Author Topic: The Athletic  (Read 26671 times)

Offline classycarra

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Re: The Athletic
« Reply #120 on: July 19, 2021, 10:22:26 am »
Went to cancel my monthly subscription after paying full price for four or five months (initial getting first six months for 1 quid a month).

when i click the cancel subscription button, they offered an annual subscription  for 17.99 all in. Decided to do that.

Offline .adam

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Re: The Athletic
« Reply #121 on: July 19, 2021, 03:26:41 pm »
Went to cancel my monthly subscription after paying full price for four or five months (initial getting first six months for 1 quid a month).

when i click the cancel subscription button, they offered an annual subscription  for 17.99 all in. Decided to do that.

After reading this, I decided to check my account to see when my sub was up. It's expiring in late August and was set to auto-renew at £59.99 a year. I clicked 'Cancel' and pop-up came along offering to subscribe at £17.99. I accepted it and now my sub will renew in August at that reduced price.

Thanks!

Offline royhendo

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Re: The Athletic
« Reply #122 on: July 19, 2021, 03:33:11 pm »
I did that, but just cancelled. I felt better about that having read the James Pearce article today, I have to say.
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Offline No666

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Re: The Athletic
« Reply #123 on: July 19, 2021, 03:44:43 pm »
To be honest, I do kind of think journalism as we know it is fucked. I say that as someone who works as a (local) journalist. For all the talk about "being prepared to pay for good journalism" I just don't see it happening. I just don't believe people will be paying a significant amount of money for something they can get elsewhere for free or they don't really care that much about.
You're right. I saw the change, from the days on weekend supplements when good writing was a holy grail, to recent years when they just wanted you to churn out crap with a pre-agreed angle to which a catchy headline could be attached. Had a great time, met interesting people, travelled all over but wouldn't go near the profession now.

Offline Dave McCoy

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Re: The Athletic
« Reply #124 on: July 19, 2021, 05:35:18 pm »
You're right. I saw the change, from the days on weekend supplements when good writing was a holy grail, to recent years when they just wanted you to churn out crap with a pre-agreed angle to which a catchy headline could be attached. Had a great time, met interesting people, travelled all over but wouldn't go near the profession now.

I can't speak to journalism in the UK but here in the states most of the local newsrooms were gutted due their owners not realizing that Google, Facebook and Craigslist would destroy their ad revenue.  They then sold the papers to new owners (investors) who strip mined them for money.  I believe NYT and WaPo have record high subscription numbers and are doing really well.  You also have the burgeoning Substack crowd.  So I think people do value and will pay for good reporting.  The biggest issue is the owners of the papers not caring about that, cutting costs and just running it into the ground as they load it with debt and pay themselves mega bucks.  Chicago, Denver, Detroit, Baltimore, Philly, etc etc.  All places that used to have great papers but now are just trash due to private equity scum like Alden Capital.

If Mackenzie Scott (Bezos) really wants to make a difference with all her billions that she wants to give away the biggest thing she could do is fund these papers again as most of these communities have a real lack of local reporting now.  My hometown used to have a twice weekly paper just for local county issues which you would never see in a big national paper but were important to the locals.  All that is gone.

As far as the Athletic, again I can't compare it to UK papers, but here in the US it's probably got the best set of sports writers around. 

Offline No666

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Re: The Athletic
« Reply #125 on: July 19, 2021, 05:47:35 pm »
I'm not sure if The Athletic's coverage here is that much better in quality than the better broadsheets, but I like the fact there are a few articles on Liverpool each week, some of which (not all) are insightful. However, I'd rather read Pep Lijnder's diary from LFC than today's piece on Henderson's contract. & good self-generated content sounds the death-knell for their business model.

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Re: The Athletic
« Reply #126 on: July 19, 2021, 06:07:48 pm »
The thing I want most right now when it comes to football is quality analysis of how teams play, what certain players offer, how players are scouted in modern football, etc. Tifo offers a little of this but seems to be covering a much broader range of topics now and seem to have shifted their focus to transfers as that's where the clicks/views are, though maybe that'll change once the season starts.

Quality tactical analysis laid out in an easy to follow way is something I would pay for, not fluff pieces that hint at transfers but ultimately say nothing of substance.

Offline Dave McCoy

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Re: The Athletic
« Reply #127 on: July 19, 2021, 06:26:48 pm »
The thing I want most right now when it comes to football is quality analysis of how teams play, what certain players offer, how players are scouted in modern football, etc. Tifo offers a little of this but seems to be covering a much broader range of topics now and seem to have shifted their focus to transfers as that's where the clicks/views are, though maybe that'll change once the season starts.

Quality tactical analysis laid out in an easy to follow way is something I would pay for, not fluff pieces that hint at transfers but ultimately say nothing of substance.

This is available if you know where to look for it.  It just may not be focused on LFC. 

I also think the UK press is conditioned not to ask these things as I can't recall a press conference where any of this is discussed in any detail.  It's always just about character and referee incidents.  Any actual probing questions seem to be actually dissuaded.

Offline classycarra

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Re: The Athletic
« Reply #128 on: July 19, 2021, 07:42:09 pm »
After reading this, I decided to check my account to see when my sub was up. It's expiring in late August and was set to auto-renew at £59.99 a year. I clicked 'Cancel' and pop-up came along offering to subscribe at £17.99. I accepted it and now my sub will renew in August at that reduced price.

Thanks!

No worries mate!

Offline rossipersempre

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Re: The Athletic
« Reply #129 on: July 19, 2021, 08:59:55 pm »
I did that, but just cancelled. I felt better about that having read the James Pearce article today, I have to say.
Was that the one about Henderson and LFC contracts in general? Haven’t read it in full yet but overall found the sub to be good value especially in light of No.19 last year, some fantastic articles on us, Mo and Sadio’s rise from humble origins etc.

Mine renews on 30th July but I cancelled the auto-renewal through Apple almost immediately last year. So no option to pop-up sadly.
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Offline OOS

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Re: The Athletic
« Reply #130 on: July 19, 2021, 09:22:19 pm »
Did the pay a pound a month thing and jibbed it off once that expired. Not a fan of how journalists are on twitter, coming across as 'rockstars' to footballing twitter masses. Got the vibe that journalist are bigger than the stories sometimes. I couldn't care less about the journalists opinion, and some stuff could have come straight from clubs PR department, fluff pieces. Not interested in that, but I could see why someone would be.

Can't stand footballing twitter these days, deleted my account a few years back and I haven't missed it. I get my footballing fix on here, the odd footballing podcast, or I'll just chat shite to the lads in work/ out when watching the game.

Plus i'm paying subscriptions left, right and center these days. Follow a few free footballing podcasts, along with news/ Politics/ history/ niche topics podcasts and whenever a headline catches me eye, ill listen to that. I hate reading on a screen, so I'd rather listen to a podcast while working.
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Re: The Athletic
« Reply #131 on: July 20, 2021, 12:10:46 am »
Did the pay a pound a month thing and jibbed it off once that expired. Not a fan of how journalists are on twitter, coming across as 'rockstars' to footballing twitter masses. Got the vibe that journalist are bigger than the stories sometimes. I couldn't care less about the journalists opinion, and some stuff could have come straight from clubs PR department, fluff pieces. Not interested in that, but I could see why someone would be.

Can't stand footballing twitter these days, deleted my account a few years back and I haven't missed it. I get my footballing fix on here, the odd footballing podcast, or I'll just chat shite to the lads in work/ out when watching the game.

Plus i'm paying subscriptions left, right and center these days. Follow a few free footballing podcasts, along with news/ Politics/ history/ niche topics podcasts and whenever a headline catches me eye, ill listen to that. I hate reading on a screen, so I'd rather listen to a podcast while working.

I had a debate with Ornstein in the comments of one of his articles and he went to the effort of finding me on Twitter and blocking me.
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Offline Ray K

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Re: The Athletic
« Reply #132 on: July 20, 2021, 09:01:18 am »
I had a debate with Ornstein in the comments of one of his articles and he went to the effort of finding me on Twitter and blocking me.
To be honest, I appreciate and admire that level of pettiness   ;D
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Offline Charlie Adams fried egg

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Re: The Athletic
« Reply #133 on: July 20, 2021, 09:17:03 am »
Did the pay a pound a month thing and jibbed it off once that expired. Not a fan of how journalists are on twitter, coming across as 'rockstars' to footballing twitter masses. Got the vibe that journalist are bigger than the stories sometimes. I couldn't care less about the journalists opinion, and some stuff could have come straight from clubs PR department, fluff pieces. Not interested in that, but I could see why someone would be.

Can't stand footballing twitter these days, deleted my account a few years back and I haven't missed it. I get my footballing fix on here, the odd footballing podcast, or I'll just chat shite to the lads in work/ out when watching the game.

Plus i'm paying subscriptions left, right and center these days. Follow a few free footballing podcasts, along with news/ Politics/ history/ niche topics podcasts and whenever a headline catches me eye, ill listen to that. I hate reading on a screen, so I'd rather listen to a podcast while working.

I agree with you and was having a similar conversation over the weekend.

There's so much media, but also access to clubs and players in general is a lot more structured and formal, that there's a huge gap that needs to be filled. Enter the high profile journo to fill that gap. Can't get anyone from the club to interview? No problem, get the journo on.
There's now so much journalist interviewing fellow journalist related content and it's rarely good. There's hardly any challenge or scrutiny to what's being said and the danger is that, as you say, it becomes about the journalist who become stars in their own right.
« Last Edit: July 20, 2021, 09:57:03 am by Charlie Adams fried egg »

Offline bradders1011

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Re: The Athletic
« Reply #134 on: July 20, 2021, 09:50:13 am »
Did the pay a pound a month thing and jibbed it off once that expired. Not a fan of how journalists are on twitter, coming across as 'rockstars' to footballing twitter masses.

I get the feeling a lot of football journalists hate the football fans with whom they have to share space.
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Re: The Athletic
« Reply #135 on: July 20, 2021, 09:56:27 am »
This is available if you know where to look for it.  It just may not be focused on LFC. 

I also think the UK press is conditioned not to ask these things as I can't recall a press conference where any of this is discussed in any detail.  It's always just about character and referee incidents.  Any actual probing questions seem to be actually dissuaded.

To be honest I think most of the media just don't have a clue about tactics beyond what any fan does, and they have no desire to learn. It's not necessarily where the money is anyway, transfer gossip and player PR pieces seem to be where it's at.

Offline rossipersempre

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Re: The Athletic
« Reply #136 on: July 20, 2021, 10:15:50 am »
I get the feeling a lot of football journalists hate the football fans with whom they have to share space.
Hate is too strong. Smugly superior is more like it.
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Re: The Athletic
« Reply #137 on: July 20, 2021, 10:22:29 am »
Hate is too strong. Smugly superior is more like it.
Ah that explains it, must be loads of journos on here.

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Re: The Athletic
« Reply #138 on: July 20, 2021, 04:52:48 pm »
I had a debate with Ornstein in the comments of one of his articles and he went to the effort of finding me on Twitter and blocking me.
That does not surprise me, I went to a Tifo IRL Q&A session where Ornstein was on the panel, he acted a bit affronted towards some of the questions that even vaguely cast doubt on his sources. Was a bit of a nob to be honest.
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Offline Red Cactii

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Re: The Athletic
« Reply #139 on: August 17, 2021, 04:57:50 pm »
Gonna go against the grain here and say I  prefer the full price. Last season for example the articles and interactions with the authors in the comments section was fully worth it.

They started giving away 12 pounds a year subscriptions and the trolls flooded in. It's as bad as any other online paper now. Won't renew my subscription because it's so cheap, ironically.

Yes and now we’re paying for it through the copious amounts of ads they pour into the podcasts, especially outside the app. Also find it tasteful that they’re slapping bet365 all over their podcasts, but whatever pays I guess.

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Re: The Athletic
« Reply #140 on: August 17, 2021, 04:59:08 pm »
I get the feeling a lot of football journalists hate the football fans with whom they have to share space.
I hate most football fans too so can't blame them there

Offline ToneLa

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Re: The Athletic
« Reply #141 on: August 17, 2021, 05:51:58 pm »
Yeah the comments on The Athletic turned me off.

I stupidly thought a pay wall would lead to a more serious class of poster but nope

Has the occasional good article on us... I maybe should read more than just Liverpool stories.


But between the ads, betting crap, and commends, I just didn't feel I liked it.

Offline Lidmanen

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Re: The Athletic
« Reply #142 on: August 17, 2021, 05:56:14 pm »
I can see the sense in having the "best" local journalists cover each club so the fans get the best connected and most focused analysis of their team, but it certainly has its drawbacks too.

Namely, it leads to tribalism not only filling the comments sections, but driving the articles themselves. Case in point, the steaming pile of article from Laurie Whitwell today absolutely fumbling about with the numbers of United's transfer dealings to try and make Klopp's comments about rival spending look foolish. To create such a strawman argument is pathetic in itself, but he doesn't even capitalise on it with the correct answer. He seems to have just made up some things about amortization and theoretical amounts, rather than actually knowing how much United are paying and when. If you're getting triggered by some pretty harmless comments from a rival manager, enough to write a hasty and poorly stuctured piece for a paid subscription service, then maybe you're not professional enough to be in such a role.

This was followed up by the Chelsea correspondent Simon Johnson doing similar via Twitter in response to Klopp's comments, in which he added up Chelsea's sales to make it seem like they've pretty much broken even, despite the fact the figure includes the £34m for the Abraham deal, completed today, four days after Klopp made those comments.

If this is what modern journalism is going to be, slightly more erudite versions of the same gimps you see on Twitter with Sancho or Mount as their avatars who scream at anyone not on their side, I'm out. The Athletic does have some terrific journalists/writers, but they are increasingly being lost in the puddle of biased 'opinion' pieces from people who would make AFTV blush.

Oh, and their sub-editors are shite, or possibly non-existent. Like reading The Grauniad most of the time.

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Re: The Athletic
« Reply #143 on: August 17, 2021, 06:03:21 pm »
Ah that explains it, must be loads of journos on here.
haha  ;D

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Re: The Athletic
« Reply #144 on: August 17, 2021, 10:09:11 pm »
Looks like The Athletic journos must have had a meeting about Kloppo today, some right cry-arsey stuff coming out from them  ;D

Offline classycarra

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Re: The Athletic
« Reply #145 on: August 17, 2021, 10:17:27 pm »
Looks like The Athletic journos must have had a meeting about Kloppo today, some right cry-arsey stuff coming out from them  ;D

What could possibly be said to criticise him?!

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Re: The Athletic
« Reply #146 on: August 17, 2021, 10:22:03 pm »
What could possibly be said to criticise him?!

Seems that certain teams’ journalists are stewing over his very mild comments about teams’ spending, that he made 5 days ago!

It’s actually really odd. A co-ordinated attack by the Man Utd and Chelsea journos on the Athletic.  Both very het up about his comments and both published articles today about it.

It’s like they didn’t actually hear what he said, all he did was answer a question.

Shame for the Athletic too, as it was supposed to be a ‘serious’ publication, this is basically the lowest form of tabloid journalism.

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Re: The Athletic
« Reply #147 on: August 17, 2021, 10:36:04 pm »
Very powerful piece of writing from our own Caoimhe O'Neill about the appalling abuse directed at women at the Euros from predominantly drunken England fans:

https://theathletic.com/2704711/2021/07/15/this-is-what-you-endure-watching-england-as-a-woman-misogyny-sexism-and-the-constant-fear-of-being-touched-without-consent/

https://xcancel.com/search?q=Caoimhe%20O%27Neill%20&src=typed_query&f=live

It's a big problem where lots of men are gathered and particularly drunk and particularly English supporters.
Let's bring in a law where there's an automatic minimum fine or a spell in a cell. I realise that this is not easy to police especially when lots of drunken yobs are concerned.

Any comment where a partner, parent or sibling would like to punch the loudmouth should be a crime where the police can lift the idiots.

However, the big problem is that this culture appears to be accepted by a large bunch of people.

It's not acceptable and needs to stop.
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Re: The Athletic
« Reply #148 on: August 18, 2021, 07:00:26 am »
Seems that certain teams’ journalists are stewing over his very mild comments about teams’ spending, that he made 5 days ago!

It’s actually really odd. A co-ordinated attack by the Man Utd and Chelsea journos on the Athletic.  Both very het up about his comments and both published articles today about it.

It’s like they didn’t actually hear what he said, all he did was answer a question.

Shame for the Athletic too, as it was supposed to be a ‘serious’ publication, this is basically the lowest form of tabloid journalism.

Guess the truth hurts
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Re: The Athletic
« Reply #149 on: August 18, 2021, 07:58:01 am »
Seems that certain teams’ journalists are stewing over his very mild comments about teams’ spending, that he made 5 days ago!

It’s actually really odd. A co-ordinated attack by the Man Utd and Chelsea journos on the Athletic.  Both very het up about his comments and both published articles today about it.

It’s like they didn’t actually hear what he said, all he did was answer a question.

Shame for the Athletic too, as it was supposed to be a ‘serious’ publication, this is basically the lowest form of tabloid journalism.

When you've got journalists covering all the top clubs they'll put out what the club tell them. Look at all the puff pieces James Pearce writes.
Could have done with Grujic and even Chirivella to tide us over this season

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Re: The Athletic
« Reply #150 on: August 18, 2021, 07:59:34 am »
I love the Athletic, though I read about many sports from different journos on it. I even have Raphael Honingstein favourited, he writes some pretty insightful pieces that are pretty entertaining. I'm just not really a fan of James Pearce, to be honest, and having listened to him on the podcasts too, just reinforced my feelings about it. He's just...a boring writer with a few cliches. Cancelled the subscription to the podcast just last week.

But if you are really into sports in general, and if you take the time to find the journos worth reading, it does provide a lot of entertainment for the buck.

Offline Charlie Adams fried egg

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Re: The Athletic
« Reply #151 on: August 18, 2021, 10:48:30 am »
Seems that certain teams’ journalists are stewing over his very mild comments about teams’ spending, that he made 5 days ago!

It’s actually really odd. A co-ordinated attack by the Man Utd and Chelsea journos on the Athletic.  Both very het up about his comments and both published articles today about it.

It’s like they didn’t actually hear what he said, all he did was answer a question.

Shame for the Athletic too, as it was supposed to be a ‘serious’ publication, this is basically the lowest form of tabloid journalism.
If the journo's start to reflect fan rivalry in their writing, it doesn't exactly scream as "must resubscribe" for me.
Using fan rivalry to create engagement and clicks is a race to the bottom. I guess though it exposes one of the biggest issues with mass coverage, which is that they need something to write/talk about. Also guess- and they'll have the data to prove it - that if you put Liverpool or Klopp into a headline, it gets a bit of interest.

At least Pearce's puff pieces are exactly that, and don't stray into too much rivalry based mud slinging.

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Re: The Athletic
« Reply #152 on: August 18, 2021, 11:28:41 am »
If the journo's start to reflect fan rivalry in their writing, it doesn't exactly scream as "must resubscribe" for me.
Using fan rivalry to create engagement and clicks is a race to the bottom. I guess though it exposes one of the biggest issues with mass coverage, which is that they need something to write/talk about. Also guess- and they'll have the data to prove it - that if you put Liverpool or Klopp into a headline, it gets a bit of interest.

At least Pearce's puff pieces are exactly that, and don't stray into too much rivalry based mud slinging.

It's the same deal though. Putting the message across that the club hierarchy want.

Haven't seen or read the Chelsea article. The United one was detailing how they could afford Sancho and Varane and it went into a lot of detail about the financial arrangements of those buys (a bit like Jota and Thiago last year they aren't paying much of the fees this year and it's spread out over the contracts).

It was making comparisons between Liverpool and United's revenues where Liverpool had significantly closed the gap and detailed United's commercial prowess and Liverpool's. There was therefore a bit of conjecture made that perhaps Klopp was using United to have a thinly veiled dig at the Liverpool owners.

There's a lot of good stuff on The Athletic but ultimately journos covering the club beat are going to indulge in puff pieces and more tribal pieces to defend the club. There's enough Manchester bias in the media as it is with the Guardian and Salford BBC and the influence Neville has with Sky. At least with The Athletic we have three of our own journos, so it's worth the subscription from an LFC perspective and there's other good stuff on there. But, yeah, like everywhere else you have Manc shithousery to contend with.

« Last Edit: August 18, 2021, 11:31:40 am by Fromola »
Could have done with Grujic and even Chirivella to tide us over this season

Offline Broad Spectrum

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Re: The Athletic
« Reply #153 on: August 18, 2021, 12:27:47 pm »
There's shite on The Athletic because that's what creates drama and helps with revenue. Michael Cox is brilliant on there, similar tactical breakdown of selected matches in a way PoP, Babu Yagu etc. used to do on here. Also some of the guys covering football across the continent are excellent (Raphael Honingstein, James Horncastle etc.), and it's coverage of the US Sports is very good.

Also when will people learn to avoid the comments section of websites if it just irritates you...

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Re: The Athletic
« Reply #154 on: August 19, 2021, 09:42:36 am »
the Chelsea and Lewandowski articels today are brilliant and why i pay this 1 pound a month :D
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Offline Broad Spectrum

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Re: The Athletic
« Reply #155 on: August 19, 2021, 10:47:43 am »
the Chelsea and Lewandowski articels today are brilliant and why i pay this 1 pound a month :D

Where's that? The only article I can see is the excellent piece by Honingstein...?

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Re: The Athletic
« Reply #156 on: August 19, 2021, 10:49:44 am »
I posted it in the chelsea thread
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Offline Broad Spectrum

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Re: The Athletic
« Reply #157 on: August 19, 2021, 10:56:09 am »
I posted it in the chelsea thread

Ah sorry ignore me you meant both the Chelsea racism article AND the Lewandowski article. That Chelsea one is horrific, racism is disgusting in any form but against children as well, what absolute pieces of shit.

Offline Greyfox

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Re: The Athletic
« Reply #158 on: August 19, 2021, 11:40:31 am »
I went onto my bt account and on there was a code giving me The Athletic free for a year...so took them up on it.

Offline Dave McCoy

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Re: The Athletic
« Reply #159 on: August 19, 2021, 04:51:50 pm »
As an American there's this weird subculture around football writers and the UK that I just can't really get.  I think it's more akin to US political reporting in that it's all about the horse race, feelings, and nebulous opinions than actual facts and tactics.  I used to read Pearce, Liew, Wilson, etc etc but they basically re-write the same story every week and it's kind of mystifying why anyone finds any value in it at all.  I think it somewhat explains why there is such a focus on the club "Captain" because it fits in with the narrative that these jokers seemingly only care about.

Cox and Worville at least give some value in trying to explain what happened in a particular match or player and why.  The rest wouldn't teach you anything about the sport in 100 years of reading except whatever is the current flavor de jour opinion amongst the general populace that the TV pundits then regurgitate ad naseum.

Aside from that I wouldn't spend a penny on the Athletic.

Also in general can someone explain to me what the fuck "The Bid" is?  The club is monitoring the bid.  The club is preparing the bid.  The club is refining the bid.  Who comes up with this shit and why does anybody believe it?  It's crazy.  You mean to tell me these clubs don't pick up the phone and talk?  Spurs are just waiting for this mysterious care package like its Christmas and ManC is fat jolly Santa Claus to find out what they get?   Its a total scam and anybody that believes this should feel bad.