Author Topic: Team Analysis: Jürgen Klopp’s Liverpool Tactics (*)  (Read 957633 times)

Offline Djimi Smicer34

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Re: Team Analysis: Jürgen Klopp’s Liverpool Tactics (*)
« Reply #7640 on: April 28, 2018, 10:05:11 pm »
There was someone on Twitter, Alex Mansfield I believe, who broke down James Maddison's numbers at Norwich.

Not sure what his endurance levels are like but he certainly sounds like a playmaker.

Offline Samie

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Re: Team Analysis: Jürgen Klopp’s Liverpool Tactics (*)
« Reply #7641 on: April 28, 2018, 10:05:56 pm »
We don't need an out and out replacement, Samie - but we need someone who can sprint for 90 minutes, but also has a pass on them. Eriksen seems to be the most appropriate template. Or someone like him.
Agreed, so someone like Naby?  :D He can do that easily. Seen him play passes like he's a #10.

Offline PhaseOfPlay

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Re: Team Analysis: Jürgen Klopp’s Liverpool Tactics (*)
« Reply #7642 on: April 28, 2018, 10:06:26 pm »
There was someone on Twitter, Alex Mansfield I believe, who broke down James Maddison's numbers at Norwich.

Not sure what his endurance levels are like but he certainly sounds like a playmaker.

Pure playmakers are easier to find, but playmakers who can press for 90 minutes without a rest, less so :)
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Offline Eeyore

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Re: Team Analysis: Jürgen Klopp’s Liverpool Tactics (*)
« Reply #7643 on: April 28, 2018, 10:06:58 pm »
We shouldn't focus on the ref decisions as a reason we didn't win, even though that might be legitimate. We do have to look at the continuing problem of not turning possession dominance into goals, though. And as mentioned before, this is a long-term thing with Klopp at Liverpool. It got better this season, but we're clearly some players short on the technical side in midfield. We'd 72% possession today, and only 2 shots on target. So our players are either too impatient, make bad shot choices, or we don't have players who can set up a good final ball in these games. It's likely a combination of all three.

I asked a pro player once what they thought the most important position on the field was. They said the playmaker, as a good playmaker can elevate a good striker to a great striker, and an average one to a good one, by putting goals on a plate.

We need a high-energy, tactically disciplined, agile playmaker.

Do any exist?

Or is it Keita?

For me under Klopp we have relied on Coutinho dropping off and scoring from outside the area or Lallana twisting and turning and creating things in the final third against low block sides. We gambled on selling Coutinho and not replacing him, that gamble backfired the moment Lallana got injured. That has been compounded by the loss of AOC who was one of the few players we have who is prepared to run with the ball.

Keita will help but for me we need more players who are prepared to dribble with the ball. Robbo, Moreno and Trent have good delivery and good movement but don't have the ability to take their man on, Milner and Hendo are the same, Gini can dribble but isn't really aggressive enough his dribbles are usually more about retaining the ball than offering penetration so it is left to the front three to take players on but against a low block there is very little space.

So for me the key is to have more players comfortable at taking on an opponent and breaking the lines.
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Offline PhaseOfPlay

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Re: Team Analysis: Jürgen Klopp’s Liverpool Tactics (*)
« Reply #7644 on: April 28, 2018, 10:09:52 pm »
There was someone on Twitter, Alex Mansfield I believe, who broke down James Maddison's numbers at Norwich.

Not sure what his endurance levels are like but he certainly sounds like a playmaker.

Just had a look at Madison. Looks like his key passes break down into mostly crosses and restarts. We need those, of course, but that's not what our midfield needs in these games - we need someone who can do it in open play.
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Offline Eeyore

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Re: Team Analysis: Jürgen Klopp’s Liverpool Tactics (*)
« Reply #7645 on: April 28, 2018, 10:10:04 pm »
Pure playmakers are easier to find, but playmakers who can press for 90 minutes without a rest, less so :)

Do we actually need the pressing against teams who generally allow us the ball though PoP. Maybe we need a bit more flexibility that allows us to tailor our approach depending on the opposition.
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Offline Djimi Smicer34

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Re: Team Analysis: Jürgen Klopp’s Liverpool Tactics (*)
« Reply #7646 on: April 28, 2018, 10:10:17 pm »
Pure playmakers are easier to find, but playmakers who can press for 90 minutes without a rest, less so :)

Like I said, I've no idea what his endurance levels are so I couldn't say whether or not he could press for 90 minutes.

Spurs are interested in him as well so if Eriksen is the template, they must see something in him.

Offline Samie

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Re: Team Analysis: Jürgen Klopp’s Liverpool Tactics (*)
« Reply #7647 on: April 28, 2018, 10:11:17 pm »
Let's just get Kai Havertz from Leverkusen. He's the future #10 for Germany.  ;D

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Re: Team Analysis: Jürgen Klopp’s Liverpool Tactics (*)
« Reply #7648 on: April 28, 2018, 10:11:41 pm »
There was someone on Twitter, Alex Mansfield I believe, who broke down James Maddison's numbers at Norwich.

Not sure what his endurance levels are like but he certainly sounds like a playmaker.

He is a really talented player but he would struggle in the front 3.

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Re: Team Analysis: Jürgen Klopp’s Liverpool Tactics (*)
« Reply #7649 on: April 28, 2018, 10:11:51 pm »
For me under Klopp we have relied on Coutinho dropping off and scoring from outside the area or Lallana twisting and turning and creating things in the final third against low block sides. We gambled on selling Coutinho and not replacing him, that gamble backfired the moment Lallana got injured. That has been compounded by the loss of AOC who was one of the few players we have who is prepared to run with the ball.

Keita will help but for me we need more players who are prepared to dribble with the ball. Robbo, Moreno and Trent have good delivery and good movement but don't have the ability to take their man on, Milner and Hendo are the same, Gini can dribble but isn't really aggressive enough his dribbles are usually more about retaining the ball than offering penetration so it is left to the front three to take players on but against a low block there is very little space.

So for me the key is to have more players comfortable at taking on an opponent and breaking the lines.

That also works, and would be easier to scout. But unless they're also goalscorers, then they still need to have a good final ball, Al. Even if they have the sense to just slip it to Firmino or Salah at the end as they draw defenders in. I think Keita has that in his locker, but I'm not sure AOC does, and unfortunately we're getting to the shipping-out point with Lallana.
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Offline Djimi Smicer34

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Re: Team Analysis: Jürgen Klopp’s Liverpool Tactics (*)
« Reply #7650 on: April 28, 2018, 10:13:16 pm »
He is a really talented player but he would struggle in the front 3.

He doesn't play in a front three so I'd be surprised if we wanted him to play in ours.

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Re: Team Analysis: Jürgen Klopp’s Liverpool Tactics (*)
« Reply #7651 on: April 28, 2018, 10:14:19 pm »
Do we actually need the pressing against teams who generally allow us the ball though PoP. Maybe we need a bit more flexibility that allows us to tailor our approach depending on the opposition.

We don't, but you'd expect Klopp wouldn't keep them on the bench solely for those few games per season ;D

Although, if we were clever, we'd get an older player or two specifically for those games where we anticipate having the ball. Players who won't expect a game every week, and would be probably glad not to have one every week (from a physical POV). A Gary Mac type.
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Offline Samie

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Re: Team Analysis: Jürgen Klopp’s Liverpool Tactics (*)
« Reply #7652 on: April 28, 2018, 10:15:20 pm »
But PoP mentioned Ericksen, he's apparently on shit wages at Spurs and with the debacle over the "Goal" with Kane, we should put a bid in. We can double his wages easily.  ;D

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Re: Team Analysis: Jürgen Klopp’s Liverpool Tactics (*)
« Reply #7653 on: April 28, 2018, 10:15:54 pm »
Not going to lie I'd be a tad disappointed if James Maddison is who we really want. Think we've gone beyond looking for players who might be decent, we can buy players who definitely are decent now.

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Re: Team Analysis: Jürgen Klopp’s Liverpool Tactics (*)
« Reply #7654 on: April 28, 2018, 10:16:02 pm »
But PoP mentioned Ericksen, he's apparently on shit wages at Spurs and with the debacle over the "Goal" with Kane, we should put a bid in. We can double his wages easily.  ;D

"Come to Liverpool, where all your goals are yours"

;D
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Offline Samie

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Re: Team Analysis: Jürgen Klopp’s Liverpool Tactics (*)
« Reply #7655 on: April 28, 2018, 10:16:18 pm »
We don't, but you'd expect Klopp wouldn't keep them on the bench solely for those few games per season ;D

Although, if we were clever, we'd get an older player or two specifically for those games where we anticipate having the ball. Players who won't expect a game every week, and would be probably glad not to have one every week (from a physical POV). A Gary Mac type.

So Anders Iniesta you mean?  ;D

Offline Samie

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Re: Team Analysis: Jürgen Klopp’s Liverpool Tactics (*)
« Reply #7656 on: April 28, 2018, 10:17:07 pm »
"Come to Liverpool, where all your goals are yours"

;D

Unless Mo is after a record.  ;D

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Re: Team Analysis: Jürgen Klopp’s Liverpool Tactics (*)
« Reply #7657 on: April 28, 2018, 10:17:18 pm »
So Anders Iniesta you mean?  ;D

Imagine it ;D
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Re: Team Analysis: Jürgen Klopp’s Liverpool Tactics (*)
« Reply #7658 on: April 28, 2018, 10:17:24 pm »
He doesn't play in a front three so I'd be surprised if we wanted him to play in ours.

There is a question about numbers then if they cant play in a front 3 or at least the sort of role that Mane plays and Coutinho played. We have Keita, Oxlade-Chamberlain, Lallana, Wijnaldum, Milner, Henderson and maybe Can or another player in Can’s place. Thats 7 players effectively for 3 positions.

Maybe we sign him and loan him out but numbers wise it seems difficult. Surely the only spot in our squad for an attacking playmaker has to be someone who can play off the left in the way Mane does.

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Re: Team Analysis: Jürgen Klopp’s Liverpool Tactics (*)
« Reply #7659 on: April 28, 2018, 10:18:03 pm »
There is a question about numbers then if they cant play in a front 3 or at least the sort of role that Mane plays and Coutinho played. We have Keita, Oxlade-Chamberlain, Lallana, Wijnaldum, Milner, Henderson and maybe Can or another player in Can’s place. Thats 7 players effectively for 3 positions.

Maybe we sign him and loan him out but numbers wise it seems difficult. Surely the only spot in our squad for an attacking playmaker has to be someone who can play off the left in the way Mane does.

If they are agile and energetic, they can float between midfield and attack easily.
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Offline Samie

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Re: Team Analysis: Jürgen Klopp’s Liverpool Tactics (*)
« Reply #7660 on: April 28, 2018, 10:18:28 pm »
Imagine it ;D


Yes mate! I would want mods to un ban AWWYC just for the sheer pleasure of what he thought.   ;D

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Re: Team Analysis: Jürgen Klopp’s Liverpool Tactics (*)
« Reply #7661 on: April 28, 2018, 10:19:28 pm »
There is a question about numbers then if they cant play in a front 3 or at least the sort of role that Mane plays and Coutinho played. We have Keita, Oxlade-Chamberlain, Lallana, Wijnaldum, Milner, Henderson and maybe Can or another player in Can’s place. Thats 7 players effectively for 3 positions.

Maybe we sign him and loan him out but numbers wise it seems difficult. Surely the only spot in our squad for an attacking playmaker has to be someone who can play off the left in the way Mane does.

From what I've heard, Maddison would be the midfield signing.

We want a midfielder, Maddison is a midfielder - that's where our interest stems from.

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Re: Team Analysis: Jürgen Klopp’s Liverpool Tactics (*)
« Reply #7662 on: April 28, 2018, 10:20:32 pm »
If they are agile and energetic, they can float between midfield and attack easily.

Yes I agree totally but at the moment I think Maddison would struggle in the Premier League doing the sort of deep and then attacking role Mane and Coutinho did for us. I really like him but its a massive step up.

I would like for us to sign him however as I think he could challenge for a midfield spot with us at some point in the future.

Offline Samie

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Re: Team Analysis: Jürgen Klopp’s Liverpool Tactics (*)
« Reply #7663 on: April 28, 2018, 10:21:23 pm »
Why can't we see where Iniesta's head is at? I;m sure he'd rather play for us and get good money than go to China. Put the feelers out if  I were Klopp.  ;D

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Re: Team Analysis: Jürgen Klopp’s Liverpool Tactics (*)
« Reply #7664 on: April 28, 2018, 10:21:31 pm »
From what I've heard, Maddison would be the midfield signing.

We want a midfielder, Maddison is a midfielder - that's where our interest stems from.

Thats fair enough. I would imagine we will be letting a midfielder go from that list if we sign Maddison.

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Re: Team Analysis: Jürgen Klopp’s Liverpool Tactics (*)
« Reply #7665 on: April 28, 2018, 10:23:12 pm »
Why can't we see where Iniesta's head is at? I;m sure he'd rather play for us and get good money than go to China. Put the feelers out if  I were Klopp.  ;D

Because he's said he's not playing for any European team other than Barcelona.

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Re: Team Analysis: Jürgen Klopp’s Liverpool Tactics (*)
« Reply #7666 on: April 28, 2018, 10:24:02 pm »
Because he's said he's not playing for any European team other than Barcelona.

Yeah, but surely Brexit takes care of the "European" part? ;D
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Re: Team Analysis: Jürgen Klopp’s Liverpool Tactics (*)
« Reply #7667 on: April 28, 2018, 10:24:18 pm »
Because he's said he's not playing for any European team other than Barcelona.

And i said I'm not shagging Scarlett Johansson...but in my dreams I do.

Also Brexit means we;re out.  ;D

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Re: Team Analysis: Jürgen Klopp’s Liverpool Tactics (*)
« Reply #7668 on: April 28, 2018, 10:25:11 pm »
Why can't we see where Iniesta's head is at? I;m sure he'd rather play for us and get good money than go to China. Put the feelers out if  I were Klopp.  ;D

Imagine this version of Iniesta in our side. Be doing a Gregory Vignal every week, getting subbed after coming as a sub ;D He'll be blowing out his arse after 10 minutes.

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Re: Team Analysis: Jürgen Klopp’s Liverpool Tactics (*)
« Reply #7669 on: April 28, 2018, 10:26:53 pm »
And i said I'm not shagging Scarlett Johansson...but in my dreams I do.

Also Brexit means we;re out.  ;D

"I said I would never play against Barca so it is not going to be in Europe."

Brexit or no Brexit, we're not signing Iniesta.

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Re: Team Analysis: Jürgen Klopp’s Liverpool Tactics (*)
« Reply #7670 on: April 28, 2018, 10:27:14 pm »
Imagine this version of Iniesta in our side. Be doing a Gregory Vignal every week, getting subbed after coming as a sub ;D

Iniesta in our side would mean others shitting it further mate.  Reputation still count's when it comes to big name players.  And as soon as they did that with Anders, he'd kill them by laying off a killer pass.  It would be a Gary Mac type role.

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Re: Team Analysis: Jürgen Klopp’s Liverpool Tactics (*)
« Reply #7671 on: April 28, 2018, 10:28:53 pm »
"I said I would never play against Barca so it is not going to be in Europe."

Brexit or no Brexit, we're not signing Iniesta.

You're not Tepid, don't use his catchphrase or you'll be getting a  letter from his lawyers.

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Re: Team Analysis: Jürgen Klopp’s Liverpool Tactics (*)
« Reply #7672 on: April 28, 2018, 10:28:54 pm »
Iniesta in our side would mean others shitting it further mate.  Reputation still count's when it comes to big name players.  And as soon as they did that with Anders, he'd kill them by laying off a killer pass.  It would be a Gary Mac type role.

I think he could be useful in games like today to be honest, but I wouldn't be enormously keen on playing him in big matches. Whether we could sell that role to him is another matter.

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Re: Team Analysis: Jürgen Klopp’s Liverpool Tactics (*)
« Reply #7673 on: April 28, 2018, 10:29:24 pm »
"I said I would never play against Barca so it is not going to be in Europe."

Brexit or no Brexit, we're not signing Iniesta.
Is his son any good? He's 3, must be kicking a ball already. Anyone with YouTube videos of him?

;D
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Re: Team Analysis: Jürgen Klopp’s Liverpool Tactics (*)
« Reply #7674 on: April 28, 2018, 10:30:22 pm »
You're not Tepid, don't use his catchphrase or you'll be getting a  letter from his lawyers.

Ok, there is a zero chance of us signing Iniesta then.

Unless we set up a franchise club in China or the US, then he might be up for it.

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Re: Team Analysis: Jürgen Klopp’s Liverpool Tactics (*)
« Reply #7675 on: April 28, 2018, 10:32:03 pm »
Is his son any good? He's 3, must be kicking a ball already. Anyone with YouTube videos of him?

;D

Knowing Barcelona they will have already signed him to a pre-contract at La Masia, just in case.

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Re: Team Analysis: Jürgen Klopp’s Liverpool Tactics (*)
« Reply #7676 on: April 28, 2018, 10:32:19 pm »
There's zero chance of me actually shagging Scar Jo but you know let me dream.   ;D

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Re: Team Analysis: Jürgen Klopp’s Liverpool Tactics (*)
« Reply #7677 on: April 28, 2018, 10:32:38 pm »
That also works, and would be easier to scout. But unless they're also goalscorers, then they still need to have a good final ball, Al. Even if they have the sense to just slip it to Firmino or Salah at the end as they draw defenders in. I think Keita has that in his locker, but I'm not sure AOC does, and unfortunately we're getting to the shipping-out point with Lallana.

I think it is about mixing it up more. In games against a low block we are too predictable. You can see our patterns of play two or three passes ahead and it makes it so easy to defend against. We get into pockets of space where there is an opportunity to drive at the opposition and we have too many players who look for the safe option. There is very little unpredictably in the midfield.

As I said you can see what we are going to attempt before we do it. Too many players have stock passes that they rely on too heavily. Instead of a drop of the shoulder and a little dart forward that throws the opposition it is the safe ball time and time again.

We rely too heavily on the brilliance of the front three. 
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Re: Team Analysis: Jürgen Klopp’s Liverpool Tactics (*)
« Reply #7678 on: April 28, 2018, 10:40:43 pm »
We have Keita, Oxlade-Chamberlain, Lallana, Wijnaldum, Milner, Henderson and maybe Can or another player in Can’s place. Thats 7 players effectively for 3 positions.

But Millner is another year older and Lallana may well struggle with injuries/intensities.

I fully expect us to sign a creative player (ideally they can fill in, in the final third if needed).

                       New 6/Henderson

                                            Keita/Gini
              New/OX                           

With Millner, Lallana and Woodburn being bit part players due to age, injuries or youth.
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Offline killer-heels

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Re: Team Analysis: Jürgen Klopp’s Liverpool Tactics (*)
« Reply #7679 on: April 28, 2018, 10:48:36 pm »
But Millner is another year older and Lallana may well struggle with injuries/intensities.

I fully expect us to sign a creative player (ideally they can fill in, in the final third if needed).

                       New 6/Henderson

                                            Keita/Gini
              New/OX                           

With Millner, Lallana and Woodburn being bit part players due to age, injuries or youth.

Bit part players but at least with enough left in the tank to contribute next season. Plus I can’t see how we start with 3 new midfielders next season.

The only way that happens is if as you say whomever we sign is comfortable playing in the attacking positions but that would have to be their primary role.

We pretty much need someone who can do what Coutinho did. Albeit no one we will sign will be in that level.