Author Topic: The Murder of George Floyd and Black Lives Matter.  (Read 258022 times)

Offline rafathegaffa83

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Re: Civil unrest in America
« Reply #320 on: June 1, 2020, 05:19:31 pm »
@edokeefe
MORE: Trump tells governors: "You’ve got to arrest people, you have to track people, you have to put them in jail for 10 years and you’ll never see this stuff again," per audio obtained by @CBSNews

One person listening in on the call describes the president's words and tone as "unhinged."

Par for the course.  Straight of the strongman playbook

Offline Machae

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Re: Civil unrest in America
« Reply #321 on: June 1, 2020, 05:20:56 pm »
Zuckerberg is such a coward, hiding behind freedom of speech when Facebok have repeatedly taken down other less controversial topics in the past.

Facebook staff anger over Trump post

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-52880151

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Re: Civil unrest in America
« Reply #322 on: June 1, 2020, 05:21:17 pm »
I'm not sure what you're saying here. The LA riots lasted for six days and were responsible for the deaths of dozens of people in addition to entire neighbourhoods being decimated. This unrest is has been going on two days so far and the destruction level is nowhere near. If you're referring to the nationwide nature of it, a more direct comparison would be the wave of riots that took place across American cities in 1967 and '68. The ones that were followed by the election of a right-wing Republican government and a pro-segregation candidate winning five states.

I mean, no one is actually explaining how rioting is going to help the cause against police brutality. Especially since the far more likely result is what we're already seeing: the police being given more powers to quell unrest.

Well it depends if you're asking how it helps if you're working within the current environment or not.

If you're assuming that the rioting and the civil unrest burns out and the status quo returns post rioting then what you hope for is that this serves as a reminder to those within law enforcement, and the governing of it, that the people can and will revolt if you fuck them over.

So they hopefully fuck them over...less.

Less police officers want to risk being the most hated man in America when being asked to carry out their duties so they correct their behaviours.

Those who run cities and are community leaders don't want their communities laid waste to in the ways that we've seen people readily willing to do so and so policing attitudes change as a result of a top down message of "look everyone has a camera phone now and even if we dont care about recruiting racists, its not very cost effective for us to continue having to deal with your being racist and the fallout it causes...try to kill less black people".

Or perhaps candidates emerge who want to work within the current power structures inspired by correcting these mistakes and reforming from the inside. There's plenty of politically engaged smart young people in those crowds.

OR

If there's no burn out and the revolt is sustained enough, focused enough, large scale enough then who knows how far it can go. You can stop asking/hoping for reform and instead demand it or force it.

Demand legislation around police recruitment, training, tactics, reviews, prosecutions because if you don't we wont stop and *this* won't stop.

Offline rafathegaffa83

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Re: Civil unrest in America
« Reply #323 on: June 1, 2020, 05:23:17 pm »
More soothing words from Dear Leader in a time of crisis

Ed O'Keefe@edokeefe
JUST IN: President Trump unloads on the nation's governors on a call, calls on them to step up enforcement: "You have to dominate, if you don’t dominate you’re wasting your time. They’re going to run over you, you’re going to look like a bunch of jerks. You have to dominate."

Kevin Robillard@Robillard
Trump is now telling the governors they should pass laws criminalizing the burning of the American flag. “We have a different court. It’s time to review that again,” Trump said, according to a source. “If you wanted to try a very powerful anti-flag burning law, we’ll back you.”

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Re: Civil unrest in America
« Reply #324 on: June 1, 2020, 05:27:12 pm »
I understand we have American posters on here but what I don't understand is why so many UK posters seem to care so vehemently about this issue? I'm not telling anyone how to feel but looking at the relevant threads - why is this so important yet the situation in Hong Kong isn't? When on paper one seems like a drop in the ocean and the other has huge ramifications to the larger political landscape - not to mention it's a former colony we still have ties with.

I see people up in arms about Trump labelling ANTIFA as terrorists while China has literally passed legislation which enables them to classify Hong Kong protesters as terrorists and deploy the army to deal with them.

If we had similar issues with race related police brutality here I'd be less inquisitive, I'm sure some will say we do but I don't think they're remotely comparable.
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Re: Civil unrest in America
« Reply #325 on: June 1, 2020, 05:27:25 pm »
Quote
The Kremlin has confirmed Pres Trump and Putin spoke today, per @Reuters

@HelenKennedy

Was Trump’s call telling the governors to crack down harder on protesters before or after his check-in call this morning with Putin? I bet it was after.
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Re: Civil unrest in America
« Reply #326 on: June 1, 2020, 05:29:09 pm »
More soothing words from Dear Leader in a time of crisis

Ed O'Keefe@edokeefe
JUST IN: President Trump unloads on the nation's governors on a call, calls on them to step up enforcement: "You have to dominate, if you don’t dominate you’re wasting your time. They’re going to run over you, you’re going to look like a bunch of jerks. You have to dominate."

Kevin Robillard@Robillard
Trump is now telling the governors they should pass laws criminalizing the burning of the American flag. “We have a different court. It’s time to review that again,” Trump said, according to a source. “If you wanted to try a very powerful anti-flag burning law, we’ll back you.”


Reminds me of that Simpsons episode with the 'Amendment to Be' song. It was funny then, not so much now.
We have to change from doubter to believer. Now.

Offline Cpt_Reina

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Re: Civil unrest in America
« Reply #327 on: June 1, 2020, 05:39:27 pm »
I understand we have American posters on here but what I don't understand is why so many UK posters seem to care so vehemently about this issue? I'm not telling anyone how to feel but looking at the relevant threads - why is this so important yet the situation in Hong Kong isn't? When on paper one seems like a drop in the ocean and the other has huge ramifications to the larger political landscape - not to mention it's a former colony we still have ties with.

I see people up in arms about Trump labelling ANTIFA as terrorists while China has literally passed legislation which enables them to classify Hong Kong protesters as terrorists and deploy the army to deal with them.

If we had similar issues with race related police brutality here I'd be less inquisitive, I'm sure some will say we do but I don't think they're remotely comparable.

The fact that it's America just puts it front and centre, its nothing to do with caring less about the people of Hong Kong. But when the media, the pop culture, the culture in general you consume is western, english speaking, even as far as American centric then American issues are just going to resonate more.

People follow American celebrities on social media, they follow the american president and american politics, they consume America in ways which they dont for Hong Kong, or Kashmir, or North Korea etc and so it's just higher on their radar.

Nobody here is a global political commentator, hell even the news breaks things down by region rather than expecting one person to be fully abreast of and informed on all the political goings on worldwide.

Online Sheer Magnetism

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Re: Civil unrest in America
« Reply #328 on: June 1, 2020, 05:43:23 pm »
The rioting is not going to help, but when you are backed into a corner and you don't know what else to do, in that moment, and you are trying to get people to actually pay attention to whats going on, it's an  understandable reaction

LA riots were LA specific as well, not nation wide, not to this extent .
Everyone knows what's going on - there have been dozens of these incidents over the years. It isn't a matter of awareness, the root of this is a difference in attitudes. There are people who viewed that video and thought it was a shame, but that the officer was just trying to do his job. That the streets are a dangerous place and the police are the only people standing between the law abiding and violent criminals. The fact George Floyd wasn't a violent criminal is almost irrelevant in this case, the important thing is that he was one of 'them' and the cop was one of 'us'.

This is essentially a long-rooted attitude that has existed for a long time in the US and is exacerbated by a culture that still reveres the wild west and action films. It goes beyond basic racism to a good guy vs bad guy dynamic where the cop is always the good guy and violence is justified to 'clean up the streets' (though the fact that so much black pop culture in the past 30 years has centred on a ghetto/streets aesthetic almost certainly helps anchor that to a racial dynamic*). Looting as part of anti-police protests solidify that binary in people's minds, which is a large part of why I think they're ultimately harmful. These are attitudes that need to be tackled at their source, but how would you even begin to do that?

Ideally there needs to be pressure on Democratic politicians to bring in a bill that will turn police brutality cases over to an independent committee and make their rulings legally binding; ensure the guilty are prosecuted in courts where the offence takes place (this was a major factor in the Rodney King acquittals); permanently ban any officer being found guilty of brutality from holding any police rank; and ban military grade weapons and civil asset forfeiture, as part of a wider range of reforms that would also involve overhauling the court system at a local level. If it was at all possible I'd advocate removing local sheriff elections too. But I suspect root and branch reform of the police in the US would be very difficult if not impossible because police forces tend to operate at county, city and state level and the police union is notoriously strong.

EDIT: *I don't want that to sound as if I hold black culture responsible for that dynamic, simply saying that a lot of the black culture that has been successful in mainstream America in recent years plays into it, even if it's intended as a protest against it. How much of that is down to existing attitudes, or what art gets promoted over others by the mainstream media, is an open-ended question.
« Last Edit: June 1, 2020, 06:04:37 pm by Sheer Magnetism »

Offline davidlpool1982

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Re: Civil unrest in America
« Reply #329 on: June 1, 2020, 05:47:19 pm »
the US political system has major flaws, particularly as it's only a two party system. there's also the issue of gerrymandering [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gerrymandering] just a reference for those who aren't aware of it.

Again, this is easy to say from Liverpool and I'm only going on what I have self taught about America, I'm more than happy to be corrected. That being said, my two cents in non flowing, all over the place train of thought:

1) The founders/forefathers/whatever wanted the status quo. They only wanted to leave the UK rule. You just need to look at the systems set up by them to see that. The three equal branches of government are meant to act as a counter balance to power, but in reality it just creates a counter balance to actual change. Obviously it's been good in certain times (a completely unfettered Trump is frightening) but at the same time it means opportynity to change becomes lost in political mires. I've heard of people voting opposite parties down the ballot just to check the power of the person they voted for President. I mean, some of the founding fathers didn't want political parties, a few especially warned against allowing 2 dominant parties (and have been proven pretty much right, same in the UK). The Deification of the Founding Fathers by huge swathes of the country (and taught in schools) makes actual changes to the systems put in place almost impossible. You can hold out hope for change at the ballot box and sometimes, slow change does come through. But then the other side gets in power and undoes that slow change. The Status quo remains. What the Trump admin has also done is show how much of US institutions is run on goodwill and the honour system. He has no honour and either does Mitch McConnell. Any new admin that comes in needs to start putting laws behind some of those goodwill mechanisms.

 2) I'm not a huge Hip Hop man (Punk and Hardcore kids for life!), but 2 pac was right: The US wasn't ready for a Black president. I don't mean this as a slight against Obama as a man. You can never take away from him being the 1st Black President or the absolute emotion in the winning night in 2008 or at his swearing in later in January 2009. But a lot of what you see now in parts of the US is a reaction to it. Obama spoke of hope and change, but he was a very centrist politician. He was as much in thrawl to Wall St as an republican was. But the sight of a black man in the White House absolutely set a load of nutters off. The white supremecists started to organise, they raised up the politicans and spokesmen they wanted. Fox News, already filled with white supremecists, went into overdrive. From Terrorist fist bumps, tanned suits, Dijon mustard to everything he did being a slight against capitalism and american pride, values and the dreaded C word: Communism. Trump is a snapback to black america from parts of white america for every getting ideas above their station again.

3) Society works on unwritten contracts. When one group sees that contract spat on and torn up constantly, they aren't going to fulfil their end of it. Why play by the rules when the rules are different for you and yours? But what we are seeing isn't just black america being angry, we are seeing other less well off parts of society leeching onto the anger and looting to use for their own release. You are seeing poor white people who feel marginalised using the opportunity to loot stuff they could never afford, you have anarchists using the opportunity to attack corporations and state pillars, you have criminals using the cover of the riots to their own ends. America is a tinderbox (as is the rest of the western world) due to COVID. People lost jobs, businesses and opportunities. They have been locked inside for 3 months, 100k of their fellow citizens died, there is grief and anger at how the situation has been fucked up by the federal government. Look how angry we were about Cummings and his trip. If there was a similar situation over here in the UK, the situation is absolutely there for riots here too.

4) This is more a personal opinion of something I've noticed than anything else. I hate corporations using this situation to grandstand. I don't need to know how Bratz dolls feel about the George Lloyd murder. Corporations exist to sell us shit or servies and actions are louder than words.  It makes me uncomfortable to see these companies talking out of one side of their mouth about standing by the black community but them their hiring practices and wages showing exactly how they feel about them.

Offline Mumm-Ra

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Re: Civil unrest in America
« Reply #330 on: June 1, 2020, 05:51:20 pm »
For anyone who didn't see:



https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/52875059

And then up pops a smiling Glen Johnson...

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Re: Civil unrest in America
« Reply #331 on: June 1, 2020, 05:52:18 pm »

Snip

4) This is more a personal opinion of something I've noticed than anything else. I hate corporations using this situation to grandstand. I don't need to know how Bratz dolls feel about the George Lloyd murder. Corporations exist to sell us shit or servies and actions are louder than words.  It makes me uncomfortable to see these companies talking out of one side of their mouth about standing by the black community but them their hiring practices and wages showing exactly how they feel about them.

That’s a very good post, and I completely echo your thoughts on the above. Saw this earlier which sums it up really.


Offline Gnurglan

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Re: Civil unrest in America
« Reply #332 on: June 1, 2020, 05:58:45 pm »
It's depressing to watch the countless of videos from the riots in America. I really don't get why people think looting local shops is the way to protest against police brutality. The likely reason is people are angry with many other things and the killing of Floyd was just the spark needed for things to get going. There are some good videos out there too. I liked the speech from the Atlanta mayor.

I understand we have American posters on here but what I don't understand is why so many UK posters seem to care so vehemently about this issue? I'm not telling anyone how to feel but looking at the relevant threads - why is this so important yet the situation in Hong Kong isn't? When on paper one seems like a drop in the ocean and the other has huge ramifications to the larger political landscape - not to mention it's a former colony we still have ties with.

I see people up in arms about Trump labelling ANTIFA as terrorists while China has literally passed legislation which enables them to classify Hong Kong protesters as terrorists and deploy the army to deal with them.

If we had similar issues with race related police brutality here I'd be less inquisitive, I'm sure some will say we do but I don't think they're remotely comparable.

Hong Kong is indeed an area to watch. We had mass protests there before the lockdowns. Same in France. The entire world seems to have gone crazy, but as always Trump's America is in the center of attention. HK may be the ones that have the most to lose, but that's better discussed in the dedicated thread.

        * * * * * *


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Offline Kashinoda

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Re: Civil unrest in America
« Reply #333 on: June 1, 2020, 06:07:07 pm »
The fact that it's America just puts it front and centre, its nothing to do with caring less about the people of Hong Kong. But when the media, the pop culture, the culture in general you consume is western, english speaking, even as far as American centric then American issues are just going to resonate more.

People follow American celebrities on social media, they follow the american president and american politics, they consume America in ways which they dont for Hong Kong, or Kashmir, or North Korea etc and so it's just higher on their radar.

Nobody here is a global political commentator, hell even the news breaks things down by region rather than expecting one person to be fully abreast of and informed on all the political goings on worldwide.

Hong Kong is indeed an area to watch. We had mass protests there before the lockdowns. Same in France. The entire world seems to have gone crazy, but as always Trump's America is in the center of attention. HK may be the ones that have the most to lose, but that's better discussed in the dedicated thread.


Fair responses, thank you. I have personal connections in Hong Kong which is why I'm more vested in what happens there. As you allude to China does have the benefit of not being lead by mid-card WWE Wrestler with a shit gimmick so they get on with despicable things rather quietly.
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Offline Cpt_Reina

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Re: Civil unrest in America
« Reply #334 on: June 1, 2020, 06:12:12 pm »
Quote
.@JoeBiden says in first 100 days of his administration he will set up police oversight board @CBSNews

https://twitter.com/BoKnowsNews/status/1267481301600403460

Now, the cynic in me says these are empty words of a man looking to get elected to office, but if you're less of a pessimist you can look to this as proof that the large scale discontent and actions undertaken are forcing a narrative and putting things on agendas.

Biden seemed to be taking the black vote for granted when interviewing with Charlamagne just days before the George Floyd murder

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KOIFs_SryHI

Would Biden be making this noise without the rioting and civil disobedience?

You tell me (no).


Online Dench57

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Re: Civil unrest in America
« Reply #335 on: June 1, 2020, 06:19:50 pm »
And then up pops a smiling Glen Johnson...

 :D
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Re: Civil unrest in America
« Reply #336 on: June 1, 2020, 06:29:05 pm »
Sure there's progress, but that progress isn't enough. In this instance, changing the police departments, is not something that should take another 70 years.

There are 17,985 U.S. police agencies in the United States which include City Police Departments, County Sheriff's Offices, State Police/Highway Patrol and Federal Law Enforcement Agencies.

They all have their own guidelines.

And State laws.
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Offline Mumm-Ra

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Offline FlashingBlade

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Re: Civil unrest in America
« Reply #338 on: June 1, 2020, 06:43:50 pm »
I think the reason why what's happening in the USA dominates the news/responses more than say Hong Kong...and many other anti democratic /horrible things in other countries is simply that since WII America has dominated the world Economically Cultrally amd Politically....what happens in the US resonates around the world unlike any other country...so now we have this terrible situation  making the world sit up and take notice....unlike other terrible things happening around the world tight now.

I'm old enough to remember when I was young , America was the country that gave the world hope and prospect of an exciting future..then as you get older you see the corrupt nature of its society

There are many great things about America..but as a country built on violence and slavery..racism...it will never escape this state of obnoxious  unjustice racist divide which is a chasm in American society

When MLK was assinated there where riots in 125 cities in America far worse than now...but now its diffrent..the establishment is stronger and has enough white support to ride this out.

There was a time America lit the torch for an optimistic future....no more.



Offline Ray K

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Re: Civil unrest in America
« Reply #339 on: June 1, 2020, 06:58:36 pm »
Gregg Popovich:

Late last night my phone rang, and it was Coach Pop. He was ready to say something.

“The thing that strikes me is that we all see this police violence and racism and we’ve seen it all before but nothing changes. That’s why these protests have been so explosive. But without leadership and an understanding of what the problem is, there will never be change. And white Americans have avoided reckoning with this problem forever because it’s been our privilege to be able to avoid it. That also has to change.”

The question of leadership is weighing heavily on Popovich’s mind. At this critical moment, he is feeling despair over what he sees as a leadership void at the White House.

“It’s unbelievable. If Trump had a brain, even if it was 99 percent cynical, he would come out and say something to unify people. But he doesn’t care about bringing people together. Even now. That’s how deranged he is. It’s all about him. It’s all about what benefits him personally. It’s never about the greater good. And that’s all he’s ever been.”

Popovich then took a moment to imagine a different kind of leadership.

“It’s so what needs to be done. We need a president to come out and say simply that ‘Black Lives Matter.’ Just say those three words. But he won’t and he can’t. He can’t because it’s more important to him to mollify the small group of followers who validate his insanity. But it’s more than just Trump. The system has to change. I’ll do whatever I can do to help because that’s what leaders do. But he can’t do anything to put us on a positive path because he’s not a leader.

“It’s like what Lindsay Graham and Ted Cruz used to say when they had the courage to say it: He’s unfit. But they have chosen instead to be invisible and obsequious in the face of this carnage. In the end what we have is a fool in place of a president, while the person who really runs the country, Senator Mitch McConnell, destroys the United States for generations to come. McConnell has destroyed and degraded our judicial system. He has tried to destroy heath care. He’s destroyed the environment. He’s the master and Trump’s the stooge, and what’s funny is that Trump doesn’t even know it. Trump’s always wanted to be part of the in-group, but McConnell is an in-group of one and Trump plays the fool.”

Pop then makes his opinion that we have a uniquely mant presence in the White House.

“He’s not just divisive. He’s a destroyer. To be in his presence makes you die. He will eat you alive for his own purposes. I’m appalled that we have a leader who can’t say ‘Black Lives Matter.’ That’s why he hides in the White House basement. He is a coward. He creates a situation and runs away like a grade-schooler. Actually, I think it’s best to ignore him. There is nothing he can do to make this better because of who he is: a deranged idiot.”

I asked Coach Pop about the protests, about the raw anger that’s been produced by police violence, disease, and mass unemployment.

“They are very necessary, but they need to be organized better. It’s frustrating. When Dr. King did a protest, you knew when to show, when to come back the next day. But if you’re just organizing protests and everyone is coming and going in every direction, it doesn’t work that way. If it was nonviolent, they knew to be nonviolent, but this is muddled. More leadership would be very welcome so these incredible mass demonstrations can’t be used by people for other means. We can limit the bad, but only if things are organized better.”

I wanted to ask how they could “limit the bad” if the police were instigating violence, as reported, in so many locales. But before I could, Pop sighed deeply and said, “Again, we need change. The system has to change. I’m willing to do my part. That’s all I got. Bye, Dave.”

*****
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Offline deFacto please, you bastards

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Re: Civil unrest in America
« Reply #340 on: June 1, 2020, 07:02:24 pm »
There are 17,985 U.S. police agencies in the United States which include City Police Departments, County Sheriff's Offices, State Police/Highway Patrol and Federal Law Enforcement Agencies.

They all have their own guidelines.

And State laws.
There are laws that exist that allow people to be charged with murder when they commit such a crime. but that doesn't happen to police officers, they get fired or a leave of absence. You don't need to change the system entirely right now this moment, you need heads of police departments to stop abiding the ''Blue Shield'' and start abiding the actual law.

Case in point. When George Floyd was murdered, they fired the officer.

That was it.

he killed a man, an innocent man, and his consequence was getting fired.  Then they proceeded to say they didn't have enough evidence.

The only reason they arrested him later was due to the reaction from everywhere. But clearly they could and should have arrested him the same time they fired him.

They all abide by the Blue code, protecting their own, and not doing whats right. That has very little to do with laws,legislation,policies,etc...  This change can happen right now. Starting tomorrow if those people in said positions gave enough of a fck.
« Last Edit: June 1, 2020, 07:04:28 pm by deFacto »

Offline WhereAngelsPlay

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Offline deFacto please, you bastards

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Re: Civil unrest in America
« Reply #342 on: June 1, 2020, 07:31:05 pm »
The murdering officer, has had over 12 complaints in regards to brutal use of force. He has murdered several people already, one of them being a 21 year old in 2008, unarmed Black man. His punishment was a leave of absence.

There aren't 17,985 different ways of dealing with murder. There aren't 17,985 different policies for dealing with black men. The PD's and SO's have one way of dealing with Black men. That's evident.

In any profession, in any job, if any on of us had 12 complaints, we would have been terminated after the 2nd,3rd,4th,etc...

Systemic racism you can't change overnight.

You can't undo 500 years of injustice.

But you can definitely start imposing laws accordingly that already exist.

Offline Ron

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Re: Civil unrest in America
« Reply #343 on: June 1, 2020, 07:36:50 pm »
For anyone who didn't see:



https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/52875059
Virgil van Dijk is getting a lot of shit about this on Twitter.
https://twitter.com/VirgilvDijk/status/1267454825538695168
People are pointing to the Suarez shirt protest and there is even a post saying "@LFC a club that only remembers the past when it suits them #alwaythevictims "

Offline deFacto please, you bastards

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Re: Civil unrest in America
« Reply #344 on: June 1, 2020, 07:37:56 pm »
Virgil van Dijk is getting a lot of shit about this on Twitter.
https://twitter.com/VirgilvDijk/status/1267454825538695168
People are pointing to the Suarez shirt protest and there is even a post saying "@LFC a club that only remembers the past when it suits them #alwaythevictims "

Of course. Predictable as ever

Offline WhereAngelsPlay

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Re: Civil unrest in America
« Reply #345 on: June 1, 2020, 07:45:15 pm »
 ;D ;D

My cup, it runneth over, I'll never get my fill

Offline Kenny's Jacket

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Re: Civil unrest in America
« Reply #346 on: June 1, 2020, 07:49:43 pm »
Virgil van Dijk is getting a lot of shit about this on Twitter.
https://twitter.com/VirgilvDijk/status/1267454825538695168
People are pointing to the Suarez shirt protest and there is even a post saying "@LFC a club that only remembers the past when it suits them #alwaythevictims "

Its from Mancs of both persuaisions

A "Liverpool fan" tweeted back to Trent that white lives matter too.  What an ill educated prick.
As I've said before, the Full English is just the base upon which the Scots/Welsh/NI have improved upon. Sorry but the Full English is the worst of the British breakfasts.

Offline ljycb

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Re: Civil unrest in America
« Reply #347 on: June 1, 2020, 07:50:38 pm »
Flatmate’s just told me that 40% of police officers in the US have a history of domestic violence. That is grim. That’s self-reported too.
« Last Edit: June 1, 2020, 07:52:30 pm by ljycb »

Offline Macphisto80

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Re: Civil unrest in America
« Reply #348 on: June 1, 2020, 08:19:47 pm »
I understand we have American posters on here but what I don't understand is why so many UK posters seem to care so vehemently about this issue? I'm not telling anyone how to feel but looking at the relevant threads - why is this so important yet the situation in Hong Kong isn't? When on paper one seems like a drop in the ocean and the other has huge ramifications to the larger political landscape - not to mention it's a former colony we still have ties with.

I see people up in arms about Trump labelling ANTIFA as terrorists while China has literally passed legislation which enables them to classify Hong Kong protesters as terrorists and deploy the army to deal with them.

If we had similar issues with race related police brutality here I'd be less inquisitive, I'm sure some will say we do but I don't think they're remotely comparable.
Well, if there's one thing the two issues have in common, it's how colonial imperialism has fucked up another part of the world. The thing is, what I often see being neglected with the Hong Kong problem whenever people argue for it, is that Hong Kong is Chinese. It was never sovereign. The gobshites doing the rioting over there need to accept that.

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Re: Civil unrest in America
« Reply #349 on: June 1, 2020, 08:24:48 pm »
So, Liverpool players are kneeling?

Good to see them do it when Chinese were getting bashed throughout Europe as well? Hypocrites!!

And why the hell are Brits marching for American cultural issues? Amazing!!

Guys, I'm off to protest against rampant drug violence in Papue New Guinea, hope I get as much traction as well? What, Papua New Guineans don't matter as much as Blacks? RACIST!!


'Oppressed' people sticking it to the man  ::)

https://twitter.com/dbongino/status/1267238959718989828

Why aren't you posting on your main account?
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Re: Civil unrest in America
« Reply #350 on: June 1, 2020, 08:25:03 pm »
Oh God - have registrations re-opened?
"If you can't say anything nice, don't say nothing at all"  Thumper (1942)

Justice for the 96

I'm a Believer

Offline Macphisto80

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Re: Civil unrest in America
« Reply #351 on: June 1, 2020, 08:26:39 pm »
So, Liverpool players are kneeling?

Good to see them do it when Chinese were getting bashed throughout Europe as well? Hypocrites!!

And why the hell are Brits marching for American cultural issues? Amazing!!

Guys, I'm off to protest against rampant drug violence in Papue New Guinea, hope I get as much traction as well? What, Papua New Guineans don't matter as much as Blacks? RACIST!!
Who let this c*nt in?

Offline Ron

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Re: Civil unrest in America
« Reply #352 on: June 1, 2020, 08:27:03 pm »
So, Liverpool players are kneeling?

Good to see them do it when Chinese were getting bashed throughout Europe as well? Hypocrites!!

And why the hell are Brits marching for American cultural issues? Amazing!!

Guys, I'm off to protest against rampant drug violence in Papue New Guinea, hope I get as much traction as well? What, Papua New Guineans don't matter as much as Blacks? RACIST!!
Why are you such a dick ?
Cultural issue ?
It's not a cultural issue, it's a power abuse thing.

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Re: Civil unrest in America
« Reply #353 on: June 1, 2020, 08:29:46 pm »
Since when were new accounts allowed to post in the News forum?

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Re: Civil unrest in America
« Reply #354 on: June 1, 2020, 08:30:31 pm »

Why aren't you posting on your main account?

Who was he?
As I've said before, the Full English is just the base upon which the Scots/Welsh/NI have improved upon. Sorry but the Full English is the worst of the British breakfasts.

Offline Macphisto80

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Re: Civil unrest in America
« Reply #355 on: June 1, 2020, 08:31:52 pm »
Well, I dare say that will be his last post. What a cuntnuggit.

Offline Kenny's Jacket

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Re: Civil unrest in America
« Reply #356 on: June 1, 2020, 08:32:26 pm »
Because when I made these points in a respectful way I got banned.

So whats this is aid of?  Suicide by mod?
As I've said before, the Full English is just the base upon which the Scots/Welsh/NI have improved upon. Sorry but the Full English is the worst of the British breakfasts.

Offline exiledintheUSA

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Re: Civil unrest in America
« Reply #357 on: June 1, 2020, 08:32:59 pm »
Because when I made these points in a respectful way I got banned. I guess left nazis are now censoring every uncomfortable truth. Look at this forum, posters advocating for violence and 'burning down the USA' and 'looting shops is acceptable' is somehow let stand but everyone else is called  a 'racist' and a 'facist'.

Puke, civil war indeed!

Do fuck off.
Been all over the world but Anfield is still my home.

Offline Indomitable_Carp

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Re: Civil unrest in America
« Reply #358 on: June 1, 2020, 08:34:51 pm »
Just another point regarding looting. A lot of people are saying what is the looting of small businesses going to achieve in regards to advancing the position of black people in American society, or aiding the cause of Black Lives Matter etc. Obviously nothing.

But we are talking about maybe the most materialistic culture on earth here, with this rampant and frankly obscene consumerism combined with a huge and ever increasing wealth gap. Many countries experience looting in certain instances of civil breakdown, but it seems to be the go to in nearly all instances of US civil breakdown. People looting shops are probably not thinking "How is this going to serve the cause" (in fact seemingly many of them are not even African American in the first place). They are probably thinking (consciously or unconsciously) "what shit can I grab that I normally can't afford or wouldn't buy" or "oh shit if I don't grab it someone else will", after being bombarded by advertisements 24/7 since early childhood and being raised in a culture which relentlessly pushes the belief that material stuff is the route to happiness or satisfaction. The individual is king and dog eat dog is the way of social advancement.

My point being that while looting is not directly related to the cause of Black Lives Matter, nor does it serve it in any way, it is symbolic of another deeply fucked up and sick aspect of US and by-extension Western society and culture. Sitting on the side lines from the outside and saying people should stop looting is as pointless as saying people shouldn't be burning things, because it is not a particularly rational thought process. However it is one following this strain of materialism to its logical conclusion.

Trumps Presidency, and especially these riots, might just symbolise the tipping point in which US soft power is irreversibly damaged and the rest of the world starts to realise that this is not the kind of society or culture that we want to imitate anymore.
« Last Edit: June 1, 2020, 08:36:49 pm by Indomitable_Carp »

Offline Macphisto80

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Re: Civil unrest in America
« Reply #359 on: June 1, 2020, 08:35:23 pm »
Hold on a wee second. A turd needs flushed.