Topic: Takumi Minamino

[tubby]

Paradoxically though he uses his body really well - bit like Mane. If he develops physically he’ll be a hell of a pain. He already is in a buzzing wasp sort of way.

I'm not sure about that, Mane has insane strength for someone with his physique.  Agree on his... buzziness.

[rafathegaffa83]

That "needs to bulk up" assessment is often a cliche but it is true in this case. He just bounces off every player, as he is now he is far too lightweight.

Needs a full pre-season really. He's had prolonged stoppages due to Austrian winter break + COVID

[the first available number at the end, starting with 1]

Has the technical ability, but needs to anticipate defenders faster, when he has the ball.
Was dispossessed a few times, when Brighton defenders were on him, perhaps faster than he's used to.

We have plenty of players he can learn from, that are good at protecting the ball.
Salah, Mané and Keita for starters.

Still early days with him, so difficult to say how he'll adjust.

[the first available number at the end, starting with 1]

I'm not sure about that, Mane has insane strength for someone with his physique.  Agree on his... buzziness.

Both Mané and Salah have worked on strength for years and are in incredible shape.
Probably an area Minamino will be working on.

[royhendo]

I'm not sure about that, Mane has insane strength for someone with his physique.  Agree on his... buzziness.

The Salzburg game - he held off Hendo and Fabinho at the same time at one point. Balance and the ability to spin at pace is enough in some circumstances.

Tonight tho - he closes down time and again and then has his man closed, hanging out a leg Mane style, but the Brighton man bounces him off. That doesn’t happen with Mané.

[tubby]

The Salzburg game - he held off Hendo and Fabinho at the same time at one point. Balance and the ability to spin at pace is enough in some circumstances.

Tonight tho - he closes down time and again and then has his man closed, hanging out a leg Mane style, but the Brighton man bounces him off. That doesn’t happen with Mané.

Someone like David Silva is a good comparison, he's small, not particularly strong or quick, but an expert at getting his body between ball and player and drawing fouls if he's touched.

[duvva 💅]

What did he get 10 minutes at most tonight. Enough to show glimpses of his potential without having the time to really adapt and become part of the game. Think he’s gonna be just fine.

[classycarra]

What did he get 10 minutes at most tonight. Enough to show glimpses of his potential without having the time to really adapt and become part of the game. Think he’s gonna be just fine.

Exactly. And he showed brilliant movement to almost be in on goal (but showed his rustiness, sadly). Must have had ten minutes max with Mane and Salah together. Lets give him more minutes to see what he can do.

[JP!]

He needs a pre-season I feel. Saw him referred to as a buzzing wasp, can't help but recall 'float like an anchor, stings like a butterfly' from Ali's trainer towards the end of his career.  Don't think he's there yet physically, but I do think he's very talented.

[Black Bull Nova]

Relax, amazing what a difference a goal or two will make

Almost got it, getting closer

[McrRed]

I'm reminded of how utterly complicated Klopp's system is. Minamino knows how to press, we've seen him do it to great effect against us. But such is the complexity of The Rules That Must Be Followed that him buzzing about also vaguely resembled a headless chicken at times. It was just a cameo so I'm not worried or anything, just trying to keep in mind how long it takes to learn this system.

[MNAA]

At our current level, with the players that we have - we need and we have time to develop players so that they are truly ready to play at the level that we want them to be. With Robbo, Fabinho and Keita as clear case studies we should know by now that we should be patient and willing to wait for Minamino to be ready. Spouting nonsense now quite likely means that you may have to eat crow later

He will do fine

[Knight]

The more I see of him the more convinced I am that he’ll be a worthy Firmino understudy. Question is, can he also find minutes playing in place of Mané or Salah.

[Amatt]

The more I see of him the more convinced I am that he’ll be a worthy Firmino understudy. Question is, can he also find minutes playing in place of Mané or Salah.

Really?  That’s a massive statement to make. Prior to him signing for us I’d only seen him score against us at Anfield so had no preconceptions as to what he was like as a player. From what I’ve seen of him so far he’s not fit to lace Bobbys boots, never mind be an understudy to him. I’ve not been impressed with him at all to be honest.

[KillieRed]

I`m guessing people have already said this, but he needs to be in the Firmino role when RF is not available or being rested, and playing with Mane and Salah to show us what he can really offer.

[El Lobo]

I`m guessing people have already said this, but he needs to be in the Firmino role when RF is not available or being rested, and playing with Mane and Salah to show us what he can really offer.

Not particularly.

If we can get him to a level where he’s good out wide, but better in the middle, then surely that’s a good thing?

As with Ox and Neco, I’ll never understand people getting annoyed that we’re trying them in secondary positions now the league is already won.

[wige]

Not particularly.

If we can get him to a level where he’s good out wide, but better in the middle, then surely that’s a good thing?

As with Ox and Neco, I’ll never understand people getting annoyed that we’re trying them in secondary positions now the league is already won.

Slight difference here for me, We've seen Neco have (relatively) a lot of time in his primary position. Same with Ox.

So far I think Minamino has probably had the majority of his minutes off the right, and maybe left, flank.

From what I've seen of him - the Salzburg games in particular, but also the time with us, he doesn't quite have the acceleration and power to play that Mane/Salah role. He seems perfect to bring in for Bobby though, presses like a maniac, good touch and awareness, finds space really well. He just needs time, both to adapt to/understand the system and also to settle still.

I'd like to see him get the majority of his time through the middle for now so he can really get to grips with that. Once he's familiar, then yeah, would be brilliant if he was able to offer something from the wide spots too. I think Origi probably got the nod ahead of him vs Villa due to his record for us - his contributions over last 12 months deserved it. I think he might have lost that 4th spot to Minamino now though based on that performance. Was exactly as described on TAW I listened too, he's not just a level below the front three, he's a completely different player. Minamino isn't from what I've seen.

[fredfrop]

You can see his skill and great positioning, but as they said in the commentary thread last night, he does seem to bounce off the groks in defence. Perhaps he will be the player we finally see bulking up?

[harleydanger]

Id like to see him start, in Bobby’s position, with Salah and Mane beside and give him 90.

[Lidmanen]

It does seem unfair to be judging him when he came on in the 85th minute, but although he did good things and bad things, I was pleased to see how many chances we created when he was there. His movement with Salah and Mane seemed better, and he nearly got on the end of a Robbo cross too. In face, if it wasn't for crosses from others being slightly too close to the keeper against Palace and last night, he'd have two goals since the restart. Would like to see him start through the middle either against Burnley or Arsenal. He needs a goal like I need a haircut.

[Jookie]

You can see his skill and great positioning, but as they said in the commentary thread last night, he does seem to bounce off the groks in defence. Perhaps he will be the player we finally see bulking up?

I don't think bulking up is his primary issue.

We are looking at a talented player who has come in mid-season and then had to deal with difficult circumstances in terms of the covid-19 pandemic. From a personal point of view this may have made it hard to settle. More than that though, I'm not sure how much time he would have had to work on the tactical side of things with the coaching staff and other players.

We know Klopp operates a complex tactical system that requires all 11 players to be in sync. We've seen players who've come in from the same league, or higher quality leagues than the Austrian Bundelsiga, in the summer transfer window, have a pre-season and still primarily sit out the 1st few months of the season whilst they adapt. Easy to see how Minamino's situation is much more difficult than those and how he may benefit from a pre-season where he can learn the nuances of our tactical demands, maybe improve his physical condition and become more attuned to playing with new team mates.

Next season will be the time to properly assess him. I think the time on the training pitch and any minutes he gets in game time are giving him a head start for next season. One of his main hurdles to maximise his potential here might be the shortened pre-season this summer. I don't think this helps Minamino or any other signing we make. Not in terms of instant impact anyway.

[bornandbRED]

He’s clearly got lots of technical ability, and suits playing through the middle much more than out wide. Excited to see his progression next season.

[fredfrop]

I don't think bulking up is his primary issue.

We are looking at a talented player who has come in mid-season and then had to deal with difficult circumstances in terms of the covid-19 pandemic. From a personal point of view this may have made it hard to settle. More than that though, I'm not sure how much time he would have had to work on the tactical side of things with the coaching staff and other players.

We know Klopp operates a complex tactical system that requires all 11 players to be in sync. We've seen players who've come in from the same league, or higher quality leagues than the Austrian Bundelsiga, in the summer transfer window, have a pre-season and still primarily sit out the 1st few months of the season whilst they adapt. Easy to see how Minamino's situation is much more difficult than those and how he may benefit from a pre-season where he can learn the nuances of our tactical demands, maybe improve his physical condition and become more attuned to playing with new team mates.

Next season will be the time to properly assess him. I think the time on the training pitch and any minutes he gets in game time are giving him a head start for next season. One of his main hurdles to maximise his potential here might be the shortened pre-season this summer. I don't think this helps Minamino or any other signing we make. Not in terms of instant impact anyway.

I agree, the only criticism I could make of his play is that he seems to be pushed off the ball too easily. I'm not sure how learning our system helps with what looks like a straightforward issue of physical strength?

[RedForeverTT]

He was starting to demand the ball and go looking for it which is a good start. Certainly imposing himself now.

I was hoping Mane could see his runs a bit more because it looks as if Mane never passes to him.

[Ghost Town]

Really?  That’s a massive statement to make. Prior to him signing for us I’d only seen him score against us at Anfield so had no preconceptions as to what he was like as a player. From what I’ve seen of him so far he’s not fit to lace Bobbys boots, never mind be an understudy to him. I’ve not been impressed with him at all to be honest.

Bobby was not fit to lace Bobby's boots either when he first came here. Give him time for fuck's sake. Klopp knows what he is doing. If Klopp wants to turn Taki into a Firmino back up/alternative then he will need some time to do it, and some patience from impatient fans

[number 168]

Really?  That’s a massive statement to make. Prior to him signing for us I’d only seen him score against us at Anfield so had no preconceptions as to what he was like as a player. From what I’ve seen of him so far he’s not fit to lace Bobbys boots, never mind be an understudy to him. I’ve not been impressed with him at all to be honest.

You sound like Danny Murphy. Jurgen knows exactly what he's doing and to judge a Liverpool player in such derogatory terms, especially as he hasn't even played one full game, is not only unfair but insulting and stupid ... no offence.

[Amatt]

You sound like Danny Murphy. Jurgen knows exactly what he's doing and to judge a Liverpool player in such derogatory terms, especially as he hasn't even played one full game, is not only unfair but insulting and stupid ... no offence.

None taken. But I said so far. I’d love the lad to do well. To compare him to Bobby at this moment in time  is absolutely ridiculous. This is just my opinion so far. Like I said, I’d only seen his goal against us as I missed 90% of the Salzburg match. But from what I’ve seen SO FAR I’ve not been impressed at all. Just my opinion so please don’t shoot me down for it.

[terry_macss_perm]

One thing you can say for Minamino is that he has more goals at Anfield this season than Bobby.

[Hazell]

One thing you can say for Minamino is that he has more goals at Anfield this season than Bobby.

You can't really say that though.

[number 168]

None taken. But I said so far. I’d love the lad to do well. To compare him to Bobby at this moment in time  is absolutely ridiculous. This is just my opinion so far. Like I said, I’d only seen his goal against us as I missed 90% of the Salzburg match. But from what I’ve seen SO FAR I’ve not been impressed at all. Just my opinion so please don’t shoot me down for it.

Opinions are as valid as the evidence used to substantiate them You have hardly seen the guy play yet you seem happy to traduce him. I am impressed with him myself based on his limited time in a redshirt. He is always moving, looking for space, he is tenacious and looks so eager to do well, so on that basis I want to see more of him before I agree that he's not fit to lace Bobby's, or indeed anybody's boots

[afc tukrish]

Opinions are as valid as the evidence used to substantiate them You have hardly seen the guy play yet you seem happy to traduce him. I am impressed with him myself based on his limited time in a redshirt. He is always moving, looking for space, he is tenacious and looks so eager to do well, so on that basis I want to see more of him before I agree that he's not fit to lace Bobby's, or indeed anybody's boots

Did seem something of an impulsively impertinent traduction... 

[Ghost Town]

None taken. But I said so far. I’d love the lad to do well. To compare him to Bobby at this moment in time  is absolutely ridiculous. This is just my opinion so far. Like I said, I’d only seen his goal against us as I missed 90% of the Salzburg match. But from what I’ve seen SO FAR I’ve not been impressed at all. Just my opinion so please don’t shoot me down for it.

So you're happy to dish it out, but...?

[MNAA]

None taken. But I said so far. I’d love the lad to do well. To compare him to Bobby at this moment in time  is absolutely ridiculous. This is just my opinion so far. Like I said, I’d only seen his goal against us as I missed 90% of the Salzburg match. But from what I’ve seen SO FAR I’ve not been impressed at all. Just my opinion so please don’t shoot me down for it.

Opinion is a bitch. Opinion “so far” is even worse. The thing is, air your opinion if you must (even though we are not really interested) but be respectful with the words you choose. After Robertson, Ox, Fabinho and Naby ... we fans should know certain players need at least a full pre-season and at least half a season to get used to Klopp and how we play. Minamino had neither. So it would be nice to reserved your “so far” opinion until much much later

[him_15]

Takumi seems more like to be Bobby's sub now. He simply can't replicate what Salah does.

[farawayred]

Takumi seems more like to be Bobby's sub now. He simply can't replicate what Salah does.

Bobby's position doesn't seem best suited for him. I think he's more like Curtis-type player, maybe the more advanced No.8. The false 9 has a player who made it his own. The team would be loosing too much of Taki plays instead of Bobby.

[Red Beret]

This is a good conversation to have, isnt it? Debating a player's undeniable skill and commitment, and being able to acknowledge areas of his game where he needs to improve, knowing full well he's in the perfect place to do so, surrounded as he is by some of the best in the business?

Yes, this is a good conversation to be able to have. 

[Crimson]

I'm not sure about that, Mane has insane strength for someone with his physique.  Agree on his... buzziness.

Mané's built like a tank. He's like a Traore with less fat percentage.

[DelTrotter]

Did alright I thought and had his first assault on him in the penalty area which is just totally ignored, will help get him used to the way things work here! Hopefully he starts the next 2.

[Bend It Like Aurelio]

We really should play with a 4-2-3-1, with Minamino central, Salah and Mane on the ranks, then Firmino up front. We've been making the front three carry such a load these days, I think it's time to put someone up there with them like what Fernanades has been able to provide for United.

If not this season then the next, playing two mid across the front 4 with Keita and Henderson. We would demolish so many teams like we did before. Our midfield's main job now is to fill spaces and link up, but they get bypassed so often anyway. Minamino can be that glue for the front three, he's got that creativity and his mind is super sharp.

[HeartAndSoul]

We really should play with a 4-2-3-1, with Minamino central, Salah and Mane on the ranks, then Firmino up front. We've been making the front three carry such a load these days, I think it's time to put someone up there with them like what Fernanades has been able to provide for United.

If not this season then the next, playing two mid across the front 4 with Keita and Henderson. We would demolish so many teams like we did before. Our midfield's main job now is to fill spaces and link up, but they get bypassed so often anyway. Minamino can be that glue for the front three, he's got that creativity and his mind is super sharp.

Really thought we would have been trying some new formations and style of play since we won the league but nope it's been the same team/formation every single game. Would have been nice to try some new things seeing as we're playing well below our best just now and get game time to the likes of minamino and keita who have something to prove