Topic: Youth and Under 23 Thread

[Suareznumber7]

I'm sure they'll be good enough. Easily. Lads who play amatuer football can get scholarships over there. The standard isn't great in the grand scheme of things.

That's putting it nicely.

[B0151?]

More players should go abroad. Playing football for a living beats staying in this country, if you ask me.

I guess the first big rejection can be pretty devastating though.

[KennyDaggers]

I think bagpuss has got an excellent insight of what goes on at the academy.

People need to remember we have families of academy players posting on here

My son is an Acadamy player, I know nothing, I don't even know when they are taking a break for the summer.

Rumour has it, it's next week or so but I don't know for sure or how long they stop for.

Bagpuss??

[jimmyjr86]

They would probably walk into a top university side and get their education all paid for. Pretty sweet deal really and I'm surprised more don't do it. I know I would.

Are we expecting any surprises for the game tomorrow or much the same squad as last week?

[superjack]

http://conorfootball9.wordpress.com/2013/05/16/liverpool-end-of-season-awards/ made me laugh

[Dowling10]

My son is an Acadamy player, I know nothing, I don't even know when they are taking a break for the summer.

Rumour has it, it's next week or so but I don't know for sure or how long they stop for.

Bagpuss??

Next week it is. Then the restart beginning of June I think?

[Barefoot Doctor]

Jordon Ibe apparently making his debut today.

[Mercer]

Jordon Ibe apparently making his debut today.

Great stuff.

Happy for the lad.

[Drinks Sangria]

Jordon Ibe apparently making his debut today.

Wow. Good news, hope he has a good game. Well in lad.

[bagpuss]

My son is an Acadamy player, I know nothing, I don't even know when they are taking a break for the summer.

Rumour has it, it's next week or so but I don't know for sure or how long they stop for.

Bagpuss??

Finished now till the beginning of July

The older lads have anyway, not sure about young'ns.

It is scholarship based with Quirk and Gainford.

Quirk fancies California while Gainford might be looking at Ohio.

[Asam]

Jordon Ibe apparently making his debut today.

He'll be getting more games next season, very impressive

[greenstien]

Jordan Ibe was great today.  Such confidence from such a young man on a massive step up from the U21's. Big things ahead for him and no doubt more game time next season.

[Saul Goodman]

That was an extremely composed, mature debut from Ibe today.

[Juan Loco]

Forgot that he was making his debut after about 5 minutes.

Should temper the hype by pointing out that it was a dead rubber, end of season, against the shittest team in the division. But yeah, didn't look out of place. A season of U21s and cup games next year.

[b_joseph]

I'd rather him get a season of games in the Championship than play U21's but yeah, really impressive game from him and he looks physically ready for the league already.

Just hope he stays healthy and keeps his focus over the summer and for the coming seasons. Lots of people will be propping him up over the summer.

[Cpt_Reina]

Great season for all involved in the club below the first team.

Semi's of both the reserve league and FA Youth Cup.
Coady, Ibe, Sterling, Morgan, Wisdom, Robinson, Suso, Sinclair, Flanno, all getting first team minutes.

S'all good.

[Juan Loco]

I'd rather him get a season of games in the Championship than play U21's but yeah, really impressive game from him and he looks physically ready for the league already.

Just hope he stays healthy and keeps his focus over the summer and for the coming seasons. Lots of people will be propping him up over the summer.

Really not as big on loans as some of the others on here. I think you start thinking about them when the players pushing 20, 21 and doesn't have a way of getting first team games at Liverpool. In Ibe's case there's no need for it yet.

[Kochevnik]

Forgot that he was making his debut after about 5 minutes.

Should temper the hype by pointing out that it was a dead rubber, end of season, against the shittest team in the division. But yeah, didn't look out of place. A season of U21s and cup games next year.

It's really the perfect time to be giving a player like that a debut.  No pressure to be heaped on the lad if he struggles, and if he does well (which he did) it really boosts his confidence.  Not to mention that if we're looking to send him out on loan next season (which I kind of doubt, but who knows?) it improves his profile a lot.  If I were a team in the Championship looking to bring in a winger with a bit about him, Ibe just jumped up near the top of my list as a realistic loan target.

Even so, you're right to point out that we should be careful to manage the hype.  Not that he'll get much, really; I think everyone understands the situation, and the people who might not care to manage it (the media) will be too busy wanking over Ferguson and Scholes' retirement and the like.  Really, it worked out perfectly for us and Ibe both.

Not to mention the lad looks like he has a bit about him.  Did well, and I think he gets credit for the assist, no?

[johnhouldinglfc]

I think Ibe will really struggle to get any sort of serious first team game-time next season, even in the cups.

Suarez, Coutinho, Borini, Downing, Sterling, Suso, all ahead of him in the pecking order.

He'll need to start performing at a serious consistent level for the reserves before he can even start challenging for a first team place.

The game today was very much an end-of-season affair and was a serious way off the pace of a competitive league game.

On massive advantage that a loan to the Championship or Division One has over the reserve league is that you have pretty much twice the number of games in the Championship compared to in the reserves.

We played 27 games in the reserve league this season getting to the semi-finals.

In the Championship and Division One there are 46 games and that is before either of the cups; which means the minimum number of games a Championship and Divison One side would have in a season would be 48 and could very easily hit into the over 50 territory if a club has any sort of a decent cup run. That's a lot of extra games for a youngsters development.

The perfect example of this is Tom Ince who has played 88 games in the last two seasons for Blackpool. How much has this helped his development?

[Redondos Barber]

I think Ibe will really struggle to get any sort of serious first team game-time next season, even in the cups.

Suarez, Coutinho, Borini, Downing, Sterling, Suso, all ahead of him in the pecking order.

He'll need to start performing at a serious consistent level for the reserves before he can start challenging for a first team place.

The game today was very much an end-of-season affair and was a serious way off the pace of a competitive league game.

On massive advantage that a loan to the Championship or Division One has over the reserve league is that you have pretty much twice the number of games in the Championship compared to in the reserves.

We played 27 games in the reserve league this season getting to the semi-finals.

In the Championship and Division One there are 46 games and that is before either of the cups; which means the minimum number of games a Championship and Divison One side would have in a season would be 48 and could very easily hit into the over 50 territory if a club has any sort of a decent cup run. That's a lot of extra games for a youngsters development.

The perfect example of this is Tom Ince who has played 88 games in the last two seasons for Blackpool. How much has this helped his development?

He's 17 though. Wasn't he still playing U16 football for a part of last season? He needs  to be allowed time to grow and progress as much as anything else. Would you not prefer our teenage players to develop under the tutelage of Borrell and Inglethorpe, rather than be in the hands of some of the muck savages that masquerade as coaches down the leagues.

[kcbworth]

Missed the game but just heard about Ibe's start (and good performance). Any chance of unlocking http://www.redandwhitekop.com/forum/index.php?topic=295781.0

[johnhouldinglfc]

He's 17 though. Wasn't he still playing U16 football for a part of last season? He needs  to be allowed time to grow and progress as much as anything else. Would you not prefer our teenage players to develop under the tutelage of Borrell and Inglethorpe, rather than be in the hands of some of the muck savages that masquerade as coaches down the leagues.

I wouldnt send Ibe out on loan this season .

I'd give him a full season on in the reserves first.

The season after that I'd be looking to send him on loan.

I'd be looking for season long loans for Suso, Coady, N'goo, Morgan,  Sama, Adorjan, and Flanagan
Robinson and Shelvey are two others that might also be considered but season-long loans next season.

In a year's time I'd be looking at sending Ibe, McLaughlin, Teixeira, Yesil, Hodzic, Bijev, Smith, Pelosi and possibly Dunn and Petersen on loan.

There's only so much a coach can do after a certain stage.

The standard plan should be basically one full season at reserve level => loan to Championship.

It might vary because of injury/loan to a higher level but I think we need to improve our use of loans massively.

Coaches are always going to say that players are better off being under their expert tutelage but there is an element of "well they would say that" and I'm not sure I fully buy it.

[TepidT2O]

Worth rememebering that Ibe made his professional debut a couple of years ago which must have taken the edge off his nerves.

[sminp]

Hopefully this will help Sterling to improve as well. He will have seen today that he has someone a little bit younger than him who will be pushing for a spot on the wing in the next few years. The future looks bright for our wide players.

[Gitsy606]

Ibe will hopefully push Sterling on and vice versa, proper competition for a place can make a huge difference when players are at that age.

Depending on summer signings and lack of European football, I would say both players will find it hard to get game time, I would say Sterling may be more of an impact player next year in the league and Ibe will spend most of his time in the u21 team and maybe be involved in a few cup games.

[The Infamous_LFC]

Really impressed how assured he was in possession he was was picking the right options while Raheem is more of a instinct sort of winger. Like the ball for Enrique to put him through. Another good player produced excited about his progress. Next season might be hard for him to get games but he can play in the under 21's and fight for his spot on the team after next season, we all know players get fast tracked Sterling,Wisdom and Suso. 

[johnhouldinglfc]

Don't know if Ibe will be pushing Sterling all that much next season.

Ibe played 64 minutes of first team football this season [Today] and 765 minutes of reserve football.

Ibe's performances in the reserves have been good but hardly all that impressive especially when compared to the standard Sterling set in his brief cameos at reserve level.

Sterling played 2219 of first-team football, 1748 minutes of league time.

The 1748 minutes of league time was the 11th highest in the squad.

Sterling also played 231 minutes of reserve football.

Sterling was capped as a full international for England. Ibe didnt even make the English U20s.

Very hard to see a situation where Ibe starts putting Sterling under any sort of serious pressure until the season after next.

[Cpt_Reina]

Be nice if we could just let Ibe be Jordan Ibe and go at his own pace.

[KirkVanHouten]

Really happy with Brendan's decision there. It gives Ibe and all the youth players extra motivation over the summer. They'll see Jordan getting a game and also Coady in the last game and think that if they work hard enough they can make the senior squad too.

[sminp]

Very hard to see a situation where Ibe starts putting Sterling under any sort of serious pressure until the season after next.

It's not about how close they are in ability that will pressure him to improve. It's just that today was a little reminder to Sterling that he has a player coming up behind him who could in future have the ability to take his place in the squad. Not that Sterling will need much motivation to keep improving of course

[nyrrard]

How much work/would it even be possible to create a LFCB ala barca?
Would it start as a non-league team or possible to go around?

[swordfishtrombone]

Do you mean Liverpool basically having a B side as part of the league structure? It'd be impossible.

[bigbear]

Do you mean Liverpool basically having a B side as part of the league structure? It'd be impossible.

Thing is, that is the way to produce better players.

[Juan Loco]

Thing is, that is the way to produce better players.

Aye, but that'll take the FA deciding that they'd rather have the chance of better producing for the national team than having all these clubs that have been around for a 100+ years.

[bigbear]

Aye, but that'll take the FA deciding that they'd rather have the chance of better producing for the national team than having all these clubs that have been around for a 100+ years.

Yep and if I was a supporter of one of the clubs that was going to get the boot I wouldn't be happy about it whether it was good for the England side or not.

[nyrrard]

Do you mean Liverpool basically having a B side as part of the league structure? It'd be impossible.

yes. why? seems logic to me..

[swordfishtrombone]

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/teams/l/liverpool/6471413.stm

Think most of the pro's and con's are covered in this article

[nyrrard]

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/teams/l/liverpool/6471413.stm

Think most of the pro's and con's are covered in this article

 

Thank you.

[superjack]

Great season for all involved in the club below the first team.

Semi's of both the reserve league and FA Youth Cup.
Coady, Ibe, Sterling, Morgan, Wisdom, Robinson, Suso, Sinclair, Flanno, all getting first team minutes.

S'all good.

We were rubbish in the u18's league. We had a very easy run in fa youth cup to semis. We got well beat by Chelsea in semi. We were poor in the nex gen. Lost all our away matches and got destroyed by sporting. We faired better in the u21's until Xmas but we had basically no one on loan until then. We got well beaten by united in semi. Players got minutes in the Europa league group games that's hardly worth talking about same for the league cup. Our first team struggled first half of the season when wisdom,
Suso and sterling played. Ibe played in a dead rubber. Besides sterling no one else showed they were ready for the first team. can we honestly say there is anyone in the u21's ready to step to the first team next season even as a squad player. We totally over estimate our u21's and u18's. a lot of work is required plus a lot of recruitment. We were out classed too many times when we played anyone half decent.

[DanA]

We were rubbish in the u18's league. We had a very easy run in fa youth cup to semis. We got well beat by Chelsea in semi. We were poor in the nex gen. Lost all our away matches and got destroyed by sporting. We faired better in the u21's until Xmas but we had basically no one on loan until then. We got well beaten by united in semi. Players got minutes in the Europa league group games that's hardly worth talking about same for the league cup. Our first team struggled first half of the season when wisdom,
Suso and sterling played. Ibe played in a dead rubber. Besides sterling no one else showed they were ready for the first team. can we honestly say there is anyone in the u21's ready to step to the first team next season even as a squad player. We totally over estimate our u21's and u18's. a lot of work is required plus a lot of recruitment. We were out classed too many times when we played anyone half decent.

This is hilarious, talk about glass half empty.

We shouldn't be too focused on results and team performances. I'd argue three players made the jump from u21 to first team (Sterling, Suso and Wisdom) and that in itself is a far bigger success than a youth cup.  Wisdom started more games that Shelvey (19 starts)  while Suso made 20 appearances himself. Hard to argue all three of them didn't make the jump to first team. You're flat out wrong too about performances. Suso, Wisdom and Sterling didn't establish themselves until after the first 5 games and from there we averaged 1.7 ppg through til Christmas. That's an almost identical ppg to that acheived in the back half of the season though granted we weren't nearly as prolific in front of goal.

You mentioned too plenty of others played in the Europa league but hard to see that as anything other than a positive. We topped the group against Anzi, Young Boys and Udinese. You can talk it down all you want but Di Natalie is football royalty while Eto and Lass Diarra played for Barcelona and Real Madrid! These are good teams and our youngsters did well to play a role in topping the group against strong opposition.

In terms of stepping up from the u21's it's hard to say, that's a big jump as you know.  The likes of Coady and Robinson might not be ready for the first team football at Liverpool but they've progressed beyond the reserves and will likely be looking to have a big impact at Championship level if they can find a loan. Ibe will get opportunites in preseason after impressing in his "dead rubber" while i'm hopefully Texeira and McLaughlin get opporunity and impress as well.

Loyd Jones and Rossiter were probably the highlights, showing amazing progress over the course of the season. But guys like Dunn, Lussey etc showed improvement too. I get the point you're making though, it's not all sunshine and lollie pops. We were thread bare in defence at u18 level coming into the season and that really showed, depth very much needs to improve across the board from the first team through to the academy. Also have lacked goal scorers at every level. There were unfortunately injuries to Smith, Pelosi along with a few others but overall I think we can be very proud of what our academy achieved.