Topic: PL: Leicester 3 vs 1 Liverpool Mo ‘67 Maddison ‘79 Vardy ‘81 Barnes ‘85

[Jm55]

That was always a stupid argument.

The reality is more simple: a lot of these referees just don't like us. And why would they, when most of them are from Manchester?

But there is something a bit more sinister this season, the shit we've had with decisions.

I don’t disagree with this but they didn’t like us a year ago either, they never liked us in the 90s, or the 00s.

What irks me is the shifting of the narrative ‘the PL want a more consistent title race’’ then it’s blatantly obvious that City are going to win the league, suddenly it’s a still a conspiracy but for a different reason. I let it bother me more than it should but it’s the same idiots scraping for semblance of fact to back up a failing point.

[darragh85]

Because he has tried his heart out and doesn’t have a clue why we are getting beaten game after game. He’s just lost his mother and that will affect him.

However nobody has said he is a quitter.

im sure he has a clue 

[na fir dearg]

The annoying thing about today is that I thought we were back to looking like our old selves a bit more, I saw Robertson making a marauding run up through the middle in the second half, Mane seemed to be running at players and beating them, Trent made some more forward runs as well

Then the second goal happens and you feel like that is just the last thing that is needed

Hear people saying "mentality midgets" but how often can keep absorbing the stuff that's going on without feeling that the whole world is against you, i don't think any team on the planet would have the mentality to put up with this season, even getting some players back from injury and you have the officials/VAR waiting to pounce at the first opportunity

[jillcwhomever]

I don’t disagree with this but they didn’t like us a year ago either, they never liked us in the 90s, or the 00s.

What irks me is the shifting of the narrative ‘the PL want a more consistent title race’’ then it’s blatantly obvious that City are going to win the league, suddenly it’s a still a conspiracy but for a different reason. I let it bother me more than it should but it’s the same idiots scraping for semblance of fact to back up a failing point.

It has all changed with what happened in the Derby, a lot of this kicked off after the club had a go at the referees. It got noticeably worse after then with our comments on Coote and it's felt almost personal at times, the way some decisions have been made.

[Racer]

I wholeheartedly agree with you. I actually said that the money spent on a decent CB might pay for itself in improved league placings and CL run. I never for a minute believed it might be the difference between keeping us in the top 4.

Being too tight to sign a CB on Jan the 1st was one of the most boneheaded moves FSG have made.

Completely agree. Most of us thought we’d have a CB through the door on 1 Jan when we lost Big Virgil and Joe. Banking on Matip and Fab for half the season was always flawed. All we can do is back the boys and hope we turn things around quickly. 

[El Lobo]

Because it’s a fucking shite system which isn’t fit for purposes and is in the control of a bunch of self serving shithouses.

I assume that’s just another honest mistake jm55?

[Fromola]

I don’t disagree with this but they didn’t like us a year ago either, they never liked us in the 90s, or the 00s.

What irks me is the shifting of the narrative ‘the PL want a more consistent title race’’ then it’s blatantly obvious that City are going to win the league, suddenly it’s a still a conspiracy but for a different reason. I let it bother me more than it should but it’s the same idiots scraping for semblance of fact to back up a failing point.

That's why I think this season is more sinister. It's outrageous what we've had to deal with. If it's not the referee it's VAR, if it's not VAR it's the ref.

Last season i'd dread seeing Martin Atkinson, Anthony Taylor, Lee Mason as referee. The usual names who clearly have it in for us and never give us a decision. Then that no mark Coote emerges. The problem is, it doesn't end there. We have to play in Europe now to get a referee to treat us half way fair.

Clearly, as I said, the title race argument is a daft one. Not least because we're clearly out the title race for weeks now and still getting fucked over.

[Avens]

What are we going to blame the ref or VAR on? The ref was giving a penalty but VAR over-ruled him. Their player was not offside and at best was level. Alisson should not let the shot beat him just because several of their players nearly got to the ball. Yes there was a push on Mane but we had enough chances to stop the goal.

The 2nd goal was due to a brain-fart from Alisson. No complaints for the 3rd even though Salah gave the ball away.

The main issue is that we don’t make enough chances. We bossed the game but what did we do with the ball?

Henderson was the only player who had a decent game and some may as well not turned up.

It was one of our performances from 5 or so years ago......plenty of possession but no cutting edge and too many mistakes.

How many mistakes did Leicester gift us?

Wondering if you've seen the screenshot that shows the frame that was chosen to measure that offside. The ball hasn't left Maddison's foot yet. If the next frame was chosen, Amaty would've been offside.

[Reeves]

It has all changed with what happened in the Derby, a lot of this kicked off after the club had a go at the referees. It got noticeably worse after then with our comments on Coote and it's felt almost personal at times, the way some decisions have been made.

I've not thought about this but I think you're right. Do you think the refs association or whatever the fuck they're called, took against us after that?

They fucking deserved it though! That Coote decision was diabolical, but maybe they group together like fans. Sticking up for one another.....

[Fromola]

It has all changed with what happened in the Derby, a lot of this kicked off after the club had a go at the referees. It got noticeably worse after then with our comments on Coote and it's felt almost personal at times, the way some decisions have been made.

It would explain it because there's definitely something sinister. I've never known anything like it in this country before. The problem is, we're fair game because other fans hate us anyway and most pundits don't like us either or were happy to see us dropping points after two seasons of not doing so. Plus the fact Riley and his cabal are answerable to nobody but themselves.

It's only when Oliver is in charge (who fucked us over in the derby himself) that I feel we may actually get any kind of decision. I take Oliver in the Derby as an honest mistake, where the VAR that day was outright match fixing.

Atkinson and Taylor have always fucked us over, but not every single one of the fuckers. In a normal season if i see Atkinson, for example, is ref I know we're getting fucked over. I don't even bother to check anymore.

[Samie]

Can we all ignore the tin foil hat whacko's for fucks sakes.

[didi shamone]

What are we going to blame the ref or VAR on? The ref was giving a penalty but VAR over-ruled him. Their player was not offside and at best was level. Alisson should not let the shot beat him just because several of their players nearly got to the ball. Yes there was a push on Mane but we had enough chances to stop the goal.

The 2nd goal was due to a brain-fart from Alisson. No complaints for the 3rd even though Salah gave the ball away.

The main issue is that we don’t make enough chances. We bossed the game but what did we do with the ball?

Henderson was the only player who had a decent game and some may as well not turned up.

It was one of our performances from 5 or so years ago......plenty of possession but no cutting edge and too many mistakes.

How many mistakes did Leicester gift us?

You've brushed over the clear foul on Mane that could have been a  yellow card and definitely should have led to a free kick for us. The ref was looking straight at it. Second goal never happens. Much worse mistake from the ref than Beckers.

The first was offside. The third was a sloppy goal from a team in shock and low on confidence, but it doesn't happen without two massive "mistakes" from the officials.

We rightly called out our keeper for two mistakes against city so I don't see whats wrong with giving stick to the officials for their horror showing today.

[RyanBabel19]

The Derby was a huge turning point

After we called them out on that we were fucked, didn't matter if we were right. That Pickford challenge was fuck all and Kabak got booked today for daring to touch a Leicester player.

[Fromola]

And if the ref can give a pen for their lad's dive, why didn't he give Salah a pen? I don't want to see either given really but if you give one you need to give the other.

[stockdam]

Wondering if you've seen the screenshot that shows the frame that was chosen to measure that offside. The ball hasn't left Maddison's foot yet. If the next frame was chosen, Amaty would've been offside.

No I haven’t seen that and I was basing my decision on the frame they chose. I have said however that it does depend on subjective things like where the ball was kicked and which point of the body is chosen. VAR needs to include a margin of uncertainty and to favour the attacking team. We shouldn’t be arguing over inches as VAR cannot resolve to inches (yes the computer can but the subjective decisions cannot). It would benefit us more if the attacking team was given the benefit rather than trying to resolve to inches.

[gemofabird]

Wondering if you've seen the screenshot that shows the frame that was chosen to measure that offside. The ball hasn't left Maddison's foot yet. If the next frame was chosen, Amaty would've been offside.

Can you share screenshot if possible please

[Fromola]

The Derby was a huge turning point

After we called them out on that we were fucked, didn't matter if we were right. That Pickford challenge was fuck all and Kabak got booked today for daring to touch a Leicester player.

I wonder how the higher ups at the club will react when it costs the club 100 million quid in lost revenue with CL gone/lower league placings.

You have to wonder if there's also a double punishment for the club coming out regarding TV rights/Super League-talk.

Nothing will change until the Atkinson/Taylor/Mason generation retire and Manc Riley isn't tasked with bringing through the next crop.

[lamonti]

It has all changed with what happened in the Derby, a lot of this kicked off after the club had a go at the referees. It got noticeably worse after then with our comments on Coote and it's felt almost personal at times, the way some decisions have been made.

The refereeing is at this stage deeply deeply crooked.

[Saul Goodman]

Wondering if you've seen the screenshot that shows the frame that was chosen to measure that offside. The ball hasn't left Maddison's foot yet. If the next frame was chosen, Amaty would've been offside.

I don't think many people are arsed with the VAR discussions anymore but this shouldn't be subjective. The video should be 3D modeled by a computer that is able to tell what frame to choose and use the 3D model to give the offside. You can then also show this 3D model in the replay so there is no ambiguity. It boggles my mind that the current state of the technology being used seems to be some guy trying to stop the frame at the right place then drawing lines on images to determine the offside.

[Fromola]

The refereeing is at this stage deeply deeply crooked.

They've just realised they can get away with it. The punditry is piss poor and concentrates on other narratives. The media in general in this country we know how they are.

The only real pressure on a ref this season was when Mike Dean fucked over Southampton the other week. We're fair game and the ref's know it. If there's no blowback then there's no incentive to stop screwing us.

[Avens]

No I haven’t seen that and I was basing my decision on the frame they chose. I have said however that it does depend on subjective things like where the ball was kicked and which point of the body is chosen. VAR needs to include a margin of uncertainty and to favour the attacking team. We shouldn’t be arguing over inches as VAR cannot resolve to inches (yes the computer can but the subjective decisions cannot). It would benefit us more if the attacking team was given the benefit rather than trying to resolve to inches.

I agree with this argument. The fact that it's impossible to tell the correct frame that the ball leaves the passer's foot means that measuring offsides by millimetres is fundamentally flawed so a margin of error has to be allowed.

However, that isn't the rule as it stands and if it was wouldn't the margin of error go with the onfield linesmam's decision? Also, in this case it should be much easier to get the right frame as it's a dead ball situation.

[Avens]

Can you share screenshot if possible please

Here it is on Twitter. Check this out then get the fuck off Twitter is my advice!

https://twitter.com/Pippa35/status/1360618354864771084?s=19

[Avens]

I don't think many people are arsed with the VAR discussions anymore but this shouldn't be subjective. The video should be 3D modeled by a computer that is able to tell what frame to choose and use the 3D model to give the offside. You can then also show this 3D model in the replay so there is no ambiguity. It boggles my mind that the current state of the technology being used seems to be some guy trying to stop the frame at the right place then drawing lines on images to determine the offside.

It seems like nobody is talking about the issue in mainstream media. They all keep looking at them and talking about how harsh it is when an armpit is deemed offside but then saying things like "well the line has to be somewhere" or "it's so tight but it is offside" when the truth is offside is entirely dependent on the split second that the ball leaves the player's foot and they have never had a consistent way of determining that.

We've had so many of these tight ones go against us but I'll use the Son one that went our way as an example. If the frame before the one that was used was the one that was chosen he'd have been onside. Instead, they measure to the millimetre whether his toe is ahead of the defender and that is the factual decision. All the pundits say yep, you're either onside or you're offside and he was just offside. But if the frame before that was chosen they'd all be saying, wow so tight but he's stayed just onside. I haven't seen anyone analyse the selection of the frame and it needs to be talked about.

[Always_A_Red]

Net spend in the last 5 years.....

1. Man City - £601m
2. Man Utd - £484m
3. Arsenal - £267m
4. Everton - £225m
5. Brighton - £214m
6. Wolves - £205m
7. West Ham - £187m
8. Bournemouth FFS!! - £176m
9. Villa - £166m
10. Watford - £125m
11. Leicester - £124m
12. Newcastle - £122m
13. Chelsea - £115m
14. Liverpool - £107m

I said a few week ago that we have overachieved in the last few years and we have. Klopp has got us to the point where we are regarded as one of the best sides in Europe and we're being investing less into our squad than fucking Bournemouth, Watford & Everton!

5 years ago City's squad was FAR better than ours. Since then, they have invested £500m MORE than us NET.

Is it any wonder that when we get a few injuries our performances go to shit?

[Fromola]

Net spend in the last 5 years.....

1. Man City - £601m
2. Man Utd - £484m
3. Arsenal - £267m
4. Everton - £225m
5. Brighton - £214m
6. Wolves - £205m
7. West Ham - £187m
8. Bournemouth FFS!! - £176m
9. Villa - £166m
10. Watford - £125m
11. Leicester - £124m
12. Newcastle - £122m
13. Chelsea - £115m
14. Liverpool - £107m

I said a few week ago that we have overachieved in the last few years and we have. Klopp has got us to the point where we are regarded as one of the best sides in Europe and we're being investing less into our squad than fucking Bournemouth, Watford & Everton!

5 years ago City's squad was FAR better than ours. Since then, they have invested £500m MORE than us NET.

Is it any wonder that when we get a few injuries our performances go to shit?

It makes a big difference with depth. It's also why we've had to go to bat with the same players every week and the likes of the full backs and the front three are feeling the strain after several seasons.

Good draws aside there's a reason City and Chelsea dominate the domestic cups every year. They've got the strongest squads because of how much they've spent on them. When we make a lot of changes we tend to fall short.

[Ratboy3G]

Net spend in the last 5 years.....

1. Man City - £601m
2. Man Utd - £484m
3. Arsenal - £267m
4. Everton - £225m
5. Brighton - £214m
6. Wolves - £205m
7. West Ham - £187m
8. Bournemouth FFS!! - £176m
9. Villa - £166m
10. Watford - £125m
11. Leicester - £124m
12. Newcastle - £122m
13. Chelsea - £115m
14. Liverpool - £107m

I said a few week ago that we have overachieved in the last few years and we have. Klopp has got us to the point where we are regarded as one of the best sides in Europe and we're being investing less into our squad than fucking Bournemouth, Watford & Everton!

5 years ago City's squad was FAR better than ours. Since then, they have invested £500m MORE than us NET.

Is it any wonder that when we get a few injuries our performances go to shit?

Is every thread the net spend thread???

[Always_A_Red]

Is every thread the net spend thread???

God knows? I've only been on this one 

Do you not like the narrative that we're trying to compete with two hands tied behind our back?

[MoSzizlak]

Is every thread the net spend thread???

Net yet.....

[Gray Hamster]

I don't think many people are arsed with the VAR discussions anymore but this shouldn't be subjective. The video should be 3D modeled by a computer that is able to tell what frame to choose and use the 3D model to give the offside. You can then also show this 3D model in the replay so there is no ambiguity. It boggles my mind that the current state of the technology being used seems to be some guy trying to stop the frame at the right place then drawing lines on images to determine the offside.

Ive mentioned this a number of times to friends. I’m absolutely amazed that there is not more technological intervention, to put an end to these monkeys drawing their lines and trying to freeze frames. Crazy amount of money in football, yet we have the crudest of systems in use.

[Ratboy3G]

God knows? I've only been on this one 

Do you not like the narrative that we're trying to compete with two hands tied behind our back?

No, because its bullshit.

[MH41]

Can you share screenshot if possible please

Look at this one. Look where bobby's foot is....... shocking decision.

[Always_A_Red]

No, because its bullshit.

Financial spend in comparison to our rivals is bullshit? Ok 

[Eeyore]

Financial spend in comparison to our rivals is bullshit? Ok 

Ratboy3G wants us to think of how well a Club is run. Things like spending in comparison to our rivals. Results or even League positions are irrelevant the key metric is how well run a club is.

When you look at centre backs for instance whether they can play in our system is a tad irrelevant. The only criteria is whether they were a bargain or not.

[LiverBirdKop]

I feel awful for Jurgen and the boys - pretty f-ing pissed off too(at the bean counters). So much shit going against them.

[andy07]

Our players need to wake up and understand who they are playing for and what is expected of them.  We can talk all day and night about investment, tactics and referees but quite simply the players at our disposal are more than good enough to have secured three points against the relegation fodder that have outwitted us this season.   Sadly they have been found wanting and we are in a real
battle for top 4.

[kasperoff]

Look at this one. Look where bobby's foot is....... shocking decision.

You can't tell from that. The ball also looks like it's left it's foot in that frame. It also looks like Mane is playing them all on. The angle of that shot is all wrong.

I'd do yourself a favour and move on. You'll send yourselves mental. If the club aren't willing to stick up for themselves then we are pissing in the wind.

[Chris~]

Ratboy3G wants us to think of how well a Club is run. Things like spending in comparison to our rivals. Results or even League positions are irrelevant the key metric is how well run a club is.

When you look at centre backs for instance whether they can play in our system is a tad irrelevant. The only criteria is whether they were a bargain or not.

Yes results like winning the league, champions league, another Chmapions league final, another 90+ point season 83 wins out of 114 league games over 3 seasons. All results we now ignore as they happened over 6 months ago (but we will also select arbitrary cut offs to like summer 2019 to talk about net spend)

[Ratboy3G]

Financial spend in comparison to our rivals is bullshit? Ok 

Your question was "Do you not like the narrative that we're trying to compete with two hands tied behind our back?"

My answer was "No, because its bullshit"

In case you misunderstood

[Ratboy3G]

Ratboy3G wants us to think of how well a Club is run. Things like spending in comparison to our rivals. Results or even League positions are irrelevant the key metric is how well run a club is.

When you look at centre backs for instance whether they can play in our system is a tad irrelevant. The only criteria is whether they were a bargain or not.

Al likes to answer on my behalf but completely miss the point to push his own narrative. I suspect he wants sugar daddy owners, but we all know for a fact he loves high jacking threads as we all see it happening.

[Ratboy3G]

Yes results like winning the league, champions league, another Chmapions league final, another 90+ point season 83 wins out of 114 league games over 3 seasons. All results we now ignore as they happened over 6 months ago (but we will also select arbitrary cut offs to like summer 2019 to talk about net spend)

Apparently it was all just a dream, along with the stadium redevelopment and the new training ground.