Topic: Munich Chants/Banners

[Rafa Rafael]

but what gets me is the[  without killing anyone song] is sung by most of the fucking ground.

.............and their players in the Champions League Final last season

C*nts

[Rafa Rafael]

Sticks and Stones may break my bones but words will never hurt me

Nuff said

[Mad Men]

.............and their players in the Champions League Final last season

C*nts

What else is new...you do realize why their fan's never get ANY respect anywhere they go right? Half the stadium, no offence meant, are filled by tourist visiting the UK anyways.

What do they know?

[Veinticinco de Mayo]

People have to understand that by us stopping the nonesense, then man utd and everton will stop their nonsense.

That's nonsense.  Nothing that we do will stop their moronic behaviour.  However it does not mean that we are forced to sink to their level.  We make our own choices.

Point 1: Exploitation of the dead to score cheap points at rivals at a football game is sick.

Now if that is a bit wishy washy for you and you are too stupid or hot-headed to impose any sort of moral control over your own actions then consider...

Point 2: If we respond in kind then we give them justification for their own bile.  If we do not then we expose them for the moronic gutter-dwelling sewer rats that they are.
 
Now if that is too difficult a concept to grasp, then...
 
Point 3: Taking the piss about a football disaster and the loss of life involved disrespects all the dead and survivors of Hillsborough. And in doing so it hampers our cause in seeking justice for those 96 fans every time it is sung.
 
We all know that when the Mancs started openly singing "Where's your famous Munich chant" it was a de facto song about Hillsborough.  It was not getting sung anymore because of what had happened in '89. It had made us realise that it was wrong and to sing it would be to disrespect our own dead. Some of our fans apparently think that 20 years is long enough and there is no need for that respect any more. They are wrong.

[redmark]

Unfortunately, no it won't!  I can only see it stopping if their is a campaign / name and shame by the clubs, or media, or group like SOS.  The mindset of these people dictate that your suggestion just won't work!

Of course it won't stop instantly, but it will stop over a period of time. Do you not think United fans also justify it to themselves with 'they sing Munich songs', or 'they started it'?

For a start, it's just wrong. An excuse of 'they do it too' is childish. Secondly, if we did infact stop, there would then be some room for the club and United fans who cringe just as much about 'murderers' chants etc (and there will be many) to apply similar pressure on their own.

[Veinticinco de Mayo]

Sticks and Stones may break my bones but words will never hurt me

Nuff said

But that's because you are a pig-shit ignorant retarded inbred progeny of an illicit coupling between a whore and a donkey.

[Rafa Rafael]

But that's because you are a pig-shit ignorant retarded inbred progeny of an illicit coupling between a whore and a donkey.

Fuckin hell, get a grip

You have just called me the offspring of a whore, how do you know that my Ma isnt/wasnt a whore and if she was/is then that makes you as bad as all the "pig-shit ignorants"

The fact of the matter is, people always have and always will find the need to ridicule tragedys

Thats the reason the same day Jade Goody was printed bald in the paper after chemotherapy i got about 209 duifferent jokes sent by text/email, the same reason the day Josef Fritzl was found out to be a maniac who did what he did.........I had equally as many emails/text jokes..............and its also the reason that many, many, many a comedian all over the world make jokes about every single natural disaster or 9/11 or whatever

The reason they do it is to get a reaction, and people like you, who react as you do..........only stoke their fire

[redmark]

Fuckin hell, get a grip

You have just called me the offspring of a whore, how do you know that my Ma isnt/wasnt a whore and if she was/is then that makes you as bad as all the "pig-shit ignorants"

The fact of the matter is, people always have and always will find the need to ridicule tragedys

Thats the reason the same day Jade Goody was printed bald in the paper after chemotherapy i got about 209 duifferent jokes sent by text/email, the same reason the day Josef Fritzl was found out to be a maniac who did what he did.........I had equally as many emails/text jokes..............and its also the reason that many, many, many a comedian all over the world make jokes about every single natural disaster or 9/11 or whatever

The reason they do it is to get a reaction, and people like you, who react as you do..........only stoke their fire

So we shouldn't get upset about anyone disrespecting or ridiculing the 96 Hillsborough victims either? It's just a laugh?

[Suspect Package.]

That's nonsense.  Nothing that we do will stop their moronic behaviour.  However it does not mean that we are forced to sink to their level.  We make our own choices.

Point 1: Exploitation of the dead to score cheap points at rivals at a football game is sick.

Now if that is a bit wishy washy for you and you are too stupid or hot-headed to impose any sort of moral control over your own actions then consider...

Point 2: If we respond in kind then we give them justification for their own bile.  If we do not then we expose them for the moronic gutter-dwelling sewer rats that they are.
 
Now if that is too difficult a concept to grasp, then...
 
Point 3: Taking the piss about a football disaster and the loss of life involved disrespects all the dead and survivors of Hillsborough. And in doing so it hampers our cause in seeking justice for those 96 fans every time it is sung.
 
We all know that when the Mancs started openly singing "Where's your famous Munich chant" it was a de facto song about Hillsborough.  It was not getting sung anymore because of what had happened in '89. It had made us realise that it was wrong and to sing it would be to disrespect our own dead. Some of our fans apparently think that 20 years is long enough and there is no need for that respect any more. They are wrong.

Brilliant post. You nicely summed up the points I'd been trying to make in this thread.

[Wingman]

I'll continue to sing nasty songs about Mancs when we are playing them while they continue to make banners and sing shit songs about us EVERY FUCKIN GAME they play.

People disagree fine, but I can't tolerate them and I am sick of people giving it the 'we should be the better man' like we should make effort to make the derby more friendly when it's entirely Everton's fault it has gone down the pan. Fuck them all, it's their fault it's got this bad so they can be the better man first, not us.

How ironic. Take a look in the mirror sometime.

[hassinator]

Is there really any reason to start a thread drawing attention to the pricks who do it?
We know, it's wrong. It won't stop people who want to do it doing it though....

we have to keep our own house in order. 

its certainly much better us talking about why its wrong on here than just ignoring it.

its bad enough we boo our own players but with our own tragedies to deal with its important that we lead on this.

[Rafa Rafael]

So we shouldn't get upset about anyone disrespecting or ridiculing the 96 Hillsborough victims either? It's just a laugh?

Where did I say it was a laugh?

I said people do it for a reaction...

Its never, ever, ever gonna stop.......................EVER

[hassinator]

So we shouldn't get upset about anyone disrespecting or ridiculing the 96 Hillsborough victims either? It's just a laugh?

of course we should be annoyed but we have to be the bigger club, we're liverpool after all.  taking the moral high ground might not be the easiest course but look at rafa this season:  he points out that ferguson acts above the rules of the game and the press call it 'rafa's rant' but who's had the last laugh?

[Veinticinco de Mayo]

Rafa Rafael - firstly you have rather been whooshed my friend.  Secondly you have nicely shown that you don't actually live by the glib truisms that you trot out.  And thirdly

So we shouldn't get upset about anyone disrespecting or ridiculing the 96 Hillsborough victims either? It's just a laugh?

[Raul!]

Where did I say it was a laugh?

I said people do it for a reaction...

Its never, ever, ever gonna stop.......................EVER

And therefore, dear savant, no one should do anything about it?  By that argument, no one should have done anything about racism, colonial independence or universal suffrage.

[It's Jimmy Corkhill]

Of course it won't stop instantly, but it will stop over a period of time. Do you not think United fans also justify it to themselves with 'they sing Munich songs', or 'they started it'?

I'm sure their reasons for the disgraceful shit I've heard since 1989 is that the Kop, en masse whether people liek it or not, used to sing Munich songs. And do arms outstretched plane impressions. FACT, end of.

And their fucking players sing about us murdering our own fans, on the pitch after they've won the European Cup? And we're supposed to take the moral high ground?

The moral high ground has deffo worked after 20 years, the hostility is barely there anymore, you hear no chants now.

Fuck them. Give it to them both barrels.

[Sasquatch]

I still find it ironic that Mancs chant "murderers" at us.........when their own fans have been guilty in the past of "murdering" Middlesboro, Spurs and Crystal Palace fans.

I don't even think most of them know this though. I mean, it's not something that is shoved down their throats...unlike Heysel.

[robbie96]

That's nonsense.  Nothing that we do will stop their moronic behaviour.  However it does not mean that we are forced to sink to their level.  We make our own choices.

Point 1: Exploitation of the dead to score cheap points at rivals at a football game is sick.

Now if that is a bit wishy washy for you and you are too stupid or hot-headed to impose any sort of moral control over your own actions then consider...

Point 2: If we respond in kind then we give them justification for their own bile.  If we do not then we expose them for the moronic gutter-dwelling sewer rats that they are.
 
Now if that is too difficult a concept to grasp, then...
 
Point 3: Taking the piss about a football disaster and the loss of life involved disrespects all the dead and survivors of Hillsborough. And in doing so it hampers our cause in seeking justice for those 96 fans every time it is sung.
 
We all know that when the Mancs started openly singing "Where's your famous Munich chant" it was a de facto song about Hillsborough.  It was not getting sung anymore because of what had happened in '89. It had made us realise that it was wrong and to sing it would be to disrespect our own dead. Some of our fans apparently think that 20 years is long enough and there is no need for that respect any more. They are wrong.

Well said, now how do we encourage LFC to "officially" discourage this behaviour in the future

[Rafa Rafael]

I'm sure their reasons for the disgraceful shit I've heard since 1989 is that the Kop, en masse whether people liek it or not, used to sing Munich songs. And do arms outstretched plane impressions. FACT, end of.

And their fucking players sing about us murdering our own fans, on the pitch after they've won the European Cup? And we're supposed to take the moral high ground?

The moral high ground has deffo worked after 20 years, the hostility is barely there anymore, you hear no chants now.

Fuck them. Give it to them both barrels.

Well fuckin said

We were singing about Munich long before Hillsborough even happened

.....and now we are the moral club?

Get a fuckin grip knobheads

[liverpoolsox]

 never argue with idiots for they will bring u down to their level and beat you with experience

[Veinticinco de Mayo]

The moral high ground has deffo worked after 20 years, the hostility is barely there anymore, you hear no chants now.

Fuck them. Give it to them both barrels.

PMS.  The moral high ground was not taken to try and stop them chanting or improve them as people.  That is something only they can do.  The moral high ground was taken because it was right and because given what happened in 1989 to do anything less would be to disrespect the memory of the 96 dead.

Nobody runs on the pitch any more either.  Are you suggesting we let that one go too?

[Sasquatch]

Well fuckin said

We were singing about Munich long before Hillsborough even happened

.....and now we are the moral club?

Get a fuckin grip knobheads

Even that was tit for that. It started after the Bill Shankly dead chants from the Mancs.

[It's Jimmy Corkhill]

Even that was tit for that. It started after the Bill Shankly dead chants from the Mancs.

Indeed. Accomponied by a blow-up skeleton.

Fucking skeletons in the closet of the fucking Mancs never get brought out though, its always fucking us.

[Dr. Beaker]

Even that was tit for that. It started after the Bill Shankly dead chants from the Mancs.

Nope. Started a long time before then.

[Veinticinco de Mayo]

The point here is not whether we were singing about Munich before Hillsborough. We were. I think everyone knows that.  The point is that Hillsborough caused us to stop doing so because it made us realise that singing about people dying at football matches was wrong.  So twenty years later it ain't wrong anymore then?

[mikeb58]

Even that was tit for that. It started after the Bill Shankly dead chants from the Mancs.

Nope. Started a long time before then.

Is right, the Munich chant was sung well before Bill Shankly's death.

[redmark]

Well fuckin said

We were singing about Munich long before Hillsborough even happened

.....and now we are the moral club?

Get a fuckin grip knobheads

No, we're not the moral club. If you read the thread you'll notice that several of those against the Munich songs have already said that.

The fact is, the Munich stuff is wrong. The fact is, it did initially decline after first Heysel and then Hillsborough. The fact is, they've resurfaced in response to scum amongst United's fanbase AND a new generation of scum (if the word fits theirs, why not ours?) amongst our own fanbase who don't know any better, or pretend not to, or just don't give a fuck. Is our scum better than their scum? Do we have less scum than they do? Great.

Whatever happened to the legendary scouse wit? Nah, let's just sing about a plane disaster and make aeroplane gestures. That's fucking hilarious, even 50 years on.

[redmark]

Even that was tit for that. It started after the Bill Shankly dead chants from the Mancs.

No, that was a copy of the Munich song.

If we want any moral high ground at all, we could probably argue that Leeds were worse, certainly in the 80s. But as they're no longer around, the Mancs only have us to retaliate against.

[No666]

The argument from some on here reeks of the playground: they started it...
ffs, people died, there are bereaved still out there, and we, of all people, know how that feels - time to stop now.

[Ron]

It's all about good taste.
There is nothing criminal about chanting unpleasantries so I don't think there is any legal ground to give people a stadium ban for it.
Personally I don't understand why people get so worked up about what some morons sing, chant or even think.
I like to think that I'm above all that, it's all so childish really.
At the end of the day all those people we really hate on matchdays, or in some cases even in "normal" life, are (more or less) the same as us, they support a football club and behave stupidly when packed together in a group, often high on alcohol. I'm not saying it justifies all stupidness, I just think we should not be too insulted by it.

I don't think what people chant is necessarily what they think for themselves, or even what they will say if they are confronted in person.
A good friend of mine, an English lad from Ashton living over here in Holland, once told me about a hard core Manc hooligan who was crying his eyes out when he first heard about the Hillsborough disaster.

[WorldChampions]

You lot are acting like its a recent thing, vile songs have always been around at football matches and always will

[shanklyboy]

I'm sure their reasons for the disgraceful shit I've heard since 1989 is that the Kop, en masse whether people liek it or not, used to sing Munich songs. And do arms outstretched plane impressions. FACT, end of.

And their fucking players sing about us murdering our own fans, on the pitch after they've won the European Cup? And we're supposed to take the moral high ground?

The moral high ground has deffo worked after 20 years, the hostility is barely there anymore, you hear no chants now.

Fuck them. Give it to them both barrels.

If you hate what they are doing Scrapper, how can you justify our own supporters doing it?

I can't understand how people don't see it.I can't understand why you don't see it.

I have never sung about Munich even in the 70s and I never will. The Shipman song is just a joke. Something a 10 year old would think up and sing so I don't touch that either. Though I've sung virtually every other song at these shitheads.
I love to see their faces when we shut them up with something they can't argue about, that really hurts them.

I'm not advocating taking the moral high ground to stop them doing it.It's a personal thing with me.
To be honest, there is no hope for these ignorant,rodent gobshites.

So yes I want to see them suffer. Yes I want to hurt them.
I see people calling them all kinds for singing about Hillsborough, Heysel.....along with the bitters.
There were pages of threads about it. How they were the scum of the Earth,c.u.n.t.s, rodents, inbreds.

How do we respond?....... "I know....lets do what they're doing"
The justification is mind boggling.

To be the opposite of them we try to be like them?.......fucking priceless logic that.

[Veinticinco de Mayo]

You lot are acting like its a recent thing, vile songs have always been around at football matches and always will

Nobody is saying it is a recent thing.  You've clearly not been reading.

[Smellytrabs]

There is no excuse for it, and the moral high ground is a very important factor.  We pride ourselves on our knowledge, intelligence and decency, and the Munich songs drag us down to the level of scum singing about Hillsborough.

They have a small section of vermin that do the Hillsborough songs, and the decent majority of their fanbase need to get a grip of them and sort it out. likewise at Liverpool, good fans need to make sure that Munich songs are not tolerated.

Fuck all this "who started what first" bollocks. If the people who are doing the Munich songs cut it the fuck out, the Mancs that continue the Hillsborough songs look like even bigger pieces of shit than they do now.

[scoobs]

You lot are acting like its a recent thing, vile songs have always been around at football matches and always will

I can see things deterioating further the more successful we get in the coming years. Say if we won the League and maybe the Campions League and and challenged them on a constant basis. We saw how nasty the FA Cup game in 2006 on the back of Istanbul the season before.

[SwedenRed]

I sang the Munich songs before Hillsborough, I admit it... I was a teenager. However when Hillsborough happened, I realized how wrong it was and I stopped. Morally its wrong, and football is only a game... Its not more important than losing a life.
Nowadays, to sing Munich songs is childish, and disrespectful to all those who died and sufferred at both Hillsborough and Munich. Its embarrassing listening to people, whether Manc or Red, singing about events where people have died. Its sick.

[WorldChampions]

Nobody is saying it is a recent thing.  You've clearly not been reading.

Therefore the longer it goes on the harder it is to eradicate no?

[Veinticinco de Mayo]

Therefore the longer it goes on the harder it is to eradicate no?

True. Does not mean that it is not worth trying however. And above it all precedent does not make it right.

[HelterSkelter]

Of course it won't stop instantly, but it will stop over a period of time. Do you not think United fans also justify it to themselves with 'they sing Munich songs', or 'they started it'?

For a start, it's just wrong. An excuse of 'they do it too' is childish. Secondly, if we did infact stop, there would then be some room for the club and United fans who cringe just as much about 'murderers' chants etc (and there will be many) to apply similar pressure on their own.

They won't stop.
The majority of their fans see the 3 times song and calling us murderers as fair game. It was a response the the constant stream of the 5 times abuse. Pretty plain to see it how much that song pissed them off and I believe is still the best retort to 3 times.
These shouts, although I don't associate them with '89 and they don't arse me (Bluenoses apart), are leading to a growth in the '58, '89 songs from both sides which is just fueling the fire.
They incite some reds to react to it like they would with Hillsborough abuse, and that just plays into the c*nts hands.

[scoopex]

Their were no munich banners outside or inside at old trafford on saturday so the heading in this thread is a bit misleading.