Topic: LFC Ticket Pricing Forum

[Lush is the best medicine...]

I’m a hospitality season ticket holder. Why does the club not do what they do with us. If you can’t attend the game you transfer the ticket via email to someone else and they download and print the eticket.

id guess the bolder bit is why

[SP]

I’m a hospitality season ticket holder. Why does the club not do what they do with us. If you can’t attend the game you transfer the ticket via email to someone else and they download and print the eticket.

Because it makes it easy to sell on the ticket. They want to cut down touting, not facilitate it.

[CraigDS]

It’s not 20%, it’s less than 17% and it will be even less in 12 months time.

And that’s without increases in other commercial income nor the Club ‘siloing’ revenue streams by saying that for instance £143m of player sales has to see all of it remain in that silo.

It's still a what, £80m+ (with the new Main Stand income) chunk of the pie. It's simply a ridiculous argument to make to a business that this is not relevant.

There are so many arguments you could make for lowering ticket prices, I simply think if you attempt to tell a business that a £80m+ part of their revenue source is not relevant that you'll not be taken seriously.

[Graham Smith]

It's still a what, £80m+ (with the new Main Stand income) chunk of the pie. It's simply a ridiculous argument to make to a business that this is not relevant.

There are so many arguments you could make for lowering ticket prices, I simply think if you attempt to tell a business that a £80m+ part of their revenue source is not relevant that you'll not be taken seriously.

It isn’t £80m, don’t know why you keep saying that figure. I’ve seen the Club’s data and figures.

The target area are season tickets and general admission. They represent less than half of your figure and no one is suggesting the whole sum is in play.

You’re probably talking about a debate over about less tha 2% of the Club’s income.

So no more nonsense please.

[CraigDS]

It isn’t £80m, don’t know why you keep saying that figure. I’ve seen the Club’s data and figures.

Then what is the figure?

Matchday without the new main was £62.4m in the last accounts, and the additional revenue was said to add around £20-25m, and we've since been told it has performed above the expected level.

The target area are season tickets and general admission. They represent less than half of your figure and no one is suggesting the whole sum is in play.

You’re probably talking about a debate over about less tha 2% of the Club’s income.

So no more nonsense please.

Provide the figures then seems you've got them...

[gazzam1963]

Match day revenue probably takes in more forms than just ticket prices , surely food , beverages , programmes is included in the match day revenue . And that will include corporate tickets and hospitaility possibly including boxes . So quick match day ticket for season ticket and general admission calculation is roughly what 45000 x 19 games x average ticket price say £50 comes to about 42 million , not insignificant but definitely becoming a lower percentage of turnover as time goes by .

[Lush is the best medicine...]

Match day revenue probably takes in more forms than just ticket prices , surely food , beverages , programmes is included in the match day revenue . And that will include corporate tickets and hospitaility possibly including boxes . So quick match day ticket for season ticket and general admission calculation is roughly what 45000 x 19 games x average ticket price say £50 comes to about 42 million , not insignificant but definitely becoming a lower percentage of turnover as time goes by .

at least 5 CL games, 4 at PL prices all sold out adds a pretty large amount, plus gate receipts last year were £62m I think so feasible it’s nearer £80m this year

[gazzam1963]

at least 5 CL games, 4 at PL prices all sold out adds a pretty large amount, plus gate receipts last year were £62m I think so feasible it’s nearer £80m this year

But I don't think the figure you quoted are just gate receipts ,quick look at basic accounts published in various outlets has match day revenue at 62 million and as Craig points out the new stand may increase that too £ 80 million . But just season tickets ( £900 tops) and general admission prices are not the only thing thats Inc In match day revenue , to me it looks like all corporate hospitality , beverages , food etc is Inc in them figures .

If there correct and just general admission prices generate say £40 million pound Inc season tkts then a 20 % cut of ticket prices would cost the club £8 million , a considerable sum but one that's being dwarfed every time there's a new tv or corporate sponsor announced .

You mentioned the champions league but aren't them match day revenue figures also for the year up to may 2016 When we would have had match day income from a Europa league run that had us play 7 home games possibly all full houses .

[Johnny Foreigner]

Because it makes it easy to sell on the ticket. They want to cut down touting, not facilitate it.

A considerable part of the previous customer base for the touts, have now purchased hospitality season tickets and is re-selling in line with the conditions set by the club

[Tommypig]

Because it makes it easy to sell on the ticket. They want to cut down touting, not facilitate it.

But why can't they have a system whereby instead of transferring as an eticket pdf you transfer it onto someone else's members card - it works now as when a season ticket holder doesn't go he resells it back to the club and a member buy's it on his member card - your just transferring to someone you know instead.

Only requirement is they must have a members card that anyone can have for a one off cost of £5

[SP]

But why can't they have a system whereby instead of transferring as an eticket pdf you transfer it onto someone else's members card - it works now as when a season ticket holder doesn't go he resells it back to the club and a member buy's it on his member card - your just transferring to someone you know instead.

Only requirement is they must have a members card that anyone can have for a one off cost of £5

That’s roughly what has been suggested earlier in the topic. My comment was in response to someone discussing the hospitality system.

[Johnny Foreigner]

That’s roughly what has been suggested earlier in the topic. My comment was in response to someone discussing the hospitality system.

The possibility to transfer the corporate tickets electronically was done after a sharp increase in prices and the sweet spot was met in terms of supply/demand. An easy way to transfer “normal” tickets would of course be customer friendly, but would also be very handy for touts and their customers and the margin would be left with the touts.

It would also hurt the match-by-match hospitality, so don’t see that happening very soon

[WisconsinRed]

I don't think £30 is realistic, I turn 29 next week and I can't remember prices ever being that low. They must have been around £35 when I first started paying for myself at around 13/14 years old. I agree with away seats being cheaper though, £20 is probably ok for them due to other costs in my eyes and I'd argue £40 for a home ticket is about as low as we could realistically expect although as previously stated I don't think the current prices are too bad.

The simplest way to avoid these arguments every year is to set a price one season and then state prices will rise by CPI every season. I think that would be an easy and justifiable increase as in real terms the ticket prices would stay the same.

Well you are wrong mate. 15 years ago we were paying less than £25 for a champions league match and there was a lot less tv money then too.

[Lush is the best medicine...]

Well you are wrong mate. 15 years ago we were paying less than £25 for a champions league match and there was a lot less tv money then too.

the club record transfer was 14% of what it is now

But I don't think the figure you quoted are just gate receipts ,quick look at basic accounts published in various outlets has match day revenue at 62 million and as Craig points out the new stand may increase that too £ 80 million . But just season tickets ( £900 tops) and general admission prices are not the only thing thats Inc In match day revenue , to me it looks like all corporate hospitality , beverages , food etc is Inc in them figures .

If there correct and just general admission prices generate say £40 million pound Inc season tkts then a 20 % cut of ticket prices would cost the club £8 million , a considerable sum but one that's being dwarfed every time there's a new tv or corporate sponsor announced .

You mentioned the champions league but aren't them match day revenue figures also for the year up to may 2016 When we would have had match day income from a Europa league run that had us play 7 home games possibly all full houses .

those Europa games were at quite a large discount, lower than cat c prior to the United game and around cat b from memory for the last three games so probably less than what they’d get for the CL up to Porto

[CraigDS]

the club record transfer was 14% of what it is now

Wages were less than 25% of what they were in the accounts to end May 2016 too.

[andy84]

I don't think you're right.  Some lucky people get into the Members' sales first, and the cheaper seats always go first.  Ok the 300s may go before the 200s but the price differential there is small, but I think the difference in price between Kop and Upper Main is a big driver of Kop demand.

So you agree with me then? The cheapness of the Kop means the majority of people are left with whatever's left in Anfield Road and Upper Main which costs £8-£12 more than the Kop. £50 is too much for a seat in those areas.

I wasn't referring to the difference between the 200s and 300s

[Tommypig]

I am Personally a fan of tiered pricing.

I would like Low ball pricing for Kop and Annie Road of between £10 and £30 max and an increasing price range depending on position of £30 - £100 for KD & Main Stand -

I know its controversial to have a high price band in the middle but the important thing is to have the majority of the stadium as cheap as possible that way the people that can afford to pay more for the expensive central seats help subsidise the cost for the majority.

In addition I would like to see the Annie Road expansion agreed as part of this so that the club can seewhat extra Match day ticketincome they will generate as part of this.

[the 92A]

I am Personally a fan of tiered pricing.

I would like Low ball pricing for Kop and Annie Road of between £10 and £30 max and an increasing price range depending on position of £30 - £100 for KD & Main Stand -

I know its controversial to have a high price band in the middle but the important thing is to have the majority of the stadium as cheap as possible that way the people that can afford to pay more for the expensive central seats help subsidise the cost for the majority.

In addition I would like to see the Annie Road expansion agreed as part of this so that the club can seewhat extra Match day ticketincome they will generate as part of this.

Nice one Tom just put my seat up to £100 a game.

[CraigDS]

Nice one Tom just put my seat up to £100 a game.

Same here 

Fuck that!

[SP]

Well you are wrong mate. 15 years ago we were paying less than £25 for a champions league match and there was a lot less tv money then too.

£25 15 years ago is £38 in today's money. The most expensive Champions League ticket in the Kop is £43 - £28 in 2003 money.

[Giovanni]

I am Personally a fan of tiered pricing.

I would like Low ball pricing for Kop and Annie Road of between £10 and £30 max and an increasing price range depending on position of £30 - £100 for KD & Main Stand -

I know its controversial to have a high price band in the middle but the important thing is to have the majority of the stadium as cheap as possible that way the people that can afford to pay more for the expensive central seats help subsidise the cost for the majority.

In addition I would like to see the Annie Road expansion agreed as part of this so that the club can seewhat extra Match day ticketincome they will generate as part of this.

This is exactly what the club want to do. They repeatedly went back to the term 'stretching prices - and refering to the 'secondary market' which they aren't seeing a penny from.

The problem with this, as argued by Harinder, is that our current capacity means that people end up not having a choice and it's £100 or nothing.

We are all pissing in the wind until we get a capacity befit of a club of our size.

[SP]

If you have the tiered pricing, the cheap season tickets will become gold dust. And the problem of old farts not retiring gracefully to the other stands when they stop singing becomes even worse. The problem of having a youthful kop and placating the older support that have given years of service to the club is a bit of a gordian knot. No pricing formula in isolation will tackle the wider issues of building a support for the present and the future.

[BaZ87]

Then what is the figure?

Matchday without the new main was £62.4m in the last accounts, and the additional revenue was said to add around £20-25m, and we've since been told it has performed above the expected level.



Provide the figures then seems you've got them...

Matchday revenue is a lot more than just season tickets and general admission - it includes all corporate hospitality & food and drink sales on a match day.

[Tommypig]

Nice one Tom just put my seat up to £100 a game.

And my own but the best should be more to allow more at affordable prices - if we can't afford it we get option to move

[the 92A]

And my own but the best should be more to allow more at affordable prices - if we can't afford it we get option to move

That's the problem,  move where?  most of us in the main stand had rubbish seats for years, I had a big post in front of the Anny goal, In the lower Kemlyn the leg rooms really limited hardly premium, most of the people in them stands are exactly the same social and economic background as the people in the Kop and as SP rightly points out the cheap seats become goldust and that exacerbates problems and makes it harder to get new people in because every cheap seat in the ground would be massively oversubscribed as the Main stand and Kemlyn would be fighting to leave £100 seats for cheaper seats.

When the walkout happened, I wasn't confident that most of the main stand moaners around us would leave. at half time a group of us met and we were all checking everyone was up for it because we thought we might be isolated. No worries though because when it came to it, the same arl moaners were right at the front with us, never seen them chanting so enthusiastically because with austerity biting, we'd be subject to them 10% prices and it was hurting us.

[Harinder]

Correct whoever said match day revenue isn't solely cost of tickets. This is precisely why increases don't really fuel being competitive or being meaningful to providing resources to Klopp etc.

There is a side to all this that is being missed. The club sees what the secondary market is charging. This in turn gives them a belief that because an inflated price can be paid that it WILL be paid should the club bring it in. The club just want the money because they can. I truly believe that.

Sticking a fiver on top of ticket prices won't buy you a superstar player. Taking a fiver off ticket prices will give you the goodwill that changes so much.

If the club shares fully the breakdown of match day revenue then you can really articulate what things sit where. They haven't. Will they? who knows really. My gut take on all things is simplistic in that 16/17 financials when released in first week of March will show revenue being up already from main stand. It will be interesting if they show they 17/18 monies already taken from hospitality season ticket holders too which they took last season.

[gazzam1963]

All good points harinder , can't really think of any business that would voluntarily drop prices when there is demand there it's just alien to business people and that may be the crux of it . As you say if they supplied you with actual ticket revenue per game I think a 20% reduction on all normal priced season tickets and general admission is not a huge amount as turnover increases . There must already be a good few thousand season ticket holders on a discount just for the fact there over 65 . Should they be factored into any discount ?

[BaZ87]

Correct whoever said match day revenue isn't solely cost of tickets. This is precisely why increases don't really fuel being competitive or being meaningful to providing resources to Klopp etc.

There is a side to all this that is being missed. The club sees what the secondary market is charging. This in turn gives them a belief that because an inflated price can be paid that it WILL be paid should the club bring it in. The club just want the money because they can. I truly believe that.

Sticking a fiver on top of ticket prices won't buy you a superstar player. Taking a fiver off ticket prices will give you the goodwill that changes so much.

If the club shares fully the breakdown of match day revenue then you can really articulate what things sit where. They haven't. Will they? who knows really. My gut take on all things is simplistic in that 16/17 financials when released in first week of March will show revenue being up already from main stand. It will be interesting if they show they 17/18 monies already taken from hospitality season ticket holders too which they took last season.

If pricing was based on what people would pay then we'd be charging a lot more than what we are. Yes the club want to maximise revenue but they're clearly conscious of the backlash that overcharging fans will bring. They're looking to find the balance between the maximum they can charge with the minimum fuss it will cause. Whether we like it or not, the club are probably doing that now - I'm sure every match going supporter would like £5 off their ticket but the vast majority are willing to suck it up and (unfortunately) for every match goer we've got 1000 non match goers that are far more concerned with the club not paying an extra £5m to sign Lemar than knocking £5 off ticket prices.

While discussion around ticket pricing is important, the priority should be how to handle the secondary market and imo we're currently in a chicken and egg situation. You can come up with all the measures in the world to stop touting but as long as the demand is there then touts will find a way and the lower prices become the greater the demand. We need the Anfield Road expansion (+ more in reality) but that's unlikely to happen without an increase in ticket prices. Until supply meets demand then supporters will be paying ott, whether that be directly to the club or to professional touts or fellow supporters fleecing each other.

[Hightown Phil]

I am Personally a fan of tiered pricing.

I would like Low ball pricing for Kop and Annie Road of between £10 and £30 max and an increasing price range depending on position of £30 - £100 for KD & Main Stand -

I know its controversial to have a high price band in the middle but the important thing is to have the majority of the stadium as cheap as possible that way the people that can afford to pay more for the expensive central seats help subsidise the cost for the majority.

In addition I would like to see the Annie Road expansion agreed as part of this so that the club can seewhat extra Match day ticketincome they will generate as part of this.

Make the Kop £150 a go, everywhere else £15 a ago.

Sounds good to me because I don't sit there.

You?

[Harinder]

If pricing was based on what people would pay then we'd be charging a lot more than what we are. Yes the club want to maximise revenue but they're clearly conscious of the backlash that overcharging fans will bring. They're looking to find the balance between the maximum they can charge with the minimum fuss it will cause. Whether we like it or not, the club are probably doing that now - I'm sure every match going supporter would like £5 off their ticket but the vast majority are willing to suck it up and (unfortunately) for every match goer we've got 1000 non match goers that are far more concerned with the club not paying an extra £5m to sign Lemar than knocking £5 off ticket prices.

While discussion around ticket pricing is important, the priority should be how to handle the secondary market and imo we're currently in a chicken and egg situation. You can come up with all the measures in the world to stop touting but as long as the demand is there then touts will find a way and the lower prices become the greater the demand. We need the Anfield Road expansion (+ more in reality) but that's unlikely to happen without an increase in ticket prices. Until supply meets demand then supporters will be paying ott, whether that be directly to the club or to professional touts or fellow supporters fleecing each other.

Supply will never match demand. We all know this. Creating a monopoly on the back off that does seem a little off then. I know you’re not stating that they are. They just seem to come across that way when attempting to rationalise increases

[thisyearisouryear]

Saw this on twitter. Are these the normal prices for cup matches?

[SP]

Saw this on twitter. Are these the normal prices for cup matches?

You could have just looked on the official site.

http://www.liverpoolfc.com/tickets/domestic-cup-match-prices

[thisyearisouryear]

You could have just looked on the official site.

http://www.liverpoolfc.com/tickets/domestic-cup-match-prices

I did go to the official site for a minute or so but couldn't manage to find the relevant section you have linked. Just thought RAWK would be faster.

Anyway, the updated prices link is here - http://www.liverpoolfc.com/tickets/domestic-cup-match-prices/cup-price-update
They seem to have reduced the prices for the West Brom game.

[sminp]

I did go to the official site for a minute or so but couldn't manage to find the relevant section you have linked. Just thought RAWK would be faster.

Anyway, the updated prices link is here - http://www.liverpoolfc.com/tickets/domestic-cup-match-prices/cup-price-update
They seem to have reduced the prices for the West Brom game.

That’s quite a big reduction, £15-£20 depending on where you’re sitting. Quite surprised at that as I think it would have sold out at full price.

[gazzalfc]

http://www.liverpoolfc.com/amp/news/announcements/290327-liverpool-fc-season-ticket-amnesty-proposal?__twitter_impression=true


Mmmmmm don't know how to take this

The possible ideas sound ok on paper. But all those ideas will end up with some fans losing out on future ST's

[Giovanni]

The possible ideas sound ok on paper. But all those ideas will end up with some fans losing out on future ST's

What do you mean?

[gazzalfc]

What do you mean?

The idea of ID cards and the possibility of getting chucked out by stewards.

The idea of those that on occasion pay for a ST that's not technically in their name losing out.

Those that may miss a game due to something beyond their control possibly being punished for leaving a seat empty.

[CraigDS]

The idea of those that on occasion pay for a ST that's not technically in their name losing out.

Those that may miss a game due to something beyond their control possibly being punished for leaving a seat empty.

I'm sure the first is dealt with via a 'friends and family' scheme as mentioned. Not sure on the latter but they can't punish anyone for not turning up, they'd be on extremely thin ice legally.

[TepidT2O]

The idea of ID cards and the possibility of getting chucked out by stewards.

The idea of those that on occasion pay for a ST that's not technically in their name losing out.

Those that may miss a game due to something beyond their control possibly being punished for leaving a seat empty.

I know the club wants to deal with this issue. It also wants to deal with touting.

Surely a way that season tickets that weren’t needed for a game could be ‘resold’ in some way to keep everyone happy.

Personally I’d have unused seats sold via a ticket office on match days ... that would prioritise local support, and you could even target them at the young.

Mind you there are no easy solutions to any of the problems..

[CraigDS]

Surely a way that season tickets that weren’t needed for a game could be ‘resold’ in some way to keep everyone happy.

Personally I’d have unused seats sold via a ticket office on match days ... that would prioritise local support, and you could even target them at the young.

Mind you there are no easy solutions to any of the problems..

Think they'd have more take up of a system that took less of a cut for the sale and gave the ST owner the money once the game has concluded rather than taken off next seasons ticket cost.