Topic: COVID-19:VERIFIED news sources, 0 politishit, 0 CONSPIRACY SHITE

[PaulF]

Its getting to be a bit of a fucking joke this, like I've said, my missus works with a 41 yr old who has very mild asthma and he's has his, she is 51 and had 4 days in hospital with a severe attack 10 yrs ago, she couldn't breathe and her O2 levels were about 90/91 and still no appt - her sister and brother are in next wed and her sister hasn't had any issues since she was a kid, brother is as far as we know healthy, he's never sick.

But your missus is a Man Utd fan. Seems eminently sensible way to do it to me.


(Not sure if that shot was too cheap. It must be stressful for you Rob)

[rob1966]

But your missus is a Man Utd fan. Seems eminently sensible way to do it to me.


(Not sure if that shot was too cheap. It must be stressful for you Rob)

Nah, piss taking is still allowed. I'm pretty sure she had Covid 12 months ago and she was one of only 5 in her office who tested negative the other week when it ripped through the place, so I'm quite relaxed, I'm just a bit annoyed at the GP

[Zeb]

Asked one of the councillors earlier today my way what was happening with it and he was saying they've been told to use spares really flexibly. For where I live, population is about 60% black, Asian, and other minority groups so councillor was saying there's a picture there beyond even the initial priority groups of encouraging people in to get a vaccine on the day.

[west_london_red]

Apparently Pfizer have been investigating the impact of storing their vaccine at higher temperatures and will be asking regulators to update the instructions for their vaccine so it can be kept in a regular fridge for 5 days before use.

[Red Beret]

Looking at the random spread of vaccine receivers, I think it must be a combination of small errors on medical records leading to people looking at said records making a call on whether somebody gets the vaccine or not.

I'm not overly fond of dealing with my GP, especially the reception, so I've got no clue how they're going about this and little inclination to ask.  I'm just going to sit tight and wait to be called - unless it comes to a point where I think I should have been contacted or there seems to be a chance I've been missed.

[filopastry]

Was chatting to the Janssen team about potentially being unblinded.

I'm not sure if there is anyone on here left in the trial, but in case it is of interest, they were saying from what they have seen of the data they expect the FDA to approve the one dose vaccine next week, and after that they think the 2 dose trial will likely move from the current 2 low dose v placebo to 2 low dose (Ensemble 2) v 1 high dose (Ensemble 1)

[Ashburton]

Downright rude and selfish. If you book an appointment then go unless extenuating circs, and even then you contact them. I have always made in number one priority to attend all medical appts I get and on the one occasion I haven`t been able to I have made contact as soon as I knew. It is just basic manners.

I really do feel strongly about this as it goes. It costs the NHS, and other patients, a lot of time and money and always has done.

NHS has a problem with this across the board, as does dentistry.  If you offer anything for 'free' some people deem it to be not worth anything.  If we were charging for vaccines and offered people a discount if they get vaccinated during the first year the perceived 'value' would go up.

Sadly people are quite stupid when it comes to making decisions like this.

[west_london_red]

NHS has a problem with this across the board, as does dentistry.  If you offer anything for 'free' some people deem it to be not worth anything.  If we were charging for vaccines and offered people a discount if they get vaccinated during the first year the perceived 'value' would go up.

Sadly people are quite stupid when it comes to making decisions like this.

Dentist visits aren’t free though are they? Even under the NHS you still have to pay about £20 for a check up don’t you? Unless my dentist has been ripping me off!

[No666]

Was chatting to the Janssen team about potentially being unblinded.

I'm not sure if there is anyone on here left in the trial, but in case it is of interest, they were saying from what they have seen of the data they expect the FDA to approve the one dose vaccine next week, and after that they think the 2 dose trial will likely move from the current 2 low dose v placebo to 2 low dose (Ensemble 2) v 1 high dose (Ensemble 1)

That's interesting. I am still on the trial - they said even if I had been on a placebo and took up my NHS vaccine they wanted to keep following my statistics (I have no idea why). As it is, I go back in July to give more blood. Had very nearly an armful so far.

[filopastry]

That's interesting. I am still on the trial - they said even if I had been on a placebo and took up my NHS vaccine they wanted to keep following my statistics (I have no idea why). As it is, I go back in July to give more blood. Had very nearly an armful so far.

Yes I think when I unblind they still keep monitoring for safety data, they just don't use it for effectiveness anymore

[Red Beret]

Dentist visits aren’t free though are they? Even under the NHS you still have to pay about £20 for a check up don’t you? Unless my dentist has been ripping me off!

I'm on ESA and don't pay for dental appointments.

[BobPaisley3]

How do you end up with a spare 35 vaccines? 

And why weren't they ringing the next most vulnerable on the list to see if they could get there before 5.30?

Don’t know is my answer to both questions although re the second one, I heard of another practice asking people over 60 to come in spontaneously as they had a lot left over too and only a handful came. Weather was crap-ice, snow, freezing and over 60s probably reluctant to go out spontaneously. I guess younger folk can be more proactive.

[BobPaisley3]

People not turning up, my sister's practice had more than that.  No notification that they're not turning up either, the receptionist had to ring the no shows up, 'oh we've decided against it'.  It's getting worse as they go down the age groups.

Yeah sounds about right. The school staff took 35 vaccines, there may well have been loads more but that was enough to do all teachers, ta’s, caretaker and kitchen staff.

[CraigDS]

Don’t know is my answer to both questions although re the second one, I heard of another practice asking people over 60 to come in spontaneously as they had a lot left over too and only a handful came. Weather was crap-ice, snow, freezing and over 60s probably reluctant to go out spontaneously. I guess younger folk can be more proactive.

Surely just have a list of the next most vulnerable to hand and then ring them and ask though, no? Rather than ringing and offering them to randoms who aren't vulnerable.

I mean a lot of 60-65yr olds are hardly "old", and would probably happily get themselves to their local docs for the vaccine.

[BobPaisley3]

Surely just have a list of the next most vulnerable to hand and then ring them and ask though, no? Rather than ringing and offering them to randoms who aren't vulnerable.

I mean a lot of 60-65yr olds are hardly "old", and would probably happily get themselves to their local docs for the vaccine.

I’ve not heard of ‘randoms’ being called. The teachers were just fortunate that they had a contact at the surgery. I guess you could class them as randoms but they weren’t randomly selected per se. The over 60s were called because this particularly surgery had vaccinated all of its over 70s and vulnerables I believe.

[rob1966]

Surely just have a list of the next most vulnerable to hand and then ring them and ask though, no? Rather than ringing and offering them to randoms who aren't vulnerable.

I mean a lot of 60-65yr olds are hardly "old", and would probably happily get themselves to their local docs for the vaccine.

Absolutely, being in your 60's is nothing these days. My stepdad is 79, played all kinds of sports until his 50's and still goes the gym and cycles, my Dad is 73, only stopped teaching Karate in his early 60's due to not wanting to teach scallies to fight, was doing Kendo until 10 years ago, still does spin classes, swims, runs, he's still fitter than a lot of fellas in their 30's and 40's. Both of them have no worries about driving in snow or ice

[Thepooloflife]

Was chatting to the Janssen team about potentially being unblinded.

I'm not sure if there is anyone on here left in the trial, but in case it is of interest, they were saying from what they have seen of the data they expect the FDA to approve the one dose vaccine next week, and after that they think the 2 dose trial will likely move from the current 2 low dose v placebo to 2 low dose (Ensemble 2) v 1 high dose (Ensemble 1)

What's the situation here in UK then - are the MHRA looking to approve soon too ?

[west_london_red]

For anyone whose been vaccinated after booking an appointment (as opposed to because there’s spare vaccine that needs to be used), how do you chose where to get vaccinated? Do they give you a list of a few places near by or so you have quite a large choice? The reason I ask is that I haven’t changed my address and the NHS still think I live at my parents (not that it’s a million miles away).

[redbyrdz]

Dentist visits aren’t free though are they? Even under the NHS you still have to pay about £20 for a check up don’t you? Unless my dentist has been ripping me off!

Pretty sure they are if you are on benefits, under 18, or pregnant.

[Zeb]

For anyone whose been vaccinated after booking an appointment (as opposed to because there’s spare vaccine that needs to be used), how do you chose where to get vaccinated? Do they give you a list of a few places near by or so you have quite a large choice? The reason I ask is that I haven’t changed my address and the NHS still think I live at my parents (not that it’s a million miles away).

I got a text message with a link to website. Website gave times but can't recall it giving alternatives to where it automatically sent me (which was closest centre to where I live). Think you can phone 119 and they'll sort you out for stuff cos missus had problems getting her's done with being in one place and registered with a GP up here.

[Crumble]

For anyone whose been vaccinated after booking an appointment (as opposed to because there’s spare vaccine that needs to be used), how do you chose where to get vaccinated? Do they give you a list of a few places near by or so you have quite a large choice? The reason I ask is that I haven’t changed my address and the NHS still think I live at my parents (not that it’s a million miles away).

When I did it on the nhs website, they gave me a list of places nearby to choose from. I think there was a button to click if you didn't like any of the ones offered, but can't be certain.

[John C]

Yeah those getting it now do seem random. My gf's auntie and uncle have been done, both late 40's, no underlying health issues that she knows of.

Yet my near 65yr old Dad, diabetic and high blood pressure, has yet to get a date.

You're right Craig, I know of a few examples also. I do wonder if it's a matter of some vaccine types not being able to be kept and so they've happy to use them.

[CraigDS]

I’ve not heard of ‘randoms’ being called. The teachers were just fortunate that they had a contact at the surgery. I guess you could class them as randoms but they weren’t randomly selected per se. The over 60s were called because this particularly surgery had vaccinated all of its over 70s and vulnerables I believe.

Plenty of examples in this thread alone. I know of a handful who have managed to get it too the same way.

Just seems strange that local surgeries wouldn't have a list of local people who are next on the most vulnerable list to ring to see if they can get there in the next X minutes before they start ringing people are aren't vulnerable or their family/mates.

[Ashburton]

Plenty of examples in this thread alone. I know of a handful who have managed to get it too the same way.

Just seems strange that local surgeries wouldn't have a list of local people who are next on the most vulnerable list to ring to see if they can get there in the next X minutes before they start ringing people are aren't vulnerable or their family/mates.

If you're doing 70+ for an area and then need to switch to 65+ and vulnerable, to get 30 jabs used up that might be something like 120 phone calls.  The amount which bounce off answering machines, go to voice mail, as well as those who may be less comfortable driving in (look at the weather at the moment, it's gale force winds and atrocious) - if you call a colleague you know works for a school you might be able to reasonable guarantee 20 doses used from one phone call. 

[CraigDS]

If you're doing 70+ for an area and then need to switch to 65+ and vulnerable, to get 30 jabs used up that might be something like 120 phone calls.  The amount which bounce off answering machines, go to voice mail, as well as those who may be less comfortable driving in (look at the weather at the moment, it's gale force winds and atrocious) - if you call a colleague you know works for a school you might be able to reasonable guarantee 20 doses used from one phone call.

I don't really begrudge the school one if I'm honest, and like you say it seems a good way to guarantee them getting used up.

However there are plenty other examples which aren't teachers or in bulk like that. My gf's auntie and uncle got them because they got a random call from their docs - they're mid to late 40's and neither have pre-existing conditions. Now surely they are just as likely to not be able to make it, not be comfortable driving in, etc. etc. as if someone who is more vulnerable (60+, pre-existing condition, etc)?

[TepidT2O]

France is weird...

They’ve had 20k-25k cases a day for months now...

Are they in lockdown? Are their measures working? They certainly aren’t seeing numbers increase, but they’ve kept numbers steady at a really high level... which is odd.

[west_london_red]

France is weird...

They’ve had 20k-25k cases a day for months now...

Are they in lockdown? Are their measures working? They certainly aren’t seeing numbers increase, but they’ve kept numbers steady at a really high level... which is odd.

They have a curfew from 18:00 to 06:00, that much I do know.

[djahern]

Plenty of examples in this thread alone. I know of a handful who have managed to get it too the same way.

Just seems strange that local surgeries wouldn't have a list of local people who are next on the most vulnerable list to ring to see if they can get there in the next X minutes before they start ringing people are aren't vulnerable or their family/mates.

I think a lot of it might be to with lists already having been drawn up and probably those on the list already officially booked in or about to be booked in pretty soon.

Calling them in at short notice creates more work for the surgery - amending the list of people that are next up as they’ve now already had it and creating a new list in time for the next batch of people who will be called.

It’s probably simpler for many surgeries to leave the planned list they already have for the next 3-4 weeks intact as they are stretched already. You’d rather their time is dedicated to getting the vaccinations done rather than constantly amending the list of upcoming people. The wait for these folks shouldn’t be long even if they stick to their original plans - you’re probably only talking a week or two for the majority.

[west_london_red]

Pretty sure they are if you are on benefits, under 18, or pregnant.

Yeah, that’s what I thought. But adults in work and not in receipt of benefits do pay, thats what I was getting at so it’s not free for everyone like going to the GP for example.

[Ashburton]

Yeah, that’s what I thought. But adults in work and not in receipt of benefits do pay, thats what I was getting at so it’s not free for everyone like going to the GP for example.

Yeah but what I was getting at is if you don't turn up you don't need to pay.  I've got a private dentist and get charged whether I turn up or not, but I'm aware the NHS dentists have a huge issue with people just deciding not to go and not fussed about telling anyone about it.  The same for vaccinations, there is no downside to just using the booking system then deciding you'll sack it off as you don't fancy going whilst it's raining.

Obviously it's great to see Zeb's post on the other page with such high confidence/intention to get vaccinated, and hope that carries through in to seeing people actually get a jab.  I'd imagine there's a strong social bias to people being interviewed and asked if they'll get a vaccine or not, so lets hope this isn't just hot air.

[RainbowFlick]

No, I understand what you're saying and do agree with what you've said there. But, with 1.6 million working in the social care sector - to have a third, that's approx half a million, not have a vaccine is a huge problem.......don't know what proportion are from BAME background though, and hopefully what you suggest will have an affect. I still think it should be mandatory for care staff though.
My sister is still in hospital having tested Covid positive at the end of last year, after a member of staff brought it into the home. Subsequently the whole home was infected and in lockdown and on Red alert and now they cannot vaccinate residents until they are clear. So, as Paul above suggests, some form of regulation could be used, surely - I mean this is still killing elderly people. When I worked in the NHS we were mandated to have the Hepatitis B vaccine as it was highly recommended to do so -

As an example, I found this in my former Trust policy document on 'Healthcare Workers Screening & Immunisation'....

'Occupational Health and Wellbeing (OHW) will identify the vaccinations required by different groups of staff and will make arrangements for these to take place. Line managers will be asked to ensure their staff attend for vaccinations where required and will be informed if their staff do not attend for vaccination and if workplace restrictions are required.

The four main staff groups for vaccination are: ‘staff involved in direct patient care’; ‘nonclinical staff in healthcare settings’; ‘laboratory and pathology staff’ and ‘staff handling specific organisms’. The vaccinations required for each group are set out in this policy.

Health Care Workers (HCW) joining the Trust who will have direct contact with patient’s blood or other body fluids/ tissues, must provide documentary evidence of satisfactory hepatitis B antibody levels (anti-HBs >10mIU/mL) or must undergo testing and/or hepatitis B immunisation.

Non- immune clinical HCW who will have regular contact with blood or bodily fluids, must receive appropriate immunisations in the Occupational Health Department (OH).Further specific details about management of each vaccination can be obtained from the Trust Standard Operating Procedures:'

Interesting this, I didn't realise hepatitis vaccines were required. I was keen to progress with pushing for educating people before mandating but at this point I feel the remaining people are probably going to be the hardest to budge.

I'm also a bit sceptical whether this Tory populist government with a strong libertarian backbench would want to be seen to mandating vaccinations either. I can't imagine it, personally, but care workers need to ultimately be mindful of where they work.

[RainbowFlick]

For anyone whose been vaccinated after booking an appointment (as opposed to because there’s spare vaccine that needs to be used), how do you chose where to get vaccinated? Do they give you a list of a few places near by or so you have quite a large choice? The reason I ask is that I haven’t changed my address and the NHS still think I live at my parents (not that it’s a million miles away).

My parents had a letter through the door with their NHS number inviting them to book online. There was a fairly broad set of vaccination centres there (included some about an hour away too) with seemingly lots of availability. Next day or two they also received a call from our GP where they were invited to a more local clinic instead (walking distance).

But feasibly the online website will give you a range of different places to book in what I imagine to be your NHS 'area'. All mine seemed to be in South West London and South London.

[Macphisto80]

Several cases found of the Brazilian variant in Ireland. Linked to recent travel there. Bravo. Big massive fucking round of applause.

Well, that's that one out of the box.

[killer-heels]

Several cases found of the Brazilian variant in Ireland. Linked to recent travel there. Bravo. Big massive fucking round of applause.

Well, that's that one out of the box.

Laughable, both by the government allowing it and of individuals making that journey.

[Guz-kop]

You're right Craig, I know of a few examples also. I do wonder if it's a matter of some vaccine types not being able to be kept and so they've happy to use them.

I suspect its a combination of

1. People have medical conditions not broadcast publically
2. Incorrect or out of date coding on gp registers
3. People who happen to be contactable for end of day or no show left overs and/or happen to be in the right place at the right time

As someone said above the logistics of organising this are insane. It takes a lot of effort to move people around pre existing lists planned a few weeks in advance. So if gaps appear may have to fill with flexibility in who is offered to

[Wabaloolah]

Plenty of examples in this thread alone. I know of a handful who have managed to get it too the same way.

Just seems strange that local surgeries wouldn't have a list of local people who are next on the most vulnerable list to ring to see if they can get there in the next X minutes before they start ringing people are aren't vulnerable or their family/mates.

my mates missus who does admin for the local Drug and Alcohol abuse team, works one day a week and from home has just had her second Pfizer jab and she's 42!


She had the second jab three weeks after the first, apparently they had a batch left over after they finished the key workers so they targeted  the local council staff when she had her first.


Another friend's son who is 17 had his as he volunteers at a local special needs school!?!


It seems just as random in Wales as it does in England

[Lynx the saucy mynx]

Plenty of examples in this thread alone. I know of a handful who have managed to get it too the same way.

Just seems strange that local surgeries wouldn't have a list of local people who are next on the most vulnerable list to ring to see if they can get there in the next X minutes before they start ringing people are aren't vulnerable or their family/mates.

Yes I know someone who's 21 who had their vaccine done. Their cousin works at the surgery, and they said to her if you have any friends and family, you can come here before 8pm and we will do it. Low and behold, people they hadn't spoken to in a while came, and was like a family reunion at the surgery. This was early January too.

[Zeb]

Thread by Lewis Goodall (Newsnight) on disparity by postcode in vaccination rates across Birmingham: https://twitter.com/lewis_goodall/status/1362891194414616584

Non-twitter view of it: https://threadreaderapp.com/thread/1362891194414616584.html

Ties in with a Sky story from earlier tonight: https://news.sky.com/story/covid-19-ethnicity-biggest-determining-factor-in-vaccine-uptake-study-finds-12222636

Kind of fits to why they've gone for the approach they have where I live. Also noticeable on the Sky map is not just London but also the big urban centres elsewhere with lower rates of vaccination for whichever reason/s.

[djahern]

Thread by Lewis Goodall (Newsnight) on disparity by postcode in vaccination rates across Birmingham: https://twitter.com/lewis_goodall/status/1362891194414616584

Non-twitter view of it: https://threadreaderapp.com/thread/1362891194414616584.html

Ties in with a Sky story from earlier tonight: https://news.sky.com/story/covid-19-ethnicity-biggest-determining-factor-in-vaccine-uptake-study-finds-12222636

Kind of fits to why they've gone for the approach they have where I live. Also noticeable on the Sky map is not just London but also the big urban centres elsewhere with lower rates of vaccination for whichever reason/s.

I guess the real issue comes about if these areas correlate with the areas we were talking about the past few days - those areas that infection rates may not be falling as fast as the national average, the ones maybe that have seen the infection rate plateaued already.

If we have an overlap between those that are currently more likely to be infected and those that are more likely to refuse a vaccine, then that creates a real problem. And most likely that is exactly the case.

[redbyrdz]

I do understand that those on an official list, who haven't had their call yet, are getting frustrated when they hear about young people getting vaccinated before them. But honestly I don't think vaccinating at random in the younger age groups (those not on the priority lists) would be a big problem. We don't have a clear picture of who is at higher risk in those age groups (outside of those with certain medical conditions), so vaccinating at random is just as likely to get the right people as going through them in order. Plus the current "lets call someone nearby" approach seems to get a lot of school and shop staff, who are at higher risk of exposure to the virus, and also more likely to be a significant multiplicator, if they were ill.