Topic: Pep Lijnders

[Peabee]

He's definitely a great coach. But it's such an unknown quantity making that step up to management. There's the issue of tactics, in game management and leadership capabilities.

Not saying that Pep doesn't have these or doesn't contribute his fair share already, but there have been plenty of technically brilliant coaches making the step up who have severely lacked the key aspects of management.

Those in the club will know better, and FSG are certainly no sentimentalists, so if he does, then I have every confidence they have made the right decision.

Is he not getting some of that experience in the cup games? He’s responsible for tactics, in game management, leadership, as you mention, plus he’s dealing with all the media responsibilities for each game. I know it’s limited experience, but it’s still more than coaching.

[tornado]

I just hope Klopp can go on for ever, but more realistically given the demands of the game, he will probably leave sometime soon
Dream scenario if we can convince him for a sabbatical - the only one then who can fill in for 6mos - one year can be someone like Pep, no elite established coach will do that.

Well, if wishes were horses....

[CraigDS]

I wouldn't be sad if Pep took the reins for a period.  The main thing would be that he was surrounded by strong leaders that understand the current set up, such as Milner and Henderson, rather than any ex-player whose frame of reference is former managers and players.

It’s ok. You can say Gerrard you know 

[RyanBabel19]

Peps a brilliant assistant, always speaks very well on the game

I do wonder how good of a manager he is though. I know he's around the set up every day and will have learned a load from Klopp and our other coaches but wasn't a huge criticism of Gerrard (merely as an example) his lack of experience as a manager which meant he couldn't take over from Klopp? Pep has even less

[Lynx the saucy mynx]

It’s ok. You can say Gerrard you know 

Maybe he was talking about Ole 

[FlashGordon]

Peps a brilliant assistant, always speaks very well on the game

I do wonder how good of a manager he is though. I know he's around the set up every day and will have learned a load from Klopp and our other coaches but wasn't a huge criticism of Gerrard (merely as an example) his lack of experience as a manager which meant he couldn't take over from Klopp? Pep has even less

For myself anyway, the only way I could stomach a lack of managerial experience in the next manager is if he comes from withing the existing set up.

[thaddeus]

Peps a brilliant assistant, always speaks very well on the game

I do wonder how good of a manager he is though. I know he's around the set up every day and will have learned a load from Klopp and our other coaches but wasn't a huge criticism of Gerrard (merely as an example) his lack of experience as a manager which meant he couldn't take over from Klopp? Pep has even less

I'm trying not to compare Ljinders to Klopp as it's unfair on almost every manager in world football.  Ljinders has strengths which I'm sure Klopp would admit he doesn't, it's why they compliment each other so well.  If Ljinders were to become our new manager then he would need to bring in as assistant manager that likewise had strengths where Ljinders doesn't.  Fergie's tactical approach was largely dictated by his assistant managers, the more tactical Houllier brought in Phil Thompson to be his enforcer.

Ljinders is never going to have the force of personality, the aura, that Klopp has.  The big bear hugs.  The side-line grimaces.  The effortless take-downs of interviewers with ulterior motives.  Maybe in the grand scheme those things don't really amount to much anyway and what Klopp and Ljinders have in common is what matters.

Like you though, I'd be nervous in handing over a team that will likely need a rebuild to some extent to anybody that hasn't got a strong track record.  When the time sadly comes it won't be like Zidane cutting his teeth at a star-studded Real Madrid where even a disastrous season by their standards would still result in a third placed finish - the Premier League is an unforgiving place.

[Coolie High]

I wouldn't be sad if Pep took the reins for a period.  The main thing would be that he was surrounded by strong leaders that understand the current set up, such as Milner and Henderson, rather than any ex-player whose frame of reference is former managers and players.

Gerrard has way more experience and actual success as a first team manager than Pep.

[Schmidt]

Peps a brilliant assistant, always speaks very well on the game

I do wonder how good of a manager he is though. I know he's around the set up every day and will have learned a load from Klopp and our other coaches but wasn't a huge criticism of Gerrard (merely as an example) his lack of experience as a manager which meant he couldn't take over from Klopp? Pep has even less

There are other question marks with Gerrard though, his style of play seems wildly different from Klopp's, and is a lot closer to the type of set up that many journeyman British managers have used in the past. We also don't know how much control he likes to have, would we have the same issues that we had with Rodgers wanting his own targets? Would he give the medical team as much authority as Klopp appears to, or would he want players to play through the pain like he often did?

On top of that, when you hear the top managers talk about football they talk about very specific details that are rarely picked up on by the commentators and pundits, rather than talking in cliches and 'footballisms' I guess. Ljinders has talked a lot about these tiny details that they work on and has shown that he is a huge part of the way we've evolved and grown with Klopp, keeping things fresh to ensure teams don't easily work us out. Maybe Gerrard works on similar things behind closed doors, but he feels closer to another Moyes than the next Klopp, at least for now.

Ljinders seems to have a great rapport with the players, and if he is the transition plan then it would allow us to begin to bring in some younger players in Klopp's final seasons, giving Ljinders time to work with those players in a lower pressure environment before taking the big job.

None of this is meant as an attack on Stevie despite how it might look, I'm just very wary of us making the sentimental choice that Arsenal, United and Chelsea have all made in recent seasons. If Gerrard wasn't an ex-player who is often talked up for the job in the media, he wouldn't be in the frame at all.

[naka]

Gerrard has way more experience and actual success as a first team manager than Pep.

really hope stevie is nowhere near the discussion when we are choosing Klopps successor.
he needs to move from scotland to a team like brighton etc and get them moving like potts has before we can view him as a reds manager

[Coolie High]

really hope stevie is nowhere near the discussion when we are choosing Klopps successor.
he needs to move from scotland to a team like brighton etc and get them moving like potts has before we can view him as a reds manager

Yes I ageee but using that logic Pep shouldn’t be in the frame either, the one time he tried to be a first team manager he failed badly, in Netherlands.

[RyanBabel19]

There are other question marks with Gerrard though, his style of play seems wildly different from Klopp's, and is a lot closer to the type of set up that many journeyman British managers have used in the past. We also don't know how much control he likes to have, would we have the same issues that we had with Rodgers wanting his own targets? Would he give the medical team as much authority as Klopp appears to, or would he want players to play through the pain like he often did?

On top of that, when you hear the top managers talk about football they talk about very specific details that are rarely picked up on by the commentators and pundits, rather than talking in cliches and 'footballisms' I guess. Ljinders has talked a lot about these tiny details that they work on and has shown that he is a huge part of the way we've evolved and grown with Klopp, keeping things fresh to ensure teams don't easily work us out. Maybe Gerrard works on similar things behind closed doors, but he feels closer to another Moyes than the next Klopp, at least for now.

Ljinders seems to have a great rapport with the players, and if he is the transition plan then it would allow us to begin to bring in some younger players in Klopp's final seasons, giving Ljinders time to work with those players in a lower pressure environment before taking the big job.

None of this is meant as an attack on Stevie despite how it might look, I'm just very wary of us making the sentimental choice that Arsenal, United and Chelsea have all made in recent seasons. If Gerrard wasn't an ex-player who is often talked up for the job in the media, he wouldn't be in the frame at all.

Again Stevie was merely an example and i'm not saying anything you've said is wrong but you could make the same kind of post outlining why Ljinders wouldn't be a realistic choice as the next manager.

It's great seeing Ljinders talk about the game, its actually fascinating but at the same time I do wonder if a lot is a case of 'he works in our set up and we get told he's a good coach so it makes sense'. How much of what is used as reasons for Ljinders to be a good appointment actually relates to him being a good manager? Very little is ever used that is concrete in terms of managing a side.

I'm not saying Stevie is the man for the job when the time comes, in fact i'd have many reservations about that appointment BUT I do think Ljinders is talked up so much for some reasons that other sides would get laughed at were they appointing a manager in that same scenario.

I think being an actual manager is becoming slightly devalued in the game in favour of some who haven't actually successfully done it. Not just with us but I keep seeing calls for next choices to be men who don't have any successful management experience, coaching is obviously not something to be ignored and the step up CAN be made, but surely there's a reason so few have stepped into these huge jobs with so little experience of being the main man and just aced it.

Waves of managers are deemed poor nowadays and sometimes coaches are almost talked up as being superior or more deserving of opportunities despite inferior records in the job they're being talked up for. I LOVE our playstyle but it wouldn't be insane for it to change once  Klopp does go, in fact it's pretty normal in the game but there's almost this clamour for it to remain so much so that it's like it's a given we must hire someone who does the same

[Coolie High]

There are other question marks with Gerrard though, his style of play seems wildly different from Klopp's, and is a lot closer to the type of set up that many journeyman British managers have used in the past. We also don't know how much control he likes to have, would we have the same issues that we had with Rodgers wanting his own targets? Would he give the medical team as much authority as Klopp appears to, or would he want players to play through the pain like he often did?

On top of that, when you hear the top managers talk about football they talk about very specific details that are rarely picked up on by the commentators and pundits, rather than talking in cliches and 'footballisms' I guess. Ljinders has talked a lot about these tiny details that they work on and has shown that he is a huge part of the way we've evolved and grown with Klopp, keeping things fresh to ensure teams don't easily work us out. Maybe Gerrard works on similar things behind closed doors, but he feels closer to another Moyes than the next Klopp, at least for now.

Ljinders seems to have a great rapport with the players, and if he is the transition plan then it would allow us to begin to bring in some younger players in Klopp's final seasons, giving Ljinders time to work with those players in a lower pressure environment before taking the big job.

None of this is meant as an attack on Stevie despite how it might look, I'm just very wary of us making the sentimental choice that Arsenal, United and Chelsea have all made in recent seasons. If Gerrard wasn't an ex-player who is often talked up for the job in the media, he wouldn't be in the frame at all.

Being a coach is different from being a first team manager has pep himself will attest to. And how many games of Rangers and Gerrard have you analysed to come to the conclusion his style of play is like British journeyman managers of the past, other than the fact he is British?

Did you ever watch many games of Peps time in Netherlands also?

[Coolie High]

Again Stevie was merely an example and i'm not saying anything you've said is wrong but you could make the same kind of post outlining why Ljinders wouldn't be a realistic choice as the next manager.

It's great seeing Ljinders talk about the game, its actually fascinating but at the same time I do wonder if a lot is a case of 'he works in our set up and we get told he's a good coach so it makes sense'. How much of what is used as reasons for Ljinders to be a good appointment actually relates to him being a good manager? Very little is ever used that is concrete in terms of managing a side.

I'm not saying Stevie is the man for the job when the time comes, in fact i'd have many reservations about that appointment BUT I do think Ljinders is talked up so much for some reasons that other sides would get laughed at were they appointing a manager in that same scenario.

I think being an actual manager is becoming slightly devalued in the game in favour of some who haven't actually successfully done it. Not just with us but I keep seeing calls for next choices to be men who don't have any successful management experience, coaching is obviously not something to be ignored and the step up CAN be made, but surely there's a reason so few have stepped into these huge jobs with so little experience of being the main man and just aced it.

Exactly.

[the_red_pill]

Give Klopp his 6 months to a year off and have Pep take control for that period.

Yep.. IF he decides to continue in Football, that is.
How different things would have been if we just had the good fortune to go back to Kenny after a year? But then I understand why we didn't. The respect we had for him, was just too great and the toll it all took on him visiting all those funerals.
By all accounts, it appeared he was "done" with Football after that.

In any case, it's an outrageous idea to begin with, but..... it won't hurt to entertain the possibility.
"Nothing ventured, nothing gained" excetera...

[WhereAngelsPlay]

He's a top coach but should get nowhere near the managers seat.Also the pipe dream that Klopp would take a year off on the understanding that he would then come back is nuts,he wouldn't be able to relax and enjoy his break,so what would be the point of taking it.

[Schmidt]

Again Stevie was merely an example and i'm not saying anything you've said is wrong but you could make the same kind of post outlining why Ljinders wouldn't be a realistic choice as the next manager.

It's great seeing Ljinders talk about the game, its actually fascinating but at the same time I do wonder if a lot is a case of 'he works in our set up and we get told he's a good coach so it makes sense'. How much of what is used as reasons for Ljinders to be a good appointment actually relates to him being a good manager? Very little is ever used that is concrete in terms of managing a side.

I'm not saying Stevie is the man for the job when the time comes, in fact i'd have many reservations about that appointment BUT I do think Ljinders is talked up so much for some reasons that other sides would get laughed at were they appointing a manager in that same scenario.

I think being an actual manager is becoming slightly devalued in the game in favour of some who haven't actually successfully done it. Not just with us but I keep seeing calls for next choices to be men who don't have any successful management experience, coaching is obviously not something to be ignored and the step up CAN be made, but surely there's a reason so few have stepped into these huge jobs with so little experience of being the main man and just aced it.

Waves of managers are deemed poor nowadays and sometimes coaches are almost talked up as being superior or more deserving of opportunities despite inferior records in the job they're being talked up for. I LOVE our playstyle but it wouldn't be insane for it to change once  Klopp does go, in fact it's pretty normal in the game but there's almost this clamour for it to remain so much so that it's like it's a given we must hire someone who does the same

The main reason for thinking Ljinders is a good coach is that he's been getting consistent promotions at the club during a period of success under one of the greatest managers we've had. There's more to management than coaching of course but a lot of what he does will translate. Klopp also seems to foster an environment of responsibility at the club, he hires the best people and gives them autonomy, rather than wanting control of everything, which makes the transition easier for Pep as a lot of the knowledge he needs outside of coaching should still be at the club when Klopp leaves.

I don't think we'd laugh at another club promoting from within, especially when the person potentially being promoted has been through all levels of the club and is there on merit, not due to their playing career or past relationships. I think a lot of clubs have tried to replicate Guardiola's rise at Barcelona but have gone about it the wrong way, focusing more on the past player aspect, rather than looking to develop coaches internally. I think we've done everything we can to develop Ljinders at the club, I guess the question now is whether he has the ability to make that step up without a lot of management experience.

[RedSince86]

Totally agreed. The last thing we need is a “Class of 92” situation like at United.

They mentioned this on the Guardian’s Football Weekly podcast this week. How United have developed a policy of just letting in random ex-players into pivotal roles.

It's strange because clubs like Ajax, Barca, Real, Bayern are well known for always having ex players in pivotal roles from executive to coaching.

For some reason the class of 92 all have the combined football IQ of a gnat, is it no wonder not one of them has done anything of note in the game (Salford they have the help of a Singaporean billionaire who threw money with the class of 92 being the faces of the club), same with all the United players under Fergie who went into the game, all mid table/relegation fodder and no where near winning a trophy.

Long may Fergie's influence continue at the club.

[Dim Glas]

He's a top coach but should get nowhere near the managers seat.Also the pipe dream that Klopp would take a year off on the understanding that he would then come back is nuts,he wouldn't be able to relax and enjoy his break,so what would be the point of taking it.

exactly, once he is done, he’s moving back to Germany.

One note of interst I guess though is his next move - many sort of presumed it’d be take a break, then Germany job, but I fully expect Flick to have a Löw type residency, and be the manager for a long long time.

And I honestly can’t see Kloppo wanting to start another new club project after this, he’ll be around 58 then, the intensity with which he works, that’s one heck of an ask, to do another Dortmund or Liverpool type build. 

Anyway! Not going to dwell on it too much now, just enjoy the ride 

[the_red_pill]

One of the things I think is important to a successful manager is familiarity with the club and everyone around it.
Familiarity with how things are done, what is expected, the "culture", the people, the opponents, the past matches and tactics etc..

I do think Pep's technical excellence does not guarantee he would make a good manager, but everything around him is being setup for that, and it looks like he is being groomed- or perhaps Jurgen being Jurgen- believing in empowerment and improvement, he just hands him the responsibilities of the League Cup.

I think stepping from the outside in for a manager, may make it harder to succeed than being promoted from within (BUT AFTER PROVING YOURSELF and Pep has already done that)
Pep's got another advantage in that he knows that he had been partly responsible for the success at the club- and the winning football the club plays at all ages, is due in a small part to him.
Otoh, promotions from within can also be disastrous, BUT a lot of times, the incumbent isn't as dedicated and committed as Pep or have been exposed to, or given the same amount of exposure as Pep has seen.

Pep's already being exposed in a supportive, calm environment and importantly- a successful environment, to Management (contrast to his short stint). You don't get to brief the press ahead of the manager, before a game if you're in ANY other club. (and what with a successful manager at that?).

The only thing that really is a danger and an unknown is how he will he respond at his first period of prolonged disappointment and run of not-so-good results. That's the big question for me. How will he respond to it and how will he get out?

[newterp]

exactly, once he is done, he’s moving back to Germany.

One note of interst I guess though is his next move - many sort of presumed it’d be take a break, then Germany job, but I fully expect Flick to have a Löw type residency, and be the manager for a long long time.

And I honestly can’t see Kloppo wanting to start another new club project after this, he’ll be around 58 then, the intensity with which he works, that’s one heck of an ask, to do another Dortmund or Liverpool type build. 

Anyway! Not going to dwell on it too much now, just enjoy the ride 

which is why I think he's going to surprise everyone and do one more extension with us.

[S]

I really don't get the objections some have toward Lijnders taking over. To be clear, we're not talking about taking over tomorrow. We're talking about when Klopp leaves. So that's in 2024 most likely. That's another three years of Lijnders working under him, gradually getting more and more experience. In the scenario where he takes over from Klopp, it's because he's been steadily taking on more responsibility to the point where he is essentially a first team manager of sorts anyway.

Two things about it make perfect sense to me. One is the simple fact that this is the best period the club have enjoyed for a long, long time. It makes sense to prolong that with continuity and nobody is more familiar with the setup than Lijnders. The second is, I admit, guesswork on my part. I think if Klopp himself were to choose a successor, he'd choose Pep Lijnders. That matters because Klopp isn't some mercenary hopping from club to club who would be doing it to help a mate. He will care about the long term wellbeing of the club when he leaves. Seeing as he's the one who has taken us to the success we've experienced, I'd trust his views when it comes to sustaining it.

[the_red_pill]

I really don't get the objections some have toward Lijnders taking over. To be clear, we're not talking about taking over tomorrow. We're talking about when Klopp leaves. So that's in 2024 most likely. That's another three years of Lijnders working under him, gradually getting more and more experience. In the scenario where he takes over from Klopp, it's because he's been steadily taking on more responsibility to the point where he is essentially a first team manager of sorts anyway.

Two things about it make perfect sense to me. One is the simple fact that this is the best period the club have enjoyed for a long, long time. It makes sense to prolong that with continuity and nobody is more familiar with the setup than Lijnders. The second is, I admit, guesswork on my part. I think if Klopp himself were to choose a successor, he'd choose Pep Lijnders. That matters because Klopp isn't some mercenary hopping from club to club who would be doing it to help a mate. He will care about the long term wellbeing of the club when he leaves. Seeing as he's the one who has taken us to the success we've experienced, I'd trust his views when it comes to sustaining it.

Agree mate and it does appear that he's being groomed- even if just to perform the role as interim should anything happen. Like I said- the only worrying thing for me is how he will handle disappointment. That's a barometer for me. As a manager- can he handle prolonged years of stress and expectation to perform in and out.

Also... Pep's been involved in building a legacy- at 48 years of age already at this club.
Remember that 433 is Pep's preferred formation and so Jurgen- although he has his preferred formation, has agreed with Pep and so that's the formation Liverpool play at all age groups basically, and the players' technical proficiency and the standard they are expected to perfrom at in the roles/responsibilites in that system, is also down to Pep to a large extent- throughout all age groups.

It reminds me of the work the assistant coaches must have performed behind the scenes during the time Shanks was rebuilding the club. The man's already been a big part of overhauling an entire club's football, and a big club at that- to a winning setup, with winning football and a system that has proven to himself and others to be a succesful formula- even outperforming the oil clubs.

[thaddeus]

I really don't get the objections some have toward Lijnders taking over. To be clear, we're not talking about taking over tomorrow. We're talking about when Klopp leaves. So that's in 2024 most likely. That's another three years of Lijnders working under him, gradually getting more and more experience. In the scenario where he takes over from Klopp, it's because he's been steadily taking on more responsibility to the point where he is essentially a first team manager of sorts anyway.

Two things about it make perfect sense to me. One is the simple fact that this is the best period the club have enjoyed for a long, long time. It makes sense to prolong that with continuity and nobody is more familiar with the setup than Lijnders. The second is, I admit, guesswork on my part. I think if Klopp himself were to choose a successor, he'd choose Pep Lijnders. That matters because Klopp isn't some mercenary hopping from club to club who would be doing it to help a mate. He will care about the long term wellbeing of the club when he leaves. Seeing as he's the one who has taken us to the success we've experienced, I'd trust his views when it comes to sustaining it.

I'm sure Man U fans would have said the same about Ferguson.  Perhaps even more so as Fergie stayed with the club afterwards and, judging by the sick look on his face at the weekend, is very much Man U to the bitter end.  They have lurched all over the place since and are currently managed by somebody that is poles apart from Ferguson but has the "right DNA".

That's not me saying you're wrong but just pointing out that taking the views of the current manager, no matter how great, on board when picking a replacement brings no guarantees of continuity or sustaining the success.

I'm right on the fence with Ljinders.  I'm sure more will become clear over the next few years and not something we happily have to worry about right now.

[Chris~]

We don't play 433 in all ages groups and where is the evidence we play it in the first team due to Lijnders?

We don't know how involved or how good a coach Lijnders really is. Klopp and his team were very good and successful before Lijnders replaced Buvac (the brain wasnt he?)

[rob1966]

Gerrard has way more experience and actual success as a first team manager than Pep.

He has more than Bob had when he took over from Shanks, Joe when he took over from Bob and Kenny when he took over from Joe.

I honestly have no idea if Lijnders has what it takes to be our next manager, but not managing before isn't necessarily a requirement, nor a guarantee it'll work out.

[thaddeus]

We don't play 433 in all ages groups and where is the evidence we play it in the first team due to Lijnders?

We don't know how involved or how good a coach Lijnders really is. Klopp and his team were very good and successful before Lijnders replaced Buvac (the brain wasnt he?)

We didn't do too bad in the six months he was managing in Holland either.

[tubby]

I mean, who knows?  Gerrard could be amazing, Lijnders could be amazing.  Guardiola might not have had the career he's had if circumstances had been different, there's so many sliding doors moments with football management.

[S]

I'm sure Man U fans would have said the same about Ferguson.  Perhaps even more so as Fergie stayed with the club afterwards and, judging by the sick look on his face at the weekend, is very much Man U to the bitter end.  They have lurched all over the place since and are currently managed by somebody that is poles apart from Ferguson but has the "right DNA".

That's not me saying you're wrong but just pointing out that taking the views of the current manager, no matter how great, on board when picking a replacement brings no guarantees of continuity or sustaining the success.

I'm right on the fence with Ljinders.  I'm sure more will become clear over the next few years and not something we happily have to worry about right now.

I did think about Ferguson and Moyes, inevitably. With Lijnders though, I again have to point out the importance of continuity. When Klopp leaves it would ideally be only him leaving and there would be minimal disruption elsewhere. The transfer to Moyes isn't really comparable because he, rather hilariously, brought all his own staff with him and uprooted the system the players were used to.

There are incredible stories from United players about just how different Moyes' coaching was to what they were used to. In a situation where Lijnders takes over though, it's not like his first training session would be an entirely new experience. It would be something the team and club would already be familiar with.

[Paisley79]

When Klopp leaves it would ideally be only him leaving and there would be minimal disruption elsewhere.

This is absolutely key to me. We have a solid foundation. We can not just throw it away when Klopp eventually stands down

[thaddeus]

I did think about Ferguson and Moyes, inevitably. With Lijnders though, I again have to point out the importance of continuity. When Klopp leaves it would ideally be only him leaving and there would be minimal disruption elsewhere. The transfer to Moyes isn't really comparable because he, rather hilariously, brought all his own staff with him and uprooted the system the players were used to.

There are incredible stories from United players about just how different Moyes' coaching was to what they were used to. In a situation where Lijnders takes over though, it's not like his first training session would be an entirely new experience. It would be something the team and club would already be familiar with.

Fair point.  Who knows how things would have panned out if they'd given the job to Mike Phelan or Carlos Queiroz and gone for true continuity.  At the risk of arguing against myself, Ferguson also left an utter mess for the next manager to pick up and *hopefully* Klopp's successor will inherit something more sustainable.

[Coolie High]

He has more than Bob had when he took over from Shanks, Joe when he took over from Bob and Kenny when he took over from Joe.

I honestly have no idea if Lijnders has what it takes to be our next manager, but not managing before isn't necessarily a requirement, nor a guarantee it'll work out.

I think it is preferable in the modern era.

[Dim Glas]

I did think about Ferguson and Moyes, inevitably. With Lijnders though, I again have to point out the importance of continuity. When Klopp leaves it would ideally be only him leaving and there would be minimal disruption elsewhere. The transfer to Moyes isn't really comparable because he, rather hilariously, brought all his own staff with him and uprooted the system the players were used to.

There are incredible stories from United players about just how different Moyes' coaching was to what they were used to. In a situation where Lijnders takes over though, it's not like his first training session would be an entirely new experience. It would be something the team and club would already be familiar with.

Peter Krawietz will leave too. 

But it all does depend of course on who arrives, most already established coaches do bring their own assistant. Now it’s at a mad level where even not great coaches want to bring a whole entourage (Nuno to Spurs being an example).

[Coolie High]

We don't play 433 in all ages groups and where is the evidence we play it in the first team due to Lijnders?

We don't know how involved or how good a coach Lijnders really is. Klopp and his team were very good and successful before Lijnders replaced Buvac (the brain wasnt he?)

Wouldn’t mind seeing that ‘evidence’ myself.

[rob1966]

I think it is preferable in the modern era.

Why though? As others have said, a new manager can change everything up and when you are already one of the most feared teams in world football, then changing everything can be a disaster. We saw it with Souness when he tried to, by his own admission, change things too quickly and it did long term damage. At each change of manager since then, its been because what was in place was not working (Rafa is an exception as the cowboys were making it impossible for him to work), but now that we have something that works so well, we need to ensure we keep as much of it in place as we can when Klopp goes. If Gerrard is to get the job, I personally think he needs to work alongside Klopp for a couple of years and retain most/all of the current staff.

[SamLad]

I'm trying not to compare Ljinders to Klopp as it's unfair on almost every manager in world football.  Ljinders has strengths which I'm sure Klopp would admit he doesn't, it's why they compliment each other so well.  If Ljinders were to become our new manager then he would need to bring in as assistant manager that likewise had strengths where Ljinders doesn't.  Fergie's tactical approach was largely dictated by his assistant managers, the more tactical Houllier brought in Phil Thompson to be his enforcer.

Ljinders is never going to have the force of personality, the aura, that Klopp has.  The big bear hugs.  The side-line grimaces.  The effortless take-downs of interviewers with ulterior motives.  Maybe in the grand scheme those things don't really amount to much anyway and what Klopp and Ljinders have in common is what matters.

Like you though, I'd be nervous in handing over a team that will likely need a rebuild to some extent to anybody that hasn't got a strong track record.  When the time sadly comes it won't be like Zidane cutting his teeth at a star-studded Real Madrid where even a disastrous season by their standards would still result in a third placed finish - the Premier League is an unforgiving place.

right on.  Jurgen has set the bar so damned high, there isn't a manager / coach anywhere who can do it as well as him.  pretty crazy to expect it really.

whoever takes the reins from him, expectations and patience will need to be adjusted correctly.

[67CherryRed]

3 years is a long time in football.

In 2024 the Klopp era might be coming to its natural end, and it might feel right for everyone if we start afresh, and by then there could be an obvious candidate who might not even be managing at a decent level yet. For all we know Neil Critchley could have just taken Blackpool in to Europe. Marc Bridge-Wilkinson might be celebrating a hattrick of youth cup wins.

But if we're still absolutely shit hot at that point and everything in the garden is rosie I'd be amazed if we waved goodbye to Pep.

[RyanBabel19]

The main reason for thinking Ljinders is a good coach is that he's been getting consistent promotions at the club during a period of success under one of the greatest managers we've had. There's more to management than coaching of course but a lot of what he does will translate. Klopp also seems to foster an environment of responsibility at the club, he hires the best people and gives them autonomy, rather than wanting control of everything, which makes the transition easier for Pep as a lot of the knowledge he needs outside of coaching should still be at the club when Klopp leaves.

I don't think we'd laugh at another club promoting from within, especially when the person potentially being promoted has been through all levels of the club and is there on merit, not due to their playing career or past relationships. I think a lot of clubs have tried to replicate Guardiola's rise at Barcelona but have gone about it the wrong way, focusing more on the past player aspect, rather than looking to develop coaches internally. I think we've done everything we can to develop Ljinders at the club, I guess the question now is whether he has the ability to make that step up without a lot of management experience.

But no ones arguing Peps ability as a coach, he's a fantastic one, it's clear how good of a coach he is... but we dont need a coach at the top of the pyramid, we need a manager. He may well transition into the role of a manager sublimely should we choose to make that choice but obviously that remains to be seen. I agree the way Klopp does things is fantastic but at the same time I think that still doesn't mean having control over some things makes you a manager, it would help with the transition but overall I think it's just a completely different role. Going by what's been said and reported Ferguson allowed a lot of things to be done by his coaching staff and they were talked up massively, but I personally cant recall any of them transitioning into management and excelling. There's so much to management in terms of personality and responsibility, being the main man is huge pressure and being part of a set up and seeing things done isn't always enough. Peps fucking incredible as a coach but i do feel the clamour for him to naturally take over from some doesn't take into account a lot of factors involved. I could be completely wrong and this whole theoretical scenario may never even develop into reality to be honest.

The rest I guess it depends who it is but the reaction on here to a coach with little to no managerial experience taking the management job at one of our rivals would likely be laughter and writing them off. Managers with more silverware than in some clubs history are written off as little to no threat at times (sometimes rightly so) so some coaches coming in to take the top job at a big club, we would have a field day

[scatman]

The rest I guess it depends who it is but the reaction on here to a coach with little to no managerial experience taking the management job at one of our rivals would likely be laughter and writing them off. Managers with more silverware than in some clubs history are written off as little to no threat at times (sometimes rightly so) so some coaches coming in to take the top job at a big club, we would have a field day

Not true, it depends who it is, what club it is and if they have a distinct style of play. The comparison to Ferguson is stupid too. There's no comparison, he literally had managers as assistants (Kidd, Queiroz, Smith) and one of the best assistants in british football (Knox).

[Suareznumber7]

Article in The Athletic today about how it's very possible that Pep will be the person in the way of Gerrard succeeding Klopp as manager. 

https://theathletic.com/3004054/2021/12/11/gerrards-biggest-barrier-to-being-liverpools-next-manager-might-be-lijnders/

Will be happy to paste the article if it's not against forum rules.