Author Topic: CL 1st leg: L’pool 0 v Bayern 0  (Read 21361 times)

Offline Flaccido Dongingo

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Re: CL 1st leg: L’pool 0 v Bayern 0
« Reply #520 on: February 20, 2019, 01:46:58 AM »
Bit flat all round, going there suits us though as they've got to attack, up the Reds.
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Offline deFacto

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Re: CL 1st leg: L’pool 0 v Bayern 0
« Reply #521 on: February 20, 2019, 01:51:36 AM »
Can't say it was flat all around. Granted the second half could have been better, but as I said, that first half, for all their hard working defensively, we should have scored at least once.

Some overestimating on their actual performance and underrating that we did. It wasn't the best, but a bit sharper in the final third and we score at least two.

They're a good side no doubt but we played well defensively and nullified whaetever threat they possessed

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Re: CL 1st leg: L’pool 0 v Bayern 0
« Reply #522 on: February 20, 2019, 02:12:19 AM »
We are due a decent away performance in the CL this season, we will win it 3 - 2

Offline deFacto

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Re: CL 1st leg: L’pool 0 v Bayern 0
« Reply #523 on: February 20, 2019, 02:21:26 AM »
They will pose a different threat obviously at home, Robben and Goretzka will be back for them by then and that will be something new for us to deal with. Having said that, they will leave some gaps for us and surely we can put at least one of our chances away

Offline Suareznumber7

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Re: CL 1st leg: L’pool 0 v Bayern 0
« Reply #524 on: February 20, 2019, 02:37:06 AM »
I’m not sure what game half of you lot expected but I thought that was a great game.  We clearly created better chances and on a different night we win this 2-0.  Bayern played very well, very smart tactically, and got what they came for. 

See a lot of people blaming the “warm weather” training camp for us not scoring a hatful.  I’d say any issues in our play were because we hadn’t played in 10 days and lost some rhythm.  Nothing to do with going away. 

Offline PhaseOfPlay

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Re: CL 1st leg: L’pool 0 v Bayern 0
« Reply #525 on: February 20, 2019, 02:42:23 AM »
Rafa-esque compactness. Nice 4-3-1-2 shape too


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Offline deFacto

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Re: CL 1st leg: L’pool 0 v Bayern 0
« Reply #526 on: February 20, 2019, 02:43:06 AM »
I’m not sure what game half of you lot expected but I thought that was a great game.  We clearly created better chances and on a different night we win this 2-0.  Bayern played very well, very smart tactically, and got what they came for. 

See a lot of people blaming the “warm weather” training camp for us not scoring a hatful.  I’d say any issues in our play were because we hadn’t played in 10 days and lost some rhythm.  Nothing to do with going away.

They played better than they have in recent months at the same time they rode their luck in certain moments where as we didn't have the luck we needed.

I agree with the rest. Overall I think it was a good performance.

Offline soxfan

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Re: CL 1st leg: L’pool 0 v Bayern 0
« Reply #527 on: February 20, 2019, 03:36:33 AM »
Van Dijk back in.  Kimmich out.  I like our chances in the second leg. 
And we didn't surrender an away goal. We're in good shape.

Offline him_15

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Re: CL 1st leg: L’pool 0 v Bayern 0
« Reply #528 on: February 20, 2019, 04:00:24 AM »
A bit frustrated with the lack of goal but not a bad result overall, no away goal conceded and we will have VVD back for the second leg.
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Re: CL 1st leg: L’pool 0 v Bayern 0
« Reply #529 on: February 20, 2019, 04:15:33 AM »
Score in Munich and we’re through I reckon.
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Offline Kovai Red

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Re: CL 1st leg: L’pool 0 v Bayern 0
« Reply #530 on: February 20, 2019, 04:47:04 AM »
I think it will be a scored draw in Munich.
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Offline RedG13

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Re: CL 1st leg: L’pool 0 v Bayern 0
« Reply #531 on: February 20, 2019, 05:27:23 AM »
I thought we played well to win 1-0 or 2-0(Caley had Xg at 2.2-.5 in favor of liverpool). No complaints about a 0-0 draw as no away goal was given up. Thought Fabinho and matip  well at CB. Mf looked good. Attack created multiple pretty good chances but was just a little off to finish them.
Most of Bayern chances seemed to come off sloppy play in the first. Bayern seemed to tired at the end of the game, with players cramping,mostly Javi Martinez.
They did give us issues with how well they can keep ball under pressure having Neuer as basically another Cb passing wise is very helpful with that however they struggled to get create much in the final third.

Online latortuga

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Re: CL 1st leg: L’pool 0 v Bayern 0
« Reply #532 on: February 20, 2019, 05:50:23 AM »

I think we’ll see United try exactly the same tactics. They’ll mark our front three with 5 or 6 players and will be quickly into the tackle in midfield. They’ll try to break quickly.


At home?  That would be very Mourinho'esque and see them have very little possession.  OGS' been banging on about the "Man Utd way" since he arrived, so while I think it would be the right tactic to get a result, he's backed himself into a corner and opposing that edict would see his chances of taking over longterm die.   
« Last Edit: February 20, 2019, 05:52:19 AM by latortuga »

Offline PhaseOfPlay

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Re: CL 1st leg: L’pool 0 v Bayern 0
« Reply #533 on: February 20, 2019, 05:51:20 AM »
I thought we played well to win 1-0 or 2-0(Caley had Xg at 2.2-.5 in favor of liverpool). No complaints about a 0-0 draw as no away goal was given up. Thought Fabinho and matip  well at CB. Mf looked good. Attack created multiple pretty good chances but was just a little off to finish them.
Most of Bayern chances seemed to come off sloppy play in the first. Bayern seemed to tired at the end of the game, with players cramping,mostly Javi Martinez.
They did give us issues with how well they can keep ball under pressure having Neuer as basically another Cb passing wise is very helpful with that however they struggled to get create much in the final third.

This is why I don't like the expected goal metric based on "shot location". We only had two shots on target. We'd have to have been unusually clinical (or for Neuer to unusually shite) to get two goals out of that. The other shots that were off target for me aren't worth being assessed, because the shots themselves weren't threats to the goalkeeper (unless they took deflections into his path). 0-0 was probably a correct score, but 1-0 to us wouldn't have been flattering. Our defensive block, though, did their job in limiting Bayern to no shots on target at all. Great defensive display.
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Offline BrandoLFC

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Re: CL 1st leg: L’pool 0 v Bayern 0
« Reply #534 on: February 20, 2019, 06:07:03 AM »
This is why I don't like the expected goal metric based on "shot location". We only had two shots on target. We'd have to have been unusually clinical (or for Neuer to unusually shite) to get two goals out of that. The other shots that were off target for me aren't worth being assessed, because the shots themselves weren't threats to the goalkeeper (unless they took deflections into his path). 0-0 was probably a correct score, but 1-0 to us wouldn't have been flattering. Our defensive block, though, did their job in limiting Bayern to no shots on target at all. Great defensive display.

Because hundreds of thousands of shots being analyzed on why one is a goal and one is not being almost entirely predicated on location means nothing I guess?  Why did bookies start paying for this info and adjusting their odds I wonder?  It being accurate would play no part in that for sure....

We created those chances whether the shots were on target or not.  Mane's chances, would they be off-target every time he attempted them from the same spot?  If not what are the odds they would actually go by the keeper?  Pretty good from that spot right? 

Anyway, I agree we were great defensively and should hopefully go through.

Offline vinothmct

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Re: CL 1st leg: L’pool 0 v Bayern 0
« Reply #535 on: February 20, 2019, 06:19:00 AM »
For me it was a fantastic result. Importmat that we didnt concede. Weather the initial storm from Bayern and smash them on the counter. WIth VVD back i'm confident we can go through

Offline PhaseOfPlay

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Re: CL 1st leg: L’pool 0 v Bayern 0
« Reply #536 on: February 20, 2019, 06:25:08 AM »
Because hundreds of thousands of shots being analyzed on why one is a goal and one is not being almost entirely predicated on location means nothing I guess?  Why did bookies start paying for this info and adjusting their odds I wonder?  It being accurate would play no part in that for sure....

We created those chances whether the shots were on target or not.  Mane's chances, would they be off-target every time he attempted them from the same spot?  If not what are the odds they would actually go by the keeper?  Pretty good from that spot right? 

Anyway, I agree we were great defensively and should hopefully go through.

We have more than 100's of thousands of shots stretching back to 1963 that show that the average rate of shots on target to goal is 3:1. I prefer that metric. It's more robust over time.

You are perfectly free to use the other model. It's a free world. If it makes you angry that I don't agree with it, I don't know what to say to you.
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Offline RedG13

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Re: CL 1st leg: L’pool 0 v Bayern 0
« Reply #537 on: February 20, 2019, 06:30:43 AM »
This is why I don't like the expected goal metric based on "shot location". We only had two shots on target. We'd have to have been unusually clinical (or for Neuer to unusually shite) to get two goals out of that. The other shots that were off target for me aren't worth being assessed, because the shots themselves weren't threats to the goalkeeper (unless they took deflections into his path). 0-0 was probably a correct score, but 1-0 to us wouldn't have been flattering. Our defensive block, though, did their job in limiting Bayern to no shots on target at all. Great defensive display.
I like with other stuff, shots and on target plus the map where I can see what the data says is big(Understat map is very good on the interactive way to do). On the Shots on target it might just be 1 as opta has Mane header that currently listed as on target,on the replay on TV it was going to hit the post, anything hitting post and going wide even with a hand too it is supposed to be considered off target. The other on target was salah shot at neuer. Looking at Caley Map seems like a lot of shots basically on the edge of the box with 3 big chances missed(Mane had 2 and Salah had one, Im pretty sure Opta would considers a big chance basically xg over .4 but I doubt any of them are much over .5) Im pretty sure big chances are salah shot that was saved by Neuer, Mane header that was saved and Mane shot on edge of the 6 yard box which he was on half turn and off balance for.
Created a bunch in good spots but didnt have the shooting boots to put them on net and covert into goals and limited bayern to very little chances. Bayern best chance seems like that coman chance where alisson and matip did not do a good job of passing out of the back.
here is the Caley Map https://twitter.com/Caley_graphics/status/1097982761996963843
On Neuer, He has allowed 24 goals on 56 shots which is 57.14% save percentage he been really bad at shot stopping. 32 saves this year in bundesliga play only Im counting, If Liverpool able to put 5 shots on target there is a good chance that could be 3 goals.

Offline rojo para la vida

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Re: CL 1st leg: L’pool 0 v Bayern 0
« Reply #538 on: February 20, 2019, 06:44:57 AM »
As Klopp said, it was the best draw you could get and you've got to fancy us to score a goal over there and with Virgil back, not to concede more than one.

The first half was engrossing and mentally draining, like two heavy weight boxers slugging it out early rounds and seemed to pass in slow motion for me. The second quickly felt like it was fizzling out to the inevitable clean sheets. The big plus was Henderson, please can you maintain that form on Sunday, if selected Jordan. And just as good, a thriller is set up for a fortnight.

Offline bird_lfc

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Re: CL 1st leg: L’pool 0 v Bayern 0
« Reply #539 on: February 20, 2019, 06:47:15 AM »
0-0 at home first leg can be both a good and bad result

For a team like us, we are easily capable of scoring early out in Munich. Do that and they are under massive pressure and with VVD back, we stand a great chance imo.


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Re: CL 1st leg: L’pool 0 v Bayern 0
« Reply #540 on: February 20, 2019, 07:05:36 AM »
nice to see us press high up again, wonder if we unleash our press now for the second half of the season
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Re: CL 1st leg: L’pool 0 v Bayern 0
« Reply #541 on: February 20, 2019, 07:24:57 AM »
nice to see us press high up again, wonder if we unleash our press now for the second half of the season

They have pretty much said that would be the case. We can't do that all season so lets get through to the end and then open up more.
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Offline robgomm

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Re: CL 1st leg: L’pool 0 v Bayern 0
« Reply #542 on: February 20, 2019, 07:29:51 AM »
This is why I don't like the expected goal metric based on "shot location". We only had two shots on target. We'd have to have been unusually clinical (or for Neuer to unusually shite) to get two goals out of that. The other shots that were off target for me aren't worth being assessed, because the shots themselves weren't threats to the goalkeeper (unless they took deflections into his path). 0-0 was probably a correct score, but 1-0 to us wouldn't have been flattering. Our defensive block, though, did their job in limiting Bayern to no shots on target at all. Great defensive display.

There's two ways of looking at it I guess:

1) From where the shot was, Mane's miss for example, shots from that location should yield X goals.
2) Shots such as Mane's should yield X goals (post-season model).

One suspects the two can work quite well in tandem.

Offline Sharado

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Re: CL 1st leg: L’pool 0 v Bayern 0
« Reply #543 on: February 20, 2019, 07:31:14 AM »
It's not the end of the world if they go 1 up over there. I've always thought 0-0 away is a fucker of a result in Europe. If you concede at home you're done for. If we score 2 in that game we'll without doubt go through. Few games between now and then to get our eye in (hi, sadio) and think we'll be sound. Agree with whoever said about Gini looking a bit like he was playing injured, wouldn't be a huge shock to see him out for the weekend.
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Offline robgomm

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Re: CL 1st leg: L’pool 0 v Bayern 0
« Reply #544 on: February 20, 2019, 07:32:28 AM »
I saw the BBC saying only 10 out of 31 teams who drew the home first leg 0-0 went through in CL history. But it really depends on the teams because obviously Lyon drawing 0-0 at home to Barca... you still easily fancy Barca.

One thing is for sure, we'll have to actually turn up in an away game in Europe this season.  ;D

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Re: CL 1st leg: L’pool 0 v Bayern 0
« Reply #545 on: February 20, 2019, 07:42:45 AM »
I saw the BBC saying only 10 out of 31 teams who drew the home first leg 0-0 went through in CL history. But it really depends on the teams because obviously Lyon drawing 0-0 at home to Barca... you still easily fancy Barca.

One thing is for sure, we'll have to actually turn up in an away game in Europe this season.  ;D

The only 0-0 first leg I can remember involving us was the first Chelsea semi and obviously the side who drew 0-0 at home went out there.

But I remember United drawing 0-0 away at Monaco and Real back in the day before being done on Away goals (or just battered in Real’s case).

Any other obvious ones I’ve missed?

Offline Macca201188

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Re: CL 1st leg: L’pool 0 v Bayern 0
« Reply #546 on: February 20, 2019, 08:01:16 AM »
Don't really understand why there has been so much praise for Bayern last night. Fair enough they didn't even try to score (and never looked like they would), but if we had our shooting boots on the tie would be effectively over, we created a few really good chances. I feel like if it was a thrilling 3-3 draw the media would be saying great result, even though a tame 0-0 is actually much more beneficial. Really confident we can score over there and get over the line.
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Re: CL 1st leg: L’pool 0 v Bayern 0
« Reply #547 on: February 20, 2019, 08:05:38 AM »
Score in Munich and we’re through I reckon.

I think that's pretty much the size of it. Not conceding last night was crucial
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Offline phonic

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Re: CL 1st leg: L’pool 0 v Bayern 0
« Reply #548 on: February 20, 2019, 08:08:22 AM »
We have two chances to get through now whereas they have 1. Whenever you go away in Europe and not score, you'll always feel there's been a missed opportunity especially if the other side get an early goal in the return leg.

We're more than capable of scoring in Munich. I think they'll want to start fast, if we stay compact and weather the early storm then we'll be fine on the counter.

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Re: CL 1st leg: L’pool 0 v Bayern 0
« Reply #549 on: February 20, 2019, 08:25:17 AM »
I thought it was an interesting game rather than the classic "Anfield night" I was hoping for. I think they have too much quality and nous for us to try and just steamroller them. After all their years in the final rounds of this competition they were just to experienced to get ruffled, individually or tactically. Thought they done well as did we to a point.

Does anyone know what our passing stats were like, or the number of simple giveaways we did. First time ever I think where a lot of our players seemed to get flustered and play a meaningless directional pass, or just give the ball away.

I though Trents distribution was awful last night but that might have just been me. Any passing stats for him?
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Offline just redk84 will do

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Re: CL 1st leg: L’pool 0 v Bayern 0
« Reply #550 on: February 20, 2019, 08:26:54 AM »
More like an old fashioned European tie that.

Before the game I was desperate for a clean sheet...tho I thought we'd score at least 1.
1st half we should have been a goal up I feel, on the balance of play and the chances we had....one of them should have been put away. You don't get clearcut chances all the time in games at this level so we were lacking a bit.

2nd half Bayern dug in a bit more and we found it hard to get through. The workrate off the ball in this game was ridiculous....so many passing lanes cut off and although we did misplace a few balls which we shouldn't have (our fullbacks being the most guilty in this respect), I think the pressure of the game itself with there being so little room for error made it that way. Glad Kimmich is not available for the 2nd leg.

Sometimes the opposition play really well, and they definitely did not pose much of a threat to us and wanted to avoid defeat, so they got their wish. We got a clean sheet and now if we score over there we can make it really uncomfortable for them.

Not disappointed with the result. Was an interesting game...2nd leg will be massive, we need to show up away from home which we haven't done so far in Europe
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Offline PhilV

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Re: CL 1st leg: L’pool 0 v Bayern 0
« Reply #551 on: February 20, 2019, 08:31:19 AM »
I am actually OK with the result, obviously not the one we wanted but a clean sheet at home/no away goals for them is massive, both teams will play more attacking second leg you'd imagine for the win and I think we can go there and do some damage plus get the away goal advantage.


I thought our midfield trio were class last night, worked their socks off and so many good balls won back and so on, Gini and Keita were sending people to the shops all night and Hendo with the tireless work and winning everything back.

Surprisingly was disappointed with a person who is normally a solid 8 every game, Robbo, his crossing and some decision making was a bit off last night but goes to show how consistent he is that this is that random off day!


All in all, it wasn't a bad result. Mats Hummels was class I thought, were it not for him we would have had more chances/space in the final third.
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Re: CL 1st leg: L’pool 0 v Bayern 0
« Reply #552 on: February 20, 2019, 08:52:45 AM »
This is why I don't like the expected goal metric based on "shot location". We only had two shots on target. We'd have to have been unusually clinical (or for Neuer to unusually shite) to get two goals out of that. The other shots that were off target for me aren't worth being assessed, because the shots themselves weren't threats to the goalkeeper (unless they took deflections into his path). 0-0 was probably a correct score, but 1-0 to us wouldn't have been flattering. Our defensive block, though, did their job in limiting Bayern to no shots on target at all. Great defensive display.
If I understand you correctly, a penalty shot that misses the goal wouldn’t be considered a chance at all. But it obviously is before the shot is taken, regardless of what happens next, isn’t it? Seems strange not to take the situation before the shot (such as location, and how free the player is) into consideration when trying to assess the quality of a chance created.
« Last Edit: February 20, 2019, 09:41:00 AM by Roger Federer »

Offline Dan6times

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Re: CL 1st leg: L’pool 0 v Bayern 0
« Reply #553 on: February 20, 2019, 09:01:23 AM »
I wouldn't say I was happy with the result after the game last night just content. This morning I'm more disappointed  with the draw. A 1-0 would have been an ideal scenario in that we could control the game a little more but we still have a 50/50 chance and I'll take that.

I thought it was a good game obviously not on the same caliber but it reminded me of the City away game last month, two good teams playing well trying to cancel each other out and find moments. I thought their use of Neuer and the two CB's was excellent, it forced us to press signally rather than in packs around the centre circle (counter press)  and when one of the front 3 nearly got to their men they just kicked it long which ended up being a 50/50 header or us regaining the ball in a deeper position. That's really how to play against this Liverpool side at Anfield but obviously you need the players to have the ability to do it. Saying that we did break them a good few times but just failed to find the net.

Its all set up for a good game on the 13th March, Kimmich a big loss for them, Rafinha is 33
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Offline vicar

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Re: CL 1st leg: L’pool 0 v Bayern 0
« Reply #554 on: February 20, 2019, 09:05:03 AM »
Think opting for Origi in the hope the ball drops on his head 2 feet out over Shaqiri who might provide th lockpick was a mistake, but otherwise a clean sheet on a day when we were misfiring is not a bad result.
Bayern have to win - unless their plan is to play for 0-0 and hope for the lottery of penalties, which by default should leave more space foe our attacking players.

Agree. I know hindsight is great but at the time I though Sturridge might have been a better option as there were a few times in that game where I wanted players to shoot, there wasn't much space but the chances were there. Sturridge is a master at shooting from tight spaces.

Offline pathetic

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Re: CL 1st leg: L’pool 0 v Bayern 0
« Reply #555 on: February 20, 2019, 09:05:51 AM »
I don't know why everyone seems to think it's an advantage for Bayern going into the second leg. The commentators seemed to think so anyway. Have they ever watched us play? Playing away suits us to a tee. Bayern will have to attack and we will score. A draw or a win and we go through. Couldn't ask much more than that against Bayern.
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Offline ArthurDent

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Re: CL 1st leg: L’pool 0 v Bayern 0
« Reply #556 on: February 20, 2019, 09:07:50 AM »
Proper club, proper fans, proper tough European night. None of your flash-in-the-pans or manufactured clubs.
Henderson immense. Fabinho excellent. I think Bayern may regret not pushing for an away goal.
« Last Edit: February 20, 2019, 09:10:56 AM by ArthurDent »
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Offline KissThisGuy

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Re: CL 1st leg: L’pool 0 v Bayern 0
« Reply #557 on: February 20, 2019, 09:16:54 AM »
The only 0-0 first leg I can remember involving us was the first Chelsea semi and obviously the side who drew 0-0 at home went out there.

But I remember United drawing 0-0 away at Monaco and Real back in the day before being done on Away goals (or just battered in Real’s case).

Any other obvious ones I’ve missed?
Have you forgotten the hilarity of Sevilla at Old Trafford last season? Or Atletico v Chelsea under Mourinho a few seasons back. I'm not 100% sure the Sevilla game was 0-0 first leg, but I couldn't be arsed looking it up.

Offline keyop

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Re: CL 1st leg: L’pool 0 v Bayern 0
« Reply #558 on: February 20, 2019, 09:18:33 AM »
A 0-0 at home against Bayern with our makeshift defence is a decent result.

Earlier in the season, many were concerned what would happen if either VVD or Gomez were injured or couldn't play. Last night both were out and we still didn't concede - against a side that are better than most in the Premier league. That in itself is a reason to be satisfied with the result. Henderson was excellent throughout and we limited Bayern to very few opportunities.

The second leg will naturally be more open which will suit us, and with VVD back we're even less likely to concede than we were last night.



« Last Edit: February 20, 2019, 09:25:20 AM by keyop »
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Offline Groundskeeper Willie

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Re: CL 1st leg: L’pool 0 v Bayern 0
« Reply #559 on: February 20, 2019, 09:39:33 AM »
I think it was a decent performance against one of the top teams in Europe. The last 25 minutes of the first half were really good. Unfortunately, we fell in to their trap of trying to slow the game down in the 2nd half. But we should have put 2 past them in the first half, with better finishing and decision making. Sadio's chance was especially frustrating. I think the xG this game was 2.5- 0.5.

I was left feeling a bit frustrated after the game, as I thought that with just a little bit better decision making and/or execution in the decisive moments, we could have been through already. The non shot based xG was 2.9 I believe. Klopp also recognised this after the game.

Still, as far as draws go, 0-0 is a good result. A goal from us in 3 weeks time will really put the pressure on them. We'll get our chances in Munich, we just have to take them.

Also, the first half performance gave me encouragement ahead of the weekend. I was a bit unsure about our form after the recent league run and the long break, but i feel much better now.
« Last Edit: February 20, 2019, 09:43:10 AM by Groundskeeper Willie »
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