Author Topic: COVID-19: General Stuff. VERIFIED news sources, 0 politishit, 0 CONSPIRACY SHITE  (Read 808812 times)

Offline rodderzzz

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this thread is for opinions and the usual rational expertise'd debate on the subject. There is a separate thread for up to date info. thanks.




Looks like we don't have a thread on this yet and as its no an official WHO health emergency and all the British Evacuees will be quarantined just across the water I thought it was worth it.


Looks like this might end up getting worse than SARS given the reaction from around the world, interested couple of months ahead as the race for a vaccine is on.

Unfortunately I have to do 4 international airports next week, so not looking forward to that.
« Last Edit: April 2, 2020, 10:06:17 PM by 24/50 geek! »

Offline GreatEx

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Re: Coronavirus
« Reply #1 on: January 31, 2020, 03:04:30 AM »
Good luck to you! For once I'm pleased that my young family makes international travel unthinkable for the next few years, and that my suburb is the least ethnically diverse in the western hemisphere.

Offline rodderzzz

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Re: Coronavirus
« Reply #2 on: January 31, 2020, 03:47:54 AM »
Good luck to you! For once I'm pleased that my young family makes international travel unthinkable for the next few years, and that my suburb is the least ethnically diverse in the western hemisphere.

I now live in Vancouver which has one of the largest Chinese communities outside of China. My mum and dad still live back home and have just moved to Upton about five minutes away from the hospital the quarantines will be at 🤦🏻‍♂️

Offline west_london_red

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Re: Coronavirus
« Reply #3 on: January 31, 2020, 04:42:44 AM »
The positive is that the death rate so far at least is very low, and hopefully it fizzles out like previous outbreaks like SARS and Swine flu.

But in the longer run, the Chinese and the world need to do something to look at why these outbreaks keep on starting in China and what can be done to prevent them. Any country can be unfortunate in being the starting point for an outbreak, but when it keeps on happening in the same country the causes and preventative actions need to be taken.

Offline Kashinoda

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Re: Coronavirus
« Reply #4 on: January 31, 2020, 04:45:25 AM »
The positive is that the death rate so far at least is very low, and hopefully it fizzles out like previous outbreaks like SARS and Swine flu.

But in the longer run, the Chinese and the world need to do something to look at why these outbreaks keep on starting in China and what can be done to prevent them. Any country can be unfortunate in being the starting point for an outbreak, but when it keeps on happening in the same country the causes and preventative actions need to be taken.

It's lower than SARS but it's not very low. It also has a longer incubation period and will inevitably spread to a lot more people.
:D

Offline Max_powers

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Re: Coronavirus
« Reply #5 on: January 31, 2020, 06:13:46 AM »
The positive is that the death rate so far at least is very low, and hopefully it fizzles out like previous outbreaks like SARS and Swine flu.

But in the longer run, the Chinese and the world need to do something to look at why these outbreaks keep on starting in China and what can be done to prevent them. Any country can be unfortunate in being the starting point for an outbreak, but when it keeps on happening in the same country the causes and preventative actions need to be taken.


I mean could be because China has about a sixth of worlds population. Just a game of probability. I lived in a part of Canada with lot of poultry farms, when the avian flu was a big scare it affected a lot of farms here too.

Although it is quite likely that local authorities hid scale of outbreak at early stages in fear of facing political consequences which made the situation worse. But unless China changes its whole political system nothing will change on that front.

Offline CorKopite

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Re: Coronavirus
« Reply #6 on: January 31, 2020, 06:21:07 AM »
It's worrying enough. It seems to be spreading very quickly and the massive Lunar New Year travel season has obviously made it more of a global concern. I live and work in Vietnam and while there wasn't any major disruption at any of the international airports I was at while travelling back a few days ago, people are definitely more on edge.

Been pretty hard to find basic things like masks and hand sanitizer since I got back as people have bought them all out as they get worried. It's calm enough for now but there are a lot of people expecting it to get much worse also as there is a relatively long incubation period and most people will be going back to work fully on Monday. Saw and heard of instances of groups of Chinese tourists being turned away from restaurants/hotels in a few places in other countries in the region. Thankfully there are brilliant scientists and doctors working on this around the world so hopefully we can get it under control soon.



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Re: Coronavirus
« Reply #7 on: January 31, 2020, 08:28:27 AM »
Masks for protection of healthy individuals is psychology,  not science unless you intend to go about in a HEPA grade full face respirator. Don't waste money on standard surgical / dust masks.

Offline gazzalfc

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Re: Coronavirus
« Reply #8 on: January 31, 2020, 08:33:38 AM »
We've had our advice in work stopping all travel to China for the foreseeable future.

Loads online losing their shit over repatriated people being housed on the Wirral for their quarantine period. Of course the fact that we have one of the best tropical disease facilities on the planet in Liverpool school of tropical medicine nearby as a good enough reason.

Also a few videos online of people using the virus as an excuse to be racist towards Chinese people which is horrible.

But I bet amazon will have face masks and alcohol hand gel front and centre.


Offline a treeless whopper

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Re: Coronavirus
« Reply #9 on: January 31, 2020, 08:41:32 AM »
The positive is that the death rate so far at least is very low, and hopefully it fizzles out like previous outbreaks like SARS and Swine flu.

But in the longer run, the Chinese and the world need to do something to look at why these outbreaks keep on starting in China and what can be done to prevent them. Any country can be unfortunate in being the starting point for an outbreak, but when it keeps on happening in the same country the causes and preventative actions need to be taken.

Apparently it was from those disgusting wet markets.

Offline Classycara

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Re: Coronavirus
« Reply #10 on: January 31, 2020, 09:05:11 AM »
The positive is that the death rate so far at least is very low, and hopefully it fizzles out like previous outbreaks like SARS and Swine flu.

But in the longer run, the Chinese and the world need to do something to look at why these outbreaks keep on starting in China and what can be done to prevent them. Any country can be unfortunate in being the starting point for an outbreak, but when it keeps on happening in the same country the causes and preventative actions need to be taken.

It tends to be because of wet markets, where dead and live stock and seafood are all sold together. Though also just a matter of diverse vectors of disease, good temperatures for viruses, a huge susceptible population and state dishonesty also contribute variously to the onset of disease and imperfect surveillance that followed.

We'll learn a lot more after the two weeks incubation period around chinese new year passes.


EDIT: just found this which is a handy intro to the wet markets https://www.nytimes.com/2020/01/25/world/asia/china-markets-coronavirus-sars.html

When I started studying this almost ten years ago the wet markets were sharply in focus and cited as a reason why many outbreaks start in south east asia
« Last Edit: January 31, 2020, 09:09:38 AM by Classycara »

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Re: Coronavirus
« Reply #11 on: January 31, 2020, 09:18:43 AM »

Offline Classycara

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Re: Coronavirus
« Reply #12 on: January 31, 2020, 09:21:41 AM »


While that's funny, it's a con/joke. Presumably out of Brazil, going by the language

https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/coronavirus-bulletin-farm-animals/

Offline [new username under construction]

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Re: Coronavirus
« Reply #13 on: January 31, 2020, 09:31:43 AM »
There are plenty of threads on reddit about it. Think it's less infectious than 'normal' flu which has killed 6000 this year

Offline Nobby Reserve

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Re: Coronavirus
« Reply #14 on: January 31, 2020, 09:38:29 AM »

Loads online losing their shit over repatriated people being housed on the Wirral for their quarantine period. Of course the fact that we have one of the best tropical disease facilities on the planet in Liverpool school of tropical medicine nearby as a good enough reason.

The quarantine facility will be a staff accommodation block, and reports that staff living there were given just 12 hours to move out.

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Offline Classycara

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Re: Coronavirus
« Reply #15 on: January 31, 2020, 09:41:53 AM »
There are plenty of threads on reddit about it. Think it's less infectious than 'normal' flu which has killed 6000 this year

It's conceivably more infectious than influenza, but far too early to say with confidence. WHO estimating the R0 (R nought) to be between 1.4 and 2.5 (source link). Seasonal flu strains are usually 0.9 to 2.1.

What's your 6,000 figure? Is that an estimate for the UK?

Offline Classycara

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Re: Coronavirus
« Reply #16 on: January 31, 2020, 09:44:24 AM »
The quarantine facility will be a staff accommodation block, and reports that staff living there were given just 12 hours to move out.

Source?

Offline [new username under construction]

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Re: Coronavirus
« Reply #17 on: January 31, 2020, 09:55:23 AM »

It's conceivably more infectious than influenza, but far too early to say with confidence. WHO estimating the R0 (R nought) to be between 1.4 and 2.5 (source link). Seasonal flu strains are usually 0.9 to 2.1.

What's your 6,000 figure? Is that an estimate for the UK?

61,000 missed the one :/

Offline west_london_red

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Re: Coronavirus
« Reply #18 on: January 31, 2020, 09:59:50 AM »


I mean could be because China has about a sixth of worlds population. Just a game of probability. I lived in a part of Canada with lot of poultry farms, when the avian flu was a big scare it affected a lot of farms here too.

Although it is quite likely that local authorities hid scale of outbreak at early stages in fear of facing political consequences which made the situation worse. But unless China changes its whole political system nothing will change on that front.

Yeah, China has more people then most countries but so does India (and itís not exactly known for its hygiene either) but hasnít had the same history at least recently of outbreaks.

However, trying to cover up bad news isnít unique to China or its system, and if anything in a country where the rule of law is harsh and the state keeps a very watchful eye on its citizens I would have thought that might provide a few advantages in this situation.

Offline Nobby Reserve

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Offline Andy82lfc

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Re: Coronavirus
« Reply #20 on: January 31, 2020, 10:10:59 AM »

Offline Classycara

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Re: Coronavirus
« Reply #21 on: January 31, 2020, 10:13:59 AM »

https://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/news/liverpool-news/200-brits-coronavirus-quarantine-held-17661707

(4th para)

Nice one, cheers.

I'm sure working in healthcare they are more than happy to make a worthy sacrifice, so long as an alternative is found.

However, trying to cover up bad news isn’t unique to China or its system, and if anything in a country where the rule of law is harsh and the state keeps a very watchful eye on its citizens I would have thought that might provide a few advantages in this situation.

Mostly disadvantages given that viruses don't recognise international borders. Information sharing and notification of infectious diseases aren't aided by authoritarian states. The willingness to shut down cities is one of the few things they can do over other states, though we don't know how effective that's been. Certainly that's a case of closing the door and then informing the rest of the world that the horse might bolt, after it's run off

Offline Mister men

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Re: Coronavirus
« Reply #22 on: January 31, 2020, 10:37:34 AM »
Speaking from a selfish Irish perspective and as someone who works in a major hospital in Dublin i hope it doesn't take hold here like in China. Our health service is an utter mess at the best of times and we certainly won't have the capacity to care and quarantine the sick and dying. I knew when i seen the footage last week of the Chinese building a 1000 bed hospital with a timeline of a week that something was up and it just seems to be getting worse. Worrying times.


Offline Spezialo

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Re: Coronavirus
« Reply #23 on: January 31, 2020, 11:23:37 AM »
Why would this disease have a patent?

Offline meady1981

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Re: Coronavirus
« Reply #24 on: January 31, 2020, 11:31:33 AM »
Letís get this title wrapped up asap

Offline Classycara

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Re: Novel coronavirus originating in Wuhan (2019-nCoV)
« Reply #25 on: January 31, 2020, 11:35:29 AM »
Why would this disease have a patent?

I've just had to look up what you're asking. Turns out you've been conned by misinformation or potentially a deliberate malicious conspiracy theory. There isn't one. Details here https://fullfact.org/online/Rothschild-coronavirus/

This is a type of virus called coronavirus - but that's just the name of the type of virus. Any previous patent containing the word coronavirus has nothing to do with this virus. SARS is an example of a coronavirus. So is MERS.

In an attempt to try to make this topic title more accurate, shall we call it 'Novel coronavirus originating in Wuhan (2019-nCoV)'

(Mods or Rodderz, could you change the title please?)

Offline Nobby Reserve

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Re: Coronavirus
« Reply #26 on: January 31, 2020, 12:46:25 PM »
In the first Resident Evil, a deadly virus is created at a research facility at Racoon City

An anagram of 'Racoon' is 'Corona'


We're not being told the truth!!!



















I'm joking, before one of the earnest anti-conspiracy posters gets shirty
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Offline Qston

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Re: Coronavirus
« Reply #27 on: January 31, 2020, 01:02:54 PM »
Well it is affecting some patients as well. I should know. I was due to have my quad tendon re rupture (yup done it twice) operated on today. Cancelled. I knew it would be the moment I saw the news last night. Hey ho. These people need looking after.

I still don't quite get the logic of travelling 180 miles from raf Brize Norton to the wirral. I suppose there are specialist facilities over the water to deal with anyone who does show signs. Other than that the logic is lost on me

I feel sorry for the staff that had 12 hours notice
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Offline Caligula?

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Re: Coronavirus
« Reply #28 on: January 31, 2020, 01:06:28 PM »
Gunning for our first title in 30 years which we've nearly won and a few weeks ago there were fears of WW3 and now a massive global outbreak. I'm fully expecting aliens to land on Earth sometime before May and make contact with humans.

Before anyone has a go, calm down. I fully understand the seriousness of it and am only joking. I really hope this doesn't morph into something worse than it already is.

Offline meady1981

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Re: Coronavirus
« Reply #29 on: January 31, 2020, 01:10:16 PM »
My greatest fear in all this the reaction of the great British public if this got serious.

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Re: Coronavirus
« Reply #30 on: January 31, 2020, 01:10:57 PM »
I still don't quite get the logic of travelling 180 miles from raf Brize Norton to the wirral. I suppose there are specialist facilities over the water to deal with anyone who does show signs. Other than that the logic is lost on me

I was just thinking they'd end up infecting everyone at service stations along the way when I heard that...
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Offline JC the Messiah

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Re: Coronavirus
« Reply #31 on: January 31, 2020, 01:17:01 PM »
It's exciting to think about a novel virus that could become a pandemic and devastate populations.  Who doesn't love a good pandemic film or book?

But in truth, it's far less dangerous than 'flu. Seasonal influenza kills between 250,000 and 500,000 people a year. Every year.  In the UK in a 'bad' year, over 10,000 people can be killed by flu. In 1918 (which is when Liverpool last lost a home game), the flu epidemic affected about half the world's population, and killed about 50-million people worldwide.  Imagine what that death-toll would have been if it had been 2018 instead, with 7 billion people in the world rather than the 2 billion 100 years ago, and far more movement between populations.

Has this coronavirus killed 500 people yet?
« Last Edit: January 31, 2020, 01:19:32 PM by JC the Messiah »
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Offline Red-Soldier

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Re: Wuhan Coronavirus
« Reply #32 on: January 31, 2020, 01:19:53 PM »
My personal opinion is that It is much ado about nothing.


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Re: Wuhan Coronavirus
« Reply #33 on: January 31, 2020, 01:22:19 PM »
I think all the fatalities have been those in in ill-health, the elderly or those with a weakened immune system.

Offline Classycara

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Re: Wuhan Coronavirus
« Reply #34 on: January 31, 2020, 01:30:01 PM »
It's exciting to think about a novel virus that could become a pandemic and devastate populations.  Who doesn't love a good pandemic film or book?

But in truth, it's far less dangerous than 'flu. Seasonal influenza kills between 250,000 and 500,000 people a year. Every year.  In the UK in a 'bad' year, over 10,000 people can be killed by flu. In 1918 (which is when Liverpool last lost a home game), the flu epidemic affected about half the world's population, and killed about 50-million people worldwide.  Imagine what that death-toll would have been if it had been 2018 instead, with 7 billion people in the world rather than the 2 billion 100 years ago, and far more movement between populations.

Has this coronavirus killed 500 people yet?

Jumping the gun here.

Of course it's not as harmful as influenza now, it's only a month or so old. It's important people stay calm and rational about it. But that doesn't mean that there aren't further risks of it getting worse.

It seems to be around as transmissible as the 'spanish flu', although obviously the fatality rate will be far lower. As always with outbreaks like this the biggest risk is the virus mutating to become more transmissible or destructive, which can't really be predicted. But the important thing is that people are working on it, the response is being resourced globally, information is being shared, people are behaving rationally - so agree with your point on perspective ultimately :)

Offline Classycara

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Re: Wuhan Coronavirus
« Reply #35 on: January 31, 2020, 01:32:15 PM »
I think all the fatalities have been those in in ill-health, the elderly or those with a weakened immune system.

No deaths outside of China yet either.

We'll have a much better picture of this by next week.

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Re: Wuhan Coronavirus
« Reply #36 on: January 31, 2020, 01:38:18 PM »
I think all the fatalities have been those in in ill-health, the elderly or those with a weakened immune system.

I think little to no sneezing, running nose etc, seems to start with a fever so might be hard to actually pass on until you're laid up with a fever coughing

Offline King.Keita

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Re: Wuhan Coronavirus
« Reply #37 on: January 31, 2020, 01:39:56 PM »
My personal opinion is that It is much ado about nothing.
I think so too. Weíve definitely got a situation but Iím willing to bet this time next month, this will be forgotten about like Ebola and the Iran situation and weíll have moved on to the next controversial thing.

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Re: Wuhan Coronavirus
« Reply #38 on: January 31, 2020, 01:41:45 PM »
I think so too. Weíve definitely got a situation but Iím willing to bet this time next month, this will be forgotten about like Ebola and the Iran situation and weíll have moved on to the next controversial thing.

Hopefully it is an isn't. Would be great for everyone if someone found a vaccine but we seem to be heading for one we can't stop, something needs to be done

Offline Mumm-Ra

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Re: Coronavirus
« Reply #39 on: January 31, 2020, 01:43:01 PM »
While that's funny, it's a con/joke. Presumably out of Brazil, going by the language

https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/coronavirus-bulletin-farm-animals/

Aye, everyone knows the only prevention for coronavirus is to jam a lime wedge up each nostril