Author Topic: Welcome to Liverpool Alex Oxlade-Chamberlain  (Read 30559 times)

Offline nico 8

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Re: Welcome to Liverpool Alex Oxlade-Chamberlain
« Reply #400 on: September 5, 2017, 08:09:56 PM »
Babu I'd like to hear your thoughts on this article

http://www.espn.co.uk/football/english-premier-league/23/blog/post/3191689/how-alex-oxlade-chamberlain-rugby-background-influences-his-playing-style

I do not propose to deconstruct the merits or demerits of this article as there are better informed and knowledgeable posters who will better analyze same. However, I shall add a few comments which I can speak of from a personal experience.
Shooting and finishing is the single biggest problem in African football, especially in the south.  We simply do not have the facilities and coaches fail to work on this part of the game, which to me is the most important part of the game. I have been fortunate to travel various parts of the world with my sons from an early age (of 7 years old) through to US college football. I noticed that coaches in both England and Germany teach their kids to smash a ball as hard and quickly as possible. On one occasion, a coach had 2 bags of balls and threw them at this kid who had to get onto it asap. In Germany, I noted that kids at 15/16 were encouraged to shoot from 20- 30 yards. Just last year December I took my son to a lower league team in the England for an assessment. I found them to be weak technically, very one footed and direct. Nothing new. What amazed me is that just about every player could smash a ball ferociously. In Spain, I watched the youth play the typical tikka takka style but saw none of it in the men's third tier. It was as quick and direct as the lower leagues in England.

Insofar as rugby is concerned, youth football make good back line players as they tend to play with their heads up and some are able to punt with either foot. In regard to Aoc carrying the ball in straight lines and passing side ways is too simplistic an explanation. Your style, size and speed in youth football generally dictates how you turn out. The speed of your development depends on your physicality which relates to puberty. Late bloomers are disadvantaged but those that stay in the game work on their technique and find ways to counter stronger and physical players. On one occasion, I met an ex-LFC player who asked whether my sons played rugby. They hadn't played rugby which he thought to be a mistake. I could never understand why??? We focused on football but did other school sports. In hindsight, I would have got them to do boxing instead of karate and persisted with basketball. They compliment football in so many ways.
To the extent rugby may have influenced AOC style, I believe it gives you the confidence to take an opponent on. He may have developed this ability in his youth especially if he was a lot quicker than his peers. The downside is that it detracts from football intelligence where a less physical player will look to think more and execute a lot quicker. Both styles find application in football and it would be incumbent on a coach to compliment and gel the different styles of players. Ginoi will struggle against low block teams where I expect AOC to be more effective. Yet in more evenly contested games, I anticipate Gini's style of pass and move and letting the ball do the work being more effective than AOC's style of carrying the ball. The difference is that AOC can be taught to make better footballing decisions unlike the type of player who does not have the ability or lacks the confidence to take an opponent on.
AOC has time on his side and can work on his end product- be it creating or scoring goals.

« Last Edit: September 5, 2017, 08:29:22 PM by nico 8 »

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Re: Welcome to Liverpool Alex Oxlade-Chamberlain
« Reply #401 on: September 5, 2017, 09:46:12 PM »
I do not propose to deconstruct the merits or demerits of this article as there are better informed and knowledgeable posters who will better analyze same. However, I shall add a few comments which I can speak of from a personal experience.
Shooting and finishing is the single biggest problem in African football, especially in the south.  We simply do not have the facilities and coaches fail to work on this part of the game, which to me is the most important part of the game. I have been fortunate to travel various parts of the world with my sons from an early age (of 7 years old) through to US college football. I noticed that coaches in both England and Germany teach their kids to smash a ball as hard and quickly as possible. On one occasion, a coach had 2 bags of balls and threw them at this kid who had to get onto it asap. In Germany, I noted that kids at 15/16 were encouraged to shoot from 20- 30 yards. Just last year December I took my son to a lower league team in the England for an assessment. I found them to be weak technically, very one footed and direct. Nothing new. What amazed me is that just about every player could smash a ball ferociously. In Spain, I watched the youth play the typical tikka takka style but saw none of it in the men's third tier. It was as quick and direct as the lower leagues in England.

Insofar as rugby is concerned, youth football make good back line players as they tend to play with their heads up and some are able to punt with either foot. In regard to Aoc carrying the ball in straight lines and passing side ways is too simplistic an explanation. Your style, size and speed in youth football generally dictates how you turn out. The speed of your development depends on your physicality which relates to puberty. Late bloomers are disadvantaged but those that stay in the game work on their technique and find ways to counter stronger and physical players. On one occasion, I met an ex-LFC player who asked whether my sons played rugby. They hadn't played rugby which he thought to be a mistake. I could never understand why??? We focused on football but did other school sports. In hindsight, I would have got them to do boxing instead of karate and persisted with basketball. They compliment football in so many ways.
To the extent rugby may have influenced AOC style, I believe it gives you the confidence to take an opponent on. He may have developed this ability in his youth especially if he was a lot quicker than his peers. The downside is that it detracts from football intelligence where a less physical player will look to think more and execute a lot quicker. Both styles find application in football and it would be incumbent on a coach to compliment and gel the different styles of players. Ginoi will struggle against low block teams where I expect AOC to be more effective. Yet in more evenly contested games, I anticipate Gini's style of pass and move and letting the ball do the work being more effective than AOC's style of carrying the ball. The difference is that AOC can be taught to make better footballing decisions unlike the type of player who does not have the ability or lacks the confidence to take an opponent on.
AOC has time on his side and can work on his end product- be it creating or scoring goals.
Excellent post mate.

If you really want to help your kids in any sport, get them to involve themselves with something that heavily relies on balance to underpin it. Judo, Ju-Jitsu, something like that. Almost everything we do in any sport uses balance. I saw a volleyball coach on the beach near my house once. He had tied a rope between two trees and the players hand to walk along it sidewise and also try to catch/hit any balls he lobbed their way. It looked almost impossible from my perspective and yet some of the kids were excellent at it, something clearly that he works on with them a lot. Based on what he was shouting out, it seems it was more for defending/control.

Btw that whole rope-tree thing is a very common sight here in Brazil. That's the only time I have seen it specifically linked to a sport though. I'd love to know how a wonderfully balanced player like Coutinho honed it as a kid. He lived quite near a few nice beaches.

I asked my wife about this and she believes Brazilians are better balanced because of dance. In schools here there are 4 holidays a year in which public dancing is a huge part of the culture. One you likely know of - Carnival. For a month before each of those (so effectively for half the school year) there will be 2 hours of rehearsing per week for dancing for all kids. But because latins have a very big dancing culture, there is also plenty of street parties all year round with plenty of dancing.

None of this has anything to do with AoC of course. So let me try and bring it back. When AoC signed someone posted a video of him dancing around a lot on England duty with Sturridge. Let's hope that means he's a big fan of samba :D
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Offline nico 8

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Re: Welcome to Liverpool Alex Oxlade-Chamberlain
« Reply #402 on: September 5, 2017, 11:26:14 PM »
No doubt that dance has a positive impact. Quick feet,agility and strong core. Would also recommend ballet but boys generally run the other way at the mere suggestion of it. Cheers.

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Re: Welcome to Liverpool Alex Oxlade-Chamberlain
« Reply #403 on: September 5, 2017, 11:35:54 PM »
Only me, do you like apples?

How you like dis apples? Babu has the numbers (stats)!
Oh yeh and good on the Club and the owners for standing up to Barca and their shitty tactics.
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Re: Welcome to Liverpool Alex Oxlade-Chamberlain
« Reply #405 on: September 6, 2017, 02:56:44 PM »

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Re: Welcome to Liverpool Alex Oxlade-Chamberlain
« Reply #407 on: September 6, 2017, 10:30:04 PM »
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UPj5tpPeZ64

The fuck is up with the split into 4 screens thing?

Good interview though.
« Last Edit: September 6, 2017, 11:02:36 PM by Chakan »

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Re: Welcome to Liverpool Alex Oxlade-Chamberlain
« Reply #408 on: September 6, 2017, 11:01:45 PM »
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UPj5tpPeZ64
Cheers for that, think he will fit right in and klopp will get a lot more from him than he's down do far.
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Re: Welcome to Liverpool Alex Oxlade-Chamberlain
« Reply #409 on: September 6, 2017, 11:16:38 PM »
The fuck is up with the split into 4 screens thing?

Good interview though.

Ripped off video trying to get around copyright I assume?!

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Re: Welcome to Liverpool Alex Oxlade-Chamberlain
« Reply #410 on: September 7, 2017, 07:02:37 AM »
Ripped off video trying to get around copyright I assume?!

Why doesthe official Liverpool youtube channel take so long to upload their own content.
We generally need to wait 4 days after it's already been ripped and shown on youtube before we can actually see the full content on the official channel.
Can't just be about access for the LFC main site, can it?
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Re: Welcome to Liverpool Alex Oxlade-Chamberlain
« Reply #411 on: September 7, 2017, 06:37:59 PM »
Babu I'd like to hear your thoughts on this article

http://www.espn.co.uk/football/english-premier-league/23/blog/post/3191689/how-alex-oxlade-chamberlain-rugby-background-influences-his-playing-style

I had a look into some stats for this to see if there was any correlation between him passing sideways because he thinks he is playing rugby and a the rest of the Arsenal team.

Comparing as a wingback, I looked at Chamberlin v Bellarin.

Bellarin = 1,392 passes. 370 forwards. 26.58% forward passes
Chamberlain = 775 passes. 209 forwards. 26.97% forwards passes.

Pretty much no difference at all which is what you would expect of two players in the same roles.

I wanted to compare the other Arsenal players though to get a more broad idea.

Ramsey = 23.8%
Iwobi = 24.4%
Coquelin = 28.9%
Xhaka = 28.55%
Wilshire = 26%
Ozil = 27,96%
Elneny = 24.2%
Cazorla = 30.3%

I suspect there is a correlation between how far back you play and how often you play forwards, that just makes sense. But there seems to be no discernible difference between how often players pass forwards compared to Alex Oxlaide-Chamberlain which makes his entire article = BOLLOCKS :D
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Re: Welcome to Liverpool Alex Oxlade-Chamberlain
« Reply #412 on: September 7, 2017, 10:19:22 PM »
Don't rugby players have to pass backwards?
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Offline nico 8

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Re: Welcome to Liverpool Alex Oxlade-Chamberlain
« Reply #413 on: September 8, 2017, 07:08:37 AM »
I had a look into some stats for this to see if there was any correlation between him passing sideways because he thinks he is playing rugby and a the rest of the Arsenal team.

Comparing as a wingback, I looked at Chamberlin v Bellarin.

Bellarin = 1,392 passes. 370 forwards. 26.58% forward passes
Chamberlain = 775 passes. 209 forwards. 26.97% forwards passes.

Pretty much no difference at all which is what you would expect of two players in the same roles.

I wanted to compare the other Arsenal players though to get a more broad idea.

Ramsey = 23.8%
Iwobi = 24.4%
Coquelin = 28.9%
Xhaka = 28.55%
Wilshire = 26%
Ozil = 27,96%
Elneny = 24.2%
Cazorla = 30.3%

I suspect there is a correlation between how far back you play and how often you play forwards, that just makes sense. But there seems to be no discernible difference between how often players pass forwards compared to Alex Oxlaide-Chamberlain which makes his entire article = BOLLOCKS :D

His only iota of credence may have been the point that as rugby players tend to do, AOC drives forward into space carrying the ball. This is also bollocks as kids at a very young age are taught to play with their head up. Those that don't, I label as back garden footballers as they tend to keep their head down and merely drive forward. Usually kids playing with mates or siblings. Street football doesn't suffer the same fate as there is space which develops peripheral vision.

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Re: Welcome to Liverpool Alex Oxlade-Chamberlain
« Reply #414 on: September 8, 2017, 10:44:14 AM »
What a great opening post mate. Nice critique analysis.

I'd say that Alex Oxlade Chamberlain still has "great potential". I've been watching him a bit closely since he was linked to us. He does a number of jobs very well, but not one thing at elite level, yet. I'm being cautious because he's been playing for a lacklustre Arsenal side, and a odd england side too.

I cant see him being a 6 anytime soon, with Hendo always improving there, and Emre Can also excels at that position. I see him playing 8 (Central-midfield Attack) or 11 (Right winger/forward). You could play him in 6 though, cos he doesnt shy away and always wants the ball.

He'll need time to adjust to the team, he seems to have vision, but he's also very greedy for the shot (as he was against Slovakia for England). If klopp can get him making better decisions in the final third, he'll be a great asset to us. Seems a lovely lad too.

Good luck to him.
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Re: Welcome to Liverpool Alex Oxlade-Chamberlain
« Reply #415 on: September 8, 2017, 01:28:05 PM »
His only iota of credence may have been the point that as rugby players tend to do, AOC drives forward into space carrying the ball. This is also bollocks as kids at a very young age are taught to play with their head up. Those that don't, I label as back garden footballers as they tend to keep their head down and merely drive forward. Usually kids playing with mates or siblings. Street football doesn't suffer the same fate as there is space which develops peripheral vision.

I agree that sports can influence each other. That instinctively you react to things in a similar way due to some form of muscle memory perhaps. The example I always use is Skrtel backing away from players running at him. He is the center back I have most seen do this for Liverpool and the fact he was a ice hockey player at a high level makes sense. There is data to support that as he always led the side in blocks and there was video to support it too, plus my own vivid nightmares if they can ever be downloaded and mass viewed :D

However, this article reads as someone who has discovered AoC played rugby and decided to apply in a broad manner where the two sports would impact each other without doing the most basic of tests on the validity of what he was saying. And it's not hard to do. He does't pass forward, play through balls, only runs with the ball and passes sideways - the first every touch video I saw of him destroys that idea. The one of Southampton shows him run with the ball maybe twice, play about 20 forward passes, 6 through balls, and 5 additional penetrative passes.

When you look at data, as I did in the OP, in terms of penetrative and creative passing, AoC comes out as one of the top performers across both Liverpool and Arsenal in all categories. So in terms of how well his theory stands up - it doesn't - it's bollocks.

I can only assume it's some form of confirmation bias where he imagined the job of winger in football as running down the wing and then crossing (or passing sideways as he calls it). Then looking at the role in rugby and thinking "meh, that's the same so I am right". It seems like there is a lot of hate on AoC at the moment from I suspect underwhelmed Liverpool fans, rejected Chelsea fans and bitter Arsenal fans who didn't want him to go. Therefore this is a hatchet job with a target audience.
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Re: Welcome to Liverpool Alex Oxlade-Chamberlain
« Reply #416 on: September 8, 2017, 01:44:52 PM »
What a great opening post mate. Nice critique analysis.

I'd say that Alex Oxlade Chamberlain still has "great potential". I've been watching him a bit closely since he was linked to us. He does a number of jobs very well, but not one thing at elite level, yet. I'm being cautious because he's been playing for a lacklustre Arsenal side, and a odd england side too.

I cant see him being a 6 anytime soon, with Hendo always improving there, and Emre Can also excels at that position. I see him playing 8 (Central-midfield Attack) or 11 (Right winger/forward). You could play him in 6 though, cos he doesnt shy away and always wants the ball.

He'll need time to adjust to the team, he seems to have vision, but he's also very greedy for the shot (as he was against Slovakia for England). If klopp can get him making better decisions in the final third, he'll be a great asset to us. Seems a lovely lad too.

Good luck to him.
Good point about the shooting. The interesting thing is his shot count has gone way down at Arsenal in recent years based on the data. But it's still high at England. That leads me to suspect that is tactical instruction. SHite instruction, but instruction none the less. This is where my criticism of Southgate lies. I think he's a shite coach. I also doubt he uses analytics. If he did he would know AoC is shite at shooting and should be discouraged from shooting where possible. Seeing him score a piledriver occasionally is like walking into a casino as someone wins a jackpot. You didn't see the 4 hours he was there ploughing money into the casino before that jackpot came along. Or the other 4 days this week he's been in ploughing money in for nothing back at all. Even a basic look at his shot maps is a warning sign for a coach on his shooting.

Coutinho's shots under Klopp are the second thing to look at here. First of all, Coutinho's shooting used to be highly erratic. First of all, his shots were mostly daisy cutters. The technique on hitting them has clearly improved. Secondly his shot locations has changed from being all over the shop to being more central. He has also removed entirely those insanely speculative shots from way outside the danger zone. He also has so few blocked shots compared to the past - which if you watch him is because he now unbalances a defender, then shoots so he cannot block. So you can see a huge amount of work has gone into Coutinho's shooting in many different ways.

The other interesting thing here is Ramsey. Ramsey's shot maps look like a very clever player getting into great locations (e.g. Lampard) and then being a shit finisher in those locations. His goalscoring reads as variance, one season of his erratic shooting resulting in goals. Four seasons of being average or below average. He fluffs so many big chances though. It's never been corrected either. His finishing isn't improving at all. Is he just incapable of learning and improving or is this not coached at Arsenal? I've no idea. There is a clear improvement in the finishing skill of several players at Liverpool both in terms of where they are shooting from and their success rates in doing so. The few times I am doing a hard look at an Arsenal player I don't see the same improvements. All their erratic finishers like Coutinho are still erratic finishers a few years later. Players like Ozil, Welbeck, AoC, Ramsey - no real improvement.

So I think worst case scenario, we will see very little of that wasteful shooting here as he has shown at Arsenal when encouraged to shoot less, he has been doing so for them. But shoots far more for England. Best case scenario, maybe he can be coached to improve his technique and shot choice up to being an average finisher. Maybe even better. Even if he doesn't though, if he is just offering high penetration and creativity and stops wasting possession with shots, that's a winning combination right there. 
Gonna stay behind at work and wait to see what happens.

I am betting some split arse and crying.

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Re: Welcome to Liverpool Alex Oxlade-Chamberlain
« Reply #417 on: September 8, 2017, 02:32:12 PM »
Still don't get this signing, or why Klopp has apparently been after him for years. Average player with no stand out skills.

 ???
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Re: Welcome to Liverpool Alex Oxlade-Chamberlain
« Reply #418 on: September 8, 2017, 02:36:02 PM »
Still don't get this signing, or why Klopp has apparently been after him for years. Average player with no stand out skills.

 ???
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Re: Welcome to Liverpool Alex Oxlade-Chamberlain
« Reply #419 on: September 8, 2017, 11:43:48 PM »
Still don't get this signing, or why Klopp has apparently been after him for years. Average player with no stand out skills.

 ???
Good job Klopp is a professional football coach and you're a nameless internet poster then.

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Re: Welcome to Liverpool Alex Oxlade-Chamberlain
« Reply #420 on: September 9, 2017, 08:06:17 PM »
Thierry Henry:

"'You have to bring something on the table. I have been watching him for a very long time and I still don't know what he's good at.
'You can find out on all players what they are not good at, but normally you also find out what they are good at.
'He needs to bring something to the table and give something to work with."

I agree with him. Hopefully he develops to the contrary

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Re: Welcome to Liverpool Alex Oxlade-Chamberlain
« Reply #421 on: September 10, 2017, 04:00:57 PM »
Thierry Henry:

"'You have to bring something on the table. I have been watching him for a very long time and I still don't know what he's good at.
'You can find out on all players what they are not good at, but normally you also find out what they are good at.
'He needs to bring something to the table and give something to work with."

I agree with him. Hopefully he develops to the contrary
Well you can sort of see what he is good at from that first game even though it was a lost cause. He is good at turning and running with the ball and can play a good forward thinking pass (offside pass to TAA). Not so good in defensive discipline and poor at scoring from past reputation.

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Re: Welcome to Liverpool Alex Oxlade-Chamberlain
« Reply #422 on: September 13, 2017, 05:21:10 PM »
Thierry Henry:

"'You have to bring something on the table. I have been watching him for a very long time and I still don't know what he's good at.
'You can find out on all players what they are not good at, but normally you also find out what they are good at.
'He needs to bring something to the table and give something to work with."

I agree with him. Hopefully he develops to the contrary



This says more about Henry than Alex. Perhaps he should pay more attention rather than spouting empty platitudes.

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Re: Welcome to Liverpool Alex Oxlade-Chamberlain
« Reply #423 on: September 13, 2017, 06:44:34 PM »
Thierry Henry:

"'You have to bring something on the table. I have been watching him for a very long time and I still don't know what he's good at.
'You can find out on all players what they are not good at, but normally you also find out what they are good at.
'He needs to bring something to the table and give something to work with."

I agree with him. Hopefully he develops to the contrary
Quote
“It was really my first start in a massive game,’’ recalled Oxlade-Chamberlain. “Just before we were walking out to the tunnel, Thierry put me in a headlock and whispered in my ear: ‘I’ve been watching you in training. You have a bit extra, so try to run at people. Don’t waste today. Take people on, show the world what you can do, work hard, work back.’ That gave me massive confidence.”

Arsenal lost 2-1 but Oxlade-Chamberlain shone. “Thierry took me to one side after the game, with a big smile, and said: ‘Well done. That’s what I was talking about.’

Quote
Speaking on Sky Sports at half-time, Henry said: “The reply of Arsenal was great.

“Sometimes he doesn’t get a mention but The Ox makes a great run to create space for Sanchez, and the rest is history.

“The run takes Dawson away. You have to give Oxlade-Chamberlain some great credit because if it wasn’t for him, there would have been no goal.”

As with all things pundits say - wouldn't read too much into it.
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Offline KurtVerbose

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Re: Welcome to Liverpool Alex Oxlade-Chamberlain
« Reply #424 on: September 16, 2017, 11:19:05 AM »
Think he'll get game time today. Wondering if he'll fill in for Mane or play in midfield for one of Gini/Can. Also wondering if either he or Phil will play and one subbed for the other.

I didn't see the CL game so didn't see how he did.
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Re: Welcome to Liverpool Alex Oxlade-Chamberlain
« Reply #425 on: September 16, 2017, 12:38:31 PM »
Think he'll get game time today. Wondering if he'll fill in for Mane or play in midfield for one of Gini/Can. Also wondering if either he or Phil will play and one subbed for the other.

I didn't see the CL game so didn't see how he did.

I was looking into how long it took Firmino and Lallana to click with our pressing system. Basically run less with higher defensive output, when Klopp joined. It took them about two months and could actually be plotted against each other on a graph. It took the entire first season to actually hit a peak though. I'm writing something up about our pressing actually to show this better.

The reason I mention it is because when we sign players, it means they will leave holes in our press for about 2 months. Or press before the team is ready do. etc. With Salah, he had a full pre-season and so he is likely in sync with the system now and won't leave gaps but won't actually peak until maybe early next year. AoC might need a another 6-8 weeks before we can throw him in as he won't be pressing in sync with the rest of the team. Especially in central midfield where tactically the role is more complicated and the risks much greater when you get it wrong.
Gonna stay behind at work and wait to see what happens.

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Re: Welcome to Liverpool Alex Oxlade-Chamberlain
« Reply #426 on: September 19, 2017, 11:01:01 PM »
This should be moved to the main board or an Ox thread should be started there so that we can discuss his integration 
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Offline KurtVerbose

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Re: Welcome to Liverpool Alex Oxlade-Chamberlain
« Reply #427 on: September 20, 2017, 10:05:40 AM »
This should be moved to the main board or an Ox thread should be started there so that we can discuss his integration 

All the ones on the main board got closed and refered to this. No idea why it's not on the main board, the mods are normally so good at things like that, as well as being good looking and charming.
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Re: Welcome to Liverpool Alex Oxlade-Chamberlain
« Reply #428 on: September 20, 2017, 10:49:00 AM »
All the ones on the main board got closed and refered to this. No idea why it's not on the main board, the mods are normally so good at things like that, as well as being good looking and charming.

Trying to hide it away. Massive mistake to buy someone who has flattered to deceive over his whole career. I agree with Henry on AOC, no idea what he's good at or what his position is.
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Re: Welcome to Liverpool Alex Oxlade-Chamberlain
« Reply #429 on: September 20, 2017, 11:26:15 AM »
Trying to hide it away. Massive mistake to buy someone who has flattered to deceive over his whole career. I agree with Henry on AOC, no idea what he's good at or what his position is.

arsenal supporting friends said he was their best wing back before he left, mainly
because bellerin has been out of form.

doesn't really help us though and he seems intent on playing centrally  - i doubt he would of come here if klopp didn't say he would be given a shot in the middle. just can't see how he gets in the team myself

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Re: Welcome to Liverpool Alex Oxlade-Chamberlain
« Reply #430 on: September 20, 2017, 01:21:40 PM »
Trying to hide it away. Massive mistake to buy someone who has flattered to deceive over his whole career. I agree with Henry on AOC, no idea what he's good at or what his position is.
Interesting, there is praise of AoC and him specifically stating what he is good at when he was at Arsenal from Henry (I quoted it before in this thread)

It changed when he left Arsenal for Henry. A bit like how Lukaku was suddenly shite for Everton fans ;)

This should be moved to the main board or an Ox thread should be started there so that we can discuss his integration 

I think it's because after every defeat there is a kangaroo court as people want their pound of flesh and then in every player thread where people act like twats and then the thread gets locked.

If we don't improve our approach to discussing our club on this forum to something better than twitter, the natural conclusion is that the mods get bored of the river of fast flowing shit they have to dive into and moderate after every defeat and just lock the forum down until people get it out of their system elsewhere or calm down.

The mods of the forum are fans too. They are hurting like us with bad results. But instead of finding a way manage their own feelings, they have to instead moderate all of us acting like entitled children. Can't be much fun.
Gonna stay behind at work and wait to see what happens.

I am betting some split arse and crying.

Offline The 1989 Brit Awards

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Re: Welcome to Liverpool Alex Oxlade-Chamberlain
« Reply #431 on: September 20, 2017, 02:32:57 PM »
I think it's because after every defeat there is a kangaroo court as people want their pound of flesh and then in every player thread where people act like twats and then the thread gets locked.

If we don't improve our approach to discussing our club on this forum to something better than twitter, the natural conclusion is that the mods get bored of the river of fast flowing shit they have to dive into and moderate after every defeat and just lock the forum down until people get it out of their system elsewhere or calm down.

The mods of the forum are fans too. They are hurting like us with bad results. But instead of finding a way manage their own feelings, they have to instead moderate all of us acting like entitled children. Can't be much fun.
I think all of that is true, but then it's also true what noname says: "trying to hide it away".

I'm as much of a fan as you on being level headed when discussing football, but people will want to vent. In any case, if they talk shit about AOC and then he does well, people can score their usual points pointing out whoever doubted him in earlier pages.

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Offline vagabond

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Re: Welcome to Liverpool Alex Oxlade-Chamberlain
« Reply #433 on: September 20, 2017, 04:22:33 PM »
Having a player on his first start for the club with a makeshift team around him and he not yet up to speed with the tactical system is exactly the right time to judge him.

Offline KurtVerbose

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Re: Welcome to Liverpool Alex Oxlade-Chamberlain
« Reply #434 on: September 20, 2017, 09:44:50 PM »
I feel very positive about this transfer. I think he'll play more than people think.

As above, won't judge him on one match in a cup game.
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Offline Big Poppa

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Re: Welcome to Liverpool Alex Oxlade-Chamberlain
« Reply #435 on: September 29, 2017, 04:03:47 PM »
Arsenal fan here.

Ox is a talented player and definitely has a higher football IQ than he shows consistently but his issues are mental. He tries too hard to prove he belongs, and often messes up on very basic things, while pulling off things that are much more difficult. He needs to get out of his own way and accept that he is a conduit rather than a facilitator. He's become too obsessed with being the next Gerrard and forgotten to just focus on learning.

In fairness, despite his horrendous injury record before last season, I think he was badly managed by Wenger. He'd often play well, then be the first to get subbed while someone like Ozil was stinking out the place and left on. He was also moved around loads of different positions so the fact that Henry said he doesn't know what he's good at is not surprising (not the smartest of comments from Henry who saw him in training every day).

He's a fantastic crosser of the ball on the run, he is excellent at the chipped through ball, and his acceleration is phenomenal. He needed regular football at a smaller club IMO. He'd be a star for a team like Spurs for example. 40m quid was way way too much but he'll prove to be a valuable addition to your squad.

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Re: Welcome to Liverpool Alex Oxlade-Chamberlain
« Reply #436 on: September 29, 2017, 05:06:25 PM »
Arsenal fan here.

Ox is a talented player and definitely has a higher football IQ than he shows consistently but his issues are mental. He tries too hard to prove he belongs, and often messes up on very basic things, while pulling off things that are much more difficult. He needs to get out of his own way and accept that he is a conduit rather than a facilitator. He's become too obsessed with being the next Gerrard and forgotten to just focus on learning.

In fairness, despite his horrendous injury record before last season, I think he was badly managed by Wenger. He'd often play well, then be the first to get subbed while someone like Ozil was stinking out the place and left on. He was also moved around loads of different positions so the fact that Henry said he doesn't know what he's good at is not surprising (not the smartest of comments from Henry who saw him in training every day).

He's a fantastic crosser of the ball on the run, he is excellent at the chipped through ball, and his acceleration is phenomenal. He needed regular football at a smaller club IMO. He'd be a star for a team like Spurs for example. 40m quid was way way too much but he'll prove to be a valuable addition to your squad.
That is one of the best disguised digs I've seen on here. Well done sir! :D Literally laughing out loud here.
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I am betting some split arse and crying.

Offline Leosheer

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Re: Welcome to Liverpool Alex Oxlade-Chamberlain
« Reply #437 on: October 12, 2017, 11:38:07 PM »
Excellent opening post - I now understand why we bought him and where he would "fit in" to the team.

Whether he is worth £40m or whether we were right to prioritize this type of players over others (CD, DM, LB etc) - which I think are the reasons why some fans have reacted to his arrival in the (negative) way they have - are questions most of us are not in any position to comment on meaningfully because we don't have the relevant information.