Topic: Kylian Mbappé. The best there is

[Elzar]

He is

I think it's Beckenbauer.

[carling]

I wonder if he will ever leave PSG, there's always a price that becomes impossible to ignore.  It appeared Mbappe was determined to leave last season but all it meant was that his wage was pushed higher.  If you ask me what breaks first - Mbappe's desire to become a legend of club football or the Qataris willingness to throw more money at the most integral part of their sportswashing project, then I know which one I'm choosing.  While they want him this much I can't see him going anywhere.

[Elzar]

I wonder if he will ever leave PSG, there's always a price that becomes impossible to ignore.  It appeared Mbappe was determined to leave last season but all it meant was that his wage was pushed higher.  If you ask me what breaks first - Mbappe's desire to become a legend of club football or the Qataris willingness to throw more money at the most integral part of their sportswashing project, then I know which one I'm choosing.  While they want him this much I can't see him going anywhere.

He did ask to leave just before the World Cup, so can't see him feeling that loyal to them.

[has gone odd]

PSG just hasn't quite worked out for the oilers. An irrelevant club in historic terms and always a step behind the headlines in modern day, no matter how much money they fling about. The time for Mbappe to move on cannot be far away.

[Scottymuser]

PSG just hasn't quite worked out for the oilers. An irrelevant club in historic terms and always a step behind the headlines in modern day, no matter how much money they fling about. The time for Mbappe to move on cannot be far away.

They are doing it in a really weird way also - if you discount the two massive transfers of Mbappe and Neymar from summer of 2017 (almost 400m between them), they have only spent 40m euros or more on a player 3 times since 2016 - Icardi was 50m (and is now on loan to Galatasaray), Hakimi was 68m and Vitinha was 42m.  Then they've been buying instead the likes of Gueye, Diallo, Paredes, Berchiche, Mendes, etc.  Meaning they have a massively unbalanced squad, with no real vision on how to build a better one.

[Circa1892]

They are doing it in a really weird way also - if you discount the two massive transfers of Mbappe and Neymar from summer of 2017 (almost 400m between them), they have only spent 40m euros or more on a player 3 times since 2016 - Icardi was 50m (and is now on loan to Galatasaray), Hakimi was 68m and Vitinha was 42m.  Then they've been buying instead the likes of Gueye, Diallo, Paredes, Berchiche, Mendes, etc.  Meaning they have a massively unbalanced squad, with no real vision on how to build a better one.

The thing I never understand about PSG is how many genuinely average players they have. With the exception of Veratti, I can't think of a high end midfielder they've had...

[afc tukrish]

I`m not sure what you`re after. Lots of people think Maradona is the greatest.

But you just posted that most people don't.

So which is it?

[rob1966]

This. And it's why his decision not to go to Madrid was utterly bizarre. Screwed us over on the Tchouameni thing too. Absolute shocker.

PSG just hasn't quite worked out for the oilers. An irrelevant club in historic terms and always a step behind the headlines in modern day, no matter how much money they fling about. The time for Mbappe to move on cannot be far away.

I can think of 574 million reasons why he stayed at PSG.

[Raaphael]

But you just posted that most people don't.

So which is it?

Let me re-phrase: I think most forum users(who I assume are born after Maradona played) don’t understand how good he was.

[afc tukrish]

Let me re-phrase: I think most forum users(who I assume are born after Maradona played) don’t understand how good he was.

Fair enough, I understand the point you were making. Cheers...

[So… Howard Philips]

PSG just hasn't quite worked out for the oilers. An irrelevant club in historic terms and always a step behind the headlines in modern day, no matter how much money they fling about. The time for Mbappe to move on cannot be far away.

And the same applies to City and Newcastle.

[mikey_LFC]

My guess would be that he’ll have a far shorter career than a lot of others since he relies on his pace so much. He’s likely at or close to his peak now. Wouldn’t surprise me if he has a Michael Owen style drop off at some point, although let’s hope not as he’s a joy to watch.

I’d put him some way off the top tier of footballers ever though and out of reach of the very top table. Talent wise he could definitely end up in the top 50 ish ever. Below the likes of Zidane and Ronaldinho, or even Suarez maybe in the tier below which would be people like Henry, Kaka and Salah. Currently achievement wise he’d be somewhere just behind Sadio Mane. And in terms of performance I’d say up until this point Michael Owen is about right, which is fantastic since he was constantly superb before the age of 24.

[Sheer Magnetism]

Can't go with the predictions he'll break every scoring record. If they both keep fit Haaland will finish well ahead. He has Owen's scoring instinct combined with a Zlatan-esque physique, a physique that's allowed Zlatan to play at the top level at 39.

As for his status in general, he's up there right now but at this age Maradona was the most expensive player in the world and had two South American player of the year awards under his belt at a time when Zico, Socrates, Passarella, etc. were at their peak. Mbappe hasn't come close to even being the top European player in the Ballon d'Or voting.

And yes, the league he's in does make a difference. There's a reason Mitrovic's last season wasn't enough for people to judge him as a top player. Mbappe's very talented and extremely effective but for me he hasn't shown he's definitively above Kane - a player with a better international scoring record who's topped the scoring and assist charts in a better league - let alone on a level with the true greats.

[Raaphael]

Mbappe, speed merchant.

[mikey_LFC]

Mbappe, speed merchant.

 

I didn’t intend to say this. I meant more his pace is a key part of his game, and without it I am not sure how he gets on. Not to say it’s the only part of his game. However players like him are often prone to devastating injuries which limit their effectiveness there after.

[Scottymuser]

My guess would be that he’ll have a far shorter career than a lot of others since he relies on his pace so much. He’s likely at or close to his peak now. Wouldn’t surprise me if he has a Michael Owen style drop off at some point, although let’s hope not as he’s a joy to watch.

I’d put him some way off the top tier of footballers ever though and out of reach of the very top table. Talent wise he could definitely end up in the top 50 ish ever. Below the likes of Zidane and Ronaldinho, or even Suarez maybe in the tier below which would be people like Henry, Kaka and Salah. Currently achievement wise he’d be somewhere just behind Sadio Mane. And in terms of performance I’d say up until this point Michael Owen is about right, which is fantastic since he was constantly superb before the age of 24.

Mbappe is miles, miles, miles better than Owen was at his age IMO, and I don't think it's close either - at the end of the equivalent season when Owen turned 24 (which Mbappe just has), so 2002/03, he had just reached 102 league goals in 187 games, 16 European goals in 43 games (6 goals in 15 CL games and 10 goals in 27 UEFA cup matches)  and 20 international goals (in about 49 matches).  Mbappe, who has the rest of the season to then catch up, already has 147 goals in 197 games in the league, 34 CL goals in 50 games, and 36 goals in 66 games for France.  And 6 months to put more on.  He also has many, many more assists (Owen had 29 assists in the league, 2 in the CL, 1 in the UEFA, and 3 for England; Mbappe has got 63 in the league, 26 in the CL and 23 for France) as he is a much better all round player than Owen ever was.

The reason that Owen had such a short career had nothing to do with pace, and everything to do with injuries and poor career choices (going to Real when he did meaning he was never first properly first choice ) then picking a mid table Newcastle United to join (and then promptly lose almost 2 full seasons to injury with) meaning when he was fit enough to play in 07/08 (turning 29 mid season, so FIVE years older than Mbappe is today), they had just finished 13th the previous season and were bang average (their  most creative players were Jonas Gutierrez, Danny Guthrie, Damien Duff  and Shola Ameobi FFS) - so it wasn't the biggest surprise ever that he only managed 19 goals in 2 seasons.  I don't see Mbappe being as stupid as Owen was re: club moves, or as being as unlucky as Owen was with injuries.

In terms of talent - he is already a more effective player than Ronaldinho ever was, and probably ditto Zidane.  At the same age, Ronaldinho had just left PSG (where he helped them finish ... 11th), and had just started to win a first XI place for an decent Barcelona.  Dinho was an absolute magician with the ball, but that doesn't mean that even if Mbappe continues to get better and better, that Mbappe won't be able to be considered as his equal, or better.   Mane having a better "carreer" (when he is almost 7 years older - at his age he was still at Southampton) is laughable really - it is just a silly argument to compare an about to turn 31 year old, with a just turned 24 year old.

[mikey_LFC]

Mbappe is miles, miles, miles better than Owen was at his age IMO, and I don't think it's close either - at the end of the equivalent season when Owen turned 24 (which Mbappe just has), so 2002/03, he had just reached 102 league goals in 187 games, 16 European goals in 43 games (6 goals in 15 CL games and 10 goals in 27 UEFA cup matches)  and 20 international goals (in about 49 matches).  Mbappe, who has the rest of the season to then catch up, already has 147 goals in 197 games in the league, 34 CL goals in 50 games, and 36 goals in 66 games for France.  And 6 months to put more on.  He also has many, many more assists (Owen had 29 assists in the league, 2 in the CL, 1 in the UEFA, and 3 for England; Mbappe has got 63 in the league, 26 in the CL and 23 for France) as he is a much better all round player than Owen ever was.

The reason that Owen had such a short career had nothing to do with pace, and everything to do with injuries and poor career choices (going to Real when he did meaning he was never first properly first choice ) then picking a mid table Newcastle United to join (and then promptly lose almost 2 full seasons to injury with) meaning when he was fit enough to play in 07/08 (turning 29 mid season, so FIVE years older than Mbappe is today), they had just finished 13th the previous season and were bang average (their  most creative players were Jonas Gutierrez, Danny Guthrie, Damien Duff  and Shola Ameobi FFS) - so it wasn't the biggest surprise ever that he only managed 19 goals in 2 seasons.  I don't see Mbappe being as stupid as Owen was re: club moves, or as being as unlucky as Owen was with injuries.

In terms of talent - he is already a more effective player than Ronaldinho ever was, and probably ditto Zidane.  At the same age, Ronaldinho had just left PSG (where he helped them finish ... 11th), and had just started to win a first XI place for an decent Barcelona.  Dinho was an absolute magician with the ball, but that doesn't mean that even if Mbappe continues to get better and better, that Mbappe won't be able to be considered as his equal, or better.   Mane having a better "carreer" (when he is almost 7 years older - at his age he was still at Southampton) is laughable really - it is just a silly argument to compare an about to turn 31 year old, with a just turned 24 year old.

102 in 187 games vs 147 in 197 games in the league is not dissimilar considering the standard of the teams they were playing in.

20 in 49 vs 36 in 66 in international games is not dissimilar given the standards of the teams.

I see glaring similarities between them and do not think Owen would be far off the same numbers if he was surrounded by talent (Owen had the highest goals per game ratio during his time at Real Madrid but was out of favour with Madrid preferring their hero, Raul).

Owen's major injuries came in 2005 and then 2006, at which point his pace and reliability went, so to separate out his pace and his injuries misses the point. After that point, he was far less effective. As for his move to Newcastle, Owen had wanted to return to Liverpool who had bid for him but Real Madrid rejected that bid in favour of a Newcastle side who had in the last four years only finished outside the top 5 once, with a 3rd, 4th and 5th place finish in 3 of the 4 prior years, and they spent a significant amount of money that summer, a lot more than Liverpool for example and were only 1 point behind us when Owen got injured having scored 7 in 11.

I think overall you may be underestimating just how good Owen was early in his career and overrating Mbappe shown by your positioning of him ahead of Zidane and Ronaldinho. He simply has not got the talent to reach those levels, and is in reality exactly the sort of player to pick up similar injuries to Owen. Think about the injuries sustained by sprinters, and how they tend to peak far before they turn 30.

South American's will always tend to reach their career peak clubs later as they need to come over to Europe first and make an impression. And you were understating his position at that point. After the world cup in 2002 until around 2006, Ronaldinho was considered  one of the best player in the world, hitting his pomp at the age of 24.

As for the Mane comparison, it was just a benchmark to say, Mane has not had the most successful career ever, and Mbappe currently lags behind him. Obviously he will overtake him eventually given the time he has left, but that is some way off what the likes of Ronaldinho, Zidane, Kaka and Henry won.

I'm by no means saying he is a bad player, he is certainly top 10 in the world, but he has not shown himself to be the outright best by any means, and he is well off being considered in a conversation with the all-time greats.

[Coolie High]

Owen didn’t have the all round game Mbappe had despite him being a teenage phenom in his own right, and Mbappe doesn’t lag behind Mane at all.

[Ghost Town]

For context-free, pure statistical, everything has a linear relationship, 'because X, therefore definitely, unfailingly more X', age-predictive, breathless over-reaction, you can always trust football fans

[AndyMuller]

For context-free, pure statistical, everything has a linear relationship, 'because X, therefore definitely, unfailingly more X', age-predictive, breathless over-reaction, you can always trust football fans

Scottymuser is AI I’m convinced.

[mikey_LFC]

Owen didn’t have the all round game Mbappe had despite him being a teenage phenom in his own right, and Mbappe doesn’t lag behind Mane at all.

Didn’t say Mbappe lags behind Mane in anything other than success to date, with our Champions League win being the clincher.

I’m not convinced that Mbappe does have an all-round game though, to be honest. He’s very very good at his game but he’s hardly the sort of player who could drop deep and become a playmaker in his later career unless he seriously reinvents himself. Very rarely do you see him playing with his back to goal as part of the build up. His career prolonging role would have to be something similar to C.Ronaldo which I think is a potential route for him, but it’s hard to see him growing to be a much more effective player than he is now, given his age and the style of player he is, which would leave him some way short of some of the comparisons in here.

I’d love to see him develop further as at his best he’s a joy to watch, so I hope to be proven wrong, but I just don’t see him at the level that same have placed him at. Henry despite his earlier setbacks was a more all round player who could be involved in the build up more often, for example.

[Bend It Like Aurelio]

Didn’t say Mbappe lags behind Mane in anything other than success to date, with our Champions League win being the clincher.

I’m not convinced that Mbappe does have an all-round game though, to be honest. He’s very very good at his game but he’s hardly the sort of player who could drop deep and become a playmaker in his later career unless he seriously reinvents himself. Very rarely do you see him playing with his back to goal as part of the build up. His career prolonging role would have to be something similar to C.Ronaldo which I think is a potential route for him, but it’s hard to see him growing to be a much more effective player than he is now, given his age and the style of player he is, which would leave him some way short of some of the comparisons in here.

I’d love to see him develop further as at his best he’s a joy to watch, so I hope to be proven wrong, but I just don’t see him at the level that same have placed him at. Henry despite his earlier setbacks was a more all round player who could be involved in the build up more often, for example.

All the things you describe could all easily be used to describe Messi early on in his career. Players with prodigious talent adapt, but it is the talent that has to first move them forward.

Mbappe has shown his ability to carry the French national team on his back for two world cups already, and he’s just turned 23. Not even Messi has achieved that much at his age.

To worry about if Mbappe pans out at this stage in his career would be a ridiculous overagumentative suggestion of massive proportions. He’ll be fine.

[Scottymuser]

Didn’t say Mbappe lags behind Mane in anything other than success to date, with our Champions League win being the clincher.

I’m not convinced that Mbappe does have an all-round game though, to be honest. He’s very very good at his game but he’s hardly the sort of player who could drop deep and become a playmaker in his later career unless he seriously reinvents himself. Very rarely do you see him playing with his back to goal as part of the build up. His career prolonging role would have to be something similar to C.Ronaldo which I think is a potential route for him, but it’s hard to see him growing to be a much more effective player than he is now, given his age and the style of player he is, which would leave him some way short of some of the comparisons in here.

I’d love to see him develop further as at his best he’s a joy to watch, so I hope to be proven wrong, but I just don’t see him at the level that same have placed him at. Henry despite his earlier setbacks was a more all round player who could be involved in the build up more often, for example.

So you didn't see the WC final then - he put 3 balls in for team mates which were easy chances, which if KDB or Messi had made those passes everyone would be climaxing over.  Also, as I pointed out, he has LOADS of assists, both domestically and internationally - if that isn't the epitome of a more all round player than just a goal scorer I don't know what is.  If you compare him to Kane, say - before 20/21 season (when he had  already turned 27), Kane was an out and out goal poacher (in 6 full seasons, and some matches for Spurs in 13/14, 24 league assists so about 4 a season).  Mbappe has already got 23 *for France*, and 26 in the CL alone - let alone 63 in the league (he has been averaging almost TEN a season sionce he turned 17/18).  In fact the argument about his style of play reminds me of Salah - who the last 2 seasons has stepped back and created more for us, and I think Mbappe has already shown he would be able to do that in a few years to a similar degree.

Going back to a couple of your previous points also - Owen's 20 in 49 is not really "similar" to 33 in 66 - especially as significantly more of Mbappes goals have come in World Cups, European Cups, or Nations League (where the other teams have been much better than the teams Owen scored against in friendlies and qualifiers just due to how it is formatted) - Owen had 4 goals at 2 WCs, and 1 goal at a Euro, compared to 12 at 2 WCs including a hat trick in the final.

I also never said that he was better than Dinho or Zidane - I simply tried to say that you saying he *could never be* as good as them in the future was something I disagree with, and tried to show why I disagreed.

[mikey_LFC]

All the things you describe could all easily be used to describe Messi early on in his career. Players with prodigious talent adapt, but it is the talent that has to first move them forward.

Mbappe has shown his ability to carry the French national team on his back for two world cups already, and he’s just turned 23. Not even Messi has achieved that much at his age.

To worry about if Mbappe pans out at this stage in his career would be a ridiculous overagumentative suggestion of massive proportions. He’ll be fine.

Messi was leaps and bounds ahead of Mbappe at the same age. He was already considered in the conversation for greatest ever by many at that point.

To say Mbappe carried the French team on his back is a massive overstatement. In 2018 they were the best XI and squad at the tournament, and from the sounds of it (I didn't watch the World Cup) Mbappe was underwhelming for much of the knockout rounds this time round, putting in anonymous performances against England and Morocco for the most part. Even in the final it took him 80 minutes to get in the game, apparently.

I don't worry about his talent, but his skill set tends to be one associated with a shorter career, and so he will need to reinvent himself at some point if he is to prolong it.

So you didn't see the WC final then - he put 3 balls in for team mates which were easy chances, which if KDB or Messi had made those passes everyone would be climaxing over.  Also, as I pointed out, he has LOADS of assists, both domestically and internationally - if that isn't the epitome of a more all round player than just a goal scorer I don't know what is.  If you compare him to Kane, say - before 20/21 season (when he had  already turned 27), Kane was an out and out goal poacher (in 6 full seasons, and some matches for Spurs in 13/14, 24 league assists so about 4 a season).  Mbappe has already got 23 *for France*, and 26 in the CL alone - let alone 63 in the league (he has been averaging almost TEN a season sionce he turned 17/18).  In fact the argument about his style of play reminds me of Salah - who the last 2 seasons has stepped back and created more for us, and I think Mbappe has already shown he would be able to do that in a few years to a similar degree.

Going back to a couple of your previous points also - Owen's 20 in 49 is not really "similar" to 33 in 66 - especially as significantly more of Mbappes goals have come in World Cups, European Cups, or Nations League (where the other teams have been much better than the teams Owen scored against in friendlies and qualifiers just due to how it is formatted) - Owen had 4 goals at 2 WCs, and 1 goal at a Euro, compared to 12 at 2 WCs including a hat trick in the final.

I also never said that he was better than Dinho or Zidane - I simply tried to say that you saying he *could never be* as good as them in the future was something I disagree with, and tried to show why I disagreed.

As mentioned above, I did not watch the World Cup, but reading between the lines on reports of the games, he was not involved massively in the games, but appeared in moments, pointing to him being less of an all round player. Add to this is complete lack of contribution at the Euros. His assists come in the same way as his goals, with him baring down on goal because he rarely if ever plays with his back to goal. Don't get me wrong, he has aspects to his game that are rounded, and he is certainly more of an all round player then the likes of Haaland, but I don't believe he could work as a midfielder at a later point in his career, so when his pace goes he would be far more likely to become a between the posts striker.

Again the comparison between their different statistics needs to take into account that England were a poor side for much of Owen's time with England prior to his injury early on in the 2006 WC. He'd also by that age scored a wonder goal against Argentina in a WC (sound familiar) and scored an open-play hat-trick against a Germany side that would reach the WC final the following year. He was an outstanding world class talent.

I simply do not think he has the talent to match up against Ronaldinho or Zidane, which is no massive criticism as they are near to the top of an all time top players list. I do not actually see a player below 30 who currently looks like being in that conversation. Mbappe is the closest but I think he misses a certain.. je ne sais quoi.

[RyanBabel19]

Mbappe is a special talent. He's just turned 24 and he's 5 goals from being all time top world cup goalscorer (as he's shown, this can be hit in one world cup), 18 goals from being Frances all time top goalscorer, 11 goals from being PSGs all time top goalscorer.

He's 24 years old ffs, these are insane numbers for someone so young. 2 world cup finals and he's got 4 goals in them, insane!

Disappointed by the whole money situation at PSG but his talent is never in doubt in my opinion, I think he would be sublime in any league and there's this weird narrative developing suggesting his all round game is somehow limited, there aren't many things the kid cant do with the ball.

[Billy The Kid]

Can't see him ending up anywhere other than Man City

[Coolie High]

Messi was leaps and bounds ahead of Mbappe at the same age. He was already considered in the conversation for greatest ever by many at that point.

To say Mbappe carried the French team on his back is a massive overstatement. In 2018 they were the best XI and squad at the tournament, and from the sounds of it (I didn't watch the World Cup) Mbappe was underwhelming for much of the knockout rounds this time round, putting in anonymous performances against England and Morocco for the most part. Even in the final it took him 80 minutes to get in the game, apparently.

I don't worry about his talent, but his skill set tends to be one associated with a shorter career, and so he will need to reinvent himself at some point if he is to prolong it.

As mentioned above, I did not watch the World Cup, but reading between the lines on reports of the games, he was not involved massively in the games, but appeared in moments, pointing to him being less of an all round player. Add to this is complete lack of contribution at the Euros. His assists come in the same way as his goals, with him baring down on goal because he rarely if ever plays with his back to goal. Don't get me wrong, he has aspects to his game that are rounded, and he is certainly more of an all round player then the likes of Haaland, but I don't believe he could work as a midfielder at a later point in his career, so when his pace goes he would be far more likely to become a between the posts striker.

Again the comparison between their different statistics needs to take into account that England were a poor side for much of Owen's time with England prior to his injury early on in the 2006 WC. He'd also by that age scored a wonder goal against Argentina in a WC (sound familiar) and scored an open-play hat-trick against a Germany side that would reach the WC final the following year. He was an outstanding world class talent.

I simply do not think he has the talent to match up against Ronaldinho or Zidane, which is no massive criticism as they are near to the top of an all time top players list. I do not actually see a player below 30 who currently looks like being in that conversation. Mbappe is the closest but I think he misses a certain.. je ne sais quoi.

Mbappe will be better than Zidane when all said and done, he’ll be competing with Platini as greatest French player of all time.

[Drinks Sangria]

Without wanting to praise Michael Owen, he’s top 5 teenagers I’ve ever seen in men’s senior football. People forget how good he was and forget largely how callow and poor we were pre-Houllier, then dour and conservative under Houllier.

Owen at 20 was better than all but a small handful of the modern games’ forwards.

Mbappe is clearly sensational but I see the comparison. I also don’t think Haaland is immune to his body falling apart. He has enough soft tissue injuries as is, never mind as he gets older. He’s a lot more explosive and bulky than the much wirier, slower Zlatan, who I don’t think is the most natural analogue to compare him to.

[Ghost Town]

Mbappe is a special talent. He's just turned 24 and he's 5 goals from being all time top world cup goalscorer (as he's shown, this can be hit in one world cup)

You're right! He might soon be as good as Miroslav Klose

Party time!

[I've been a good boy]

I hope he bangs in loads at the next World Cup. Seeing Klose as the all-time top scorer has always annoyed me.

[mikey_LFC]

Mbappe will be better than Zidane when all said and done, he’ll be competing with Platini as greatest French player of all time.

Platini and Zidane is definitely closer than a lot of people will care to admit, but I’d still give it to Zidane for the artistry. Mbappe needs to catch the likes of Ribery, Benzema and Henry. Even a few of Frenchmen could rank higher for the moment, they’ve had some wonderful players like Thuram, Desailly, Kante, Makelele and Cantona (as much I detest the guy).

[**** The Pain Away.]

Nunez is way better.

[Ghost Town]

I hope he bangs in loads at the next World Cup. Seeing Klose as the all-time top scorer has always annoyed me.

Both Klose and Mbappe have benefited from playing in sides which, during their tenure in the team, did/are doing well in the World Cup.

There's some proper shoddy thinking going on (not your post, generally), divorcing the player's achievements from their context. That Mbappe has 4 WC Final goals is cool, but he has them because he plays in a side which has got to two consecutive WC Finals and won two Penalties (at least; can't remember the first final in detail) within those two games.

It's good going, but if Salah or Haaland or Lewa or Ronaldo or Messi (or some others as well) had got to two consecutive WC Finals, in which they, as designated penalty takers, also had two penalties awarded, there's a good chance all of those would also be on a similar number of WC Final goals. Maybe even more

Great player, but also a player favoured by circumstances

[Flaccido Dongingo]

Anybody questioning the talent of Mbappe needs to seriously go and boil their own head, he's a phenomenal player.

[mikey_LFC]

Anybody questioning the talent of Mbappe needs to seriously go and boil their own head, he's a phenomenal player.

I don’t so anyone questioning his talent. Saying he’s not yet dining at the top table of footballers ever is hardly a criticism. That’s the level we are comparing him too, so any ‘flaws’ in his game are obviously not calling him rubbish, just saying in comparison to that level he’s not quite there yet. He’s still young and has time to reach that level, I don’t quite see him getting there, but I’ve been wrong before.

[Flaccido Dongingo]

I don’t so anyone questioning his talent. Saying he’s not yet dining at the top table of footballers ever is hardly a criticism. That’s the level we are comparing him too, so any ‘flaws’ in his game are obviously not calling him rubbish, just saying in comparison to that level he’s not quite there yet. He’s still young and has time to reach that level, I don’t quite see him getting there, but I’ve been wrong before.

OK fair enough, maybe if he moved to a more competitive league we'd see?, but you can only judge him on International and Champions league football and he's been outstanding in both.