Author Topic: What next?  (Read 28924 times)

Offline BobPaisley3

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Re: What next?
« Reply #320 on: January 22, 2019, 07:52:11 PM »
Wilson shoots,scores and assists a lot more & we already own him.
I don’t think it’s a case of one or the other, we’ll need to replace a few attacking options this summer id imagine. Can see Wilson coming back, and probably two more on top.

Online RedG13

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Re: What next?
« Reply #321 on: January 22, 2019, 07:55:37 PM »
he's not as good a goal scorer as salah so in trouble if we stick with 4-3-3.

in a 4-2-3-1 he's got shaqiri ahead of him and of course mane can come across to play there too.

he's really dangerous from set pieces but would he be taking them for the first team?

my gut is that we cash in on him this summer and look to get £15m but of course that depends on whom we're bringing in.

i'm thinking we got £15m for ibe who got a few first team games but aware we were nothing like as good in those days.
if we get 15 mil pounds is not enough needs to be closer to solanke(20+). I dont expect him start if he here next year, he would be a somebody to help rotate shaqiri,mane and Ox. We see what happens though.

Offline hassinator

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Re: What next?
« Reply #322 on: January 22, 2019, 08:05:30 PM »
if we get 15 mil pounds is not enough needs to be closer to solanke(20+). I dont expect him start if he here next year, he would be a somebody to help rotate shaqiri,mane and Ox. We see what happens though.

how many games have shaq and sadio been unavailable for this season?

factor in a fit ox and it would be slim pickings.

maybe he goes on loan again to a prem club but i still think it's shop window.

will we get £20? edwards is the master but he's not yet prem proven so i guess that might count against a higher fee.

Online RedG13

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Re: What next?
« Reply #323 on: January 22, 2019, 08:30:08 PM »
how many games have shaq and sadio been unavailable for this season?

factor in a fit ox and it would be slim pickings.

maybe he goes on loan again to a prem club but i still think it's shop window.

will we get £20? edwards is the master but he's not yet prem proven so i guess that might count against a higher fee.
Mane only missed League Cup,Fa cup game, burnley IRC, and that was for rest.  15 seems low, 20 mil would make more sense, we see what happens.  Shaq been available for all game even if not used in all games.

Offline Sangria

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Re: What next?
« Reply #324 on: January 22, 2019, 08:32:26 PM »
what about harry wilson as an attacking LB? 

possibly his only way into the first team squad.

(i have absolutely no idea of his defensive output but saw babu suggesting ojo and wondered if harry may be a better option)

From what I can make out, Wilson is playing a Shaqiri type role at Derby, an AM/F on the inside right/centre with little defensive contribution but threatening on the ball. Sessegnon, while also left footed and attacking more than defending, is on the other flank. Also, one of the common complaints about Wilson is that he lacks endurance. I have no idea why this is or whether it'll hinder him in our first team.
"i just dont think (Lucas is) that type of player that Kenny wants"
Vidocq, 20 January 2011

http://www.redandwhitekop.com/forum/index.php?topic=267148.msg8032258#msg8032258

Offline fucking appalled

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Re: What next?
« Reply #325 on: January 22, 2019, 08:55:55 PM »
Sessegnon certainly looks like he’d have the dreaded ‘higher ceiling’ than Wilson
I believe the average spend will go up £5 ahead and that’s being very conservative. So that’s £185k. Then you have a new 25k who will spend £10 a head that’s £250k. This is without the massively enhanced hospitality areas.

Offline hassinator

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Re: What next?
« Reply #326 on: January 22, 2019, 08:56:13 PM »
From what I can make out, Wilson is playing a Shaqiri type role at Derby, an AM/F on the inside right/centre with little defensive contribution but threatening on the ball. Sessegnon, while also left footed and attacking more than defending, is on the other flank. Also, one of the common complaints about Wilson is that he lacks endurance. I have no idea why this is or whether it'll hinder him in our first team.

harry is left footed though which is why i was suggesting LB. 

staggering the number of players that have played that role for us over the years who were right footed.

Offline Sangria

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Re: What next?
« Reply #327 on: January 22, 2019, 09:13:58 PM »
harry is left footed though which is why i was suggesting LB. 

staggering the number of players that have played that role for us over the years who were right footed.

Derby fans are already commenting on Wilson's lack of stamina and he's playing in an AM role. FB requires even more. If he returns to a role in the first team, it'll be because the front 3 require more rotation with Shaqiri because of their summer commitments, with Wilson stepping into the fringe attacker role that Shaqiri started the season as, with the potential of stepping up further as Shaqiri has.
"i just dont think (Lucas is) that type of player that Kenny wants"
Vidocq, 20 January 2011

http://www.redandwhitekop.com/forum/index.php?topic=267148.msg8032258#msg8032258

Offline Redcap

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Re: What next?
« Reply #328 on: January 23, 2019, 10:53:15 PM »
Question: What is Harry Wilson's shot/key pass contributing in open play?

Because it seems everytime I see him score a goal, it's from a free kick.

It's great that he's so good at free kicks, but if he's not producing as much in open play, doesn't raise questions about what he would add to our attack?

Offline Sheer Magnetism

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Re: What next?
« Reply #329 on: January 24, 2019, 12:44:11 AM »
According to WhoScored he's number eight in the division for shots on target per game, and in the top 30 for key passes.

Offline Redcap

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Re: What next?
« Reply #330 on: January 24, 2019, 01:12:16 AM »
According to WhoScored he's number eight in the division for shots on target per game, and in the top 30 for key passes.

I'm fairly sure Whoscored doesn't have shots on target, but only shots per game.

Also, my sense is that includes his set piece contributions. He shoots 2.6 times a game, which is very good for a young attacking mid, but if two of those 2.6 are from set pieces, suddenly it's not that good at all.

My sense is his set pieces are so good that it's unclear what kind of a player he is in open play, and how he fits in with how we play. This nuance is important, because we signed Mario Balotelli on the back of a 16 league goal season for Milan, but he scored about 2 goals from inside the area, because he just didn't get inside the area (and also scored a bunch of pens).

Offline Sheer Magnetism

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Re: What next?
« Reply #331 on: January 24, 2019, 10:29:59 AM »
You're wrong I'm afraid, the shots on target stat is under the Detailed tab. In any case, I'm not sure why that's meant to be bad news. I'd love to have someone who can contribute half a dozen extra goals a season from set pieces. It's not like we already have a free kick specialist putting up those numbers, which is what the equivalent with Balotelli taking penalties would be. Again, Wilson is just shy of one goal in two at the age of 21 while playing in midfield. After putting up better numbers for Hull the year before, without any free kick goals.

Offline Redcap

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Re: What next?
« Reply #332 on: January 24, 2019, 09:18:50 PM »
You're wrong I'm afraid, the shots on target stat is under the Detailed tab. In any case, I'm not sure why that's meant to be bad news. I'd love to have someone who can contribute half a dozen extra goals a season from set pieces. It's not like we already have a free kick specialist putting up those numbers, which is what the equivalent with Balotelli taking penalties would be. Again, Wilson is just shy of one goal in two at the age of 21 while playing in midfield. After putting up better numbers for Hull the year before, without any free kick goals.
Ah there it is. Thanks for pointing that out.

I think it's important to have players that contribute to the way the team plays in open play, is all. I'm not saying Wilson wouldn't. It just looks like his productivity comes almost exclusively from set pieces this year.

Don't get me wrong, I want to see him get a chance. I just want to know what he's bringing outside of set piece deadlines. Mind you, we could afford to score a few more from set pieces to open up games for our forwards a bit more.

Offline Sangria

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Re: What next?
« Reply #333 on: January 24, 2019, 10:26:40 PM »
Ah there it is. Thanks for pointing that out.

I think it's important to have players that contribute to the way the team plays in open play, is all. I'm not saying Wilson wouldn't. It just looks like his productivity comes almost exclusively from set pieces this year.

Don't get me wrong, I want to see him get a chance. I just want to know what he's bringing outside of set piece deadlines. Mind you, we could afford to score a few more from set pieces to open up games for our forwards a bit more.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B9_1Lq7wuf4
"i just dont think (Lucas is) that type of player that Kenny wants"
Vidocq, 20 January 2011

http://www.redandwhitekop.com/forum/index.php?topic=267148.msg8032258#msg8032258

Offline soxfan

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Re: What next?
« Reply #334 on: January 29, 2019, 06:31:52 PM »
Article by Ralphael Honigstein discussing Timo Werner's future. Liverpool mentioned as an option. Here's a snippet: http://www.espn.com/soccer/german-bundesliga/10/blog/post/3761801/rb-leipzig-striker-timo-werner-has-an-extremely-bright-future;-nowwhere-will-it-be

"...And what about Liverpool? Klopp's insistence that the squad is now "complete" would suggest that a fourth transition-type forward for a total outlay north of €100m might not be a priority right now. LFC are probably more interested in bringing in a versatile centre-back with the ability to deputise in wide areas. In purely tactical terms, however, few attacking players look as perfect a fit for the explosive style favoured at Anfield. Just like his potential teammates, Werner thrives on spaces to attack; just like them, he attacks in quick bursts and often looks most dangerous without the ball. By Premier League standards, his price tag looks almost cheap, especially if his high re-sale value is factored in as well. The return of Alex-Oxlade Chamberlain notwithstanding, Liverpool could really do with a proven goalscorer able to fill any of the three forward position.

Eleven goals in 19 league games has been a decent if not spectacular return this season for Werner. A deeper dive into his performance metrics courtesy of data from statsbomb.com paints a picture of sustained competence, however. There's quality, as far shooting positions are concerned -- he's the 15th best player in Europe's top five leagues this season with a non-penalty xG per 90 of 0.54 -- and quantity, too. A non-penalty shot rate of 3.71 per 90 minutes has him ranked 24th in that regard. His assist rates are much lower in contrast (55th with xGA90 0,13) but that's partly to do with Leipzig's direct style.

Once you compare his numbers to other forwards of the same age, the attraction becomes clearer still. Only four strikers aged 23 or younger in Europe have scored more goals per minutes than him this season -- PSG's Kylian Mbappe, Frankfurt's Luka Jovic, Lille's Rafael Leao and new Milan signing Krzysztof Piatek. He's fifth for non-penalty shots per 90 (behind Mbappe, Fiorentina's Federico Chiesa, Jovic and Piatek) and fourth for non-penalty xG per 90, beaten only by Mbappe, Jovic and Man City's Gabriel Jesus. He's firmly among the elite of his age group, playing for a side just below the league's best, specialising in counter-attacking football. No wonder many can see a giant upside..."


Offline L8Craig

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Re: What next?
« Reply #335 on: January 30, 2019, 11:48:11 PM »
With Origi and Sturridge out the door in the summer, we really need a pacey attacking player.
It would be nice to be able to play Salah inbetween the CBs and Mane and 'new signing' out wide/ in the half spaces when the wing backs are supporting.

Shaqiri isn't that player and we don't have no one else pacey who can drive at defenders other than Mane and Salah.

Offline Paul1611

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Re: What next?
« Reply #336 on: February 1, 2019, 11:42:37 AM »

Shaqiri isn't that player and we don't have no one else pacey who can drive at defenders other than Mane and Salah.

Is that not what Keita has been brought in for?

Offline HeartAndSoul

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Re: What next?
« Reply #337 on: February 1, 2019, 12:36:01 PM »
Watched a few Betis games this season and been very impressed with Gio Lo Celso on loan from PSG. Can play in a midfield 3 or behind the striker. Has a lovely range of passing, very good in tight spaces and very good shot on him too.

Wonder if we’ll look at a player like him as a Fekir alternative in the summer.

Offline Midget

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Re: What next?
« Reply #338 on: February 2, 2019, 03:23:44 PM »
Think we could still do with upgrades at centre back, attacking midfielder and forward next summer. Think we might be relying too much on Gomez given his injury history. I would like us to target a starting calibre centre back to partner van Dijk and use Gomez more sparingly in a back up/rotational role for both centre back and both fullback positions. Think we also need one more creative midfielder and a quality competiton four our trio up front. These two would essentially be replacements for Sturridge and Lallana. Would also sell one of Matip or Lovren to make room for the new centre back.

My top targets for those positions would look something like this (in an ideal world): Koulibaly, Havertz and Werner.

Offline Djozer

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Re: What next?
« Reply #339 on: February 2, 2019, 06:08:17 PM »
Think we could still do with upgrades at centre back, attacking midfielder and forward next summer. Think we might be relying too much on Gomez given his injury history. I would like us to target a starting calibre centre back to partner van Dijk and use Gomez more sparingly in a back up/rotational role for both centre back and both fullback positions. Think we also need one more creative midfielder and a quality competiton four our trio up front. These two would essentially be replacements for Sturridge and Lallana. Would also sell one of Matip or Lovren to make room for the new centre back.

My top targets for those positions would look something like this (in an ideal world): Koulibaly, Havertz and Werner.
I'd love that, but I'd be surprised if we go for a centreback of the level of Koulibaly, and I'm not sure we even need to unless the club is convinced that Gomez will have long term injury problems on a consistent basis. Think we're more likely to shift one of Lovren and Matip, and get a more reliable (fitnesswise) backup of a similar level in, or maybe make sure whoever replaces Moreno can also play at centre half, like Lloyd Kelly supposedly can.

I think we also need to think about the homegrown squad quota levels. Sturridge, Lallana, and Milner are all likely to leave within the next season or two, and the FA seem like they're thinking about increasing the number of HG players required, with a commensurate decrease in the foreign players we can use. Fucking parochialist twats.