Poll

RAWK and Brexit

No Deal!
57 (9%)
Mays Deal!
13 (2%)
No Brexit!
460 (72.3%)
Don't Know
9 (1.4%)
Don't Care
12 (1.9%)
I don't live in the UK
85 (13.4%)

Total Members Voted: 636

Author Topic: Brexit Magic Flying Rainbow coloured Unicorn jolly tip-top-ho! Gosh! Thread.  (Read 581936 times)

Offline nayia2002

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Re: Brexit Magic Flying Rainbow coloured Unicorn jolly tip-top-ho! Gosh! Thread.
« Reply #24440 on: August 16, 2019, 09:44:14 AM »
Thatís an answer to a different question...

Go back and answer my question...  I donít know the answer too it, I donít have an answer, I'm interested in what others think

No he shouldn't step aside and I'm 100% sure no other opposition leader(past/present/future) would allow a back bench mp to lead a  TEMPORARY government until a GE.
who are you to judge the life i live?
i know im not perfect-and i dont live to be,
but before you start pointing fingers make
sure your hands are clean!.

Offline nayia2002

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Re: Brexit Magic Flying Rainbow coloured Unicorn jolly tip-top-ho! Gosh! Thread.
« Reply #24441 on: August 16, 2019, 09:51:50 AM »
Kinder gentler politics. Gendered offensive language, name calling, suspicious targeting of only one of the many to leave Labour aswell. Youíre like every hard left troll on here and on Twitter.

It's all well and good calling Corbyn a c*nt/tw*t and every other word under the sun!
Some of you need to get off your high horses!
who are you to judge the life i live?
i know im not perfect-and i dont live to be,
but before you start pointing fingers make
sure your hands are clean!.

Offline Cpt_Reina

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Re: Brexit Magic Flying Rainbow coloured Unicorn jolly tip-top-ho! Gosh! Thread.
« Reply #24442 on: August 16, 2019, 09:55:22 AM »
The Lib Dem's have done plenty to erode any amount of trust or affection they might have from genuinely left leaning voters.

It really isn't a case of they're disliked because they're moderate or centrists, they're disliked because they enabled the Tories to implement nasty, damaging and cruel austerity *this decade* much of which is still being felt, still fresh in the memories of most.

They also flip flopped on their one actual policy which garnered them some amount of votes to even enable them to be able to cosign on austerity in that whole tuition fee fuck up.

Now here we are again and for the second time in my life the Lib Dems are ready to fuck shit up and undermine the one thing they claim to stand for.

They earned any and all of the vitriol they get.

Offline Zeb

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Re: Brexit Magic Flying Rainbow coloured Unicorn jolly tip-top-ho! Gosh! Thread.
« Reply #24443 on: August 16, 2019, 09:58:42 AM »
No he shouldn't step aside and I'm 100% sure no other opposition leader(past/present/future) would allow a back bench mp to lead a  TEMPORARY government until a GE.

Every government is temporary.

I actually think Corbyn is perfectly correct that he should have the first chance of forming a government. The question is who gets the chance after he fails.

----

Thought this was interesting on how voters have responded to the past few years in politics in terms of their trust in democracy and MPs etc. Via Will Jennings, one of Sky's boffins as well as a few other things including his academic career.


Obviously, you can draw your own conclusions about likely future trends given whichever outcome you see as being most likely or preferable.
« Last Edit: August 16, 2019, 10:06:01 AM by Zeb »
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Re: Brexit Magic Flying Rainbow coloured Unicorn jolly tip-top-ho! Gosh! Thread.
« Reply #24444 on: August 16, 2019, 10:01:40 AM »
No he shouldn't step aside and I'm 100% sure no other opposition leader(past/present/future) would allow a back bench mp to lead a  TEMPORARY government until a GE.

Read your history. A government with a working majority has allowed the opposition to name a replacement leader in the past.
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Re: Brexit Magic Flying Rainbow coloured Unicorn jolly tip-top-ho! Gosh! Thread.
« Reply #24445 on: August 16, 2019, 10:02:33 AM »
Remembering BJ's tactics for disposing of Gove in the leadership election, I wouldn't be surprised to see a steady stream of Tories 'joining' Corbyn's call for a VoNC to give it a false momentum.
Scepticism is the chastity of the intellect.

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Re: Brexit Magic Flying Rainbow coloured Unicorn jolly tip-top-ho! Gosh! Thread.
« Reply #24446 on: August 16, 2019, 10:07:11 AM »
Corbyn is going to need quite a few Tories, because it seems a few former Labour Indepedents aren't exactly rushing to vote for him as PM.


Offline nayia2002

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Re: Brexit Magic Flying Rainbow coloured Unicorn jolly tip-top-ho! Gosh! Thread.
« Reply #24447 on: August 16, 2019, 10:08:07 AM »


So Nayia2002 what Iím saying is if you canít even work with the likes of us placid Inbetweeners then youíve got little chance of government again if the landscape looks like changing to this multi party system for the foreseeable.




She has refused to work/cooperate with the oppision party leader to support a vonc and lead a gonu to stop no deal and call a GE which all other party leaders have accepted!

She's a lying selfish 2 faced tory bitch!
who are you to judge the life i live?
i know im not perfect-and i dont live to be,
but before you start pointing fingers make
sure your hands are clean!.

Offline naka

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Re: Brexit Magic Flying Rainbow coloured Unicorn jolly tip-top-ho! Gosh! Thread
« Reply #24448 on: August 16, 2019, 10:10:44 AM »
I think this is playing out as expected up to now, it all depends on whether Corbyn makes a bad tactical error. he is leader of the opposition, he should be the person who has the first chance to form a government so there's nothing wrong with him asking other parties to form a government with him, this is how things have always worked, the Lib Dems see Corbyn as a remainer they can't trust, they don't trust him and would never endorse him as leader so it's no suprise to hear them say they won't support him but this is the first stage, it's a opportunity for the Lib Dems to show the country they are not willing to jump into bed with Corbyn unless they are given no choice, so I wouldn't be surprised if the Lib Dems walked away telling Corbyn he has to allow another leader to be chosen or we will finish up with a no deal. Corbyn will go on record saying he's not prepared to allow another MP to be leader, imo the Lib Dems will back down and support him and we hopefully win the VONC,
Corbyn now has to campaign to win a GE, the Lib Dems will rip him apart for being prepared to allow us to crash out with no deal unless he became leader, being leader was more important to Corbyn than stopping a no deal.
a fair analysis but I believe the lib dems wont support him though.
this is on Corbyn and he knows it no matter what his aficionados think
swinson is playing a blinder throwing out names such as Clarke and harman( although am looking forward to seeing the abuse both get for daring to consider the job)
if Corbyn is so self absorbed that he would rather have a no deal  go through than not be elected then the lib dems will destroy labour at the next elections
« Last Edit: August 16, 2019, 10:17:38 AM by naka »

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Re: Brexit Magic Flying Rainbow coloured Unicorn jolly tip-top-ho! Gosh! Thread.
« Reply #24449 on: August 16, 2019, 10:13:09 AM »
The Lib Dem's have done plenty to erode any amount of trust or affection they might have from genuinely left leaning voters.

It really isn't a case of they're disliked because they're moderate or centrists, they're disliked because they enabled the Tories to implement nasty, damaging and cruel austerity *this decade* much of which is still being felt, still fresh in the memories of most.

They also flip flopped on their one actual policy which garnered them some amount of votes to even enable them to be able to cosign on austerity in that whole tuition fee fuck up.

Now here we are again and for the second time in my life the Lib Dems are ready to fuck shit up and undermine the one thing they claim to stand for.

They earned any and all of the vitriol they get.

Thank you.

Offline Red-Soldier

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Re: Brexit Magic Flying Rainbow coloured Unicorn jolly tip-top-ho! Gosh! Thread.
« Reply #24450 on: August 16, 2019, 10:14:43 AM »
Corbyn hasn't got a chance of commanding a majority in the HoC.

It's hard to see him commanding their respect either. 

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Re: Brexit Magic Flying Rainbow coloured Unicorn jolly tip-top-ho! Gosh! Thread.
« Reply #24451 on: August 16, 2019, 10:17:10 AM »


She has refused to work/cooperate with the oppision party leader to support a vonc and lead a gonu to stop no deal and call a GE which all other party leaders have accepted!

She's a lying selfish 2 faced tory bitch!

If you think this kind of ranting does anything to convince those of us who are no fans of the current Labour leadership that we are wrong in our views, I can assure you, you are very much mistaken.

Back on the issue in hand, I haven't seen much to change my view from yesterday, if Corbyn can get close enough in terms of support from other MPs, so that he can form a GNU with LD support the LDs wll fall in line after having an approriate length grump about it, but it looks even less likely today than yesterday that Corbyn can get those votes from elsewhere.

In short the LDs will fall in line if Corbyn gets the numbers (you can already see indications of this) but he almost certainly won't get the numbers.

Offline fudge

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Re: Brexit Magic Flying Rainbow coloured Unicorn jolly tip-top-ho! Gosh! Thread.
« Reply #24452 on: August 16, 2019, 10:18:47 AM »
The Lib Dem's have done plenty to erode any amount of trust or affection they might have from genuinely left leaning voters.

It really isn't a case of they're disliked because they're moderate or centrists, they're disliked because they enabled the Tories to implement nasty, damaging and cruel austerity *this decade* much of which is still being felt, still fresh in the memories of most.

They also flip flopped on their one actual policy which garnered them some amount of votes to even enable them to be able to cosign on austerity in that whole tuition fee fuck up.

Now here we are again and for the second time in my life the Lib Dems are ready to fuck shit up and undermine the one thing they claim to stand for.

They earned any and all of the vitriol they get.

As I said skeletons. If the electorate can forgive an illegal war with 100ís of thousands dead they can forgive being called to power at the countries greatest need since the Second World War.  As I said all conjecture but with labour pulling the Yes Prime Minister/New Statesmen trick of leaving the next lot to clear up your own shit whilst they rebuild and snipe from the sidelines. Even with little comedy notes to say the moneys all gone.

Dead dead easy to throw stones from glass houses but we all end shredded because every party has blood on their hands
Rubber Dinghy Rapids....

Offline filopastry

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Re: Brexit Magic Flying Rainbow coloured Unicorn jolly tip-top-ho! Gosh! Thread.
« Reply #24453 on: August 16, 2019, 10:21:49 AM »
As I said skeletons. If the electorate can forgive an illegal war with 100ís of thousands dead they can forgive being called to power at the countries greatest need since the Second World War.  As I said all conjecture but with labour pulling the Yes Prime Minister/New Statesmen trick of leaving the next lot to clear up your own shit whilst they rebuild and snipe from the sidelines. Even with little comedy notes to say the moneys all gone.

Dead dead easy to throw stones from glass houses but we all end shredded because every party has blood on their hands

All political parties fuck you over in the end, Labour have just done it more recently and under current leadership as far as I am concerned!

Offline Tepid T₂O

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Re: Brexit Magic Flying Rainbow coloured Unicorn jolly tip-top-ho! Gosh! Thread.
« Reply #24454 on: August 16, 2019, 10:23:00 AM »
As I said skeletons. If the electorate can forgive an illegal war with 100ís of thousands dead they can forgive being called to power at the countries greatest need since the Second World War.  As I said all conjecture but with labour pulling the Yes Prime Minister/New Statesmen trick of leaving the next lot to clear up your own shit whilst they rebuild and snipe from the sidelines. Even with little comedy notes to say the moneys all gone.

Dead dead easy to throw stones from glass houses but we all end shredded because every party has blood on their hands
Thatís true...

And we shouldnít forget that the Lib Demís supported the Tories because they wanted to change the voting system to make politics in this country  fairer

It would have revolutionised the way our country worked.  That was an admirable aspiration.. 
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Offline fudge

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Re: Brexit Magic Flying Rainbow coloured Unicorn jolly tip-top-ho! Gosh! Thread.
« Reply #24455 on: August 16, 2019, 10:25:34 AM »


She has refused to work/cooperate with the oppision party leader to support a vonc and lead a gonu to stop no deal and call a GE which all other party leaders have accepted!

She's a lying selfish 2 faced tory bitch!

🤣 half his own MPís canít stand Corbyn and youíre worrying about what the LIb Dems have to say, which btw is the main reason sheís saying she canít work with him because any concept of unity goes out of the window with the Labour and Tory MPís who wonít work with him.

Rubber Dinghy Rapids....

Offline nayia2002

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Re: Brexit Magic Flying Rainbow coloured Unicorn jolly tip-top-ho! Gosh! Thread.
« Reply #24456 on: August 16, 2019, 10:25:52 AM »
The Lib Dem's have done plenty to erode any amount of trust or affection they might have from genuinely left leaning voters.

It really isn't a case of they're disliked because they're moderate or centrists, they're disliked because they enabled the Tories to implement nasty, damaging and cruel austerity *this decade* much of which is still being felt, still fresh in the memories of most.

They also flip flopped on their one actual policy which garnered them some amount of votes to even enable them to be able to cosign on austerity in that whole tuition fee fuck up.

Now here we are again and for the second time in my life the Lib Dems are ready to fuck shit up and undermine the one thing they claim to stand for.

They earned any and all of the vitriol they get.

100% well said mate
who are you to judge the life i live?
i know im not perfect-and i dont live to be,
but before you start pointing fingers make
sure your hands are clean!.

Offline fudge

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Re: Brexit Magic Flying Rainbow coloured Unicorn jolly tip-top-ho! Gosh! Thread.
« Reply #24457 on: August 16, 2019, 10:26:44 AM »
Thatís true...

And we shouldnít forget that the Lib Demís supported the Tories because they wanted to change the voting system to make politics in this country  fairer

It would have revolutionised the way our country worked.  That was an admirable aspiration.. 

Thatís the biggest regret and missed opportunity I believe . Wouldíve genuinely improved this countries democracy
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Offline Tepid T₂O

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Re: Brexit Magic Flying Rainbow coloured Unicorn jolly tip-top-ho! Gosh! Thread.
« Reply #24458 on: August 16, 2019, 10:27:08 AM »
🤣 half his own MPís canít stand Corbyn and youíre worrying about what the LIb Dems have to say, which btw is the main reason sheís saying she canít work with him because any concept of unity goes out of the window with the Labour and Tory MPís who wonít work with him.


Itís about 80% who donít have confidence in him...


Plus there are Tories who will say they will support a vonc just to screw up the numbers
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Re: Brexit Magic Flying Rainbow coloured Unicorn jolly tip-top-ho! Gosh! Thread.
« Reply #24459 on: August 16, 2019, 10:28:45 AM »
Bemused? You shouldn't be.

For the far left, the true enemy aren't the Tories or other right wing parties - they are their opponents and are truly necessary for their existence. They can campaign against them, rage against their policies and uncaring actions, sometimes beating them in elections (in theory), more often losing to them (and let's face it, they probably secretly prefer that as it avoids the messy compromises of actually governing).

No, their true enemy are other parties of the left and centre-left - be they social democrats or liberals. Because those parties show that progressive politics can be successful, both electorally and in governing, without being stuck in the old far left mindset. And in doing so, render the existence of the far left as redundant (certainly as a serious electoral force). That's why you'll see their really visceral hatred directed at those parties you might expect to be political allies.

I can recognise this 100%
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Offline Tepid T₂O

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Re: Brexit Magic Flying Rainbow coloured Unicorn jolly tip-top-ho! Gosh! Thread.
« Reply #24460 on: August 16, 2019, 10:29:35 AM »
Thatís the biggest regret and missed opportunity I believe . Wouldíve genuinely improved this countries democracy
Indeed....

And in response they promised to support the Tories.

Now the general feeling is that they shouldnít have done this and they should have gone back on their word.

However, we also want politicians who are honest and do what they actually say...

So itís complex.
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Offline Classycara

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Re: Brexit Magic Flying Rainbow coloured Unicorn jolly tip-top-ho! Gosh! Thread.
« Reply #24461 on: August 16, 2019, 10:29:58 AM »
100% well said mate
And all without a hint of misogyny. You should take note.

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Re: Brexit Magic Flying Rainbow coloured Unicorn jolly tip-top-ho! Gosh! Thread.
« Reply #24462 on: August 16, 2019, 10:31:27 AM »
As I said skeletons. If the electorate can forgive an illegal war with 100ís of thousands dead they can forgive being called to power at the countries greatest need since the Second World War.  As I said all conjecture but with labour pulling the Yes Prime Minister/New Statesmen trick of leaving the next lot to clear up your own shit whilst they rebuild and snipe from the sidelines. Even with little comedy notes to say the moneys all gone.

Dead dead easy to throw stones from glass houses but we all end shredded because every party has blood on their hands

If I had any sort of confidence the Lib Dems wouldn't do it all over again if afforded the opportunity I might agree they should be cut some slack, alas here we are and the first opportunity they have to act like the sensible centrists they claim to be and avoid no deal and Swinson steams out of the traps to make a needless and reckless move which flies in the face of what the party has claimed it stands for.

Offline Tepid T₂O

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Re: Brexit Magic Flying Rainbow coloured Unicorn jolly tip-top-ho! Gosh! Thread.
« Reply #24463 on: August 16, 2019, 10:33:00 AM »
If I had any sort of confidence the Lib Dems wouldn't do it all over again if afforded the opportunity I might agree they should be cut some slack, alas here we are and the first opportunity they have to act like the sensible centrists they claim to be and avoid no deal and Swinson steams out of the traps to make a needless and reckless move which flies in the face of what the party has claimed it stands for.
What reckless move is that?

(Bit lost here)
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Re: Brexit Magic Flying Rainbow coloured Unicorn jolly tip-top-ho! Gosh! Thread.
« Reply #24464 on: August 16, 2019, 10:33:47 AM »
Itís about 80% who donít have confidence in him...


Plus there are Tories who will say they will support a vonc just to screw up the numbers

I was plucking figures I honestly donít know
Itís about 80% who donít have confidence in him...


Plus there are Tories who will say they will support a vonc just to screw up the numbers

So regardless of what I think about the Corbyn- Momentum- Watson spat it just rams how the fuck anyone can start reviling the Lib Demís when their own party is utterly dysfunctional and unfit for purpose

Oh and by the way that doesnít make me happy this country desperately needs a strong Labour , unfortunately itís balsa wood at the mo.
« Last Edit: August 16, 2019, 10:35:31 AM by fudge »
Rubber Dinghy Rapids....

Offline filopastry

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Re: Brexit Magic Flying Rainbow coloured Unicorn jolly tip-top-ho! Gosh! Thread.
« Reply #24465 on: August 16, 2019, 10:35:54 AM »
At this stage its not even clear the numbers are there to pass a VONC never mind to get a GNU in play.

The remaining Change MPs saying they won't support a VONC unless its clear there are the numbers in Parliament to get a GNU inp place, otherwise the VONC would just allow Johnson to run out the time on Article 50 by calling an election after it had expired

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Re: Brexit Magic Flying Rainbow coloured Unicorn jolly tip-top-ho! Gosh! Thread.
« Reply #24466 on: August 16, 2019, 10:37:52 AM »
If I had any sort of confidence the Lib Dems wouldn't do it all over again if afforded the opportunity I might agree they should be cut some slack, alas here we are and the first opportunity they have to act like the sensible centrists they claim to be and avoid no deal and Swinson steams out of the traps to make a needless and reckless move which flies in the face of what the party has claimed it stands for.

Probably a bit early to call it a reckless move, no? Maybe if the VONC had already been tabled by Labour as hoped, it could be argued to be potentially reckless.

Labour's prioritising of a bukake over a couple of hundred SWP weirdos in parliament square over tabling the motion, as it stands, is looking far more reckless and concerning at this point.
« Last Edit: August 16, 2019, 10:39:57 AM by Classycara »

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Re: Brexit Magic Flying Rainbow coloured Unicorn jolly tip-top-ho! Gosh! Thread.
« Reply #24467 on: August 16, 2019, 10:37:58 AM »
At this stage its not even clear the numbers are there to pass a VONC never mind to get a GNU in play.

The remaining Change MPs saying they won't support a VONC unless its clear there are the numbers in Parliament to get a GNU inp place, otherwise the VONC would just allow Johnson to run out the time on Article 50 by calling an election after it had expired
And they do raise an important point with that...l

Fuck knows what we do to be honest.
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Re: Brexit Magic Flying Rainbow coloured Unicorn jolly tip-top-ho! Gosh! Thread.
« Reply #24468 on: August 16, 2019, 10:39:11 AM »
If I had any sort of confidence the Lib Dems wouldn't do it all over again if afforded the opportunity I might agree they should be cut some slack, alas here we are and the first opportunity they have to act like the sensible centrists they claim to be and avoid no deal and Swinson steams out of the traps to make a needless and reckless move which flies in the face of what the party has claimed it stands for.

Btw I donít see the angle here and agree that Swinson shouldnít be ruling out anything at this stage.

I think the party realises who their natural bedfellows are and whilst you canít rule out ever working with another party if the country needs it , such as now for example it makes perfect sense for Labour,Lib dems, Greens , Plaid and the SNP to work collaboratively.  Itís been shown what working with the Tories costs you and quite rightly too
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Re: Brexit Magic Flying Rainbow coloured Unicorn jolly tip-top-ho! Gosh! Thread.
« Reply #24469 on: August 16, 2019, 10:43:17 AM »
What reckless move is that?

(Bit lost here)

Refusing to work with a Corbyn led GoNU before waiting to see if he even had the numbers to make it happen. Refusing to do so before even the Tories invited along had done so.

What happens if he can make the numbers work and the 'anti brexit, we're grown ups we need to work across party lines' party has already flat out refused to allow him to prevent no deal? Another 180 from the party that's only ever so willing to do one.

Offline The Gulleysucker

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Re: Brexit Magic Flying Rainbow coloured Unicorn jolly tip-top-ho! Gosh! Thread.
« Reply #24470 on: August 16, 2019, 10:45:08 AM »
... A minority government in this house won't be able to do anything beyond a narrow scope pre-agreed with all of its backers.


I've read some suggestions (though not well sourced) that the idea of immediate proroguing could be technically possible as one of the first acts of a PM once power is gained in order to bypass such constraints. I hope for everyones sakes that this is unfounded, and just not possible.

I understand that some were quite keen on Boris actually doing it first in order to then set a precedent within the current political landscape for such a thing.



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Offline Tepid T₂O

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Re: Brexit Magic Flying Rainbow coloured Unicorn jolly tip-top-ho! Gosh! Thread.
« Reply #24471 on: August 16, 2019, 10:49:50 AM »
Refusing to work with a Corbyn led GoNU before waiting to see if he even had the numbers to make it happen. Refusing to do so before even the Tories invited along had done so.

What happens if he can make the numbers work and the 'anti brexit, we're grown ups we need to work across party lines' party has already flat out refused to allow him to prevent no deal? Another 180 from the party that's only ever so willing to do one.
I see what you meant now...

So, should we we be backing an antisemite as prime minister?
Will he put off too many Tories from a VONC?
Can we trust him not to force through a Brexit of his own if we do?

Iím guessing this is their thinking ....

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Re: Brexit Magic Flying Rainbow coloured Unicorn jolly tip-top-ho! Gosh! Thread.
« Reply #24472 on: August 16, 2019, 10:49:58 AM »
No, I donít agree. 

I donít agree with what he says, but if Iím going to describe Corbyn asa useless c*nt, heís got every right to do the same to Swinson
It can be criticised from the perspective of 'the left', though. The old hard left (influenced by proper 1970s feminism) wouldn't have been seen dead describing a female MP as a bitch or a cow. Apparently the new hard left doesn't mind so much.
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Re: Brexit Magic Flying Rainbow coloured Unicorn jolly tip-top-ho! Gosh! Thread.
« Reply #24473 on: August 16, 2019, 10:51:16 AM »
Not sure if it's registered with current Labour supporters, but moderate Tory voters - the ones who kept austerity going for 9 years and counting - will choose Johnson over Corbyn in a general election. And they'll not vote Lib Dem if Swinson puts Corbyn into power for however long before a general election. And if that doesn't happen then Labour doesn't get even a minority government supported by the Lib Dems on a vote by vote basis. Pyrrhic victories and all that.
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Re: Brexit Magic Flying Rainbow coloured Unicorn jolly tip-top-ho! Gosh! Thread.
« Reply #24474 on: August 16, 2019, 10:51:25 AM »
If I had any sort of confidence the Lib Dems wouldn't do it all over again if afforded the opportunity I might agree they should be cut some slack, alas here we are and the first opportunity they have to act like the sensible centrists they claim to be and avoid no deal and Swinson steams out of the traps to make a needless and reckless move which flies in the face of what the party has claimed it stands for.

This might be a stupid question, but it's an honest one;

Why are the Lib-dems not forgiven as a party for the coalition, but only "blairites" responsible for the Iraq war? Why can Blair be separated from Labour, but not Clegg from the Lib-dems?

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Re: Brexit Magic Flying Rainbow coloured Unicorn jolly tip-top-ho! Gosh! Thread.
« Reply #24475 on: August 16, 2019, 10:51:48 AM »
It can be criticised from the perspective of 'the left', though. The old hard left (influenced by proper 1970s feminism) wouldn't have been seen dead describing a female MP as a bitch or a cow. Apparently the new hard left doesn't mind so much.

Yeah, thatís a fair point...

I was just considering his use of invective, but of course it shouldnít be because sheís a woman.
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Re: Brexit Magic Flying Rainbow coloured Unicorn jolly tip-top-ho! Gosh! Thread.
« Reply #24476 on: August 16, 2019, 10:52:36 AM »
I've read some suggestions (though not well sourced) that the idea of immediate proroguing could be technically possible as one of the first acts of a PM once power is gained in order to bypass such constraints. I hope for everyones sakes that this is unfounded, and just not possible.

I understand that some were quite keen on Boris actually doing it first in order to then set a precedent within the current political landscape for such a thing.





I still think Johnson is more interested in being seen to be doing anything he can to force through No Deal by 31st October before a GE can be called than he is in actually doing it.

He needs to be seen to be pushing for it as hard as possible to cannibalise the Brexit Party vote, particularly if he ends up fighting an election before Brexit is delivered, but it means he isn't fighting an election in possible chaos of the period just after a No Deal Brexit has gone through that he is responsible for.

I certainly don't think he would be crying if he was blocked and had to fight a GE on a People v Parliament campaign.

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Re: Brexit Magic Flying Rainbow coloured Unicorn jolly tip-top-ho! Gosh! Thread.
« Reply #24477 on: August 16, 2019, 10:53:37 AM »
Utterly bemused by this visceral hatred for the Lib Demís, proper Life of Brian splitter stuff.
I agree with all of this - but reserve the right to point out (from the 'soft left') that Swinson has misjudged and overplayed her position on this occasion, though. A Corbyn led GNU may well have struggled to get the numbers, but it shouldn't have been the leader of the Lib Dems ruling him out, for what seems to be playing a little party politics of her own to be seen as the 'honest broker' of cross party talks. Win a couple of hundred seats and become the official opposition if you want to play at being leader of the opposition. As it is, Swinson has backed Corbyn into a corner which isn't good for anyone who wants to avoid No Deal.

She's still a relatively inexperienced and naive political leader. The vastly more experienced and astute Sturgeon - while having if anything greater recent hostility to the Labour party - has taken a very different approach.
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Re: Brexit Magic Flying Rainbow coloured Unicorn jolly tip-top-ho! Gosh! Thread.
« Reply #24478 on: August 16, 2019, 10:55:53 AM »
I agree with all of this - but reserve the right to point out (from the 'soft left') that Swinson has misjudged and overplayed her position on this occasion, though. A Corbyn led GNU may well have struggled to get the numbers, but it shouldn't have been the leader of the Lib Dems ruling him out, for what seems to be playing a little party politics of her own to be seen as the 'honest broker' of cross party talks. Win a couple of hundred seats and become the official opposition if you want to play at being leader of the opposition. As it is, Swinson has backed Corbyn into a corner which isn't good for anyone who wants to avoid No Deal.



I agree it was a misstep, and as predicted she already seems to be pulling back from it, now willing to talk to Labour to see how a GNU could be made to work, while still saying she doesn't believe the numbers are there with Corbyn leading.

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Re: Brexit Magic Flying Rainbow coloured Unicorn jolly tip-top-ho! Gosh! Thread.
« Reply #24479 on: August 16, 2019, 10:56:30 AM »
This might be a stupid question, but it's an honest one;

Why are the Lib-dems not forgiven as a party for the coalition, but only "blairites" responsible for the Iraq war? Why can Blair be separated from Labour, but not Clegg from the Lib-dems?

Because the labour party has moved significantly to the left since the Blair years and looks to be an altogether different party?

Can the same be said of the Lib Dems? What differentiates this iteration of the LD's from Clegg's?