Topic: LFC Ticket Pricing Forum

[Doc Red]

Does anyone know how much revenue the club would lose if they were to cut ticket prices by 50%?
Actually, how much do they earn from the stadium, and what percentage of the club's total revenue comes from the stadium?

At the risk of sounding naive, considering the massive influx coming into the game from the latest TV deals, is there really a need to maximise full profits from the stadium?

[Graham Smith]

If 26000 tickets were cut from an average of £45 to £30 for 19 league games it would cost £7.41m per season.

Markovic.

[4pool]

Does anyone know how much revenue the club would lose if they were to cut ticket prices by 50%?
Actually, how much do they earn from the stadium, and what percentage of the club's total revenue comes from the stadium?

At the risk of sounding naive, considering the massive influx coming into the game from the latest TV deals, is there really a need to maximise full profits from the stadium?

The last official accounts posted at Companies House in 2017, were for the May 2015- May 2016 financial year.

Despite overall revenue increasing, the club reported a loss of £19.8m for the period, mainly as a result of further investment and turnover in the first-team squad. Twelve additions were made to the first team, including Roberto Firmino, James Milner, Marko Grujic, Danny Ings, Nathaniel Clyne and Joe Gomez. Young player development also continues to be an important part of the club’s football strategy, with 12 Academy players offered professional contracts.

Financial summary
• Revenue increased by £3.9m to £301.8m
• Media revenue increased by £1m to £123.6m
• Match day revenue increased by £3.4m to £62.4m
• Commercial revenue decreased by £0.7m to £115.7m
• The loss before tax was £19.8 million
• LFC maintain ninth position in Deloitte Football Money League

[4pool]

Btw..we have 38 players listed as First team and those on loan:
http://www.liverpoolfc.com/team/first-team

We have 48 players, including those out on loan, from the U23's and U18's
http://www.liverpoolfc.com/team/academy

Didn't count the staff, and then all the support staff, at Melwood and the Academy. Don't we have teams down to U8's? Then there's the coaches for all those sides below U18's.

[Hij]

Rebuild the Anny Road. 6,000 extra tickets. Profitable eventually even if not as quick as they would like. Is it even against FFP? Send us a loan that rebuilds the stand at a compeitive rate. I know that's over simplifying it, but that's 10.9% more tickets. The current model is preferable to Hicks and Gillett but how much do you actually want to win?

[AaronSingh25]

Why don't some long standing season ticket holders give up their seats for these local young lads they champion?

Too many old farts in the ground, who have been there far too long, grown weary, who sit down and just moan and whinge without contributing anything to the atmosphere or support of the players on the pitch(if anything detrimental).

I believe this is something Hogan mentioned.

I am no fan of FSG (due partly to them not investing in the first team, selling our best players, no drive to make us winners), but they have a rite to make some changes with the commercial side. Seems like some fans want their cake and to eat it.

[RogerTheRed]

RTR,

One of the built in faults of this new system is that there are five forums and no consistency of membership - it smacks of divide and conquer. (Tony Barratt had nothing to do with the setting out of these forums).

As a result your issue falls to Ticket Accessibilty/Availability of which I am not a member and I have no access to those discussions now.

Email me at secretary@spiritofshankly.com and I’ll pass it on to the SOS rep who sits on that forum.

Thanks for this Graham - will do

[MKB]

The key to unlocking extra seats from the existing capacity is to prise back season tickets from those not using them personally.  The Club has been toying with a season ticket amnesty for years, but hasn't yet had the balls to see it through, judging -- correctly I think -- that it would upset a lot of people.

Rather than continue with the current season ticket product, which is essentially a right to one seat that people are free to pass on as they please, let's abolish that completely.

Instead, I'd propose three brand new products, making clear that they are all for personal use only:

  Season Ticket Gold - Package of all 19 games
  Season Ticket Silver - Package of 13 games
  Season Ticket Bronze - Package of 6 games

In general, the holder gets to pick which games they want at the start of the season, but with provision to do swaps later where there's availability.

Existing season tickets holders would get first dibs on converting their existing seat, followed by those on the waiting list.

The options available for the specific seat would be:

  Convert to a Gold in the same name
  Convert to a Silver in the same name
  Convert to a Bronze in the same name
  Convert to a Silver + Bronze, with one in the same name and the other in a new name
  Convert to two Bronze packages, with one in the same name and the other in a new name
  Convert to three Bronze packages, with one in the same name and the other two in new names

There would still be the option to return any given match ticket through the official exchange.  You could also allow transfers from one member of the season ticket group to another.

If the clear understanding were that anyone caught passing on their new season ticket to someone else to use would lose it, then I think a lot of existing holders would opt for a combination of packages that amounted to less than the full 19 games.  I think some people might quite like being able to pick just 13 or 6 games to see and not have to commit to them all.  This could free up a lot of seats for members' sales, youth sales, etc.

Obviously, the details above are flexible.  There's no reason why you can't have different numbers of games in a package, or splits between more people.  There's also an argument to limit the number of the old Cat A games that can be in a single Silver or Bronze package so that people can't just cherry pick the best 6 games.

[SP]

If they want to tackle the discrepancy between the people whose name the ticket is in, and the person actually on the seat, it needs a long term plan. Starting from the proviso that everyone in a home seat needs to be registered with the club (which may need a revival of the fancard - or some other mechanism without an annual fee). There should then be a simple and free mechanism to transfer the right to seat in a seat in a game to another fan. If there is a no cost way of "registering" the ticket with the person actually using it, the club can then start enforcing that.

Once they have made that step, they can identify people not using their season ticket. It also has the added bonus of officially logging the attendance of people that actually go. Thus the people who actually go could be allocated credit. Where 2 or 3 people clearly share a season ticket, that should be formalised - potentially allowing those people to continue to pool credit. Where a different person sits in a seat every week, they could lose their right to a season ticket renewal. Ultimately the transition could be made to credit being for bums on seats, not abusing your Mastercard.

Whilst the above would be fairer, there would be howls of protest - actions to hinder touts will also impact the hardcore support who sort each other out. There is no pain-free way to rip out the current edifice.

[Johnny Foreigner]

The above is a side-track. Super Billy has made it clear that increasing revenue is Priority 1,2 and 3. Why should they spend money and effort on "fairer" distribution. Would be like Apple allowing only 2 iPhones per household. Sell like hell is the mantra but invite some pensioneers to lunch to show we care

[gazzam1963]

The key to unlocking extra seats from the existing capacity is to prise back season tickets from those not using them personally.  The Club has been toying with a season ticket amnesty for years, but hasn't yet had the balls to see it through, judging -- correctly I think -- that it would upset a lot of people.

Rather than continue with the current season ticket product, which is essentially a right to one seat that people are free to pass on as they please, let's abolish that completely.

Instead, I'd propose three brand new products, making clear that they are all for personal use only:

  Season Ticket Gold - Package of all 19 games
  Season Ticket Silver - Package of 13 games
  Season Ticket Bronze - Package of 6 games

In general, the holder gets to pick which games they want at the start of the season, but with provision to do swaps later where there's availability.

Existing season tickets holders would get first dibs on converting their existing seat, followed by those on the waiting list.

The options available for the specific seat would be:

  Convert to a Gold in the same name
  Convert to a Silver in the same name
  Convert to a Bronze in the same name
  Convert to a Silver + Bronze, with one in the same name and the other in a new name
  Convert to two Bronze packages, with one in the same name and the other in a new name
  Convert to three Bronze packages, with one in the same name and the other two in new names

There would still be the option to return any given match ticket through the official exchange.  You could also allow transfers from one member of the season ticket group to another.

If the clear understanding were that anyone caught passing on their new season ticket to someone else to use would lose it, then I think a lot of existing holders would opt for a combination of packages that amounted to less than the full 19 games.  I think some people might quite like being able to pick just 13 or 6 games to see and not have to commit to them all.  This could free up a lot of seats for members' sales, youth sales, etc.

Obviously, the details above are flexible.  There's no reason why you can't have different numbers of games in a package, or splits between more people.  There's also an argument to limit the number of the old Cat A games that can be in a single Silver or Bronze package so that people can't just cherry pick the best 6 games.

Sounds a bit of an administrative nightmare especially for our ticket office , don't forget LFC get 26000 people all paying upfront 2 months before the season starts for the ticket irrespective of performance dates times etc of games . An amnesty  was supposedly coming at the end of this season if I recall correctly . What an amnesty will do is get people who are on the season ticket list off it as they admit to already having a ticket .
I have 2 tickets in someone elses name and have done for 21 years now and the club have admitted responsibility for this issue due to being cash strapped late 80 s / early 90s and allowing multiple purchases .

Does appear if match day revenues are the ones they want to grow and there are number of ways of doing and most have been set out here In the thread . There are ways and means of gettng ticket prices down and that can be done at a league level with all  premier league clubs agreeing on a common ticket price across the board or a percentage of attendance reduced , so no one is at a disadvantage . Its been shown how ticket revenue is getting less and less of turnover .

Bigger future  tv deals also negates any past expenditure on capital projects like the main stand but could constrain future development .

[number 168]

Why don't some long standing season ticket holders give up their seats for these local young lads they champion?

Too many old farts in the ground, who have been there far too long, grown weary, who sit down and just moan and whinge without contributing anything to the atmosphere or support of the players on the pitch(if anything detrimental).

I believe this is something Hogan mentioned.

I am no fan of FSG (due partly to them not investing in the first team, selling our best players, no drive to make us winners), but they have a rite to make some changes with the commercial side. Seems like some fans want their cake and to eat it.

I happen to be 'an old fart' as you put it who has a season ticket. I got my first one in 1967 as a present from my dad. It was for the Anfield Road and cost exactly the same as a pint now costs in the Main Stand - £4.20, 21 games too!

Going to the match means as much to me now as it did when I was a school boy, and I am only going to stop going when it's physically impossible to drag myself to the ground.  It's not age that determines who moans at games, there are number of young divs near me who call certain players all sorts and complain throughout if we aren't winning or playing like Kenny's 1987 heroes.
The Club needs to expand the ground and adopt policies that will enable more youngsters to attend, particularly Scousers, and not focus on selling the 'Anfield Experience' to any Tom, Dick or Harry who fancies a nice day out. I am a Scouser who goes to every home game and a few aways so I don't see why I should pack it in because the management can't sort out ticketing.
why I should pack it all in as I'm north of 60 now.

[24/7]

I happen to be 'an old fart' as you put it who has a season ticket. I got my first one in 1967 as a present from my dad. It was for the Anfield Road and cost exactly the same as a pint now costs in the Main Stand - £4.20, 21 games too!

Going to the match means as much to me now as it did when I was a school boy, and I am only going to stop going when it's physically impossible to drag myself to the ground.  It's not age that determines who moans at games, there are number of young divs near me who call certain players all sorts and complain throughout if we aren't winning or playing like Kenny's 1987 heroes.
The Club needs to expand the ground and adopt policies that will enable more youngsters to attend, particularly Scousers, and not focus on selling the 'Anfield Experience' to any Tom, Dick or Harry who fancies a nice day out. I am a Scouser who goes to every home game and a few aways so I don't see why I should pack it in because the management can't sort out ticketing.
why I should pack it all in as I'm north of 60 now.

that needed saying.

[mainone]

Why don't some long standing season ticket holders give up their seats for these local young lads they champion?

Too many old farts in the ground, who have been there far too long, grown weary, who sit down and just moan and whinge without contributing anything to the atmosphere or support of the players on the pitch(if anything detrimental).

I believe this is something Hogan mentioned.                   

I am no fan of FSG (due partly to them not investing in the first team, selling our best players, no drive to make us winners), but they have a rite to make some changes with the commercial side. Seems like some fans want their cake and to eat it.    fuck off rite???

[sonofkenny]

The key to unlocking extra seats from the existing capacity is to prise back season tickets from those not using them personally.  The Club has been toying with a season ticket amnesty for years, but hasn't yet had the balls to see it through, judging -- correctly I think -- that it would upset a lot of people.

Rather than continue with the current season ticket product, which is essentially a right to one seat that people are free to pass on as they please, let's abolish that completely.

Instead, I'd propose three brand new products, making clear that they are all for personal use only:

  Season Ticket Gold - Package of all 19 games
  Season Ticket Silver - Package of 13 games
  Season Ticket Bronze - Package of 6 games

In general, the holder gets to pick which games they want at the start of the season, but with provision to do swaps later where there's availability.

Existing season tickets holders would get first dibs on converting their existing seat, followed by those on the waiting list.

The options available for the specific seat would be:

  Convert to a Gold in the same name
  Convert to a Silver in the same name
  Convert to a Bronze in the same name
  Convert to a Silver + Bronze, with one in the same name and the other in a new name
  Convert to two Bronze packages, with one in the same name and the other in a new name
  Convert to three Bronze packages, with one in the same name and the other two in new names

There would still be the option to return any given match ticket through the official exchange.  You could also allow transfers from one member of the season ticket group to another.

If the clear understanding were that anyone caught passing on their new season ticket to someone else to use would lose it, then I think a lot of existing holders would opt for a combination of packages that amounted to less than the full 19 games.  I think some people might quite like being able to pick just 13 or 6 games to see and not have to commit to them all.  This could free up a lot of seats for members' sales, youth sales, etc.

Obviously, the details above are flexible.  There's no reason why you can't have different numbers of games in a package, or splits between more people.  There's also an argument to limit the number of the old Cat A games that can be in a single Silver or Bronze package so that people can't just cherry pick the best 6 games.

The amnesty is coming and sooner than people think.  This seems overly complicated, just make the buyback scheme easier to use and more readily available with some new rules in place to ensure seats are actually used.  You shouldn’t need a degree to decide how to watch Liverpool play! Keep it simple

[TepidT2O]

I’ve never understood why getting a season tickets means you get the ticket for ever...

It means that the crowd gets older and there are fewer cha cues for young fans to get them..

[S.Red please]

It's painful trying to get to the solution of this because they'll never accept one that will give the fans the right outcome. Truth of the matter is, they don't want to decrease ticket prices, in fact they want to increase them. I think its painfully obvious and this fans forum is a way to sugar coat it by saying 'we listened to your opinion, we've done X but unfortunately we can't do Y and Z' etc.

Don't get me wrong a fans forum like this is a brilliant idea when the people behind it are wiling to really take into consideration what the fans say. I just can't see it happening from the transcript of that meeting.

Lowering the normal ticket prices by 50% whilst upping the corporate boxes would be a mere drop in the ocean. It would be such a small dip in the clubs revenue streams they would barely even notice it. 50% being a high figure, they could lower it by less % with fans still seeing it as a massive improvement. It would put Liverpool in an amazing light with football fans, finally a club who has put their fans first and recognised that without the fans the club is nothing. Instead we will continue to be priced out of matches and they will carry on trying their luck until another protest/walk out, followed by a small decrease of freeze on prices. Give it a year or two, the same scenario. Rinse and repeat, modern football!

[4pool]

I’ve never understood why getting a season tickets means you get the ticket for ever...

It means that the crowd gets older and there are fewer cha cues for young fans to get them..

Soylent Green.

Once you reach a certain age, we grind you up and eat you for fun...

[rob1966]

I’ve never understood why getting a season tickets means you get the ticket for ever...

It means that the crowd gets older and there are fewer cha cues for young fans to get them..

Probably because when they were introduced, the take up wasn't that big. As you will know, it was turn up and pay on the gate for most games and you got a voucher to buy a ticket for the big games.

Its a nightmare scenario now - Ideally it would be that everyone had the chance to apply for one at the start of the season, but the ticket had your picture on and unless you sold a game back to the club it couldn't be used by anyone else. However, you can't just tell someone who has been paying large amounts of money every year into the club that they can no longer have a season ticket, sure fire way to piss off a lot of supporters.

[24/7]

Soylent Green.

Once you reach a certain age, we grind you up and eat you for fun...

Was thinking more like Logan's Run.....

via Imgflip Meme Generator

[redbyrdz]

the issue of the Kop being the cheapest is traditional and historical in the club but I agree with you - that time has gone. You want to remove everyone from the Kop who has bought their ONLY for economical reasons. Enough day trippers see the kop as an experience so if we cant solve that overnight they should at least pay what everyone else does in my opinion. Within the Kop there should be a decent section where its 18-25 year olds only who make a racket and get everyone going and they should be on a reduced ticket price, especially if local

The easiest and cost-free way of doing this is to introduce loyalty for Kop tickets - you can only buy in the Kop if you're been to a total of, say, 4 games over the current and the last season (anywhere in the ground). It obviously won't stop daytrippers on touted tickets, but it adds a little hurdle for those just after a ticket and it's easy enough to do.

[Harinder]

Why don't some long standing season ticket holders give up their seats for these local young lads they champion?

Too many old farts in the ground, who have been there far too long, grown weary, who sit down and just moan and whinge without contributing anything to the atmosphere or support of the players on the pitch(if anything detrimental).

I believe this is something Hogan mentioned.

I am no fan of FSG (due partly to them not investing in the first team, selling our best players, no drive to make us winners), but they have a rite to make some changes with the commercial side. Seems like some fans want their cake and to eat it.

Hogan said many things, I can't recall him saying "old farts" whinge and moan and don't contribute anything. Having just returned from Arsenal away, you can get that from 20 year olds

Now, some fans don't want their cake and to eat it. If they did, they wouldn't give a shit about anything and try and would never try to think outside of the bubble that goes "screw you Jack, I'm alright".

These aren't options. Rights minus obligations and all that jazz. If you truly deep down believe that we're just customers and the so called product managers should be able to freely define a monopoly then it could be very possible you've really missed a lot of what much of this is about.

Then again, you could just be being prickly for prickly's sake. If that's the case, this really isn't the place for it for you.

At a time of peace and goodwill to all, take this time to consider the above and we'll see how you feel in the new year. Much love and merry Christmas

[wewonit5timesinistanbul]

the also need to make it easier for season ticket holders to have an option to buy a kids ticket for some games as theres no way a season ticket holder can take a kid with them to a match unless they know somebody with 2 fancards and do a swap which is against LFC police.

ive asked LFC many times and get different answers. one option was to sell season ticket back to club (get below face value from lfc) then buy a adult/child in the general sale. another was theres no way of doing it.

LFC are going to loose a generation of kids who cant go the match because there parents are season ticket holders
 

[andy84]

As for ticket prices, let them charge whatever they want for the centre blocks of Lower Main and Lower Kenny in return for a flat £45 for every other seat.  That would at least stop people buying in the Kop just for economic reasons.  Plenty of fans who want to contribute to the atmosphere can no longer get a seat there.

This for me personally is the most important point. I used to be able to get Kop tickets in the members sale but now it's always upper main or Annie road where there is no atmosphere and the tickets cost £10 more. I can't understand for the life of me why an Anfield Road ticket costs around 20% more than a Kop ticket. It just means people going in the the Kop to save money rather than to get involved in the atmosphere.

I agree with charge whatever for the very best seats and then £45 all round in the rest of the ground.

If paying over £50 becomes the norm, I won't be attending any more and I'm sure that will be the trigger for others who go regularly or semi-regularly.

Thanks for all your hard work with this, Graham

[Graham Smith]

Club strategy now out in the open is that they want to get the touted GA and season tickets back in house and to flog them to the fam for £200 a pop.

They say that will increase ticket revenues overall and allow them to look at ticket prices in a more positive way.

Problem is that means the number of ST and GA (to be fair maybe they will only target GA recaptured tickets and use reclaimed ST to reduce the ST waiting list) recaptured are going to be out of the reach of normal, local supporters.

So maybe some very, very rough and rushed economics (Harinder does this much better):

Say 3000 touted tickets per game (estimate but you can see the principle) - say 1000 ST and 2000 GA.

So firstly the ST list gets a 1000 bump over a season as they recapture these tickets - no change in revenue as these are just being recycled from the touts.

So 2000 GA tickets sold to the Fam at £150 a pop = £300,000 per game.

So let’s say 50/50 split - FSG get half and there is £150k a game to start a journey to lower prices.

If it comes off 26,000 STs then it would mean a reduction of £11.50 a ticket, so say down to around £34 a game.

If it comes off 20,000 (?) GA tickets then they go from £59 to £44.

You can see the principle - gets better for us on a 75/25 split.

Not saying the numbers are right but it seems to be the way they want to see revenue increase and give them some way of spiking the ticket price war that is currently on armistice.

It does mean that without ground expansion ‘normal’ touted tickets don’t come back into the ‘normal’ pool of availability but I suppose there’s an argument that due to touting they never do anyway to any great degree.

[the 92A]

Club strategy now out in the open is that they want to get the touted GA and season tickets back in house and to flog them to the fam for £200 a pop.

They say that will increase ticket revenues overall and allow them to look at ticket prices in a more positive way.

Problem is that means the number of ST and GA (to be fair maybe they will only target GA recaptured tickets and use reclaimed ST to reduce the ST waiting list) recaptured are going to be out of the reach of normal, local supporters.

So maybe some very, very rough and rushed economics (Harinder does this much better):

Say 3000 touted tickets per game (estimate but you can see the principle) - say 1000 ST and 2000 GA.

So firstly the ST list gets a 1000 bump over a season as they recapture these tickets - no change in revenue as these are just being recycled from the touts.

So 2000 GA tickets sold to the Fam at £150 a pop = £300,000 per game.

So let’s say 50/50 split - FSG get half and there is £150k a game to start a journey to lower prices.

If it comes off 26,000 STs then it would mean a reduction of £11.50 a ticket, so say down to around £34 a game.

If it comes off 20,000 (?) GA tickets then they go from £59 to £44.

You can see the principle - gets better for us on a 75/25 split.

Not saying the numbers are right but it seems to be the way they want to see revenue increase and give them some way of spiking the ticket price war that is currently on armistice.

It does mean that without ground expansion ‘normal’ touted tickets don’t come back into the ‘normal’ pool of availability but I suppose there’s an argument that due to touting they never do anyway to any great degree.

  So we know where they are going with this they want the touts premium. It's not touting they dislike per se but the fact they aren't getting the extra the touts are. Number of questions raised,  Against touting yes, but can we get as many of those tickets back to GA or get a better % of the cut for lowering prices. Before any clampdown, whole issue of season tickets needs sorting, many are shared as prices have risen, many season ticket owners work shift work and with all the TV changes struggle to get to a few games so pass them on, face value to mates or free to family members,  the only way my kids  and my mates kids get to go the match. Now the only way of sorting those games is to contact the club, wait 15 years on the phone then sell your ticket back to the club at a loss, no way are you going to do that. If you going to sort out touting, you need to sort out the tickets understand the culture of passing them on in the family or sharing with you mates who created the culture they're selling. Ours are totally legitimately in one fellas name because the club used to sell them like that, one of us got the ticket taken off us for touting, until we met with the club and convinced them they'd been taking money off one name for five season tickets, for 30 years and there was no touting here. Part of the problem is also the club like the idea of demand being a little above supply, keeps us on our toes,  but thats the reason so many keep their season tickets, if there was a genuine system  to mimic pay on the gate, and you thought you could get the match occassionally people might let go of their season tickets but all the members stuff and jumping through hoops doesn't encourage people to give up season tickets because they know if they do that they'll never see another game apart from the alehouse, sort of catch 22. Season tickets are like goldust because of the difficulty to get in but having a high % of season tickets prevents room for manouvre

[Graham Smith]

My views on ^^^^^:

Shared STs should be allowed as the costs is so high.

Friends and Family scheme to allow some reallocation to a limited number of identified people a limited number of times in the season where you can't go.

Lose the loss for passing back to the Club - and get the credit there and then, not the following season.

[Barrowred]

Are the tickets that are passed on to mates and family at face value going to be classed as touted the same as the ones on Facebook, Twitter and all the pubs around the ground?

I know the name on the card should be the person who is actually sat in the seat but the two scenarios are miles apart. We hear stories of a few random checks every game and it seems to be someone who has sorted someone with a ticket for a game with genuine intentions of just helping someone out whose card ends up getting confiscated yet you see people asking stewards where a season ticket seat is.

It must be so simple to identify a vast majority of the touted cards just by the names and addresses they are linked to.

[Graham Smith]

Are the tickets that are passed on to mates and family at face value going to be classed as touted the same as the ones on Facebook, Twitter and all the pubs around the ground?

I know the name on the card should be the person who is actually sat in the seat but the two scenarios are miles apart. We hear stories of a few random checks every game and it seems to be someone who has sorted someone with a ticket for a game with genuine intentions of just helping someone out whose card ends up getting confiscated yet you see people asking stewards where a season ticket seat is.

It must be so simple to identify a vast majority of the touted cards just by the names and addresses they are linked to.

See above - Friends and Family scheme will legitimise passing on in a limited way between mates and better entry systems and monitoring will see efforts to beat the system harder than now.

And 'gentle' touting (in the sense you sell on at face value to a mate or randomer) will also be discouraged if you can sell back at short notice to the Club.

[the 92A]

Combination of friends and family scheme and being able to sell back the club easily, at no loss. Would allow them to tighten up and be harder on touting and free up some tickets, also need amnesty on names on tickets would be needed as a lot of tickets are in different peoples names. Raises question as what to do with any tickets freed up, is better more tickets in GA or better to sell at silly prices and use money to subsidise tickets, all feels like rearranging chairs.  Real solutions in longterm for young kids need more capacity and safe standing but that's another debate

[Graham Smith]

Combination of friends and family scheme and being able to sell back the club easily, at no loss. Would allow them to tighten up and be harder on touting and free up some tickets, also need amnesty on names on tickets would be needed as a lot of tickets are in different peoples names. Raises question as what to do with any tickets freed up, is better more tickets in GA or better to sell at silly prices and use money to subsidise tickets, all feels like rearranging chairs.  Real solutions in longterm for young kids need more capacity and safe standing but that's another debate

Big issue is transparency on any amnesty and that here isn’t an erosion of available tickets if they are repatriated but used for the £150 #FamTax tickets.

[gazzam1963]

Graham , didn't  the club tell you they are aware of there responsibility of multiple season tickets being in one named persons hands . Is it still a plan to have an amnesty at the end of this season ?

[Graham Smith]

Graham , didn't  the club tell you they are aware of there responsibility of multiple season tickets being in one named persons hands . Is it still a plan to have an amnesty at the end of this season ?

They’ve talked about it for at least two years.

There are many legitimate multiple season tickets in the name of one person as in the 1980s and 1990s the Club allowed them to be sold in this way.

An amnesty and tidy up is long overdue.

[lfc79]

The problem is the club want to raise revenue and are reluctant to expand the grounds capacity in case the impacts on this, greater availability of standards tickets would reduce the competition in the members bulk sales and reduce the take up of the lowest hospitality levels.
Without more seats it is impossible to increase the tickets available for getting more kids in to the ground without taking them form other people. People say they would be happy to give up  tickets to ring fence some for kids but if that meant as a member you went from 16 to say 12 and ended up in the free for all sale and got 2-3 the next year?

[wewonit5timesinistanbul]

Club strategy now out in the open is that they want to get the touted GA and season tickets back in house and to flog them to the fam for £200 a pop.

They say that will increase ticket revenues overall and allow them to look at ticket prices in a more positive way.

Problem is that means the number of ST and GA (to be fair maybe they will only target GA recaptured tickets and use reclaimed ST to reduce the ST waiting list) recaptured are going to be out of the reach of normal, local supporters.

So maybe some very, very rough and rushed economics (Harinder does this much better):

Say 3000 touted tickets per game (estimate but you can see the principle) - say 1000 ST and 2000 GA.

So firstly the ST list gets a 1000 bump over a season as they recapture these tickets - no change in revenue as these are just being recycled from the touts.

So 2000 GA tickets sold to the Fam at £150 a pop = £300,000 per game.

So let’s say 50/50 split - FSG get half and there is £150k a game to start a journey to lower prices.

If it comes off 26,000 STs then it would mean a reduction of £11.50 a ticket, so say down to around £34 a game.

If it comes off 20,000 (?) GA tickets then they go from £59 to £44.

You can see the principle - gets better for us on a 75/25 split.

Not saying the numbers are right but it seems to be the way they want to see revenue increase and give them some way of spiking the ticket price war that is currently on armistice.

It does mean that without ground expansion ‘normal’ touted tickets don’t come back into the ‘normal’ pool of availability but I suppose there’s an argument that due to touting they never do anyway to any great degree.

What does "sell them to the fam" mean?

[John C]

They’ve talked about it for at least two years.

There are many legitimate multiple season tickets in the name of one person as in the 1980s and 1990s the Club allowed them to be sold in this way.

An amnesty and tidy up is long overdue.

Definitely, but a strategy to snatch the tickets off the touts needs to be implemented first otherwise their 50 or so tickets will recirculate among their own mates in the amnesty.

They'll need to confiscate a lot of membership cards also.

[TheShanklyGates]

What does "sell them to the fam" mean?

That's the Arsenal Fan TV allocation.

[Narwin Dunez]

What does "sell them to the fam" mean?

It means Graham is having another pop at FSG despite them asking for his opinion and help. In the same post he also said that only locals are normal supporters, and then used a sarcastic hashtag to have a pop in another post. Its why nothing will get done in the end, because it's a "us vs them" mentality.


Also, why don't they just hand out fancards for free, and if you want to sell to your mate, you ring them and say "hello I'm jake member 01283 I'm selling my ticket to steve number 29437 so he'll be in my seat" - jobs a fucking good one.

[Billy Elliot]

Reading this just makes me even more relieved that I've packed it in and no longer give a shit.

Fuck it, let the Fam have the Club.

[Graham Smith]

‘Fam’ is a shorthand for the risible LFC Family branding the Club use.

There is a huge market for the tourists that this branding represents and who the Club will target these tickets at if they can get them back from the touts.