Topic: Villa Round Table - Or Clubs You Hate

[Yorkykopite]

I share your frustration Timbo. I especially share it over Suarez's sloppiness. Having now seen it from a better angle the ball to Gerrard was piss poor. Not what you expect of a player of his class. Mind you there was little wrong with the pass to Shelvey. The problem was Shelvey being back on his heels as usual. Talk about slow feet. It's painful to watch him pulling his boots out of the gluey mess that seems to lap at his feet wherever he goes. He looked like a right lummox on Saturday.

Allen's ball to Cole didn't look particularly clever. But it wasn't entirely stupid either. We've been doing those types of passes all season and they have worked for us because they tend to pull opponents forward and lengthen the pitch for our attackers. It was enough that the Villa midfield was being sucked towards Cole. He simply needed to return the ball to Allen and let Allen quickly switch play.

Why no Suso? I don't know. This was the most disappointing part of Brendan's game for me. If not a substitute instead of Joe Cole, then surely instead of Jordan Henderson. It seemed obvious to me that we needed to start going through the middle of Villa's two banks of four and not exclusively round the back (which simply led to us crossing into a densely populated goalmouth). Henderson lacks the ambition and the know-how to cope with a crowded pitch. Suso doesn't. At 0-3, frankly, we'd have been better with Adorjan, Pacheco and Suso than we would with Henderson, Cole and Gerrard. For some reason though Rodgers has leaned to the big Englishmen in recent works rather than the more technical players.

[royhendo]

Is it taboo to suggest this was Villa's "4-1 at Old Trafford" performance?

[CHOPPER]

Is it taboo to suggest this was Villa's "4-1 at Old Trafford" performance?

From us - it certainly wasn't our 4-1 performance there.

[Yorkykopite]

Is it taboo to suggest this was Villa's "4-1 at Old Trafford" performance?

Playing with fire there Roy.

[didi shamone]

Is it taboo to suggest this was Villa's "4-1 at Old Trafford" performance?

Apologise at once. I refuse to see even a grain of truth in that .

Not much to add that hasn't already been covered. I was sick as a dog with flu so decided to cheer meself up by staying in and watching us beat villa. Couldn't get a decent streem for 20 minutes so I missed the part where we were good. Signs of our vulnerability were evident early on with Lucas snuffing out a couple of dangerous attacks. Then I got progressively more sick as the match went on. I now understand death by football. Liverpool are fucking killing me.

The fundamental problem for me aside from not posessing clinical forwards is we only control the game when we have the ball. This I know is our philosophy [ sorry for the p word]. But controlling the game is also about what you do when you dont have the ball. On that side we're failing miserabley. Lucas was the best of our trio in that respect despite looking far from fit. Allen and Gerrard are largely invisible in that respect. Neither is starting on merit at the moment and it needs addressing pronto. It is worth noting that Gerrard should have scored two goals if it wasn't for Luis awful pass. There must be a way of utilising that ability considering our impotence in front of goal. We heard a lot about winning the ball back within 7 seconds of losing posession, well we do  quite often in fairness, it's unfortunately Pepe picking it out of the back of the net.

Solutions to be tried could involve Henderson for Gerrard with Stevie taking Shelyeys place. Maybe Sahin for Allen. Reads great on the internet but who knows how it would work out in practice. We've little to lose at this stage.

[hansen6]

Take your pick:

1) I think it's a mentality issue, we showed up thinking we will win against Aston Villa who had a bad run going into the match

2) We're a mid-table team now and we should get used to days like that.

[Anywhichwayicant]

Take your pick:

1) I think it's a mentality issue, we showed up thinking we will win against Aston Villa who had a bad run going into the match

2) We're a mid-table team now and we should get used to days like that.

Villa had a bad run going into this match?

[hansen6]

Villa had a bad run going into this match?

Two wins from twelve?. Drawing with QPR?. 

[Anywhichwayicant]

Two wins from twelve?. Drawing with QPR?.

Had lost 2 of their last 8, and they were against the two Manchester clubs.


Doesn't excuse our loss to them, that was disastrous, but they were on a nice little run.

[mtred1984]

Can't be bothered quoting the line I read about sterling being an exceptional player. In what way is he exceptional? People seem to go way over the top on here about a 18 year old that has just just broke into the side. Exceptional belongs to players who are established, likes of your messi, Ronaldos, Suarez. Not a little upstart (my opinion) who it seems is demanding a lot of money for what he's actually worth at this current time. I just can't see this enormous potential people are raving about. He isn't lightning quick, he hardly beats his man. But that will come in time. What he does do well is track back well beyond his years. But for the rest, he's miles behind

[mtred1984]

The fundamental problem for me aside from not posessing clinical forwards is we only control the game when we have the ball. This I know is our philosophy [ sorry for the p word]. But controlling the game is also about what you do when you dont have the ball. On that side we're failing miserabley. Lucas was the best of our trio in that respect despite looking far from fit. Allen and Gerrard are largely invisible in that respect. Neither is starting on merit at the moment and it needs addressing pronto. It is worth noting that Gerrard should have scored two goals if it wasn't for Luis awful pass. There must be a way of utilising that ability considering our impotence in front of goal. We heard a lot about winning the ball back within 7 seconds of losing posession, well we do  quite often in fairness, it's unfortunately Pepe picking it out of the back of the net.

Solutions to be tried could involve Henderson for Gerrard with Stevie taking Shelyeys place. Maybe Sahin for Allen. Reads great on the internet but who knows how it would work out in practice. We've little to lose at this stage.

Regards to what I have bolded. I said the exact same to my mate, we seem to have a plan. Have as much of the possession, try to penetrate. But when we lose where a defensive nightmare. There is certainly no tactics or thought on positioning in certain areas of the field if we where to lose it. Also, for me,the return of Lucas hasn't changed one iota of our play for me. He can only do so much covering as a dm. He's isolated when they counter attack. I'd like to see Allen, stay and stick alongside him. If Allen drives forward, Gerrard ain't going to drop back beside Lucas. When rafa was in charge, we dominated and largely controlled the who shape of the game. For me be should adopt this approach, and allow the four furthest to have as much freedom as they like

[Red number seven]

Is it taboo to suggest this was Villa's "4-1 at Old Trafford" performance?

In that things went right for them on the counter, yeah possibly. But don't flatter either us or Villa; neither of us are close to either side in that game at the moment.

Until Rodgers has had 2 more transfer windows, we will not be able to make any kind of judgement on him, because he has decided on a way of playing without the personal to effect it. ]

Quite simply he has an enormously unbalanced squad, with a lot of central midfielders (but still no cover for Lucas!)  and absolutely no cut unless Suarez does it (the blip, if there was on, was actually W.Ham when we scored 3 without him!). A pragmatic approach to this season would not have seen the signing of Joe Allen, and probably not Borini, but Rodgers is playing a long game, has his ideas and wants to get the right players to see it to fruition. Time will make it clear if he is right.

Our lack of strikers has been well documented, Rodgers knows it and I am sure will attempt to address it. He then needs to demonstrate what he has not done before - that he knows how to turn possession and territory into chances and goals.

Of more immediate concern is that I think we are poor off the ball at the moment; some of that is that Allen and Gerrard look desperate for a rest. I have concerns that Brendan, who I thought was enormously meritocratic, does seem to have his favourites.

[Yorkykopite]

Exceptional belongs to players who are established, likes of your messi, Ronaldos, Suarez. Not a little upstart (my opinion) who it seems is demanding a lot of money for what he's actually worth at this current time. I just can't see this enormous potential people are raving about. He isn't lightning quick, he hardly beats his man. But that will come in time. What he does do well is track back well beyond his years. But for the rest, he's miles behind

Why will it?

If the rest of what you say is true why are you so confident he'll suddenly develop the ability to beat men? You say you can't see the potential in Sterling. So why would things change for him in future?

Have the courage of your convictions.

[mtred1984]

I think if he has a bit of  strength behind him, he won't get shoved off the ball easier and it would improve his game alot.

Do I think he's going to be a world beater, no!

Exceptional player at this moment. Is he fuck

Good player? Possibly

[mtred1984]

I think if he has a bit of  strength behind him, he won't get shoved off the ball easier and it would improve his game alot. I feel that at the moment, he doesn't go at players enough, and for me I feel that is because he is constantly getting bullied off the ball

Do I think he's going to be a world beater, no!

Exceptional player at this moment. Is he fuck

Good player? Possibly

[fewmin' bedwetter]

I share your frustration Timbo. I especially share it over Suarez's sloppiness. Having now seen it from a better angle the ball to Gerrard was piss poor. Not what you expect of a player of his class. Mind you there was little wrong with the pass to Shelvey. The problem was Shelvey being back on his heels as usual. Talk about slow feet. It's painful to watch him pulling his boots out of the gluey mess that seems to lap at his feet wherever he goes. He looked like a right lummox on Saturday.

Allen's ball to Cole didn't look particularly clever. But it wasn't entirely stupid either. We've been doing those types of passes all season and they have worked for us because they tend to pull opponents forward and lengthen the pitch for our attackers. It was enough that the Villa midfield was being sucked towards Cole. He simply needed to return the ball to Allen and let Allen quickly switch play.

Why no Suso? I don't know. This was the most disappointing part of Brendan's game for me. If not a substitute instead of Joe Cole, then surely instead of Jordan Henderson. It seemed obvious to me that we needed to start going through the middle of Villa's two banks of four and not exclusively round the back (which simply led to us crossing into a densely populated goalmouth). Henderson lacks the ambition and the know-how to cope with a crowded pitch. Suso doesn't. At 0-3, frankly, we'd have been better with Adorjan, Pacheco and Suso than we would with Henderson, Cole and Gerrard. For some reason though Rodgers has leaned to the big Englishmen in recent works rather than the more technical players.

With our middle three showing no signs of clicking any time soon,  I'm beginning to wonder whether we shouldn't chuck Adorjan in there behind Suarez and see if it works. After all he's been training for that role game in, game out, day in, day out for the last couple of years.

As for Pacheco, don't get me started...