Topic: Liverpool 0 - 1 Aston Villa post match winge

[irish musicman]

1-2

Rodgers switched it because Villa swamped Gerrard last season (as shown on MOTD that's how they originally set out today), but there has to be a better plan than the 2 man midfield we know doesn't work.

Yes the one we used to come back last season and get a draw, but that would mean bringing Lucas out of retirement, we played with one up top at home today and Henderson and Coutinho were trying to play from very deep, we need to get it together soon or we will struggle later on playing catch up.

[L666KOP]

So Gerrard is the issue?

In certain games absolutely.

However, as we stand he's our quarterback, of sorts. But pairing him with Jordan in a flat 2, in front of a flat 4 does not help us.

You could see he kept dropping back between Dejan and Mamadou like he generally does, and this dragged us out of shape and let Villa bully us with their pressing, which to give them credit was fucking spot on, Cleverely and Delph were brilliant today.

[istvan kozma]

The worry is the last 3 teams to come to Anfield with an ultra defensive approach (Chelsea, Newcastle,Villa) , we've hardly created a chance from open play in all those games.

[thelinnen]

This Mexico team on The Simpsons played better football than us today.

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/v/31fWMyU48ag" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer" class="bbc_link bbc_flash_disabled new_win">http://www.youtube.com/v/31fWMyU48ag</a>

[L666KOP]

Some of Gerrards passing was sublime

If there was a pass of the season award they'd have awarded it aloready after that pass he made with the outside of his foot down the left.

Had me off the couch, and the dog fucked off out of the room such was it's splendour.

[Saul Goodman]

This thread is mental. Yeah the team got off to a slow start but after about half an hour we completely controlled the game. The problem wasn't system/tactics but a lack of quality football in forward positions to carve out chances. In forward areas there was no fluency, incisiveness or cohesion. One shot on target all game tells its own story. They all looked like they hadn't played together before and I guess that is because they haven't. The front three were all making home debuts at the same time, one of whom is only returning from a long injury layoff.

Rotation is something which has to happen and at this stage of the squad building we're going to be fielding players/teams that have never payed together and as a result things are going to often look disjointed as the players figure out their roles and the new players around them. The argument can be made that it should be done more incrementally than today but Rodgers has always been a rip the plaster off in one go kind of manager and his hand has been forced somewhat. Hopefully that method will mean that while we endure the pain of results like today it will get the squad as a whole up and running much quicker. I think unfortunately these are just the natural growing pains that come in the early stages of building a squad.

[hixxstar]

Is it safe to come out yet ?... 

[Carlito Roberto]

Not sure why some posters are getting ridiculed for having the audacity to mention Suarez. Let's be honest here, he was pretty fucking good wasn't he and helped us win a lot of football matches. In fact he was the best LFC player I've ever seen in my lifetime. It's too much to expect Balotelli to be anywhere near that level, but was disappointed with his performance today. Without Sturridge I expected him to lead the line, very odd seeing him stood out on the wing, didn't understand that tactic at all...

[Twelfth Man]

This thread is mental. Yeah the team got off to a slow start but after about half an hour we completely controlled the game. The problem wasn't system/tactics but a lack of quality football in forward positions to carve out chances.

That might have something to do with the fact that Villa scored and invited pressure on, to hit us on the break with Gabby A.

[Just Dan]

Its all very much shoulda woulda.

But looking back we should have gone with the 2 up top at home. Yes I know the main man is injured. But we're at home and we're playing Aston Villa. I know they're doing well and I know they're confident. They also had every right to be considering their last couple of results here. But go with the 2 up top. Ask questions. We've seen what this does for us, it unlocks space. It gives 4 defenders something more to think about. 1 up top like Balotelli was, they can become isolated. Balotelli is trying his best and isn't match sharp, but he isn't a mover like Suarez, or Sturridge for that matter. He isn't that fluid. He will move, he's not 100% Berbatov. But he's not Suarez, who would go wherever the danger is at that specific moment in time. Balotelli is more fixed in that sense. This makes it easy for the opposition to defend against. Thats why they targeted him all game and kicked lumps out of him. He was effectively out of the game just by the way we was lined up. It was our own fault. We made it easy for them from the start.  + He'd apparently had a bug, so naturally he'd be low on energy.

What more? We put players AROUND him that weren't match sharp either. This just contributed to the overall flatness in our play. It didn't help Mario. He needed runners, movement. Instead we was just passing for passings sake, getting it wide and crossing it in. There was no real invention apart from 1 or 2 moves and even then we was forcing it. There was a lack of tempo, rhythm. It wasn't coming natural. As the game went on we was forcing it more and more.

Other than 1 or 2 moves we was pretty much predictable. There was a lack of urgency in midfield and attack. In fact two of our most urgent players on the ball were in defence. Moreno and Lovren. Getting it into midfield was not a problem. Getting it quickly out of midfield and into the final third was. 

So looking back, we should have gone with the 4-1-2-1-2. I think we would have functioned better with 2 up top. Because they would be opening space up for one another, playing off and around one another. Then we can get the runners from midfield like Lallana and Henderson, Sterling/Coutinho.

As it was, we tried just a bit too much today. Balotelli, Lallana and Markovic all starting was just too much too soon. Picking 2 from the start was pushing it. Nevermind 3. We knew that Villa would do low block and the goal just gave them 101 more reasons. We needed energy. Spark. For me we needed someone actively around Balotelli so in that sense Borini would have been a starter for me today. I know that won't get much support, but coming on when he did, how is he meant to get in and effect a game like that? The table was already laid out, whats the manager supposed to say? "Go on Fabio. Be Suarez Fabio. Good lad."   ?

For me, he would have been better starting it alongside one of Balotelli or Lambert.

Its all about space and creating it, creating it even when its not there. Borini would have made more space for our killers to operate. What we did all game was run into dead-ends.

Markovic for me was ineffective and rather negative. He seemed unwilling to make things happen, the majority of time he was getting it and giving it back. We needed him to be dynamic, pro-active. With Sterling rested, we needed him to be the Sterling. I think this was the idea. We needed him picking up the ball and doing some of what Coutinho was trying to do. Basically make things happen. Instead, we was giving him it and he was playing it back. Now whether thats lack of sharpness, confidence, nerves, still learning his team mates or simply the manager telling him to play simple or a combination of things I don't know. But what I saw was negativity in his play. We needed him running at them, hurting them. Creating panic. We didn't see enough of this from him. We made it easy for them.

I don't think Sterling was the answer. When he came on he looked to me like a player that needed a rest. He didn't look fresh/as fresh as he was before the international break. He wasn't fit to start. Rodgers knew more than anyone where he was at.

This is what I would have gone with:


--------------- Mignolet ---------------
Manquillo - Lovren - Sakho - Moreno
--------------- Gerrard ----------------
------ Henderson ---- Lallana --------
--------------- Coutinho --------------
-------- Borini -------- Balotelli ------


Then of course you can bring on Markovic with his pace when Aston Villa start to fatigue. He can have more of an effect then. He would have been a better sub to come into the game later on than Borini. Lambert can come on for Balotelli to keep us fresh. We could pull Lallana off after 60, stick Sterling at the tip of the diamond, play Coutinho in left side of midfield.

I know some people will say "Well you say that team now having seen the game"

But I would have gone with Borini today, from the start. Most def. Either Borini+Lambert or Borini+Balotelli.

[Saul Goodman]

That might have something to do with the fact that Villa scored and invited pressure on, to hit us on the break with Gabby A.

On another day with Sterling and Sturridge in the team that would have been suicide. We were unlucky today in that because we're in the early stages of squad building that it didn't click up top. With better quality in the forward areas we would have ripped them apart if that became the plan after they scored. How the dominance was gained isn't really the issue and while Villa may have sat back a little after the goal, I think we also exerted ourselves far more after a slow start. The problem though was we didn't have any kind of fluency in attacking area to be able to take advantage of that dominance.

[Mutton Geoff]

Not sure why some posters are getting ridiculed for having the audacity to mention Suarez. Let's be honest here, he was pretty fucking good wasn't he and helped us win a lot of football matches. In fact he was the best LFC player I've ever seen in my lifetime. It's too much to expect Balotelli to be anywhere near that level, but was disappointed with his performance today. Without Sturridge I expected him to lead the line, very odd seeing him stood out on the wing, didn't understand that tactic at all...

However  Suarez would still be banned but never mind hey him and Rafa make such nice cheap shots when we lose!

[L666KOP]

This thread is mental. Yeah the team got off to a slow start but after about half an hour we completely controlled the game. The problem wasn't system/tactics but a lack of quality football in forward positions to carve out chances. In forward areas there was no fluency, incisiveness or cohesion. One shot on target all game tells its own story. They all looked like they hadn't played together before and I guess that is because they haven't. The front three were all making home debuts at the same time, one of whom is only returning from a long injury layoff.

Rotation is something which has to happen and at this stage of the squad building we're going to be fielding players/teams that have never payed together and as a result things are going to often look disjointed as the players figure out their roles and the new players around them. The argument can be made that it should be done more incrementally than today but Rodgers has always been a rip the plaster off in one go kind of manager and his hand has been forced somewhat. Hopefully that method will mean that while we endure the pain of results like today it will get the squad as a whole up and running much quicker. I think unfortunately these are just the natural growing pains that come in the early stages of building a squad.

Bollocks.

Villa clearly controlled the game.

Remember Rafa ?

"They may have had the ball, but we completely controlled the game"

Never once did we threaten their goal. Other than a deflected Coutinho shot that hit the post.

[elpistolero7]

Suarez would still be banned if he were here. We most likely wouldn't have acquired all the players we have if we hadn't sold him for 75 million. It was Lallana and Markovic's first start. Balotelli is yet to play 200 minutes in a red shirt. 3 of our defenders are new signings. It can't all click suddenly, especially when our 2 best attackers aren't playing, and yes, Rodgers was right to rest Sterling. What if we play him too much and burn him out/lead him toward a 3 month layoff? Then what?

There were so many occasions when a midfielder played a ball an attacker wasn't anticipating, and the interplay between the front three looked very disjointed. Individually, the players looked quite decent IMO, just didn't gel well enough on the day.

The attack can have off days, it happens. Even though we were crap today, if one of the set pieces had worked out, or we'd had a bit of luck with the shot off the post, we'd have come away with a draw. My gripe remains with the defense. How we made Senderos look like Hummels attacking those corners is beyond me. As much as I respect and rate Rodgers, I really think the issues in defense come in part from the management; do we not practice defending set pieces in training or something? Sure does look like it.

[Saul Goodman]

Bollocks.

Villa clearly controlled the game.

Remember Rafa ?

"They may have had the ball, but we completely controlled the game"

Never once did we threaten their goal. Other than a deflected Coutinho shot that hit the post.

Why are you referencing Rafa? It has absolutely no relevance to a team who had three players in attacking areas who were all making home debuts together. If a couple of months down the line we're still seeing the same kind of sterile dominant performances then your point may hold weight but for now it makes no sense. I am not saying dominance is the key. What you do with that dominance is the key. Today we had a new team all getting to know each other who couldn't find any kind of cutting edge. Further along the line in term of this squads development I'm confident that we'll create the chances in that kind of performance to put teams to the sword.

[elpistolero7]

Well it was only the 3rd best player in the world that we lost.

BAN.

He'd still not be allowed near a stadium had he not signed for FC Menos que une Messi's left testicle.

A number of the lads who'll provide the decisive depth that we'll need to sustain decent cup runs and make the CL again would

Seriously, get over it. He plays for a different club now, and its not like we haven't signed a hell of a lot of talent. Give it some fucking time. The issue today wasn't Suarez, it was that too many new players were on the pitch for us, especially in attack. Had Hodgson decided to give Sterling 3 seconds off in those 2 games and not poked his dinosaur nose into Sturridge's thigh we'd have won today no question.

[L666KOP]

Why are you referencing Rafa? It has absolutely no relevance to a team who had three players in attacking areas who were all making home debuts together. If a couple of months down the line we're still seeing the same kind of sterile dominant performances then your point may hold weight but for now it makes no sense. I am not saying dominance is the key. What you do with that dominance is the key. Today we had a knew team all getting to know each other who couldn't find any kind of cutting edge. Further along the line term of this squads development I'm confident that we'll create the chances in that kind of performance to put teams to the sword.

I'm referring to Rafa simply to qualify my statement that controlling the game is not dependant an whether you have possession, or not.

Nothing more, nothing less.

[elpistolero7]

It wasn't.

But if ever there was a definition of 'catalyst' then he is it.

Losing him will not affect us like losing Alonso, but it will take time, and we'll have to hope someone assumes the mantle, and sharpish.

Suarez was nowhere near his December form come the last 2 months of the season. Sterling, Gerrard, Coutinho , Henderson were all playing at insanely high levels every week.

[Gnurglan]

Suarez would still be banned if he were here. We most likely wouldn't have acquired all the players we have if we hadn't sold him for 75 million. It was Lallana and Markovic's first start. Balotelli is yet to play 200 minutes in a red shirt. 3 of our defenders are new signings. It can't all click suddenly, especially when our 2 best attackers aren't playing, and yes, Rodgers was right to rest Sterling. What if we play him too much and burn him out/lead him toward a 3 month layoff? Then what?

The attack can have off days, it happens. Even though we were crap today, if one of the set pieces had worked out, or we'd had a bit of luck with the shot off the post, we'd have come away with a draw. My gripe remains with the defense. How we made Senderos look like Hummels attacking those corners is beyond me. As much as I respect and rate Rodgers, I really think the issues in defense come in part from the management; do we not practice defending set pieces in training or something? Sure does look like it.

The attack wasn't even there. It's early days, but with Sturridge out and Sterling on the bench, we should still have done more. Much more. Lallana, Balotelli, Markovic, Borini and Lambert all got to play. That's 75M worth of players. And our best hope was a 19-year old... The truth is, at least a couple of the new faces need to start performing straight away. If we are to fight for the title, we need to win against the likes of Villa. Home and away. No excuses. Because at the end of the season, we need to have our 25+ wins. If we say 26-6-6 for the season and we're at 2-0-2 now, it's quite clear we can't slip up too many times.

[AndyMuller]

I'm not buying this excuse for resting Sterling as in case he burns out too soon, the lads 19 years of age for god sake he will be full of energy and can play 2 games a week easy. 

[robgomm]

I think that was the worst performance in a long time, complete with a bad team selection. But with so many new players thrown in with injuries elsewhere I'm afraid it's a difficult situation. Didn't like thr tactics at all, Gerrard in a 2 is done. He was best today when deep.

[robgomm]

suarez

Spurs 0-3 Liverpool

[elpistolero7]

The attack wasn't even there. It's early days, but with Sturridge out and Sterling on the bench, we should still have done more. Much more. Lallana, Balotelli, Markovic, Borini and Lambert all got to play. That's 75M worth of players. And our best hope was a 19-year old... The truth is, at least a couple of the new faces need to start performing straight away. If we are to fight for the title, we need to win against the likes of Villa. Home and away. No excuses. Because at the end of the season, we need to have our 25+ wins. If we say 26-6-6 for the season and we're at 2-0-2 now, it's quite clear we can't slip up too many times.

The truth is, players can take time to settle in sometimes. Balotelli moved to Anfied about 3 weeks back, and has barely played 150 minutes for us. Sure, if this game was in December, it would be a different story, but you're not giving the guys a fair chance.

I don't think its possible to win the league after a summer when we've signed half a new squad pretty much. Look at Chelsea or City. Depth, proven players, fixing the little issues they had last year, those are title winning squads. With the strain of the CL and 8 or 9 new players to bed in, the majority of them very young, I think its unrealistic to expect a title challenge. 4th would do me just fine,. We should still be comfortably ahead of United and Spurs come May, perhaps Arsenal.

[DonkeyWan]

Bit of perspective on this would be nice

Last year it was 0-1 to the Saints, 5-0 against Spurs, 1-2 to Man City and 2-2 against Villa

Don'want to put too much stock in comparing results, but the side is 2 points better off than last year.

Think some of the reaction on here has been borderline hysterical.

[elpistolero7]

I'm not buying this excuse for resting Sterling as in case he burns out too soon, the lads 19 years of age for god sake he will be full of energy and can play 2 games a week easy.

Seriously what the fuck are some of you on? You reckon you know more than world class fitness coaches and physios, or the best young manager in the league?

He's just played 3 full games in the last 10 days pretty much. There were 3 more in the next 8 going into today.

[Saul Goodman]

The attack wasn't even there. It's early days, but with Sturridge out and Sterling on the bench, we should still have done more. Much more. Lallana, Balotelli, Markovic, Borini and Lambert all got to play. That's 75M worth of players. And our best hope was a 19-year old... The truth is, at least a couple of the new faces need to start performing straight away. If we are to fight for the title, we need to win against the likes of Villa. Home and away. No excuses. Because at the end of the season, we need to have our 25+ wins. If we say 26-6-6 for the season and we're at 2-0-2 now, it's quite clear we can't slip up too many times.

Are we expected to be in a title race this season by fans?  It probably seems rather dull for alot of fans considering the title challenge last season but I think clearly that was unexpected and the club knows was mainly down to Suarez and is moving forward with plans as if the objective of last season of getting a top 4 place was achieved. Next phase is to build a squad which can compete on multiple fronts and cement top 4. Next year if Liverpool still have CL football it will allow the adding of one of two bits of quality to mount a title challenge rather than having like this window to pad out a very thin squad with numbers. I think the club have a clear vision which seems to be at odds with some fans fantasies based on last season. I lament the loss of Suarez as I think we could have done special things this season if we had added the kind of quality we did during this window but without him we need to be realistic about what we're doing this season.

[fcsantos]

It was gut wrenching watching issues from a few seasons ago, ie unable to break teams down.

But:

We were missing 2 starters.
Villa seem to be our bogey team.
We're 1 point behind City and played 2 very tough away games.

If Chelsea weren't smashing it I wouldn't feel anywhere near as bad.

[Gnurglan]

I'm not buying this excuse for resting Sterling as in case he burns out too soon, the lads 19 years of age for god sake he will be full of energy and can play 2 games a week easy. 

I side with Rodgers on this one. We need to manage Sterling the right way, not just play him as much as possible.

[gregorio]

Somebody needs to tell Balotelli to care about the famous red shirt.

I think that's unfair. It seems to me that Balotelli prefers balls to feet and running directly at defenders. We didn't play to those strengths today. Markovic took the ball of his head for what would have been a clear chance and when he did make runs, teammates were too slow to find him.

Elsewhere I thought the fullbacks were too quick to go to ground, Lallana does not look match-fit and we still need a stronger presence on the pitch when the chips are down.

Mason was far too lenient, resting Sterling was an error (I was saying it before kick off) and how many of those Villa fans celebrating today were calling for Lambert's head in April? Enough already with the City songs.

[MolbyLovesGravlax]

I'm not buying this excuse for resting Sterling as in case he burns out too soon, the lads 19 years of age for god sake he will be full of energy and can play 2 games a week easy.

Yeah but we have three games this week. He can't play every minute of every game, he isn't Suarez. And, after building a squad of this nature, it indicates some fundemental problems if a 19 year old has to play or we have no chance.

[MNAA]

We lost. We're flat. We've tired legs out there. Let's move on eh lads. Ludogorets next.

[RK7]

Really disappointed by the performance today, as a team we didn't look like we could score until Sterling came on and some individual performances were well below what would be expected.

It seems any team that sits back against us can soak up the pressure and counter us, we always give the opposition a chance.

[duvva 💅]

Last December we played far worse than this and got beat 3-1 at Hull. After that we barely looked back. I'm not saying there won't be set backs, how can there not be given the amount of new players but we need to get some perspective. Shit performance? Yes. End of the season, end of the world, end of our chances to qualify for the Champions league, or even win the league? No.
Granted if we play like we did today too many times then it will be difficult to challenge for the league again, but we played worse 4 months into last season and still nearly won it.

[S]

Just an awful game for us. I didn't think we could serve up a worse 90 minutes than the corresponding fixture from last season, but boy was I proved wrong. Can't think of a single player who came out of today looking good. Lallana looked alright...at times...I suppose.

Maybe it'll take time for the likes of Balotelli and Markovic to gel, but without Sturridge and Sterling we look average in attack. At this point it goes without saying that the defence was appalling. That part where Sakho had complete control over Agbonlahor and contrived to concede a corner sums up our defenders. They look completely panic-struck when confronted with an opposition player. Villa really should've extended their lead in the first half.

Gonna try and erase this one from my memory until they beat us again. We really can't drop points to West Ham before the derby.

[Gnurglan]

The truth is, players can take time to settle in sometimes. Balotelli moved to Anfied about 3 weeks back, and has barely played 150 minutes for us. Sure, if this game was in December, it would be a different story, but you're not giving the guys a fair chance.

I don't think its possible to win the league after a summer when we've signed half a new squad pretty much. Look at Chelsea or City. Depth, proven players, fixing the little issues they had last year, those are title winning squads. With the strain of the CL and 8 or 9 new players to bed in, the majority of them very young, I think its unrealistic to expect a title challenge. 4th would do me just fine,. We should still be comfortably ahead of United and Spurs come May, perhaps Arsenal.

Are we expected to be in a title race this season by fans?  It probably seems rather dull for alot of fans considering the title challenge last season but I think clearly that was unexpected and the club knows was mainly down to Suarez and is moving forward with plans as if the objective of last season of getting a top 4 place was achieved. Next phase is to build a squad which can compete on multiple fronts and cement top 4. Next year if Liverpool still have CL football it will allow the adding of one of two bits of quality to mount a title challenge rather than having like this window to pad out a very thin squad with numbers. I think the club have a clear vision which seems to be at odds with some fans fantasies based on last season. I lament the loss of Suarez as I think we could have done special things this season if we had added the kind of quality we did during this window but without him we need to be realistic about what we're doing this season.

Yes, it will take time for players to settle. But we need some of them to perform right away. We've signed players for more than 100M and they can't all be passengers for a few months. They've been signed to perform. It's not too much to ask that one of the attacking players can fill in for Sterling. I know this may sound harsh, but I'm not saying they all have to perform at once, just that some need to.
The squad we have may not be as good as the ones Chelsea and City have. But it's good enough to give them a fight.

On the title talk. What last season taught us, was that we can be in the race for the title. It's possible. It's very difficult to win it, but it's possible. And if it was possible then, it's possible now. We've lost Suarez, but the squad is better. We should build on last season, not shy away from it. A title challenge requires 25+ wins. Wins that are easiest to get against the bottom half sides. If we look back, it wasn't the loss to Chelsea that cost us the title last season. Those games can go either way. It was the draw with Crystal Palace, the draw with Villa and the loss to Hull that cost us. We should have beaten them. Just like we should have beaten Villa today.

[CHOPPER]

Sometimes, just sometimes - the one step backwards is more important than the two step forwards.

This is one of those.


Our season will come alive once we move from a core group of 12 to a core group of 18.


Roll on November-ish.


PS: on the Kop and this abomination, stop talkin abar Suarez, he gone, get over it. Dickheads,

[alfonso]

It was gut wrenching watching issues from a few seasons ago, ie unable to break teams down.

But:

We were missing 2 starters.
Villa seem to be our bogey team.
We're 1 point behind City and played 2 very tough away games.

If Chelsea weren't smashing it I wouldn't feel anywhere near as bad.

"Bogey team". That is a term I have always thought as superstitious bollox.

[Durlmints]

Sometimes, just sometimes - the one step backwards is more important than the two step forwards.

What happened in your summer absence Chops!?

Taoism? 

[Saul Goodman]

Yes, it will take time for players to settle. But we need some of them to perform right away. We've signed players for more than 100M and they can't all be passengers for a few months. They've been signed to perform. It's not too much to ask that one of the attacking players can fill in for Sterling. I know this may sound harsh, but I'm not saying they all have to perform at once, just that some need to.
The squad we have may not be as good as the ones Chelsea and City have. But it's good enough to give them a fight.

I think the 100m figure is little disingenuous for want of a better word in today's market. Even just taking the wages argument we haven't really gone out and spent astronomical money. We haven't gone out and bought players who you would expect to hit the ground running. Markovic is a kid. Balo we all know about his problems. Lallana I'd expect more but it's his first game back after a lengthy layoff. We have taken what I would describe as quite a few punts in the market or even you can say players for the future. I don't have a problem with all that as we don't have the resources of other teams so need to think outside the box. When other teams are going out and spending that near entire budget on one players fee/wages it shows what a hard task is ahead.

On the title talk. What last season taught us, was that we can be in the race for the title. It's possible. It's very difficult to win it, but it's possible. And if it was possible then, it's possible now. We've lost Suarez, but the squad is better. We should build on last season, not shy away from it. A title challenge requires 25+ wins. Wins that are easiest to get against the bottom half sides. If we look back, it wasn't the loss to Chelsea that cost us the title last season. Those games can go either way. It was the draw with Crystal Palace, the draw with Villa and the loss to Hull that cost us. We should have beaten them. Just like we should have beaten Villa today.

We had a small core group of players last season who could compete with the best teams on their day as the first 11 is of huge quality with the added element of having the best player in the world within that team on last seasons form. The landscape of having lost Suarez and building a squad not just a first 11 which can compete on multiple fronts is so far removed from last season that I have no expectations for this season other than competing for top 4.

[fcsantos]

"Bogey team". That is a term I have always thought as superstitious bollox.

It's a term used by my arl fellah and his arl fellah etc are you from Liverpool or born in the seventies? May be a culture / age thing, you may say a team who have tactically / mentally out-thought us on a regular basis, same thing lar.