Topic: Rox's Dog Advice Thread

[Naby Lad]

I’ve never had a dog before, always been a little bit wary/scared of dogs since I had a bad experience with one when I was kid.

Over the last few months though I’ve really been thinking that after lockdown I want to get one. Been doing a fair amount of research in to it, looking at temperaments, the needs of the dogs as well etc. Prices for puppies have gone mad now though so I’ll need to save for one because I don’t have a couple grand just sitting to buy a puppy at the moment. I’m mostly looking in to one for the companionship as I usually live alone, although during last few months i’ve been staying with grandparents.

The breeds I’ve looked at are Cavapoo, cockapoo, and goldendoodle. I think I’m leaving towards Cavapoo because I’m a first time owner and having a smaller and less energetic dog might be best for me.

[Slippers]

I’ve never had a dog before, always been a little bit wary/scared of dogs since I had a bad experience with one when I was kid.

Over the last few months though I’ve really been thinking that after lockdown I want to get one. Been doing a fair amount of research in to it, looking at temperaments, the needs of the dogs as well etc. Prices for puppies have gone mad now though so I’ll need to save for one because I don’t have a couple grand just sitting to buy a puppy at the moment. I’m mostly looking in to one for the companionship as I usually live alone, although during last few months i’ve been staying with grandparents.

The breeds I’ve looked at are Cavapoo, cockapoo, and goldendoodle. I think I’m leaving towards Cavapoo because I’m a first time owner and having a smaller and less energetic dog might be best for me.

You're not wrong about prices,there aren't many going for less than two grand these days.

[redbyrdz]

I’ve never had a dog before, always been a little bit wary/scared of dogs since I had a bad experience with one when I was kid.

Over the last few months though I’ve really been thinking that after lockdown I want to get one. Been doing a fair amount of research in to it, looking at temperaments, the needs of the dogs as well etc. Prices for puppies have gone mad now though so I’ll need to save for one because I don’t have a couple grand just sitting to buy a puppy at the moment. I’m mostly looking in to one for the companionship as I usually live alone, although during last few months i’ve been staying with grandparents.

The breeds I’ve looked at are Cavapoo, cockapoo, and goldendoodle. I think I’m leaving towards Cavapoo because I’m a first time owner and having a smaller and less energetic dog might be best for me.

Have you thought about adapting one from a shelter? As a first time dog owner, not having to go through puppy training might be a good thing. The shelter can also help advise about each dog's temperament (more than you can predict from a puppy's breed) and find you a good match.

Sadly I expect a lot of dogs to go into shelters once lockdown is over and people will have to go back to work and have less time to look after them.


Oh, and I was bitten as a child once too, and was afraid of dogs - until the neighbour's dog got puppies! One then moved into ours...

[reddebs]

Definitely consider a rescue dog as there's so many needing homes despite the price people pay for puppies.

You get all the support you need before and after and they're very well adjusted before adoption as they know they're likely to be brought back if they still have behaviour issues.

They're generally very good at matching the owners to the right pets too. 

I know at least 2 friends who went through your process of "choosing" the right breed only to realise they were nothing like what the books said in terms of size and temperament once they'd grown up.

[Claire.]

in your shoes, I'd definitely look at the shelters, you can volunteer (in normal times!) and take dogs for walks for them if you want to have a feel for it, you'll probably end up with about 10

[Naby Lad]

Have you thought about adapting one from a shelter? As a first time dog owner, not having to go through puppy training might be a good thing. The shelter can also help advise about each dog's temperament (more than you can predict from a puppy's breed) and find you a good match.

Sadly I expect a lot of dogs to go into shelters once lockdown is over and people will have to go back to work and have less time to look after them.


Oh, and I was bitten as a child once too, and was afraid of dogs - until the neighbour's dog got puppies! One then moved into ours...

I had a look at adopting but couldn’t really find any of the breed I was after. Also a bit wary of adopting because you just don’t know what type of life the dog has had or able to fully research it. When I get one I’d prefer to be able to see it’s parents etc and the type of breeder it has come from, and how it’s been socialised the first 10-12 weeks of its life before I’m able to take it home.

Even though I haven’t had a dog, I do have people in the family with a lot of experience. My gran and papa have had three german shepards, the last of which they had when I was a toddler, and I weirdly got along with that very well. It came before my bad experience. They havent had a dog since until a couple years ago when they adopted a shih tzu and I get along with that well. My mums husband also has always had dogs. Great Danes usually. His last one only passed away a few months ago, but I liked that as well. They are planning on getting a golden retriever this summer so i’ll spend some time with that puppy and see how that gets trained.

[Nobby Reserve]

I’ve never had a dog before, always been a little bit wary/scared of dogs since I had a bad experience with one when I was kid.

Over the last few months though I’ve really been thinking that after lockdown I want to get one. Been doing a fair amount of research in to it, looking at temperaments, the needs of the dogs as well etc. Prices for puppies have gone mad now though so I’ll need to save for one because I don’t have a couple grand just sitting to buy a puppy at the moment. I’m mostly looking in to one for the companionship as I usually live alone, although during last few months i’ve been staying with grandparents.

The breeds I’ve looked at are Cavapoo, cockapoo, and goldendoodle. I think I’m leaving towards Cavapoo because I’m a first time owner and having a smaller and less energetic dog might be best for me.

We got a Cavachon in Aug 18 and she's the most loving little thing. Soft as anything. Took her time understanding house training, but now she's brilliant - understands everything we instruct her and manages to get across to us if she wants/needs something.

Only trouble is, she's manipulative and has you wrapped round her paw when it comes to weedling food treats, so she's become overweight since we've mostly been at home the last 10 months.

Would recommend a Cavachon, though.

[CraigDS]

Have you spent any time with dogs since deciding you may want one? With being wary/scared previously it may be an idea to do so before taking the big step into buying one which you may find you’re still wary/scared of - especially given you’re likely to go on walks around other dogs and if you’re wary/scared then your dog will become so too.

[Naby Lad]

Have you spent any time with dogs since deciding you may want one? With being wary/scared previously it may be an idea to do so before taking the big step into buying one which you may find you’re still wary/scared of - especially given you’re likely to go on walks around other dogs and if you’re wary/scared then your dog will become so too.

Yeah my grandparents have a Shih Tzu and my mum and her husband had a great dane, although he passed away a few months ago. Also my mum and her husband will be getting most likely a golden retriever this summer. I’m going to start taking my grandparents dogs on walks as well. I did that for the first time this past weekend, although we didn’t bump in to any other dogs.
 I started thinking I wanted one maybe last summer, but decided I would wait until after lockdown because I didn’t want to make a snap decision, and also I thought it would be best to get a dog when I’m able to properly take him places so he could be properly socialised rather than stuck in the house all the time.

[Devon Red]

Definitely go for a rescue. Getting an 8 week old puppy is playing the genetic lottery. As other have said; rescue dogs come with behavioural assessments and often a lot of history. Many end up in rescue because of bad luck such as owners dying, others just get dumped when people get bored of them. Many have no or minimal behavioural 'issues'.

[CraigDS]

Definitely go for a rescue. Getting an 8 week old puppy is playing the genetic lottery. As other have said; rescue dogs come with behavioural assessments and often a lot of history. Many end up in rescue because of bad luck such as owners dying, others just get dumped when people get bored of them. Many have no or minimal behavioural 'issues'.

I mean you play just as much genetic lottery with a rescue. Possibly more so given you can often be totally unsure of its lineage.

[Devon Red]

I mean you play just as much genetic lottery with a rescue. Possibly more so given you can often be totally unsure of its lineage.

Disagree. You know it's health (hip dysplasia, eye sight, hearing etc) and you know it's behaviour. Some behaviour changes might emerge in a new home, for sure, but there's much more data to go on than with an 8 week puppy. A decent rescue will have a behavioural report, plus you get to 'try before you buy' with meetings before committing.

With a puppy from a genuinely good breeder (and there are not enough of those) you can have certain expectations, but variations within litters can be huge, and within breeds as well.

[CraigDS]

Disagree. You know it's health (hip dysplasia, eye sight, hearing etc) and you know it's behaviour. Some behaviour changes might emerge in a new home, for sure, but there's much more data to go on than with an 8 week puppy. A decent rescue will have a behavioural report, plus you get to 'try before you buy' with meetings before committing.

Which rescues do the likes of a full hip score? We've been looking to adopt for the last 9 months, and I've yet to see a rescue (and I've spoken to/looked at 20+) which goes beyond dealing with immediate health issues. They'll note behaviour obviously - but then if you've an 8wk old puppy it's behaviour is down to your own training and it's often easier to teach good from the off than to try and train out bad.

With a puppy from a genuinely good breeder (and there are not enough of those) you can have certain expectations, but variations within litters can be huge, and within breeds as well.

Of course, but again, that's still the same for getting a rescue. Not all health issues are obvious, and a lot will not come to light until later in life as the dog ages. There's little info to go on if parents tested negative for various health issues which can be passed down, if there was severe inter breeding, etc.


At the end of the day there are 100% benefits to both options though, and I'd not say either is particularly worse or better than the other when all is weighed up.

[Devon Red]

I see what you mean on health issues, especially late developing issues which are highly predictable from genetic tests. Having said that, the rescue I have most knowledge of does full vet checks and will regularly get x-rays and use other diagnostics for anything concerning.

It's mostly on behaviour that I disagree. Genetics sets the boundaries for possibilities, life experiences (including training etc) influences within those set boundaries. Behaviour/personality is really not down to training to the degree that most people think. Personality is malleable to an extent, but only within a limited range of possibilities. There's no such thing as a blank slate. That's why organisations like Guide Dogs get so many rejects after training, even within a fairly small group of breeders. 

I'm not saying training isn't important, it's very important, but it can only shift behaviour/personality within a limited range. If I was looking for a specific personality type then I would 100% search rescues for the right adult dog over searching breeders for the potentially right puppy.

Anyway, I feel I'm nit-picking a bit at this point. I meant to write something pro-rescue rather than anti-breeder.

[CraigDS]

I see what you mean on health issues, especially late developing issues which are highly predictable from genetic tests. Having said that, the rescue I have most knowledge of does full vet checks and will regularly get x-rays and use other diagnostics for anything concerning.

Yeah they’ll certainly all get checks on anything concerning that shows up from an initial vet check, but that’s normally pretty much only things they are suffering with there and then. It’s certainly not things like hip or eye scoring (the former needs a GA to carry out I believe, not sure on the latter). So as said, you’re more in the dark than if you get a puppy as you can at least see their parents health test results (which most good breeders will do).

It's mostly on behaviour that I disagree. Genetics sets the boundaries for possibilities, life experiences (including training etc) influences within those set boundaries. Behaviour/personality is really not down to training to the degree that most people think. Personality is malleable to an extent, but only within a limited range of possibilities. There's no such thing as a blank slate. That's why organisations like Guide Dogs get so many rejects after training, even within a fairly small group of breeders. 

I'm not saying training isn't important, it's very important, but it can only shift behaviour/personality within a limited range. If I was looking for a specific personality type then I would 100% search rescues for the right adult dog over searching breeders for the potentially right puppy.

Anyway, I feel I'm nit-picking a bit at this point. I meant to write something pro-rescue rather than anti-breeder.

I’m not sure using guide dogs as an example is that great. They are dogs which carry out a highly trained job and which require the right dog in the first place. Same goes for other specialist jobs dogs do (sheep dogs, for one).

What we’re on about is training a puppy to be a good pet - and there are very very very few dogs who if brought up correctly from 8 weeks (and before) wouldn’t turn in to this. It is harder to train some breeds over others, and harder to breed some within any breed over others, but all have the capability.

[Devon Red]

I’m not sure using guide dogs as an example is that great. They are dogs which carry out a highly trained job and which require the right dog in the first place. Same goes for other specialist jobs dogs do (sheep dogs, for one).

What we’re on about is training a puppy to be a good pet - and there are very very very few dogs who if brought up correctly from 8 weeks (and before) wouldn’t turn in to this. It is harder to train some breeds over others, and harder to breed some within any breed over others, but all have the capability.

The point with the guide dog example is that even with the most careful puppy selection plus dedicated long-term training/socialisation input from professionals the dropout rate is still pretty high, because personality/temperament is not as easy to influence by training as most people think. Puppy selection is one of the biggest challenges with training guide dogs, picking the right puppy is just not that reliable. This is one reason why other specialists like police dog handlers are increasingly recruiting from shelters. Key traits like working drive are easy to asses in an adult dog, and breed is less important than previously thought. Hence dogs like rescue staffies now being chosen for scent work.

On pet dogs the principle is the same. If I was choosing a dog for a specific personality trait/temperament then I would look for a rescue adult dog with that trait/temperament. Of course genetics, early life experience, training etc are all important, I'm not discounting any of those things, but it seems self-evident to me that an adult dog with a proper assessment is a safer bet in terms of temperament than an 8 week old puppy and the word of the breeder.

[Naby Lad]

The price of puppies right now is another pro in the rescue box as well. I mean everything seems to be £2500 right now.

[CraigDS]

The point with the guide dog example is that even with the most careful puppy selection plus dedicated long-term training/socialisation input from professionals the dropout rate is still pretty high, because personality/temperament is not as easy to influence by training as most people think. Puppy selection is one of the biggest challenges with training guide dogs, picking the right puppy is just not that reliable. This is one reason why other specialists like police dog handlers are increasingly recruiting from shelters. Key traits like working drive are easy to asses in an adult dog, and breed is less important than previously thought. Hence dogs like rescue staffies now being chosen for scent work.

On pet dogs the principle is the same. If I was choosing a dog for a specific personality trait/temperament then I would look for a rescue adult dog with that trait/temperament. Of course genetics, early life experience, training etc are all important, I'm not discounting any of those things, but it seems self-evident to me that an adult dog with a proper assessment is a safer bet in terms of temperament than an 8 week old puppy and the word of the breeder.

I agree with all those example... for specialist jobs. Of course you’re going to need to find very specific traits for guide dogs, police dogs, scent dogs, etc. And you’re likely to find these traits easier in adult dogs than you will a puppy (but at the same time I highly doubt you’ll see a guide dog being trained from an adult dog because you also need to train those traits from a young age).

Once again though for someone wanting a pet dog, to simply be a pet, then picking out certain traits is really not so important unless you’re looking for something specific (say a pet dog you can do agility with, or who you want to take mountaineering you with, etc). Simple training and socialisation will turn 99.9% of puppies into very good pets, as much as finding an adult rescue dog would (and without the worry of unknown past life experiences triggering an unwanted reaction from a rescue dog).

[Claire.]

I tried training Floyd to do agility. He could do all the things in isolation but fuckin ell, trying to get him to do a string of things when there's a good treat on offer, he just cheats to get it quicker

[Slippers]

I tried training Floyd to do agility. He could do all the things in isolation but fuckin ell, trying to get him to do a string of things when there's a good treat on offer, he just cheats to get it quicker

Our old dog used to do that,I told myself it was a sign of great intelligence.

[reddebs]

Our old dog used to do that,I told myself it was a sign of great intelligence.

Our very first border collie hated playing fetch, his look would say, if you think I'm going to get that for you to throw it away again, think again. 

Then when we were with other dogs that did like to play he'd get it first then nonchalantly wander into the undergrowth, drop it, piss on it then walk off.

He was far too clever to play [emoji16]

Sent from my Pixel 4a (5G) using Tapatalk

[Slippers]

Our very first border collie hated playing fetch, his look would say, if you think I'm going to get that for you to throw it away again, think again. 

Then when we were with other dogs that did like to play he'd get it first then nonchalantly wander into the undergrowth, drop it, piss on it then walk off.

He was far too clever to play [emoji16]

Sent from my Pixel 4a (5G) using Tapatalk

Meg would fetch a ball in the garden but if we brought one on our walks we'd have to fetch it ourselves.

[CraigDS]

Arnie would fetch a football if I booted it far enough, but would then drop if 5m in front of me and walk to me. Like he was saying if he had to run 40m to go and get it then my lazy ass can do some of the work too.

[Devon Red]

Simple training and socialisation will turn 99.9% of puppies into very good pets

With every possible variable absolutely optimal (genetics, breeder, early life experience, environment, owner commitment, owner knowledge, etc etc) you might get near that kind of figure. On average, much lower unfortunately.

But anyway, point being, if anyone is looking for a new dog first port of call should be your local rescue websites. Keep an eye on them, check every day as at the moment dogs are moving pretty quickly. If you see a dog that might match your requirements (think what is the dog bred to do and can I provide an outlet for the behaviour, and do I have the time/space/money to accommodate it's needs) then go along for a meeting, see if it clicks. Always meet a dog at least twice, make sure the rescue gives you thorough background info, and make sure they offer ongoing support with behaviour/training. Put the time in to finding the right dog for you and you won't go too far wrong.

[redbyrdz]

Just read this on the beeb about people getting "pandemic puppies" they can't cope with and are now looking to sell. Realky sad, but predictable. Just hope people think twice before getting a puppy, they can be a lot mote time consuming than an adult dog.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-55719338

[CraigDS]

Failed with our 7th application in nearly a year with the bulldog charity we’d hoped to adopt from. This was despite them ringing me in Dec to say not to worry our application was great and as soon as one close comes available we’d likely get it.... so when a 2yr old male came available around 20mins away we thought we were the sure fire choice but nah.

So we bit the bullet and bought a puppy instead. We had hoped to adopt a bulldog but honestly the desire for a dog in the house is bigger than this and waiting a year to adopt was long enough.

So in 10 days we’ll be picking him up. No name yet... I’m pushing for Norbert.

[reddebs]

Awe Craig it's really tough isn't it when you know adopting is the right way to go but constantly missing out when they do come up is heartbreaking.

Little Norbert is the winner though 😁

My son and his family are getting their first puppy on the 19th, a female border terrier.  She's gorgeous 🥰

[CraigDS]

Awe Craig it's really tough isn't it when you know adopting is the right way to go but constantly missing out when they do come up is heartbreaking.

It’s just weird really as the excuse they’ve given this time is there were two applications closer, but given I was 20, 25 max, mins away then it would seem likely that the people who did adopt him could only be a matter of minutes closer.

You’d have thought they’d give a bit of grace to someone who had applied for 6 dogs already with them, who has contributed to their group helping others for 12 months, who contributes to their fundraising, and who they personally rang in Dec to apologise for not having a foster closer and to ask me to please stick with it as one will come closer soon.

It was clear we simply weren’t going to be able to adopt via them any time soon, and honestly it’s been too long already without having a dog in my life, so buying was the only option.

[Slippers]

Awe Craig it's really tough isn't it when you know adopting is the right way to go but constantly missing out when they do come up is heartbreaking.

Little Norbert is the winner though 😁

My son and his family are getting their first puppy on the 19th, a female border terrier.  She's gorgeous 🥰

Our friends have a border terrier,he's lovely.

Incredibly daft mind.

[reddebs]

They don't do themselves any favours sometimes and I agree 12mths without a dog is too long. 

It's a good time to be getting a puppy too with summer just round the corner, he'll just about be ready to go out for walks.

[reddebs]

Our friends have a border terrier,he's lovely.

Incredibly daft mind.

Yeah they are cute and not too big which is what they wanted as Kat isn't keen on dogs at all.

[Slippers]

Failed with our 7th application in nearly a year with the bulldog charity we’d hoped to adopt from. This was despite them ringing me in Dec to say not to worry our application was great and as soon as one close comes available we’d likely get it.... so when a 2yr old male came available around 20mins away we thought we were the sure fire choice but nah.

So we bit the bullet and bought a puppy instead. We had hoped to adopt a bulldog but honestly the desire for a dog in the house is bigger than this and waiting a year to adopt was long enough.

So in 10 days we’ll be picking him up. No name yet... I’m pushing for Norbert.

Congratulations,Norbert's a great name.

[Slippers]

They don't do themselves any favours sometimes and I agree 12mths without a dog is too long. 

It's a good time to be getting a puppy too with summer just round the corner, he'll just about be ready to go out for walks.

When we lost Meg one of my cousins suggested we wait a year before getting another dog.

I'd have gone out of my mind.

[Tsar Kastik]

An anti ear-cropping petition here,


https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/574305

[Slippers]

An anti ear-cropping petition here,


https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/574305

Signed and shared.

[reddebs]

An anti ear-cropping petition here,


https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/574305

What the freak!! 

Signed

[Claire.]

An anti ear-cropping petition here,


https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/574305

wtf I thought that was illegal already!

Okay it does say it is illegal, is to make it a criminal offence?

[Claire.]

Failed with our 7th application in nearly a year with the bulldog charity we’d hoped to adopt from. This was despite them ringing me in Dec to say not to worry our application was great and as soon as one close comes available we’d likely get it.... so when a 2yr old male came available around 20mins away we thought we were the sure fire choice but nah.

So we bit the bullet and bought a puppy instead. We had hoped to adopt a bulldog but honestly the desire for a dog in the house is bigger than this and waiting a year to adopt was long enough.

So in 10 days we’ll be picking him up. No name yet... I’m pushing for Norbert.

Aww, shame about the adoption but it seems everyone is after a dog at the moment, it's doubly shitty because a lot of those dogs will come back in 3-6 months when people realise that working and having one is actually quite hard. What breed is he?

[CraigDS]

Gone for a Bulldog Claire.

to be honest I’ve wanted another since Chloe died years ago now, and that’s what we were trying to adopt.

I’ve only got vids of him but will try and get one up.

[CraigDS]

They don't do themselves any favours sometimes and I agree 12mths without a dog is too long. 

It's a good time to be getting a puppy too with summer just round the corner, he'll just about be ready to go out for walks.

It’s been longer than a year - Arnie died Sept 19, so 18 months now. We started looking to adopt around 12 months ago thinking it would be relatively easy but it’s been anything but.

We could hold out and see if more dogs now start to come in when people go back but ultimately we decided we could be waiting for another year.

Actually didn’t think we’d find a puppy so fast as know they’ve been selling light hotcakes but got lucky really.... been a while since I’ve had to look after a puppy though, excited.