11:25:14 pm

Where did you see it mate?

It was live on the NASA website/BBC News about 20 minutes ago, amazing sight

Phil M · « **Reply #151 on:** July 15, 2009, 11:27:38 pm »

Quote from: alex. on July 15, 2009, 11:26:41 pm

It was live on the NASA website/BBC News about 20 minutes ago, amazing sight

Ah bollocks why do I always miss things like that, sounds amazing.

The Fletcher Memorial · « **Reply #152 on:** July 16, 2009, 12:28:15 am »

The question surely is not if man has been to the moon or not, but where are his microscopic masters trying to get to?

I'd ask mine but they're always asleep!

TomG · « **Reply #153 on:** July 16, 2009, 03:55:12 am »

I woke up this morning and flicked on the telly and they were halfway through the countdown. Talk about great timing.

Was amazing.

seanoevil · « **Reply #154 on:** July 16, 2009, 11:16:54 am »

goto nasa tv now - its live all the way through the mission - with updates from previous day activities etc....watching catch up of the close out crew getting the astronauts into the shuttle. Cramped space, having to pull and push them around to get them in lol, everyone looking so relaxed...amazing stuff...

Biggest gathering in space ever later today when they dock with the space station and their team...

Got my youngest boy up to watch the launch last night. Well chuffed he was - in school this morning talking about it

seanoevil · « **Reply #155 on:** July 16, 2009, 11:19:29 am »

Also goto www.wechoosethemoon.com reliving the apollo 11 mission in real time, graphics, pics, vids, etc......welll good

MichaelA · « **Reply #156 on:** July 17, 2009, 06:00:49 pm »

Quote from: Art Vandelay on July 10, 2009, 01:19:29 pm

And NASA are planning to take photo's of the Apollo landing sites with the LRO that's currently in moon orbit, which hopefully will end all this conspiracy bollocks*.

*Yeah I know, some utter twats will still say it's fake....

The Lunar Reconnaisance Orbiter has just sent back images from ~~a hangar in Area 51~~ it's lunar mapping mission - take a look here.

Art Vandelay · « **Reply #157 on:** July 17, 2009, 07:10:58 pm »

Quote from: MichaelA on July 17, 2009, 06:00:49 pm

The Lunar Reconnaisance Orbiter has just sent back images from ~~a hangar in Area 51~~ it's lunar mapping mission - take a look here.

Awesome. Love how it's all so untouched (obviously). I very much hope that when we do go back, one of the first missions is to land near the Eagle.....what a moment that would be, to visit the first landing site.

Alan_X · « **Reply #158 on:** July 17, 2009, 07:41:57 pm »

Quote from: MichaelA on July 17, 2009, 06:00:49 pm

The Lunar Reconnaisance Orbiter has just sent back images from ~~a hangar in Area 51~~ it's lunar mapping mission - take a look here.

Great pictures - of course the ~~nutters~~ conspiracy theorists will say they're faked but for everyone else that is just staggering. To see the footprints on the moon from the LRO (and the next few passes will be even higher resolution) will hopefully put this to bed for most people.

The arrow in this picture points to the base of the LEM, which remained on the surface. You can clearly make out the tracks they left on their EVA towards the crater at the top left.

This is the original record of the EVA (it's upside-down with the LEM to the left and the crater to the right.

The next photo is a shot taken by Ed Mitchell on the outward trek towards the Cone - you can see Al Sheppard in front dragging the MET and heading up the slope into the sun. The cone is rising up towards left of the picture. The position of the photo is B2 on the map.

The photo was one of a series taken to form a full 360º panorama:

For those who said it was easier to fake a few photos - sorry but you really don't have a clue. basically they would have had to create all of these images, videos and audio clips and in a period when there simply weren't any computer graphics - everything was done with painted mattes and models - ensure that they tie in perfectly with images now being taken 40 years on, that show detail that at that time could only have been seen from the surface of the moon.

I've just been looking through the Apollo 14 image library again and it's amazing to tie in the videos and panoramas with that photo.

http://history.nasa.gov/alsj/a14/images14.html

I'm looking forward to the higher res images of the other sites.

Art Vandelay · « **Reply #159 on:** July 17, 2009, 07:46:12 pm »

And if anyone on here is one of these people who think the moon landings were faked, please go and tell Buzz Aldrin.....