Author Topic: Roberto Firmino  (Read 1855264 times)

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Re: Roberto Firmino
« Reply #15280 on: January 27, 2023, 09:31:50 am »
So you'd get rid of our joint top scorer in the league? he definitely deserves a one year extension

He's getting on in age, he's injured a lot these days, and he's just as likely to go 10 games without scoring.
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Re: Roberto Firmino
« Reply #15281 on: January 27, 2023, 09:42:01 am »
Great post and the strength of the pushback is very odd.

Indeed.... a well reasoned POV....... some very odd, overly sensitive cats on here
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Offline robertobaggio37

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Re: Roberto Firmino
« Reply #15282 on: January 27, 2023, 10:11:04 am »
Will be out for another couple of weeks. Who's the fella who said he'd be back for boxing day fixture?  ;D
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Re: Roberto Firmino
« Reply #15283 on: January 27, 2023, 10:21:42 am »
Heading for 2 months out then and has to get through our training on his return or it'll be longer. 25 games missed last season.

Let's renew his contract as a reliable back up option  :D

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Re: Roberto Firmino
« Reply #15284 on: January 27, 2023, 10:23:36 am »
Easy decision not to renew. We've got Salah, Nunez, Diaz, Jota and Gakpo with Elliott, Carvalho and Doak as back up for the front three. I'd rather spend what would probably be a fraction of the money on reviewing and fixing our training and fitness methods so the players aren't getting injured so often.

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Re: Roberto Firmino
« Reply #15285 on: January 27, 2023, 10:53:21 am »
One year deal with the option of another year would be fine, even if I don't agree with it really.

A long term contract would be insanity but then we do have form in giving out unmerited contracts to players.

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Re: Roberto Firmino
« Reply #15286 on: January 27, 2023, 09:39:00 pm »
Shouldnt be renewed. Mad if we do. Injured a lot now.

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Re: Roberto Firmino
« Reply #15287 on: January 27, 2023, 09:42:44 pm »
Heading for 2 months out then and has to get through our training on his return or it'll be longer. 25 games missed last season.

Let's renew his contract as a reliable back up option  :D

He can't be first pick playing as many games as he was asked to. Being a back up should see him be less injury prone.

Offline killer-heels

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Re: Roberto Firmino
« Reply #15288 on: January 27, 2023, 09:46:19 pm »
He can't be first pick playing as many games as he was asked to. Being a back up should see him be less injury prone.

He got injured in training didnt he?

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Re: Roberto Firmino
« Reply #15289 on: January 27, 2023, 09:49:20 pm »
He can't be first pick playing as many games as he was asked to. Being a back up should see him be less injury prone.

You're right about him being a backup. He'll be 6th choice. He might struggle to get on the bench.

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Re: Roberto Firmino
« Reply #15290 on: January 27, 2023, 09:54:49 pm »
Maybe so, but that's not a reason to throw good money after bad. We've made a series of bizarre contractual decisions in the past few years but we should be looking to break the cycle, not perpetuate it. Particularly since these things do not exist in a vacuum. The antidote to renewing too many old players is not to.. renew even more old players.

Ultimately:
- We have an enormous wage bill that does not remotely correlate with our level on the pitch, and which is directly impacting upon our ability to refresh the squad
- We have one of the oldest, slowest and least athletic squads in the league
- We have already renewed a large number of players in the same age bracket who are past their best (which is not to say they are *finished*, but they are demonstrably below their peak level), for the most part on enormous wages relative to their current on-pitch level (Salah, Henderson, Fabinho, VVD)
- We have a pretty bloated squad full of injury-prone players (some of these will leave soon)

Bobby is a bonafide legend. But he's also 31, has lost the vast majority of any athleticism he once had (meaning he struggles to press anywhere near as effectively as he used to), is one of our highest paid players, has declined significantly from his peak, and has started to pick up a shitload of injuries. 35 games missed (and counting) since the start of last season - with at least 5 different injuries - if you were keeping tally by the way. Keita has a better injury record over the last 18 months and he missed the entire first half of this season... Keeping injury prone players around for squad depth is a false economy, because they're never actually available when you need them. Like now, for instance.

He basically ticks every negative box on the "caution re: renewing players over 30" checklist. Does he still have a lot to offer the right team? Totally. If we kept him, would he contribute next season? I'm sure he would, to some extent. Does that mean it makes sense, financially or from a squad perspective? God no.


Good post.
Yup the mentality has to change
Itís not transition if you donít move on from post peak players

Offline killer-heels

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Re: Roberto Firmino
« Reply #15291 on: January 27, 2023, 09:56:55 pm »
Good post.
Yup the mentality has to change
Itís not transition if you donít move on from post peak players

What I dont get is this idea that its fine to have him when you have loads of other younger attackers. He still takes a place in the squad, he still costs a relatively big amount of wages. Then when there is a discussion around where the money is, you have people saying we invested it in wages.

No shit.

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Re: Roberto Firmino
« Reply #15292 on: January 28, 2023, 12:08:16 am »
I donít think we should keep him , but we are more suited to his type than a proper 9. Nunez Salah Gakpo diaz and Jota all very useful from wide positions and our ageing midfield needs a pressing monster false 9 who is good at link up play .

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Re: Roberto Firmino
« Reply #15293 on: January 28, 2023, 12:15:49 am »
There's a reason why clubs have held onto and in some cases even bought the more skilful and experienced older players and it has fuck all about sentiment or blind loyalty.

He's going to bring the young'uns on no end and I'd bet my left bollock that he'll score many a winner coming off the bench.

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Re: Roberto Firmino
« Reply #15294 on: January 28, 2023, 02:00:00 am »
How long was he originally estimated to be out for?. Would have thought its something serious if he still isnt back...

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Re: Roberto Firmino
« Reply #15295 on: January 28, 2023, 02:43:16 am »
His Instagram is like Christian TV lately
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Re: Roberto Firmino
« Reply #15296 on: January 28, 2023, 03:01:10 am »
His Instagram is like Christian TV lately

And?

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Re: Roberto Firmino
« Reply #15297 on: January 28, 2023, 03:04:10 am »
I can understand the logic in giving him an extension of a year and also of releasing him on a free. You release him on a free and and you free up some wages. If you keep him for another year you have experience in back and you also have someone in training to pass on their experience to the younger players. Iím fine with whatever the club wants to do.

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Re: Roberto Firmino
« Reply #15298 on: January 28, 2023, 05:39:39 am »
His Instagram is like Christian TV lately
was he asking for donations so he can buy a helicopter??
JFT 96

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Re: Roberto Firmino
« Reply #15299 on: January 28, 2023, 06:36:51 am »
I can understand the logic in giving him an extension of a year and also of releasing him on a free. You release him on a free and and you free up some wages. If you keep him for another year you have experience in back and you also have someone in training to pass on their experience to the younger players. Iím fine with whatever the club wants to do.
It's a tricky one. We have several players with vast experience, the same argument can be made for all. We could be spending half a million a week on players to share their experience.
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Re: Roberto Firmino
« Reply #15300 on: January 28, 2023, 06:52:06 am »
With Bobby either decision can make sense for me. If he stays, we'll have a reliable experience option, especially for cup games or as a sub who can make something happen. If he goes, he'd free up a good chunk of the wage bill and open minutes for a younger lads like Doak or Gordon or Kone-Doherty to get a crack. Either way the risk is low the way I see it because we are now well stocked and just need to have patience as the newer lads build the understanding and link up play in our system. That is not something that will happen overnight.

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Re: Roberto Firmino
« Reply #15301 on: January 28, 2023, 11:37:24 am »
Maybe so, but that's not a reason to throw good money after bad. We've made a series of bizarre contractual decisions in the past few years but we should be looking to break the cycle, not perpetuate it. Particularly since these things do not exist in a vacuum. The antidote to renewing too many old players is not to.. renew even more old players.

Ultimately:
- We have an enormous wage bill that does not remotely correlate with our level on the pitch, and which is directly impacting upon our ability to refresh the squad
- We have one of the oldest, slowest and least athletic squads in the league
- We have already renewed a large number of players in the same age bracket who are past their best (which is not to say they are *finished*, but they are demonstrably below their peak level), for the most part on enormous wages relative to their current on-pitch level (Salah, Henderson, Fabinho, VVD)
- We have a pretty bloated squad full of injury-prone players (some of these will leave soon)

Bobby is a bonafide legend. But he's also 31, has lost the vast majority of any athleticism he once had (meaning he struggles to press anywhere near as effectively as he used to), is one of our highest paid players, has declined significantly from his peak, and has started to pick up a shitload of injuries. 35 games missed (and counting) since the start of last season - with at least 5 different injuries - if you were keeping tally by the way. Keita has a better injury record over the last 18 months and he missed the entire first half of this season... Keeping injury prone players around for squad depth is a false economy, because they're never actually available when you need them. Like now, for instance.

He basically ticks every negative box on the "caution re: renewing players over 30" checklist. Does he still have a lot to offer the right team? Totally. If we kept him, would he contribute next season? I'm sure he would, to some extent. Does that mean it makes sense, financially or from a squad perspective? God no.
Excellent post.
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Re: Roberto Firmino
« Reply #15302 on: January 28, 2023, 04:18:15 pm »
was he asking for donations so he can buy a helicopter??

 :lmao :wellin
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Re: Roberto Firmino
« Reply #15303 on: January 28, 2023, 05:48:34 pm »
ďHe basically ticks every negative box on the "caution re: renewing players over 30" checklist. Does he still have a lot to offer the right team? Totally. If we kept him, would he contribute next season? I'm sure he would, to some extent. Does that mean it makes sense, financially or from a squad perspective? God no.ď

This. Heís a legend and will leave with his head held high but itís time to go.

Of course he will still be capable of the odd purple patch or stunning moment but he canít contribute at the highest level for 40 games a season. He should probably have been moved on in the summer. We canít keep clinging to Kloppís first great team. We need to focus on building his second great team.

We could do with the foreign player spot and the 100k+ a week in wages.
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Re: Roberto Firmino
« Reply #15304 on: January 28, 2023, 07:04:09 pm »
was he asking for donations so he can buy a helicopter??

 ;D
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Re: Roberto Firmino
« Reply #15305 on: January 30, 2023, 05:37:35 pm »
I know that RB is 31 years old - seems to be a wonderful human being - lovely smile and contributed to some of the clubs best moments. sadly now - a bit injuries and lost a bit of his pace (although pace not primary asset). He is set for life

The club does not owe him anything; lowball him on a one year contract and tell his agent to fuck off

I thought you were american ?

Speaking about contracts; 2,5 months since most recent league match - enough said
Itís not even about individuality, itís about the team. Our game was based on his controlling of the tempo. Squeeze the life out of the opposition and then strike. That is our game. Like a pack of pythons.

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Re: Roberto Firmino
« Reply #15306 on: February 1, 2023, 08:48:28 pm »
ďHappiness can be found in the darkest of times, if one only remembers to turn on the light.Ē
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Re: Roberto Firmino
« Reply #15307 on: February 1, 2023, 08:53:10 pm »
Big mistake really. At some point we need to move on and start a proper rebuild.

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Re: Roberto Firmino
« Reply #15308 on: February 1, 2023, 09:01:06 pm »
Hmm not sure about this one.

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Re: Roberto Firmino
« Reply #15309 on: February 1, 2023, 09:01:56 pm »
I hope it is agent talk. if not and if he gets a new contract being injuried - beggars belief.. we are skint
Itís not even about individuality, itís about the team. Our game was based on his controlling of the tempo. Squeeze the life out of the opposition and then strike. That is our game. Like a pack of pythons.

Offline TepidT2O

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Re: Roberto Firmino
« Reply #15310 on: February 1, 2023, 09:12:34 pm »
I hope it is agent talk. if not and if he gets a new contract being injuried - beggars belief.. we are skint
NonsenseÖ.


A sixth choice striker who is a top top professional and who sets the level in training ? No brainer on a shorter term deal.



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Re: Roberto Firmino
« Reply #15311 on: February 1, 2023, 09:13:24 pm »
He can still contribute as a back up so not that against it but think ideally he should just be allowed to leave as he's getting more and more injured with each passing year. Maybe playing less will mean he'll be more available for us.

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Re: Roberto Firmino
« Reply #15312 on: February 1, 2023, 09:13:32 pm »
NonsenseÖ.


A sixth choice striker who is a top top professional and who sets the level in training ? No brainer on a shorter term deal.





What good has this level setting done us this season?
Sit down, shock is better taken with bent knees.

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Re: Roberto Firmino
« Reply #15313 on: February 1, 2023, 09:15:00 pm »
Good for 10 goals a season.
Good enough for me.

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Re: Roberto Firmino
« Reply #15314 on: February 1, 2023, 09:16:45 pm »
You can imagine those model pro's like Thiago, Van Dijk, Mo Salah etc refusing to train if Bobby wasn't there "setting the level in training".

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Re: Roberto Firmino
« Reply #15315 on: February 1, 2023, 09:20:43 pm »
Ludicrous decision and further evidence of how terrible our decision making has become.

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Re: Roberto Firmino
« Reply #15316 on: February 1, 2023, 09:22:01 pm »
NonsenseÖ.


A sixth choice striker who is a top top professional and who sets the level in training ? No brainer on a shorter term deal.





Sets the level in a training  sixth choice striker and beiing injuried for 2-3 months.. are you serious ?
Itís not even about individuality, itís about the team. Our game was based on his controlling of the tempo. Squeeze the life out of the opposition and then strike. That is our game. Like a pack of pythons.

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Re: Roberto Firmino
« Reply #15317 on: February 1, 2023, 09:23:45 pm »
He can still contribute as a back up so not that against it but think ideally he should just be allowed to leave as he's getting more and more injured with each passing year. Maybe playing less will mean he'll be more available for us.

he is carrying a injury and lost his pace. i love him but its time to say goodbye.. just a reflection on how bad we are in
Itís not even about individuality, itís about the team. Our game was based on his controlling of the tempo. Squeeze the life out of the opposition and then strike. That is our game. Like a pack of pythons.

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Re: Roberto Firmino
« Reply #15318 on: February 1, 2023, 09:26:40 pm »
If itís a cheaper and affordable contract short term, itís fine.  Itís not like the savings would be so immense in that case.
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Re: Roberto Firmino
« Reply #15319 on: February 1, 2023, 09:27:50 pm »
Good for 10 goals a season.
Good enough for me.

he scored 12 goals in 2018/2019 when he played 34 games.. he scored 5 in 20 last season. he hasnt played since november but lets give him a new contract - moneyball in reverse
Itís not even about individuality, itís about the team. Our game was based on his controlling of the tempo. Squeeze the life out of the opposition and then strike. That is our game. Like a pack of pythons.