Author Topic: Everton - The 777 Unflushables  (Read 515861 times)

Offline Dim Glas

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Re: Everton - The 777 Unflushables
« Reply #9880 on: February 12, 2024, 07:32:36 pm »
So its red cartel now and cheating scumbags sticking together, blame everyone else but themselves ;D

I hope that idiot isn’t actually from Liverpool, imagine brown nosing fanbases that sing ‘feed the Scousers’ on a regular basis.

Never fails to amuse/amaze me how Everton fans ignore that they as a club have suffered as much as anyone from Man City’s cheating and blood money, as before they whre bought Everton where regularly finishing above them. Same now goes with Newcastle. It’s like a bad case of Stockholm Syndrome with them.

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Re: Everton - The 777 Unflushables
« Reply #9881 on: February 12, 2024, 08:04:39 pm »
Even if they did ugnore all that shite and liked to think they were some valiant underdog alongside some of those other names, saudicastle and 115 fc are the obvious exceptions that it would just be complete batshittery on the part of bitters to align themselves with them.

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Re: Everton - The 777 Unflushables
« Reply #9882 on: February 12, 2024, 08:10:19 pm »
Even if they did ugnore all that shite and liked to think they were some valiant underdog alongside some of those other names, saudicastle and 115 fc are the obvious exceptions that it would just be complete batshittery on the part of bitters to align themselves with them.
good word to use when discussing Everton.  "I think I'll uggg!nore them"

Offline G Richards

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Re: Everton - The 777 Unflushables
« Reply #9883 on: February 12, 2024, 08:36:52 pm »
I remember a better day with Everton. I don't remember their Holy Trinity - that was my dad's era, but I do remember the smashing side they had in the mid 1980s. I also remember our rivalry, but it seemed healthier at the time.

Over the years too many of their base have gone off the deep end and into a spiraling world of bitterness, raging against Liverpool and the wider footballing world, when they would have been a lot better served by looking inward, and getting their own house in order.

It saddens me to say it, as I am well aware of how they stood with us for justice for the 96 (97) but I think they have a bit more to go before they hit rock bottom. That will probably come when they are relegated, possibly on the back of also going into administration.

At that point they will have two options. Fade into oblivion, while raging against the world. Or, dust themselves down, regroup, cut their cloth accordingly, and start building a football club again.

A reset is possible, and it might just come with a new stadium and the promise of a better future. But too many of them are detached from reality at present, as they did cheat, they did cook the books, they did miss their financial target by quite a margin, and other clubs who kept to the rules were relegated. Come clean Everton! Come clean! And redemption might be possible.

Offline SamLad

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Re: Everton - The 777 Unflushables
« Reply #9884 on: February 12, 2024, 09:22:13 pm »
I remember a better day with Everton. I don't remember their Holy Trinity - that was my dad's era, but I do remember the smashing side they had in the mid 1980s. I also remember our rivalry, but it seemed healthier at the time.

Over the years too many of their base have gone off the deep end and into a spiraling world of bitterness, raging against Liverpool and the wider footballing world, when they would have been a lot better served by looking inward, and getting their own house in order.

It saddens me to say it, as I am well aware of how they stood with us for justice for the 96 (97) but I think they have a bit more to go before they hit rock bottom. That will probably come when they are relegated, possibly on the back of also going into administration.

At that point they will have two options. Fade into oblivion, while raging against the world. Or, dust themselves down, regroup, cut their cloth accordingly, and start building a football club again.

A reset is possible, and it might just come with a new stadium and the promise of a better future. But too many of them are detached from reality at present, as they did cheat, they did cook the books, they did miss their financial target by quite a margin, and other clubs who kept to the rules were relegated. Come clean Everton! Come clean! And redemption might be possible.
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Offline Skeeve

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Re: Everton - The 777 Unflushables
« Reply #9885 on: February 12, 2024, 10:29:45 pm »
good word to use when discussing Everton.  "I think I'll uggg!nore them"

Totally unintentional, but it does seem to fit them doesn't it.  ;D

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Re: Everton - The 777 Unflushables
« Reply #9886 on: February 13, 2024, 04:20:00 am »
Is it Friday yet......
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Re: Everton - The 777 Unflushables
« Reply #9887 on: February 13, 2024, 07:35:59 am »
I remember a better day with Everton. I don't remember their Holy Trinity - that was my dad's era, but I do remember the smashing side they had in the mid 1980s. I also remember our rivalry, but it seemed healthier at the time.

Over the years too many of their base have gone off the deep end and into a spiraling world of bitterness, raging against Liverpool and the wider footballing world, when they would have been a lot better served by looking inward, and getting their own house in order.

It saddens me to say it, as I am well aware of how they stood with us for justice for the 96 (97) but I think they have a bit more to go before they hit rock bottom. That will probably come when they are relegated, possibly on the back of also going into administration.

At that point they will have two options. Fade into oblivion, while raging against the world. Or, dust themselves down, regroup, cut their cloth accordingly, and start building a football club again.

A reset is possible, and it might just come with a new stadium and the promise of a better future. But too many of them are detached from reality at present, as they did cheat, they did cook the books, they did miss their financial target by quite a margin, and other clubs who kept to the rules were relegated. Come clean Everton! Come clean! And redemption might be possible.

I started getting into football around the year 2000, were their fans like this in the late 90s too? I was watching a derby match from 1997 where they beat us 2-0. And i honestly couldn’t sense any bitterness there. They seemed like a club who had just won a trophy 2 years ago in 1995, and just avoided relegation. But optimistic they could go on to bigger things.

Is that a correct late 90s/Cadamarteri observation?

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Re: Everton - The 777 Unflushables
« Reply #9888 on: February 13, 2024, 07:46:53 am »
I blame Hans Segars.

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Re: Everton - The 777 Unflushables
« Reply #9889 on: February 13, 2024, 07:54:46 am »
Just so I understand this:

Can the appeals' panel only uphold the appeal or reject it? As in, can they only confirm the original punishment is fair, wrong or too lenient?

A part of me wonders if the PL requested 12 points knowing Everton would appeal, so there would be scope to increase the deduction if the appeal fails. I certainly don't want the punishment reduced solely on the grounds that it's poor little Everton and that they face financial oblivion if they're not let off. That isn't the PL's problem.
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Re: Everton - The 777 Unflushables
« Reply #9890 on: February 13, 2024, 07:56:39 am »
Seen a discussion before about Premier League-era Everton teams. Would there be any PL era Everton player who'd get in our side now? A peak Beardsley or Rooney would (neither of which Everton got in the Premier League, similar with PL era Southall). I'd still say Rooney though, at least in rotation with our forward line (from his first spell at Everton).  Beyond that i'm struggling. Obviously the likes of Gazza or Ginola were well past it when they went there.

Yet the amount of times the Echo or blues would run combined XI's with half their players in ours.


There was always an argument that Everton had a better left back until Robertson signed.
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Offline Wigwamdelbert

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Re: Everton - The 777 Unflushables
« Reply #9891 on: February 13, 2024, 08:15:10 am »
Even prior to Klopp, everton's own survey produced figures of 50% reds, 25% blues and 25% no interest for the football support in the city and you'd have to think their position has dropped from that level by now too.
So... 50% Reds, and 50% no interest in football?
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Re: Everton - The 777 Unflushables
« Reply #9892 on: February 13, 2024, 09:00:24 am »
I'd be embarrassed to support Everton. Theyre desperate wannabees without even the conscience to appreciate how poor at everything they are. They cannot even cheat properly without being embarrassingly shit at it. They cannot even gas light without being equally terrible at it. They are shit at every single aspect of anything they try. Their utter and dismal failure at all things is like a gift. It is the only thing they are successful at. Being an embarrassment. But they have no shame nor cognisance of their failings. Its always someone elses fault, never their own. What a miserable existence, wallowing in the glory of the peoples cup. Spending millions on players that wouldnt get in my grandaughters schools 2nd XI. Building a stadium next to a sewage works that will hang round their necks like a turd that just wont flush. A lot of the aroma that will hang over it like a fugue will be delivered via reds. What will they build to obscure the smell of our shite? Another big blue air freshener? Will they divert our pooh to another works because they cant stand that our pooh probably smells redish.
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Re: Everton - The 777 Unflushables
« Reply #9893 on: February 13, 2024, 09:26:49 am »

There was always an argument that Everton had a better left back until Robertson signed.

To be fair Baines was a good player at his peak. The only one of their players I would have taken at the time.

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Re: Everton - The 777 Unflushables
« Reply #9894 on: February 13, 2024, 09:51:20 am »
the 10 point deduction will be reduced on appeal and any points deduction due for the latest infraction will be allotted to next season, as the thread states they're unflushable
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Offline Fromola

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Re: Everton - The 777 Unflushables
« Reply #9895 on: February 13, 2024, 09:56:45 am »

There was always an argument that Everton had a better left back until Robertson signed.

Yeah Baines was a decent left back. Mainly because it was our graveyard position for so long. I'd say Aurelio was better when actually fit though. Baines was durable.
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Re: Everton - The 777 Unflushables
« Reply #9896 on: February 13, 2024, 09:57:41 am »
the 10 point deduction will be reduced on appeal and any points deduction due for the latest infraction will be allotted to next season, as the thread states they're unflushable
Allotted to next season? So why hear it before the end of this season? 
Don’t think they will get a second points deduction, but if they did, it would absolutely be for this season.
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Offline Fromola

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Re: Everton - The 777 Unflushables
« Reply #9897 on: February 13, 2024, 09:58:05 am »
the 10 point deduction will be reduced on appeal and any points deduction due for the latest infraction will be allotted to next season, as the thread states they're unflushable

Would sum them up if that happens and they stay up because Forest lose 10.
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Re: Everton - The 777 Unflushables
« Reply #9898 on: February 13, 2024, 09:58:11 am »
Anyway, they get some points back, Forest get hammered and they’re safe. 
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Re: Everton - The 777 Unflushables
« Reply #9899 on: February 13, 2024, 10:06:56 am »
To think that Blackburn Rovers and Leicester have both won the title in the Premier League era and been relegated - yet any number of online Everton fans are convinced that PL and Sky have kept Everton in a box for the past 20 years because they don't want their top 4/5/6 cartel threatened.

I'd say the absolute opposite would have been true.
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Re: Everton - The 777 Unflushables
« Reply #9900 on: February 13, 2024, 11:23:49 am »
Just so I understand this:

Can the appeals' panel only uphold the appeal or reject it? As in, can they only confirm the original punishment is fair, wrong or too lenient?

A part of me wonders if the PL requested 12 points knowing Everton would appeal, so there would be scope to increase the deduction if the appeal fails. I certainly don't want the punishment reduced solely on the grounds that it's poor little Everton and that they face financial oblivion if they're not let off. That isn't the PL's problem.

We are in unknown territory here because a club has never been daft enough to deliberately breach PSR. Never mind then plead guilty but still appeal.

My understanding is that Everton have two ways to reduce the penalty. Firstly to show there was a procedural error. Secondly to show that the original panel gave an unreasonable punishment in essence that the punishment was excessively severe.

The first one is implausible given who was on the panel.

The second one has happened before Sheff Wed had a 12-point penalty reduced on appeal to 6 points regarding their failure to sell Hillsborough. The issue though is that the EFL does have a formula for working out punishments and previous precedents.

If the appeal panel does agree to use the formula that the PL proposed then the punishment would start at 9 points before mitigating factors and aggravating factors. Everton's problem though is that their mitigations were fanciful and rightly laughed away. Whilst that genius Moshiri admitted to breaching PSR because not doing so would have left them without a midfield.
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Re: Everton - The 777 Unflushables
« Reply #9901 on: February 13, 2024, 11:37:55 am »
Fury amongst Ev blues as MNF does piece on Alonso.

Genuinely triggered even though MNF usually does big sections on general football rather than just the game they’re about to show.

Offline Romford_Red

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Re: Everton - The 777 Unflushables
« Reply #9902 on: February 13, 2024, 11:49:35 am »
I blame Hans Segars.


I blame his cousin - Feet Nintendoes.

Offline Fromola

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Re: Everton - The 777 Unflushables
« Reply #9903 on: February 13, 2024, 12:22:18 pm »
To think that Blackburn Rovers and Leicester have both won the title in the Premier League era and been relegated - yet any number of online Everton fans are convinced that PL and Sky have kept Everton in a box for the past 20 years because they don't want their top 4/5/6 cartel threatened.

I'd say the absolute opposite would have been true.

They've been terribly run throughout the PL era is the reality. They had a decade where they overachieved under Moyes (while never really achieving anything ultimately) because they were skint. They never had a pot to piss in under Kenwright and were trying to geg in on a groundshare with us, move to Kirkby or fail to come up with funds for the Kings Dock.

Then they were 'fucking rich' and spunked the lot on shite by the time Usmanov (who the corrupt PL let launder his dirty money into Everton) was sanctioned.

People always used to go on about the 'big 4'. Then it was a big 6. What have Spurs done to gatecrash that? Obviously not win trophies but they've made sound decisions off the pitch and they never went on mad spending sprees either

Evertonians spent decades blaming Heysel for their decline and now the Premier League are to blame. They were a goal away from relegation last season. Had they gone down it'd the EFL docking them points, but now everything is the Premer League's fault and naturally even within that Liverpool are to blame, given we helped push for FFP.
« Last Edit: February 13, 2024, 12:34:11 pm by Fromola »
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Offline Fromola

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Re: Everton - The 777 Unflushables
« Reply #9904 on: February 13, 2024, 12:28:10 pm »
We are in unknown territory here because a club has never been daft enough to deliberately breach PSR. Never mind then plead guilty but still appeal.

My understanding is that Everton have two ways to reduce the penalty. Firstly to show there was a procedural error. Secondly to show that the original panel gave an unreasonable punishment in essence that the punishment was excessively severe.

The first one is implausible given who was on the panel.

The second one has happened before Sheff Wed had a 12-point penalty reduced on appeal to 6 points regarding their failure to sell Hillsborough. The issue though is that the EFL does have a formula for working out punishments and previous precedents.

If the appeal panel does agree to use the formula that the PL proposed then the punishment would start at 9 points before mitigating factors and aggravating factors. Everton's problem though is that their mitigations were fanciful and rightly laughed away. Whilst that genius Moshiri admitted to breaching PSR because not doing so would have left them without a midfield.

In 2020, with Covid in full swing and Everton losing hundred of millions via Covid losses (purely genuine) they went out and spent 20 miillion on Doucore and 20 million on Allan and still had the likes of Gomes and Delph on 100 grand a week sat on the bench. Even if they wanted to strengthen they didn't have to spend that much.

They were one of the few clubs to spend money that summer. Since then they've added Garner, Gana and Onana to their midfield.
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Offline Romford_Red

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Re: Everton - The 777 Unflushables
« Reply #9905 on: February 13, 2024, 01:01:41 pm »
In 2020, with Covid in full swing and Everton losing hundred of millions via Covid losses (purely genuine) they went out and spent 20 miillion on Doucore and 20 million on Allan and still had the likes of Gomes and Delph on 100 grand a week sat on the bench. Even if they wanted to strengthen they didn't have to spend that much.

They were one of the few clubs to spend money that summer. Since then they've added Garner, Gana and Onana to their midfield.

Almost like they signed the wrong one by mistake so had to go buy the player they ACTUALLY wanted.
Like when you were a kid and you'd ask your parents for a very specific thing and they'd either get the wrong thing entirely or they'd talked to 'someone who knows' and this is actually the better one. No really. Sigh.

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Re: Everton - The 777 Unflushables
« Reply #9906 on: February 13, 2024, 01:20:26 pm »
We are in unknown territory here because a club has never been daft enough to deliberately breach PSR. Never mind then plead guilty but still appeal.

My understanding is that Everton have two ways to reduce the penalty. Firstly to show there was a procedural error. Secondly to show that the original panel gave an unreasonable punishment in essence that the punishment was excessively severe.

The first one is implausible given who was on the panel.

The second one has happened before Sheff Wed had a 12-point penalty reduced on appeal to 6 points regarding their failure to sell Hillsborough. The issue though is that the EFL does have a formula for working out punishments and previous precedents.

If the appeal panel does agree to use the formula that the PL proposed then the punishment would start at 9 points before mitigating factors and aggravating factors. Everton's problem though is that their mitigations were fanciful and rightly laughed away. Whilst that genius Moshiri admitted to breaching PSR because not doing so would have left them without a midfield.
The other point to add here is that shouting corruption hardly helps their case. To reduce the points deduction now would give those claims credibility while also setting a precedent for every other club that gets a point deduction.
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Re: Everton - The 777 Unflushables
« Reply #9907 on: February 13, 2024, 01:28:36 pm »
Fury amongst Ev blues as MNF does piece on Alonso.

Genuinely triggered even though MNF usually does big sections on general football rather than just the game they’re about to show.

Its triggered a number of City fans too. They seem to struggle with the concept of Carra putting a poll out and asking for a subject to speak on.

Had one city fan ask why Girona Vs Madrid wasn't an option

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Re: Everton - The 777 Unflushables
« Reply #9908 on: February 13, 2024, 01:33:17 pm »
Over the years too many of their base have gone off the deep end and into a spiraling world of bitterness, raging against Liverpool and the wider footballing world, when they would have been a lot better served by looking inward, and getting their own house in order.

This is, and always will be, the crux of the matter. As long as they blame Liverpool or the 'red cartel' for their issues, they'll never fix their issues. They could have blamed their own management for the cheating, but instead they're blaming the Premier League for noticing and punishing their cheating.

It's gone on for so many years now that I can't see them ever rolling back from their position that everything Everton does badly is the fault of everyone else and never the fault of Everton. It means there's never any real pressure on the club to improve.
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Re: Everton - The 777 Unflushables
« Reply #9909 on: February 13, 2024, 01:36:43 pm »
They plead guilty, then try to bullshit their way through mitigating circumstances with creative accounting; shifting money around, changing definitions, mislabelling allocations etc. Then they cry when their lies don't sway the panel.

Now they appeal because they're claiming not enough weight was given to their extenuating circumstances, despite the mitigation being exposed as bs and receiving multiple warnings over around 18 months that they were heading in the wrong direction and getting worse.

If this appeal is upheld then what's the fucking point of football anymore?
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Re: Everton - The 777 Unflushables
« Reply #9910 on: February 13, 2024, 01:55:11 pm »

If this appeal is upheld then what's the fucking point of football anymore?

If it is upheld or there is a reduced penalty, clubs will go back to spending as they have in the hope of a lesser sanction on appeal

Online smicer07

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Re: Everton - The 777 Unflushables
« Reply #9911 on: February 13, 2024, 02:04:45 pm »
Why do they think there's a big conspiracy? Why on earth would the PL have anything against Everton in particular? 😂

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Re: Everton - The 777 Unflushables
« Reply #9912 on: February 13, 2024, 02:18:52 pm »
Seen a discussion before about Premier League-era Everton teams. Would there be any PL era Everton player who'd get in our side now? A peak Beardsley or Rooney would (neither of which Everton got in the Premier League, similar with PL era Southall). I'd still say Rooney though, at least in rotation with our forward line (from his first spell at Everton).  Beyond that i'm struggling. Obviously the likes of Gazza or Ginola were well past it when they went there.

Yet the amount of times the Echo or blues would run combined XI's with half their players in ours.

Cahill and Rooney (1st spell) are the main two I can think of.

As others have said, Baines was probably better than our left backs other than Robertson and a fit Aurelio.

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Re: Everton - The 777 Unflushables
« Reply #9913 on: February 13, 2024, 02:19:18 pm »
This is, and always will be, the crux of the matter. As long as they blame Liverpool or the 'red cartel' for their issues, they'll never fix their issues. They could have blamed their own management for the cheating, but instead they're blaming the Premier League for noticing and punishing their cheating.

It's gone on for so many years now that I can't see them ever rolling back from their position that everything Everton does badly is the fault of everyone else and never the fault of Everton. It means there's never any real pressure on the club to improve.

In a nutshell.

It's an attitude that lets the cycle of madness continue unabated. Actually, it's something that affects many individuals in life, so it's not just a collective malaise like it is at Goodison.

There are certain people who do not accept any responsibility for their situations. In doing so, they create their our hopelessness, their own malaise and their own helplessness. Because they convince themselves their problems are all the fault of someone else, they absolve themselves of any responsibility to do something about their circumstances and improve them.

Everton have done this collectively. They've created their own helplessness then revelled in it like pigs in shit. They've absolved themselves of any responsibility for their position and any responsibility for rectifying it.

It's all so very convenient, because it means they don't have to look inwards and self reflect. There is no reflective practice with anything they do. They don't have to be grown up and accept personal responsibility. They can happily play the victim without putting any pressure on themselves to grow up and actually take control of their own destiny.

They're basically lazy cowards. They refuse to self reflect and they refuse to do the hard work. They just want it all to fall into their lap for free. When it doesn't, everyone but them is to blame.

If Everton was an individual, they'd need years of therapy.
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Offline LuverlyRita

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Re: Everton - The 777 Unflushables
« Reply #9914 on: February 13, 2024, 02:20:04 pm »
Schmeichel said in an interview that they had to move him on, and wouldn't extend Tielemans because of FFP.
By staying within the P&S rules, Leicester were disadvantaged compared to Everton and that disadvantage may have contributed to their relegation. But the very fact that they did stay within the rules means that relegation was not a complete financial disaster. The rules are there for a purpose and that Everton chose to break them means not only that they cheated but that they put the very existence of their club at risk.

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Re: Everton - The 777 Unflushables
« Reply #9915 on: February 13, 2024, 02:29:04 pm »
Why do they think there's a big conspiracy? Why on earth would the PL have anything against Everton in particular? 😂
They live in the delusion that Everton are not only relevant, but also some kind of threat. A threat to what, no one actually knows.

The PL have shown that you can be murderers and cheats. You can be gangsters or pariah states. They'll welcome you to the top table regardless. You can be a existential threat to the game and it's future, but they'll still roll out the red carpet for you. So why they believe little old Everton would be seen as a threat, goodness only knows. Even if they were, why would the PL care when it's proven time and again that it welcomes any scumbag that can cheat it's way to the top table.

« Last Edit: February 13, 2024, 02:31:44 pm by Son of Spion »
The light that burns twice as bright, burns half as long, and you've burned so very, very brightly, Jürgen.

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Re: Everton - The 777 Unflushables
« Reply #9916 on: February 13, 2024, 02:33:33 pm »
To be fair Baines was a good player at his peak. The only one of their players I would have taken at the time.
I think that's fair and I'd have been happy to see him in a red shirt. But he is a reminder of how badly their transfer policy went awry when they became "f***ing rich". Previously they'd done a reasonable job of trawling the "less fashionable" clubs - in the Prem and lower leagues - for solid players at a reasonable price - Tim Cahill, Baines, Jagielka etc. That policy went out of the window with the arrival of Moshiri and they started flinging big money at cast offs from Champions League clubs (players who were cast-offs for good reason). In effect they moved on from decent quality at a fair price from the footballing equivalent of your local high street store to expensive tat from Harrods and they imagined they were better for it  ::)

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Re: Everton - The 777 Unflushables
« Reply #9917 on: February 13, 2024, 02:37:21 pm »
If you were to offer them Leicester's past 20 years of league positions, I'm convinced that the majority would turn it down. Not getting relegated is more important to them than winning trophies, as they wouldn't want to sully their reputation. Even if that meant turning down winning League One, the Championship, the Premier League and the FA cup.

The irony now is that not getting relegated is far more important than any trophy. They're fucked if they go down now.

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Re: Everton - The 777 Unflushables
« Reply #9918 on: February 13, 2024, 02:43:59 pm »
I think that's fair and I'd have been happy to see him in a red shirt. But he is a reminder of how badly their transfer policy went awry when they became "f***ing rich". Previously they'd done a reasonable job of trawling the "less fashionable" clubs - in the Prem and lower leagues - for solid players at a reasonable price - Tim Cahill, Baines, Jagielka etc. That policy went out of the window with the arrival of Moshiri and they started flinging big money at cast offs from Champions League clubs (players who were cast-offs for good reason). In effect they moved on from decent quality at a fair price from the footballing equivalent of your local high street store to expensive tat from Harrods and they imagined they were better for it  ::)

I met Baines once. Genuinely nice bloke and was happy having a bit of a laugh about the 'rivalry' when I told him I was a red. I suspect he got a lot of that !
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Re: Everton - The 777 Unflushables
« Reply #9919 on: February 13, 2024, 02:45:11 pm »
By staying within the P&S rules, Leicester were disadvantaged compared to Everton and that disadvantage may have contributed to their relegation. But the very fact that they did stay within the rules means that relegation was not a complete financial disaster. The rules are there for a purpose and that Everton chose to break them means not only that they cheated but that they put the very existence of their club at risk.

Yep, and now Leicester are smashing it in the Championship with Leeds and Southampton just behind.  It looks nailed on that it will be much tougher to stay in the Premier League next season.  Everton might regret pushing to defer points deductions.