Topic: Rafa knocks back contract

[SamAteTheRedAcid]

No he should not, look at his failures too - Morientes, Dossena etc, he makes mistakes too.

Dossena - alright, he's looked pretty shite so far, but can;t we withhold the final damnations until he's had a whole season?

Morientes - there was hardly a Red who didn't think we'd got a soddin bargain with him, seemed like a dream someone like Morientes, proven CL winner, coming to Liverpool, at that point in our rebuild at least -  I was made up with the news. OK so he didn't adapt well to the PL, and maybe Rafa should have known that, but it's not something that is entirely predictable. But Morientes for less than ten million, that'd be like someone offering, for example, David Villa to us for £12 mill now, you'd bite their fucking hand off up to the elbow. I still don't think that can go down as a transfer failure on Rafa's part.

About the contract - I'm a bit gutted. Mind you, didn't Moyes sign his new contract with Everton the week before they played us at Goodison earlier in the season and they got beat, so maybe we'll win (clings frantically at fuzzy logic) this one.

[rafathegaffa83]

Give Rafa our vocal support each and every match. He needs to be given in his contract what he feel he needs to compete. I think part of this is more transparency on how much he actually has to spend each year and control over transfers to stop a repeat of the Barry saga. I'm amazed we are in the position we are in the league considering the off-the-field antics he constantly has to put up with.

[Jason McG]

name me one top european team were the manager does the deals .

The CEO and manager should work as a team, if that doesn't happen, it should be the manager who determines the targets and (assuming he's been given a budget) the value of those players. Ultimately it's the manager who stands or falls by the signings which is what Rafa has said.

Just putting the transfers to one side, what do you think about the academy situation? This appears as important to Rafa as the transfers.

[JackBurton]

You are joking right?

Reina, Arbeloa, Skrtel, Agger, Insua, Mascherano, Alonso, Torres - all Benitez signings.

Alves, Simao (to an extent), Vidic. Players he couldn't sign as he didn't have the control he wants.

So because of a few bad signings (which only Dossena is still here - and even then he's only had 6 months) someone should decide for Benitez who he does/doesn't sign?!

He wanted Berbatov as well but we took too long and ended up being drawn against his old team in the CL, making the transfer impossible.  By the time the opportunity arose again his value had risen dramatically.

[Gnurglan]

I believe Rafa should be given a sum of money to spend as he pleases. Naturally, he should have some help from financial people to set up the best deals, so they need to be involved.

But when it comes to decisions about who to sign, that is Rafa's job.

[Stussy]

Can't wait for next Friday, lets see if he can make it three in a row....

 

Has to be a whack at Everton next week, another knock at Mr Ferguson too for good measure.

"My doctor, he show me the kidney stones under a microscope, eez looks like David Moyes and Meestah Fergusons face, you know"

[scatman]

This is great.

There's no actual talk of the derby game now, this is good, the players can concentrate on the game away from the media prescence as they concentrate on Rafa. Wenger has done this many a time for his players.

Parry needs to walk and Beni does need control, the list of players we've missed out on because of vetos from Parry is major, the one that still pisses me off is Dani Alves, we could have had for a snippet at £12m, 2 seasons later and he's signed by Barca for in excess of £25m. fuckin ridiculous.

[Tyler Durden]

Has to be a whack at Everton next week, another knock at Mr Ferguson too for good measure.

"My doctor, he show me the kidney stones under a microscope, eez looks like David Moyes and Meestah Fergusons face, you know"

No, they were his stool samples

[red_dub]

i think rafa is right and i don't think he is in the same position as ferguson or other managers with relation to his cheif exec. parry has to go, he restricted evans in his dealings(or so robbie said in his book) and i think he was behind the keane signing and the non-signing of barry. rafa said in the summer that he was frustrated with how long parry was taking in transfers and missing out on them. i don't think its been as simple as he hands rick a list with 1 to 10 on it. i reckon parry picks who he wants from the list.
i know i've no facts in this but its the way i see it.
give him the contact!!!!!!

[liverbnz]

You are joking right?

Reina, Arbeloa, Skrtel, Agger, Insua, Mascherano, Alonso, Torres - all Benitez signings.

Alves, Simao (to an extent), Vidic. Players he couldn't sign as he didn't have the control he wants.

So because of a few bad signings (which only Dossena is still here - and even then he's only had 6 months) someone should decide for Benitez who he does/doesn't sign?!

I think you are missing the point as are many others. Alves and Simao were not signed because we would not pay the money for the player at the time. That was a board decision and always should remain so. Rafa doesn't want to control budget. Rafa wants to negiotiate with the player that the board allow the funds to sign.

Basically if Rafa had the control that he is looking for now we still would not have signed Alves or Simao because the club would not release the money.

[Narf]

Once again Rafa has the balls to stand up and fights for what he believes in and I've nothing but respect for him for that.

[hansen6]

You are joking right?

Reina, Arbeloa, Skrtel, Agger, Insua, Mascherano, Alonso, Torres - all Benitez signings.

Alves, Simao (to an extent), Vidic. Players he couldn't sign as he didn't have the control he wants.

So because of a few bad signings (which only Dossena is still here - and even then he's only had 6 months) someone should decide for Benitez who he does/doesn't sign?!

He should be accountable to someone rather than be given a blank cheque.

[liverbnz]

I believe Rafa should be given a sum of money to spend as he pleases. Naturally, he should have some help from financial people to set up the best deals, so they need to be involved.

But when it comes to decisions about who to sign, that is Rafa's job.

Always has been. Every player that has been signed here in the last 5 years have been by Rafa. They may not have been his first choices but that is a budget issue.

[Tyler Durden]

He should be accountable to someone rather than be given a blank cheque.

Course he fucking will, the BOARD

[SamAteTheRedAcid]

He should be accountable to someone rather than be given a blank cheque.

But surely better to be accountable to the fans than to Coco? And as someone said before, it's not going to be a blank cheque, it's going to be a sum decided by the board, which Rafa can then use how he sees fit, without Parry in the way to mess up negotitations, or go on holiday while our star player is waiting for a new contract to be drawn up.

[Jason McG]

Basically if Rafa had the control that he is looking for now we still would not have signed Alves or Simao because the club would not release the money.

Perhaps Rafa would have cut back spending on other players to increase the amount available for them. Hence...

“In this scenario the manager knows the amount money he has available to him and can decide how much he should spend on each player according to the needs of the team.''

[liverbnz]

He should be accountable to someone rather than be given a blank cheque.

He is accountable to Hicks and Gillete, a blank cheque is not what he is asking for.

[sisterbliss]

Can't wait for next Friday, lets see if he can make it three in a row....

Next weeks is Gerrard's court date so needless to say the media will have that pencilled in.

[the_red_pill]

This is great.

There's no actual talk of the derby game now, this is good, the players can concentrate on the game away from the media prescence as they concentrate on Rafa. Wenger has done this many a time for his players.

Parry needs to walk and Beni does need control, the list of players we've missed out on because of vetos from Parry is major, the one that still pisses me off is Dani Alves, we could have had for a snippet at £12m, 2 seasons later and he's signed by Barca for in excess of £25m. fuckin ridiculous.

And you'd think we would have learned something from that by now...

[simmo]

How the fuck do you know we wouldn't be top of the league?  Maybe we'd be better off by 8 points....maybe we'd be in the relegation zone.  It's a completely useless point to try and use to show that the manager shouldn't have full say in transfers in and out of the club.

I know because Alonso has been by far our best player this season, the difference between this season and last has mostly been down to Alonso's reemergence, his fine form this season has coincided with our upturn in form.Gareth Barry is a decent footballer yes, but he cannot influence a team the way Alonso does for us, you only have to look at how poor and ruderless we were against Stoke City without him, he is our most important player.

[fowlermagic]

The priority today should be the next game and anyone from tea lady to owner who does not think that and put their own position ahead of the club ...and makes it public.....is so far from what this club was built on.

Very fecking angry today as the team is on the right tracks and if this shit distracts then a lot of parties including the owners, Parry & Rafa can share the blame.

As I said before what does Rafa not have in his responsibilties that Fergie has?

 

[simmo]

Once again Rafa has the balls to stand up and fights for what he believes in and I've nothing but respect for him for that.

Or he could be seen as spitting his dummy out and throwing his toys out of the pram because he has not got his way again, there are always two sides.

[liverbnz]

Perhaps Rafa would have cut back spending on other players to increase the amount available for them. Hence...

“In this scenario the manager knows the amount money he has available to him and can decide how much he should spend on each player according to the needs of the team.''

Your right, but Rafa has always known his budget surely. I think it is the dithering that has bothered Rafa and then missing out on players, or maybe paying more than we should. The issue with Simao was that Benfica upped the price at the last minute and Moores wouldn't pay them which is fair enough.

I don't believe for 1 second that any signing of the last 5 years has been by anyone other than Rafa.

[mainstandred]

Can't wait for next Friday, lets see if he can make it three in a row....

so true whats next ?

[mainstandred]

The priority today should be the next game and anyone from tea lady to owner who does not think that and put their own position ahead of the club ...and makes it public.....is so far from what this club was built on.

Very fecking angry today as the team is on the right tracks and if this shit distracts then a lot of parties including the owners, Parry & Rafa can share the blame.

As I said before what does Rafa not have in his responsibilties that Fergie has?

 

Correct .
This club of ours is called Liverpool Football Club 

Not Rafa Benitez Football Club .

[yafoy]

The priority today should be the next game and anyone from tea lady to owner who does not think that and put their own position ahead of the club ...and makes it public.....is so far from what this club was built on.

Very fecking angry today as the team is on the right tracks and if this shit distracts then a lot of parties including the owners, Parry & Rafa can share the blame.

As I said before what does Rafa not have in his responsibilties that Fergie has?

 

I support Rafa if he wants it clear that HE alone decides on players...put in the contract..
(as SHANKS did, and in fact refused to join LFC when first asked because the board had the final say)  Shanks mentality = Rafa REALity
YNWA

[Number 7]

Correct .
This club of ours is called Liverpool Football Club 

Not Rafa Benitez Football Club .

It seems like just when we have finally put together a team capable of challenging for the league we start getting all these distractions. Our dirty linen is being hung out to dry in the public and its really becoming quite embarassing.

I really hope in all of this the players are still focused.

[RAFA - 6 - 19]

Fergie gets whoever he wants, rafa gets a clown with a broken fax. Has Rafa ever signed his first choice?

[yafoy]

Correct .
This club of ours is called Liverpool Football Club 

Not Rafa Benitez Football Club .

it wasnt called Shankly football club either but all Real RED supporters knows which man to support ...v the "office"

[Ed-Zeppelin]

I liked Hicks showing confidence in a 5 year deal being agreed, and suggesting Rafa will get the control he wants.

I'm all for Rafa getting a 5 year deal and for giving him the control he wants. I had assumed he gets to pick all the players that arrive at the club.

Whatever is the case IMO it makes sense to give Rafa control. Rafa is an excellent manager but also someone i'd trust with the club over a long period. I see it making sense in making him a single point of failure as it removes the elements of doubt and potential blame game between people like Rafa and Parry.

If they just Rafa a degree of control that keeps him happy then he has noone to blame. If he's happy to take that, that's a good sign IMO. Without the sharp lawyers and big money that clubs like Utd seem to have we need to be cleverer in the market. If Rafa believes he can do a better job than is currently being done with a change then I believe in him to achieve improvements.

Furthermore it should bring stability to the club as players like Reina, Mascherano and Torres are more likely to stay and IMO they are fundamental to our future with a few others.

As long as it isn't all politics between Hicks and Rafa and Gillette and Parry I don't mind!

[hansen6]

But surely better to be accountable to the fans than to Coco? And as someone said before, it's not going to be a blank cheque, it's going to be a sum decided by the board, which Rafa can then use how he sees fit, without Parry in the way to mess up negotitations, or go on holiday while our star player is waiting for a new contract to be drawn up.

The "blank cheque" was a figure of speech, but I don't think that he should be able to spend the money as he sees fit - he should have to run his purchases past someone.

[mainstandred]

it wasnt called Shankly football club either but all Real RED supporters knows which man to support ...v the "office"

no man is bigger than the club no man

[simmo]

Fergie gets whoever he wants, rafa gets a clown with a broken fax. Has Rafa ever signed his first choice?

Torres, Mascharano, Alonso, Garcia, Reina to name just five

[SamAteTheRedAcid]

there are always two sides.

Shame your posts are all so one sided then really - the dark side. Never seen such negativity.

Alright, none of us want a media circus, none of us want Rafa to become some evil Galactus type figure who controls everything with only his own best interests at heart. But I still can;t see why anyone thinks Rafa would deliberately do anything to hurt our club.

He's moved here. His kids speak Scouse. He signed Torres, Reina, Masch, got Gerrard to re-sign, etc etc. He won the CL for us. He's not scared of Ferguson. He's got us top of the league. And people still think he's somehow going to do us in from the inside - what is good for Liverpool is what's good for Rafa, they're intrinsically linked both ways - Rafa doesn;t want us to fail, he doesn't want us to bottle the league, he doesn;t want us to lose - because in doing so we would weaken his reputation. Liverpool's reputation is Rafa's reputation, his CV is going to show what we did or didn't win. And I for one am damn sure that he wants the PL medal on his CV and am calm and objective when I say I believe he can do it for us.

[liverbnz]

Fergie gets whoever he wants, rafa gets a clown with a broken fax. Has Rafa ever signed his first choice?

Not everyone gets their first choice, do I have my first choice car? No I dont because I cant afford it. Rafa wanted David Villa but that was never realistic in the Moores era cos we could never fund it. So was Morientes his 2nd choice, I would say no, that was his first realistic choice.

Along with him you could add Sissoko, Mascherano, Alonso, Garcia, Reina, Torres, Keane, Dossena, Kuyt and maybe more.

[Art Vandelay]

I know because Alonso has been by far our best player this season, the difference between this season and last has mostly been down to Alonso's reemergence, his fine form this season has coincided with our upturn in form.Gareth Barry is a decent footballer yes, but he cannot influence a team the way Alonso does for us, you only have to look at how poor and ruderless we were against Stoke City without him, he is our most important player.

So you're just guessing then.

Pretend, for a minute, that we were after Aguero in the summer....Rafa talks the player into coming, we have the funds necessary to buy him but Parry comes along says he isn't worth that fee and gets Robbie Keane instead.  Would you be fine with Rick doing that, then?

[RedAtHeart]

No this is simply about corporate governance. Whatever we think of Parry is irrelevant. He may not be CEO in the foreseeable future.

The CEO has a clear legal responsibility for the business, whether it is football or not. Rafa should dictate his targets and football strategy within the delegation of authority he has been given by the Board.

Parry or whoever cannot becomes CEO cannot allow the manager to make committments on behalf of the business that the Board cannot meet. It is basic legal responsibilities and is corporate governance.

One of us must have misunderstood Rafa's demands. As far as I can tell he only wants to work freely withing his budgets, wich means that he isn't making any committments on behalf of the club that it can't afford. It's not like Rafa is wanting to control the entire financial piece of the club, and I am sure he is aware that it is someone else who has to make the final siging of the checks, he just wants to have the final word in who is getting bought, and if he finds it fit to spend all of the transferbudget on one player, then the club should buy that player as long as its withing the limits of the budget, and not give a shit about who that player is, as it is up to the manager to create the team. They should just make sure the club does well economically, and set the boundaries for the manager to work within.

[fry]

Since when does Tom fucking hicks get to tell us to relax likes he is our fucking chum, "fuck off and stay away you greedy American twat".  He is part of the greater problem, how dare he think he can muster some PR with us cause he is coming to Rafa's rescue blah blah blah.  Give RAFA what he wants and stay the fuck away!!!  and while your at it get ready to sell up you have a snow balls chance in hell getting refinanced!!!

[mainstandred]

Since when does Tom fucking hicks get to tell us to relax likes he is our fucking chum, "fuck off and stay away you greedy American twat".  He is part of the greater problem, how dare he think he can muster some PR with us cause he is coming to Rafa's rescue blah blah blah.  Give RAFA what he wants and stay the fuck away!!!  and while your at it get ready to sell up you have a snow balls chance in hell getting refinanced!!!

so give rafa benitez carte blanche  ?

[Rome-77]

stand your ground Rafa lad,the match going fans back you 100%
has you will see on Monday night.