Topic: Our Fundamental Problem

[Red_Isle_Chap]

There is no way to sell Carroll, Adam, Downing or Henderson as much as the overall policy last year was wrong.

We NEED them in order to become a big and powerful squad, being flexible enough to handle those thursday/sunday games on a regular basis.

What we have to do is make up for the losses of Meireles and Torres and for the slow fading out of Kuyt, Maxi.

For that we have to buy a younger version of Torres, Kuyt, Maxi and Meireles next summer. I think we have to concentrate on this only, invest all our money on adding enough of this extra international quality in midfield and attack (as well as probably one full back for competition with Enrique but I don´t see this as a first priority).

If we do that, we are back, I am 100% sure of this.

Selling the likes of Downing and Carroll would simply put too much burdon on the summer window again and it´s just not possible to replace AND improve too many players. We should have learned this from last summer.

I wouldn't say 100% back, but i do agree with all the rest of your post. We can't sell them, what's the point? We can't have another year of trying to integrate 6-7 players into the squad and team. What we have to do is build on our squad and move forward. The only players that i can see likely to leave are maxi and dirk. I honestly don't expect anyone else from the first team squad to go, i do expect at least 3 new faces to come in, and not cheap ones either.

We're a couple of big, big players away from a healthy looking side. It's going to be down to kenny and commoli to get it right as in choosing the personnel, and down to the owners to dig into their pockets and pay not only the transfer fees, but the wages as well. It's either that or accept not being in the top 4 for a fair old time.

[Veinticinco de Mayo]

There's no way we can just unload players to that degree. Anyone calling for such is an idiot with no idea of how the game works. We give Kenny as much dough as possible. We tweak were it's most essential. It's like the plate balancing act some mentioned before. That's why it takes time and patience. You get to the balanced squad, then it's just the occasional tweek in the summer. We can't keep going through massive upheavel. This what we've seen in the last few years is the result.

I would love to nail this to most RAWKites foreheads

[filopastry]

I wouldn't say 100% back, but i do agree with all the rest of your post. We can't sell them, what's the point? We can't have another year of trying to integrate 6-7 players into the squad and team. What we have to do is build on our squad and move forward. The only players that i can see likely to leave are maxi and dirk. I honestly don't expect anyone else from the first team squad to go, i do expect at least 3 new faces to come in, and not cheap ones either.

We're a couple of big, big players away from a healthy looking side. It's going to be down to kenny and commoli to get it right as in choosing the personnel, and down to the owners to dig into their pockets and pay not only the transfer fees, but the wages as well. It's either that or accept not being in the top 4 for a fair old time.

I suspect your view of our likely base transfer budget for this summer is a lot more optimistic is mine then!

I suspect we will largely live within our means this summer in the transfer market, in line with the owners views on how transfers need to be funded and if I'm being honest I'd agree with that, especially in light of the lack of return we've seen from the 2011 purchases so far.

[Fat Scouser]

I defo don't think we can afford to get it wrong again in the summer. Next year the pressure will really be on to get the top four finish at the very least.
I think Kenny took a gamble with the Carling Cup, knowing we would struggle to get top four, made a full on push in the cups. It's not a bad thing. It's usually a springboard to league success. But look at clubs who've won the League Cup in recent years. Every team from the so called big ones who gave it a real go, had a dip in their league form. Then, there was Birmingham, who ended up relegated... I think there was others. I've been on the ale for a few days, licking me wounds here, so not at me most clear headed.

I'm not a great one for stats. I'm knocking on a bit, all this assists to me is modern bollocks. Players made goals for their team mates. I think an awful lot of the newer stuff is just cack to keep opta fellas busy. But I do know it's fact, that most clubs have started successful periods with cup runs, then a decent tilt at a title challenge. And I said it earlier, but I think we went through that part of the process with Rafa only to lose our nerve. We can't do it again.

Fuck the stats. Just check the histories of dominant clubs in the game... stable board, management, settled squad, cup wins, title push, title. That's something that hasn't changed in the game.

[Blade]

Ok pal, whatever, you've obviously not read the post.

Here's another SOLID STAT for you:

Number of trophies Liverpool won with Fernando Torres on the pitch: 0
Number of ttrophies won with Andy Carroll on the pitch: 1.

So obviously, we're alot better with Carroll than Torres.

Good God.

Well, we obviously are. For all the goals that Torres has scored for us, we have never won anything with him on the team. Of course, that doesn't means I wouldn't take him back. An attacking force of Suarez, Torres and Carroll would be fearsome. Kenny will need to rotate them, but imagine the possibilities.

[Fat Scouser]

I would love to nail this to most RAWKites foreheads

I'd like to just put nails in their heads mate. But we can't win em all.

[Suspect Package.]

I wouldn't say 100% back, but i do agree with all the rest of your post. We can't sell them, what's the point? We can't have another year of trying to integrate 6-7 players into the squad and team. What we have to do is build on our squad and move forward. The only players that i can see likely to leave are maxi and dirk. I honestly don't expect anyone else from the first team squad to go, i do expect at least 3 new faces to come in, and not cheap ones either.

We're a couple of big, big players away from a healthy looking side. It's going to be down to kenny and commoli to get it right as in choosing the personnel, and down to the owners to dig into their pockets and pay not only the transfer fees, but the wages as well. It's either that or accept not being in the top 4 for a fair old time.

Unfortunately, this modicum of sense is being posted on RAWK.

Ah Rawk, where a player is only as good as their last 5 games, where the CL hasn't as much value if we're not in it, where if you're not already world class by 21 you're permanently crap and if you're aged 27+ you're too old already, where we need to sell half of the squad and replace it every summer, if we don't spend enough money the owners are tight bastards, if we spend but not in Spain or Latin America the clueless owners are wasting their money, and we should all be dreaming of that footballing god Jose Mourinho waltzing into our manager's seat.

Sorry, it's just I can already feel the muppets racing to this thread to disagree with you and FS.

[Red_Isle_Chap]

I suspect your view of our likely base transfer budget for this summer is a lot more optimistic is mine then!

I suspect we will largely live within our means this summer in the transfer market, in line with the owners views on how transfers need to be funded and if I'm being honest I'd agree with that, especially in light of the lack of return we've seen from the 2011 purchases so far.

Yes and no mate on the transfer budget. I know the sum total of fuck all as to what we'll have to spend. I'm just looking at the owners and know that they want to win. To do so means they have to spend, it's the nature of the beast that is the premier league unfortunately.

But, if they are going to spend within the clubs means and only that, then people can't fucking whinge about us not being in the top four can they? IF the owners had spent this fabled 100m and just added to what we'd had then yeah fair enough, whinge away about being in 7th and our form being a bunch of arse. But they didn't do that, in fact they've spent fuck all really since taking us over. So if they want this part of their sporting portfolio to be a successful one then they'll have to crack open the wallets.

Messi, Ronaldo, Huigan (sp?) to name but 3 that i'm expecting then

[Veinticinco de Mayo]

Sorry, it's just I can already feel the muppets racing to this thread to disagree with you and FS.

Fear not, I have Fats' back and I am armed with the muppet muting cannon

[Brentieke]

Well, we obviously are. For all the goals that Torres has scored for us, we have never won anything with him on the team. Of course, that doesn't means I wouldn't take him back. An attacking force of Suarez, Torres and Carroll would be fearsome. Kenny will need to rotate them, but imagine the possibilities.

Sorry pal, convinced you're wuming. Cant take you seriously.

[Zeb]

I'm guessing that the opinion is that the stories of Carroll being offered to Manchester City were bollocks?

Here's what Kenny said about it: "“We’re not going to get involved in justifying what people are saying – we don’t have to. Get City to justify it, not us. We’re not talking about any specific incident, but if you are going to do business in any way shape or form, no matter what life you are in, you don’t need to disclose it until it’s done."

Devil's advocate, but not personally closing my mind to the possibility that the cupboard is fairly bare and this summer the tweaking may involve money being raised from player sales.

[Red_Isle_Chap]

Fear not, I have Fats' back and I am armed with the muppet muting cannon

[filopastry]

Yes and no mate on the transfer budget. I know the sum total of fuck all as to what we'll have to spend. I'm just looking at the owners and know that they want to win. To do so means they have to spend, it's the nature of the beast that is the premier league unfortunately.

But, if they are going to spend within the clubs means and only that, then people can't fucking whinge about us not being in the top four can they? IF the owners had spent this fabled 100m and just added to what we'd had then yeah fair enough, whinge away about being in 7th and our form being a bunch of arse. But they didn't do that, in fact they've spent fuck all really since taking us over. So if they want this part of their sporting portfolio to be a successful one then they'll have to crack open the wallets.

Messi, Ronaldo, Huigan (sp?) to name but 3 that i'm expecting then

THey've been pretty clear throughout that they expect the club to live within its means they just won't be sucking cash out of it, unlike the previous fuckwits.

Given they've repeated it publicly often enough I'm sure Kenny and Comolli knew what the expectations were when they signed up, getting top 4 and the CL cash would obviously ease the financial pressure but in the absence of that all we can do is grow the commercial revenues as quickly as possible and try to be as clever as possible in the transfer market to get the maximum out of our limited funds.

With FFP the owners would be limited in terms of how much they could invest into the playing side of things anyway, even if they wanted to and I've seen nothing to indicate they want to.

Last year we probably had more flexibility than this year, given Torres' departure and there was so much obvious deadwood to offload which generated fees and reduced the wage bill, I'm not sure it'll be quite as easy this year, although the new kit deal will help us.

[Phatz]

Unfortunately, this modicum of sense is being posted on RAWK.

Ah Rawk, where a player is only as good as their last 5 games, where the CL hasn't as much value if we're not in it, where if you're not already world class by 21 you're permanently crap and if you're aged 27+ you're too old already, where we need to sell half of the squad and replace it every summer, if we don't spend enough money the owners are tight bastards, if we spend but not in Spain or Latin America the clueless owners are wasting their money, and we should all be dreaming of that footballing god Jose Mourinho waltzing into our manager's seat.

Sorry, it's just I can already feel the muppets racing to this thread to disagree with you and FS.

That just made me spray chilli at my screen. Thanks...

 

[Red_Isle_Chap]

THey've been pretty clear throughout that they expect the club to live within its means they just won't be sucking cash out of it, unlike the previous fuckwits.

Given they've repeated it publicly often enough I'm sure Kenny and Comolli knew what the expectations were when they signed up, getting top 4 and the CL cash would obviously ease the financial pressure but in the absence of that all we can do is grow the commercial revenues as quickly as possible and try to be as clever as possible in the transfer market to get the maximum out of our limited funds.

With FFP the owners would be limited in terms of how much they could invest into the playing side of things anyway, even if they wanted to and I've seen nothing to indicate they want to.

Last year we probably had more flexibility than this year, given Torres' departure and there was so much obvious deadwood to offload which generated fees and reduced the wage bill, I'm not sure it'll be quite as easy this year, although the new kit deal will help us.

Aye, i know we'll be limited to what the owners can put in due to FFP (in which we'll probably be the only ones adhering to it). The thing that resonates with me though is John Henry being interviewed on LFC tv and stating that they wanted to be in with winning the title within 3 years. Won't happen unless we spend spend spend right up to the amount we're allowed and spunk on wages.

Either that or pray that a couple of the kids are a) world class talent waiting to blossom in the next year and b) don't burn out  really quick

[Fat Scouser]

I think I can' cope with them. But I don't mind having a proper discussion, even if it is with some people that scream for heads to roll after every set back. It's what older fellas did with me on the Kop. The lads who'd ran the gaff in the 50's and 60's weren't too happy when us younger fellas started to take over. They're in the centenary moaning to this day. It's not just kids who kneejerk and throw wobblers. I know an aul fella who hasn't missed a home game since we were in the 2nd division. HE only stopped going the away's a few seasons back because he's knocking on a bit too much for all the travelling. He absolutely hated Rafa. Said, he was the worse manager we've ever had and constantly called for his head. There's no arguing with that. So I just chinned him. Nah jokes aside, true story. Bollocks to Istanbul, Cardiff, Athens, title pushes, etc... Rafa worse manager we've ever had in his opinion. Fucking mind boggling, but you couldn't argue with the fellas match going record or his love of the club.

[west_london_red]

THey've been pretty clear throughout that they expect the club to live within its means they just won't be sucking cash out of it, unlike the previous fuckwits.

Given they've repeated it publicly often enough I'm sure Kenny and Comolli knew what the expectations were when they signed up, getting top 4 and the CL cash would obviously ease the financial pressure but in the absence of that all we can do is grow the commercial revenues as quickly as possible and try to be as clever as possible in the transfer market to get the maximum out of our limited funds.

With FFP the owners would be limited in terms of how much they could invest into the playing side of things anyway, even if they wanted to and I've seen nothing to indicate they want to.

Last year we probably had more flexibility than this year, given Torres' departure and there was so much obvious deadwood to offload which generated fees and reduced the wage bill, I'm not sure it'll be quite as easy this year, although the new kit deal will help us.

Really dont want to turn this into a 'we must get in the CL places' debate but I dont think the problem with the club signing players is about money, we are one of the wealthiest clubs in Europe even without CL money, almost certainly the wealthiest outside of the CL. Not playing in the CL will cost us in terms of prestige, exposure etc, more then the money we miss out on.

[jDJ]

Whenever things go a little wrong at Liverpool we always make this massive list of players who aren't "fit to wear the shirt".  It's b0llocks and always has been.  Lucas Leiva was on such a list every single time.  I actually think there's less bad players on our books than there has been for a long time.  Last summer wasn't perfect, the overall player procurement strategy was very difficult to gauge other than a clear undeniable focus on British players.  That was a mistake.  Once Young and Jones went to United, who were the obvious British talent available last summer we should have altered our targets, not just gone for next grade down.  Still we did what we did and whilst Henderson and Downing might not be worth what we paid, we've still got a couple of decent players in the squad.

If last summer was about British, this summer should be about quality.  If a top class British player is available, by all means go for him, but if that deal falls through, look abroad.

[scatman]

I think those posting the Carroll fact about Suarez's goals are missing the key point.

The main thing should be that Suarez isnt the focal point of the attack, and whether that is Andy, Dirk or whoever, Suarez not being the focal point of the attack gives him more space.

[Blade]

Sorry pal, convinced you're wuming. Cant take you seriously.

I am wumimg because I disagree with your opinion? Interesting. By the way, the game of football has always been and always will be about the team success. That is why Djimi Traore has more Champions League medals than Chelsea, Arsenal and Man City put together. If you can't understand that, any further discussion is pointless.

[Eeyore]

I'm guessing that the opinion is that the stories of Carroll being offered to Manchester City were bollocks?

Here's what Kenny said about it: "“We’re not going to get involved in justifying what people are saying – we don’t have to. Get City to justify it, not us. We’re not talking about any specific incident, but if you are going to do business in any way shape or form, no matter what life you are in, you don’t need to disclose it until it’s done."

Devil's advocate, but not personally closing my mind to the possibility that the cupboard is fairly bare and this summer the tweaking may involve money being raised from player sales.

It was Ferguson's mouthpiece Daniel Taylor who broke that story and it was probably just an opportunity to stir things up between City and Liverpool. The last thing on earth Ferguson would of wanted was Liverpool creating a relationship between City and Liverpool where we hoovered up players they were looking to offload. With FFP coming in City will need to get players with big wages off their books and we are one of the few Clubs with the financial clout to take advantage of that.

As for Kenny he had to tread a very fine line between killing the speculation and making a rod for his own back, if he is seen to answer questions on who will be leaving the Club then he would get a different question regarding a different player at every press conference. What his answer did was to lead the pack of baying wolves off to City's door.

[filopastry]

Aye, i know we'll be limited to what the owners can put in due to FFP (in which we'll probably be the only ones adhering to it). The thing that resonates with me though is John Henry being interviewed on LFC tv and stating that they wanted to be in with winning the title within 3 years. Won't happen unless we spend spend spend right up to the amount we're allowed and spunk on wages.

Either that or pray that a couple of the kids are a) world class talent waiting to blossom in the next year and b) don't burn out  really quick

I think you can see some source for optimism versus the top sides in the league, if UEFA are serious about FFP, then Chelsea and City have some serious issues to address in the next few years, its hard to see at present how they can meet those targets without fiddling the figures or offloading significant numbers of players.

United are still being held back by the drain of the debt placed on the club, and Spurs are still restricted by not having huge sources of revenue to draw on themselves, only Arsenal are in strong financial shape out of that lot and nobody knows if and when they are going to allow the funds to be released in the transfer market.

I don't want to get into the whole Cup v 4th argument here, but missing out on 4th was important for us in terms of aggressively pursuing that timetable given the extra funds it would have freed up for us to pursue players, given how the club is being run at the moment I don't think those funds are going to magically appear from the owners pockets to make up the shortfall, we'll just have to make do.

The other scenario of course is that FFP is a sham in which case I think we'll be looking for new owners again in a few years.

[Blade]

I think those posting the Carroll fact about Suarez's goals are missing the key point.

The main thing should be that Suarez isnt the focal point of the attack, and whether that is Andy, Dirk or whoever, Suarez not being the focal point of the attack gives him more space.

And how am I missing the point? I have stated very obviously that Andy must improve his game, especially his positioning, his movement and, above all, his finishing. I am of the opinion that he can do that. Why? Because he is young and talented, and has all the physical and technical tools to become a very good striker. What's wrong with being patient with young and talented players?

[Zeb]

It was Ferguson's mouthpiece Daniel Taylor who broke that story and it was probably just an opportunity to stir things up between City and Liverpool. The last thing on earth Ferguson would of wanted was Liverpool creating a relationship between City and Liverpool where we hoovered up players they were looking to offload. With FFP coming in City will need to get players with big wages off their books and we are one of the few Clubs with the financial clout to take advantage of that.

As for Kenny he had to tread a very fine line between killing the speculation and making a rod for his own back, if he is seen to answer questions on who will be leaving the Club then he would get a different question regarding a different player at every press conference. What his answer did was to lead the pack of baying wolves off to City's door.

Fair enough Al. I'll still keep an open mind because I'm a suspicious sod

[Fat Scouser]

I don't think there's any chance of FSG just throwing loads of dough at Dalglish and Comolli. He'll probably have to unload some players, what he can get for the likes of Maxi, Cole, and sadly probably, Dirk remains to be seen. But I think he better get rooting down the back of the couch and in the slummy bottle as I don't see the Yanks lashing open cheque books around.

[Chakan]

I don't think there's any chance of FSG just throwing loads of dough at Dalglish and Comolli. He'll probably have to unload some players, what he can get for the likes of Maxi, Cole, and sadly probably, Dirk remains to be seen. But I think he better get rooting down the back of the couch and in the slummy bottle as I don't see the Yanks lashing open cheque books around.

While I don't see them doing that either, I do think if Kenny/Comolli made a case for dishing out 35/40m for a player they really needed, I think they would happily open the cheque book.

[Rohit]

I don't think there's any chance of FSG just throwing loads of dough at Dalglish and Comolli. He'll probably have to unload some players, what he can get for the likes of Maxi, Cole, and sadly probably, Dirk remains to be seen. But I think he better get rooting down the back of the couch and in the slummy bottle as I don't see the Yanks lashing open cheque books around.

But they are going to need give some investment from their own pocket to comolli/kenny if they want to make that initial push otherwise we'll find it harder by the year to reassert ourselves amongsts the big boys. We aren't far off from a good team for me, three players but they have to be key signings that give the current the final push over the finishing line. If FSG want to make the most out of their investment they are going to have put their hands in their pockets.

[Johnny Foreigner]

Back to the drawing board and just about realize that this squad is a 6-10th placed team with the ability to rise to the occassion on cup nights.. We're far off putting anything like an attempt to compete on the highest level in Europe..

The team that demolished Real Madrid back in 2009 was

Reina - Aurelio - Carrager - Skrtel - Arbeloa - Babel - Mascherano - Alonso -Gerrard -  Kuyt - Torres

The team that lost to Wigan was

Reina - Enrique - Carragher - Skrtl - Flanagan - Downing - Spearing - Henderson - Gerrard - Kuyt - Torres

We have 5 in both teams where 1 has improved, 1 stable if being nice, two have lost their legs and 1 is effected by injuries..

Aurelio, Arbeloa, Babel, Mascherano, Alonso, Torres

vs

Enrique, Flanagan, Downing, Spearing, Henderson, Suarez..

Not sure how that flies with the marketing, but the current league position gives a true reflection of where we are for the time being..

[scatman]

And how am I missing the point? I have stated very obviously that Andy must improve his game, especially his positioning, his movement and, above all, his finishing. I am of the opinion that he can do that. Why? Because he is young and talented, and has all the physical and technical tools to become a very good striker. What's wrong with being patient with young and talented players?

No you stated initially that the reason Suarez scores goals is because of Carroll. There is nothing to prove that Carroll has directly contributed to Suarez scoring except for the one assist.

[lachesis]

The team that demolished Real Madrid back in 2009 was

Reina - Aurelio - Carrager - Skrtel - Arbeloa - Babel - Mascherano - Alonso -Gerrard -  Kuyt - Torres

The team that lost to Wigan was

Reina - Enrique - Carragher - Skrtl - Flanagan - Downing - Spearing - Henderson - Gerrard - Kuyt - Torres??

[Veinticinco de Mayo]

Back to the drawing board and just about realize that this squad is a 6-10th placed team with the ability to rise to the occassion on cup nights.. We're far off putting anything like an attempt to compete on the highest level in Europe..

The team that demolished Real Madrid back in 2009 was

Reina - Aurelio - Carrager - Skrtel - Arbeloa - Babel - Mascherano - Alonso -Gerrard -  Kuyt - Torres

The team that lost to Wigan was

Reina - Enrique - Carragher - Skrtl - Flanagan - Downing - Spearing - Henderson - Gerrard - Kuyt - Torres

We have 5 in both teams where 1 has improved, 1 stable if being nice, two have lost their legs and 1 is effected by injuries..

Aurelio, Arbeloa, Babel, Mascherano, Alonso, Torres

vs

Enrique, Flanagan, Downing, Spearing, Henderson, Suarez..

Not sure how that flies with the marketing, but the current league position gives a true reflection of where we are for the time being..

Torres was fucking anonymous against Wigan.  That was the problem, that and the fact that Skrtel lost his supply of E.

[Fat Scouser]

Torres was fucking anonymous against Wigan.  That was the problem, that and the fact that Skrtel lost his supply of E.

Yeah but Carra got on the h which does sort of explain a few things

[Blade]

I don't think there's any chance of FSG just throwing loads of dough at Dalglish and Comolli. He'll probably have to unload some players, what he can get for the likes of Maxi, Cole, and sadly probably, Dirk remains to be seen. But I think he better get rooting down the back of the couch and in the slummy bottle as I don't see the Yanks lashing open cheque books around.

FSG have always been very clear about their spending policy at LFC: Whatever the club earns, it will be reinvested. So far, they have honored their promise. Personally, I don't have any problem with that kind of policy. Kenny, Comolli and our scouting department should start earning their wages in this area. Going for overpriced domestic players is no longer an option. Buying top quality players from La Liga, Serie A, Bundesliga and Ligue 1 would also be a very difficult task, without the ability to offer CL football. We should focus our attention to the smaller leagues like Russia, Turkey, Portugal, Holland, Ukraine, Belgium and the likes. We should also revisit our traditional hunting ground in Scandinavia. And last, but not least, we should seriously explore the South American and Central American leagues. With this type of recruitment policy, and with the still existing pulling power of our club, we could finish the rebuilding process with the available financial resources, and to a great effect.

[Blade]

No you stated initially that the reason Suarez scores goals is because of Carroll. There is nothing to prove that Carroll has directly contributed to Suarez scoring except for the one assist.

I know this might come as a shock for you, but there is so much more to the game of football than goals and assists records.

[Carlito Roberto]

I personally think Carroll will be sold in the summer. How much we get for him remains to be seen but his continued non selection speaks volumes about how highly he's rated within the club.

It's proving very difficult to integrate him into a proper system and all this chopping and changing both personnel and systems is becoming a problem. I'd have him at the focal point of a 4-2-3-1 with Gerrard, Suarez and Bellamy/Maxi supporting him and see how it goes. Unfortunately I can't see that happening as Gerrard has reverted to type as an all seeing all dancing central midfielder and Downing seems to be favoured over Maxi, which I find extremely strange.

[scatman]

I know this might come as a shock for you, but there is so much more to the game of football than goals and assists records.

Yeah because a team who does not score goals will get places in football?

You keep changing your argument to suit yourself. That's fine, please tell me what makes Carroll fit into our system (if there is a system) of play?

[Saul Goodman]

And how am I missing the point? I have stated very obviously that Andy must improve his game, especially his positioning, his movement and, above all, his finishing. I am of the opinion that he can do that. Why? Because he is young and talented, and has all the physical and technical tools to become a very good striker. What's wrong with being patient with young and talented players?

The same point keeps getting made over and over by different people.

We know Andy is talented. We know he has some excellent attributes. We know he will develop.

The key point here is will he develop into the type of striker that will suit Liverpool and how Kenny wants to play football. Andy is not suddenly going to develop into a player who likes neat one touch pass and move football. THIS IS 'PLAN A' FOR KENNY. Getting plan A up and firing is what is important right now. Not the fact that we're getting better results with Andy!

[lachesis]

I think this thread is lacking videos.

[Blade]

Yeah because a team who does not score goals will get places in football?

You have just argued that Andy doesn't contribute to Suarez' goals, yet now you say that we don't score goals. Make up your mind.

[Fat Scouser]

Oh I'm not saying FSG are pulling any sort of stunts. We'll have to wait on that one, but I do think they'll be true to their word. They are here to make money. They know to do so, we'll have to be succesful on the feild. After the H&G policy of brand loyalty, I have no problem with that. But I do think some of the older fringe players will have to be sold to give Dalglish the sort of money he'll need to compete. That doesn't mean a clear out. Like I said earlier, we obviously can't just go on the huge clear outs that some on here rant about. I know what I'd like to see, but Dalglish has also made it pretty clear... just a few bits of missing quality will be searched out. I don't think we need much more, but we will have to be patient.