Author Topic: Liverpool 2 - 0 Tottenham  (Read 63430 times)

Offline killer-heels

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Re: Liverpool vs Tottenham February 12th, 5:30 pm
« Reply #120 on: February 6, 2017, 08:37:25 am »
We have no choice but pick our best side and hope for the best. So Wijnaldum and if fit, Lovren for Lucas and Can. I wouldnt be surprised if Klopp brings in Wijnaldum for an attacker.

None of our subs are playing well so its not like we can change it up anyway.

Offline redk84

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Re: Liverpool vs Tottenham February 12th, 5:30 pm
« Reply #121 on: February 6, 2017, 09:11:45 am »
Klopp has a week to prepare for this game with a full squad.

We'll win, and that will be the end of this embarrassing start to 2017 which has ruined the season of all but 1 goal.

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Offline puroresu_kid

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Re: Liverpool vs Tottenham February 12th, 5:30 pm
« Reply #122 on: February 6, 2017, 09:36:01 am »
The one positive I have going into this is I do think the way we play causes the most problems for Spurs.  Spurs haven't really been effective vs us in any of Klopp's games against Pocchetino.

Our form is worrying though and it will take a big improvement to beat a very good Spurs side.

Offline morrisonlfc

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Re: Liverpool vs Tottenham February 12th, 5:30 pm
« Reply #123 on: February 6, 2017, 09:49:31 am »
My second game this season, since Watford in November, how things have changed since then  :-\

Anyways, here's hoping we can turn this around, up the Reds!

Offline jediwarrior

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Re: Liverpool vs Tottenham February 12th, 5:30 pm
« Reply #124 on: February 6, 2017, 11:09:06 am »
Would like us to change things round. Put Sturridge up front. The guy needs a decent run of games and we need someone to start scoring.

Please no Can or Migs. Let Karius have the rest of the season and see how he goes. We know what we get with Migs and it ain't much.

Also subs to be made earlier if needed not around the 80 min mark when a player ain't got much chance to change things.

Most of all just f**king win!!!!!

Offline Redman78

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Re: Liverpool vs Tottenham February 12th, 5:30 pm
« Reply #125 on: February 6, 2017, 11:24:32 am »
Based on Henderson not being a DM and not doing a good job there.

Based on Can not producing

Based on Gini not finding his Newcastle form.

No PL win in 2017 I think it's not a time to be scared of change.

City bench their best forward, Everton make changes..Liverpool are predictable and need to make big changes and big decisions.

All that still doesn't make Woodburn our best midfielder, and it's unfair to expect him to be.

It's not these games we struggle in, it's the ones against the teams that put 10 behind the ball.  Think we should make changes, but I don't think starting a number of u23's against Spurs, in a must win, highly pressured game is the way to go.
« Last Edit: February 6, 2017, 11:36:50 am by Redman78 »

Offline LallanaInPyjamas

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Re: Liverpool vs Tottenham February 12th, 5:30 pm
« Reply #126 on: February 6, 2017, 11:28:38 am »
Make no mistake, lose this and the season is over.

We haven't lost a game of this ilk yet, so despite our terrible recent form, Klopp and the team have certainly done something right in these games. With that said, in order to give us a good chance of winning the game, rather than just avoiding defeat, I think a slight tweak could be necessary.

We need to be competitive against a physically and technically excellent midfield. With Danny Rose out for them, I'd be tempted to diamond it. I've laughed on here at people seeing it as this magical formation but I think Saturday is tailor made for it and potentially Arsenal too.

I think Clyne can handle Son 1v1 and while I'd worry about Walker's raids on the other side, I think staying compact in our defensive third against Kane, Eriksen and Alli and in the middle third against Dembela and Wanyama is more important.

The issue for us is, if everyone is fit, who doesn't start?

Coutinho? He's been shite since returning from injury, but he's symptomatic of our side; often ineffective against low block sides, but so regularly effective against the big boys. You also have to consider the psychological boost it would give to the opposition not to play him and the damage it could do for the rest of his and our season. We need to play him into form and his record against Spurs is quite good I think.

Can or Wijnaldum, then, seem the obvious choice but I honestly think we need both for this game. Despite not playing very well from a progressive point of view I think Can showed against Chelsea how useful his physicality can be against a strong side, and the same goes for Gini along with his ability to keep the ball ticking quickly, not to mention his late runs which provided goals against City and Chelsea, and almost in the last minute against United too.

And for me Lallana has to play at the tip of that diamond; leading the press, disrupting their play, and constantly moving laterally either direction in order to help us construct attacking moves. He's not been at his best lately but, again, he's definitely a man for the big games.

So the only conclusion I can reach is diamond it with a twist. Sure, he did well against Swansea, but otherwise Firmino has been ghastly for months. We'd miss his pressing and we'd miss the occasional out ball he can provide but we wouldn't miss the dreadful touches, the woeful passes, and the abject finishing which can destroy the flow and confidence of our side. It won't happen but I'd bench him.

Solution? In possession, it might look like a diamond with Mane moving inside from the right, and Coutinho from the left. Out of possession it's not all that different to what we're using at the moment, with Lallana essentially becoming a false nine. Of course there's the option to switch him and Mane at times in order to give us a bit more physicality through the middle, be it to feet or over the top should Spurs play a high line as they sometimes do.

For me that would give our best three footballers every possible platform to give us the win we need.

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Re: Liverpool vs Tottenham February 12th, 5:30 pm
« Reply #127 on: February 6, 2017, 11:29:21 am »
Woodburn, has the talent, Stewart does not. the bloke is 23 and is still playing for our u-23's. He has no future here, I'd take back spearing over him.

Woodburn has gone on to another level since being promoted to the first team set up. His game intelligence is totally amazing. He does things on the pitch playing with older players (in the u23's) that they would never think about. He could be used as Lallana's natural successor. So excited to see where this boy could go to. I think Klopp will use him a lot more next season, but I hope he uses him this season as well.
« Last Edit: February 6, 2017, 11:37:49 am by jillc »
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Offline Upinsmoke

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Re: Liverpool vs Tottenham February 12th, 5:30 pm
« Reply #128 on: February 6, 2017, 11:35:39 am »
We can't be too radical but we definitely need to drop the players that have undoubtedly cost us points time and time again down the line and thats the three of Mignolet, Lucas and Can.

If we don't score than hey ho but these lads are throwing points away for fun.

Offline slaphead

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Re: Liverpool vs Tottenham February 12th, 5:30 pm
« Reply #129 on: February 6, 2017, 11:41:16 am »
We can't be too radical but we definitely need to drop the players that have undoubtedly cost us points time and time again down the line and thats the three of Mignolet, Lucas and Can.

If we don't score than hey ho but these lads are throwing points away for fun.

Whilst I agree that those 3 have been very poor, I think Can will and should start this game. Spurs have Wanyama and Dembele in the middle, that's some serious power we'd get steam rolled if we go too light,
I know we should let other teams worry about us, but it would be foolish not be realise that's a big factor.

Offline Chris~

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Re: Liverpool vs Tottenham February 12th, 5:30 pm
« Reply #130 on: February 6, 2017, 11:44:58 am »
Whilst I agree that those 3 have been very poor, I think Can will and should start this game. Spurs have Wanyama and Dembele in the middle, that's some serious power we'd get steam rolled if we go too light
People had this worry last time and we were absolutely fine against them.

They don't like being pressed, especially with no Vertonghen or Rose. Maybe Pochettino will go with the Burnley/Sunderland/Hull/etc. approach and just kick it away and sit deep, hopefully not.
 

Offline LallanaInPyjamas

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Re: Liverpool vs Tottenham February 12th, 5:30 pm
« Reply #131 on: February 6, 2017, 11:45:54 am »
We can't be too radical but we definitely need to drop the players that have undoubtedly cost us points time and time again down the line and thats the three of Mignolet, Lucas and Can.

If we don't score than hey ho but these lads are throwing points away for fun.

Mignolet has made one or two mistakes. Let's not forget the reason he's playing is because the goalkeeper we signed to replace him is a dud who can't claim crosses nor seemingly save things.

Lucas is a terrible centre back but guess what, you have to play a terrible centre back at times when you've only got two good ones at the club, both of whom are prone to injury. I seem to recall pointing out our pitiful squad depth on the opening day of the season and you acting like I was crazy, but there we go.

As for Can, is he kicking the ball in his own net now then? We look more solid with him in the middle, simple as that. As the poster above rightly points out, it would be suicide to go into Saturday's game with four guys below 5'10.

Offline slaphead

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Re: Liverpool vs Tottenham February 12th, 5:30 pm
« Reply #132 on: February 6, 2017, 11:47:56 am »
People had this worry last time and we were absolutely fine against them.

They don't like being pressed, especially with no Vertonghen or Rose. Maybe Pochettino will go with the Burnley/Sunderland/Hull/etc. approach and just kick it away and sit deep, hopefully not.
 

Aye fair point. I'd also like to see Sturridge start he might not be on his game but he's a goalscorer, and we need that badly

Offline HeartAndSoul

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Re: Liverpool vs Tottenham February 12th, 5:30 pm
« Reply #133 on: February 6, 2017, 11:49:54 am »
Please no Emre Can for this one.

He'll play even though he doesn't deserve to be starting. Klopp seems to love playing him against the tougher teams, hell he's even playing and stinking out the place against the dross in the league. He badly needs some time out the team and hopefully regain his form.

Offline plura

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Re: Liverpool vs Tottenham February 12th, 5:30 pm
« Reply #134 on: February 6, 2017, 11:54:06 am »
Klopp has a week to prepare for this game with a full squad.

We'll win, and that will be the end of this embarrassing start to 2017 which has ruined the season of all but 1 goal.

Well Tottenham also has a week to prepare for this game. But I hope for everyone's sake that the players really ups their performances.

Online JackWard33

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Re: Liverpool vs Tottenham February 12th, 5:30 pm
« Reply #135 on: February 6, 2017, 12:08:33 pm »
Mignolet has made one or two mistakes. Let's not forget the reason he's playing is because the goalkeeper we signed to replace him is a dud who can't claim crosses nor seemingly save things.


Karius has played well recently.
Given that we didn't think Mignolet was good enough in the summer and at the start of the season and he's now making the same mistakes he's always made persisting with him seems pretty futile.

Offline Souness1

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Re: Liverpool vs Tottenham February 12th, 5:30 pm
« Reply #136 on: February 6, 2017, 12:20:53 pm »
Cant't believe there are some people claiming Can should start. We dominated Spurs at WHL with Lallana, Gini, Hendo midfield and Can has been woeful the past month or so. It has to be;

Karius - Clyne, Matip, Lovren, Milner - Hendo, Wijnladum, Lallana - Coutinho, Firmino, Mane.

We still havent seen this lineup since early November and its the one that has served us so well. Calls for Sturridge to start are mad as well, Carra was right when he said if he's not scoring its like playing with 10 men. And he is currently not scoring, despite having a decent number of minutes in the last 10 games. Whilst Firmino hasn't been in great form, you can see what he brings to the team in the bigger games. His best two games recently have been United and Chelsea in a general sense, I know he scored 2 great goals agaisnt Swansea but he didnt have a good game on the whole and generally he influences himself well against the bigger teams.

We need to get our best team back together for a long period. We had our best front 4 on the pitch against Hull and it should have been enough to beat them but we are still carrying players like Lucas, Can and Mignolet who dont deserve to be anywhere near the first team, currently.

Offline 007.lankyguy

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Re: Liverpool vs Tottenham February 12th, 5:30 pm
« Reply #137 on: February 6, 2017, 12:27:45 pm »
Cant't believe there are some people claiming Can should start. We dominated Spurs at WHL with Lallana, Gini, Hendo midfield and Can has been woeful the past month or so.
Can has had more good performances than Lallana and Wijnaldum in the last month. Maybe we should drop them?

There's an argument for dropping Can but the way people go on about him as if everyone's outperforming him is laughable.
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Offline Souness1

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Re: Liverpool vs Tottenham February 12th, 5:30 pm
« Reply #138 on: February 6, 2017, 12:33:16 pm »
Can has had more good performances than Lallana and Wijnaldum in the last month. Maybe we should drop them?

There's an argument for dropping Can but the way people go on about him as if everyone's outperforming him is laughable.

Can had an OK game against Chelsea but thats about as much as I can remember. Lallana has arguably been our player of the season so far and he was the key man in our brilliant early season form. If we want to get back to that level then Lallana cannot be dropped surely? I actually think Wijnaldum has had good games over the past month, moreso than Can. Even before our bad run he was comfortably playing better than Can as well. I haven't got a personal vendetta against Emre but its pretty obvious that he should be dropped, he hasnt had a good season in the slighest.

Offline Redman78

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Re: Liverpool vs Tottenham February 12th, 5:30 pm
« Reply #139 on: February 6, 2017, 12:48:31 pm »
Can has had more good performances than Lallana and Wijnaldum in the last month. Maybe we should drop them?

There's an argument for dropping Can but the way people go on about him as if everyone's outperforming him is laughable.

He was decent against Chelsea but that's it.   I'd rather see Gini in midfield because whilst he's not been great, I think he moves and keeps the ball better than Can, plus offers more of a threat going forward.  He works much better with Henderson than Can does.

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Re: Liverpool vs Tottenham February 12th, 5:30 pm
« Reply #140 on: February 6, 2017, 12:54:24 pm »
Can has had more good performances than Lallana and Wijnaldum in the last month. Maybe we should drop them?

There's an argument for dropping Can but the way people go on about him as if everyone's outperforming him is laughable.

Lallana has gone back to how he's been playing before. No end product. I really hope it wasn't just a purple patch. Said at the time we've rewarded 6 months good form with a huge pay rise. But anyway least of our worries right now.
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Offline 007.lankyguy

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Re: Liverpool vs Tottenham February 12th, 5:30 pm
« Reply #141 on: February 6, 2017, 12:56:35 pm »
Can had an OK game against Chelsea but thats about as much as I can remember. Lallana has arguably been our player of the season so far and he was the key man in our brilliant early season form. If we want to get back to that level then Lallana cannot be dropped surely? I actually think Wijnaldum has had good games over the past month, moreso than Can. Even before our bad run he was comfortably playing better than Can as well. I haven't got a personal vendetta against Emre but its pretty obvious that he should be dropped, he hasnt had a good season in the slighest.
Can was our best player against Man Utd as well, or at least right up there. That's more than Lallana's had in the last month.

And no, I'm not actually suggesting Lallana should be dropped (even though I think there is an argument for it). I'm just finding it confusing that while nobody is playing well, Can is the one people are picking out for specific criticism. It's odd.
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Offline Funky_Gibbons

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Re: Liverpool vs Tottenham February 12th, 5:30 pm
« Reply #142 on: February 6, 2017, 12:58:22 pm »
Lallana has gone back to how he's been playing before. No end product. I really hope it wasn't just a purple patch. Said at the time we've rewarded 6 months good form with a huge pay rise. But anyway least of our worries right now.
The whole team has no end product right now!!!

Arguing who's playing better out of Can and Lallana or anyone else for that matter is like arguing about different shades of shit.
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Offline LallanaInPyjamas

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Re: Liverpool vs Tottenham February 12th, 5:30 pm
« Reply #143 on: February 6, 2017, 01:08:14 pm »
Can was our best player against Man Utd as well, or at least right up there. That's more than Lallana's had in the last month.

And no, I'm not actually suggesting Lallana should be dropped (even though I think there is an argument for it). I'm just finding it confusing that while nobody is playing well, Can is the one people are picking out for specific criticism. It's odd.

It's not really odd, it's just blatant scapegoating. And it's largely based on this ongoing myth that we only ever played well and won games with Henderson, Wijnaldum and Lallana in midfield, Firmino's top knot upfront and Klopp wearing his glasses at the precise angle.

Offline 007.lankyguy

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Re: Liverpool vs Tottenham February 12th, 5:30 pm
« Reply #144 on: February 6, 2017, 01:14:32 pm »
It's not really odd, it's just blatant scapegoating. And it's largely based on this ongoing myth that we only ever played well and won games with Henderson, Wijnaldum and Lallana in midfield, Firmino's top knot upfront and Klopp wearing his glasses at the precise angle.
True. It's still odd though that people are ignoring the fact that everyone's playing badly. Apart from odd individual performances nobody has any credit right now.
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Offline LallanaInPyjamas

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Re: Liverpool vs Tottenham February 12th, 5:30 pm
« Reply #145 on: February 6, 2017, 01:17:30 pm »
True. It's still odd though that people are ignoring the fact that everyone's playing badly. Apart from odd individual performances nobody has any credit right now.

It helps people sleep at night thinking they have the explanation for it.

There's nerds over at This Is Anfield right now furiously typing how our season can be saved by playing Wijnaldum over Can, I guarantee it.

Offline Souness1

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Re: Liverpool vs Tottenham February 12th, 5:30 pm
« Reply #146 on: February 6, 2017, 01:23:12 pm »
Can was our best player against Man Utd as well, or at least right up there. That's more than Lallana's had in the last month.

And no, I'm not actually suggesting Lallana should be dropped (even though I think there is an argument for it). I'm just finding it confusing that while nobody is playing well, Can is the one people are picking out for specific criticism. It's odd.

Lallana did a proper job on Carrick in the first half of that game, something that has very rarely happened by any player this season. He was brilliant and had a far better game than Can. I'm not picking Can out personally for criticism, I just found it baffling that there were few posts further up that were keen to keep Can in the side when he hasn't found any decent form all season. All of the front 6 that i mentioned have had sustained periods of really good games, Can hasn't. I don't think its unreasonable to suggest that the team the shot us to the top of the league should be re-instated? If he was in form and I was calling for him to be axed then fair enough, comment on my unfair assessment of the player, but we need to get back to a winning formula and I don't think Can deserves a place in the XI for this purpose.

Offline Souness1

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Re: Liverpool vs Tottenham February 12th, 5:30 pm
« Reply #147 on: February 6, 2017, 01:25:52 pm »
It's not really odd, it's just blatant scapegoating. And it's largely based on this ongoing myth that we only ever played well and won games with Henderson, Wijnaldum and Lallana in midfield, Firmino's top knot upfront and Klopp wearing his glasses at the precise angle.

It's not blatant scapegoating in the slightest, Can has had a mediocre season at best. I'm guessing you want us to finish in the top 4 don't you? Well its time to get back to what has worked the best and that's a team which doesn't include Can. Its not a hard concept to get to grips with.

Offline Souness1

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Re: Liverpool vs Tottenham February 12th, 5:30 pm
« Reply #148 on: February 6, 2017, 01:28:08 pm »
It helps people sleep at night thinking they have the explanation for it.

There's nerds over at This Is Anfield right now furiously typing how our season can be saved by playing Wijnaldum over Can, I guarantee it.

What maniacs they are; suggesting playing a player better than Can in a quest for improvement. I think I've heard it all now.

Offline 007.lankyguy

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Re: Liverpool vs Tottenham February 12th, 5:30 pm
« Reply #149 on: February 6, 2017, 02:00:48 pm »
Lallana did a proper job on Carrick in the first half of that game, something that has very rarely happened by any player this season. He was brilliant and had a far better game than Can. I'm not picking Can out personally for criticism, I just found it baffling that there were few posts further up that were keen to keep Can in the side when he hasn't found any decent form all season. All of the front 6 that i mentioned have had sustained periods of really good games, Can hasn't. I don't think its unreasonable to suggest that the team the shot us to the top of the league should be re-instated? If he was in form and I was calling for him to be axed then fair enough, comment on my unfair assessment of the player, but we need to get back to a winning formula and I don't think Can deserves a place in the XI for this purpose.
That's bollocks but at least you've come up with something approaching a cogent argument towards the end of your post. Which is more than can be said of the "if Can starts then he must have some pictures of Klopp" sort of posts, as if everyone's not playing well below their level at the moment.
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Offline Redman78

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Re: Liverpool vs Tottenham February 12th, 5:30 pm
« Reply #150 on: February 6, 2017, 02:06:42 pm »
People wanting Can dropped is really not as outrageous as some are making out.  There are valid argument for a number of players to be dropped and Emre is one of them.  Anyone would think we've not been shit for over a month now.

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Re: Liverpool vs Tottenham February 12th, 5:30 pm
« Reply #151 on: February 6, 2017, 02:12:42 pm »
If there is an indication of tiredness, I believe our boys will be the most time to recoup in the remaining three months as we do not have any distraction whatsoever from the league.
A top four finish is still a certainity but we should keep get some rhythm going into proceedings and for a start, I hope we do not see more aeriel crosses into the oppoients box against Spurs.


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Re: Liverpool vs Tottenham February 12th, 5:30 pm
« Reply #152 on: February 6, 2017, 02:13:23 pm »
People wanting Can dropped is really not as outrageous as some are making out.  There are valid argument for a number of players to be dropped and Emre is one of them.  Anyone would think we've not been shit for over a month now.
Nobody's claiming it'd outrageous for him to be dropped. It'd be very understandable.

As you point out though, there are valid arguments for a number of players being dropped. To be frank, there's probably individual arguments for all of them. What I take issue with is when every second or third post is a call for Can to be dropped, in combination with a subtle questioning of Klopp's intelligence/integrity if it doesn't happen. Given how poorly the whole team is playing, there's something a bit off with that.
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Offline Souness1

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Re: Liverpool vs Tottenham February 12th, 5:30 pm
« Reply #153 on: February 6, 2017, 02:18:36 pm »
That's bollocks but at least you've come up with something approaching a cogent argument towards the end of your post. Which is more than can be said of the "if Can starts then he must have some pictures of Klopp" sort of posts, as if everyone's not playing well below their level at the moment.

I think it all boils down to the fact that people have seen enough this season to form some sort of valid opinion who deserves a place in the first XI. Leaving out Can is a more than reasonable view to hold as there have been 3 central midfielders who have out performed him comfortably since August. The last month or so has been terrible obviously, and if you choose a first XI based on this then fuck knows what it would be but surely when the going gets tough you go back to what has served you so well most recently?

Offline vinothmct

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Re: Liverpool vs Tottenham February 12th, 5:30 pm
« Reply #154 on: February 6, 2017, 02:19:39 pm »
Can was our best player against Man Utd as well, or at least right up there. That's more than Lallana's had in the last month.

And no, I'm not actually suggesting Lallana should be dropped (even though I think there is an argument for it). I'm just finding it confusing that while nobody is playing well, Can is the one people are picking out for specific criticism. It's odd.

Can is the latest scapegoat. Can is one of those badass players we have all others except mane are soft lads. We need players like can to win stuff. Onething about can is he never stops trying.

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Re: Liverpool vs Tottenham February 12th, 5:30 pm
« Reply #155 on: February 6, 2017, 02:22:20 pm »
Can is the latest scapegoat. Can is one of those badass players we have all others except mane are soft lads. We need players like can to win stuff. Onething about can is he never stops trying.

Really? His lack of concentration led to the throw in which cost the penalty against Sunderland and the corner against Hull. He is pretty average and should be sold on. He isnt good enough.

Offline Souness1

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Re: Liverpool vs Tottenham February 12th, 5:30 pm
« Reply #156 on: February 6, 2017, 02:30:44 pm »
Can is the latest scapegoat. Can is one of those badass players we have all others except mane are soft lads. We need players like can to win stuff. Onething about can is he never stops trying.

So much wrong with this its untrue.

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Re: Liverpool vs Tottenham February 12th, 5:30 pm
« Reply #157 on: February 6, 2017, 02:42:01 pm »
I'd love to see this: Karius, Clyne, Gomez, Matip, Milner, Henderson, Lallana, Coutinho, Mane, Woodburn, Origi
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Re: Liverpool vs Tottenham February 12th, 5:30 pm
« Reply #158 on: February 6, 2017, 02:51:30 pm »
I'd love to see this: Karius, Clyne, Gomez, Matip, Milner, Henderson, Lallana, Coutinho, Mane, Woodburn, Origi

Why would you choose Woodburn over Wijnaldum? And Firmino is irreplacable for the pressing Klopp wants to play -> if he's fit, he's gonna play.

Let's see, maybe i'm proved wrong on saturday  8)

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Re: Liverpool vs Tottenham February 12th, 5:30 pm
« Reply #159 on: February 6, 2017, 02:54:39 pm »
I'd love to see this: Karius, Clyne, Gomez, Matip, Milner, Henderson, Lallana, Coutinho, Mane, Woodburn, Origi

Putting Gomez against Kane, Henderson on his own against Dembele and Wanyama is just asking for a loss. Origi has been terrible and doesnt deserve a start.